[The name O'Cainus also makes little sense to me. Surnames weren't used prior to about 950 in Ireland. A man was described in terms of his father (mac) or grandfather (ua). You can see the development of fixed Irish] Sir James Lamont, in 1661, referred to an ancestor that is typed up as 'Orcanus' in the Lamont Papers. The Lamont Papers themselves are transcripts of handwritten documents. So firstly, the transcription may be incorrect. Secondly, it would have been quite possible, if Sir James knew that his ancestor was called Cain, to have described him (in 1661) as O'Cainus, notwithstanding the fact that surnames first started taking off around 950. It's just possible that the Inveryn Charters (from which the Lamont Papers drew the Orcanus story), may be in the the Inverchaolain Manse library. The secretary of the Clan Lamont Society out for the morning. I'll call this afternoon. -----Original Message----- From: dna-r1b1c7-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:dna-r1b1c7-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Lochlan@aol.com Sent: 24 May 2011 23:02 To: dna-r1b1c7@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [R-M222] Orcanus In a message dated 5/24/2011 6:51:14 A.M. Central Daylight Time, alexanderpatterson@btinternet.com writes: