Bonjour Lori, I am also very interested in this time period and I just finish reading a book written by an Alsatian guy, Rene SPIESS, in 1992. The name of the book, written in french, is "La tragédie des Banatais" (The tragedy of the inhabitants of Banat). The story begins in a part of Banat that has become Serbian and ends with the return to France of some Banat survivors The first chapters therefore describe the life of a Banaters family under the administration of Serbs whom they despise. The young Banaters people who fight on Sundays around the dance halls if young Serbs want to come and dance too.... The growing popularity of HITLER in the eyes of those people who see in the Wermacht an army of liberation from which they look forward to its arrival. But it is in the Yugoslav army that young people are mobilized. At least until March 1941 when the German army invaded Yugoslavia; then the Banaters dressed all their villages with swastika flags! The Yugoslav army is in total disarray and some Serbs decide to continue the fight in hiding; this is the beginning of other chapters that will have a tragic end for the Banaters; hence the title of this historical novel. Daniel, Bordeaux ________________________________ De : Lori Straus <loristraus@loristraus.com> Envoyé : jeudi 24 janvier 2019 02:12 À : Donauschwaben Villages Helping Hands (DVHH) Objet : [DVHH] Re: Attitudes toward Germans in Croatia, Bosnia, Serbia from 1918-1941 This is exactly the time period I’m researching. It’s been difficult, precisely because of the new borders and shifting languages. I just recently hired two freelancers in Romania via Upwork to carry out some research for me, because the material I need to research for my novels (they have a DS storyline—www.loriwolfheffner.com) is in either Romanian or Hungarian. The results I got were very good. I can forward on names if you’d like. They can, for example, scan local newspapers from the time and look for any attitudes towards Germans and then translate those for you. I paid one $25 USD per hour (she was well worth it) and the other $10 USD per hour (I think she’s just finishing up post-secondary or has just finished). She was also good. Lori Straus Freelance writer, editor, and German-to-English translator Sent from my phone > On Jan 23, 2019, at 8:40 PM, Rita Schiwanowitsch <schiwanore@msn.com> wrote: > > No.... that started 01/01/1900. Overnight all documents were written in Hungarian and that became the language in school. > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Jan 23, 2019, at 5:37 PM, Joe Schmidt <joseph.n.schmidt@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> When my great-great grandparents immigrated to the United States in 1906 >> they translated all of their names back from Hungarian to German (both were >> from the Kikinda region). It was a huge mystery to us until recently, as we >> had no idea why our last name was changed from Kovacs to Schmidt! >> >> On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 4:13 PM Thomas Myers <tom.john.myers@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >>> Paul, >>> >>> Didn't they require all citizens to speak and write Hungarian beginning the >>> late 1800s? >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Tom >>> >>>> On Wed, Jan 23, 2019, 16:03 Paul Thompson <patjahsd@gmail.com wrote: >>>> >>>> I agree with you, Eve. There is no single answer. There were many people >>> in >>>> many towns. No single situation. >>>> >>>> However, I do know that some things were happening. There was >>>> "magyarization" in Hungary - a push to become ethnically more Hungarian. >>> My >>>> GGGrandfather's obituary talks about "3 attacks on the family" leading to >>>> "turning his eyes to America". >>>> >>>> In the Vojvodinja, in particular, things were probably quite difficult. >>>> That area was A-H before the war and Serbian after the war. There was >>>> hatred due to wartime loses against Germans. My Great-uncle was shot by >>>> Serbs, I believe due to his speaking German. My grandfather spent time in >>>> prison. >>>> >>>> So, there was an increase in anti-Germanic attitudes. I am looking for a >>>> book or article discussing this. >>>> >>>> Paul A. Thompson >>>> >>>>> On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 2:55 PM Eve <evebrown@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Hello Paul, >>>>> >>>>> I don't know if there would be a universal answer to this from all I've >>>>> heard. I believe the attitudes were different depending on where you >>>>> lived. My parents lived in very diverse towns and some of their >>> closest >>>>> friends were Serbs and some family members also intermarried. During >>> the >>>>> second WW though brother was pitted against brother as to who's "side" >>>> they >>>>> were on. Very much like the US during the Civil War. Just my 2 cents >>>>> worth. >>>>> >>>>> Eve >>>>> >>>>> On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 3:41 PM Paul Thompson <patjahsd@gmail.com> >>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Many here are familiar with the events following WWII on the Germanic >>>>>> population in Czech R, Yugoslavia, Poland, etc. >>>>>> >>>>>> I am interested in the time after WWI up to WWII. Is there a book or >>>>>> document which discusses the overall impact on Germanic persons in >>> the >>>>>> Auslanderdeutschenlander? >>>>>> >>>>>> Paul A. Thompson >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref >>>>>> Unsubscribe >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com >>>>>> Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: >>>>>> https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 >>>>>> Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog >>>>>> RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal >>> RootsWeb >>>>>> community >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Syrmia Regional Coordinator >>>>> http://www.dvhh.org/syrmia >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref >>>>> Unsubscribe >>>>> >>>> >>> https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com >>>>> Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: >>>>> https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 >>>>> Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog >>>>> RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb >>>>> community >>>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref >>>> Unsubscribe >>>> >>> https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com >>>> Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: >>>> https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 >>>> Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog >>>> RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb >>>> community >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref >>> Unsubscribe >>> https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com >>> Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: >>> https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 >>> Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog >>> RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb >>> community >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref >> Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com >> Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 >> Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog >> RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community > > _______________________________________________ > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community _______________________________________________ Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community

