Hi Ethel, There is a Dietrich Wannemacher mentioned on the Hunter Lists starting in July 1710 and continuing to 12 Sep 1712. This is from Hank Jones' Even More Palatine Families. There is information in Hank Jones' Palatine Families 1710 on many other member of this family. Richard

If you do not find them at your library, send me the info and I will try to find what you want here at our Ky. Historical Society. Donna ----- Original Message ----- From: "Agnes Mitchell" <almitch1@earthlink.net> To: <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, February 18, 2007 8:02 PM Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Wanamaker - Rev Kocherthal records > > Never! Am going to have to check them out. Need all the info I can get. > alm > >> [Original Message] >> From: Donna Stark <donnaStarkKy@fewpb.net> >> To: <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> >> Date: 2/18/2007 8:01:25 PM >> Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Wanamaker - Rev Kocherthal records >> >> Have you heard of the Germanna Books? They have great information on the >> German Immigrants. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: <ETHELKK@aol.com> >> To: <Dutch-Colonies@rootsweb.com> >> Sent: Sunday, February 18, 2007 7:18 PM >> Subject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Wanamaker - Rev Kocherthal records >> >> >> > Adam Wanamaker (Jr). son of Adam Wanamaker (Sr) and Dorothea, married >> > Anna >> > Margaretta and they had six children born in Leeheim, Darmstadt, > Germany. >> > I >> > am trying to find the about date when they emigrated to New York and > if >> > they >> > were part of the 1708 Palatine migration. >> > >> > Their eldest son Dietrich, bp 4 Oct 1682 in Leeheim, and Anna Margaret >> > Luz, >> > were supposedly married January 1709 by the Rev. J. Kocherthal. I >> > have >> > the West Camp Lutheran Church, NY records by Rev. Kocherthal and the >> > marriage >> > is not recorded in the records. Their first child Michael bp 27 > Aug >> > 1710 >> > is entered on page 17. >> > >> > If they were married January 1709, would they be included in the >> > first >> > migration in 1708. Is there a list of the 1708 Palatines. >> > >> > Ethel >> > >> > Source: The Book of Names Especially Relating to the Early Palatines > and >> > the >> > First Settlers in the Mohawk Valley. Compiled and Arranged by Lou D >> > MacWethy >> > Gen Pub Co 1969 Among the many records are the Rev Joshua > Kocherthal >> > records. [A good book if you have Palatine ancestors.] >> > >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------- >> > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> > DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without >> > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > >> > >> > >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > >

The issue here is a boy who was living among Indians (I assume Algonquins) and at what age did males wed in that society? I haven't the faintest idea, but I certainly cannot say without study whether 17 was too young. Among the colonial Dutch in the 17th century, the normal age for marriage was 21 for males and 18 for females. If a girl was as young as 16 when she married, she was most likely pregnant. If she were younger than that, the normal practice was for her not to marry and so have the child out of wedlock. Apparently the Dutch thought that younger than 16, a girl was not mature enough to make an informed choice of marriage partner. There is certainly no evidence in New York State's colonial records that girls were marrying as young as you suggest. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Donna Stark" <donnaStarkKy@fewpb.net> To: <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, February 18, 2007 12:14 PM Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Evert Pels "boy" > In that time period it was not unusual for a young boy to take a wife. > Girls > even married at 12, 13 and 14, so take that into consideration. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "l. s." <lemaes63@msn.com> > To: "dutch" <Dutch-Colonies-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Sunday, February 18, 2007 9:41 AM > Subject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Evert Pels "boy" > > >> Hello, >> I am wondering if anyone knows any more about this person. I am wondering >> how the name Hendrick was given to this "boy" The one who was taken >> captive by the Indians in 1659. It was written he took a wife among the >> Indians. But, looking at the possible birth day for this boy, he would >> probably be only 16-17 years old. His parents married Dec. 1641. Even if >> he was an early baby, he would be quite young to take a bride. Is it >> possible he may have been called Pels "boy", because he was a young boy >> who worked for Evert? And yet, he seems to have been given a name. Who >> has >> that record? >> How were possible birth dates given to Everts children. I have only found >> three that were baptized. I kind of was guessing on some of them, by >> checking the possible marriage dates and subtracting 18-20. I would love >> to have better church records or family Bible records. >> Thanks for any information, >> LeemaeGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : >> http://explorer.msn.com >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without >> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >> > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Never! Am going to have to check them out. Need all the info I can get. alm > [Original Message] > From: Donna Stark <donnaStarkKy@fewpb.net> > To: <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> > Date: 2/18/2007 8:01:25 PM > Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Wanamaker - Rev Kocherthal records > > Have you heard of the Germanna Books? They have great information on the > German Immigrants. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <ETHELKK@aol.com> > To: <Dutch-Colonies@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Sunday, February 18, 2007 7:18 PM > Subject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Wanamaker - Rev Kocherthal records > > > > Adam Wanamaker (Jr). son of Adam Wanamaker (Sr) and Dorothea, married > > Anna > > Margaretta and they had six children born in Leeheim, Darmstadt, Germany. > > I > > am trying to find the about date when they emigrated to New York and if > > they > > were part of the 1708 Palatine migration. > > > > Their eldest son Dietrich, bp 4 Oct 1682 in Leeheim, and Anna Margaret > > Luz, > > were supposedly married January 1709 by the Rev. J. Kocherthal. I > > have > > the West Camp Lutheran Church, NY records by Rev. Kocherthal and the > > marriage > > is not recorded in the records. Their first child Michael bp 27 Aug > > 1710 > > is entered on page 17. > > > > If they were married January 1709, would they be included in the first > > migration in 1708. Is there a list of the 1708 Palatines. > > > > Ethel > > > > Source: The Book of Names Especially Relating to the Early Palatines and > > the > > First Settlers in the Mohawk Valley. Compiled and Arranged by Lou D > > MacWethy > > Gen Pub Co 1969 Among the many records are the Rev Joshua Kocherthal > > records. [A good book if you have Palatine ancestors.] > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Have you heard of the Germanna Books? They have great information on the German Immigrants. ----- Original Message ----- From: <ETHELKK@aol.com> To: <Dutch-Colonies@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, February 18, 2007 7:18 PM Subject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Wanamaker - Rev Kocherthal records > Adam Wanamaker (Jr). son of Adam Wanamaker (Sr) and Dorothea, married > Anna > Margaretta and they had six children born in Leeheim, Darmstadt, Germany. > I > am trying to find the about date when they emigrated to New York and if > they > were part of the 1708 Palatine migration. > > Their eldest son Dietrich, bp 4 Oct 1682 in Leeheim, and Anna Margaret > Luz, > were supposedly married January 1709 by the Rev. J. Kocherthal. I > have > the West Camp Lutheran Church, NY records by Rev. Kocherthal and the > marriage > is not recorded in the records. Their first child Michael bp 27 Aug > 1710 > is entered on page 17. > > If they were married January 1709, would they be included in the first > migration in 1708. Is there a list of the 1708 Palatines. > > Ethel > > Source: The Book of Names Especially Relating to the Early Palatines and > the > First Settlers in the Mohawk Valley. Compiled and Arranged by Lou D > MacWethy > Gen Pub Co 1969 Among the many records are the Rev Joshua Kocherthal > records. [A good book if you have Palatine ancestors.] > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > >

Hi Ethel, From: <ETHELKK@aol.com> Sent: Sunday, February 18, 2007 4:18 PM Subject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Wanamaker - Rev Kocherthal records > Adam Wanamaker (Jr). son of Adam Wanamaker (Sr) and Dorothea, married Anna > Margaretta and they had six children born in Leeheim, Darmstadt, Germany. I > am trying to find the about date when they emigrated to New York and if they > were part of the 1708 Palatine migration. > > Their eldest son Dietrich, bp 4 Oct 1682 in Leeheim, and Anna Margaret Luz, > were supposedly married January 1709 by the Rev. J. Kocherthal. I have > the West Camp Lutheran Church, NY records by Rev. Kocherthal and the marriage > is not recorded in the records. Their first child Michael bp 27 Aug 1710 > is entered on page 17. > > If they were married January 1709, would they be included in the first > migration in 1708. Is there a list of the 1708 Palatines. > > Ethel > > Source: The Book of Names Especially Relating to the Early Palatines and the > First Settlers in the Mohawk Valley. Compiled and Arranged by Lou D MacWethy > Gen Pub Co 1969 Among the many records are the Rev Joshua Kocherthal > records. [A good book if you have Palatine ancestors.] The 1708 list is pretty short and the Wanamakers are not on it. See CDNY vol 4, pp 52-53. Your best source for Palatines to New York would be Henry Z. Jones' three books. In particular his book, Even More Palatine FAmilies, vol. 3 has the best version of the Hunter subsistence lists of 1710 to 1713. This site has has, I believe, used those lists to reconstruct some passenger lists. http://www.progenealogists.com/palproject/ny/index.html Your "Johann Dietrich Wannemacher, 27, and Anna Margaretha (Lüz)" are shown on the Fifth list. Apparently they are first listed on the 1 July 1710 subsistence list. So, they probably arrived a little bit before that (you'd have to check when the next earlier payment was). Kocherthal's records from the Book of Names are online here: http://threerivershms.com/nameskocherthal.htm I don't see the marriage you mention. And the date seems impossible based on the subsistence lists. So, what was your source of "supposedly married January 1709 by the Rev. J. Kocherthal"? Something else in MacWethy's book? Beware, people can make mistakes re. dates. Perhaps your Jan 1709 should be Jan 1709/10. However, as they apparently were part of the large 1710 migration, be aware that those people got on board ship in London in Dec of 1709 and sat on board until they finally left Plymouth on 10 April 1710. Another good book on the Palatine migration is: Early Eighteenth Century Palatine Emigration by Walter Allen Knittle. According to him (see pp 43-46), although Rev. K. returned to London in 1709, he did not lead nor was part of the 1710 migration. Indeed, looking at his records here: http://threerivershms.com/nameskocherthal.htm it does not appear he could have been on one of those ships. Regards, Howard hswain@ix.netcom.com

