Daniel: I don't mind at all, in fact I appreciate your input and explanations. It all helps me understand or clarify what information I do have even better :-) I see you are in Bordeaux! I will be visiting there the first week of May. I will be on a Viking River Cruise through Bordeaux wine country and see some Chateau as well - I will end my trip with 3 days in Paris - one of my favorite cities! Again, thanks much for the points of interest. John John F. Schambre San Francisco, CA jfschambre@comcast.net On Apr 24, 2014, at 10:16 AM, Daniel HILAIRE <danielhilaire@hotmail.com> wrote: > John, > > Most of people coming from Alsace-Lorraine (in fact, Lorraine), didn't speak german when they arrived in Banat; they were speaking only french and same for their children; but, as the local administration, the army, sometimes the boys or the girls they married, were speaking german, they had to speak german and finally they lost their french language; so, 120-130 years after, when they arrived to US, they were speaking only german until... 120 years after, their descendants speak english and very few are able to speak german! > Another point : Lorraine was not a part of France until 1766 > Last point : Germany, as a state, didn't exist before 1871; to obtain this, Bismark had to fight against Austria in 1866 (and again the french in 1870). So, there was no "german from Austria-Hungary". > > But, as another member of the group explained very well a couple of days ago, it's too difficult for a Banater Schwaben to explain who he is really; so, let's people from Lorraine, speaking french, become... German from Austria. > > Hope you'll pardon me for these points. > > Bonne journée > > Daniel Hilaire, Bordeaux > > > > > > From: jfschambre@comcast.net > > Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2014 08:53:15 -0700 > > To: ljaspersen@gmail.com > > CC: DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES@rootsweb.com > > Subject: Re: [DVHH] Donauschwaben and Schwowe > > > > Linda: It is possible your family came from Alsace-Lorraine France where so many German speaking people lived and migrated to the Banat. I thought my family came from Germany too because, like yours, they always said they were German from Austria-Hungary. Well, they were German and, once they moved to the Banat, they were Austro-Hungarians but before that, probably back in the late 1600's or throughout the 1700 and 1800's they may have lived in France. It was quite a revelation to me. > > > > Interestingly, my family had relatives in Buffalo and Tonawanda too! Their family names were Bishop and Stetzer and, unfortunately I haven't been able to find out much about them. I remember them visiting us in Mansfield, Ohio (my home town) but we never went to New York to see them. So many mysteries to uncover! > > > > Best of luck in your research! > > > > John F. Schambre > > San Francisco, CA > > > > > > > > > > > > On Apr 24, 2014, at 5:44 AM, Linda Jaspersen <ljaspersen@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > Rose - Thank you for starting this very informative thread! The heritage > > > postings have been fascinating! I have enjoyed reading them all - trying to > > > catch up after the busy Easter holiday. > > > > > > > > > > > > Jody and other DVHH listees - I can relate to the many comments about > > > little information offered by our Donauschwab ancestors. Perhaps they were > > > too busy struggling to support their families, learn English, and adapt to > > > a radically new life in their adopted country. And in my case... I also > > > regret not asking the questions that might have triggered more sharing of > > > oral history before my grandparents died. > > > > > > > > > > > > Brief background for those interested: My maternal grandparents were born > > > in Glogowatz, as were their parents and grandparents, etc., to the 1700’s, > > > according to Erwin Kilzheimer’s wonderful Familienbuch. My GF immigrant to > > > Buffalo, New York, as a teenager in 1909, age 13; his widowed mother (my GGM) > > > immigrated in 1907, age 33. My GM immigrated to Tonawanda, New York, in > > > 1914, age 12 years; her father had previously immigrated in 1906 & 1910, > > > and returned to Glogowatz for the last time in 1914 to accompany his wife > > > and 4 remaining children. > > > > > > > > > > > > There is still an active Hungarian Club in Buffalo, but no > > > Donauschwabclub. My mother states that her parents and older sister > > > went to the German > > > club but that it closed during WWII and never reopened. There was distrust > > > and fear at the time; many of the neighbors’ sons were soldiers fighting > > > overseas. > > > > > > > > > > > > When my immigrant grandparents talked about “the old country” as they > > > called it, they always spoke of themselves as Germans from Austria-Hungary, > > > never mentioning either the Banat or Donauschwaben. One of my huge brick > > > walls is trying to learn where in Germany my ancestors emigrated from in > > > the 1700’s. Unfortunately, I haven’t been able to find them in the > > > Stadervolumes. > > > > > > > > > > > > All these postings and the information provided on the DVHH site have been > > > a wonderful gift of discovery! There is always something new to learn, > > > particularly from listers with family memories of what life was like in the > > > Banat for both the people who stayed and those who emigrated. > > > > > > > > > Thank You All, > > > > > > > > > Linda > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Apr 23, 2014 at 7:38 PM, Jody McKim Pharr <jodymckimpharr@comcast > > > .net> wrote: > > > > > >> Tina, -- First or second marriage, you're still the daughter of a Schwowe. > > >> Barb, -- My family who immigrated to the US lived like they were in the > > >> witness protection program. They would barely talk about anything. Papa > > >> would tell his kids (my grandmother and siblings) to speak English "You are > > >> in America now!". It wasn't until 1999 when I started my family research > > >> quest. It wasn’t easy figuring out all the answers to my questions after > > >> those who had the answers had passed away. Because of our wonderful and > > >> knowledgeable DVHH volunteers, it all fell in place. > > >> > > >> This list and DVHH volunteers love genealogical digs, so if you have brick > > >> walls, post it onto the mail list. > > >> Note: If anyone helps you privately from the list, pass it back to the > > >> entire mail list, it's the only way others who wish to help can know where > > >> you are at in your search. > > >> > > >> Thanks for sharing, > > >> > > >> Jody McKim Pharr > > >> Woodstock, GA - USA > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> -----Original Message----- > > >> From: donauschwaben-villages-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto: > > >> donauschwaben-villages-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Tina Michel > > >> Sent: Tuesday, April 22, 2014 3:11 PM > > >> To: Barb D; DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES@rootsweb.com > > >> Subject: Re: [DVHH] Donauschwaben and Schwowe > > >> > > >> I have the same feeling as you Barb. Although my father kept on telling > > >> us about the good eating and all the things that were done in and around > > >> his village, I took everything for granted instead of asking why and how. > > >> Also, we spoke several german dialects at home, but I never asked my > > >> father why he would speak schwowisch and not better Hochdeutsch (Academic > > >> German). > > >> > > >> I was the youngest child of his second marriage, but I'm the only one with > > >> a sense of belonging to his community and his past, and sure enough with a > > >> need to dig and find out more. > > >> > > >> With kind regards, > > >> > > >> Tina Michel, > > >> Montreal > > >> > > >> > > >> ----- Original Message ----- > > >> From: "Barb D" <bbd2424@gmail.com> > > >> To: "SusanM" <soozn_6@yahoo.com>; <DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES@rootsweb.com> > > >> Sent: Tuesday, April 22, 2014 2:24 PM > > >> Subject: Re: [DVHH] Donauschwaben and Schwowe > > >> > > >> > > >>> I agree!!!! This has been fun and very informative. I hope it keeps up. I > > >>> am > > >>> getting the feel for how my grandparents and families lived and died. So > > >>> many question to go and I will probably never have the answers to most. I > > >>> am > > >>> not even sure how to know if we are Donauschwaben or not. > > >>> I wish I had some stories to tell but it was my grandparents who lived in > > >>> DSM. and they didn't talk a lot about the old country even to their kids > > >>> (sometimes with their old country friends) or maybe we weren't paying > > >>> enough attention to remember. All I can tell you is I wish I had had the > > >>> foresight to ask or listen better. > > >>> So keep the info coming please! If there is anything I can do to help let > > >>> me > > >>> know. I live in a suburb of Chicago, Il. > > >>> Thanks so much for all info and help! > > >>> Barb D. > > >>> > > >>> -----Original Message----- > > >>> From: SusanM > > >>> Sent: Tuesday, April 22, 2014 11:36 AM > > >>> To: DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES@rootsweb.com > > >>> Subject: Re: [DVHH] Donauschwaben and Schwowe > > >>> > > >>> I just wanted to say how much I have appreciated this discussion. It has > > >>> been so interesting, and now I want to go back and hunt the archives. I'm > > >>> not sure what search terms to use though. Anyway, I wanted to say thanks > > >>> to > > >>> people who have written on this thread. I'm fascinated. > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> Susan M > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> ------------------------------- > > >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > >> DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > > >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > >> > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DONAUSCHWABEN-VILLAGES-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message