Bonjour Akos, There was a KROGLOTH (KROGLOTT) family in Gottlob. Nicolas KROGLOTH married Katharina KATHREIN there in 1775; they had at least 8 children married in Gottlob and a large number of descendants in Banat and some in USA. And Nicolas KROGLOTH was in fact Nicolas CLOUQUEUR born on March 3rd, 1743 in Hannocourt, a small village just near Delme in Lorraine. In this village, people were speaking french. Katharina KATHREIN was also originated from Lorraine; her village was Vibersviller, 30 miles east from Hannocourt. If somebody is interested, I can print a chart of this family starting from Adam CLOUQUEUR and Geneviève MENETRÉ who lived in 17th century. Daniel, Bordeaux ________________________________ De : AR <rittiaki@gmail.com> Envoyé : jeudi 24 janvier 2019 00:09 À : Donauschwaben Villages Helping Hands (DVHH) Objet : [DVHH] Krogloth mill in Gottlob, who are they? Hi everyone, I've found a girl, called Katharina Ritter who was born and died in the Krogloth mill (Kroglot mühle) in 1795 when she was 1 day old. Somebody mentioned, that Krogloth was a family name. May I ask if anyone knows who they were? Did they own mills? Was Krogloth even a family? Thank you, Akos _______________________________________________ Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community

Bob, My grandmothers maiden name was Kippert. Her father, Andreas Kippert, was born in Ujfutak in 1892. He married Veronika Csecs, who was born in 1895, also in Ujfutak. His father was Johannes Kippert, born in 1852 in Ujfutak. Johannes' father was Josephus Kippert, born in 1823, who was married to Julianna Piller. Finally, Josephus' father was Andreas Kippert, born in 1769, and died in 1848. He was married to Anna Montag. I am not sure if either Andreas or Josephus was born in Ujfutak, as birth records only start in 1826. I did not find a daughter named Franziska for them however.  Matthew Wolpert Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone -------- Original message --------From: bob@freiguys.com Date: 1/23/19 9:58 PM (GMT-05:00) To: "'Donauschwaben Villages Helping Hands (DVHH)'" <donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com> Subject: [DVHH] Re: ROLL CALL - Ujfutak and Ofutak Greetings, We may have a connection in the Kippert family of Ofutak. It appears my great- great-great-grandmother Franziska Kippert may have lived in Ofutak  in 1836 and married Josef Schneider.   Their marriage produced - among other children - the woman I believe to be my great-great-grandmother, Elisabeth Schneider. Elisabeth married Martin Walter, and they had a couple of daughters who came to the United States, my great Grandmother Julia and her sister Eva. I have not verified all of this yet with firm documentation, so I am hesitant to post it online because I have seen my speculative postings come back to me many years later in other people's online trees with the speculative notation removed. (My speculation had been wrong, but even today there are people quoting my incorrect speculation from the 1990s as fact.) How much information do you have about your Kippert clan?  I have almost nothing about mine. Bob Frei -----Original Message----- From: wolpert1015 <wolpert1015@gmail.com> Sent: Saturday, January 19, 2019 8:53 PM To: Donauschwaben Villages Helping Hands (DVHH) <donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com> Subject: [DVHH] ROLL CALL - Ujfutak and Ofutak Surnames- Stutz, Barth, Csecs, Kippert, and Piller. Particularly interested in finding the parents/ ancestry of Franciscus Stutz, Anna Barth, and Paulus Csecs, all probably born around 1810. Also, death dates for Johannes Kippert born 1852, Josephus Kippert born in 1823, Johannes Csecs born in 1832, and Magdalena(Kleinchek) Csecs, born in 1836. Thank you. Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone _______________________________________________ Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY  Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community _______________________________________________ Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY  Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community

Greetings, We may have a connection in the Kippert family of Ofutak. It appears my great- great-great-grandmother Franziska Kippert may have lived in Ofutak in 1836 and married Josef Schneider. Their marriage produced - among other children - the woman I believe to be my great-great-grandmother, Elisabeth Schneider. Elisabeth married Martin Walter, and they had a couple of daughters who came to the United States, my great Grandmother Julia and her sister Eva. I have not verified all of this yet with firm documentation, so I am hesitant to post it online because I have seen my speculative postings come back to me many years later in other people's online trees with the speculative notation removed. (My speculation had been wrong, but even today there are people quoting my incorrect speculation from the 1990s as fact.) How much information do you have about your Kippert clan? I have almost nothing about mine. Bob Frei -----Original Message----- From: wolpert1015 <wolpert1015@gmail.com> Sent: Saturday, January 19, 2019 8:53 PM To: Donauschwaben Villages Helping Hands (DVHH) <donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com> Subject: [DVHH] ROLL CALL - Ujfutak and Ofutak Surnames- Stutz, Barth, Csecs, Kippert, and Piller. Particularly interested in finding the parents/ ancestry of Franciscus Stutz, Anna Barth, and Paulus Csecs, all probably born around 1810. Also, death dates for Johannes Kippert born 1852, Josephus Kippert born in 1823, Johannes Csecs born in 1832, and Magdalena(Kleinchek) Csecs, born in 1836. Thank you. Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone _______________________________________________ Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community

This is exactly the time period I’m researching. It’s been difficult, precisely because of the new borders and shifting languages. I just recently hired two freelancers in Romania via Upwork to carry out some research for me, because the material I need to research for my novels (they have a DS storyline—www.loriwolfheffner.com) is in either Romanian or Hungarian. The results I got were very good. I can forward on names if you’d like. They can, for example, scan local newspapers from the time and look for any attitudes towards Germans and then translate those for you. I paid one $25 USD per hour (she was well worth it) and the other $10 USD per hour (I think she’s just finishing up post-secondary or has just finished). She was also good. Lori Straus Freelance writer, editor, and German-to-English translator Sent from my phone > On Jan 23, 2019, at 8:40 PM, Rita Schiwanowitsch <schiwanore@msn.com> wrote: > > No.... that started 01/01/1900. Overnight all documents were written in Hungarian and that became the language in school. > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Jan 23, 2019, at 5:37 PM, Joe Schmidt <joseph.n.schmidt@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> When my great-great grandparents immigrated to the United States in 1906 >> they translated all of their names back from Hungarian to German (both were >> from the Kikinda region). It was a huge mystery to us until recently, as we >> had no idea why our last name was changed from Kovacs to Schmidt! >> >> On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 4:13 PM Thomas Myers <tom.john.myers@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >>> Paul, >>> >>> Didn't they require all citizens to speak and write Hungarian beginning the >>> late 1800s? >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Tom >>> >>>> On Wed, Jan 23, 2019, 16:03 Paul Thompson <patjahsd@gmail.com wrote: >>>> >>>> I agree with you, Eve. There is no single answer. There were many people >>> in >>>> many towns. No single situation. >>>> >>>> However, I do know that some things were happening. There was >>>> "magyarization" in Hungary - a push to become ethnically more Hungarian. >>> My >>>> GGGrandfather's obituary talks about "3 attacks on the family" leading to >>>> "turning his eyes to America". >>>> >>>> In the Vojvodinja, in particular, things were probably quite difficult. >>>> That area was A-H before the war and Serbian after the war. There was >>>> hatred due to wartime loses against Germans. My Great-uncle was shot by >>>> Serbs, I believe due to his speaking German. My grandfather spent time in >>>> prison. >>>> >>>> So, there was an increase in anti-Germanic attitudes. I am looking for a >>>> book or article discussing this. >>>> >>>> Paul A. Thompson >>>> >>>>> On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 2:55 PM Eve <evebrown@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Hello Paul, >>>>> >>>>> I don't know if there would be a universal answer to this from all I've >>>>> heard. I believe the attitudes were different depending on where you >>>>> lived. My parents lived in very diverse towns and some of their >>> closest >>>>> friends were Serbs and some family members also intermarried. During >>> the >>>>> second WW though brother was pitted against brother as to who's "side" >>>> they >>>>> were on. Very much like the US during the Civil War. Just my 2 cents >>>>> worth. >>>>> >>>>> Eve >>>>> >>>>> On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 3:41 PM Paul Thompson <patjahsd@gmail.com> >>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Many here are familiar with the events following WWII on the Germanic >>>>>> population in Czech R, Yugoslavia, Poland, etc. >>>>>> >>>>>> I am interested in the time after WWI up to WWII. Is there a book or >>>>>> document which discusses the overall impact on Germanic persons in >>> the >>>>>> Auslanderdeutschenlander? >>>>>> >>>>>> Paul A. Thompson >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref >>>>>> Unsubscribe >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com >>>>>> Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: >>>>>> https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 >>>>>> Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog >>>>>> RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal >>> RootsWeb >>>>>> community >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Syrmia Regional Coordinator >>>>> http://www.dvhh.org/syrmia >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref >>>>> Unsubscribe >>>>> >>>> >>> https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com >>>>> Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: >>>>> https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 >>>>> Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog >>>>> RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb >>>>> community >>>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref >>>> Unsubscribe >>>> >>> https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com >>>> Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: >>>> https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 >>>> Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog >>>> RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb >>>> community >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref >>> Unsubscribe >>> https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com >>> Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: >>> https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 >>> Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog >>> RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb >>> community >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref >> Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com >> Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 >> Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog >> RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community > > _______________________________________________ > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community

No.... that started 01/01/1900. Overnight all documents were written in Hungarian and that became the language in school. Sent from my iPhone > On Jan 23, 2019, at 5:37 PM, Joe Schmidt <joseph.n.schmidt@gmail.com> wrote: > > When my great-great grandparents immigrated to the United States in 1906 > they translated all of their names back from Hungarian to German (both were > from the Kikinda region). It was a huge mystery to us until recently, as we > had no idea why our last name was changed from Kovacs to Schmidt! > > On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 4:13 PM Thomas Myers <tom.john.myers@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> Paul, >> >> Didn't they require all citizens to speak and write Hungarian beginning the >> late 1800s? >> >> Thanks, >> >> Tom >> >>> On Wed, Jan 23, 2019, 16:03 Paul Thompson <patjahsd@gmail.com wrote: >>> >>> I agree with you, Eve. There is no single answer. There were many people >> in >>> many towns. No single situation. >>> >>> However, I do know that some things were happening. There was >>> "magyarization" in Hungary - a push to become ethnically more Hungarian. >> My >>> GGGrandfather's obituary talks about "3 attacks on the family" leading to >>> "turning his eyes to America". >>> >>> In the Vojvodinja, in particular, things were probably quite difficult. >>> That area was A-H before the war and Serbian after the war. There was >>> hatred due to wartime loses against Germans. My Great-uncle was shot by >>> Serbs, I believe due to his speaking German. My grandfather spent time in >>> prison. >>> >>> So, there was an increase in anti-Germanic attitudes. I am looking for a >>> book or article discussing this. >>> >>> Paul A. Thompson >>> >>>> On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 2:55 PM Eve <evebrown@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> Hello Paul, >>>> >>>> I don't know if there would be a universal answer to this from all I've >>>> heard. I believe the attitudes were different depending on where you >>>> lived. My parents lived in very diverse towns and some of their >> closest >>>> friends were Serbs and some family members also intermarried. During >> the >>>> second WW though brother was pitted against brother as to who's "side" >>> they >>>> were on. Very much like the US during the Civil War. Just my 2 cents >>>> worth. >>>> >>>> Eve >>>> >>>> On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 3:41 PM Paul Thompson <patjahsd@gmail.com> >>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Many here are familiar with the events following WWII on the Germanic >>>>> population in Czech R, Yugoslavia, Poland, etc. >>>>> >>>>> I am interested in the time after WWI up to WWII. Is there a book or >>>>> document which discusses the overall impact on Germanic persons in >> the >>>>> Auslanderdeutschenlander? >>>>> >>>>> Paul A. Thompson >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref >>>>> Unsubscribe >>>>> >>>> >>> >> https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com >>>>> Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: >>>>> https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 >>>>> Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog >>>>> RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal >> RootsWeb >>>>> community >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Syrmia Regional Coordinator >>>> http://www.dvhh.org/syrmia >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref >>>> Unsubscribe >>>> >>> >> https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com >>>> Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: >>>> https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 >>>> Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog >>>> RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb >>>> community >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref >>> Unsubscribe >>> >> https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com >>> Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: >>> https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 >>> Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog >>> RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb >>> community >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref >> Unsubscribe >> https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com >> Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: >> https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 >> Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog >> RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb >> community >> > > _______________________________________________ > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community

When my great-great grandparents immigrated to the United States in 1906 they translated all of their names back from Hungarian to German (both were from the Kikinda region). It was a huge mystery to us until recently, as we had no idea why our last name was changed from Kovacs to Schmidt! On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 4:13 PM Thomas Myers <tom.john.myers@gmail.com> wrote: > Paul, > > Didn't they require all citizens to speak and write Hungarian beginning the > late 1800s? > > Thanks, > > Tom > > On Wed, Jan 23, 2019, 16:03 Paul Thompson <patjahsd@gmail.com wrote: > > > I agree with you, Eve. There is no single answer. There were many people > in > > many towns. No single situation. > > > > However, I do know that some things were happening. There was > > "magyarization" in Hungary - a push to become ethnically more Hungarian. > My > > GGGrandfather's obituary talks about "3 attacks on the family" leading to > > "turning his eyes to America". > > > > In the Vojvodinja, in particular, things were probably quite difficult. > > That area was A-H before the war and Serbian after the war. There was > > hatred due to wartime loses against Germans. My Great-uncle was shot by > > Serbs, I believe due to his speaking German. My grandfather spent time in > > prison. > > > > So, there was an increase in anti-Germanic attitudes. I am looking for a > > book or article discussing this. > > > > Paul A. Thompson > > > > On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 2:55 PM Eve <evebrown@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > Hello Paul, > > > > > > I don't know if there would be a universal answer to this from all I've > > > heard. I believe the attitudes were different depending on where you > > > lived. My parents lived in very diverse towns and some of their > closest > > > friends were Serbs and some family members also intermarried. During > the > > > second WW though brother was pitted against brother as to who's "side" > > they > > > were on. Very much like the US during the Civil War. Just my 2 cents > > > worth. > > > > > > Eve > > > > > > On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 3:41 PM Paul Thompson <patjahsd@gmail.com> > > wrote: > > > > > > > Many here are familiar with the events following WWII on the Germanic > > > > population in Czech R, Yugoslavia, Poland, etc. > > > > > > > > I am interested in the time after WWI up to WWII. Is there a book or > > > > document which discusses the overall impact on Germanic persons in > the > > > > Auslanderdeutschenlander? > > > > > > > > Paul A. Thompson > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > > > > Unsubscribe > > > > > > > > > > https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com > > > > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: > > > > https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > > > > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > > > > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal > RootsWeb > > > > community > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Syrmia Regional Coordinator > > > http://www.dvhh.org/syrmia > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > > > Unsubscribe > > > > > > https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com > > > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: > > > https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > > > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > > > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb > > > community > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > > Unsubscribe > > > https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com > > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: > > https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb > > community > > > > _______________________________________________ > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > Unsubscribe > https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: > https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb > community >

Paul, Didn't they require all citizens to speak and write Hungarian beginning the late 1800s? Thanks, Tom On Wed, Jan 23, 2019, 16:03 Paul Thompson <patjahsd@gmail.com wrote: > I agree with you, Eve. There is no single answer. There were many people in > many towns. No single situation. > > However, I do know that some things were happening. There was > "magyarization" in Hungary - a push to become ethnically more Hungarian. My > GGGrandfather's obituary talks about "3 attacks on the family" leading to > "turning his eyes to America". > > In the Vojvodinja, in particular, things were probably quite difficult. > That area was A-H before the war and Serbian after the war. There was > hatred due to wartime loses against Germans. My Great-uncle was shot by > Serbs, I believe due to his speaking German. My grandfather spent time in > prison. > > So, there was an increase in anti-Germanic attitudes. I am looking for a > book or article discussing this. > > Paul A. Thompson > > On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 2:55 PM Eve <evebrown@gmail.com> wrote: > > > Hello Paul, > > > > I don't know if there would be a universal answer to this from all I've > > heard. I believe the attitudes were different depending on where you > > lived. My parents lived in very diverse towns and some of their closest > > friends were Serbs and some family members also intermarried. During the > > second WW though brother was pitted against brother as to who's "side" > they > > were on. Very much like the US during the Civil War. Just my 2 cents > > worth. > > > > Eve > > > > On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 3:41 PM Paul Thompson <patjahsd@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > > > Many here are familiar with the events following WWII on the Germanic > > > population in Czech R, Yugoslavia, Poland, etc. > > > > > > I am interested in the time after WWI up to WWII. Is there a book or > > > document which discusses the overall impact on Germanic persons in the > > > Auslanderdeutschenlander? > > > > > > Paul A. Thompson > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > > > Unsubscribe > > > > > > https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com > > > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: > > > https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > > > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > > > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb > > > community > > > > > > > > > -- > > Syrmia Regional Coordinator > > http://www.dvhh.org/syrmia > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > > Unsubscribe > > > https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com > > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: > > https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb > > community > > > > _______________________________________________ > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > Unsubscribe > https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: > https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb > community >

Hi everyone, I've found a girl, called Katharina Ritter who was born and died in the Krogloth mill (Kroglot mühle) in 1795 when she was 1 day old. Somebody mentioned, that Krogloth was a family name. May I ask if anyone knows who they were? Did they own mills? Was Krogloth even a family? Thank you, Akos

I agree with you, Eve. There is no single answer. There were many people in many towns. No single situation. However, I do know that some things were happening. There was "magyarization" in Hungary - a push to become ethnically more Hungarian. My GGGrandfather's obituary talks about "3 attacks on the family" leading to "turning his eyes to America". In the Vojvodinja, in particular, things were probably quite difficult. That area was A-H before the war and Serbian after the war. There was hatred due to wartime loses against Germans. My Great-uncle was shot by Serbs, I believe due to his speaking German. My grandfather spent time in prison. So, there was an increase in anti-Germanic attitudes. I am looking for a book or article discussing this. Paul A. Thompson On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 2:55 PM Eve <evebrown@gmail.com> wrote: > Hello Paul, > > I don't know if there would be a universal answer to this from all I've > heard. I believe the attitudes were different depending on where you > lived. My parents lived in very diverse towns and some of their closest > friends were Serbs and some family members also intermarried. During the > second WW though brother was pitted against brother as to who's "side" they > were on. Very much like the US during the Civil War. Just my 2 cents > worth. > > Eve > > On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 3:41 PM Paul Thompson <patjahsd@gmail.com> wrote: > > > Many here are familiar with the events following WWII on the Germanic > > population in Czech R, Yugoslavia, Poland, etc. > > > > I am interested in the time after WWI up to WWII. Is there a book or > > document which discusses the overall impact on Germanic persons in the > > Auslanderdeutschenlander? > > > > Paul A. Thompson > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > > Unsubscribe > > > https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com > > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: > > https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb > > community > > > > > -- > Syrmia Regional Coordinator > http://www.dvhh.org/syrmia > > _______________________________________________ > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > Unsubscribe > https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: > https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb > community >

