Chris, > So what families are your researching in New Netherland? I have Post and > Bonen who are unrelated to Urbanus Luursen, Warnar Wessels, I have been working on the Post and Bonen families. Liz has been instrumental in identifying the parents of both Lodewyck Cornelis Post and Agnietje Bonen. I am working on a possible connect of them with Warnar Wessels. I would be glad to share information. Mike Morrissey > Date: Thu, 11 Apr 2013 13:20:49 -0500 > From: brookskcmo@gmail.com > To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com > CC: new-netherland@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Cornelia Maas, wife of Johannes Holsaert & Rutgert Waldron; Jannetje so-called "Boonen" (who isn't)

Hi Chris, I'm glad to hear you're still planning to go forward with the Urbanus Luursen article, and are making progress with the transcription of the Kingston records. I don't seem to have any of the same lines as you, as it happens. I am lucky to have as much traceable colonial ancestry as I do, considering that only one of my great-grandparents came from the U.S. (the rest came directly to Canada from Europe). I still have some missing lines that might conceivably lead back to New Netherland, but this seems unlikely on geographical grounds. I think this is a complete list of my New Netherland immigrant ancestors (roughly in order of latest to earliest): Hendrick Willemsen Leeuwaert or Ruwaert Adolf Meyer Adriaen Hegeman & Catharina Margetts Frans Jans Bloetgoet & Lysbeth Jans Cornelis Vonck & Magdalena Hendrickse Catharina Cronenberg (widow of Hendrick ____ and mother of Magdalena Hendrickse) Abraham Rycken van Lent & Grietje Hendrickse Harck Syboutszen & Wyntje Theunisse Johannes Verveelen & Anna Chatvelt Daniel Verveelen & Anna Eelhout Pieter Cornelis Luyster & Aeltje Thysse Johannes Nevius & Adriaentje Cornelis Bleyck Swaentje Jans (widow of Cornelis Adriaens Bleyck and mother of Adriaentje Cornelis Bleyck) Joris Rapalje & Catalyntje Trico Abraham Martenszen Clock & Tryntje Alberts Potthoff Theunis Thomasz Quick & Belitgen Jacobus van Vleckesteyn Most of my research for about the last 15 years has centered on these people, and in three cases (Harck Syboutszen, Anna Chatvelt, and Anna Eelhout) I was the one who determined their place of origin and parentage (or at least the father, in the case of Harck Syboutszen). Progress on this cluster of ancestry has been slowing down, and the only other recent advance has been Carolyn Nash's discovery late last year of the surname of Catharina Cronenberg. Some of the surnames involved are uncommon (such as Vonck, Cronenberg, Luyster, Clock, Potthoff, and Quick) but frustratingly, American sources do not seem to supply any clues to the immigrants' places of origin. Best wishes, John On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 1:20 PM, Chris Brooks <brookskcmo@gmail.com> wrote: > Hello Liz > > It's amazing the families we appear to be researching at the same time. > First Michael Tadens and now Urbanus Luursen and his wife. We have a lot > of the same information, a few different conclusions and I have two > additional children but very similar. One thing I did was trace this two > sons Harman and Urbanus and was able to tie Haman to Jacob Cornelis Swits > in the article I had published last fall in the NYG&B Record. I submitted > the Urbanus information but was able to finish the article because I ended > up spending two months in Saudi Arabia for work. I will likely go on and > publish my article since it has been in progress and the intent is as much > to trace the two sons. > > So what families are your researching in New Netherland? I have Post and > Bonen who are unrelated to Urbanus Luursen, Warnar Wessels, and more > information on the Swits/Trommels, some information on Dirck Benson, also > Evert Duyckink and his wife, Jan Teunisen Westbroeck, Michel Hainelle and > his wife Henrica Strockels, Jan Thomasen Mingael, the van der Kuyl family, > Viervant, Jannetje Le Seuer, the Pietersen sisters of Hoorn, Noord Holland > who migrated to New Netherland and several others. Are you working on any > of them :-) > > I also just finished the first draft of the Minutes of the Trustees of > Kingston, NY 1688 to 1777 and started on the actual conveyances/grants. > > Take care > > Chris > > > On Tue, Apr 9, 2013 at 9:40 AM, E Johnson <iris.gates@gmail.com> wrote: > > > Hi everyone, > > > > We've identified Cornelia Maas, born about 1675, who married Johannes > > Holsaert II and Rutgert Waldron in the New York Dutch church. > > > > I have a web page online now which gives details of four generations of > her > > ancestors, several of whom lived in Amsterdam. There is a good amount of > > new information here. Hulsart and Hulst descendants, Waldron researchers, > > and certain Bennet and Emans/Emmons descendants will want to have a look. > > Shahaan descendants, certain Romeyn descendants, some Thomas/Thomaszen > > researchers, and certain Tobias researchers will also want to see. > > > > Cornelia Maas' ancestors include: > > > > * Thomas Franszen of England, who married two Dutch wives in New > Amsterdam. > > > > * Urbanus Luursen, a master mason, who owned several properties in > > Amsterdam including three in a row, two of which he built. He was drowned > > in the Prinses Amelia shipwreck of 1647. His wife was Jannetje Claes of > > Amsterdam, who married twice more after his death. As noted below, this > > Jannetje Claes in New Amsterdam - NY records was most often known as > > Jannetje 'Boonen'. > > > > * Claes Arents, a butcher who lived in the Kalverstraat in Amsterdam, and > > his wife Beatrix Hermans, of (probably) Veere, Zeeland. > > > > In this article, I have an image of the beautiful and rare signature of > > Johannes Holsaert I, Cornelia Maas' father-in-law. He was the town clerk > of > > Flatlands for only a few years before he died there in 1687. He is the > > forefather of the Hulsart and Hulst families of New York, New Jersey, and > > beyond. > > > > A significant side effect of this research provided the correct > > identification of Jannetje "Boonen", whose name appears several times in > > New Amsterdam / NY church records and in the Orphanmasters records of New > > Amsterdam. She was Jannetje Claes, baptized in 1619 in Amsterdam. The > > surname she was ususally known by in New Amsterdam was dervied from her > > first husband's first name. > > > > Another result of this effort was the identification of Rutgert Waldron's > > so-called daughter Anna Holseart, mentioned in his 1720 will as one of > his > > seven children. But there is no space in his two marriages for a daughter > > Ann to have been born and to have married a Holseart man by 1720. This > Anna > > Holseart was his step-daughter, a child of his second wife's first > > marriage. > > > > This article was made possible by the collaborative effort of several > > people, whose input, contributions and suggestions were invaluable in > > sorting out these families. I thank these persons in the article. Here > also > > I would like to thank the invisible Roberto (whoever he is), the senior > > website technician who maintains the Stadsarchief Amstersam databases. > > > > "Ancestors of Cornelia Maas, Wife of Johannes Holsaert and Rutgert > Waldron" > > can be found here: > > > > > http://17thcenturyhollanders.pbworks.com/w/page/65172546/Ancestors%20of%20Cornelia%20Maas%2C%20Wife%20of%20Johannes%20Holsaert%20and%20Rutgert%20Waldron#view=edit > > > > Enjoy the article. Questions, comments, corrections or suggestions are > > always welcome. > > > > Best wishes, > > Liz J > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > -- > Chris Brooks > Kansas City, Missouri > 816-363-1831 > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hello Liz It's amazing the families we appear to be researching at the same time. First Michael Tadens and now Urbanus Luursen and his wife. We have a lot of the same information, a few different conclusions and I have two additional children but very similar. One thing I did was trace this two sons Harman and Urbanus and was able to tie Haman to Jacob Cornelis Swits in the article I had published last fall in the NYG&B Record. I submitted the Urbanus information but was able to finish the article because I ended up spending two months in Saudi Arabia for work. I will likely go on and publish my article since it has been in progress and the intent is as much to trace the two sons. So what families are your researching in New Netherland? I have Post and Bonen who are unrelated to Urbanus Luursen, Warnar Wessels, and more information on the Swits/Trommels, some information on Dirck Benson, also Evert Duyckink and his wife, Jan Teunisen Westbroeck, Michel Hainelle and his wife Henrica Strockels, Jan Thomasen Mingael, the van der Kuyl family, Viervant, Jannetje Le Seuer, the Pietersen sisters of Hoorn, Noord Holland who migrated to New Netherland and several others. Are you working on any of them :-) I also just finished the first draft of the Minutes of the Trustees of Kingston, NY 1688 to 1777 and started on the actual conveyances/grants. Take care Chris On Tue, Apr 9, 2013 at 9:40 AM, E Johnson <iris.gates@gmail.com> wrote: > Hi everyone, > > We've identified Cornelia Maas, born about 1675, who married Johannes > Holsaert II and Rutgert Waldron in the New York Dutch church. > > I have a web page online now which gives details of four generations of her > ancestors, several of whom lived in Amsterdam. There is a good amount of > new information here. Hulsart and Hulst descendants, Waldron researchers, > and certain Bennet and Emans/Emmons descendants will want to have a look. > Shahaan descendants, certain Romeyn descendants, some Thomas/Thomaszen > researchers, and certain Tobias researchers will also want to see. > > Cornelia Maas' ancestors include: > > * Thomas Franszen of England, who married two Dutch wives in New Amsterdam. > > * Urbanus Luursen, a master mason, who owned several properties in > Amsterdam including three in a row, two of which he built. He was drowned > in the Prinses Amelia shipwreck of 1647. His wife was Jannetje Claes of > Amsterdam, who married twice more after his death. As noted below, this > Jannetje Claes in New Amsterdam - NY records was most often known as > Jannetje 'Boonen'. > > * Claes Arents, a butcher who lived in the Kalverstraat in Amsterdam, and > his wife Beatrix Hermans, of (probably) Veere, Zeeland. > > In this article, I have an image of the beautiful and rare signature of > Johannes Holsaert I, Cornelia Maas' father-in-law. He was the town clerk of > Flatlands for only a few years before he died there in 1687. He is the > forefather of the Hulsart and Hulst families of New York, New Jersey, and > beyond. > > A significant side effect of this research provided the correct > identification of Jannetje "Boonen", whose name appears several times in > New Amsterdam / NY church records and in the Orphanmasters records of New > Amsterdam. She was Jannetje Claes, baptized in 1619 in Amsterdam. The > surname she was ususally known by in New Amsterdam was dervied from her > first husband's first name. > > Another result of this effort was the identification of Rutgert Waldron's > so-called daughter Anna Holseart, mentioned in his 1720 will as one of his > seven children. But there is no space in his two marriages for a daughter > Ann to have been born and to have married a Holseart man by 1720. This Anna > Holseart was his step-daughter, a child of his second wife's first > marriage. > > This article was made possible by the collaborative effort of several > people, whose input, contributions and suggestions were invaluable in > sorting out these families. I thank these persons in the article. Here also > I would like to thank the invisible Roberto (whoever he is), the senior > website technician who maintains the Stadsarchief Amstersam databases. > > "Ancestors of Cornelia Maas, Wife of Johannes Holsaert and Rutgert Waldron" > can be found here: > > http://17thcenturyhollanders.pbworks.com/w/page/65172546/Ancestors%20of%20Cornelia%20Maas%2C%20Wife%20of%20Johannes%20Holsaert%20and%20Rutgert%20Waldron#view=edit > > Enjoy the article. Questions, comments, corrections or suggestions are > always welcome. > > Best wishes, > Liz J > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > -- Chris Brooks Kansas City, Missouri 816-363-1831

