Hello again Listers, I have a copy of the marriage certificate for Henry John TURNER, aged 21, R.N. Seaman of H.M.S. Cambridge, son of Henry John Turner, laborer, who married Mary Ann HYLTON, aged 20, daughter of William HYLTON, hatter, in the Parish Church of St. Peter, Plymouth, Devon, on 28.11.1869. I have not been able to find any trace of this couple in the online census records. Can anyone give me a clue where to look next. Thanks, Margaret in Australia

G'day Margaret You could try the seamen's lists at the National Archive to see if he appears there. If he was at sea, he probably would not appear in the 1871 Census or the 1881 Census. Also you might be able to obtain his attestation papers which should have the ships in which he served and when and where he was discharged. Hope this helps. Regards Ray Lewis Hazelmere Western Australia On 9/01/2014 7:11 AM, Margaret Baensch wrote: > Hello again Listers, > > I have a copy of the marriage certificate for Henry John TURNER, aged 21, > R.N. Seaman of H.M.S. Cambridge, <snipped>

Yes, Yes, that would be here. They were the parents of Grace JOHNS. HMMM, I wander why she was living with her grandparents, and did not immigrate to Canada with the rest of the family. Anything on this Sidney HEARD? Thanks, Lance -----Original Message----- From: SP Sent: Wednesday, January 08, 2014 10:33 PM To: devon@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [DEV] Missing HEARDs Hello Again This could be the Ellen b 1858 with the Johns grandparents 1861 Census *4 Records found* *Piece:* RG9/1497 *Place:* High Bickington -Devon *Enumeration District:* 6 *Civil Parish:* St Giles In The Wood *Ecclesiastical Parish:* St Giles In The Wood *Folio:* 70 *Page:* 15 *Schedule:* 57 *Address:* Healand Cross ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Surname First name(s) Rel Status Sex Age Occupation Where Born Remarks JOHNS Robert Head M M 70 Ag Lab Cornwall - Stockconlin JOHNS Ann Wife M F 66 Wife Devon - St Giles In The Wood JOHNS Sarah Dau U F 42 Serv Devon - St Giles In The Wood HEARD Ellen Grndau - F 2 Sussex - - :) Susan On 9/01/2014 3:37 PM, Lance L. Piatt wrote: > Dear List Members, > > I am working on putting the family of George HEARD & Grace JOHNS of > Beaford together for a friend of mine. However, I ran into a small > problem. > > > 1. The census records do not include a daughter by the name of Ellen > HEARD who was born 11 Jan 1858 in Beaford. She does not appear in the > immigration records of Ontario either when the family arrived. However, a > death record was discovered that lists her maiden name of BOWDEN, and > listed as their daughter. There is also an immigration record of her > visiting her sister Jessie (Heard) STARKIE in New York. It appears that > she may have married a Walter John BOWDEN (June Quarter 1896 St. Thomas 5b > 119). > > 2. Again I find no census records of a son Sidney HEARD who was listed in > the immigration records as being their son, born in 1860. I that there > was a birth registered for a Sidney HEARD (June Quarter 1861 Chelmsford 4a > 148) > > I tried to see if I could order the church records for Beaford, but it > doesn’t appear that they are available after 1839. > > Is there anyway of proving or disproving the parentage of these kids. Is > anyone available to do Beaford look-ups? > > Regards, > Lance > > ------------------------------------------ > The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon > ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) > and > the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) > List archive for Devon can be found at > http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message --- This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active. http://www.avast.com ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Sounds like a good excuse to get there someday. We were in Devon two years ago for our 40th anniversary trip, a tour all around Britain, but there wasn't time for anything but the normal tourist things. It was exciting to drive through or near so many of the locations mentioned in my genealogy: Totness, Colyton, Southcott, Biddeford, Paignton, etc. In fact, we had dinner at a farm in Buskfastleigh, near the homes of many of my early (1620s and 1630s) New England ancestors. Chuck May Pittsfield MA ChuckMay@may-engineering.com http://www.may-engineering.com -----Original Message----- From: elizabeth howard [mailto:elizgh@btinternet.com] Sent: Wednesday, January 08, 2014 6:26 AM To: ChuckMay@may-engineering.com; devon@rootsweb.com Subject: [DEV] Will from Devon Record Office (was Devon Wills) Hi Chuck this is now called Devon Heritage Services and can be found at devrec@devon.gov.uk and Devon Heritage Services Great Moor House Bittern Road Sowton EXETER Devon EX2 7NL - See more at: http://www.devon.gov.uk/record_office.htm#sthash.Zl0e1lZ0.dpuf

Dear List Members, I am working on putting the family of George HEARD & Grace JOHNS of Beaford together for a friend of mine. However, I ran into a small problem. 1. The census records do not include a daughter by the name of Ellen HEARD who was born 11 Jan 1858 in Beaford. She does not appear in the immigration records of Ontario either when the family arrived. However, a death record was discovered that lists her maiden name of BOWDEN, and listed as their daughter. There is also an immigration record of her visiting her sister Jessie (Heard) STARKIE in New York. It appears that she may have married a Walter John BOWDEN (June Quarter 1896 St. Thomas 5b 119). 2. Again I find no census records of a son Sidney HEARD who was listed in the immigration records as being their son, born in 1860. I that there was a birth registered for a Sidney HEARD (June Quarter 1861 Chelmsford 4a 148) I tried to see if I could order the church records for Beaford, but it doesn’t appear that they are available after 1839. Is there anyway of proving or disproving the parentage of these kids. Is anyone available to do Beaford look-ups? Regards, Lance

A Register of Ships, Employed in the Service of the Honorable United East India Company 1760-1810. on Google Books By the late Charles Hardy & Horatio Charles Hardy - a fascinating book on vessels, captains, payment of wages, uniforms, stocking of ships, etc. Listing also of some of the crew. Found my 3rd Great-grandfather in there: Charles Olliver Worth 1749-1800 of Washfield and Bristol. Take a look. Edna - Ottawa

There's a Batter Street in Plymouth. It's just off Notte Street near the Barbican. Jane Gould (formerly of Plymouth) -----Original Message----- From: linandgeorge Sent: Wednesday, January 08, 2014 5:25 PM To: devon@rootsweb.com Subject: [DEV] ANN SAMWELL Hi I am trying to locate the marriage details for Ann and Luke Masters around 1800. She was baptised in the Batter st Presbyterian church so may well have been married there. I am trying to locate it because it may clear up who her father was. According to her baptism record it is George Samwell but according to another researcher it was John. I can find no record of George anywhere. Help would be gratefully received Sent from Samsung Mobile ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I just checked the image for the marriage at https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1942-20277-24458-64?cc=1769414&wc=MMVH-NTC:250264978 A Honora SAMBELS was a witness and Ann was described as a sojourner. A Honora SAMWELL was also baptised at Batter St Presbyterian 11 Dec 1785 dau of John & Sarah. Regards, Deborah O’Brien Devon OPC Co-ordinator DFHS Member 11261 http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/OPCproject.html Online Parish Clerk for Meavy, Newton Ferrers, Roborough by Torrington, Sheepstor, Walkhampton http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~dob7/index.html Researching SQUANCE, LILLICRAP, SURTEES, DANKESTER & YATES -----Original Message----- From: devon-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:devon-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Deborah O'Brien Sent: 08 January 2014 18:15 To: 'linandgeorge'; devon@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [DEV] ANN SAMWELL Hello, they married at St Antony, Cornwall 18 April 1802 and the bride signed her surname SAMBLES. Luke's burial in 1836 gave his age as 56 so born ca 1780. Why do you think that Ann is the one baptised at Batter St Presbyterian? There are several possibilities baptised in Cornwall - see the Cornwall OPC database at http://www.cornwall-opc-database.org/ Regards, Deborah O’Brien Devon OPC Co-ordinator DFHS Member 11261 http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/OPCproject.html Online Parish Clerk for Meavy, Newton Ferrers, Roborough by Torrington, Sheepstor, Walkhampton http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~dob7/index.html Researching SQUANCE, LILLICRAP, SURTEES, DANKESTER & YATES -----Original Message----- From: devon-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:devon-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of linandgeorge Sent: 08 January 2014 17:25 To: devon@rootsweb.com Subject: [DEV] ANN SAMWELL Hi I am trying to locate the marriage details for Ann and Luke Masters around 1800. She was baptised in the Batter st Presbyterian church so may well have been married there. I am trying to locate it because it may clear up who her father was. According to her baptism record it is George Samwell but according to another researcher it was John. I can find no record of George anywhere. Help would be gratefully received Sent from Samsung Mobile ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

An Ann Sambell was baptised in Maker, Cornwall  31 Jul 1771. Parents Thomas and Ann. Sue ________________________________ From: Sue Stoneman <sstoneman@btinternet.com> To: linandgeorge <linandgeorge@ntlworld.com>; "devon@rootsweb.com" <devon@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, January 8, 2014 6:16 PM Subject: Re: [DEV] ANN SAMWELL There is a marriage between as Luke Masters and an Ann Sambels in Antony just over the water from Plymouth 18 Apr 1802. No details of parents. Sue ________________________________ From: linandgeorge <linandgeorge@ntlworld.com> To: devon@rootsweb.com Sent: Wednesday, January 8, 2014 5:25 PM Subject: [DEV] ANN SAMWELL Hi I am trying to locate the marriage details for Ann and Luke Masters around 1800. She was baptised in the Batter st Presbyterian church so may well have been married there. I am trying to locate it because it may clear up who her  father was. According to her baptism record it is George Samwell but according to another researcher it was John. I can find no record of George anywhere. Help would be gratefully received Sent from Samsung Mobile ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

There is a marriage between as Luke Masters and an Ann Sambels in Antony just over the water from Plymouth 18 Apr 1802. No details of parents. Sue ________________________________ From: linandgeorge <linandgeorge@ntlworld.com> To: devon@rootsweb.com Sent: Wednesday, January 8, 2014 5:25 PM Subject: [DEV] ANN SAMWELL Hi I am trying to locate the marriage details for Ann and Luke Masters around 1800. She was baptised in the Batter st Presbyterian church so may well have been married there. I am trying to locate it because it may clear up who her  father was. According to her baptism record it is George Samwell but according to another researcher it was John. I can find no record of George anywhere. Help would be gratefully received Sent from Samsung Mobile ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hello, they married at St Antony, Cornwall 18 April 1802 and the bride signed her surname SAMBLES. Luke's burial in 1836 gave his age as 56 so born ca 1780. Why do you think that Ann is the one baptised at Batter St Presbyterian? There are several possibilities baptised in Cornwall - see the Cornwall OPC database at http://www.cornwall-opc-database.org/ Regards, Deborah O’Brien Devon OPC Co-ordinator DFHS Member 11261 http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/OPCproject.html Online Parish Clerk for Meavy, Newton Ferrers, Roborough by Torrington, Sheepstor, Walkhampton http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~dob7/index.html Researching SQUANCE, LILLICRAP, SURTEES, DANKESTER & YATES -----Original Message----- From: devon-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:devon-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of linandgeorge Sent: 08 January 2014 17:25 To: devon@rootsweb.com Subject: [DEV] ANN SAMWELL Hi I am trying to locate the marriage details for Ann and Luke Masters around 1800. She was baptised in the Batter st Presbyterian church so may well have been married there. I am trying to locate it because it may clear up who her father was. According to her baptism record it is George Samwell but according to another researcher it was John. I can find no record of George anywhere. Help would be gratefully received Sent from Samsung Mobile ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I'll be in the DRO next week; if you can wait I'll look at it then. >From memory, what I'll see is a microfilm image of the will, which I can print out &/or photograph Chris -----Original Message----- From: Chuck May Sent: Wednesday, January 08, 2014 4:28 AM To: devon@rootsweb.com Subject: [DEV] Will from Devon Record Office (was Devon Wills) Can anyone suggest how someone in the US can get access to a will in the Devon Record Office? Specifically I am looking for the following from "Estate Duty Office Wills": "Thomas May of Brixham, Devon, 1833, 1078/IRW/M/460". I am trying to find a connection with the Thomas May who was a baker, and was a passenger in the barque "Mary Ann" from London and Plymouth to Australia, departing about 4 February 1833 and arriving in Sydney 15 November 1833. This Thomas had a younger brother Robert who, with wife Mary, departed from London or Plymouth in the "City of Edinburgh" November 1833 and arrived in Sydney March 1834. Thank you. Chuck May Pittsfield Massachusetts, USA ChuckMay@may-engineering.com http://www.may-engineering.com ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

It is somewhat later, but I have a subsequent Thomas Bale: " Mary PHELPS, a daughter of John Phelps and Joan Salisbury, his wife, was baptized in Shepton Beauchamp, Somerset, on January 11th., 1813. At the 1851 census for S. B., Mary 38 was an annuitant, living with niece Anna 16. On November 20th., 1852, in Shepton Beauchamp church, Mary married Thomas BALE, widower, cordwainer of Cullompton, in the presence of Wm. Harris and ?Louiza? G. Phelps. At the 1871 census, Thomas was a farmer of 80 acres in Teignmouth, Devon. Thomas died in 1882, in Newton Abbot, Devon; Mary died in 1893 in Newton Abbot, Devon; Thomas and Mary had issue: a. Mary Phelps BALE, born in Collumpton, Devon, about 1851; b. John Phelps BALE, born in Collumpton, Devon, on October 18th., 1853. " If anybody is interested, I have details of the children and grandchildren of this Thomas and Mary BALE, all of them cousins of mine. Best wishes. Peter Ferreira Toronto, Canada. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Madalene Frost" <mafrost@farmside.co.nz> To: <mgsmale@gmail.com>; <Devon@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, January 08, 2014 4:50 PM Subject: [DEV] Thomas BALE of Cullompton <snip>

Hi I am trying to locate the marriage details for Ann and Luke Masters around 1800. She was baptised in the Batter st Presbyterian church so may well have been married there. I am trying to locate it because it may clear up who her  father was. According to her baptism record it is George Samwell but according to another researcher it was John. I can find no record of George anywhere. Help would be gratefully received Sent from Samsung Mobile

Hi: I'm not sure, so have to use the TNA Wills 1384-1858 website to check when I am uncertain about the information that is provided to me. (I like to use the name and place name spelling as given by TNA, as well as the full reference, so I have to check these if it's not clear that the transcriber has.) Cheers Brian On 8 Jan 2014, at 15:52, Jonathan Frayne <jonfrayne@btinternet.com> wrote: > Hi Brian > > I only have the short form PROB11 references; I assume the longer version > includes the folio number as well? If so no problem to add them in. > > Jon > > -----Original Message----- > From: devon-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:devon-bounces@rootsweb.com] On > Behalf Of Brian Randell > Sent: 08 January 2014 11:15 > To: <devon@rootsweb.com> > Cc: Brian Randell > Subject: Re: [DEV] Devon Wills > > Hi Jon: > > DWP is not collecting will transcripts, but I happily accept them for > GENUKI/Devon, which by now contains nearly five hundred will transcripts. I > of course would prefer transcripts of Devon wills that miraculously escaped > the wartime destruction of the Exeter probate office, but am grateful for > PROB 11 wills, and ones from other sources. > > My preference is for transcripts to be very simply formatted - basic text > will do, rather than multiple fonts, footnotes, etc. - so as to ease my task > of converting them to HTML. I also ask that they are accompanied by full > reference details, obtained directly from the archive holding them. (In the > case of TNA, PCC wills now have a more detailed reference number than they > used to have, e.g. PROB 11/350/266 rather than PROB 11/350.) > > Thanks in advance! > > Cheers > > > Brian > > > On 8 Jan 2014, at 02:53, Jonathan Frayne <jonfrayne@btinternet.com> > wrote: > >> Hi Brian >> >> Are you then collecting transcripts of PROB 11 wills? If so I can let >> you have copies of mine. >> >> Jon >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: devon-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:devon-bounces@rootsweb.com] >> On Behalf Of Brian Randell >> Sent: 07 January 2014 22:28 >> To: <devon@rootsweb.com> >> Cc: Brian Randell >> Subject: Re: [DEV] Devon Wills >> >> Hi Tim: >> >> On 7 Jan 2014, at 22:22, Tim Treeby (Genealogy) wrote: >> >>> So long as you are looking at the right Dataset it definitely looks >>> to be all PCC Wills, with the actual copy of the will as you would >>> get from TNA. >>> As they definitely list one's up to 1858 and looking at the image >>> gives the actual Will. >>> The fact that i struggle to actually read the will is a different >>> matter, but it is there. >> >> Check the Devon Wills Project - just in case the will has already been >> transcribed or abstracted. >> >> Cheers >> >> Brian >> >> >> -- >> School of Computing Science, Newcastle University, Newcastle upon >> Tyne, >> NE1 7RU, UK >> EMAIL = Brian.Randell@ncl.ac.uk PHONE = +44 191 222 7923 >> FAX = +44 191 222 8232 URL = >> http://www.cs.ncl.ac.uk/people/brian.randell >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------ >> The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( >> http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS >> (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at >> http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> ------------------------------------------ >> The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( >> http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS >> (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at >> http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > School of Computing Science, Newcastle University, Newcastle upon Tyne, NE1 > 7RU > EMAIL = Brian.Randell@ncl.ac.uk PHONE = +44 191 222 7923 > URL = http://www.cs.ncl.ac.uk/people/brian.randell > > > > > > ------------------------------------------ > The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( > http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS > (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at > http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in > the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------------------ > The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon > ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) > and > the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) > List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message School of Computing Science, Newcastle University, Newcastle upon Tyne, NE1 7RU EMAIL = Brian.Randell@ncl.ac.uk PHONE = +44 191 222 7923 URL = http://www.cs.ncl.ac.uk/people/brian.randell

Hi Brian I only have the short form PROB11 references; I assume the longer version includes the folio number as well? If so no problem to add them in. Jon -----Original Message----- From: devon-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:devon-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Brian Randell Sent: 08 January 2014 11:15 To: <devon@rootsweb.com> Cc: Brian Randell Subject: Re: [DEV] Devon Wills Hi Jon: DWP is not collecting will transcripts, but I happily accept them for GENUKI/Devon, which by now contains nearly five hundred will transcripts. I of course would prefer transcripts of Devon wills that miraculously escaped the wartime destruction of the Exeter probate office, but am grateful for PROB 11 wills, and ones from other sources. My preference is for transcripts to be very simply formatted - basic text will do, rather than multiple fonts, footnotes, etc. - so as to ease my task of converting them to HTML. I also ask that they are accompanied by full reference details, obtained directly from the archive holding them. (In the case of TNA, PCC wills now have a more detailed reference number than they used to have, e.g. PROB 11/350/266 rather than PROB 11/350.) Thanks in advance! Cheers Brian On 8 Jan 2014, at 02:53, Jonathan Frayne <jonfrayne@btinternet.com> wrote: > Hi Brian > > Are you then collecting transcripts of PROB 11 wills? If so I can let > you have copies of mine. > > Jon > > -----Original Message----- > From: devon-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:devon-bounces@rootsweb.com] > On Behalf Of Brian Randell > Sent: 07 January 2014 22:28 > To: <devon@rootsweb.com> > Cc: Brian Randell > Subject: Re: [DEV] Devon Wills > > Hi Tim: > > On 7 Jan 2014, at 22:22, Tim Treeby (Genealogy) wrote: > >> So long as you are looking at the right Dataset it definitely looks >> to be all PCC Wills, with the actual copy of the will as you would >> get from TNA. >> As they definitely list one's up to 1858 and looking at the image >> gives the actual Will. >> The fact that i struggle to actually read the will is a different >> matter, but it is there. > > Check the Devon Wills Project - just in case the will has already been > transcribed or abstracted. > > Cheers > > Brian > > > -- > School of Computing Science, Newcastle University, Newcastle upon > Tyne, > NE1 7RU, UK > EMAIL = Brian.Randell@ncl.ac.uk PHONE = +44 191 222 7923 > FAX = +44 191 222 8232 URL = > http://www.cs.ncl.ac.uk/people/brian.randell > > > > > > ------------------------------------------ > The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( > http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS > (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at > http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------------------ > The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( > http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS > (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at > http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message School of Computing Science, Newcastle University, Newcastle upon Tyne, NE1 7RU EMAIL = Brian.Randell@ncl.ac.uk PHONE = +44 191 222 7923 URL = http://www.cs.ncl.ac.uk/people/brian.randell ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Common law marriages do not exist under English Law and it was only in the late 20th century that illegitimate children had any claim to inherit. The parish would not allow co-habiting although would force the father to support the child if he was known. In the cities incomers would not be questioned too closeley but in the villages there was no hiding. Paul ________________________________ From: Liz Loveland <lovelandfamilyhistory@gmail.com> To: devon@rootsweb.com Sent: Wednesday, 8 January 2014, 15:04 Subject: Re: [DEV] Tracing mother of an 'illegitimate' child Hi Sher, Thanks for responding. You wrote in part, "The boarder was in fact her common law husband, but in that area, in that time, people frowned on that relationship and therefore he became the boarder.  Perhaps John Evans was her common law husband." I'm guessing that you meant to write John Kinsman rather than John Evans. As I mentioned in a previous email, Ann Evans's examination testimony indicated that at a minimum she had an ongoing sexual relationship with John Kinsman. Whether it was more than that I cannot say from the records I have so far. Either way, the parish expected the child to be chargeable to them. Thanks for the thoughts, Liz Loveland ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Brian I'll get right on it. All PROB 11 and IR wills, I'm afraid, apart from more recent grandparents. Jon -----Original Message----- From: devon-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:devon-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Brian Randell Sent: 08 January 2014 11:15 To: <devon@rootsweb.com> Cc: Brian Randell Subject: Re: [DEV] Devon Wills Hi Jon: DWP is not collecting will transcripts, but I happily accept them for GENUKI/Devon, which by now contains nearly five hundred will transcripts. I of course would prefer transcripts of Devon wills that miraculously escaped the wartime destruction of the Exeter probate office, but am grateful for PROB 11 wills, and ones from other sources. My preference is for transcripts to be very simply formatted - basic text will do, rather than multiple fonts, footnotes, etc. - so as to ease my task of converting them to HTML. I also ask that they are accompanied by full reference details, obtained directly from the archive holding them. (In the case of TNA, PCC wills now have a more detailed reference number than they used to have, e.g. PROB 11/350/266 rather than PROB 11/350.) Thanks in advance! Cheers Brian On 8 Jan 2014, at 02:53, Jonathan Frayne <jonfrayne@btinternet.com> wrote: > Hi Brian > > Are you then collecting transcripts of PROB 11 wills? If so I can let > you have copies of mine. > > Jon > > -----Original Message----- > From: devon-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:devon-bounces@rootsweb.com] > On Behalf Of Brian Randell > Sent: 07 January 2014 22:28 > To: <devon@rootsweb.com> > Cc: Brian Randell > Subject: Re: [DEV] Devon Wills > > Hi Tim: > > On 7 Jan 2014, at 22:22, Tim Treeby (Genealogy) wrote: > >> So long as you are looking at the right Dataset it definitely looks >> to be all PCC Wills, with the actual copy of the will as you would >> get from TNA. >> As they definitely list one's up to 1858 and looking at the image >> gives the actual Will. >> The fact that i struggle to actually read the will is a different >> matter, but it is there. > > Check the Devon Wills Project - just in case the will has already been > transcribed or abstracted. > > Cheers > > Brian > > > -- > School of Computing Science, Newcastle University, Newcastle upon > Tyne, > NE1 7RU, UK > EMAIL = Brian.Randell@ncl.ac.uk PHONE = +44 191 222 7923 > FAX = +44 191 222 8232 URL = > http://www.cs.ncl.ac.uk/people/brian.randell > > > > > > ------------------------------------------ > The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( > http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS > (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at > http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------------------ > The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( > http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS > (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at > http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message School of Computing Science, Newcastle University, Newcastle upon Tyne, NE1 7RU EMAIL = Brian.Randell@ncl.ac.uk PHONE = +44 191 222 7923 URL = http://www.cs.ncl.ac.uk/people/brian.randell ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Monica I'd love to have it as I have Bales in my ancestry. A transcript to Brian Randall as well perhaps? I can do it when I receive it if not. It occurs to me that an image on the DFHS Facebook page might be easiest? Let me know how you want to do it. Tx in advance Jon -----Original Message----- From: devon-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:devon-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Monica Smale Sent: 08 January 2014 11:47 To: devon@rootsweb.com Subject: [DEV] Thomas Bale of Cullompton, staymaker. Dear All While turning out I have found the extract and probate of this chap's will dated 1823. He died in London but the will includes refers to other family members still living in Devon. I cannot see that he is any connection of mine so if this is of interest to anyone else let me know and I will pass it on. Cheers Monica Smale ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Paul, Thanks for responding. You said, "Common law marriages do not exist under English Law and it was only in the late 20th century that illegitimate children had any claim to inherit. The parish would not allow co-habiting although would force the father to support the child if he was known. In the cities incomers would not be questioned too closeley but in the villages there was no hiding." While they wouldn't have had a legal common law marriage, whether they had a relationship beyond an apparently ongoing sexual one I cannot say at this point. The historical laws about 'illegitimate' children in England are part of why it has been difficult for me to sort all these 'illegitimate' Evans children out as they legally had no parents, and so, for example, they didn't have to get a parent's permission when they joined the British Army while underage and their apprenticeship indentures were made by parish officers and churchwardens rather than by a parent. Thanks again, Liz Loveland