Here are a few "outiside the box" thoughts, Howard: Have you considered the possibility that Wolster/Welster is a type of place, rather than a political subdivision? I'm thinking along the lines of the Hague, which I've read means the hedge, although it obviously eventually became a city name. I'm also thinking of such "Vander" names as Van der Hoef (Hof meaning yard or station or station in German), which also makes me think that "van der" implies Germanic roots, whereas I think of "van de" implies Dutch. Also, I assume you've seen the family that appears to have been Woltzer in the 17th century but Wolster in the 18th: http://www.deltgen.com/deltgen/f_4d2.html#30 Chris On 2/18/07, Howard Swain <hswain@ix.netcom.com> wrote: > > Hi all, > > Thanks to all who responded. > They idea of Ulster had occured to me. It was interesting that Rick > actually found the spelling Wolster for Ulster in print. It also seemed > to me that the "-ster" ending seemed more English than Dutch or German. > So, Pete's suggesting of Worcester might be a possibility. However, > maybe "-ster" is Anglo-Saxon so maybe also occurs where the Angles > and Saxon's came from? Like the place Chris suggested. > > Although, men from the British Isles did go to The Netherlands to help > them fight the Spanish, I would have thought this would have ended > after the Peace of Westphalia in 1648. I don't recall any men that > came directly from the British Isles to New Netherland as soldiers; > so I would have expected them to go first to The Netherlands and > then transfer. But because Pieter P. arrived in 1658 and seemed so > young (if all these are the same guy), then that double move seems > unlikely. > I now remember Brian Newton; but did he come directly from England > as a soldier? > > Anyway, my guess would have been that Pieter P. came from The Netherlands > or an > adjoining country. As Chris mentions, there are other men known to have > come from what is now Germany as soldiers. Also, if he came from a > place in Ireland or Britain, I doubt he would have had "van der Welster" > appended to his name. > > The above is about all I can say in answer to Chris' first question. > > As to his religion, my hypothesis is that he is the Pieter Pauluszen who > baptized two daughters in the NA RDC in 1663 and 1666; but he > does not seem to have joined the church. The only lists I have of > Lutherans are petitions of 1657 and 1659 asking for a Lutheran > minister. But Pieter was still at New Amstel then. So, I don't know > his religion. (I might also mention that Hendrick Jansen Spier who did > sign > the Lutheran petition also baptized his children in the NA RDC.) > > So, I believe the Pieter Pauluszen could well have been a German Lutheran. > And Chris' suggestion of Wilster looks like the best possibility to me so > far. > > Regards, > Howard > hswain@ix.netcom.com > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <brookskcmo@aol.com> > To: <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, February 16, 2007 11:26 AM > Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Location of Wolster/Welster? > > > > Howard > > > > I've never seen a location in the Nederlands similar to Wolster or > Welster, so do you have anything to show he might be Dutch? Do you know his > religion? Is it possible that Peter Pousen was German or at least from a > modern German area. There is a city near the Elbe river in present > Schleswig-Holstein named Wilster that dates back to the 1200's which is a > possible location you might wish to check out. Several years ago I knew two > brothers who were born there and they pronounced the town name as if it were > spelled "Velster" > > > > We know many early emigrants were from this area and many soldiers in > the Dutch service were actually Germans. The church records I believe are > still intact and date back to 1616, but they are not available through the > LDS Family History Library. > > > > Hope that may be of some help. > > > > Chris Brooks > > Kansas City, Missouri > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: hswain@ix.netcom.com > > To: Dutch-Colonies@rootsweb.com > > Sent: Thu, 15 Feb 2007 7:07 PM > > Subject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Location of Wolster/Welster? > > > > > > Hi all, > > > > On 21 Feb. 1664 there was an order for the payment of arrears > > due to Peter Paulusen van der Welster, a soldier. > > [CDM p. 261] > > > > On 5 April 1674 "Peter Poulsen, aged 43 years, born at Wolster," > > was accused of assaulting people in the streets of New Orange. > > [CDNY 2:703] > > > > Since o and e in 17th C. handwriting looked similar, I assume that > > O'Callghan may have misread one of them and that this is the same > > guy from the same place. > > > > Furthermore, back in August 1658, Alrichs had written to Stuyvesant > > and mentioned the arrival of two soldiers, Evert Brantsen and Peter > Paulus, > > at New Amstel. > > > > I believe this is the same Peter. He would be about 17 or 18 when he > > arrived at New Amstel. I'm guessing he came from The Netherlands. > > > > But where is Wolster or Welster? Or what should the place be? > > I cannot seem to find any place named that nor a place that could be > > misread as that. > > > > Thanks for any ideas, > > Howard > > hswain@ix.netcom.com > > Standard Source Abbreviations: > > > http://www.newyorkfamilyhistory.org/modules.php?name=Sections&op=viewarticle&artid=96 > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Adam Wanamaker (Jr). son of Adam Wanamaker (Sr) and Dorothea, married Anna Margaretta and they had six children born in Leeheim, Darmstadt, Germany. I am trying to find the about date when they emigrated to New York and if they were part of the 1708 Palatine migration. Their eldest son Dietrich, bp 4 Oct 1682 in Leeheim, and Anna Margaret Luz, were supposedly married January 1709 by the Rev. J. Kocherthal. I have the West Camp Lutheran Church, NY records by Rev. Kocherthal and the marriage is not recorded in the records. Their first child Michael bp 27 Aug 1710 is entered on page 17. If they were married January 1709, would they be included in the first migration in 1708. Is there a list of the 1708 Palatines. Ethel Source: The Book of Names Especially Relating to the Early Palatines and the First Settlers in the Mohawk Valley. Compiled and Arranged by Lou D MacWethy Gen Pub Co 1969 Among the many records are the Rev Joshua Kocherthal records. [A good book if you have Palatine ancestors.]