Pam and all, Jurian Blauw married 1st Hester Emmet, as is seen from the baptsims of two of their children:12 Mar 1729; Jurian Blauw, Hester Emmet; Leena; Fredrik Blaw, Lena, z.h.v.Collections of the New York Genealogical and Biographical Society, Vol. II, Baptism for 1620 to 1730 in the Reformed Dutch Church, New York, pg 490. 10 Oct 1731; Fredrick; Juryson Blaauw, Hester s.v.; Nicholaes Vechten, Cornelia s.v.New Utrecth Baptisms, NYGBR 112:211 Jurian was baptized at the DRC of Brooklyn:1708, February 29: -Jurjen; parents: Fredirck Blaauw, Lena; witnesses: Abram Blaauw, Jannetje Brouwer.New York Historical Dutch Manuscripts, Old First Dutch Reformed Church of Brooklyn, New York, First Book of Records, 1660-1752, by A.P.G. Jos van der Linde, pg f152. Based on his baptism in 1708, the baptism of Leena in 1729, and the mention of Engeltje was his oldest daughter, it seems lilkely that Leena died young and they had a second child named Magdalena, though that Magdalena could be a daughter of Cornelia. Hester's parents were probably John Emmet and Engeltje (?). It seems likely that John (his oldest son) and Engeltje are Hester's children, named after their maternal grandparents. Fredrick apparently died young as he is not mentioned in the will. Mike Morrissey> > > Actually, Jeremiah/Juriaen Blauw and his wife Cornelia Waldron had a total > of 8 children, as listed in the will of Jurry Blaew of Gowanus: > > Abstracts of wills on file in the Surrogate's Office, City of New York > (Volume V. 1754-1760) > Liber 21, page 317 > Page 338. In the name of God, Amen, March 9, 1759. I, Jurry Blaew, of > Gowanus, in Brookland, in Kings County, farrier, being weak in body. I > leave to my wife Cornelia all household goods. I leave to my eldest son > John £3 for his birth right. All the rest of my estate, real and personal, > to be sold by my executors 3 months after my decease and the money paid to > my wife and children, John, Waldron, Abraham, Hendrick, Magdalena, > Cornelia, and Sara. My eldest daughter Engeltie has been a disobedient > child, and for that reason I debar her from any share. I make my wife, and > my son Waldron, and my friend, Aert Hyer, executors. Witnesses, Nicholas > Vechten, Peter Staats, Simon Boerum. Proved, June 19, 1759. > [Note. The name in old deeds is generally spelled Blaw. W. S. P.] > > > > Regards, > Pam Sears

Thanks Mike. Daughter "Maghdeleentie" in Jurry's will isn't named in Cornelia's, so she was likely born by Hester.  Maybe Engeltje was born first around 1728, Leena/Maghdeleentie 1729, Frederick 1731, John etc.   Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael Morrissey <mikemorr@hotmail.com> To: "dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com" <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> Cc: Sent: Wednesday, April 10, 2013 8:54 PM Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Cornelia Maas, wife of Johannes Holsaert & Rutgert Waldron; Pam and all, Jurian Blauw married 1st Hester Emmet, as is seen from the baptsims of two of their children:12 Mar 1729; Jurian Blauw, Hester Emmet; Leena; Fredrik Blaw, Lena, z.h.v.Collections of the New York Genealogical and Biographical Society, Vol. II, Baptism for 1620 to 1730 in the Reformed Dutch Church, New York, pg 490. 10 Oct 1731; Fredrick; Juryson Blaauw, Hester s.v.; Nicholaes Vechten, Cornelia s.v.New Utrecth Baptisms, NYGBR 112:211 Jurian was baptized at the DRC of Brooklyn:1708, February 29: -Jurjen; parents: Fredirck Blaauw, Lena; witnesses: Abram Blaauw, Jannetje Brouwer.New York Historical Dutch Manuscripts, Old First Dutch Reformed Church of Brooklyn, New York, First Book of Records, 1660-1752, by A.P.G. Jos van der Linde, pg f152. Based on his baptism in 1708, the baptism of Leena in 1729, and the mention of Engeltje was his oldest daughter, it seems lilkely that Leena died young and they had a second child named Magdalena, though that Magdalena could be a daughter of Cornelia.  Hester's parents were probably John Emmet and Engeltje (?).  It seems likely that John (his oldest son) and Engeltje are Hester's children, named after their maternal grandparents.  Fredrick apparently died young as he is not mentioned in the will. Mike Morrissey> > > Actually, Jeremiah/Juriaen Blauw and his wife Cornelia Waldron had a total > of 8 children, as listed in the will of Jurry Blaew of Gowanus: > > Abstracts of wills on file in the Surrogate's Office, City of New York > (Volume V. 1754-1760) > Liber 21, page 317 > Page 338. In the name of God, Amen, March 9, 1759. I, Jurry Blaew, of > Gowanus, in Brookland, in Kings County, farrier, being weak in body. I > leave to my wife Cornelia all household goods. I leave to my eldest son > John £3 for his birth right. All the rest of my estate, real and personal, > to be sold by my executors 3 months after my decease and the money paid to > my wife and children, John, Waldron, Abraham, Hendrick, Magdalena, > Cornelia, and Sara. My eldest daughter Engeltie has been a disobedient > child, and for that reason I debar her from any share. I make my wife, and > my son Waldron, and my friend, Aert Hyer, executors. Witnesses, Nicholas > Vechten, Peter Staats, Simon Boerum. Proved, June 19, 1759. > [Note. The name in old deeds is generally spelled Blaw. W. S. P.] > > > > Regards, > Pam Sears                         ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

That's a great idea, Judy.  Our genealogy library in the West Valley of Phoenix has over 15,000 books now.  Most of them were donated by members or the Salt Lake City library.  Many genealogy societies have a "will" that you can attach to your important documents and it's strictly for your genealogy collection so your heirs know what to do with your things.  Please consider your local societies as recipients. Dee in Phoenix   www.azwvgs.org When a person dies, a library closes. Researching: NJ: Snook, Bozarth, Dickerson, Dalton, Hicks, Asay NY: Semlear, Stoothoff, Foster, Murray, Dierks, Cairns PA: Hicks, Shaw, Roberts, Swartz/Black, Penrose Nova Scotia: Arthur, Hutt, Eisenhauer, Conrod, Morris     >________________________________ > From: "jacassidy22@verizon.net" <jacassidy22@verizon.net> >To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com >Sent: Wednesday, April 10, 2013 12:33 PM >Subject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Donating Your Unused Books > > > >    I just shipped off 32 pounds of books, U. S. Media Mail, to two different >  Historical Society libraries which only cost me $20.00. These were books, >  like new, that I no longer used, or that didn't contain the information >  which I thought they would, purchased over the years.  I am sure many people >  have such a collection and can't figure out what to do with them.  Rather >  than leave it to my children, who would have no idea, I decided that it was >  time to pass them on.  So if any of you have such books at home, which are >  gathering dust and no longer used, I bet a Historical Society Library might >  appreciate them.  If not they can always sell them and donate the proceeds >  to the library. >  I  have  a  friend  who  just died not so long ago, he had a wonderful >  collection, but it was a sudden death and now this collection is sitting in >  the milk house on the farm, he left no instructions on how he wanted them >  disposed. >  Judy > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > >

Hi Liz et al, New York Marriages Previous to 1784 (Baltimore: Genealogical Publishing Company, 1968) 29 Dec 1737; pages 34 and 443. M.B. 1:8 Jeremiah Blow and Cornelia Waldron Actually, Jeremiah/Juriaen Blauw and his wife Cornelia Waldron had a total of 8 children, as listed in the will of Jurry Blaew of Gowanus: Abstracts of wills on file in the Surrogate's Office, City of New York (Volume V. 1754-1760) Liber 21, page 317 Page 338. In the name of God, Amen, March 9, 1759. I, Jurry Blaew, of Gowanus, in Brookland, in Kings County, farrier, being weak in body. I leave to my wife Cornelia all household goods. I leave to my eldest son John £3 for his birth right. All the rest of my estate, real and personal, to be sold by my executors 3 months after my decease and the money paid to my wife and children, John, Waldron, Abraham, Hendrick, Magdalena, Cornelia, and Sara. My eldest daughter Engeltie has been a disobedient child, and for that reason I debar her from any share. I make my wife, and my son Waldron, and my friend, Aert Hyer, executors. Witnesses, Nicholas Vechten, Peter Staats, Simon Boerum. Proved, June 19, 1759. [Note. The name in old deeds is generally spelled Blaw. W. S. P.] Regards, Pam Sears

I just shipped off 32 pounds of books, U. S. Media Mail, to two different Historical Society libraries which only cost me $20.00. These were books, like new, that I no longer used, or that didn't contain the information which I thought they would, purchased over the years. I am sure many people have such a collection and can't figure out what to do with them. Rather than leave it to my children, who would have no idea, I decided that it was time to pass them on. So if any of you have such books at home, which are gathering dust and no longer used, I bet a Historical Society Library might appreciate them. If not they can always sell them and donate the proceeds to the library. I have a friend who just died not so long ago, he had a wonderful collection, but it was a sudden death and now this collection is sitting in the milk house on the farm, he left no instructions on how he wanted them disposed. Judy

Hi all, Rutger Waldron appears to descend from Joseph Waldron, the brother of Resolved. The second half of the Revised History of Harlem has genealogies of many of the Harlem families, including that of Resolved Waldron (begins p. 691). Joseph’s family is in footnote on pp. 691-692. You can download this book at Google: http://books.google.com/books?id=WFAOAAAAIAAJ Others have noted here in the past that there are errors in these genelogies. Eg., I see in this case they have Rutger Waldron marrying Cornelia Morse, not Maas. And they have daughter Cornelia marrying Juriaen Blauw, not Jeremiah. But, there may be some leads there. Those interested in the Waldron family should also see: “The European Origin and Ancestry of Joseph and Resolved Waldron” by Douglas Richardson in NYGBR vol 126, no. 1 (Jan 1995), pp. 12 – 24. This begins with the grandfather of the Waldron brothers. The article is continued in later issues. The April issue covers the ancestry of the wives of Joseph and Resolved, Aeltje and Rebecca Hendricks. (The brothers married sisters.) The July issue covers the ancestry of the 2nd wife of Joseph, Annetje Daniels. Note: this second wife of Joseph was the mother of Daniel, who married Sara Rutgers. They were the parents of Rutger Waldron. Regards, Howard hswain@ix.netcom.com Sent: Wednesday, April 10, 2013 2:08 AM To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Cornelia Maas, wife of Johannes Holsaert &Rutgert Waldron; Jannetje so-called "Boonen" (who isn't) Hi Liz, Apparently both daughters lived long lives as per in Cornelia's 1786 will, proved in 1787, which mentions her 4 children with Jeremias Blauw (1707/8-1759), and her sister Sara Waldron. NYHS Abstract below. A copied record of the will and probate begins on page 31 here: http://tinyurl.com/d4523sx NY Marriage License: 1737 29 Dec; Jeremiah Blauw; Cornelia Waldron Jim ABSTRACTS OF WILLS— LIBER 40 124 Page 39. — Cornelia Blaau, of New York City, wid- ow of Jeremiah Blaau, late of the said City, to my ex- ecutors, all my real estate in New York City or else- <snip>

Hi Liz, Apparently both daughters lived long lives as per in Cornelia's 1786 will, proved in 1787, which mentions her 4 children with Jeremias Blauw (1707/8-1759), and her sister Sara Waldron.  NYHS Abstract below. A copied record of the will and probate begins on page 31 here: http://tinyurl.com/d4523sx NY Marriage License: 1737 29 Dec; Jeremiah Blauw; Cornelia Waldron Jim ABSTRACTS OF WILLS— LIBER 40 124 Page 39. — Cornelia Blaau, of New York City, wid- ow of Jeremiah Blaau, late of the said City, to my ex- ecutors, all my real estate in New York City or else- where, upon trust that they sell the same within three months after my decease, and the moneys so arising, after my debts and funeral charges are paid, to put £200 out at interest, upon sufficient landed security and to pay the interest so arising to my sister, Sarah Waldron, during her life ; one equal third part of the residue to my son, Abraham, for his use and benefit, and his heirs share and share alike; one other equal third part to my daughter, Cornelia Alboy, wife of John Alboy, late of the said City, deceased, to her heirs share and share alike; the remaining third part to be put out at interest, upon sufficient landed secur- ity, the interest so arising to be paid to my daughter, Sarah Jarvis, wife of Arthur Jarvis, of New York City for her use and benefit during the joint lives of my daughter Sarah, and her husband; if the interest is not sufficient, then I order my executors to give part of the principal of the one-third part not exceed- ing in the whole £300, to be paid to my daughter, Sarah Jarvis ; her receipt alone shall be a sufficient dis- charge to my executors ; if my daughter, Sarah Jarvis, should die before the said one the third part is put 125 out at interest, then it is to be paid to her child or children which shall be living at the time of her decease, share and share alike ; in default of such child or chil- dren, the same to be paid to my daughter, Cornelia Alboy, and my son, Abraham Blaau, for their use, share and share alike, to them, their heirs, as tenants in common; after the death of my sister, Sarah Waldron, two equal third parts of the above mentioned sum of £200 to my son, Abraham Blaau, and Cornelia Alboy, to them, their heirs, share and share alike as tenants in common; the remaining equal third part of the said £200 to my executors to put out at interest for my daughter, Sarah Jarvis, for her use during her life, to her, her heirs, share and share alike as tenants in common; all my household furniture and plate to my children, Abraham, Cornelia Alboy, and Sarah Jarvis, and my sister, Sarah Waldron, for their use and benefit ; if either die before my decease, the share to be divided among the survivors, share and share alike; as my son, Waldron Blaau, has in his lifetime received more than his full share I cannot, in justice to my other children, give his children anything by my last will. I appoint His Excellency, George Clin- ton, Esq., Governor of New York State, and Nicholas Bogart, merchant, of New York City (son of Cornelius Bogart), executors.   Dated August, 24, 1786. Witnesses, Gerret Van Gelden, Robt. Troup, Esq., Theophilus De Bow. Proved, July 24, 1787. On July 28, 1787, the executors having refused to serve, the Court appointed Robert Richardson Cross and Arthur Jarvis, of New York, gentlemen, to administer the estate.   ----- Original Message ----- From: E Johnson <iris.gates@gmail.com> To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com; new-netherland@rootsweb.com Cc: Sent: Tuesday, April 9, 2013 7:31 PM Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Cornelia Maas, wife of Johannes Holsaert & Rutgert Waldron; Jannetje so-called "Boonen" (who isn't) I hope you find something useful, Dawn. I hope someone knows if Cornelis Maas' two daughters with Rutgert Waldron (Sara Waldron 1716, and Cornelia Waldron 1619) lived to adulthood, and if so, who they married. Their father died when they were only little girls. I also need a death date for Cornelis (Maas) Waldron, or info on whatever happened to her after Rutgert Waldron died. Thanks for the thanks, Liz J ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I hope you find something useful, Dawn. I hope someone knows if Cornelis Maas' two daughters with Rutgert Waldron (Sara Waldron 1716, and Cornelia Waldron 1619) lived to adulthood, and if so, who they married. Their father died when they were only little girls. I also need a death date for Cornelis (Maas) Waldron, or info on whatever happened to her after Rutgert Waldron died. Thanks for the thanks, Liz J

