Hello Bev, The problem with Philip ATWELL/ATWILL is that he probably was baptised at Walkhampton, but parish registers only survive from 1674. I show a burial for a Philip ATWELL 1 May 1677 at Walkhampton. Regards,   Deborah O’Brien Devon OPC Co-ordinator DFHS Member 11261 http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/OPCproject.html Online Parish Clerk for Meavy, Newton Ferrers, Roborough by Torrington, Sheepstor, Walkhampton http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~dob7/index.html Researching SQUANCE, LILLICRAP, SURTEES, DANKESTER & YATES ----- Original Message ----- From: "B. Edmonds" <beverley@yourisp.com.au> To: <DEVON@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2014 9:31 PM Subject: [DEV] EDMONDS/LUSCOMBE and ATWELL > Morning, > > The name ATWILL/ATWELL mentioned on the list reminded me of my chap. > > I have an Andrew EDMONDS who married Alice LUSCOMBE 13 May 1579 at Stoke > Fleming > No children appear to be named after this Andrew > However there is a Cicilia [or Ciceley] in 1587. > > Before the marriage of Andrew to Alice LUSCOMBE there was a Sicillia > EDMUNDE > buried at Whitchurch 12 Mar 1579 who may have been either Andrew's mother > of > a 1st wife. > > A Cicilaia EDMUNDS of Whitchurch has a marriage licence to marry Phillipp > ATWELL of Walkhampton 10 Dec 1628. I am not sure if they married at > Whitchurch though. > > Ciceley/Cicilia is a very unusual name for me so I figure it is the same > Ciceley who is bapt at Stoke Fleming. > > Anyone with a Philip ATWELL/ATWILL at all anywhere? > > Bev > > > > ------------------------------------------ > The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon > ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) > and > the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) > List archive for Devon can be found at > http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi David, I know you have changed tack but look out for the name being spelt as Gunfeeld as well just in case it got corrupted in their movements from parish to parish. Bev -------------------------------------------------- From: "David L. Langenberg" <gallienus@mac.com> Sent: Friday, January 31, 2014 6:55 AM To: <devon@rootsweb.com> Subject: [DEV] Phenix, LARRABEE/LEREBY, GREENFIELD/GRENVILLE, DARKE, ROCKEY > Paul, > > Thanks for your additional thoughts. I'm still working on the assumption > that Greenfield LARRABEE's name is for real and that it can tell me > something

Staplehill I would consider Staplehill's ship as a priority study; it will perhaps suggest Devon as Larrabee's roots. It is well known that Aldred (not Alfred) Staplehill was involved in the Newfoundland trade out of Dartmouth by 1641/42 and perhaps long before that date. In 1641 I am not certain if this is Aldred Sr or Jr and it is just a jaunt down the coast from Newfoundland to Barbados or to New England. Aldred Sr seems to have been born in 1580 at Exeter, son of Gilbert, and Aldred Jr was born in Dartmouth. Alexander Staplehill, Sr and Jr were also involved in Newfoundland adventures c1642 likewise Gilbert Jr., 2 named John, 2 named Thomas all out of Dartmouth. They were no strangers in the New World. in St Saviour's Church, at Dartmouth, there is a brass effigy of Gilbart Staplehiil, once Mayor of the town. He died 15th February, 1637.

Bev, I have the name ATWEL/ATTWELL in my Tree although I am not sure that your ancestor is related at all. All my Attwells come from Ramsgate, Kent - do any of yours migrate to Kent ? I do have a Phillip Attwell and I will have a closer look at my Tree over the weekend - getting late and my quilt is calling! Laura DFHS No; 20185 ----- Original Message ----- From: "B. Edmonds" <beverley@yourisp.com.au> To: <DEVON@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2014 9:31 PM Subject: [DEV] EDMONDS/LUSCOMBE and ATWELL > Morning, > > The name ATWILL/ATWELL mentioned on the list reminded me of my chap. > > I have an Andrew EDMONDS who married Alice LUSCOMBE 13 May 1579 at Stoke > Fleming > No children appear to be named after this Andrew > However there is a Cicilia [or Ciceley] in 1587. > > Before the marriage of Andrew to Alice LUSCOMBE there was a Sicillia > EDMUNDE > buried at Whitchurch 12 Mar 1579 who may have been either Andrew's mother > of > a 1st wife. > > A Cicilaia EDMUNDS of Whitchurch has a marriage licence to marry Phillipp > ATWELL of Walkhampton 10 Dec 1628. I am not sure if they married at > Whitchurch though. > > Ciceley/Cicilia is a very unusual name for me so I figure it is the same > Ciceley who is bapt at Stoke Fleming. > > Anyone with a Philip ATWELL/ATWILL at all anywhere? > > Bev > > > > ------------------------------------------ > The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon > ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) > and > the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) > List archive for Devon can be found at > http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message >

I cannot answer your question, Bev, but it's a very interesting blog. Thanks for bringing it to our attention! David On Jan 30, 2014, at 9:32 PM, B. Edmonds wrote: > Afternoon all, > > Does anyone know please if any of this is on-line anywhere yet? > > http://devonquartersessions.wordpress.com/ > > Will it be incorporated in with the National Archives? > > When I Googled, this was all that came up. > > Bev > ------------------------------------------ > The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon > ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) > and > the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) > List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Is it possible that Charles emigrated, there a large number of Charles Franks in the US including 196 Warren Franks, or perhaps joined the forces, army or navy. These are common reasons