Hi Roger, This whole discussion about Alsace-Lorraine has encouraged a broader perspective and the need to think about the possibility that our German-speaking ancestors might have originated in many other areas. For example, one of my main 4 maternal surnames is FIALA, which can be traced back to the 1700's in the Banat. Whenever I've googled that family surname, I came up with many Italian responses! Truthfully, the name doesn't sound typically German, but I never questioned it because they spoke German in the home and identified themselves as of German heritage from Austria-Hungary... I realize now that I have no idea where they originally came from before arriving in the Banat many generations ago. This genealogy search and discussion is continually turning up many surprising insights which will hopefully lead to some new discoveries for all of us. Thank you everyone, Linda On Fri, Apr 25, 2014 at 9:21 AM, ROGER WARD <hummrhaven@verizon.net> wrote: > > As little research I have done on the Treis/Tries family, the first clue I > saw was on maps showing a twin city in the Lorraine area called > Treis-Karden! > That part of my family migrated from the Banat to Buffalo, NY, into the > Black Rock German section of that city, in 1907. So how, I wonder, did that > last name come about? Were they related to the people who founded that town > around the Moselle region? I should not jump to that until I begin to trace > down more immediate ancestors, and the immigration info is all I have to > start with. As so many ethnic Germans did, my mother and her siblings were > proud Americans, speaking only German in my grandparent's home. > Yet the name being Treis seems to be such a clue to their origin! > > > > ------------------------------ > On Thu, Apr 24, 2014 1:16 PM EDT Daniel HILAIRE wrote: > > >John, > >Most of people coming from Alsace-Lorraine (in fact, Lorraine), didn't > speak german when they arrived in Banat; they were speaking only french and > same for their children; but, as the local administration, the army, > sometimes the boys or the girls they married, were speaking german, they > had to speak german and finally they lost their french language; so, > 120-130 years after, when they arrived to US, they were speaking only > german until... 120 years after, their descendants speak english and very > few are able to speak german!Another point : Lorraine was not a part of > France until 1766Last point : Germany, as a state, didn't exist before > 1871; to obtain this, Bismark had to fight against Austria in 1866 (and > again the french in 1870). So, there was no "german from Austria-Hungary". > >But, as another member of the group explained very well a couple of days > ago, it's too difficult for a Banater Schwaben to explain who he is really; > so, let's people from Lorraine, speaking french, become... German from > Austria. > >Hope you'll pardon me for these points. > >Bonne journée > >Daniel Hilaire, Bordeaux > > > > > > > > From: jfschambre@comcast.net > > Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2014 08:53:15 -0700 > > To: ljaspersen@gmail.com > > CC: DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES@rootsweb.com > > Subject: Re: [DVHH] Donauschwaben and Schwowe > > > > Linda: It is possible your family came from Alsace-Lorraine France > where so many German speaking people lived and migrated to the Banat. I > thought my family came from Germany too because, like yours, they always > said they were German from Austria-Hungary. Well, they were German and, > once they moved to the Banat, they were Austro-Hungarians but before that, > probably back in the late 1600's or throughout the 1700 and 1800's they may > have lived in France. It was quite a revelation to me. > > > > Interestingly, my family had relatives in Buffalo and Tonawanda too! > Their family names were Bishop and Stetzer and, unfortunately I haven't > been able to find out much about them. I remember them visiting us in > Mansfield, Ohio (my home town) but we never went to New York to see them. > So many mysteries to uncover! > > > > Best of luck in your research! > > > > John F. Schambre > > San Francisco, CA > > > > > > > > > > > > On Apr 24, 2014, at 5:44 AM, Linda Jaspersen <ljaspersen@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > > > Rose - Thank you for starting this very informative thread! The > heritage > > > postings have been fascinating! I have enjoyed reading them all - > trying to > > > catch up after the busy Easter holiday. > > > > > > > > > > > > Jody and other DVHH listees - I can relate to the many comments about > > > little information offered by our Donauschwab ancestors. Perhaps they > were > > > too busy struggling to support their families, learn English, and > adapt to > > > a radically new life in their adopted country. And in my case... I also > > > regret not asking the questions that might have triggered more sharing > of > > > oral history before my grandparents died. > > > > > > > > > > > > Brief background for those interested: My maternal grandparents were > born > > > in Glogowatz, as were their parents and grandparents, etc., to the > 1700’s, > > > according to Erwin Kilzheimer’s wonderful Familienbuch. My GF > immigrant to > > > Buffalo, New York, as a teenager in 1909, age 13; his widowed mother > (my GGM) > > > immigrated in 1907, age 33. My GM immigrated to Tonawanda, New York, in > > > 1914, age 12 years; her father had previously immigrated in 1906 & > 1910, > > > and returned to Glogowatz for the last time in 1914 to accompany his > wife > > > and 4 remaining children. > > > > > > > > > > > > There is still an active Hungarian Club in Buffalo, but no > > > Donauschwabclub. My mother states that her parents and older sister > > > went to the German > > > club but that it closed during WWII and never reopened. There was > distrust > > > and fear at the time; many of the neighbors’ sons were soldiers > fighting > > > overseas. > > > > > > > > > > > > When my immigrant grandparents talked about “the old country” as they > > > called it, they always spoke of themselves as Germans from > Austria-Hungary, > > > never mentioning either the Banat or Donauschwaben. One of my huge > brick > > > walls is trying to learn where in Germany my ancestors emigrated from > in > > > the 1700’s. Unfortunately, I haven’t been able to find them in the > > > Stadervolumes. > > > > > > > > > > > > All these postings and the information provided on the DVHH site have > been > > > a wonderful gift of discovery! There is always something new to learn, > > > particularly from listers with family memories of what life was like > in the > > > Banat for both the people who stayed and those who emigrated. > > > > > > > > > Thank You All, > > > > > > > > > Linda > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Apr 23, 2014 at 7:38 PM, Jody McKim Pharr > <jodymckimpharr@comcast > > > .net> wrote: > > > > > > Tina, -- First or second marriage, you're still the daughter of a > Schwowe. > > > Barb, -- My family who immigrated to the US lived like they were in the > > > witness protection program. They would barely talk about anything. > Papa > > > would tell his kids (my grandmother and siblings) to speak English > "You are > > > in America now!". It wasn't until 1999 when I started my family > research > > > quest. It wasn’t easy figuring out all the answers to my questions > after > > > those who had the answers had passed away. Because of our wonderful and > > > knowledgeable DVHH volunteers, it all fell in place. > > > > > > This list and DVHH volunteers love genealogical digs, so if you have > brick > > > walls, post it onto the mail list. > > > Note: If anyone helps you privately from the list, pass it back to the > > > entire mail list, it's the only way others who wish to help can know > where > > > you are at in your search. > > > > > > Thanks for sharing, > > > > > > Jody McKim Pharr > > > Woodstock, GA - USA > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: donauschwaben-villages-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto: > > > donauschwaben-villages-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Tina Michel > > > Sent: Tuesday, April 22, 2014 3:11 PM > > > To: Barb D; DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES@rootsweb.com > > > Subject: Re: [DVHH] Donauschwaben and Schwowe > > > > > > I have the same feeling as you Barb. Although my father kept on > telling > > > us about the good eating and all the things that were done in and > around > > > his village, I took everything for granted instead of asking why and > how. > > > Also, we spoke several german dialects at home, but I never asked my > > > father why he would speak schwowisch and not better Hochdeutsch > (Academic > > > German). > > > > > > I was the youngest child of his second marriage, but I'm the only one > with > > > a sense of belonging to his community and his past, and sure enough > with a > > > need to dig and find out more. > > > > > > With kind regards, > > > > > > Tina Michel, > > > Montreal > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Barb D" <bbd2424@gmail.com> > > > To: "SusanM" <soozn_6@yahoo.com>; <DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES@rootsweb.com > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, April 22, 2014 2:24 PM > > > Subject: Re: [DVHH] Donauschwaben and Schwowe > > > > > > > > > I agree!!!! This has been fun and very informative. I hope it keeps > up. I > > > am > > > getting the feel for how my grandparents and families lived and died. > So > > > many question to go and I will probably never have the answers to > most. I > > > am > > > not even sure how to know if we are Donauschwaben or not. > > > I wish I had some stories to tell but it was my grandparents who lived > in > > > DSM. and they didn't talk a lot about the old country even to their > kids > > > (sometimes with their old country friends) or maybe we weren't paying > > > enough attention to remember. All I can tell you is I wish I had had > the > > > foresight to ask or listen better. > > > So keep the info coming please! If there is anything I can do to help > let > > > me > > > know. I live in a suburb of Chicago, Il. > > > Thanks so much for all info and help! > > > Barb D. > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: SusanM > > > Sent: Tuesday, April 22, 2014 11:36 AM > > > To: DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES@rootsweb.com > > > Subject: Re: [DVHH] Donauschwaben and Schwowe > > > > > > I just wanted to say how much I have appreciated this discussion. It > has > > > been so interesting, and now I want to go back and hunt the archives. > I'm > > > not sure what search terms to use though. Anyway, I wanted to say > thanks > > > to > > > people who have written on this thread. I'm fascinated. > > > > > > > > > Susan M > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > > DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word > 'unsubscribe' > > > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > > >------------------------------- > >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >
In the Buffalo area there are still German clubs, that may offer information on relatives, linked under the web page of WWW.BuffaloGerman.com with calenders of events mainly held south of Buffalo, in Hamburg or Cheektowaga. The Buffalo Schwaben Chor performs at the big German Heritage Festival is held on Labor Day weekend, which I have yet to attend. Unfortunately, the distance from my home on Lake Ontario (NY ) & age, makes that difficult.
Roger, Wow - Thank you for that information and link about the existence of an active German Club in Buffalo!! I looked into their calendar of events and may actually get to attend the German Heritage Festival since I have tentative plans to visit my parents and siblings over Labor Day weekend. It would be great fun to go with them and hear their Buffalo Schwaben Chorperform!! I also see that the Bergholz Blaskapelle is scheduled to perform that weekend. My paternal ancestors immigrated from Prussia and lived mostly in the old German settlements of St.Johnsburg and Bergholz, Town of Wheatfield, (north of Buffalo) starting in 1843. Thanks again! Linda On Sun, Apr 27, 2014 at 11:07 AM, ROGER WARD <hummrhaven@verizon.net> wrote: > In the Buffalo area there are still German clubs, that may offer > information on relatives, linked under the web page of > WWW.BuffaloGerman.com with calenders of events mainly held south of > Buffalo, in Hamburg or Cheektowaga. > The Buffalo Schwaben Chor performs at the big German Heritage Festival is > held on Labor Day weekend, which I have yet to attend. > Unfortunately, the distance from my home on Lake Ontario (NY ) & age, > makes that difficult. > > ------------------------------ > * From: * Linda Jaspersen <ljaspersen@gmail.com>; > * To: * ROGER WARD <hummrhaven@verizon.net>; > * Cc: * DVHH <donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com>; > * Subject: * Re: [DVHH] Donauschwaben and Schwowe > * Sent: * Sun, Apr 27, 2014 2:40:04 PM > > Hi Roger, > > This whole discussion about Alsace-Lorraine has encouraged a broader > perspective and the need to think about the possibility that our > German-speaking ancestors might have originated in many other areas. > > For example, one of my main 4 maternal surnames is FIALA, which can be > traced back to the 1700's in the Banat. Whenever I've googled that family > surname, I came up with many Italian responses! Truthfully, the name > doesn't sound typically German, but I never questioned it because they > spoke German in the home and identified themselves as of German heritage > from Austria-Hungary... I realize now that I have no idea where they > originally came from before arriving in the Banat many generations ago. > This genealogy search and discussion is continually turning up many > surprising insights which will hopefully lead to some new discoveries for > all of us. > > Thank you everyone, > > Linda > > > On Fri, Apr 25, 