Thank you for the information. My great grandmother was a Waldron. Dawn Wisconsin -----Original Message----- From: E Johnson <iris.gates@gmail.com> To: Dutch Colonies <Dutch-Colonies@rootsweb.com>; new-netherland <new-netherland@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tue, Apr 9, 2013 10:24 am Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Cornelia Maas, wife of Johannes Holsaert & Rutgert Waldron; Jannetje so-called "Boonen" (who isn't) I had an incorrect link to the Cornelia Maas article. The correct link is: ttp://17thcenturyhollanders.pbworks.com/w/page/65172546/Ancestors%20of%20Cornelia%20Maas%2C%20Wife%20of%20Johannes%20Holsaert%20and%20Rutgert%20Waldron Or use the Index/Contents page here: ttp://17thcenturyhollanders.pbworks.com/w/page/742574/Index Liz J On 9 April 2013 10:40, E Johnson <iris.gates@gmail.com> wrote: > Hi everyone, We've identified Cornelia Maas, born about 1675, who married Johannes Holsaert II and Rutgert Waldron in the New York Dutch church. I have a web page online now which gives details of four generations of her ancestors, several of whom lived in Amsterdam. There is a good amount of new information here. Hulsart and Hulst descendants, Waldron researchers, and certain Bennet and Emans/Emmons descendants will want to have a look. Shahaan descendants, certain Romeyn descendants, some Thomas/Thomaszen researchers, and certain Tobias researchers will also want to see. Cornelia Maas' ancestors include: * Thomas Franszen of England, who married two Dutch wives in New Amsterdam. * Urbanus Luursen, a master mason, who owned several properties in Amsterdam including three in a row, two of which he built. He was drowned in the Prinses Amelia shipwreck of 1647. His wife was Jannetje Claes of Amsterdam, who married twice more after his death. As noted below, this Jannetje Claes in New Amsterdam - NY records was most often known as Jannetje 'Boonen'. * Claes Arents, a butcher who lived in the Kalverstraat in Amsterdam, and his wife Beatrix Hermans, of (probably) Veere, Zeeland. In this article, I have an image of the beautiful and rare signature of Johannes Holsaert I, Cornelia Maas' father-in-law. He was the town clerk of Flatlands for only a few years before he died there in 1687. He is the forefather of the Hulsart and Hulst families of New York, New Jersey, and beyond. A significant side effect of this research provided the correct identification of Jannetje "Boonen", whose name appears several times in New Amsterdam / NY church records and in the Orphanmasters records of New Amsterdam. She was Jannetje Claes, baptized in 1619 in Amsterdam. The surname she was ususally known by in New Amsterdam was dervied from her first husband's first name. Another result of this effort was the identification of Rutgert Waldron's so-called daughter Anna Holseart, mentioned in his 1720 will as one of his seven children. But there is no space in his two marriages for a daughter Ann to have been born and to have married a Holseart man by 1720. This Anna Holseart was his step-daughter, a child of his second wife's first marriage. This article was made possible by the collaborative effort of several people, whose input, contributions and suggestions were invaluable in sorting out these families. I thank these persons in the article. Here also I would like to thank the invisible Roberto (whoever he is), the senior website technician who maintains the Stadsarchief Amstersam databases. "Ancestors of Cornelia Maas, Wife of Johannes Holsaert and Rutgert Waldron" can be found here: http://17thcenturyhollanders.pbworks.com/w/page/65172546/Ancestors%20of%20Cornelia%20Maas%2C%20Wife%20of%20Johannes%20Holsaert%20and%20Rutgert%20Waldron#view=edit Enjoy the article. Questions, comments, corrections or suggestions are always welcome. Best wishes, Liz J ------------------------------ o unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com ith the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of he message

I had an incorrect link to the Cornelia Maas article. The correct link is: http://17thcenturyhollanders.pbworks.com/w/page/65172546/Ancestors%20of%20Cornelia%20Maas%2C%20Wife%20of%20Johannes%20Holsaert%20and%20Rutgert%20Waldron Or use the Index/Contents page here: http://17thcenturyhollanders.pbworks.com/w/page/742574/Index Liz J On 9 April 2013 10:40, E Johnson <iris.gates@gmail.com> wrote: > Hi everyone, > > We've identified Cornelia Maas, born about 1675, who married Johannes > Holsaert II and Rutgert Waldron in the New York Dutch church. > > I have a web page online now which gives details of four generations of > her ancestors, several of whom lived in Amsterdam. There is a good amount > of new information here. Hulsart and Hulst descendants, Waldron > researchers, and certain Bennet and Emans/Emmons descendants will want to > have a look. Shahaan descendants, certain Romeyn descendants, some > Thomas/Thomaszen researchers, and certain Tobias researchers will also want > to see. > > Cornelia Maas' ancestors include: > > * Thomas Franszen of England, who married two Dutch wives in New Amsterdam. > > * Urbanus Luursen, a master mason, who owned several properties in > Amsterdam including three in a row, two of which he built. He was drowned > in the Prinses Amelia shipwreck of 1647. His wife was Jannetje Claes of > Amsterdam, who married twice more after his death. As noted below, this > Jannetje Claes in New Amsterdam - NY records was most often known as > Jannetje 'Boonen'. > > * Claes Arents, a butcher who lived in the Kalverstraat in Amsterdam, and > his wife Beatrix Hermans, of (probably) Veere, Zeeland. > > In this article, I have an image of the beautiful and rare signature of > Johannes Holsaert I, Cornelia Maas' father-in-law. He was the town clerk of > Flatlands for only a few years before he died there in 1687. He is the > forefather of the Hulsart and Hulst families of New York, New Jersey, and > beyond. > > A significant side effect of this research provided the correct > identification of Jannetje "Boonen", whose name appears several times in > New Amsterdam / NY church records and in the Orphanmasters records of New > Amsterdam. She was Jannetje Claes, baptized in 1619 in Amsterdam. The > surname she was ususally known by in New Amsterdam was dervied from her > first husband's first name. > > Another result of this effort was the identification of Rutgert Waldron's > so-called daughter Anna Holseart, mentioned in his 1720 will as one of his > seven children. But there is no space in his two marriages for a daughter > Ann to have been born and to have married a Holseart man by 1720. This Anna > Holseart was his step-daughter, a child of his second wife's first marriage. > > This article was made possible by the collaborative effort of several > people, whose input, contributions and suggestions were invaluable in > sorting out these families. I thank these persons in the article. Here also > I would like to thank the invisible Roberto (whoever he is), the senior > website technician who maintains the Stadsarchief Amstersam databases. > > "Ancestors of Cornelia Maas, Wife of Johannes Holsaert and Rutgert > Waldron" can be found here: > http://17thcenturyhollanders.pbworks.com/w/page/65172546/Ancestors%20of%20Cornelia%20Maas%2C%20Wife%20of%20Johannes%20Holsaert%20and%20Rutgert%20Waldron#view=edit > > Enjoy the article. Questions, comments, corrections or suggestions are > always welcome. > > Best wishes, > Liz J > > > >

