Hello, Using Bob Billard's engine set on fuzzy search for "Minisink" results in an interesting though partial list of surnames of the folk who traveled to & from Kingston for marriages & baptisms. Keep in mind that 1737 saw the founding of the first four churches within the valley of the Minisink region, subsequent (and sometimes confusing) records are found in Minisink Valley Reformed Dutch Church Records: http://www.archive.org/stream/minisinkvalleyre00vosb#page/n3/mode/2up Note the spelling variation Menissing I live in the Minisink valley on the PA side and having been working on an annotated map ... please zoom in http://goo.gl/maps/QnT1 Best, Jane The Billard search: http://www.ancestralcurios.com/cgi-bin/VitalSearch.pl?stext=minisink&subbtn=Search&stype=fuzzy&Fields=All * [5] kingston_marriages<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/kingston_marriages.htm>44 Marriages, Memberships, etc. Husband;[semicolon] Wife 1701 21 Apr; Jurie Quick, jm, of Mombaccus; Rebecca Titsoort, jd, born Schenectady, liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#194>[5] 1702 18 Oct; Stephanus Titsoort, jm, born Schenectady, liv Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#228>; Sara Hoornbeek, jd, born Hurley, liv Mombaccus. [5] 1712 03 Feb; Jacob Van Kuykendaal, wid Ariaantjen Tietsoort; Zara Westvaal, jd, both liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#310>(b) [5] 1714 05 Oct; Jacobus Swartwoud, jm, born Hurley, liv Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#354>; Gieletjen Nieuwkerk, jd, of Horly. [5] 1715 27 Mar; Matheus Van Kuykendaal, jm, born Rochester; Jannetjen Westvaal, jd, born Kingstown, both liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#361>[5] 1716 20 Aug; Juriaan Westvaal, wid Styntjen van Kuykendaal; Marytjen Koddebek, jd, both born Kingstown; liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#398>[5] 1716 20 Aug; Johannes Kwik, jm, born Rochester; Bregjen Middag, jd, born Nescotak, both liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#397>[5] 1717 06 Feb; Frederick Schoonmaker, wid Annaatjen De Wit; Eva Swartwout, jd, liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#404>[5] 1717 25 Feb; Abel Westvaal, jm; Antjen Bogaart, jd, both liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#405>[5] 1717 19 Nov; Jacob Westvaal, jm, born Kingstown; Margrieta de Duyster, jd, born Hurley, both now liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#423>[5] 1718 27 Sep; Roeloff Brink, jm, born Hurley; Antjen Kuykendaal, jd, born Minisink. <http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#440>[5] 1719 08 Jul; Pieter Kuykendaal, jm; Femmetjen Dekker, jd, both liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#455>[5] 1719 25 Sep; Manuel Consalisduk, jm, of Marbletown; Reymerig Kwik, jd, born Rochester, liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#460>[5] 1721 30 May; Jacobus Swartwoud, jm, born Hurley; Antjen Gomaar, jd, born Kingstown, both liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#512>[5] 1721 22 Sep; Salomon Freer, jm, born New Palz; Klaartjen Westvaal, jd, born Minisink <http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#514>, both now liv Kingstown. [5] 1722 13 Mar; Hendrik Dekker, jm, born Rochester; Hanna Titsoort, jd, born Minisink <http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#523>, both now liv there. [5] 1722 20 Jun; Gysbert Bogert, jm, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#532>; Catrina Dekker, jd, born Rochester, both liv Menissing. [5] 1723 14 Mar; Cornelis Devoor, jm, born New York; Helena Westvaal, jd, born Minisink <http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#553>, both liv there. [5] 1724 18 Oct; Jacob Middag, jm, born Neschotah; Zara Van Kuykendaal, jd, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#590>, both liv Rochester. [5] 1724 18 Nov; Jan Emans, wid Rachel Stout, born on L.I.; Neeltjen Van Aaken, jd, both liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#599>[5] 1724 14 Dec; Cornelis Brink, jm; Maria Kool, jd,both livin Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#608>[5] 1725 11 Mar; Jan Van Vlied, junior, jm, born Marbletown; Ezyntjen Swartwoud, jd, born Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#615>[5] 1727 12 Feb; Lambartus Brink, jm; Rachel Van Garde, jd, both born Rochester, both now liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#677>(b) [5] 1727 04 Jun; Thomas Dekker, jm; Janneken Van Nimmegen, jd, both of Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#680>(b) [5] 1727 11 Jun; Harmen Van Garden, jm, born Rochester; Elsjen Koddebek, jd, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#681>, both liv there. (b) [5] 1727 18 Jun; Jacobus Dekker, jm, born Rochester; Neeltjen Titsoort, jd, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#682>, both liv there. (b) [5] 1728 24 Apr; Johannes Elting, jm, born Kingston, liv New Palz; Marytjen Gemaar, jd, born Kingstown, liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#708>[5] 1728 29 May; Jan Eduwaartsz, jm, born Albany liv Poughkeepsie; Marretjen Consalis Duk, jd, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#716>liv Kingston [5] 1729 09 May; Ary Van Etten, jm, born Knightsfield, liv Marbletown; Sytjen Kuykendaal, jd, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#744>, liv Kingstown. [5] 1729 21 Nov; Willem Freer, jm, born New Palz; Margrieta Van Keuykendaal, jd, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#756>, liv Kingstown. [5] 1731 22 Aug; Gerardus van Nimwegen, jm, of Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#800>; Jannetjen De Wit, jd, of Rochester. (b) [5] 1732 27 May; Luer Kuykendaal, jm, of Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#821>; Lena Consalisduk, jd, of Kingstown. [5] 1733 02 May; Willem Koddebek, jm, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#829>; Jacomyntjen Elting, jd, born Kingstown, liv New Palz. [5] 1738 07 May; Jacobus Westvaal, jm, of Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#958>; Sofia Van Aaken, jd, of Kingstown. [5] 1738 31 May; Abraham Louw, jm, liv Rochester; Dina Koettebek, jd, liv Minisink. <http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#960>[5] 1747 28 Jun; Cornelis Kool, wid Madaleen Dekker, born Shawangunk; Sytjen Kuykendaal, wid Ary van Etten, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#1173>both liv Walkill. (b) [5] 1747 15 Oct; Jacobus Swartwoud, wid, liv Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#1186>; Annetje Westbroek, jd, liv Rochester. [5] 1749 23 Apr; Cornelis Terwilligen, jm, of Shawangunk; Catharina Van Der Merken, jd, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#1235>liv Marbletown. (b) [5] 1755 01 Nov; Gideon Westbroek, jm, of Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#1386>; Jannetje Keter, jd, born Hurley liv Marbletown. [5] 1759 28 Nov; Petrus Edmundus Osterhout, jm, of Rochester; Geertje Rosekrans, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#1485>liv Rochester. [5] 1761 30 Oct; Jacob Gemaar, jm, of Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#1540>; Alida Dekker, jd, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#1540>liv Rochester. [5] 1765 16 Jun; Johannes Kool, jm, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#1602>; Catharina Wiest, jd, born Dutchess Co. both liv Kingstouwn. [5] 1784 29 Nov; Petrus Dumont, wid, of Kingston; Lena Tack, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#1917>liv Kingston. [5] 1785 13 Feb; Cornelius C. Masten, jm, of Kingston; Rebecca Roosa, born Minisink <http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#1925>liv Kingston. [5] * On Fri, Dec 21, 2012 at 3:01 AM, <dutch-colonies-request@rootsweb.com>wrote: > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: odd name (James Harder) > 2. Re: odd name (Les Hood) > 3. Journal of De bever 1661 (THJ) >