2014 at 9:21 AM, ROGER WARD <hummrhaven@verizon.net>wrote: > >> >> As little research I have done on the Treis/Tries family, the first clue >> I saw was on maps showing a twin city in the Lorraine area called >> Treis-Karden! >> That part of my family migrated from the Banat to Buffalo, NY, into the >> Black Rock German section of that city, in 1907. So how, I wonder, did that >> last name come about? Were they related to the people who founded that town >> around the Moselle region? I should not jump to that until I begin to trace >> down more immediate ancestors, and the immigration info is all I have to >> start with. As so many ethnic Germans did, my mother and her siblings were >> proud Americans, speaking only German in my grandparent's home. >> Yet the name being Treis seems to be such a clue to their origin! >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> On Thu, Apr 24, 2014 1:16 PM EDT Daniel HILAIRE wrote: >> >> >John, >> >Most of people coming from Alsace-Lorraine (in fact, Lorraine), didn't >> speak german when they arrived in Banat; they were speaking only french and >> same for their children; but, as the local administration, the army, >> sometimes the boys or the girls they married, were speaking german, they >> had to speak german and finally they lost their french language; so, >> 120-130 years after, when they arrived to US, they were speaking only >> german until... 120 years after, their descendants speak english and very >> few are able to speak german!Another point : Lorraine was not a part of >> France until 1766Last point : Germany, as a state, didn't exist before >> 1871; to obtain this, Bismark had to fight against Austria in 1866 (and >> again the french in 1870). So, there was no "german from Austria-Hungary". >> >But, as another member of the group explained very well a couple of days >> ago, it's too difficult for a Banater Schwaben to explain who he is really; >> so, let's people from Lorraine, speaking french, become... German from >> Austria. >> >Hope you'll pardon me for these points. >> >Bonne journée >> >Daniel Hilaire, Bordeaux >> > >> > >> > >> > From: jfschambre@comcast.net >> > Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2014 08:53:15 -0700 >> > To: ljaspersen@gmail.com >> > CC: DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES@rootsweb.com >> > Subject: Re: [DVHH] Donauschwaben and Schwowe >> > >> > Linda: It is possible your family came from Alsace-Lorraine France >> where so many German speaking people lived and migrated to the Banat. I >> thought my family came from Germany too because, like yours, they always >> said they were German from Austria-Hungary. Well, they were German and, >> once they moved to the Banat, they were Austro-Hungarians but before that, >> probably back in the late 1600's or throughout the 1700 and 1800's they may >> have lived in France. It was quite a revelation to me. >> > >> > Interestingly, my family had relatives in Buffalo and Tonawanda too! >> Their family names were Bishop and Stetzer and, unfortunately I haven't >> been able to find out much about them. I remember them visiting us in >> Mansfield, Ohio (my home town) but we never went to New York to see them. >> So many mysteries to uncover! >> > >> > Best of luck in your research! >> > >> > John F. Schambre >> > San Francisco, CA >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > On Apr 24, 2014, at 5:44 AM, Linda Jaspersen <ljaspersen@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> > >> > > Rose - Thank you for starting this very informative thread! The >> heritage >> > > postings have been fascinating! I have enjoyed reading them all - >> trying to >> > > catch up after the busy Easter holiday. >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > Jody and other DVHH listees - I can relate to the many comments about >> > > little information offered by our Donauschwab ancestors. Perhaps they >> were >> > > too busy struggling to support their families, learn English, and >> adapt to >> > > a radically new life in their adopted country. And in my case... I >> also >> > > regret not asking the questions that might have triggered more >> sharing of >> > > oral history before my grandparents died. >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > Brief background for those interested: My maternal grandparents were >> born >> > > in Glogowatz, as were their parents and grandparents, etc., to the >> 1700’s, >> > > according to Erwin Kilzheimer’s wonderful Familienbuch. My GF >> immigrant to >> > > Buffalo, New York, as a teenager in 1909, age 13; his widowed mother >> (my GGM) >> > > immigrated in 1907, age 33. My GM immigrated to Tonawanda, New