Hi Leemae, From: "l. s." <lemaes63@msn.com> To: "dutch" <Dutch-Colonies-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, February 18, 2007 6:41 AM Subject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Evert Pels "boy" > Hello, > I am wondering if anyone knows any more about this person. I am wondering how the name Hendrick was given to this "boy" The one who was taken captive by the Indians in 1659. It was written he took a wife among the Indians. But, looking at the possible birth day for this boy, he would probably be only 16-17 years old. His parents married Dec. 1641. Even if he was an early baby, he would be quite young to take a bride. Is it possible he may have been called Pels "boy", because he was a young boy who worked for Evert? And yet, he seems to have been given a name. Who has that record? > How were possible birth dates given to Everts children. I have only found three that were baptized. I kind of was guessing on some of them, by checking the possible marriage dates and subtracting 18-20. I would love to have better church records or family Bible records. > Thanks for any information, When Evert Pels came on Den Houttuyn in 1642 he came with his wife and "his servant". This is from a memo that Van Rensselaer wrote for Megapolensis (who was also on the ship). The name of Evert Pels' servant is not shown. See VRBM p. 609. Also, the Notarial Records abstracted in New Netherland Connections vols 4 and 5 do not show the engagement by Pels of a servant in the months before departure. Could this servant have been the "boy" you refer to? Is the only name you have for him Hendrick? No patronymic or surname? You mention "It was written he took a wife...." Where is this written? And does that place have only the single name "Hendrick" for him? Or does it call him Hendrick Pels? (Note: David Riker's Directory does not show a son Hendrick for Evert Pels.) Regards, Howard hswain@ix.netcom.com

Hi all, Thanks to all who responded. They idea of Ulster had occured to me. It was interesting that Rick actually found the spelling Wolster for Ulster in print. It also seemed to me that the "-ster" ending seemed more English than Dutch or German. So, Pete's suggesting of Worcester might be a possibility. However, maybe "-ster" is Anglo-Saxon so maybe also occurs where the Angles and Saxon's came from? Like the place Chris suggested. Although, men from the British Isles did go to The Netherlands to help them fight the Spanish, I would have thought this would have ended after the Peace of Westphalia in 1648. I don't recall any men that came directly from the British Isles to New Netherland as soldiers; so I would have expected them to go first to The Netherlands and then transfer. But because Pieter P. arrived in 1658 and seemed so young (if all these are the same guy), then that double move seems unlikely. I now remember Brian Newton; but did he come directly from England as a soldier? Anyway, my guess would have been that Pieter P. came from The Netherlands or an adjoining country. As Chris mentions, there are other men known to have come from what is now Germany as soldiers. Also, if he came from a place in Ireland or Britain, I doubt he would have had "van der Welster" appended to his name. The above is about all I can say in answer to Chris' first question. As to his religion, my hypothesis is that he is the Pieter Pauluszen who baptized two daughters in the NA RDC in 1663 and 1666; but he does not seem to have joined the church. The only lists I have of Lutherans are petitions of 1657 and 1659 asking for a Lutheran minister. But Pieter was still at New Amstel then. So, I don't know his religion. (I might also mention that Hendrick Jansen Spier who did sign the Lutheran petition also baptized his children in the NA RDC.) So, I believe the Pieter Pauluszen could well have been a German Lutheran. And Chris' suggestion of Wilster looks like the best possibility to me so far. Regards, Howard hswain@ix.netcom.com ----- Original Message ----- From: <brookskcmo@aol.com> To: <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, February 16, 2007 11:26 AM Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Location of Wolster/Welster? > Howard > > I've never seen a location in the Nederlands similar to Wolster or Welster, so do you have anything to show he might be Dutch? Do you know his religion? Is it possible that Peter Pousen was German or at least from a modern German area. There is a city near the Elbe river in present Schleswig-Holstein named Wilster that dates back to the 1200's which is a possible location you might wish to check out. Several years ago I knew two brothers who were born there and they pronounced the town name as if it were spelled "Velster" > > We know many early emigrants were from this area and many soldiers in the Dutch service were actually Germans. The church records I believe are still intact and date back to 1616, but they are not available through the LDS Family History Library. > > Hope that may be of some help. > > Chris Brooks > Kansas City, Missouri > > > -----Original Message----- > From: hswain@ix.netcom.com > To: Dutch-Colonies@rootsweb.com > Sent: Thu, 15 Feb 2007 7:07 PM > Subject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Location of Wolster/Welster? > > > Hi all, > > On 21 Feb. 1664 there was an order for the payment of arrears > due to Peter Paulusen van der Welster, a soldier. > [CDM p. 261] > > On 5 April 1674 "Peter Poulsen, aged 43 years, born at Wolster," > was accused of assaulting people