Hi Jane, Interesting search results - many of these same names are found on the 1739 Minisink tax list. The Conner surname we were searching for doesn't appear here or in the Minisink/Machackemeck church records unfortunately. I'm sure you know the connection of Kingston and Minisink was made early on by the Old Mine Road which connected the areas to transport copper ore in the 17th C.  Later the same basic route was followed by the D&H Canal and now Rt. 209. http://www.njskylands.com/hsoldmine2.htm http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Mine_Road Great job on your map! Jim ________________________________ From: North oftheBlueMts <northofthebluemts@gmail.com> To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com Sent: Friday, December 21, 2012 9:19 AM Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] DUTCH-COLONIES Digest, Vol 7, Issue 227 Hello, Using Bob Billard's engine set on fuzzy search for "Minisink" results in an interesting though partial list of surnames of the folk who traveled to & from Kingston for marriages & baptisms.  Keep in mind that 1737 saw the founding of the first four churches within the valley of the Minisink region, subsequent (and sometimes confusing) records are found in Minisink Valley Reformed Dutch Church Records: http://www.archive.org/stream/minisinkvalleyre00vosb#page/n3/mode/2up Note the spelling variation Menissing I live in the Minisink valley on the PA side and having been working on an annotated map ... please zoom in http://goo.gl/maps/QnT1 Best, Jane The Billard search: http://www.ancestralcurios.com/cgi-bin/VitalSearch.pl?stext=minisink&subbtn=Search&stype=fuzzy&Fields=All * [5] kingston_marriages<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/kingston_marriages.htm>44 Marriages, Memberships, etc. Husband;[semicolon] Wife 1701 21 Apr; Jurie Quick, jm, of Mombaccus; Rebecca Titsoort, jd, born Schenectady, liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#194>[5] 1702 18 Oct; Stephanus Titsoort, jm, born Schenectady, liv Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#228>; Sara Hoornbeek, jd, born Hurley, liv Mombaccus. [5] 1712 03 Feb; Jacob Van Kuykendaal, wid Ariaantjen Tietsoort; Zara Westvaal, jd, both liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#310>(b) [5] 1714 05 Oct; Jacobus Swartwoud, jm, born Hurley, liv Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#354>; Gieletjen Nieuwkerk, jd, of Horly. [5] 1715 27 Mar; Matheus Van Kuykendaal, jm, born Rochester; Jannetjen Westvaal, jd, born Kingstown, both liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#361>[5] 1716 20 Aug; Juriaan Westvaal, wid Styntjen van Kuykendaal; Marytjen Koddebek, jd, both born Kingstown; liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#398>[5] 1716 20 Aug; Johannes Kwik, jm, born Rochester; Bregjen Middag, jd, born Nescotak, both liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#397>[5] 1717 06 Feb; Frederick Schoonmaker, wid Annaatjen De Wit; Eva Swartwout, jd, liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#404>[5] 1717 25 Feb; Abel Westvaal, jm; Antjen Bogaart, jd, both liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#405>[5] 1717 19 Nov; Jacob Westvaal, jm, born Kingstown; Margrieta de Duyster, jd, born Hurley, both now liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#423>[5] 1718 27 Sep; Roeloff Brink, jm, born Hurley; Antjen Kuykendaal, jd, born Minisink. <http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#440>[5] 1719 08 Jul; Pieter Kuykendaal, jm; Femmetjen Dekker, jd, both liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#455>[5] 1719 25 Sep; Manuel Consalisduk, jm, of Marbletown; Reymerig Kwik, jd, born Rochester, liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#460>[5] 1721 30 May; Jacobus Swartwoud, jm, born Hurley; Antjen Gomaar, jd, born Kingstown, both liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#512>[5] 1721 22 Sep; Salomon Freer, jm, born New Palz; Klaartjen Westvaal, jd, born Minisink <http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#514>, both now liv Kingstown. [5] 1722 13 Mar; Hendrik Dekker, jm, born Rochester; Hanna Titsoort, jd, born Minisink <http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#523>, both now liv there. [5] 1722 20 Jun; Gysbert Bogert, jm, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#532>; Catrina Dekker, jd, born Rochester, both liv Menissing. [5] 1723 14 Mar; Cornelis Devoor, jm, born New York; Helena Westvaal, jd, born Minisink <http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#553>, both liv there. [5] 1724 18 Oct; Jacob Middag, jm, born Neschotah; Zara Van Kuykendaal, jd, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#590>, both liv Rochester. [5] 1724 18 Nov; Jan Emans, wid Rachel Stout, born on L.I.; Neeltjen Van Aaken, jd, both liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#599>[5] 1724 14 Dec; Cornelis Brink, jm; Maria Kool, jd,both livin Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#608>[5] 1725 11 Mar; Jan Van Vlied, junior, jm, born Marbletown; Ezyntjen Swartwoud, jd, born Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#615>[5] 1727 12 Feb; Lambartus Brink, jm; Rachel Van Garde, jd, both born Rochester, both now liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#677>(b) [5] 1727 04 Jun; Thomas Dekker, jm; Janneken Van Nimmegen, jd, both of Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#680>(b) [5] 1727 11 Jun; Harmen Van Garden, jm, born Rochester; Elsjen Koddebek, jd, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#681>, both liv there. (b) [5] 1727 18 Jun; Jacobus Dekker, jm, born Rochester; Neeltjen Titsoort, jd, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#682>, both liv there. (b) [5] 1728 24 Apr; Johannes Elting, jm, born Kingston, liv New Palz; Marytjen Gemaar, jd, born Kingstown, liv Minisink.<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#708>[5] 1728 29 May; Jan Eduwaartsz, jm, born Albany liv Poughkeepsie; Marretjen Consalis Duk, jd, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#716>liv Kingston [5] 1729 09 May; Ary Van Etten, jm, born Knightsfield, liv Marbletown; Sytjen Kuykendaal, jd, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#744>, liv Kingstown. [5] 1729 21 Nov; Willem Freer, jm, born New Palz; Margrieta Van Keuykendaal, jd, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#756>, liv Kingstown. [5] 1731 22 Aug; Gerardus van Nimwegen, jm, of Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#800>; Jannetjen De Wit, jd, of Rochester. (b) [5] 1732 27 May; Luer Kuykendaal, jm, of Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#821>; Lena Consalisduk, jd, of Kingstown. [5] 1733 02 May; Willem Koddebek, jm, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#829>; Jacomyntjen Elting, jd, born Kingstown, liv New Palz. [5] 1738 07 May; Jacobus Westvaal, jm, of Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#958>; Sofia Van Aaken, jd, of Kingstown. [5] 1738 31 May; Abraham Louw, jm, liv Rochester; Dina Koettebek, jd, liv Minisink. <http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#960>[5] 1747 28 Jun; Cornelis Kool, wid Madaleen Dekker, born Shawangunk; Sytjen Kuykendaal, wid Ary van Etten, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#1173>both liv Walkill. (b) [5] 1747 15 Oct; Jacobus Swartwoud, wid, liv Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#1186>; Annetje Westbroek, jd, liv Rochester. [5] 1749 23 Apr; Cornelis Terwilligen, jm, of Shawangunk; Catharina Van Der Merken, jd, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#1235>liv Marbletown. (b) [5] 1755 01 Nov; Gideon Westbroek, jm, of Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#1386>; Jannetje Keter, jd, born Hurley liv Marbletown. [5] 1759 28 Nov; Petrus Edmundus Osterhout, jm, of Rochester; Geertje Rosekrans, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#1485>liv Rochester. [5] 1761 30 Oct; Jacob Gemaar, jm, of Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#1540>; Alida Dekker, jd, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#1540>liv Rochester. [5] 1765 16 Jun; Johannes Kool, jm, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#1602>; Catharina Wiest, jd, born Dutchess Co. both liv Kingstouwn. [5] 1784 29 Nov; Petrus Dumont, wid, of Kingston; Lena Tack, born Minisink<http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#1917>liv Kingston. [5] 1785 13 Feb; Cornelius C. Masten, jm, of Kingston; Rebecca Roosa, born Minisink <http://www.ancestralcurios.com/tmp_kingston_marriages.htm#1925>liv Kingston. [5] * On Fri, Dec 21, 2012 at 3:01 AM, <dutch-colonies-request@rootsweb.com>wrote: > > Today's Topics: > >    1. Re: odd name (James Harder) >    2. Re: odd name (Les Hood) >    3. Journal of De bever 1661 (THJ) > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

A wonderful accomplishment, Terry. Congratulations! -----Original Message----- From: dutch-colonies-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:dutch-colonies-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of THJ Sent: Friday, December 21, 2012 1:41 AM To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com Subject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Journal of De bever 1661 The members of the Vanderhoof Project has been busy transcribing and translating an important source for our family history and which may be of interest to the 'New Netherland' Community in general. In 2010 we saw a reference in Jaap Jacob's books 'New Netherland, a Colony in Seventeenth Century America' (2005) and 'The Colony of New Netherland'(2009) to a Journal of voyages between New Amsterdam and the Netherlands to which he refers a number of times as 'Scott's Voyages'. This turned out to be a reference to an article in De Halve Maen by Dr Kenneth Scott which appeared in January 1968. Scott's article was based on a partial translation of an original document held by the New York Historical Society 'Journael Behouden opt'schip den Gulden Bever en t'schip den Gulden Otter', Ref MSS.Ships.Journals.1600/Ships Collection Box 1 Folder #34. However, Scott only included a summary of each voyage in the article and omitted much of the routine detail for reasons of space. The original journal contains descriptions of four voyages based on notes kept by an unknown author, probably an employee of the Dutch West India Company. First Voyage : The Vergulde Otter 10 Oct 4 Dec 1660 New Amsterdam to Texel. Second Voyage : The Vergulde Bever 9 May 29 Jul 1661 Texel to New Amsterdam Third Voyage : The Hoop 8 Sept - 26 Oct 1662 New Amsterdam to Texel. Fourth Voyage : The Rooseboom 30 Mar 3 June 1663 Texel to New Amsterdam We were able to obtain copies from the NYHS of the section which contained the account of the second voyage as this was of particular interest since it was the voyage on which our Vanderhoof ancestors travelled to America. Helped by a number of Nederlands speakers from the Historische Kring West Betuwe, the archivists at the Regional Archief Rivierenland at Geldermalsen/Tiel and the staff of the Sheepvaartmuseum in Amsterdam, we have attempted to transcribe and translate the account of the 1661 voyage of De Bever and this is available on the Project website at : http://www.vanderhoofproject.com/images/documents/journael%20of%20de%20bever .pdf During the course of the translation, a good deal of supporting and contextual information has come to light which will be included in an update in 2013. Any comments would be very welcome Terry Haslam-Jones ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

The members of the Vanderhoof Project has been busy transcribing and translating an important source for our family history and which may be of interest to the 'New Netherland' Community in general. In 2010 we saw a reference in Jaap Jacob's books 'New Netherland, a Colony in Seventeenth Century America' (2005) and 'The Colony of New Netherland'(2009) to a Journal of voyages between New Amsterdam and the Netherlands to which he refers a number of times as 'Scott's Voyages'. This turned out to be a reference to an article in De Halve Maen by Dr Kenneth Scott which appeared in January 1968. Scott's article was based on a partial translation of an original document held by the New York Historical Society 'Journael Behouden opt'schip den Gulden Bever en t'schip den Gulden Otter', Ref MSS.Ships.Journals.1600/Ships Collection Box 1 Folder #34. However, Scott only included a summary of each voyage in the article and omitted much of the routine detail for reasons of space. The original journal contains descriptions of four voyages based on notes kept by an unknown author, probably an employee of the Dutch West India Company. First Voyage : The Vergulde Otter 10 Oct 4 Dec 1660 New Amsterdam to Texel. Second Voyage : The Vergulde Bever 9 May 29 Jul 1661 Texel to New Amsterdam Third Voyage : The Hoop 8 Sept - 26 Oct 1662 New Amsterdam to Texel. Fourth Voyage : The Rooseboom 30 Mar 3 June 1663 Texel to New Amsterdam We were able to obtain copies from the NYHS of the section which contained the account of the second voyage as this was of particular interest since it was the voyage on which our Vanderhoof ancestors travelled to America. Helped by a number of Nederlands speakers from the Historische Kring West Betuwe, the archivists at the Regional Archief Rivierenland at Geldermalsen/Tiel and the staff of the Sheepvaartmuseum in Amsterdam, we have attempted to transcribe and translate the account of the 1661 voyage of De Bever and this is available on the Project website at : http://www.vanderhoofproject.com/images/documents/journael%20of%20de%20bever.pdf During the course of the translation, a good deal of supporting and contextual information has come to light which will be included in an update in 2013. Any comments would be very welcome Terry Haslam-Jones

My understanding it that people who did not have surnames, using only patronymics, gradually adopted surnames as the legal need arose (wills, and other documentation) under the English administration of New Netherland. As for the national origin of immigrants to New Netherland during the period of Dutch rule, David M. Riker, "Genealogical and Biography Directory to Persons in New Netherland, From, 1613 to 1674," a four-volume work, 1999, with supplement, although not definitive, is a useful reference work based on a compilation of information available to the author. It does not, however, go into detail about the various places of origin. David M. Riker is an officer of The Holland Society of New York. David Smock ============= ----- Original Message ----- From: <dutch-colonies-request@rootsweb.com> To: <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, December 19, 2012 8:33 PM Subject: DUTCH-COLONIES Digest, Vol 7, Issue 224 > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Places of origin and chosen surnames (Marleen Van Horne) > 2. Re: Places of origin and chosen surnames (Peter ) > 3. Re: Places of origin and chosen surnames (James Harder) > 4. Re: Places of origin and chosen surnames (Marleen Van Horne) > 5. odd name (Kathy Kelly) > 6. Re: odd name (JOAN LINCE) > 7. Re: Places of origin and chosen surnames (Peter ) > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > To contact the DUTCH-COLONIES list administrator, send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES-admin@rootsweb.com. > > To post a message to the DUTCH-COLONIES mailing list, send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES@rootsweb.com. > > __________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com > with the word "unsubscribe" without the quotes in the subject and the body > of the > email with no additional text. >

Hi Pam, yes, sorry. Roeloff Eltinge's will is indeed in Anjou, vol. 2, p72/73 quoting from Will Book A, Kingston p.241. Anjou adds in a footnote ' Roeloff m. March 10 1787 Franciska Cannes. -----Original Message----- From: Pamela J. Sears Sent: 21/12/2012 02:59 To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] odd name Dear Les, It is always helpful to include source citations when posting to the Dutch-Colonies List. You wrote: *From:* Les Hood <llvk2@aol.com> *Subject:* Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] odd name *Date:* Thu, 20 Dec 2012 The Will of Roeloff Eltinge of Marbletown 1791 includes : " my loving niece Elizabeth Conner the daughter of my sister Mayacca the wife of Cornelis Bogart ". -----Original Message----- From: Kathy Kelly Sent: 19/12/2012 08:40 To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com Subject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] odd name I encountered this name in a list of people on a transcribed tax list from 1739. Any clues as to what it means or is? It appears to be Dutch. De Staet Van Hillitge Conner James Harder wrote: I think Roeloff Elting (bapt. 1735 s/o Johannes) got his relatives confused >> if his will actually says that. > > [Hoes M#1821] 10 Mar 1787; Roeloff Eltinge, j.m., and Franciska Cannes, j.d., both parties born and resid. under the jurisdiction of Marbletown. Banns published, but dates not given. Anjou, Gustave, Ulster County, N.Y. probate records in the office of the surrogate, and in the county clerk's office at Kingston, N.Y. New York: G. Anjou, 1906, 2:72-73 Liber A, page 241; Will dated 4 April 1791; proved 21 April 1791 Roeloff Eltinge of Marbletown; mentioned wife Franciska and daughter Elizabeth Eltinge. If daughter should die, estate to go to Elizabeth Conner, daughter of sister Mayacca, the wife of Cornelius Bogart. Cousins Thomas Schoonmaker, Jun'r, Peter Jansen, and friend Edward Lounsberry, all of Marbletown, appointed executors. Signed by testator. Wit: Jacob G. Louw, William McGinnis, and Moses Cantine, Jun'r. [Hoes M#1290] 10 Dec 1756; Cornelis Bogert, j.m., and Maike Elting, j.d., both resid. in Mormel (Marbletown). Banns published, but dates not given. Regards, Pam Sears ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Dear Les, It is always helpful to include source citations when posting to the Dutch-Colonies List. You wrote: *From:* Les Hood <llvk2@aol.com> *Subject:* Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] odd name *Date:* Thu, 20 Dec 2012 The Will of Roeloff Eltinge of Marbletown 1791 includes : " my loving niece Elizabeth Conner the daughter of my sister Mayacca the wife of Cornelis Bogart ". -----Original Message----- From: Kathy Kelly Sent: 19/12/2012 08:40 To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com Subject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] odd name I encountered this name in a list of people on a transcribed tax list from 1739. Any clues as to what it means or is? It appears to be Dutch. De Staet Van Hillitge Conner James Harder wrote: I think Roeloff Elting (bapt. 1735 s/o Johannes) got his relatives confused >> if his will actually says that. > > [Hoes M#1821] 10 Mar 1787; Roeloff Eltinge, j.m., and Franciska Cannes, j.d., both parties born and resid. under the jurisdiction of Marbletown. Banns published, but dates not given. Anjou, Gustave, Ulster County, N.Y. probate records in the office of the surrogate, and in the county clerk's office at Kingston, N.Y. New York: G. Anjou, 1906, 2:72-73 Liber A, page 241; Will dated 4 April 1791; proved 21 April 1791 Roeloff Eltinge of Marbletown; mentioned wife Franciska and daughter Elizabeth Eltinge. If daughter should die, estate to go to Elizabeth Conner, daughter of sister Mayacca, the wife of Cornelius Bogart. Cousins Thomas Schoonmaker, Jun'r, Peter Jansen, and friend Edward Lounsberry, all of Marbletown, appointed executors. Signed by testator. Wit: Jacob G. Louw, William McGinnis, and Moses Cantine, Jun'r. [Hoes M#1290] 10 Dec 1756; Cornelis Bogert, j.m., and Maike Elting, j.d., both resid. in Mormel (Marbletown). Banns published, but dates not given. Regards, Pam Sears