York, >> in >> > > 1914, age 12 years; her father had previously immigrated in 1906 & >> 1910, >> > > and returned to Glogowatz for the last time in 1914 to accompany his >> wife >> > > and 4 remaining children. >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > There is still an active Hungarian Club in Buffalo, but no >> > > Donauschwabclub. My mother states that her parents and older sister >> > > went to the German >> > > club but that it closed during WWII and never reopened. There was >> distrust >> > > and fear at the time; many of the neighbors’ sons were soldiers >> fighting >> > > overseas. >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > When my immigrant grandparents talked about “the old country” as they >> > > called it, they always spoke of themselves as Germans from >> Austria-Hungary, >> > > never mentioning either the Banat or Donauschwaben. One of my huge >> brick >> > > walls is trying to learn where in Germany my ancestors emigrated from >> in >> > > the 1700’s. Unfortunately, I haven’t been able to find them in the >> > > Stadervolumes. >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > All these postings and the information provided on the DVHH site have >> been >> > > a wonderful gift of discovery! There is always something new to learn, >> > > particularly from listers with family memories of what life was like >> in the >> > > Banat for both the people who stayed and those who emigrated. >> > > >> > > >> > > Thank You All, >> > > >> > > >> > > Linda >> > > >> > > >> > > On Wed, Apr 23, 2014 at 7:38 PM, Jody McKim Pharr >> <jodymckimpharr@comcast >> > > .net> wrote: >> > > >> > > Tina, -- First or second marriage, you're still the daughter of a >> Schwowe. >> > > Barb, -- My family who immigrated to the US lived like they were in >> the >> > > witness protection program. They would barely talk about anything. >> Papa >> > > would tell his kids (my grandmother and siblings) to speak English >> "You are >> > > in America now!". It wasn't until 1999 when I started my family >> research >> > > quest. It wasn’t easy figuring out all the answers to my questions >> after >> > > those who had the answers had passed away. Because of our wonderful >> and >> > > knowledgeable DVHH volunteers, it all fell in place. >> > > >> > > This list and DVHH volunteers love genealogical digs, so if you have >> brick >> > > walls, post it onto the mail list. >> > > Note: If anyone helps you privately from the list, pass it back to the >> > > entire mail list, it's the only way others who wish to help can know >> where >> > > you are at in your search. >> > > >> > > Thanks for sharing, >> > > >> > > Jody McKim Pharr >> > > Woodstock, GA - USA >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > -----Original Message----- >> > > From: donauschwaben-villages-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto: >> > > donauschwaben-villages-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Tina Michel >> > > Sent: Tuesday, April 22, 2014 3:11 PM >> > > To: Barb D; DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES@rootsweb.com >> > > Subject: Re: [DVHH] Donauschwaben and Schwowe >> > > >> > > I have the same feeling as you Barb. Although my father kept on >> telling >> > > us about the good eating and all the things that were done in and >> around >> > > his village, I took everything for granted instead of asking why and >> how. >> > > Also, we spoke several german dialects at home, but I never asked my >> > > father why he would speak schwowisch and not better Hochdeutsch >> (Academic >> > > German). >> > > >> > > I was the youngest child of his second marriage, but I'm the only one >> with >> > > a sense of belonging to his community and his past, and sure enough >> with a >> > > need to dig and find out more. >> > > >> > > With kind regards, >> > > >> > > Tina Michel, >> > > Montreal >> > > >> > > >> > > ----- Original Message ----- >> > > From: "Barb D" <bbd2424@gmail.com> >> > > To: "SusanM" <soozn_6@yahoo.com>; < >> DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES@rootsweb.com> >> > > Sent: Tuesday, April 22, 2014 2:24 PM >> > > Subject: Re: [DVHH] Donauschwaben and Schwowe >> > > >> > > >> > > I agree!!!! This has been fun and very informative. I hope it keeps >> up. I >> > > am >> > > getting the feel for how my grandparents and families lived and died. >> So >> > > many question to go and I will probably never have the answers to >> most. I >> > > am >> > > not even sure how to know if we are Donauschwaben or not. >> > > I wish I had some stories to tell but it was my grandparents who >> lived in >> > > DSM. and they didn't talk a lot about the old country