in the streets of New Orange. > [CDNY 2:703] > > Since o and e in 17th C. handwriting looked similar, I assume that > O'Callghan may have misread one of them and that this is the same > guy from the same place. > > Furthermore, back in August 1658, Alrichs had written to Stuyvesant > and mentioned the arrival of two soldiers, Evert Brantsen and Peter Paulus, > at New Amstel. > > I believe this is the same Peter. He would be about 17 or 18 when he > arrived at New Amstel. I'm guessing he came from The Netherlands. > > But where is Wolster or Welster? Or what should the place be? > I cannot seem to find any place named that nor a place that could be > misread as that. > > Thanks for any ideas, > Howard > hswain@ix.netcom.com > Standard Source Abbreviations: > http://www.newyorkfamilyhistory.org/modules.php?name=Sections&op=viewarticle&artid=96

In that time period it was not unusual for a young boy to take a wife. Girls even married at 12, 13 and 14, so take that into consideration. ----- Original Message ----- From: "l. s." <lemaes63@msn.com> To: "dutch" <Dutch-Colonies-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, February 18, 2007 9:41 AM Subject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Evert Pels "boy" > Hello, > I am wondering if anyone knows any more about this person. I am wondering > how the name Hendrick was given to this "boy" The one who was taken > captive by the Indians in 1659. It was written he took a wife among the > Indians. But, looking at the possible birth day for this boy, he would > probably be only 16-17 years old. His parents married Dec. 1641. Even if > he was an early baby, he would be quite young to take a bride. Is it > possible he may have been called Pels "boy", because he was a young boy > who worked for Evert? And yet, he seems to have been given a name. Who has > that record? > How were possible birth dates given to Everts children. I have only found > three that were baptized. I kind of was guessing on some of them, by > checking the possible marriage dates and subtracting 18-20. I would love > to have better church records or family Bible records. > Thanks for any information, > LeemaeGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : > http://explorer.msn.com > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > >

Hello, I am wondering if anyone knows any more about this person. I am wondering how the name Hendrick was given to this "boy" The one who was taken captive by the Indians in 1659. It was written he took a wife among the Indians. But, looking at the possible birth day for this boy, he would probably be only 16-17 years old. His parents married Dec. 1641. Even if he was an early baby, he would be quite young to take a bride. Is it possible he may have been called Pels "boy", because he was a young boy who worked for Evert? And yet, he seems to have been given a name. Who has that record? How were possible birth dates given to Everts children. I have only found three that were baptized. I kind of was guessing on some of them, by checking the possible marriage dates and subtracting 18-20. I would love to have better church records or family Bible records. Thanks for any information, LeemaeGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com

Howard I've never seen a location in the Nederlands similar to Wolster or Welster, so do you have anything to show he might be Dutch? Do you know his religion? Is it possible that Peter Pousen was German or at least from a modern German area. There is a city near the Elbe river in present Schleswig-Holstein named Wilster that dates back to the 1200's which is a possible location you might wish to check out. Several years ago I knew two brothers who were born there and they pronounced the town name as if it were spelled "Velster" We know many early emigrants were from this area and many soldiers in the Dutch service were actually Germans. The church records I believe are still intact and date back to 1616, but they are not available through the LDS Family History Library. Hope that may be of some help. Chris Brooks Kansas City, Missouri -----Original Message----- From: hswain@ix.netcom.com To: Dutch-Colonies@rootsweb.com Sent: Thu, 15 Feb 2007 7:07 PM Subject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Location of Wolster/Welster? Hi all, On 21 Feb. 1664 there was an order for the payment of arrears due to Peter Paulusen van der Welster, a soldier. [CDM p. 261] On 5 April 1674 "Peter Poulsen, aged 43 years, born at Wolster," was accused of assaulting people in the streets of New Orange. [CDNY 2:703] Since o and e in 17th C. handwriting looked similar, I assume that O'Callghan may have misread one of them and that this is the same guy from the same place. Furthermore, back in August 1658, Alrichs had written to Stuyvesant and mentioned the arrival of two soldiers, Evert Brantsen and Peter Paulus, at New Amstel. I believe this is the same Peter. He would be about 17 or 18 when he arrived at New Amstel. I'm guessing he came from The Netherlands. But where is Wolster or Welster? Or what should the place be? I cannot seem to find any place named that nor a place that could be misread as that. Thanks for any ideas, Howard hswain@ix.netcom.com Standard Source Abbreviations: http://www.newyorkfamilyhistory.org/modules.php?name=Sections&op=viewarticle&artid=96 ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ________________________________________________________________________ Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more.

Or, if out of England, maybe Worcester? Assuming it was pronounced "Wooster" back then. Hard to see how an English boy might end up a WIC soldier, of course. --pete ----- Original Message ----- From: <brookskcmo@aol.com> To: <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, February 16, 2007 1:26 PM Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Location of Wolster/Welster? > Howard > > I've never seen a location in the Nederlands similar to Wolster or Welster, so do you have anything to show he might be Dutch? Do you know his religion? Is it possible that Peter Pousen was German or at least from a modern German area. There is a city near the Elbe river in present Schleswig-Holstein named Wilster that dates back to the 1200's which is a possible location you might wish to check out. Several years ago I knew two brothers who were born there and they pronounced the town name as if it were spelled "Velster" > > We know many early emigrants were from this area and many soldiers in the Dutch service were actually Germans. The church records I believe are still intact and date back to 1616, but they are not available through the LDS Family History Library. > > Hope that may be of some help. > > Chris Brooks > Kansas City, Missouri > > > -----Original Message----- > From: hswain@ix.netcom.com > To: Dutch-Colonies@rootsweb.com > Sent: Thu, 15 Feb 2007 7:07 PM > Subject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Location of Wolster/Welster? > > > Hi all, > > On 21 Feb. 1664 there was an order for the payment of arrears > due to Peter Paulusen van der Welster, a soldier. > [CDM p. 261] > > On 5 April 1674 "Peter Poulsen, aged 43 years, born at Wolster," > was accused of assaulting people in the streets of New Orange. > [CDNY 2:703] > > Since o and e in 17th C. handwriting looked similar, I assume that > O'Callghan may have misread one of them and that this is the same > guy from the same place. > > Furthermore, back in August 1658, Alrichs had written to Stuyvesant > and mentioned the arrival of two soldiers, Evert Brantsen and Peter Paulus, > at New Amstel. > > I believe this is the same Peter. He would be about 17 or 18 when he > arrived at New Amstel. I'm guessing he came from The Netherlands. > > But where is Wolster or Welster? Or what should the place be? > I cannot seem to find any place named that nor a place that could be > misread as that. > > Thanks for any ideas, > Howard > hswain@ix.netcom.com > Standard Source Abbreviations: > http://www.newyorkfamilyhistory.org/modules.php?name=Sections&op=viewarticle&artid=96 > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of > the message > ________________________________________________________________________ > Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I only know Nancy Agnes and her father James in Shelby Co., Ky. (later Henry Co.). She married John Calvin Montfort here in Ky.They were part of the LKOw Dutch who came from New Amsterdam to N.J. then to Pa. then to Ky. in 1780. I have the Montfort family back to the French immigrant to New Amsterdam, then on to Ky. I just don't know any more about the Mitchell family. Donna ----- Original Message ----- From: "Roland Elliott" <rolandelliott@inreach.com> To: <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com>; <almitch1@earthlink.net> Sent: Friday, February 16, 2007 11:31 AM Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Dutch Cousins -KY - Sept 28-30 > Which Nancy Agnes do you have and no they are not Dutch they are > Scot/Irish > but as indentured to the Colonies they were thrown together in about one > day > when New > Amsterdam became New York in the 1660's,as the move away from the Brits > they > merged in settlements with the Dutch doing the same thing and remember > many > people called Dutch were not Dutch but the did leave Holland to get here > after escaping the now UK,also the Palatines were called PA Dutch because > of > their language . > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Donna Stark" <donnaStarkKy@fewpb.net> > To: <almitch1@earthlink.net>; <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, February 16, 2007 8:03 AM > Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Dutch Cousins -KY - Sept 28-30 > > > Hi Agnes, I have an ancestor who was named Nancy Agnes Mitchell, married > John Montfort. Do you have ancestors back to that Mitchell? You may be a > married Mitchell and not a born Mitchell. I have often wondered if the > Mitchells were part opf the Low Dutch because they stayed close and > married > within the group. Donna > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Agnes Mitchell" <almitch1@earthlink.net> > To: <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, February 16, 2007 9:17 AM > Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Dutch Cousins -KY - Sept 28-30 > > >> >> Me too. both, that is. alm >> >>> [Original Message] >>> From: Barbara Whiteside <bobbeo60@yahoo.com> >>> To: <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> >>> Date: 2/15/2007 11:21:26 PM >>> Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Dutch Cousins -KY - Sept 28-30 >>> >>> Email is fine with me...send to ktdink@earthlink.net >>> you are so organized...I guess you are a first born child....or at the >> least a Capricorn..or worse, like me...you are both. LOL >>> >>> Barbara Whiteside >>> ktdink@eartlhlink.net >>> bobbeo60@yahoo.com >>> >>> >>> Carolyn Leonard <buffalo234@cox.net> wrote: >>> Just a word about the Dutch Cousins Gathering to be Sept 28-30 2007 >>> in Shelbyville, KY. I am preparing a newsletter with registration >>> info to be mailed and emailed pretty quickly. It will have info for >>> the motels, RV parks, a bus tour of the old Dutch Tract, meals etc. >>> I prefer to send email to save time and postage, so if you and have >>> high speed and can open pdf attachments please send me ASAP your >>> email address to Buffalo234@cox.net. If not, please send your snail >>> mail address same address. This is going to be a wonderful weekend >>> and you won't want to miss a minute of it. >>> >>> Cousin to Cousin We'll Always Be >>> Special Friends >>> >From the Same Family Tree. >>> >>> Hugs, >>> Carolyn >>> Remember you have a friend in Oklahoma -- endlessly sorting out dead >>> relatives! >>> Researching COZINE in Kentucky, Kansas, Indiana, Pennsylvania, New >>> Jersey, Nieuw Amsterdam (New York) and the Netherlands. >>> See the photos of our DUTCH COUSINS gathering in Kentucky in 2005 here: >>> http://homepage.mac.com/carolynleonard/Dutch_Cousins/PhotoAlbum33.html >>> and The Anderson Cow Palace meeting house >>> http://homepage.mac.com/carolynleonard/Dutch_Cousins/PhotoAlbum32.html >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without >> the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >>> >>> Barbara Whiteside >>> bobbeo60@yahoo.com >>> >>> >>> --------------------------------- >>> Looking for earth-friendly autos? >>> Browse Top Cars by "Green Rating" at Yahoo! Autos' Green Center. >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without >> the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without >> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >> > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > >

Hi Agnes, I have an ancestor who was named Nancy Agnes Mitchell, married John Montfort. Do you have ancestors back to that Mitchell? You may be a married Mitchell and not a born Mitchell. I have often wondered if the Mitchells were part opf the Low Dutch because they stayed close and married within the group. Donna ----- Original Message ----- From: "Agnes Mitchell" <almitch1@earthlink.net> To: <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, February 16, 2007 9:17 AM Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Dutch Cousins -KY - Sept 28-30 > > Me too. both, that is. alm > >> [Original Message] >> From: Barbara Whiteside <bobbeo60@yahoo.com> >> To: <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> >> Date: 2/15/2007 11:21:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Dutch Cousins -KY - Sept 28-30 >> >> Email is fine with me...send to ktdink@earthlink.net >> you are so organized...I guess you are a first born child....or at the > least a Capricorn..or worse, like me...you are both. LOL >> >> Barbara Whiteside >> ktdink@eartlhlink.net >> bobbeo60@yahoo.com >> >> >> Carolyn Leonard <buffalo234@cox.net> wrote: >> Just a word about the Dutch Cousins Gathering to be Sept 28-30 2007 >> in Shelbyville, KY. I am preparing a newsletter with registration >> info to be mailed and emailed pretty quickly. It will have info for >> the motels, RV parks, a bus tour of the old Dutch Tract, meals etc. >> I prefer to send email to save time and postage, so if you and have >> high speed and can open pdf attachments please send me ASAP your >> email address to Buffalo234@cox.net. If not, please send your snail >> mail address same address. This is going to be a wonderful weekend >> and you won't want to miss a minute of it. >> >> Cousin to Cousin We'll Always Be >> Special Friends >> >From the Same Family Tree. >> >> Hugs, >> Carolyn >> Remember you have a friend in Oklahoma -- endlessly sorting out dead >> relatives! >> Researching COZINE in Kentucky, Kansas, Indiana, Pennsylvania, New >> Jersey, Nieuw Amsterdam (New York) and the Netherlands. >> See the photos of our DUTCH COUSINS gathering in Kentucky in 2005 here: >> http://homepage.mac.com/carolynleonard/Dutch_Cousins/PhotoAlbum33.html >> and The Anderson Cow Palace meeting house >> http://homepage.mac.com/carolynleonard/Dutch_Cousins/PhotoAlbum32.html >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >> Barbara Whiteside >> bobbeo60@yahoo.com >> >> >> --------------------------------- >> Looking for earth-friendly autos? >> Browse Top Cars by "Green Rating" at Yahoo! Autos' Green Center. >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > >

Me too. both, that is. alm > [Original Message] > From: Barbara Whiteside <bobbeo60@yahoo.com> > To: <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> > Date: 2/15/2007 11:21:26 PM > Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Dutch Cousins -KY - Sept 28-30 > > Email is fine with me...send to ktdink@earthlink.net > you are so organized...I guess you are a first born child....or at the least a Capricorn..or worse, like me...you are both. LOL > > Barbara Whiteside > ktdink@eartlhlink.net > bobbeo60@yahoo.com > > > Carolyn Leonard <buffalo234@cox.net> wrote: > Just a word about the Dutch Cousins Gathering to be Sept 28-30 2007 > in Shelbyville, KY. I am preparing a newsletter with registration > info to be mailed and emailed pretty quickly. It will have info for > the motels, RV parks, a bus tour of the old Dutch Tract, meals etc. > I prefer to send email to save time and postage, so if you and have > high speed and can open pdf attachments please send me ASAP your > email address to Buffalo234@cox.net. If not, please send your snail > mail address same address. This is going to be a wonderful weekend > and you won't want to miss a minute of it. > > Cousin to Cousin We'll Always Be > Special Friends > >From the Same Family Tree. > > Hugs, > Carolyn > Remember you have a friend in Oklahoma -- endlessly sorting out dead > relatives! > Researching COZINE in Kentucky, Kansas, Indiana, Pennsylvania, New > Jersey, Nieuw Amsterdam (New York) and the Netherlands. > See the photos of our DUTCH COUSINS gathering in Kentucky in 2005 here: > http://homepage.mac.com/carolynleonard/Dutch_Cousins/PhotoAlbum33.html > and The Anderson Cow Palace meeting house > http://homepage.mac.com/carolynleonard/Dutch_Cousins/PhotoAlbum32.html > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > Barbara Whiteside > bobbeo60@yahoo.com > > > --------------------------------- > Looking for earth-friendly autos? > Browse Top Cars by "Green Rating" at Yahoo! Autos' Green Center. > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Which Nancy Agnes do you have and no they are not Dutch they are Scot/Irish but as indentured to the Colonies they were thrown together in about one day when New Amsterdam became New York in the 1660's,as the move away from the Brits they merged in settlements with the Dutch doing the same thing and remember many people called Dutch were not Dutch but the did leave Holland to get here after escaping the now UK,also the Palatines were called PA Dutch because of their language . ----- Original Message ----- From: "Donna Stark" <donnaStarkKy@fewpb.net> To: <almitch1@earthlink.net>; <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, February 16, 2007 8:03 AM Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Dutch Cousins -KY - Sept 28-30 Hi Agnes, I have an ancestor who was named Nancy Agnes Mitchell, married John Montfort. Do you have ancestors back to that Mitchell? You may be a married Mitchell and not a born Mitchell. I have often wondered if the Mitchells were part opf the Low Dutch because they stayed close and married within the group. Donna ----- Original Message ----- From: "Agnes Mitchell" <almitch1@earthlink.net> To: <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, February 16, 2007 9:17 AM Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Dutch Cousins -KY - Sept 28-30 > > Me too. both, that is. alm > >> [Original Message] >> From: Barbara Whiteside <bobbeo60@yahoo.com> >> To: <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> >> Date: 2/15/2007 11:21:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Dutch Cousins -KY - Sept 28-30 >> >> Email is fine with me...send to ktdink@earthlink.net >> you are so organized...I guess you are a first born child....or at the > least a Capricorn..or worse, like me...you are both. LOL >> >> Barbara Whiteside >> ktdink@eartlhlink.net >> bobbeo60@yahoo.com >> >> >> Carolyn Leonard <buffalo234@cox.net> wrote: >> Just a word about the Dutch Cousins Gathering to be Sept 28-30 2007 >> in Shelbyville, KY. I am preparing a newsletter with registration >> info to be mailed and emailed pretty quickly. It will have info for >> the motels, RV parks, a bus tour of the old Dutch Tract, meals etc. >> I prefer to send email to save time and postage, so if you and have >> high speed and can open pdf attachments please send me ASAP your >> email address to Buffalo234@cox.net. If not, please send your snail >> mail address same address. This is going to be a wonderful weekend >> and you won't want to miss a minute of it. >> >> Cousin to Cousin We'll Always Be >> Special Friends >> >From the Same Family Tree. >> >> Hugs, >> Carolyn >> Remember you have a friend in Oklahoma -- endlessly sorting out dead >> relatives! >> Researching COZINE in Kentucky, Kansas, Indiana, Pennsylvania, New >> Jersey, Nieuw Amsterdam (New York) and the Netherlands. >> See the photos of our DUTCH COUSINS gathering in Kentucky in 2005 here: >> http://homepage.mac.com/carolynleonard/Dutch_Cousins/PhotoAlbum33.html >> and The Anderson Cow Palace meeting house >> http://homepage.mac.com/carolynleonard/Dutch_Cousins/PhotoAlbum32.html >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >> Barbara Whiteside >> bobbeo60@yahoo.com >> >> >> --------------------------------- >> Looking for earth-friendly autos? >> Browse Top Cars by "Green Rating" at Yahoo! Autos' Green Center. >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Email is fine with me...send to ktdink@earthlink.net you are so organized...I guess you are a first born child....or at the least a Capricorn..or worse, like me...you are both. LOL Barbara Whiteside ktdink@eartlhlink.net bobbeo60@yahoo.com Carolyn Leonard <buffalo234@cox.net> wrote: Just a word about the Dutch Cousins Gathering to be Sept 28-30 2007 in Shelbyville, KY. I am preparing a newsletter with registration info to be mailed and emailed pretty quickly. It will have info for the motels, RV parks, a bus tour of the old Dutch Tract, meals etc. I prefer to send email to save time and postage, so if you and have high speed and can open pdf attachments please send me ASAP your email address to Buffalo234@cox.net. If not, please send your snail mail address same address. This is going to be a wonderful weekend and you won't want to miss a minute of it. Cousin to Cousin We'll Always Be Special Friends >From the Same Family Tree. Hugs, Carolyn Remember you have a friend in Oklahoma -- endlessly sorting out dead relatives! Researching COZINE in Kentucky, Kansas, Indiana, Pennsylvania, New Jersey, Nieuw Amsterdam (New York) and the Netherlands. See the photos of our DUTCH COUSINS gathering in Kentucky in 2005 here: http://homepage.mac.com/carolynleonard/Dutch_Cousins/PhotoAlbum33.html and The Anderson Cow Palace meeting house http://homepage.mac.com/carolynleonard/Dutch_Cousins/PhotoAlbum32.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message Barbara Whiteside bobbeo60@yahoo.com --------------------------------- Looking for earth-friendly autos? Browse Top Cars by "Green Rating" at Yahoo! Autos' Green Center.

Hi all, On 21 Feb. 1664 there was an order for the payment of arrears due to Peter Paulusen van der Welster, a soldier. [CDM p. 261] On 5 April 1674 "Peter Poulsen, aged 43 years, born at Wolster," was accused of assaulting people in the streets of New Orange. [CDNY 2:703] Since o and e in 17th C. handwriting looked similar, I assume that O'Callghan may have misread one of them and that this is the same guy from the same place. Furthermore, back in August 1658, Alrichs had written to Stuyvesant and mentioned the arrival of two soldiers, Evert Brantsen and Peter Paulus, at New Amstel. I believe this is the same Peter. He would be about 17 or 18 when he arrived at New Amstel. I'm guessing he came from The Netherlands. But where is Wolster or Welster? Or what should the place be? I cannot seem to find any place named that nor a place that could be misread as that. Thanks for any ideas, Howard hswain@ix.netcom.com Standard Source Abbreviations: http://www.newyorkfamilyhistory.org/modules.php?name=Sections&op=viewarticle&artid=96