A good answer. And the next few weeks are an ideal time to try some cheap SNP tests at yseq.net although there is probably only time left to do one round before the price goes back up. So S660 on its own or with S588 and DF85 if not tested before, is a good way to roughly place yourself on the new tree if not absolutely precisely. If you are S660- you are highly likely to be FGC4077+. When the price goes back up Chromo2 comes back more into the picture as a good catch-all test and covers most of the relevant SNPs. Iain > Date: Mon, 19 May 2014 05:43:36 -0500 > From: ldm.127187@gmail.com > To: dna-r1b1c7@rootsweb.com > Subject: [R-M222] Great question from a newer member of our M222+ > > In my Inbox this morning I had this question from one of our M222 guys: > > I was looking at the subgroups within the > > M222 group and noticed I (among a couple others) are in the S675/DF85- > > subgroup. Would it make more sense to place us in the S660+ subgroup? > > My response: > > Good question................. > > Unless you have tested for S660/S659 (DF105) on a third party > test............... > > ............we do not know if you are positive or negative for same. > > Very confusing even to me still. > > The initial test by FTDNA for your yDNA only included down to > M222........in theory.......theory being that is as far as was reported > by FTDNA at that time. > > Now FTDNA may (does) know a lot more than they tell us and so the > guarantee more or less is to test you through a certain point at a > certain given time which until a few months ago was only down to M222 > positive for our SNP M222. > > This time a year ago folks who were M222 positive had no where to go and > nothing else to test as far as yDNA was concerned. > > Now, that does not mean that some scientists did not know what was > downstream of M222. > > It just means that FTDNA did not offer a test. Nor did other companies > that I know about. But, then last summer or even a year or so earlier > > we began to hear about a > > few folks that were testing was it called, for instance, Full Genome > and Dr Jim Wilson > of BritainsDNA et al were doing sequencing on advanced yDNA > testing..............ie: new territory on the yDNA frontier. > > So, I see where you have bought the single SNP DF85 and tested negative > but I do not see where you have tested any other SNP beyond your initial > first yDNA tests. > > I would not know about THIRD PARTY TESTING unless you told me or Iain > Kennedy or Susan Hedeen or someone posted same and I happen to see > it. FTDNA only posts what their own labs do and that is all I have > access to as an FTDNA admin. > > At this time it is highly suggested you ask Iain Kennedy or Susan Hedeen > or David Wilson or post a query to the R1b1c7 before buying single SNPs > for testing. This is because there is a disconnect between the > "citizen science" and the FTDNA company. I believe I will post this > to the forum as I know it is very difficult for most newcomers. > > Please let me (us-or the forum) know if I haven't "gotten" it for you. > > > Linda > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DNA-R1B1C7-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message