even to their >> kids >> > > (sometimes with their old country friends) or maybe we weren't paying >> > > enough attention to remember. All I can tell you is I wish I had had >> the >> > > foresight to ask or listen better. >> > > So keep the info coming please! If there is anything I can do to help >> let >> > > me >> > > know. I live in a suburb of Chicago, Il. >> > > Thanks so much for all info and help! >> > > Barb D. >> > > >> > > -----Original Message----- >> > > From: SusanM >> > > Sent: Tuesday, April 22, 2014 11:36 AM >> > > To: DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES@rootsweb.com >> > > Subject: Re: [DVHH] Donauschwaben and Schwowe >> > > >> > > I just wanted to say how much I have appreciated this discussion. It >> has >> > > been so interesting, and now I want to go back and hunt the archives. >> I'm >> > > not sure what search terms to use though. Anyway, I wanted to say >> thanks >> > > to >> > > people who have written on this thread. I'm fascinated. >> > > >> > > >> > > Susan M >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > ------------------------------- >> > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> > > DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word >> 'unsubscribe' >> > > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > ------------------------------- >> > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------- >> > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > >> > >> > >> >------------------------------- >> >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > >
P.S. Roger, I forgot to mention that my GF Fiala, like your Treis/Tries family, also immigrated from the Banat to the Black Rock German section of Buffalo. He immigrated as a minor in 1909, age 13; his widowed mother previously immigrated in 1907, the same year as your family from the Banat. I agree with your conclusion that the surname must be a big clue to our families' origins. It's such an obvious thing that I wonder how I could have missed giving it more thought. Thank you for your insight. Linda On Sun, Apr 27, 2014 at 10:40 AM, Linda Jaspersen <ljaspersen@gmail.com>wrote: > Hi Roger, > > This whole discussion about Alsace-Lorraine has encouraged a broader > perspective and the need to think about the possibility that our > German-speaking ancestors might have originated in many other areas. > > For example, one of my main 4 maternal surnames is FIALA, which can be > traced back to the 1700's in the Banat. Whenever I've googled that family > surname, I came up with many Italian responses! Truthfully, the name > doesn't sound typically German, but I never questioned it because they > spoke German in the home and identified themselves as of German heritage > from Austria-Hungary... I realize now that I have no idea where they > originally came from before arriving in the Banat many generations ago. > This genealogy search and discussion is continually turning up many > surprising insights which will hopefully lead to some new discoveries for > all of us. > > Thank you everyone, > > Linda > > > On Fri, Apr 25, 2014 at 9:21 AM, ROGER WARD <hummrhaven@verizon.net>wrote: > >> >> As little research I have done on the Treis/Tries family, the first clue >> I saw was on maps showing a twin city in the Lorraine area called >> Treis-Karden! >> That part of my family migrated from the Banat to Buffalo, NY, into the >> Black Rock German section of that city, in 1907. So how, I wonder, did that >> last name come about? Were they related to the people who founded that town >> around the Moselle region? I should not jump to that until I begin to trace >> down more immediate ancestors, and the immigration info is all I have to >> start with. As so many ethnic Germans did, my mother and her siblings were >> proud Americans, speaking only German in my grandparent's home. >> Yet the name being Treis seems to be such a clue to their origin! >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> On Thu, Apr 24, 2014 1:16 PM EDT Daniel HILAIRE wrote: >> >> >John, >> >Most of people coming from Alsace-Lorraine (in fact, Lorraine), didn't >> speak german when they arrived in Banat; they were speaking only french and >> same for their children; but, as the local administration, the army, >> sometimes the boys or the girls they married, were speaking german, they >> had to speak german and finally they lost their french language; so, >> 120-130 years after, when they arrived to US, they were speaking only >> german until... 