Hi Marie: The Mike Brown essay you’ve pointed to is not the only one on aliases in GENUKI/Devon/Names, Personal. You may also find this one by Max Hooper helpful: http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/DEV/DevonMisc/AliasesDiscriminant Cheers Brian On 10 Apr 2016, at 01:13, Marie McCulloch via <[email protected]> wrote: > Many years ago (decades) I was searching for the reason for my ancestors > having alias's. I eventually found the following web site which you may find > explains a lot. > > I have checked my copy of the names and alias's but there is no > REED/REID/READE/ETC > or BLACKMORE which is no help to your direct query but reading the > information may > help you. > > http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/DevonMisc/Aliases.html > Some Devon Surname Aliases > by > Mike Brown > > I hope this has been of some assistance > Marie > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Carolyne Bruyn via > Sent: Saturday, April 09, 2016 3:46 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: [DEV] REEDE OR BLACKMORE - Alternative Surnames > > Hi, > > My query isn't specific to Devon but the names I am wondering about are > connected to my Devon lines and maybe I can also pick up more info on them. > My apologies if not appropriate for this list. > > I am researching a REED / REID / READE / ETC line and have come across one > JOSEPH REEDE or BLACKMORE, born 1662 in Barnstaple Devon. > His father is apparently JAMES REEDE or BLACKMORE, also from Barnstaple [no > firm dates as yet]. I think I have James's father as JAMES REED > [ no Blackmore ]. In the bits of documentation I have for these two, the > alternatives are clearly given in each case, REEDE or BLACKMORE. > > Does anyone have any idea why these two, and only these two, generations > would offer a choice of surname? Is OR a substitute for a hyphen? > > Thanks for any insight. > > Regards, > > Carolyne > ------------------------------------------ > The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon > http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/DEV/ > and > the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) > List archive for Devon can be found at > http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index?list=devon > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in > the subject and the body of the message > > ------------------------------------------ > The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon > http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/DEV/ > and > the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) > List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index?list=devon > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message -- School of Computing Science, Newcastle University, Newcastle upon Tyne, NE1 7RU, UK EMAIL = [email protected] PHONE = +44 191 208 7923 FAX = +44 191 208 8232 URL = http://www.cs.ncl.ac.uk/people/brian.randell

I would think that it is possible that his father could have been either James Reid or James Blackmore. The point being the actual father may not be known. This is not uncommon to have happened that a mother has affairs with two gentlemen at the same time. Besides I always maintain that the only true line of descent is the female line. The mother being the only person for sure who is the mother. Any male could be the father. Only DNA will prove otherwise. I've not yet come across this information in my data base, but it may well be among the numerous Blackmore Pedigrees I have. If it is Reid it would be doubtful I have it. Terry Blackmore O.P.C. Sheldon, Devon. > > On 09 April 2016 at 06:46 Carolyne Bruyn via <[email protected]> wrote: > > > Hi, > > My query isn't specific to Devon but the names I am wondering about are > connected to my Devon lines and maybe I can also pick up more info on > them. > My apologies if not appropriate for this list. > > I am researching a REED / REID / READE / ETC line and have come across one > JOSEPH REEDE or BLACKMORE, born 1662 in Barnstaple Devon. > His father is apparently JAMES REEDE or BLACKMORE, also from Barnstaple > [no > firm dates as yet]. I think I have James's father as JAMES REED > [ no Blackmore ]. In the bits of documentation I have for these two, the > alternatives are clearly given in each case, REEDE or BLACKMORE. > > Does anyone have any idea why these two, and only these two, generations > would offer a choice of surname? Is OR a substitute for a hyphen? > > Thanks for any insight. > > Regards, > > Carolyne > ------------------------------------------ > The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon > http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/DEV/ > and > the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) > List archive for Devon can be found at > http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index?list=devon > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in > the subject and the body of the message >

