Hi Reed! I see that you picked up on my disappointment, but I am tenacious (and skeptical) because Burke's story has been the only one known (to me) until recently when Ormerod's story came along to upset the applecart. Now, the Warburton's have believed, since at least the 17th century, that we are related to Wm the Conq., so I can't just dismiss family lore because it is not supported by the evidence that we have available today. However, I would like to read James Tait's writings and evaluate (for myself) his criticisms that would lead authorities, like yourself, to say that my grandfather's father(s) and brothers are ficitious--maybe they are not provable, but ficitious is a strong statement!!! Does Tait prove that they are ficitous or does he prove that there is no evidence to support their existence. I, myself, think that these strange names are strange. But I want to learn as much as I can. I like to form my own opinions and not just take someone's opinion as truth (even an expert's opinion!) I am sure that you understand my feelings; thus, I am asking you to give me the name of the article or book or whatever that Tait used to express his historical findings. I would very much appreciate it if you could send this reference to me. Thank you so much for your help and your time. Carole Dutton Malisiak _________________ Reedpcgen wrote: > Dear Carole, > > You received my opinion that the identities of the fathers of Odard/Hudad of > Dutton are fictitious. This was also the opinion of James Tait, one of the > best Cheshire historians, who had Omrerod and other sources at his fingertips. > > To recap, the problem is that the story given in Ormerod's History of Cheshire > and Dugdale's Monasticon Anglicanum, which is the source for the attribution of > this Odard's siblings and parentage, is fabulous (this is clear from internal > and external evidence). And there were many other Odards. > > So, I would point out that if you have accurately tied into the Medieval Dutton > family of Cheshire, which traces back, somewhat tenuously, to this Odard, who > appears in Domesday, you have done far better at tracing a direct male descent > thnt over 90% of other people can (mine goes back five generations). > > So please don't be disappointed if records do not survive to trace Odard's > origins on the Continent. He may well be from the Avranchine, but it is not > likely he is the immediate child of a count. > > Dr. Katharine Keats-Rohan agrees that William FitzNigel, who had far more > extensive properties in Cheshire, was not a member of the St. Savieur family. > That connection would have been far more likely than the ones proposed for > Odard. > > Please feel free to post dissenting views. > > pcr