120 years after, their descendants speak english and very >> few are able to speak german!Another point : Lorraine was not a part of >> France until 1766Last point : Germany, as a state, didn't exist before >> 1871; to obtain this, Bismark had to fight against Austria in 1866 (and >> again the french in 1870). So, there was no "german from Austria-Hungary". >> >But, as another member of the group explained very well a couple of days >> ago, it's too difficult for a Banater Schwaben to explain who he is really; >> so, let's people from Lorraine, speaking french, become... German from >> Austria. >> >Hope you'll pardon me for these points. >> >Bonne journée >> >Daniel Hilaire, Bordeaux >> > >> > >> > >> > From: jfschambre@comcast.net >> > Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2014 08:53:15 -0700 >> > To: ljaspersen@gmail.com >> > CC: DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES@rootsweb.com >> > Subject: Re: [DVHH] Donauschwaben and Schwowe >> > >> > Linda: It is possible your family came from Alsace-Lorraine France >> where so many German speaking people lived and migrated to the Banat. I >> thought my family came from Germany too because, like yours, they always >> said they were German from Austria-Hungary. Well, they were German and, >> once they moved to the Banat, they were Austro-Hungarians but before that, >> probably back in the late 1600's or throughout the 1700 and 1800's they may >> have lived in France. It was quite a revelation to me. >> > >> > Interestingly, my family had relatives in Buffalo and Tonawanda too! >> Their family names were Bishop and Stetzer and, unfortunately I haven't >> been able to find out much about them. I remember them visiting us in >> Mansfield, Ohio (my home town) but we never went to New York to see them. >> So many mysteries to uncover! >> > >> > Best of luck in your research! >> > >> > John F. Schambre >> > San Francisco, CA >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > On Apr 24, 2014, at 5:44 AM, Linda Jaspersen <ljaspersen@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> > >> > > Rose - Thank you for starting this very informative thread! The >> heritage >> > > postings have been fascinating! I have enjoyed reading them all - >> trying to >> > > catch up after the busy Easter holiday. >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > Jody and other DVHH listees - I can relate to the many comments about >> > > little information offered by our Donauschwab ancestors. Perhaps they >> were >> > > too busy struggling to support their families, learn English, and >> adapt to >> > > a radically new life in their adopted country. And in my case... I >> also >> > > regret not asking the questions that might have triggered more >> sharing of >> > > oral history before my grandparents died. >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > Brief background for those interested: My maternal grandparents were >> born >> > > in Glogowatz, as were their parents and grandparents, etc., to the >> 1700’s, >> > > according to Erwin Kilzheimer’s wonderful Familienbuch. My GF >> immigrant to >> > > Buffalo, New York, as a teenager in 1909, age 13; his widowed mother >> (my GGM) >> > > immigrated in 1907, age 33. My GM immigrated to Tonawanda, New York, >> in >> > > 1914, age 12 years; her father had previously immigrated in 1906 & >> 1910, >> > > and returned to Glogowatz for the last time in 1914 to accompany his >> wife >> > > and 4 remaining children. >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > There is still an active Hungarian Club in Buffalo, but no >> > > Donauschwabclub. My mother states that her parents and older sister >> > > went to the German >> > > club but that it closed during WWII and never reopened. There was >> distrust >> > > and fear at the time; many of the neighbors’ sons were soldiers >> fighting >> > > overseas. >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > When my immigrant grandparents talked about “the old country” as they >> > > called it, they always spoke of themselves as Germans from >> Austria-Hungary, >> > > never mentioning either the Banat or Donauschwaben. One of my huge >> brick >> > > walls is trying to learn where in Germany my ancestors emigrated from >> in >> > > the 1700’s. Unfortunately, I haven’t been able to find them in the >> > > Stadervolumes. >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > All these postings and the information provided on the DVHH site have >> been >> > > a wonderful gift of discovery! There is always something new to learn, >> > > particularly from listers with family memories of what life was like >> in the >> > > Banat for both the people who stayed and those who emigrated. >> > > >> > > >> > > Thank You All, >> > > >> > > >> > > Linda >> > > >> > > >> > > On Wed, Apr 23, 2014 at 7:38 PM, Jody McKim Pharr >> <jodymckimpharr@comcast >> > > .net> wrote: >> > > >> > > Tina, -- First or second marriage, you're still the daughter of a >> Schwowe. >> > > Barb, -- My family who immigrated to the US lived like they were in >> the >> > > witness protection program. They would barely talk about anything. >> Papa >> > > would tell his kids (my grandmother and siblings) to speak English >> "You are >> > > in America now!". It wasn't until 1999 when I started my family >> research >> > > quest. It wasn’t easy figuring out all the answers to my questions >> after >> > > those who had the answers had passed away. Because of our wonderful >> and >> > > knowledgeable DVHH volunteers, it all fell in place. >> > > >> > > This list and DVHH volunteers love genealogical digs, so if you have >> brick >> > > walls, post it onto the mail list. >> > > Note: If anyone helps you privately from the list, pass it back to the >> > > entire mail list, it's the only way others who wish to help can know >> where >> > > you are at in your search. >> > > >> > > Thanks for sharing, >> > > >> > > Jody McKim Pharr >> > > Woodstock, GA - USA >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > -----Original Message----- >> > > From: donauschwaben-villages-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto: >> > > donauschwaben-villages-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Tina Michel >> > > Sent: Tuesday, April 22, 2014 3:11 PM >> > > To: Barb D; DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES@rootsweb.com >> > > Subject: Re: [DVHH] Donauschwaben and Schwowe >> > > >> > > I have the same feeling as you Barb. Although my father kept on >> telling >> > > us about the good eating and all the things that were done in and >> around >> > > his village, I took everything for granted instead of asking why and >> how. >> > > Also, we spoke several german dialects at home, but I never asked my >> > > father why he would speak schwowisch and not better Hochdeutsch >> (Academic >> > > German). >> > > >> > > I was the youngest child of his second marriage, but I'm the only one >> with >> > > a sense of belonging to his community and his past, and sure enough >> with a >> > > need to dig and find out more. >> > > >> > > With kind regards, >> > > >> > > Tina Michel, >> > > Montreal >> > > >> > > >> > > ----- Original Message ----- >> > > From: "Barb D" <bbd2424@gmail.com> >> > > To: "SusanM" <soozn_6@yahoo.com>; < >> DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES@rootsweb.com> >> > > Sent: Tuesday, April 22, 2014 2:24 PM >> > > Subject: Re: [DVHH] Donauschwaben and Schwowe >> > > >> > > >> > > I agree!!!! This has been fun and very informative. I hope it keeps >> up. I >> > > am >> > > getting the feel for how my grandparents and families lived and died. >> So >> > > many question to go and I will probably never have the answers to >> most. I >> > > am >> > > not even sure how to know if we are Donauschwaben or not. >> > > I wish I had some stories to tell but it was my grandparents who >> lived in >> > > DSM. and they didn't talk a lot about the old country even to their >> kids >> > > (sometimes with their old country friends) or maybe we weren't paying >> > > enough attention to remember. All I can tell you is I wish I had had >> the >> > > foresight to ask or listen better. >> > > So keep the info coming please! If there is anything I can do to help >> let >> > > me >> > > know. I live in a suburb of Chicago, Il. >> > > Thanks so much for all info and help! >> > > Barb D. >> > > >> > > -----Original Message----- >> > > From: SusanM >> > > Sent: Tuesday, April 22, 2014 11:36 AM >> > > To: DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES@rootsweb.com >> > > Subject: Re: [DVHH] Donauschwaben and Schwowe >> > > >> > > I just wanted to say how much I have appreciated this discussion. It >> has >> > > been so interesting, and now I want to go back and hunt the archives. >> I'm >> > > not sure what search terms to use though. Anyway, I wanted to say >> thanks >> > > to >> > > people who have written on this thread. I'm fascinated. >> > > >> > > >> > > Susan M >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > ------------------------------- >> > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> > > DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word >> 'unsubscribe' >> > > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > ------------------------------- >> > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------- >> > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > >> > >> > >> >------------------------------- >> >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > >