In a message dated 10/3/2011 12:12:52 P.M. Central Daylight Time, bernardmorgan@hotmail.com writes: Am interested to learn more about this M222+ population. However troubled by there origin for I have not heard of the O'Kelly and O'Madden of Ui Maine being M222+, its been the opposite to my understanding? I don't think you can make a case for M222 among the Ui Maine of Connacht without taking O'Kelly and O'Madden, two of the main chieftains, into account. The Muinter Lorcan mentioned in the Book of Ui Maine was a line of the Siol-Anmchadha, the same tribe the O'Maddens belonged to. I looked on Ysearch and didn't see many Madden entries - none appeared to be M222. There are 10 Kelly samples from Connacht in the Trinity spreadsheet - none are M222. The origins of the Ui Maine of Connacht are obscure. I think Bernard in the past has quoted some authority (Byrnes?) who believed they were really Maine mac Neill. That is also the position adopted by the author based on the Lebor Breac, which is referenced in the article but no excerpts are offered in support. The two main origins for the Ui Maine are both pre-Niall and probably suspect. The earliest reference I can find is in Rawlinson B.502 ¶760] Dá mc Fiachach Sraiptene: Muiredach Tírech ocus Domnall a quo Úi Maine Connacht secundum quosdam.[according to some] Then of course you have the traditional pedigree from the Collas. If there is one thing most people I know agree about in Irish DNA it's that the descendants of the Collas (Airgialla) are not M222 even though their pedigree says they should be. The Ui Maine mac Neill should be M222 yet there are few samples out there to support that. I saw reference to some Fox samples lately and checked myself. That is presumably a surname that may have come from the O'Kearney chieftains of the tribe whose chieftain was called 'the Fox'. There are tons of Foxes in Ireland in the Griffith's. There is one M222 Fox in the M222 project but his origins are listed as unknown. Most of the Foxes on Ysearch are not M222. So I can't make much of this. John