Further to my very superficial head count, if you prefer a more comprehensive analysis of numbers engaged in maritime (and all other) professions then see histpop.org as suggested a few months ago by Adrian Bruce at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/DEVON/2015-12/1451392975 For 1891, standardised employment categories within most of Devon are tabulated on pages 195-202 with Devonport and Exeter tabulated separately on pages 203-210, so for Naval/Fishermen/Merchant Seamen you need to view pages 196/7/8 and 203/4/5. Note that histpop places Merchant Seamen within the sub-category of Conveyance [of Goods] on Canals, Rivers and Seas, consistent Bob Hunter's opinion that Mariners dealt with the carriage of trade goods between ports. Coming ashore, that histpop data is for a working age population of 10 years or over. Apart from over 47,000 domestic servants (96% female) and nearly 25,000 Ag Labs, the next largest occupation in Devon (excluding Devonport and Exeter) was over 12,500 milliners, dressmakers and staymakers. At the other end of the scale, death was evidently not a major economic activity because histpop records only 2 individuals as "funeral furniture makers and undertakers", albeit a lucrative sideline for many of the 6,000 carpenters in the county. The largest category was the "Unoccupied class" including 16,000 living on own means and well over 150,000 "Others" which must include a huge number of wives and daughters of farmers and shopkeepers, etc who contributed their labour to the family business. Martin Beavis -----Original Message----- From: Bob Hunter via Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 9:37 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [DEV] Terminology - Mariner vs. Fisherman I would suggest that "mariner" and "fisherman" were two different occupations. The former dealing with the carriage of trade goods between ports, the latter with fishing! A "sailor" was a (royal) naval man. Mariners did not require certificates of competency until the late 18 hundreds when they were awarded on the basis of experience. BobH

Hi Carolyne, I agree, in principle, with what others have said, in that it is not a replacement for a hyphen and that it can be for various reasons. However, that just means that you now have an interesting research project ! There is every chance that you can find the reason, at least to the extent of finding the people named REEDE and BLACKMORE from whom the person's name derives. Possibilities include, but are not limited to, the following: 1) Name at illegitimate birth was mother's surname; became father's surname after parent married. 2) Mother inherited money and it was important to show the link to mother's surname to establish inheritance rights. 3) Lord of the manor, or other important (i.e. wealthy) local dignitary, had one of the surnames and might look kindly on child being given his name. 4) Name changed to avoid association with another of same surname, for whatever reason. 5) Name changed for criminal reasons (these last two less likely, I think) It might be worth seeing whether Land Tax records have survived. It was introduced in 1692, so you would need the earliest returns. Manorial court records might also be a useful source. Best wishes, Mike Gould Leicestershire -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Carolyne Bruyn via Sent: 09 April 2016 06:47 To: [email protected] Subject: [DEV] REEDE OR BLACKMORE - Alternative Surnames Hi, My query isn't specific to Devon but the names I am wondering about are connected to my Devon lines and maybe I can also pick up more info on them. My apologies if not appropriate for this list. I am researching a REED / REID / READE / ETC line and have come across one JOSEPH REEDE or BLACKMORE, born 1662 in Barnstaple Devon. His father is apparently JAMES REEDE or BLACKMORE, also from Barnstaple [no firm dates as yet]. I think I have James's father as JAMES REED [ no Blackmore ]. In the bits of documentation I have for these two, the alternatives are clearly given in each case, REEDE or BLACKMORE. Does anyone have any idea why these two, and only these two, generations would offer a choice of surname? Is OR a substitute for a hyphen? Thanks for any insight. Regards, Carolyne ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/DEV/ and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index?list=devon ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi, My query isn't specific to Devon but the names I am wondering about are connected to my Devon lines and maybe I can also pick up more info on them. My apologies if not appropriate for this list. I am researching a REED / REID / READE / ETC line and have come across one JOSEPH REEDE or BLACKMORE, born 1662 in Barnstaple Devon. His father is apparently JAMES REEDE or BLACKMORE, also from Barnstaple [no firm dates as yet]. I think I have James's father as JAMES REED [ no Blackmore ]. In the bits of documentation I have for these two, the alternatives are clearly given in each case, REEDE or BLACKMORE. Does anyone have any idea why these two, and only these two, generations would offer a choice of surname? Is OR a substitute for a hyphen? Thanks for any insight. Regards, Carolyne

