Allene, Yes, if these closely related members share the exact same STR values as the tested member, but if they don't then Deep Clade testing is called for. The problem is that the area of Ireland, Britain or France or elsewhere, where M222 first arose, there are going to exist M222+ and M222- individuals, who probably have very similar STR values - so a Non Paternal Event (NPE) in this community would still give similar STR values to biological parent, and could be miscounted as being M222+ What I'm specifically referring to though is the huge Doherty and other projects, where only a handful of participants have been tested for M222+, and the majority are assumed to belong, based solely on similar STR values. Cheers, Paul On Thu, Jul 7, 2011 at 10:56 AM, Allene Goforth <agoforth@moscow.com> wrote: > Paul, > > I would say that only ONE member of a close cluster like my five > MacAdam/McAdam lines needs to take the Deep Clade test. I'm in a bit of > a hurry right now, but I know that FTDNA has stated more than once that > it isn't necessary to spend all that money on separate Deep Clade tests > for a group that's obviously related. > > Allene > > > R1b1c7 Research and Links: > > http://clanmaclochlainn.com/R1b1c7/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DNA-R1B1C7-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi Paul, I can see where you are coming from with the Dohertys. I don't place much faith on merely sharing the same surname, and the Mac/McAdam clan as a whole certainly isn't all M222. My little band doesn't share the exact same STR values. That's setting the bar very high. Sometimes not even father/son are exact matches. I think Thomas Krahn would tell me not to waste my money on any more Deep Clade tests for that bunch. Allene On 7/7/2011 8:03 AM, Paul Conroy wrote: > Allene, > > Yes, if these closely related members share the exact same STR values as the > tested member, but if they don't then Deep Clade testing is called for. > > The problem is that the area of Ireland, Britain or France or elsewhere, > where M222 first arose, there are going to exist M222+ and M222- > individuals, who probably have very similar STR values - so a Non Paternal > Event (NPE) in this community would still give similar STR values to > biological parent, and could be miscounted as being M222+ > > What I'm specifically referring to though is the huge Doherty and other > projects, where only a handful of participants have been tested for M222+, > and the majority are assumed to belong, based solely on similar STR values. > > Cheers, > Paul > > On Thu, Jul 7, 2011 at 10:56 AM, Allene Goforth<agoforth@moscow.com> wrote: > >> Paul, >> >> I would say that only ONE member of a close cluster like my five >> MacAdam/McAdam lines needs to take the Deep Clade test. I'm in a bit of >> a hurry right now, but I know that FTDNA has stated more than once that >> it isn't necessary to spend all that money on separate Deep Clade tests >> for a group that's obviously related. >> >> Allene >> >> >> R1b1c7 Research and Links: >> >> http://clanmaclochlainn.com/R1b1c7/ >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> DNA-R1B1C7-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > R1b1c7 Research and Links: > > http://clanmaclochlainn.com/R1b1c7/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DNA-R1B1C7-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I see Doherty 31706 (SNP untested) is a GD of 21 from Daugherty 73633 (who has been tested) over 111 markers. I don't know their haplotypes that well, but I can't see how anyone could regard them as being closely related. I'll have a look at their closest non-Doherty/Daugherty matches over 67 markers. -----Original Message----- From: dna-r1b1c7-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:dna-r1b1c7-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Paul Conroy Sent: 07 July 2011 16:03 To: dna-r1b1c7@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [R-M222] How is M222 defined? Allene, Yes, if these closely related members share the exact same STR values as the tested member, but if they don't then Deep Clade testing is called for. The problem is that the area of Ireland, Britain or France or elsewhere, where M222 first arose, there are going to exist M222+ and M222- individuals, who probably have very similar STR values - so a Non Paternal Event (NPE) in this community would still give similar STR values to biological parent, and could be miscounted as being M222+ What I'm specifically referring to though is the huge Doherty and other projects, where only a handful of participants have been tested for M222+, and the majority are assumed to belong, based solely on similar STR values. Cheers, Paul On Thu, Jul 7, 2011 at 10:56 AM, Allene Goforth <agoforth@moscow.com> wrote: > Paul, > > I would say that only ONE member of a close cluster like my five > MacAdam/McAdam lines needs to take the Deep Clade test. I'm in a bit of > a hurry right now, but I know that FTDNA has stated more than once that > it isn't necessary to spend all that money on separate Deep Clade tests > for a group that's obviously related. > > Allene > > > R1b1c7 Research and Links: > > http://clanmaclochlainn.com/R1b1c7/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DNA-R1B1C7-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > R1b1c7 Research and Links: http://clanmaclochlainn.com/R1b1c7/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DNA-R1B1C7-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message