Thank you for your response. At present I am not doing research. Barbara Sent from my iPad > On Jan 22, 2019, at 1:07 PM, Anne Dreer <dreera@sympatico.ca> wrote: > > Hello Barbara, > there are a number of Kuhn's listed in the Bukin book. What was the man's first name and approximate date of birth? No other women's names? > Anne Dreer > > > _______________________________________________ > Email preferences: https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fbit.ly%2Frootswebpref&amp;data=02%7C01%7C%7C6024510534944937a04208d680ada826%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636837880670463628&amp;sdata=0Txwh7N0HfdqGJYZimxLii5PLR6MghaKz8t0nBYvJyE%3D&amp;reserved=0 > Unsubscribe https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.rootsweb.com%2Fpostorius%2Flists%2Fdonauschwaben-villages%40rootsweb.com&amp;data=02%7C01%7C%7C6024510534944937a04208d680ada826%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636837880670463628&amp;sdata=1SyQev3z5fOH7Tk6AjTmSlf1V%2F6BLmJY%2FE%2B5Of5Z%2FTY%3D&amp;reserved=0 > Privacy Statement: https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fancstry.me%2F2JWBOdY&amp;data=02%7C01%7C%7C6024510534944937a04208d680ada826%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636837880670463628&amp;sdata=8kR6D2W8TiSOCsRpUyfzlLM%2Bg30uQtBH8W31rAm5YuA%3D&amp;reserved=0 Terms and Conditions: https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fancstry.me%2F2HDBym9&amp;data=02%7C01%7C%7C6024510534944937a04208d680ada826%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636837880670463628&amp;sdata=GtYB6%2F6AQxrom9HbTt2yHZmDnyGq2cL9mhRwuwIFlCg%3D&amp;reserved=0 > Rootsweb Blog: https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frootsweb.blog&amp;data=02%7C01%7C%7C6024510534944937a04208d680ada826%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636837880670463628&amp;sdata=gZPyAQo%2B%2FJokC4zvuXyMPUjL7qV1z0VQmNQ5MSikiN4%3D&amp;reserved=0 > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community

Hello Paul, I don't know if there would be a universal answer to this from all I've heard. I believe the attitudes were different depending on where you lived. My parents lived in very diverse towns and some of their closest friends were Serbs and some family members also intermarried. During the second WW though brother was pitted against brother as to who's "side" they were on. Very much like the US during the Civil War. Just my 2 cents worth. Eve On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 3:41 PM Paul Thompson <patjahsd@gmail.com> wrote: > Many here are familiar with the events following WWII on the Germanic > population in Czech R, Yugoslavia, Poland, etc. > > I am interested in the time after WWI up to WWII. Is there a book or > document which discusses the overall impact on Germanic persons in the > Auslanderdeutschenlander? > > Paul A. Thompson > > _______________________________________________ > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > Unsubscribe > https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: > https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb > community > -- Syrmia Regional Coordinator http://www.dvhh.org/syrmia

Many here are familiar with the events following WWII on the Germanic population in Czech R, Yugoslavia, Poland, etc. I am interested in the time after WWI up to WWII. Is there a book or document which discusses the overall impact on Germanic persons in the Auslanderdeutschenlander? Paul A. Thompson

Zenser, Roos, Gruen, Kyre...Nagyszentmiklos, Torontal, Hungary

Hi! On the roll call I sent yesterday I put any info from there. I didn’t mean time. I need before there and after. Sorry for the mix up. Barb Sent from my iPad > On Jan 22, 2019, at 1:39 PM, <bbd2424@gmail.com> <bbd2424@gmail.com> wrote: > > Hello All, > I could really use some help in finding any info about > FRESZ > LEIMETTER > KOST > JÜNGER > I know they all were in Deustch St. Michael but no one seems to have any info from there. > So if anyone has any info from anywhere I could really use it and would be forever grateful. > Thanks again, > Barb( still freeze in Chicago)

Family names in my father’s tree listed by town going back 6 generations (umlauts and accents removed per admin) with origins noted: VELISKOVCI: Vrbanac/Wrbanetz/Wrbanek (from Apatin) Bayer/Bajer Balentic Takalic APATIN: Vrbanac/Verbanatz/Verbonatz (origins of this family would be great) Becker Lautenbacher Znamenak Gissinger Mayer Weinketz/Weinkass/Veinketz Schwarzli Keller FILIPOWA (The on-line Filipowa Family Book [ http://filipowa.at/ortssippenbuch.html ] is a great reference for this branch): Schmidt (from Saarbrucken) Ertl (from Marlen, Ortenaukreis, Baden-Wurttemberg) Mattes (from Durbheim, Schwarzwaldkreis, Wurttemberg via Weprowatz, Batschka) Hock Pertschi (from Weigheim, Schwarzwaldkreis, Baden-Wurttemberg) Zollitsch (from Tirschenreuth, Bavaria) Ruppaner (from Mengen, Breisgau-Hochschwarzwald, Baden-Wurttemberg) Milla (from Biela, Chrudimerkreis, Bohmen) Vitousek/Wituschek Hluschek/Lauschek Martinetz Rapp (from Trillfingen, Zollernalbkreis, Baden-Wurttemberg) Horn (from Trillfingen, Zollernalbkreis, Baden-Wurttemberg) Urich (from Breitenbrunn, Odenwaldkreis, Hessen) KERNEI: Werle Burger Keller (from Apatin) Sonntag Keiling MARIENFELD: Windbacher (origins of this family would be great) Stagl Muller Oll Kollet Schulder Schneider (from Nadwar) Knab BRESONDORF (Konigsgnad/Tirol): Windbacher (from Marienfeld via Kübekháza) GROSS-SCHAM (an on-line tree has many of this family [ http://clandata.sytes.net:2348/clandata?lang=en ]: Damit/Damith (from Diekirch, Luxembourg) Hubert (from Diekirch, Luxembourg) Lorencz/Lorenz (from Trier) Makovitz Osterreicher/Oesterreicher Schneider Neumann (from Jahrmarkt) Oehl (from Knez) NOTABLE BRICK WALLS: - Parents of my 3rd great grandfather Adalbert Bayer (or Bajer) 1825-1867. Though he died in Veliskovci, he and his parents may be from Apatin as so many of the Donauschaben in that town. However, he does not appear in the Apatin Familienbuch. - Fate of my 2nd great grandmother Katarina Windbacher Lohmuller (b. 1861). Last known to be widowed, living in Königsgnad/Tirol in 1923. She was young enough to have seen WWII. - Fate of some of my other 2nd great grandparents: Joseph Vrbanac (b. 1853 Veliskovci), Regina (Bayer) Vrbanac (b. 1857 Veliskovci) and Ferencz Werle (b. 1856 Kernei). Thanks, John

Barb, Are you still interested in pages from the Family Book? I have Familienbuch Tschakowa which includes Wojteg (Voiteg). There are seven Bratans listed and fourteen Krumenackers. I will gladly copy the pages and send to you, if you are still in need. Regards, Joan ________________________________ From: bbd2424@gmail.com <bbd2424@gmail.com> Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2019 6:27 PM To: DVHH Subject: [DVHH] Look ups: Hi, Could some one please send me the all the pages in the Wiseschdia Book for all the Bratan’s (Brattan)? Also need the pages for KRUMENACKER– in VOITEG or ANYWHERE else. I have a ugly major mix up somewhere and hoping I can figure it out with this info. If u need to mail I will be happy to pay for postage and supplies, Thanks, Barb _______________________________________________ Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community

The Hoffmann that I am interested in is a Friedrich Hoffmann, who married Katherine/Katherina Brausch. They came to the USA in 1906. Does that line up with any of your information? Paul A. Thompson On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 12:33 AM Martina Lenhardt <martina.lenhardt@gmx.de> wrote: > Hi Paul, > > my grandmother is Magdalena Hoffmann from Franzjosefsfeld. I can trace the > Hoffmanns back to Gundelfingen near Freiburg, Germany and then even further > back to Switzerland. > > Maybe I have some information for you? > > Best wishes > Martina > > Von meinem iPhone gesendet > > > Am 23.01.2019 um 00:26 schrieb Paul Thompson <patjahsd@gmail.com>: > > > > New inquiry > > > > Paul A. Thompson > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > > Unsubscribe > https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com > > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: > https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb > community > > _______________________________________________ > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > Unsubscribe > https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: > https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb > community >

Hi Paul, my grandmother is Magdalena Hoffmann from Franzjosefsfeld. I can trace the Hoffmanns back to Gundelfingen near Freiburg, Germany and then even further back to Switzerland. Maybe I have some information for you? Best wishes Martina Von meinem iPhone gesendet > Am 23.01.2019 um 00:26 schrieb Paul Thompson <patjahsd@gmail.com>: > > New inquiry > > Paul A. Thompson > > _______________________________________________ > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/donauschwaben-villages@rootsweb.com > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community

Hi, Could some one please send me the all the pages in the Wiseschdia Book for all the Bratan’s (Brattan)? Also need the pages for KRUMENACKER– in VOITEG or ANYWHERE else. I have a ugly major mix up somewhere and hoping I can figure it out with this info. If u need to mail I will be happy to pay for postage and supplies, Thanks, Barb