Hi everyone, We've identified Cornelia Maas, born about 1675, who married Johannes Holsaert II and Rutgert Waldron in the New York Dutch church. I have a web page online now which gives details of four generations of her ancestors, several of whom lived in Amsterdam. There is a good amount of new information here. Hulsart and Hulst descendants, Waldron researchers, and certain Bennet and Emans/Emmons descendants will want to have a look. Shahaan descendants, certain Romeyn descendants, some Thomas/Thomaszen researchers, and certain Tobias researchers will also want to see. Cornelia Maas' ancestors include: * Thomas Franszen of England, who married two Dutch wives in New Amsterdam. * Urbanus Luursen, a master mason, who owned several properties in Amsterdam including three in a row, two of which he built. He was drowned in the Prinses Amelia shipwreck of 1647. His wife was Jannetje Claes of Amsterdam, who married twice more after his death. As noted below, this Jannetje Claes in New Amsterdam - NY records was most often known as Jannetje 'Boonen'. * Claes Arents, a butcher who lived in the Kalverstraat in Amsterdam, and his wife Beatrix Hermans, of (probably) Veere, Zeeland. In this article, I have an image of the beautiful and rare signature of Johannes Holsaert I, Cornelia Maas' father-in-law. He was the town clerk of Flatlands for only a few years before he died there in 1687. He is the forefather of the Hulsart and Hulst families of New York, New Jersey, and beyond. A significant side effect of this research provided the correct identification of Jannetje "Boonen", whose name appears several times in New Amsterdam / NY church records and in the Orphanmasters records of New Amsterdam. She was Jannetje Claes, baptized in 1619 in Amsterdam. The surname she was ususally known by in New Amsterdam was dervied from her first husband's first name. Another result of this effort was the identification of Rutgert Waldron's so-called daughter Anna Holseart, mentioned in his 1720 will as one of his seven children. But there is no space in his two marriages for a daughter Ann to have been born and to have married a Holseart man by 1720. This Anna Holseart was his step-daughter, a child of his second wife's first marriage. This article was made possible by the collaborative effort of several people, whose input, contributions and suggestions were invaluable in sorting out these families. I thank these persons in the article. Here also I would like to thank the invisible Roberto (whoever he is), the senior website technician who maintains the Stadsarchief Amstersam databases. "Ancestors of Cornelia Maas, Wife of Johannes Holsaert and Rutgert Waldron" can be found here: http://17thcenturyhollanders.pbworks.com/w/page/65172546/Ancestors%20of%20Cornelia%20Maas%2C%20Wife%20of%20Johannes%20Holsaert%20and%20Rutgert%20Waldron#view=edit Enjoy the article. Questions, comments, corrections or suggestions are always welcome. Best wishes, Liz J

Johannes Fonteyn and Catharine Willemse Cornel's daughter, Angenietjel Agnete born say 1700, Bushwick , m (1) Wiljam Prikket deceased by 1728. When William's widow, Antenietje baptised "Agnete 3 mo. old, 28 Sept 1729, the mother is Agnete Fontaynen, daughter of Hannes Fontayne," "She gives the father as one Jacob Gulig, son of Schreiners, unbaptised ... Wit. Sarah, wife of young Hannes Fontayne, who is also unbaptised though I did not know it." The baptism on location by the pastor of the Lutheran church of NYC, she later married 29 March 1730 RDCh. Kingston, Ulster Co. NY William Lamb. In this case Agnete Fonteyn Prikket was a widow, the child was not by her husband, rather the father was one Jacob Gulig who she did not marry. But there seemed to be no repercussions about this, Rather she baptized the child and married William Lamb a year later. Whether this was because while she had been baptized, Jacob Gulig was not, and she had the child baptized I can't say. Judy Cassidy Source: Judith Smith Cassidy, "Which Charles Fontyn?" New Netherlands Connection, Vol. 15, 2010: 2; Roswell Russell Hoes, Baptisms and Marriage Registers of the Old Dutch Church of Kingston, Ulster County New York, 1660-1809, 558 citing entry 699; "Baptisms in the Lutheran Ch. of NYC," NYGBR 97: 169 and NYBGR 98: 100; Kenneth E. Hasbrouck, Records of the Dutch Reformed Church of Fishkill, Dutchess Co. NY 1731-1850 54, 64; The highland refers to the area along the east side of the Hudson in Dutchess County, south of Poughkeepsie. On 04/03/13, juliasgenes<juliasgenes@yahoo.com> wrote: I was wondering what the common practice at the time might have been, even though individual cases would have varied, of course. That Catharina would have married 17 months after giving birth to the child, and to a minister at that, implies to me that standards in the heavily Dutch & Palatine-influenced Hudson Valley differed from those of Puritan-influenced New England. By 1808, scarlet letters and sentencing to the stocks was over, but an unwed mother may not have been embraced by the community if they knew about the child. The family may have tried to conceal the birth altogether by sending the pregnant woman away. This doesn't seem to be the case here, though. Johann Jost Frantz embraced his grandchild by specifially leaving him money. Was this culture more forgiving than that of Puritan New England and more willing to live and let live? I think it's quite reasonable to assume that "1808 baptized David" = "1811 will David Crawford". But whether or not "1808 mommy Catharine Frantz" = "1810 marriage Catherine Frans" is another question, which is why I mentioned that possibility. However, there is precedent for it being her in that marriage record as several of Catharina Frantz's siblings are known to have married at the RDC/Shawangunk and are listed in that very same small book under the name of "Frans": Anatje, Joseph, and Elizabeth. I tried searching in Google and Bing for any genealogy information on the "Pulvereck" name and came up completely empty. The only hits I got were for German-lanuage websites that mentioned the word as structures in a fort that translated from "Pulvereck" to "powder corner", similar in appearance to the bastions in star forts. There were no surname references and certainly no genealogical info. So, my question about how the children of unmarried women were named in the early 1800s has no common-practice answer? Oh, well. ________________________________ > >From: James Harder <[1]jaharder88@yahoo.com> > > I've seen it all three ways it that period: > Child taking the presumptive father's surname even without a marriage or proof. > Child taking the mother's surname. > Child taking the step-father's surname when the mother marries. > ====================================================================== ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DU[2]TCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message References 1. mailto:jaharder88@yahoo.com 2. mailto:TCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com

The only thing I can offer is my ggg grandmother's child from Schenectady in 1798. Neeltje Schermerhorn had an illegitimate child who was baptized in the DRC there as Clarasa Van Slyck that year. The child is mentioned twice--in her mother's New Testament (which I have) with her list of all her children, where she is given no surname at all. This led me to ask the list, some years back, to help me find her father. Lorine found the baptismal record, where she was shown with her father's name. Lorine scoured other documents, and she didn't show up in marriage records or wills, so she concluded this child died young. So in this particular case, the illegitimate child was given the surname of the father, Harmannus Van Slyke. As Julia notes, this case could well be the exception to whatever convention there might have been. Doris On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 11:31 PM, juliasgenes <juliasgenes@yahoo.com> wrote: > I was wondering what the common practice at the time might have been, even > though individual cases would have varied, of course. > > That Catharina would have married 17 months after giving birth to the > child, and to a minister at that, implies to me that standards in the > heavily Dutch & Palatine-influenced Hudson Valley differed from those of > Puritan-influenced New England. By 1808, scarlet letters and sentencing to > the stocks was over, but an unwed mother may not have been embraced by the > community if they knew about the child. The family may have tried to > conceal the birth altogether by sending the pregnant woman away. This > doesn't seem to be the case here, though. Johann Jost Frantz embraced his > grandchild by specifially leaving him money. Was this culture more > forgiving than that of Puritan New England and more willing to live and let > live? > > I think it's quite reasonable to assume that "1808 baptized David" = "1811 > will David Crawford". But whether or not "1808 mommy Catharine Frantz" = > "1810 marriage Catherine Frans" is another question, which is why I > mentioned that possibility. > > However, there is precedent for it being her in that marriage record as > several of Catharina Frantz's siblings are known to have married at the > RDC/Shawangunk and are listed in that very same small book under the name > of "Frans": Anatje, Joseph, and Elizabeth. I tried searching in Google and > Bing for any genealogy information on the "Pulvereck" name and came up > completely empty. The only hits I got were for German-lanuage websites that > mentioned the word as structures in a fort that translated from "Pulvereck" > to "powder corner", similar in appearance to the bastions in star forts. > There were no surname references and certainly no genealogical info. > > So, my question about how the children of unmarried women were named in > the early 1800s has no common-practice answer? Oh, well. > > > > > ________________________________ > > > >From: James Harder <jaharder88@yahoo.com> > > > > I've seen it all three ways it that period: > > Child taking the presumptive father's surname even without a marriage or > proof. > > Child taking the mother's surname. > > Child taking the step-father's surname when the mother marries. > > > ====================================================================== > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

I was wondering what the common practice at the time might have been, even though individual cases would have varied, of course. That Catharina would have married 17 months after giving birth to the child, and to a minister at that, implies to me that standards in the heavily Dutch & Palatine-influenced Hudson Valley differed from those of Puritan-influenced New England. By 1808, scarlet letters and sentencing to the stocks was over, but an unwed mother may not have been embraced by the community if they knew about the child. The family may have tried to conceal the birth altogether by sending the pregnant woman away. This doesn't seem to be the case here, though. Johann Jost Frantz embraced his grandchild by specifially leaving him money. Was this culture more forgiving than that of Puritan New England and more willing to live and let live? I think it's quite reasonable to assume that "1808 baptized David" = "1811 will David Crawford". But whether or not "1808 mommy Catharine Frantz" = "1810  marriage Catherine Frans" is another question, which is why I mentioned that possibility. However, there is precedent for it being her in that marriage record as several of Catharina Frantz's siblings are known to have married at the RDC/Shawangunk and are listed in that very same small book under the name of "Frans": Anatje, Joseph, and Elizabeth. I tried searching in Google and Bing for any genealogy information on the "Pulvereck" name and came up completely empty. The only hits I got were for German-lanuage websites that mentioned the word as structures in a fort that translated from "Pulvereck" to "powder corner", similar in appearance to the bastions in star forts. There were no surname references and certainly no genealogical info. So, my question about how the children of unmarried women were named in the early 1800s has no common-practice answer? Oh, well. ________________________________ > >From: James Harder <jaharder88@yahoo.com> > > I've seen it all three ways it that period: > Child taking the presumptive father's surname even without a marriage or proof. > Child taking the mother's surname. > Child taking the step-father's surname when the mother marries. > ======================================================================

I have another background question for this list concerning the way the children of unmarried mothers were generally named in the early 19th century. Would they have been given the surname of their mother, the surname of the supposed father (even if not acknowledged in the baptism record), or the name of a step-father once the child gets one? ----------------------- This is why I ask: * David was born 18 Jan1808 and baptized at the German Reformed Church, Town of Montgomery, Orange County. His mother was given as Catherine French [Catharina Frantz], but he was labeled "illegitimate" and no father was named. David was sponsored by his grandparents, Gost France & Catherine Synsepaugh [Johann Jost Frantz and Catharina Sensebach]. * David's mother, Catharina Frantz [as Catherine Frans], seems to have married Rev. John Pulvereck at the RDC/Shawangunk on .23 Jun 1810 (unless this is a different woman). * In Johann Jost Frantz's will,  November 1811, he left money to his grandson, David Crawford (I am assuming that the baptized "illegitimate" infant David is this David). * Perhaps Catharina remarried to a man named Crawford, between her June 1810 marriage to Pulvereck and the writing of the will in November 1811, who became the child's step-father. Thank you for your time, Julia -------------------------

The news that the Dorland Family Cemetery in Somerset County, Montgomery Twp. Sunset Road is actually located on three different lots, Crawford House and two neighboring properties, came as a great surprise to us all. We have always believed that the entire Cemetery was located on Crawford House land, the current owners. Mike Vandewoude who is on the Board of the New Netherlands Institute, lives near the Lambert Dorland house and recently brought this to my attention. Apparently there is a monument no one was aware of in someones back yard. I was flabbergasted as I had no idea nor did other descendants and many of us have been there mulitple times over the years. Crawford House has owned the land where the Dorland Family Cemetery is located since 1978 or so. For many years we have tried to fence in this cemetery, clean it up, but since we don't own the land we have often been unsuccessful in keeping it maintained. Crawford House is a half-way house for recovering women addicts and privacy is important to them. When I began visiting and exploring this cemetery about 1979, there was an old fence dividing it from the field on the other side, which I could never get to and I never even able to climb over because of the barbed wire wrapped around the wooden fence. It was a long walk through overgrown fields to get to it from the road; I had no reason at that date to go. It was so overgrown at the time, all you could see were stumps, wild grass etc. My friend Ursula Brecknell who was very active in many capacities in the township was not aware of the situation either. Houses were later built on the land on the other side of the fence. The houses on the other 2 lots, located over the fence abutting the cemetery, weren't built beginning in 1986. This means that there is an entire section of the cemetery we were never aware of in two neighbors yards. I am waiting for a photo, on one of those lots. I have no idea just how much of the cemetery extends over onto those lots. . Mike has taken a great interest in this historic Dorland Cemetery which he feels should be protected and has formed a committee to do that. He and his wife are also affiliated Crawford House, which is very helpful to us. The Dorland and related families marked their graves with field stones which probably had dates or initials carved into them when in use between 1739-1800. Unfortunately over the years, those stones have sunk and many just peek above the ground. This was a simple rural Low Dutch farm Cemetery, one of the few left in existence today. English Tombstones or the traditional tombstones were never erected on these graves as it was sold out of the family by the end of the 1700's. Once the farm on which the family cemetery exists is sold out of the family, you lose any control you normally might have. For generations descendants have tried to buy this particular cemetery only to be told "no sale." Many local residents did not realize that the cemetery existed. Descendants did however, as Nathaniel Mc Pherson Durling wrote about it in the John Cremer;s Dorland genealogy. The belief was if a cemetery had English style gravestones, it was a cemetery, if not it wasn't. If you have seen photo's of the cemetery at the Conewago Reformed Dutch Church in now Adams County, where descendants of the families of the Van Harlingen DRC and others are buried you will noticed that for the most part, rocks were used and in some cases replaced later by English style stones. Mike is going to work with the Boys Scouts to restore the cemetery and erect a wooden fence around it. The Historic Landmarks commission met last night and they have approved this project. We are very grateful to Mike that this new information has come to light and while i don't know at this time, what the plans are for the part of the cemetery located in the neighboring back yards, at least we are now aware of its existence. Judy Cassidy