someone disappears. Paul -----Original Message----- From: devon-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:devon-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of elizabeth howard Sent: 30 January 2014 16:07 To: devon@rootsweb.com Subject: [DEV] Charles Warren Franks bap 1745 Clayhidon Hi, on the Tithe Apportionment for Clayhidon, there are two Warrens , David and John, both freeholders , no Franks or Hitchcock. In the same apportionment there seem to be a collection of Franks in East Budleigh, Feniton, Littleham (Exmouth) Ottery St Mary , Upottery , Thorncombe and Woodbury both as freeholders and tenants. The Hitchcocks are more numerous and can be found in Hemyock, Honiton, Harpford, Littleham , South Molton, Thorncombe, Talaton, Uplyme, Upottery again as both freeholders and tenants. Clayhidon is just 4 miles from Wellington, Somerset. though in Devon. The 1711-1799 freeholders list shows a number of Franks, Frank, Franke, and the name change is illustrated particularly by Abraham who is Frank, Franke, and Franks. and is to be found in the Crediton and West Budleigh area . If you look at the National Archives/A2A site and just try John Frank , you will pick up Clayhidon`s apprentice orders, and you will find the combination of Warren , Hitchcock and Frank. but there is also a plethora of Somerset villages mentioned. Friends of Devon Archives tithe apportionment might also show Duns Green estate under Clayhidon. The first Franke who appears in the Freeholders lists for Clayhidon is John Franke , yeoman in 1762 , and the same year John Warren in Buckerell. And in 1771 in Clayhidon a Jacob Hitchcock as well as a Robert Warren, sergemaker, both freeholders . Robert Warren is in Churchstanton in 1783 , Jacob Hitchcock is still a yeoman in Clayhidon. By 1700 there are three Warrens in Churchstanton , Robert, William and David. So you have a choice of parishes where all three names have been found, and so three choices of places of burial of Robert Franks/Frank/Franke. On National Archives/A2A site the apprentice record of Charles to Robert Warren is shown as being part of the Clayhidon parish documents . The Tithe apportionment shows a Dunsgreen , an area of 83 acres, in the ownership and tenancy of Willliam Farrant. and also from the same source a Dunsgreen lane , both in the Clayhidon parish. life is hard . soften it with a cat \\\=^..^=/// ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ruth Henriegel" <ruthhenriegel@msn.com> To: "DEVON@rootsweb.com" <devon@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, January 28, 2014 11:51 AM Subject: [DEV] Charles Warren Franks bap 1745 Clayhidon > Charles Warren Franks was the illegitimate son of Joan Hitchcock presumed > widow of Robert Franks of Clayhidon although no record of Robert's death > has been found. > > In 1757 Charles Warren Franks was apprenticed to Robert Warren for Duns > Green Estate (PO451). It is interesting to note that someone (? Robert > Warren) has put a line through Charles second name of Warren on the > indenture! After that event I cannot find any further record of Charles > Warren Franks or as Charles Franks. Nor can I find any reference to Duns > Green Estate. Does anyone on this list know in what parish the estate was > located? > > Any thoughts on this would be appreciated. > > Ruth Henriegel > > ------------------------------------------ > The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon > ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) > and > the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) > List archive for Devon can be found at > http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

David, Unfortunately the National Archives do not seem to have the captains log for this HMS Phoenix as this would show the voyages. A major role of the navy was to patrol and project the trade routes from the other colonial powers - France, Spain, Portugal, Netherlands etc. as well as pirates' They also provided escorts for troop and treasure ships. The Maritime museum gives the following: "In the 17th and 18th centuries there were six Royal Navy dockyards in England, at Deptford, Woolwich, Chatham, Sheerness, Portsmouth and Plymouth. There were also a number of outports in England and overseas yards, including Gibraltar, Halifax and Jamaica." It would be worth downloading http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/records/research-guides/royal-navy-operat ions-1660-1914.htm 1660 was when Samuel Pepys re-organised the navy. Paul -----Original Message----- From: devon-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:devon-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of David L. Langenberg Sent: 29 January 2014 23:32 To: devon@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [DEV] H.M.S. Phoenix Thanks, Margaret, for the suggestion, but the only Phoenix listed there in the right time period (1647) [see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Phoenix_(1647)] was a warship and there is nothing in the article to indicate that it was engaged in the "triangular trade" between England, the Caribbean, and the American colonies. David Langenberg Newark, Delaware, USA On Jan 29, 2014, at 12:57 AM, Margaret Baensch wrote: > Hello David, > > There is an entry for "List of Ships Names of the Royal Navy" on Wikipedia. > Link to alphabetical entries. Th entry O-Q gives information on all R.N. > Ships with the name "Phoenix" > > Hope this is helpful. > > Margaret in Australia. > ------------------------------------------ > The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( > http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS > (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at > http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi all: The latest (2nd) edition of Herber (2005) is almost two hundred pages longer than the 