The Will of Roeloff Eltinge of Marbletown 1791 includes : " my loving niece Elizabeth Conner the daughter of my sister Mayacca the wife of Cornelis Bogart ". -----Original Message----- From: Kathy Kelly Sent: 19/12/2012 08:40 To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com Subject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] odd name I encountered this name in a list of people on a transcribed tax list from 1739.  Any clues as to what it means or is?  It appears to be Dutch. De Staet Van Hillitge Conner ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thanks Pam. I saw that marriage but the will to confirms it was this Roelof marrying the younger lady.  No baptism found for their daughter Elizabeth.  Possibly the "Elizabeth Conner" error was Anjou's. Francisca Conner was named after her maternal grandmother Francisca Consales-Duk: Rochester RC: 1754 Feb 26; John Conner, Rebecca Quik; Francisca; Reiner Van Sikkelen, Margarie Quik, his wife Kingston RC: 1752 Jan 05; John Konner, Rebecca Quik; Jacobus; Jacobus Quik & wife Francisca Consales Kingston RC: 1732 Dec 31; Jacobus Kwik, Franciska Consalis; Rebekka; Boudewyn de Graaff, Rebekka Consalis Kingston RC: 1697 Sep 11; 1697 Sep 11; Manuel van Salis Duck, Marritje Christophers Davids; Franciscus; There are a couple of Dutch families in this group; also Spanish, English, and French. Jim ________________________________ From: Pamela J. Sears <pjsears904@gmail.com> To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com Sent: Thursday, December 20, 2012 9:57 PM Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] odd name Dear Les, It is always helpful to include source citations when posting to the Dutch-Colonies List. You wrote: *From:* Les Hood <llvk2@aol.com> *Subject:* Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] odd name *Date:* Thu, 20 Dec 2012 The Will of Roeloff Eltinge of Marbletown 1791 includes : " my loving niece Elizabeth Conner the daughter of my sister Mayacca the wife of Cornelis Bogart ". -----Original Message----- From: Kathy Kelly Sent: 19/12/2012 08:40 To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com Subject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] odd name I encountered this name in a list of people on a transcribed tax list from 1739.  Any clues as to what it means or is?  It appears to be Dutch. De Staet Van Hillitge Conner James Harder wrote: I think Roeloff Elting (bapt. 1735 s/o Johannes) got his relatives confused >> if his will actually says that. > > [Hoes M#1821] 10 Mar 1787;  Roeloff Eltinge, j.m., and Franciska Cannes, j.d., both parties born and resid. under the jurisdiction of Marbletown. Banns published, but dates not given. Anjou, Gustave, Ulster County, N.Y. probate records in the office of the surrogate, and in the county clerk's office at Kingston, N.Y. New York: G. Anjou, 1906,  2:72-73 Liber A, page 241;  Will dated 4 April 1791;  proved 21 April 1791 Roeloff Eltinge of Marbletown;  mentioned wife Franciska and daughter Elizabeth Eltinge. If daughter should die, estate to go to Elizabeth Conner, daughter of sister Mayacca, the wife of Cornelius Bogart. Cousins Thomas Schoonmaker, Jun'r, Peter Jansen, and friend Edward Lounsberry, all of Marbletown, appointed executors.  Signed by testator. Wit:  Jacob G. Louw, William McGinnis, and Moses Cantine, Jun'r. [Hoes M#1290] 10 Dec 1756; Cornelis Bogert, j.m., and Maike Elting, j.d., both resid. in Mormel (Marbletown). Banns published, but dates not given. Regards, Pam Sears ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Jean Zimmerman wrote two books that could answer your "maiden name" question. Her non-fiction book, The Women of the House: How a Colonial She-Merchant Built a Mansion, a Fortune, and a Dynasty (2006) Zimmerman's historical novel _The Orphan Master_ (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=The_Orphan_Master&action=edit&redlink=1) , set in 17th century _New Amsterdam_ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Amsterdam) , has been optioned for a film. Richard Williamson Tucson, AZ

Les, I think Roeloff Elting (bapt. 1735 s/o Johannes) got his relatives confused if his will actually says that.  His sister Mayken Elting bt.1737 md Cornelius Bogart in 1756 and their daughter Elizabeth was baptized 6 Jun 1779 at Kingston, so she probably didn't marry a Conner by 1791.  Mayken's daughter Jannetje bt.1762 md. John Conner Jr., and they had an Elizabeth bapt 24 Sep 1780 at Marbletown.  I wonder who got the money. A John Conner & Rebecca Quick baptized children at Kingston and Marbletown from 1752 to 1768 - John Jr. above is their son.  I don't see any obvious connection between this John and the Hilletje in Minisink, but I suppose she could be related. Jim ________________________________ From: Les Hood <llvk2@aol.com> To: Kathy Kelly <thenume106@yahoo.com>; "dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com" <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, December 20, 2012 4:53 PM Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] odd name The Will of Roeloff Eltinge of Marbletown 1791 includes : " my loving  niece Elizabeth Conner the daughter of my sister Mayacca the wife of Cornelis Bogart ". -----Original Message----- From: Kathy Kelly Sent: 19/12/2012 08:40 To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com Subject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] odd name I encountered this name in a list of people on a transcribed tax list from 1739.  Any clues as to what it means or is?  It appears to be Dutch. De Staet Van Hillitge Conner ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

"Women in Dutch society of the time mostly carried their maiden names for life I think." That may be true as far as church records, but not so much in 18th C civil records and legal documents from what I've seen.  Women's names in tax lists are unusual because they couldn't own property unless widowed, as I understand it. ________________________________ From: Les Hood <llvk2@aol.com> To: James Harder <jaharder88@yahoo.com>; "dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com" <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, December 20, 2012 2:18 AM Subject: RE: [DUTCH-COLONIES] odd name Conner could be her maiden name so her husband a presently unknown surname. Women in Dutch society of the time mostly carried their maiden names for life I think. ________________________________ From: James Harder Sent: 20/12/2012 06:17 To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] odd name Liz, I agree with your basic take on this record. It seems to be a "pidgin Dutch" entry, meaning "the estate of Hilletje Conner".  The list is from Mathews' "History of Wayne, Pike and Monroe Counties, PA" pub. 1886, p.17, but the tax list itself is for an assessment of the Minisink area for funds to build a new "gaol" at Goshen, Orange County, NY.  I imagine the solution could be found by identifying a Hilletje, wife of ? Conner, who died before 1739. The book is here:  http://archive.org/details/historyofwaynepi00math Jim

The word "staat" (the modern spelling of "staet") has many meanings in the Dutch language, according to "Nederlands Engels van Dale Groot Wordenboek" (van Dale Dutch-English dictionary), including list, record, register, statement, and a number of others. Perhaps the word meant a list of belongings of the lady in question, but one would have to see the phrase in a broader context to get a better idea. David Smock ============= Message ----- From: <dutch-colonies-request@rootsweb.com> To: <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, December 19, 2012 8:33 PM Subject: DUTCH-COLONIES Digest, Vol 7, Issue 224 > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Places of origin and chosen surnames (Marleen Van Horne) > 2. Re: Places of origin and chosen surnames (Peter ) > 3. Re: Places of origin and chosen surnames (James Harder) > 4. Re: Places of origin and chosen surnames (Marleen Van Horne) > 5. odd name (Kathy Kelly) > 6. Re: odd name (JOAN LINCE) > 7. Re: Places of origin and chosen surnames (Peter ) > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > To contact the DUTCH-COLONIES list administrator, send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES-admin@rootsweb.com. > > To post a message to the DUTCH-COLONIES mailing list, send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES@rootsweb.com. > > __________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com > with the word "unsubscribe" without the quotes in the subject and the body > of the > email with no additional text. >

Conner could be her maiden name so her husband a presently unknown surname. Women in Dutch society of the time mostly carried their maiden names for life I think. -----Original Message----- From: James Harder Sent: 20/12/2012 06:17 To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] odd name Liz, I agree with your basic take on this record. It seems to be a "pidgin Dutch" entry, meaning "the estate of Hilletje Conner".  The list is from Mathews' "History of Wayne, Pike and Monroe Counties, PA" pub. 1886, p.17, but the tax list itself is for an assessment of the Minisink area for funds to build a new "gaol" at Goshen, Orange County, NY.  I imagine the solution could be found by identifying a Hilletje, wife of ? Conner, who died before 1739. The book is here:  http://archive.org/details/historyofwaynepi00math Jim ________________________________ From: E Johnson <iris.gates@gmail.com> To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com Sent: Wednesday, December 19, 2012 8:43 PM Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] odd name This is an interesting problem. It would help to know where the tax list was from. The 1680's tax lists from New Castle County, Delaware (formerly part of the Dutch colonies) mention 'estate of', and certainly later tax lists also mention this. Someone must pay the taxes on the land, and on the cows and horses, etc. Some of the New Utrecht town records, and some from the other Dutch towns near there, seem to be written in a peculiar Dutch or a peculiar English. The transition from making records in Dutch to making records in English took decades -- many decades in some places. Translations often seem strange, and words are sometimes unrecognizable, or not findable in modern Dutch dictionaries. In some parts of northern New Jersey, people were still speaking 'Jersey Dutch' more than 100 years after the English took over the Dutch colonies. It is very wierd, and I think people in Nederland may not understand it well at all. An example of how strange some of the Jersey Dutch dialects were is discussed here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jersey_Dutch And in fact there the word 'stat' is used in the example, and they translate it as 'fortune' (he wants to seek his fortune). I think the intent here is 'livelihood' --he wants to earn his own way, and get a place of his own. An interesting article on linguistics of Jersey Dutch and other dialects is here (downloadable pdf from Rutgers): http://mss3.libraries.rutgers.edu/dlr/outputds.php?pid=rutgers-lib:3453&mime=application/pdf&ds=PDF-1 Also, since the 1739 record is a transcription of a tax list, the transcriber may not have read the word correctly.  Or the word could simply be the tax assessor's own particular shorthand. I guess the bottom line for me is that modern dictionaries don't always give accurate translations for colonial words used in provincial records. Even colonial English sometimes used words with different meanings from the way we use the same words today. Liz J On 19 December 2012 13:17, Peter <pchrist1@nycap.rr.com> wrote: > Staet does not mean estate, at least not in my dictionary. The meanngs for > Staet are: state, condition, rank, list. Personal property in an estate > would be Boedel, or Nalatenschap. > > Peter > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Kathy I think I have been a bit slow to appreciate the underlying question you raise which I think is uncertainty over searching for Hillitje as either a Dutch or English ancestor. I appreciate the dilemma and it does seem as if either could be correct. Or both I suppose. I think the best example I have come across and mildly amusing was Femmetje Janse. She was actually an Englishwoman named Phoebe Seals but who perhaps married into or lived in Dutch NN society and the Dutch folks called her as they would one of their own. So, she was actually Phoebe the daughter of John Seals and our Dutch ancestors called her Femmetje [ the Dutch equivalent of Phoebe ] , Janse [ daughter of John ] and she thus ended up in some of the records with no discernable surname. The faint amusement being how on earth we keen genealogists were supposed to ID and trace her. So, for your Hillitje [ what is the English equivalent ? I have seen Hilda or Maria ? ] if she followed the pattern of Phoebe could have been born English or born Dutch or non - English at any rate but then married a Dutchman or anything I guess. You simply need more evidence of her and the records may reveal the answers. In Charles E Stickney's ' A History of the Minisink Region ' 1867 re done in 1995 by Heritage Books there is an Andrew Conger, Town Clerk of Deerpark 1855. In 1824 a Joseph Conklin held the same office who may have been the Dr Conklin mentioned elsewhere at around that date. They are probably unlikely to be connected to your guys although Conger is close perhaps albeit 100 years apart. Just thought you should be aware. If I find anything else I will of course mail. -----Original Message----- From: Kathy Kelly <thenume106@yahoo.com> To: JOAN LINCE <joanklince@earthlink.net>; dutch-colonies <dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thu, 20 Dec 2012 1:56 Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] odd name Joan, >From the PA Archives there is a 1758 letter to Governor Denny requesting ssistance for protection from the Indians. It is signed by a number of inhabitants of Lower Smithfield Township, today the rea around Stroudsburg, PA, or lower Minisink. One of the signers is Edward onner. I am following a trail