Per an earlier post, please correct "3. Re Jan Van Cleef and de Peel, Limburg, (cor snabel)." That was my error, thinking of the Lane family that married with the Van Cleefs in my own line. The Lane family (Laen, Lanen) bore the van Peelt (Pelt) distinguisher, not the Van Cleefs. Again, I apologize for my early error, which was a simple slip of the mind several years ago. Oh my god, how I detest that the simplest of errors can become something taken as a fact. Again, this demonstrates how very important it is to do and prove your own research, and never take someone else's work for granted without checking sources. This was NOT Cor's error, it was mine, and as I descend from a marriage between the Van Cleef and Lane (ven Pelt) families, it was just a mistake made 13 years ago. How these things come back to haunt us! With all due apologies, Bryce Stevens -----Original Message----- From: dutch-colonies-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:dutch-colonies-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Jo Culberson Sent: Monday, March 25, 2013 4:50 PM To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] DUTCH-COLONIES Digest, Vol 8, Issue 49 Janice, I am fascinated by the Van Cleef line; I descend from Neeltje who married Kryn Janse Van Meter (various spellings) through a tangled web of Van Meters to the Cartmells of Virginia and Ohio. If we have any common ancestors would you be interested in sharing data? Jo Culberson On Mon, Mar 25, 2013 at 12:01 AM, <dutch-colonies-request@rootsweb.com>wrote: > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Catharin de Hooges, wife of Harmanus Rutgers > (W David Samuelsen) > 2. Jan Van Cleef and de Peel, Limburg (Janice Pranger) > 3. Re: Jan Van Cleef and de Peel, Limburg (cor snabel) > 4. Re: Catharin de Hooges, wife of Harmanus Rutgers (juliasgenes) > 5. Re: Catharin de Hooges, wife of Harmanus Rutgers > (W David Samuelsen) > 6. Given name question: Christophel, Christopher, Christian > (juliasgenes) > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: W David Samuelsen <dsam52@sampubco.com> > To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com > Cc: > Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2013 02:11:46 -0600 > Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Catharin de Hooges, wife of Harmanus > Rutgers Hope you won't pull your hairs off your head when you try > Ulster County's backwardish filming of probate files > > The index card is at the end of each file, rather than the start then > go backward because the next sheet is not at the beginning but at the > end, right before the index card, 3rd sheet likwise before 2nd, so on. > > David Samuelsen > > On 3/24/2013 12:53 AM, James Harder wrote: > >> I know that Wyoming is not the only county that has numerous old >> documents stacked in boxes in a back room! >> >> Jim >> > > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Janice Pranger <jan.pranger@sbcglobal.net> > To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com > Cc: > Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2013 12:04:46 -0700 (PDT) > Subject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Jan Van Cleef and de Peel, Limburg Hello > List, > > I have been searching the Dutch Colonies Archives for information > about the descendants of Jan Van Cleef and Engeltje Laurens, and found > a 17 Jul 2000 response from Cor Snabel about the Van Cleef roots in "de Peel", Limburg. > > Searched but couldn't find the source for this connection between the > Van Cleef family and this particular area of the Netherlands. Can > someone tell me where to find this? > > > Many thanks, > > Jan Pranger > > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: cor snabel <cor.snabel@gmail.com> > To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com > Cc: > Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2013 20:38:38 +0100 > Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Jan Van Cleef and de Peel, Limburg > Hello Janice, > > > I have been searching the Dutch Colonies Archives for information about > the > > descendants of Jan Van Cleef and Engeltje Laurens, and found a 17 Jul > 2000 > > response from Cor Snabel about the Van Cleef roots in "de Peel", Limburg. > > My mail in July 2000 was a response to a query of Bryce Stevens who > wrote "Peelt, Limburg, the Van Cleef home town". > I know he is still around, I remember seeing a message from him > earlier this year. Maybe he can shed some light on this. > > Regards > Cor Snabel > > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: juliasgenes <juliasgenes@yahoo.com> > To: "dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com" <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> > Cc: > Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2013 14:23:09 -0700 (PDT) > Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Catharin de Hooges, wife of Harmanus Rutgers > Are the majority of Ulster's probate records filmed and online or through > Sampubco, even if backwards, or were some abandoned unsorted in those > storage boxes? > > > > > ________________________________ > > > > From: W David Samuelsen <dsam52@sampubco.com> > > > > . . .Ulster County's backwardish filming of probate files. . . > > > =========================================================== > > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: W David Samuelsen <dsam52@sampubco.com> > To: juliasgenes <juliasgenes@yahoo.com>, dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com > Cc: > Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2013 17:33:41 -0600 > Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Catharin de Hooges, wife of Harmanus Rutgers > not sure if all online and NOT through SAMPUBCO. > > As for the meaning of majority of probate records, there is the matter of > Estate Tax Records which is more detailed than the probate files, not every > county have theirs available to the public yet. At least Orange and > Westchester counties have them online. New York estate tax started in 1885. > > David Samuelsen > > On 3/24/2013 3:23 PM, juliasgenes wrote: > >> Are the majority of Ulster's probate records filmed and online or through >> Sampubco, even if backwards, or were some abandoned unsorted in those >> storage boxes? >> >> > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: juliasgenes <juliasgenes@yahoo.com> > To: "dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com" <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> > Cc: > Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2013 22:27:43 -0700 (PDT) > Subject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Given name question: Christophel, Christopher, > Christian > I know that the Sensebachs (w/numerous & imaginative spelling variations) > are Palatine, not Dutch, but they lived within the Dutch sphere and perhaps > given names followed Dutch traditions. > > > A 2nd generation son of Johann Philip Sensebach appears as Christophel, > Christopher, and Christian in records. Are these names equivalents? Is > Christian a Dutchified or Anglicized version of Christophel/ Christopher? > Is Stoffel a related name, perhaps a nickname for Christophel? The man's > daughter, Catharina, married Johann Jost Frantz and had a son they named > Christian. Apparently a namesake? > > Thank you. > > > To contact the DUTCH-COLONIES list administrator, send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES-admin@rootsweb.com. > > To post a message to the DUTCH-COLONIES mailing list, send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES@rootsweb.com. > > __________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com > with the word "unsubscribe" without the quotes in the subject and the body > of the > email with no additional text. > > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message