Well you know one now. -----Original Message----- From: "Helga Kiely" <kandhkiely@rogers.com> Sent: ‎5/‎6/‎2014 10:18 AM To: "Rose Vetter" <rosevetter@gmail.com> Cc: "DVHH-L" <donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com> Subject: Re: [DVHH] Why our parents didn't say they were Shwovish Amen! Ashamed?? No never! Thanks for the supportRose. Sent from Helga's Ipad > On May 5, 2014, at 9:23 PM, Rose Vetter <rosevetter@gmail.com> wrote: > > I can only speak for some of my relatives who were either in camps or were > deported to the mines in Russia, but I never knew any of them to be > ashamed. Why would anyone be ashamed for being imprisoned or enslaved > innocently? My grandparents died in the forced labour camp > Altker/Pasicevo. They were peaceful, god-fearing people who had never > harmed anyone. They were too frail to join us on our flight, so they > stayed home with their youngest daughter. On November 30, 1944 they were > driven out of their home at gunpoint, herded together and forced to spend > the night outside in the freezing rain. The next day they had to walk 40 > km to the camp. My grandfather, suffering from asthma and a heart > condition, collapsed and was thrown on a wagon like a sack; eight days > later he was dead. My grandmother died there 2½ years later and my aunt > lived to tell their story, but she was not ashamed. One of my aunts died > in Gakowa and another in Jarek, but I doubt very much that they were > ashamed. > > There were probably several reasons some of our people didn't want to say > they were Schwowe or Donauschwaben. Offhand these come to mind: a) the > memories were too painful, b) they did not want to dwell on the past, c) it > was too difficult to explain to outsiders, d) they were suffering from the > collective guilt syndrome imposed on all people inside and outside of > Germany, and d) they were happy to have survived, did not want to dwell on > the past and were looking ahead to building a new life. But ashamed? No, > never! > > Rose > > >> On 5 May 2014 15:21, Jody McKim Pharr <jodymckimpharr@comcast.net> wrote: >> >> Bravo Gary! >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: donauschwaben-villages-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto: >> donauschwaben-villages-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Gary Banzhaf >> Sent: Monday, May 05, 2014 4:26 PM >> To: donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com >> Subject: Re: [DVHH] Why our parents didn't say they were Shwovish >> >> >> Schwovish, Schwaebisch, Donauschwaben, Volksdeutsche, Reichsdeutsche - >> even the word "Nazis" is used !!! >> Waking up this morning I said to myself: Gary keep out, this discusion is >> getting to hot. It is where everyone wants to present their knowledge what >> we are and who we are: the one said he is glad not to be German - well, let >> him be Ukrainian or Armenian, he still participates in a forum of >> Donauschwaben who basically and by majority are Germans, whether they >> intermarried or not. >> They are in the eyes of Germany "Auslandsdeutsche" - Germans living on >> foreign soil. >> This word is fearfully used by group members of the first or second >> generation immigrants of North America. >> Only one gutsy post I have read on Friday 5/2. The list member - no >> functional Director - uses ethnicity; the term for ethnic German-s: "lit. >> Germans living outside Germany": for instance in South America, Australia >> or even Cape town, South Africa etc. >> The DS memory is traumatic, they hated us for being on their land - and >> they wanted to exterminate us with hate and when I later asked a former >> associate: why ? he answered: "may be you didn't belong down there anyhow." >> No wrong doing we did, just trying to save us from approaching evil. No, I >> wasn't in Gakowa, Jarek or Valpovo. But lets not "Jammer" (live in misery) >> for ever. The many memorials permittet now by the State of Serbia are for >> our ancestors dear to us, whom we left 'down there' and they should never >> be forgotten ! >> I do not have any other expression or explanation of who we are !! >> >> Gary >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Fran Matkovich" <mjm1021@comcast.net> >> To: "Eve" <evebrown@gmail.com>; "Joseph Psotka" <psotka@msn.com> >> Cc: "dvhh" <donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com> >> Sent: Monday, May 05, 2014 11:53 AM >> Subject: Re: [DVHH] Why our parents didn't say they were Shwovish >> >> >>> I agree. Only another Schwobish person would even understand what it >>> meant. >>> If you told any other American you were Schwobish, they would say HUHHH? >>> >>> Fran Matkovich >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Eve >>> Sent: Saturday, May 3, 2014 3:23 PM >>> To: Joseph Psotka >>> Cc: dvhh >>> Subject: Re: [DVHH] Why our parents didn't say they were Shwovish >>> >>> I always felt that my parents didn't talk about it because it was too >>> complicated to understand and explain. Most people here had preconceived >>> notions as to what was going on and with the lack of language skills by >> my >>> parents, it was easier for them to just go with whatever was being told >>> them had happened to them. This probably sounds confusing, but I know >> many >>> of the people from the church I grew up in told "me" stories about what >>> had >>> gone on with my folks before coming here and I remember questioning my >>> parents about things that were said and they would just make this >>> gesture - >>> like - ach, forget about it, almost in disgust. I don't think my mom in >>> particular ever felt any shame about being German - my dad possibly since >>> he was more aware of what was going on outside their little village, but >>> mom, nah, she has been proud of who she is always. >>> >>> Eve >>> >>> >>>> On Sat, May 3, 2014 at 11:19 AM, Joseph Psotka <psotka@msn.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> My parents also never spoke about being Shwovish to anyone outside the >>>> family; >>>> >>>> but a large part of that was being ashamed of being imprisoned in Gakowa >>>> (my mother and I) >>>> >>>> or being sent to slave labor in the Donetsk(my father). For those of us >>>> interned, it was a very painful and shameful part of our life and we >>>> never >>>> wanted to talk about it, and hid it whenever we could, in whatever way >> we >>>> could. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> The second generation seems to think that this experience is something >> we >>>> wanted to discuss, but I assure we did not and it is even harder to get >>>> started with strangers. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Best regards, >>>> Joe >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> From: Diane Halas >>>> Sent: ‎Wednesday‎, ‎April‎ ‎30‎, ‎2014 ‎9‎:‎53‎ ‎AM >>>> To: 'John Schambre', 'Eileen Simcox' >>>> Cc: dvhh >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I once asked my grandma why she had said the family was German. She >>>> said. >>>> "My dear, we were all 'Germans' then." I asked her what she considered >>>> herself and she said, "Austro-Hungarian". I told my fifth grade teacher >>>> who >>>> in turn told me there was no such place as Austria-Hungary. Everyone in >>>> Grandma's nuclear family spoke more than one language. She identified >>>> their >>>> primary language as "low German" and her family was from Alsace-Lorraine >>>> and >>>> her grandmother was pure French. The family had emigrated to the Banat >>>> before there was a "Germany". There you have it. I never even learned >>>> about Schwabish until I subscribed to this site. >>>> >>>> Diane >>>> >>>> Diane Halas >>>> 239-592-9969 >>>> >>>> in the subject and the body of the message >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Syrmia Regional Coordinator >>> http://www.dvhh.org/syrmia >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message