1997 first edition - and is even better than it. I reviewed it or GENUKI at: http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/AncestralTrails2.html Cheers Brian Cheers Brian On 20 Jan 2014, at 19:50, Jean Harris wrote: > Hi all > > Brian is so right as after 40 years of researching my own family history I have never seen or read a better book than this one by Mark Herber. It was published 1997 with the association of the Society of Genealogists, London. > > AND the joy of it is that he gives examples from his own Devonian families!! Hence he quotes many Devon documents and sources. > > I am sure that a copy can be found in any major City Library (Dewey decimal 929 for genealogy) and University Library. Find this book and enjoy!! > > Jean Harris in Toronto, Ontario > > (a former Devonian) > On Jan 20, 2014, at 6:13 AM, Brian Randell wrote: > >> Hi Bev: >> >> Yes - I'd heard of this, I think from reading the splendid book: >> >> M.D. Herber. Ancestral Trails: The Complete Guide to British Genealogy and Family History. >> >> which I regard as *the* best single book on UH genealogy. >> >> Cheers >> >> Brian >> >> On 20 Jan 2014, at 09:48, "B. Edmonds" <beverley@yourisp.com.au> >> wrote: >> >>> I wonder if this is the origin of the " Crew Cut " hair style. >>> >>> I thought I was seeing things when I first saw this: ) Bev >>> >>> A Hundred Years Ago >>> >>> An important tax of the year was the one known as the Hair Powder Tax, by >>> which a guinea per annum was imposed on all wearers of hair powder. The >>> penalty for infringing the Act was £20 >>> >>> >>> Riverine Herald (Echuca, Vic. : Moama, NSW : 1869 - 1954) Monday 24 June >>> 1895 >>> >>> http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/114982046 >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------ >>> The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon >>> ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) >>> and >>> the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) >>> List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> School of Computing Science, Newcastle University, Newcastle upon Tyne, NE1 7RU >> EMAIL = Brian.Randell@ncl.ac.uk PHONE = +44 191 222 7923 >> URL = http://www.cs.ncl.ac.uk/people/brian.randell >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------ >> The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon >> ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) >> and >> the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) >> List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > -- School of Computing Science, Newcastle University, Newcastle upon Tyne, NE1 7RU, UK EMAIL = Brian.Randell@ncl.ac.uk PHONE = +44 191 222 7923 FAX = +44 191 222 8232 URL = http://www.cs.ncl.ac.uk/people/brian.randell

Hi, on the Tithe Apportionment for Clayhidon, there are two Warrens , David and John, both freeholders , no Franks or Hitchcock. In the same apportionment there seem to be a collection of Franks in East Budleigh, Feniton, Littleham (Exmouth) Ottery St Mary , Upottery , Thorncombe and Woodbury both as freeholders and tenants. The Hitchcocks are more numerous and can be found in Hemyock, Honiton, Harpford, Littleham , South Molton, Thorncombe, Talaton, Uplyme, Upottery again as both freeholders and tenants. Clayhidon is just 4 miles from Wellington, Somerset. though in Devon. The 1711-1799 freeholders list shows a number of Franks, Frank, Franke, and the name change is illustrated particularly by Abraham who is Frank, Franke, and Franks. and is to be found in the Crediton and West Budleigh area . If you look at the National Archives/A2A site and just try John Frank , you will pick up Clayhidon`s apprentice orders, and you will find the combination of Warren , Hitchcock and Frank. but there is also a plethora of Somerset villages mentioned. Friends of Devon Archives tithe apportionment might also show Duns Green estate under Clayhidon. The first Franke who appears in the Freeholders lists for Clayhidon is John Franke , yeoman in 1762 , and the same year John Warren in Buckerell. And in 1771 in Clayhidon a Jacob Hitchcock as well as a Robert Warren, sergemaker, both freeholders . Robert Warren is in Churchstanton in 1783 , Jacob Hitchcock is still a yeoman in Clayhidon. By 1700 there are three Warrens in Churchstanton , Robert, William and David. So you have a choice of parishes where all three names have been found, and so three choices of places of burial of Robert Franks/Frank/Franke. On National Archives/A2A site the apprentice record of Charles to Robert Warren is shown as being part of the Clayhidon parish documents . The Tithe apportionment shows a Dunsgreen , an area of 83 acres, in the ownership and tenancy of Willliam Farrant. and also from the same source a Dunsgreen lane , both in the Clayhidon parish. life is hard . soften it with a cat \\\=^..^=/// ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ruth Henriegel" <ruthhenriegel@msn.com> To: "DEVON@rootsweb.com" <devon@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, January 28, 2014 11:51 AM Subject: [DEV] Charles Warren Franks bap 1745 Clayhidon > Charles Warren Franks was the illegitimate son of Joan Hitchcock presumed > widow of Robert Franks of Clayhidon although no record of Robert's death > has been found. > > In 1757 Charles Warren Franks was apprenticed to Robert Warren for Duns > Green Estate (PO451). It is interesting to note that someone (? Robert > Warren) has put a line through Charles second name of Warren on the > indenture! After that event I cannot find any further record of Charles > Warren Franks or as Charles Franks. Nor can I find any reference to Duns > Green Estate. Does anyone on this list know in what parish the estate was > located? > > Any thoughts on this would be appreciated. > > Ruth Henriegel > > ------------------------------------------ > The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon > ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) > and > the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) > List archive for Devon can be found at > http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message >

Paul, Thanks for your additional thoughts. I'm still working on the assumption that Greenfield LARRABEE's name is for real and that it can tell me something about his origins. My research has taken another tack, now that I notice that there was a family in LEREBYs as well as a family of GREENFIELDs in Saint Keverne, Cornwall in the early 17th century. So I am out of Devon and into a neighboring county. It looks like Saint Keverne is on the Lizard Peninsula, just about eight miles south of Falmouth. Preliminary research informs me that Falmouth was created in 1613 and it surpassed neighboring Penryn so that by 1650 the Custom and Excise had moved from Penryn to Falmouth. Wouldn't a bustling port have been a place of opportunity for a lad from nearby Saint Keverne? I did find an indication that Grenville was used as a Christian name in Devon: Grenville DARKE was baptized 30 January 1697 in Ashwater. (Ironically, that is a parish I am searching for my ROCKEY ancestors, a totally unrelated research project.) But on to the Public Records of the Colony of Connecticut to find out what other visits the Phenix made to Connecticut in the middle of the 17th century. Regards, David Langenberg Newark, Delaware, USA On Jan 30, 2014, at 2:53 PM, Paul Hockie wrote: > David, > > Unfortunately the National Archives do not seem to have the captains log for > this HMS Phoenix as this would show the voyages. A major role of the navy > was to patrol and project the trade routes from the other colonial powers - > France, Spain, Portugal, Netherlands etc. as well as pirates' They also > provided escorts for troop and treasure ships. The Maritime museum gives the > following: > "In the 17th and 18th centuries there were six Royal Navy dockyards in > England, at Deptford, Woolwich, Chatham, Sheerness, Portsmouth and Plymouth. > There were also a number of outports in England and overseas yards, > including Gibraltar, Halifax and Jamaica." > It would be worth downloading > http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/records/research-guides/royal-navy-operat > ions-1660-1914.htm > > 1660 was when Samuel Pepys re-organised the navy. > > Paul

Hi David, I can`t remember if anyone answered this.............both Thorverton and Cruwys Morchard are on IGI , familysearch. I can`t find a single Searle in Thorverton bapts, but there is a Susannah Way bapt CM 1762 dau of Wm Way and Joan. Wm and Joan seem to have a good many children including a George bapt in 1757, Thomas 1759 , etc. William Way and Joan Axon were married in 1744 at CM , and Susannah was m in CM in 1784 to George Searl , no extra e . There is no sign of George Searle in Thorveton ......nor of any Searle . Can you tell us what information you have on George and his connection to Thorveton ? There are George Searle bapts in 1761 Honiton, 1761 Kenton, but not every bapt is online . n Do you know where they lived ? life is hard . soften it with a cat \\\=^..^=/// ----- Original Message ----- From: "David N Adams" <davidnadams@ntlworld.com> To: <DEVON@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, January 27, 2014 7:34 PM Subject: [DEV] Searle/Way >I have lurked on this site for a number of years and am amazed at the > breadth of knowledge there is on it. A number of years ago I made the > decision to not pursue my interests any further back in time but > retirement and a sneaking admiration for people who have got further has > re-whetted my interest. In the meantime the internet has intervened and > information which I sourced from microfiche, books, CDs etc is now > available on line. > I have a George Searle born c 1760 in Thorveton and married on 24th > August 1784 to Susannah Way in Crwys Morchard. Can anyone suggest where > I can source information to look for ancestors? > > > --- > This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus > protection is active. > http://www.avast.com > > ------------------------------------------ > The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon > ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) > and > the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) > List archive for Devon can be found at > http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message >

My thanks to both Jon and Terry for their response to my post. It would certainly seem more likely that Charles was apprenticed in the Clayhidon neighbourhood. It would appear that Dunsgreen farm still exists. Streetmap shows it as being between Hemyock and Clayhidon. So back to the search for Charles in the local records. Thank you. Ruth Henriegel > From: jonfrayne@btinternet.com > To: devon@rootsweb.com > Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2014 10:47:32 +0000 > Subject: Re: [DEV] Charles Warren Franks bap 1745 Clayhidon > > Hi Ruth > > The Place Names of Devon gives a Dunsgreen Farm in Clayhidon Parish! The > reference is complex as they bundle together about a dozen farms and give > the references altogether later in the paragraph. Assuming the references > are in the same order (and it seems likely from the names) the reference to > Dunsgreen Farm is "associated with the families of . . . Robert Dunn of > Broadhembury (1670 Wills)". The Wills reference is to "Devonshire Wills", > The British Record Society volume 35, apparently. Looks like you need a good > reference library! A copy of a large scale Ordnance Survey map may help if > the name still persists in the parish. > > HTH > > Jon >

Thanks, Margaret, for the suggestion, but the only Phoenix listed there in the right time period (1647) [see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Phoenix_(1647)] was a warship and there is nothing in the article to indicate that it was engaged in the "triangular trade" between England, the Caribbean, and the American colonies. David Langenberg Newark, Delaware, USA On Jan 29, 2014, at 12:57 AM, Margaret Baensch wrote: > Hello David, > > There is an entry for "List of Ships Names of the Royal Navy" on Wikipedia. > Link to alphabetical entries. Th entry O-Q gives information on all R.N. > Ships with the name "Phoenix" > > Hope this is helpful. > > Margaret in Australia. > ------------------------------------------ > The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon > ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) > and > the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) > List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Jon, Thanks for your thoughts and suggestions regarding further research on Greenfield LARRABEE, his voyages to New England, and his possible origins in Devon. On Jan 29, 2014, at 5:27 AM, Jonathan Frayne wrote: > Hi > > If Greenfield Larrabee just appears > out of nowhere and he is a sailor I would suspect he could be a deserter > from the Royal Navy and has changed his name to protect himself. I believe > Britain owned Barbados at the time and maintained a flotilla of vessels > there. It seems strange he would change his name to something so distinctive. I'd change it to John Smith. :) As far as Barbados goes, yes, it was British and quite a few settlers spent some time there before coming to New England and elsewhere in the American colonies. I believe a number of parish registers from Barbados have been published and are fairly accessible. > > I can help with the Phoenix (or Phenix as it seems to be universally > spelled). I have looked it up in both the 'Maritime History of Devon' and > also 'Early Stuart Mariners and Shipping 1619-35'. In the former mention is > made of two such named vessels and in the latter there are four mentions. > All records refer to owners of shipping. The former states on p.134, "In > 1626 returns of ships and mariners were made to the vice-admiral of Devon. > Although incomplete, they provide useful information. . . The lists of 1626 > show that most shareholders were merchants, but there were a few > professional men, like Francis Facey, a lawyer, who was part-owner of the > Phoenix of Barnstaple, with Nicholas Delbridge, a merchant, and Mary > Jenning." This information is confirmed in Early Stuart Mariners p. 94 which > has a transcript of the survey and describes the Phenix (sic) as being of 50 > tons burden, carrying no ordnance but capable of carrying 6. This is a solid lead. I want to check the indexes to the multi-volume series of Connecticut Colonial Documents in my library and to see what other references there are to the Phenix during the 17th century. (Sorry, I shouldn't have projected a current spelling to the past.) > > The other reference in "The Maritime History of Devon" is to a Phoenix of > Dartmouth in 1588 being supplied to Drakes fleet to fight the Armada by Mr > Gawen Champernowne of Dartmouth and it is described as being of 70 tons. In > Early Stuart Mariners there is mention of two Phenix(s) of Dart (presumably > the river on which they were kept) both of 80 tons. One owned by Rawleigh > Gilbert esq and the other by George Roope. > > There is also mention in Early Stuart Mariners of a survey of shipping in > South Devon in 1619 and there is a Phenix of Dartmouth of 18 tuns (sic) 15 > ages (???) and no ordnance. Finally on p 103 there is a reference to an > Alfred Staplehill owning 8 shares in the Phenix value £1 4s 0d. As this was > also in 1619 I would assume it to be a part of the same survey and to be the > same ship. > > My view would be that a ship that went to fight the armada would be too old > (if it survived) to be sailing to Barbados and New England. I think the > Dartmouth vessel of 15 tons is far too small. I know they went across the > ocean in tiny vessels but 15 tons is the same as a small yacht and in any > event wouldn't have been commercially viable for trading, surely? That > leaves the other two vessels on the Dart and the Barnstaple vessel as > possibilities. I seem to recall reading somewhere that the profits on > shipping were enormous as were the risks. A ship would be expected to pay > for itself in less than 10 years, and less than 5 in some cases. Obviously > they were also vulnerable to weather and enemy (and piratical) action. It > meant that ships, and sailors for that matter, were regarded by the owners > as rather disposable and not expected to have long working lives. > > Early Stuart Mariners and Shipping has long lists of mariners and owners in > it, but no record of the master or the sailor mentioned I'm afraid. > > The references are: > Todd Gray, Early Stuart Mariners and Shipping, Devon and Cornwall Record > Society New series volume 33, 1990 > Michael Duffy (editor) et al, The New Maritime History of Devon, The > University of Exeter and Conway Maritime Press, 1992 I'll try to find a copies in my University library (the University of Delaware Library, where I was a librarian before I retired) and request on interlibrary loan if we doesn't have. I'm pretty sure that we don't have the Devon and Cornwall Record Society publications, at least as a set, and I have a feeling that we don't have the Duffy, either. Our holdings on Devon are rather light. Although I selected in British history, my budget for Britain was limited and I had to be quite selective. Thanks again for your insightful comments. David Langenberg Newark, Delaware, USA

Hello David, There is an entry for "List of Ships Names of the Royal Navy" on Wikipedia. Link to alphabetical entries. Th entry O-Q gives information on all R.N. Ships with the name "Phoenix" Hope this is helpful. Margaret in Australia.

>From my copy of "Devonshire Wills", I see it mentions the name Dunn twice. Once on page 80 where Ann Dunn is left £5 by Elizabeth Richards of Ilfracombe should she still be living with her when she dies. Next on page 168 where Robert Dunn is a witness to the will of Richard Tucker of Braunton. -----Original Message----- From: Jonathan Frayne Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 2014 10:47 AM To: devon@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [DEV] Charles Warren Franks bap 1745 Clayhidon Hi Ruth The Place Names of Devon gives a Dunsgreen Farm in Clayhidon Parish! The reference is complex as they bundle together about a dozen farms and give the references altogether later in the paragraph. Assuming the references are in the same order (and it seems likely from the names) the reference to Dunsgreen Farm is "associated with the families of . . . Robert Dunn of Broadhembury (1670 Wills)". The Wills reference is to "Devonshire Wills", The British Record Society volume 35, apparently. Looks like you need a good reference library! A copy of a large scale Ordnance Survey map may help if the name still persists in the parish. HTH Jon -----Original Message----- From: devon-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:devon-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Ruth Henriegel Sent: 28 January 2014 11:52 To: DEVON@rootsweb.com Subject: [DEV] Charles Warren Franks bap 1745 Clayhidon Charles Warren Franks was the illegitimate son of Joan Hitchcock presumed widow of Robert Franks of Clayhidon although no record of Robert's death has been found. In 1757 Charles Warren Franks was apprenticed to Robert Warren for Duns Green Estate (PO451). It is interesting to note that someone (? Robert Warren) has put a line through Charles second name of Warren on the indenture! After that event I cannot find any further record of Charles Warren Franks or as Charles Franks. Nor can I find any reference to Duns Green Estate. Does anyone on this list know in what parish the estate was located? Any thoughts on this would be appreciated. Ruth Henriegel ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

David The merchant Ship PHOENIX is mentioned here. https://www.repository.cam.ac.uk/bitstream/handle/1810/131691/lon69.txt?sequence=1 I have a Phoenix EDMONDS died in Plymouth Devon. Love the name. Bev Edmonds -------------------------------------------------- From: "David L. Langenberg" <gallienus@mac.com> Sent: Tuesday, January 28, 2014 9:11 AM To: <devon@rootsweb.com> Subject: Re: [DEV] Complete Records of All Fighting Ships RN - Phoenix > Edna, > > Tracking down the home port of the vessel is a good idea. However, the > Phoenix was not a Royal Navy vessel. Presumably it was a commercial > vessel engaged in shipping between the British Isles, the American > colonies, and the Caribbean. I am not sure what resources exist for ships > in the 17th century. That's a line of research I will pursue someday. > For now, my query was primarily to see whether anyone on the list has > encountered the surname LARRABEE in their research in Devon and > particularly in relation to a Christian name > Greenfeild/Grenfell/Grenville/etc. > > Regards, > > David Langenberg > Newark, Delaware, USA > > On Jan 27, 2014, at 12:28 PM, liverpud wrote: > >> You could google for e-book >> Ships of the Royal Navy: The Complete Record of All Fighting Ships >> might be handy. >> >> Cheers, >> >> Edna - Ottawa >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: elizabeth howard >> Sent: Monday, January 27, 2014 11:23 AM >> To: devon@rootsweb.com >> Subject: [DEV] Greenfield LARRABEE >> >> Hi, given the quote and its idiosyncratic spellings. >> Greenfield Larrabee could be anything !! Does anyone know of the >> Phoenix >> ship ? who owned it where it came from ? >> >> >> >> life is hard . soften it with a cat \\\=^..^=/// >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "David L. Langenberg" <gallienus@mac.com> >> To: <devon@rootsweb.com> >> Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2014 2:54 PM >> Subject: [DEV] Greenfield LARRABEE >> >> >>> This is going to be a very long shot! One of the classic problems in >>> American (specifically New England) genealogy is the English origins of >>> Greenfield LARRABEE, who shows up out of nowhere in colonial >>> Connecticut, >>> in 1647. (He went on to settled permanently in Connecticut and left >>> many >>> descendants on this side of the Atlantic.) Here is an extensive quote >>> about his appearance in court: >>> > > > ------------------------------------------ > The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon > ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) > and > the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) > List archive for Devon can be found at > http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > > ----- > No virus found in this message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 2012.0.2247 / Virus Database: 3681/6538 - Release Date: 01/27/14 >

Two farms, Artiscombe and Higher Artiscombe remain in existence today. Higher Artiscombe is the closest to Rubbytown and the former Cole Farm (Coletown?). And, indeed, Hele Farm is also very close, just to the west of Rubbytown. David Fletcher, Plymouth, UK.. Message: 9 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2014 19:13:24 -0500 From: "David L. Langenberg" <gallienus@mac.com> Subject: [DEV] SLEEMAN at Coletown, Tavistock - Thomas ROCKEY, Jr. at Heale, Tavistock To: devon@rootsweb.com Message-ID: <648010DB-BECC-41CB-A1F4-9463654D2950@mac.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I have been going through the Tavistock Land Tax Assessments, 1780-1832, at my local LDS Family History Library. It appears that J. SLEEMAN became a tenant of Coletown in the West Division of Tavistock parish in 1807 while Hy. SLEEMAN became a tenant of Great Artiscombe and Artiscombe (presumably properties adjoining Coletown) in the same year. For some years previously, Wm. Crabb had been the tenant of all three properties. Because they are listed consecutively, I conclude that they are all contiguous properties. All were owned by the Duke of Bedford. You might remember that later censuses (1841 and 1851) indicated that John SLEEMAN was born at Coletown. This establishes for certain that there was such a place in Tavistock parish. Interestingly, Thomas ROCKEY, Junior, first shows up at Heale and Heale late Kemps in the following year, 1808. I believe that Heale must be the same as Hele, mentioned in The Place-Names of Devon, v. 1, p. 122. I have no idea yet where it might be situated in the parish, but I have not examined old Ordnance Survey maps. You might recall that Salome ROCKEY married John SLEEMAN in Tavistock in 1805. David Langenberg Newark, Delaware, USA

Hi Ruth The Place Names of Devon gives a Dunsgreen Farm in Clayhidon Parish! The reference is complex as they bundle together about a dozen farms and give the references altogether later in the paragraph. Assuming the references are in the same order (and it seems likely from the names) the reference to Dunsgreen Farm is "associated with the families of . . . Robert Dunn of Broadhembury (1670 Wills)". The Wills reference is to "Devonshire Wills", The British Record Society volume 35, apparently. Looks like you need a good reference library! A copy of a large scale Ordnance Survey map may help if the name still persists in the parish. HTH Jon -----Original Message----- From: devon-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:devon-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Ruth Henriegel Sent: 28 January 2014 11:52 To: DEVON@rootsweb.com Subject: [DEV] Charles Warren Franks bap 1745 Clayhidon Charles Warren Franks was the illegitimate son of Joan Hitchcock presumed widow of Robert Franks of Clayhidon although no record of Robert's death has been found. In 1757 Charles Warren Franks was apprenticed to Robert Warren for Duns Green Estate (PO451). It is interesting to note that someone (? Robert Warren) has put a line through Charles second name of Warren on the indenture! After that event I cannot find any further record of Charles Warren Franks or as Charles Franks. Nor can I find any reference to Duns Green Estate. Does anyone on this list know in what parish the estate was located? Any thoughts on this would be appreciated. Ruth Henriegel ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi I think the spelling is fairly standard stuff for the mid-17th century and better than most. The use of 'u' for 'v' is a mistranscription I suspect as it crops up so often and I think that the handwriting of the time used a more rounded 'v' which we read as 'u'. If Greenfield Larrabee just appears out of nowhere and he is a sailor I would suspect he could be a deserter from the Royal Navy and has changed his name to protect himself. I believe Britain owned Barbados at the time and maintained a flotilla of vessels there. I can help with the Phoenix (or Phenix as it seems to be universally spelled). I have looked it up in both the 'Maritime History of Devon' and also 'Early Stuart Mariners and Shipping 1619-35'. In the former mention is made of two such named vessels and in the latter there are four mentions. All records refer to owners of shipping. The former states on p.134, "In 1626 returns of ships and mariners were made to the vice-admiral of Devon. Although incomplete, they provide useful information. . . The lists of 1626 show that most shareholders were merchants, but there were a few professional men, like Francis Facey, a lawyer, who was part-owner of the Phoenix of Barnstaple, with Nicholas Delbridge, a merchant, and Mary Jenning." This information is confirmed in Early Stuart Mariners p. 94 which has a transcript of the survey and describes the Phenix (sic) as being of 50 tons burden, carrying no ordnance but capable of carrying 6. The other reference in "The Maritime History of Devon" is to a Phoenix of Dartmouth in 1588 being supplied to Drakes fleet to fight the Armada by Mr Gawen Champernowne of Dartmouth and it is described as being of 70 tons. In Early Stuart Mariners there is mention of two Phenix(s) of Dart (presumably the river on which they were kept) both of 80 tons. One owned by Rawleigh Gilbert esq and the other by George Roope. There is also mention in Early Stuart Mariners of a survey of shipping in South Devon in 1619 and there is a Phenix of Dartmouth of 18 tuns (sic) 15 ages (???) and no ordnance. Finally on p 103 there is a reference to an Alfred Staplehill owning 8 shares in the Phenix value £1 4s 0d. As this was also in 1619 I would assume it to be a part of the same survey and to be the same ship. My view would be that a ship that went to fight the armada would be too old (if it survived) to be sailing to Barbados and New England. I think the Dartmouth vessel of 15 tons is far too small. I know they went across the ocean in tiny vessels but 15 tons is the same as a small yacht and in any event wouldn't have been commercially viable for trading, surely? That leaves the other two vessels on the Dart and the Barnstaple vessel as possibilities. I seem to recall reading somewhere that the profits on shipping were enormous as were the risks. A ship would be expected to pay for itself in less than 10 years, and less than 5 in some cases. Obviously they were also vulnerable to weather and enemy (and piratical) action. It meant that ships, and sailors for that matter, were regarded by the owners as rather disposable and not expected to have long working lives. Early Stuart Mariners and Shipping has long lists of mariners and owners in it, but no record of the master or the sailor mentioned I'm afraid. The references are: Todd Gray, Early Stuart Mariners and Shipping, Devon and Cornwall Record Society New series volume 33, 1990 Michael Duffy (editor) et al, The New Maritime History of Devon, The University of Exeter and Conway Maritime Press, 1992 HTH Jon -----Original Message----- From: devon-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:devon-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of elizabeth howard Sent: 27 January 2014 16:23 To: devon@rootsweb.com Subject: [DEV] Greenfield LARRABEE Hi, given the quote and its idiosyncratic spellings. Greenfield Larrabee could be anything !! Does anyone know of the Phoenix ship ? who owned it where it came from ? life is hard . soften it with a cat \\\=^..^=/// ----- Original Message ----- From: "David L. Langenberg" <gallienus@mac.com> To: <devon@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2014 2:54 PM Subject: [DEV] Greenfield LARRABEE > This is going to be a very long shot! One of the classic problems in > American (specifically New England) genealogy is the English origins of > Greenfield LARRABEE, who shows up out of nowhere in colonial Connecticut, > in 1647. (He went on to settled permanently in Connecticut and left many > descendants on this side of the Atlantic.) Here is an extensive quote > about his appearance in court: > > "Steven Reekes, master of a vessell that came from the Barbadoes, was > called before the court to answer for some miscariadges of his on the > Saboth daye, vizd:--that he, the said Steven, did, contrary to the law of > God and of this place, halle vp his shipp to or towardes the necke bridge > vpon the Sabothe, which is a laboure proper for the six dayes, and not to > be vndertaken on the Lords day. Mr. Reeks answered that their shipp laye > on ground and had not flotted some dayes before, but that day the winde > coming vp at the southeast, brought in a great tide, and then she flotted, > and that all ye company did was but to keepe her of from runing on the > banke or driving vpon her ancor, the shipp hauing neuer a boate to carie > another ancor forth. Hee was toold they should have provided for that > before, for it is ye duty of all men to remember the Saboth, and to > provide so beforehand that nothing maye distrube them vpon the Saboth, > vnlesse it bee in cases of mercy or workes of such ! > necessitie as could not be provided for the day before nor staye till the > day after. Mr. [Greenfield] Larebe, a seaman belonging to the Phenix, was > called before the courte, to answer to some miscariadges of his vpon the > same Saboth, vizd, that he, wth some other company, went aboard the > Phenix, and did worke not proper for that day, as halling of the vessell, > and emptying some stones out of a cannow to help them in that servie. Mr. > Larebe replied, that hee conceived the worke was a worke of charitie, to > preserve the vessell that it might not perish, for their was some danger > of her ouer-setting; besid, Mr. Pery came to hime himeselfe, and saide it > was fitt some bodye should goe downe. Mr. Malbon saith that Mr. Pery was > at his house, and he was speakeing of some danger the vessell might bee > in, whervpon he wished his sonne Pery to goe to Mr. Davenport and aske his > advise. Hee did, and Mr. Davenport tould hime hee should leave it to Gods > providence, the Saboth was a day ! > of rest, and therfore hee ought to rest. Then Mr. Malbon wished hime > to give order that nothinge should bee done, wch hee did, only on might > goe downe and see what state the vessell was in, but that nothing, wthout > apparent necessitie, be done to her, yett Mr. Larebe, wth diueres others, > went and wrought, contrary to the lawe for the Saboth. The courte > considered bothe these cases and finde them to be much alike, and > considering the persons, that they are strangers, and thinking they did > not doe it out of contempt, but ignorantly, they agreed for this time, > (that they acknowledging ther failings, and promising amendment for time > to come,) to passe it by, but if any of our owne take libbertie heareby, > the sentenc will bee heavier on them." > > I think it is quite reasonable to believe that Greenfield LARRABEE was a > West Country man, possibly from Devon or Cornwall. I also believe that > his forename Greenfield comes from the surname GRENVILLE and there was a > famous GRENVILLE family of Devon. In the article on Richard GRENVILLE in > Wikipedia it is stated: "The ancient Grenville family were lords of the > manors of Bideford in Devon and of Stowe, Kilkhampton in Cornwall. He was > a cousin of Sir Walter Raleigh and the privateer Sir Francis Drake. > Grenville's birthplace is believed to have been at Bideford." > > Now the surname LARRABEE is another matter. It appears in many forms, > ranging from LEATHERBY to LEREBE to LARRABEE and all possible spelling > variations thereof. IGI actually shows some Letherbys from Devon. I > believe the name also occurs in Cornwall. > > Has anyone ever encountered in Devon a LARRABEE (or any of its variants) > family with individuals named Greenfield or Grenville or other variants? > > David Langenberg > Newark, Delaware, USA > ------------------------------------------ > The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon > ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) > and > the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) > List archive for Devon can be found at > http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon ( http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/ ) and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index/DEVON/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DEVON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message