that might place him as the same Edward Conner ho married Ann Gallaugher at Abingdon Presbyterian in 1747. There is a Nancy onner in the line, real name Ann, born 1778 (not yours, of course). athy ________________________________ From: JOAN LINCE <joanklince@earthlink.net> o: 'Kathy Kelly' <thenume106@yahoo.com>; dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com ent: Wednesday, December 19, 2012 8:32 PM ubject: RE: [DUTCH-COLONIES] odd name had an ancestor in Cumberland County, NJ named Nancy Conner (1775-1854), aid to have been born in PA. Her ancestry has always been unknown to umberland County genealogists, and I would be very interested to know more bout the Conners of the Minisink region, because Cumberland County is also n the Delaware River. Unfortunately none of the mentions of Conner in the ook you name has anything that could connect with my Nancy Conner. Does nyone have any suggestions? Joan Lince -----Original Message----- rom: dutch-colonies-bounces@rootsweb.com mailto:dutch-colonies-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Kathy Kelly ent: Wednesday, December 19, 2012 7:43 PM o: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com ubject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] odd name Thank you all who responded to my post. The 1739 tax list is from the inisink region which is located along the Delaware River between Port ervis and the Delaware Water Gap. While most residents were on the NJ ide, the PA side was also inhabited. The names on the list appear to be of utch origin. If interested Google "History of Wayne, Pike and Monroe ounties, PA" for ebook. A stretch to be sure, but please post any information that might be relevant o this Hillitge (Hillitje) Conner. I know there were Conners on Staten sland about this time. Thanks, athy escendent of Willem Clawson and Elsje Kroezen ------------------------------ o unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com ith the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of he message

Liz, I agree with your basic take on this record. It seems to be a "pidgin Dutch" entry, meaning "the estate of Hilletje Conner".  The list is from Mathews' "History of Wayne, Pike and Monroe Counties, PA" pub. 1886, p.17, but the tax list itself is for an assessment of the Minisink area for funds to build a new "gaol" at Goshen, Orange County, NY.  I imagine the solution could be found by identifying a Hilletje, wife of ? Conner, who died before 1739. The book is here:  http://archive.org/details/historyofwaynepi00math Jim ________________________________ From: E Johnson <iris.gates@gmail.com> To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com Sent: Wednesday, December 19, 2012 8:43 PM Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] odd name This is an interesting problem. It would help to know where the tax list was from. The 1680's tax lists from New Castle County, Delaware (formerly part of the Dutch colonies) mention 'estate of', and certainly later tax lists also mention this. Someone must pay the taxes on the land, and on the cows and horses, etc. Some of the New Utrecht town records, and some from the other Dutch towns near there, seem to be written in a peculiar Dutch or a peculiar English. The transition from making records in Dutch to making records in English took decades -- many decades in some places. Translations often seem strange, and words are sometimes unrecognizable, or not findable in modern Dutch dictionaries. In some parts of northern New Jersey, people were still speaking 'Jersey Dutch' more than 100 years after the English took over the Dutch colonies. It is very wierd, and I think people in Nederland may not understand it well at all. An example of how strange some of the Jersey Dutch dialects were is discussed here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jersey_Dutch And in fact there the word 'stat' is used in the example, and they translate it as 'fortune' (he wants to seek his fortune). I think the intent here is 'livelihood' --he wants to earn his own way, and get a place of his own. An interesting article on linguistics of Jersey Dutch and other dialects is here (downloadable pdf from Rutgers): http://mss3.libraries.rutgers.edu/dlr/outputds.php?pid=rutgers-lib:3453&mime=application/pdf&ds=PDF-1 Also, since the 1739 record is a transcription of a tax list, the transcriber may not have read the word correctly.  Or the word could simply be the tax assessor's own particular shorthand. I guess the bottom line for me is that modern dictionaries don't always give accurate translations for colonial words used in provincial records. Even colonial English sometimes used words with different meanings from the way we use the same words today. Liz J On 19 December 2012 13:17, Peter <pchrist1@nycap.rr.com> wrote: > Staet does not mean estate, at least not in my dictionary. The meanngs for > Staet are: state, condition, rank, list. Personal property in an estate > would be Boedel, or Nalatenschap. > > Peter > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

This is an interesting problem. It would help to know where the tax list was from. The 1680's tax lists from New Castle County, Delaware (formerly part of the Dutch colonies) mention 'estate of', and certainly later tax lists also mention this. Someone must pay the taxes on the land, and on the cows and horses, etc. Some of the New Utrecht town records, and some from the other Dutch towns near there, seem to be written in a peculiar Dutch or a peculiar English. The transition from making records in Dutch to making records in English took decades -- many decades in some places. Translations often seem strange, and words are sometimes unrecognizable, or not findable in modern Dutch dictionaries. In some parts of northern New Jersey, people were still speaking 'Jersey Dutch' more than 100 years after the English took over the Dutch colonies. It is very wierd, and I think people in Nederland may not understand it well at all. An example of how strange some of the Jersey Dutch dialects were is discussed here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jersey_Dutch And in fact there the word 'stat' is used in the example, and they translate it as 'fortune' (he wants to seek his fortune). I think the intent here is 'livelihood' --he wants to earn his own way, and get a place of his own. An interesting article on linguistics of Jersey Dutch and other dialects is here (downloadable pdf from Rutgers): http://mss3.libraries.rutgers.edu/dlr/outputds.php?pid=rutgers-lib:3453&mime=application/pdf&ds=PDF-1 Also, since the 1739 record is a transcription of a tax list, the transcriber may not have read the word correctly. Or the word could simply be the tax assessor's own particular shorthand. I guess the bottom line for me is that modern dictionaries don't always give accurate translations for colonial words used in provincial records. Even colonial English sometimes used words with different meanings from the way we use the same words today. Liz J On 19 December 2012 13:17, Peter <pchrist1@nycap.rr.com> wrote: > Staet does not mean estate, at least not in my dictionary. The meanngs for > Staet are: state, condition, rank, list. Personal property in an estate > would be Boedel, or Nalatenschap. > > Peter >

Jim, You are right, of course, and I just missed the obvious. There were English, Scots, Welsh, and Irish. I can also think of one fellow who was born in Morocco and another who was a Croatian, some Spanards and Italians. Statistically speaking, the numbers were not significant. And we should not overlook the numbers who were born in Africa and the Caribbean region. Peter -----Original Message----- From: dutch-colonies-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:dutch-colonies-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of James Harder Sent: Wednesday, December 19, 2012 4:20 PM To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Places of origin and chosen surnames Peter, Thank you for pointing out that the much-repeated idea that the Dutch didn't use surnames until forced to by the British is a misleading generalization. Cohen's list of the places of origin is for so-called "Dutch" settlers and doesn't include English or other British families, of which there were many throughout the history of New Netherland. Jim   ________________________________ From: Peter <pchrist1@nycap.rr.com> To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com Sent: Wednesday, December 19, 2012 1:37 PM Subject: Re: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Places of origin and chosen surnames There was never any serious push by the English government to encourage people to adopt surnames. The situation remained fluid for a few generations. It was a matter of custom and just took a while to catch on. It had already begun in the Netherlands with some families -- van Rensselaer, van Curler, and a number of others that immigrated. David Steven Cohen in his book The Dutch-American Farm has a chapter titled Origins. In it he reports on the places of origin of 904 heads of families. He has 50.8% from the Netherlands, 7% Belgium, 18% the several German states, France 7%, Schleswig-Holstein 7%, Denmark 1%, Sweden 3%, Norway 5%, Poland 0.3%, and Other 0.7%. He further breaks all of the countries down by states and provinces. Since there was only one Dutch province in America, the name is New Netherland with no 's' at the end. Peter -----Original Message----- From: dutch-colonies-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:dutch-colonies-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Marleen Van Horne Sent: Wednesday, December 19, 2012 11:19 AM To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com Subject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] Places of origin and chosen surnames Are there any scholarly articles that discuss the composition of the population of New Netherlands as to places of origin? I am also looking for scholarly information of the circumstances under which surnames were chosen, when the English government of what was New Netherlands forced the issue. Actually, any documentary commentary on either issue would be greatly appreciated. Marleen Van Horne ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DUTCH-COLONIES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I had an ancestor in Cumberland County, NJ named Nancy Conner (1775-1854), said to have been born in PA. Her ancestry has always been unknown to Cumberland County genealogists, and I would be very interested to know more about the Conners of the Minisink region, because Cumberland County is also on the Delaware River. Unfortunately none of the mentions of Conner in the book you name has anything that could connect with my Nancy Conner. Does anyone have any suggestions? Joan Lince -----Original Message----- From: dutch-colonies-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:dutch-colonies-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Kathy Kelly Sent: Wednesday, December 19, 2012 7:43 PM To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com Subject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] odd name Thank you all who responded to my post.  The 1739 tax list is from the Minisink region which is located along the Delaware River between Port Jervis and the Delaware Water Gap.  While most residents were on the NJ side, the PA side was also inhabited. The names on the list appear to be of Dutch origin.  If interested Google "History of Wayne, Pike and Monroe Counties, PA" for ebook.  A stretch to be sure, but please post any information that might be relevant to this Hillitge (Hillitje) Conner. I know there were Conners on Staten Island about this time. Thanks, Kathy Descendent of Willem Clawson and Elsje Kroezen

Joan, From the PA Archives there is a 1758 letter to Governor Denny requesting assistance for protection from the Indians.  It is signed by a number of inhabitants of Lower Smithfield Township, today the area around Stroudsburg, PA, or lower Minisink.  One of the signers is Edward Conner.  I am following a trail that might place him as the same Edward Conner who married Ann Gallaugher at Abingdon Presbyterian in 1747.  There is a Nancy Conner in the line, real name Ann, born 1778 (not yours, of course). Kathy ________________________________ From: JOAN LINCE <joanklince@earthlink.net> To: 'Kathy Kelly' <thenume106@yahoo.com>; dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com Sent: Wednesday, December 19, 2012 8:32 PM Subject: RE: [DUTCH-COLONIES] odd name I had an ancestor in Cumberland County, NJ named Nancy Conner (1775-1854), said to have been born in PA. Her ancestry has always been unknown to Cumberland County genealogists, and I would be very interested to know more about the Conners of the Minisink region, because Cumberland County is also on the Delaware River. Unfortunately none of the mentions of Conner in the book you name has anything that could connect with my Nancy Conner. Does anyone have any suggestions? Joan Lince -----Original Message----- From: dutch-colonies-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:dutch-colonies-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Kathy Kelly Sent: Wednesday, December 19, 2012 7:43 PM To: dutch-colonies@rootsweb.com Subject: [DUTCH-COLONIES] odd name Thank you all who responded to my post.  The 1739 tax list is from the Minisink region which is located along the Delaware River between Port Jervis and the Delaware Water Gap.  While most residents were on the NJ side, the PA side was also inhabited. The names on the list appear to be of Dutch origin.  If interested Google "History of Wayne, Pike and Monroe Counties, PA" for ebook.  A stretch to be sure, but please post any information that might be relevant to this Hillitge (Hillitje) Conner. I know there were Conners on Staten Island about this time. Thanks, Kathy Descendent of Willem Clawson and Elsje Kroezen