On Sat, 9 Apr 2016 14:53:01 +0100 Adrian Bruce via <[email protected]> wrote: Hello Adrian, >that what we think of today as fixed and unchanging - wasn't. Indeed. My mother in law was always adamant that her Ratcliffe forebears always had the 'e' at the end, until I showed her evidence that they were often record as Ratcliff. Even nowadays, despite filling in many forms with my daughter's first name, we receive letters of which nearly 40% have her name incorrectly spelled. -- Regards _ / ) "The blindingly obvious is / _)rad never immediately apparent" No you can't hop into my shower Leave Me Alone (I'm Lonely) - P!nk

Suffice it to say that I ran into a (non-Devon) example of an "alias" (that was the word in my case, rather than "or") and when I attempted to explore whether this meant that the chap was illegitimate, I got told in no uncertain terms that there were many possible reasons for aliases. It simply was the case that, further back in time, people could be known by alternative names. If you think back to when "surnames" were still in flux, a tall chap who ran a mill might be referred to as Tom Long alias Tom Miller. I'm not suggesting that this is your explanation, especially as you suggest it's only seen in a couple of generations, but it does illustrate that what we think of today as fixed and unchanging - wasn't. You will need to look at many things to try and locate where the "other" name comes from. It could be anything.

On Sat, 9 Apr 2016 15:46:31 +1000 Carolyne Bruyn via <[email protected]> wrote: Hello Carolyne, >Does anyone have any idea why these two, and only these two, generations >would offer a choice of surname? Is OR a substitute for a hyphen? They were known by both names. 'Or' is _not_ a substitute for a hyphen. Without any evidence as to why they were known by two names, anything anyone suggests would be speculation, pure and simple. -- Regards _ / ) "The blindingly obvious is / _)rad never immediately apparent" Every single one of us Devil Inside - INXS

Carolyne: >3) Lord of the manor, or other important (i.e. wealthy) local dignitary, had >one of the surnames and might look kindly on child being given his name. I have one that was named after the vicar, who had just died. Unlikely to 'look kindly'! Regards, John Moore

Morning, Mary Stansbury was bapt at Plymouth Charles 12 Nov 1815 d/o Samuel STANSBURY and Priscilla . The only marriage I can find is that of Samuel STANBURY and Penelope HORTUP at Stoke Damerel 25 March 1815 I am wondering if the Vicar got the bride's name incorrect on the marriage, or is the mother's name on the baptism of Mary [Priscilla] incorrect? 1851 has a Samuel Stanbury 65 and Penelope 63 are at Sydenham Damerel. All research so far indicates that she really was Penelope Hortup but there is also the lingering niggle that maybe she wasn't. Has anyone else come up against this family? Regards Bev Edmonds

I am researching HARDING and SKINNER families of Otterton, Devon, England. William HARDEN/HARDING married Susanna SKINNER, in Otterton, Devon, England, 17 December 1759. Their son, William Harding was born 4 December 1769. Any information will be gratefully appreciated. Are there any descendants out there? Many Thanks, Wayne Stewart Holmes,DFHS #921.

Just to go back to tickets. They were introduced in 1845 and until 1854 required only a claim of experience to apply, bearing in mind that you also had to prove to the master, who knew every other master, that the experience was real. From 1861 a system of crew lists and agreements provided a C.V. These are held in Kew and Greenwich. Although there was no formal test of competency, no master could afford sub-standard crew members. The risks were too high. It is also worth remembering that the enumerators did not work from a list of recognised occupations and the actual visit by the enumerator may not call until a few days later. If the enumerator was told "he goes to sea", anything could be put down. Cheers Paul -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of ANGELA MARKS via Sent: 07 April 2016 14:51 To: John Lerwill; [email protected] Subject: Re: [DEV] Terminology - Mariner vs. Fisherman I too would agree. I've noticed several of my mariner ancestors became fishermen later in life. Possibly because they no longer wanted to go on long voyages, and most fishermen in the nineteenth century would have gone out in day boats because of the difficulty of preserving the catch. Long haul fishermen, such as those who went to Newfoundland would have to salt their catch, but day boat fishermen could provide a new delicacy - fresh sea fish. Also the coming of the railways opened up new markets as fish could be transported sufficiently rapidly for it to remain (relatively!) fresh. Although by our lifetime, fish were transported in ice, others can no doubt remember, as I can, when St David's Station in Exeter often smelt strongly of fish! Mainly the catch from Brixham heading for Billingsgate. Angela in Exmouth ----Original message---- >From : [email protected] Date : 07/04/2016 - 12:01 (GMTDT) To : [email protected] Subject : Re: [DEV] Terminology - Mariner vs. Fisherman Yes, I'm inclined to agree with Bob's 'take' on this.. And in fact where a person describes himself differently in different censuses he could genuinely have changed tack (pun not intended!) between functions (e.g. mariner to fisherman) in order to try to make a better living for himself and his family depending on trading conditions. Cheers, John On 07/04/2016 09:37, Bob Hunter via wrote: > I would suggest that "mariner" and "fisherman" were two different > occupations. The former dealing with the carriage of trade goods > between ports, the latter with fishing! > > A "sailor" was a (royal) naval man. > > Mariners did not require certificates of competency until the late 18 > hundreds when they were awarded on the basis of experience. > > BobH > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/DEV/ and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index?list=devon ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/DEV/ and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index?list=devon ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I too would agree. I've noticed several of my mariner ancestors became fishermen later in life. Possibly because they no longer wanted to go on long voyages, and most fishermen in the nineteenth century would have gone out in day boats because of the difficulty of preserving the catch. Long haul fishermen, such as those who went to Newfoundland would have to salt their catch, but day boat fishermen could provide a new delicacy - fresh sea fish. Also the coming of the railways opened up new markets as fish could be transported sufficiently rapidly for it to remain (relatively!) fresh. Although by our lifetime, fish were transported in ice, others can no doubt remember, as I can, when St David's Station in Exeter often smelt strongly of fish! Mainly the catch from Brixham heading for Billingsgate. Angela in Exmouth ----Original message---- >From : [email protected] Date : 07/04/2016 - 12:01 (GMTDT) To : [email protected] Subject : Re: [DEV] Terminology - Mariner vs. Fisherman Yes, I'm inclined to agree with Bob's 'take' on this.. And in fact where a person describes himself differently in different censuses he could genuinely have changed tack (pun not intended!) between functions (e.g. mariner to fisherman) in order to try to make a better living for himself and his family depending on trading conditions. Cheers, John On 07/04/2016 09:37, Bob Hunter via wrote: > I would suggest that "mariner" and "fisherman" were two different > occupations. The former dealing with the carriage of trade goods between > ports, the latter with fishing! > > A "sailor" was a (royal) naval man. > > Mariners did not require certificates of competency until the late 18 > hundreds when they were awarded on the basis of experience. > > BobH > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/DEV/ and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index?list=devon ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Yes, I'm inclined to agree with Bob's 'take' on this.. And in fact where a person describes himself differently in different censuses he could genuinely have changed tack (pun not intended!) between functions (e.g. mariner to fisherman) in order to try to make a better living for himself and his family depending on trading conditions. Cheers, John On 07/04/2016 09:37, Bob Hunter via wrote: > I would suggest that "mariner" and "fisherman" were two different > occupations. The former dealing with the carriage of trade goods between > ports, the latter with fishing! > > A "sailor" was a (royal) naval man. > > Mariners did not require certificates of competency until the late 18 > hundreds when they were awarded on the basis of experience. > > BobH > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I would suggest that "mariner" and "fisherman" were two different occupations. The former dealing with the carriage of trade goods between ports, the latter with fishing! A "sailor" was a (royal) naval man. Mariners did not require certificates of competency until the late 18 hundreds when they were awarded on the basis of experience. BobH

A very superficial head count suggests that fishermen predominately called themselves fishermen and well outnumbered those seafarers calling themselves mariners or sailors. An occupation search of FMP's 1891 census for Ramsgate parish has 178 individuals for Fisherman, 64 Mariner (including 12 Master Mariner), 8 for Sailor and 8 for Seaman, while the Plymouth registration district has 523 Fisherman, 79 Mariner (including 48 Master Mariner), 67 Sailor and 125 Seaman (all using the male gender filter to exclude mariner's wife, etc). These numbers are probably enhanced for coastal fishermen sleeping at home and reduced for mariners absent at sea and probably include quite a few retired men but probably relatively few naval men, so this is really no more than a qualitative observation. If your man was a certificated Master or Mate then you might well find his maritime career on Ancestry's collection of All UK and Ireland, Masters and Mates Certificates, 1850-1927. Regards - Martin Beavis -----Original Message----- From: Mike Mallett via Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2016 10:59 PM To: 'John Bartlett' ; [email protected] Subject: Re: [DEV] Terminology - Mariner vs. Fisherman I am sure that many of the occupations you see written down are how the person chose to describe themselves rather than the result of any formal system. I have seen this discussed elsewhere and it may have been that a mariner had some navigational skills but that is far from conclusive. 'Sailor' is another term that you may come across. I am sure that if someone in merchant service or the Royal Navy had an actual rank they would use this instead. In the period you are looking at I am sure that a fishing vessel would not be very large but could well have a master and mates. Mike -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of John Bartlett via Sent: 05 April 2016 19:09 To: [email protected] Subject: [DEV] Terminology - Mariner vs. Fisherman ​Has anyone any idea how interchangeable the terms 'Mariner' and 'Fisherman' were in the late 1800s? I have a somewhat tenuous link ​between Ramsgate and Plymouth and the distinction may (or may not) be relevant. Thanks, John Vancouver Island.

John, FMP, the National Archives and the National Maritime Museum at Greenwich have data-bases on merchant navy seamen's tickets for all ranks and, for the late 1800s , these are fairly complete. The National Maritime Museum may be able to advise on whether a fisherman even needed a ticket. A quick look at google would indicate, even today, only Captain, Engineer and Mate on fishing boats needed some sort of certificate (apart from basic safety training). Seagoing mariners certainly did need a ticket for all ranks. I am guessing you have found the terms on a census. My experience is that there is no particular logic to what the enumerator records beyond what he hears and can spell. Another approach might be to look for fathers in both places. Fishing tended to be a family business before the advent of factory ships. Son would follow father in fishing towns and villages, sailing what were comparatively small vessels with a small crew. Probably not this case but I have seen a Salmon farmer described as a fisherman. Cheers Paul -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of John Bartlett via Sent: 05 April 2016 19:09 To: [email protected] Subject: [DEV] Terminology - Mariner vs. Fisherman ​Has anyone any idea how interchangeable the terms 'Mariner' and 'Fisherman' were in the late 1800s? I have a somewhat tenuous link ​between Ramsgate and Plymouth and the distinction may (or may not) be relevant. Thanks, John Vancouver Island. ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/DEV/ and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index?list=devon ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thanks to all who replied in such detail. John. On 5 April 2016 at 11:08, John Bartlett <[email protected]> wrote: > ​Has anyone any idea how interchangeable the terms 'Mariner' and > 'Fisherman' were in the late 1800s? I have a somewhat tenuous link ​between > Ramsgate and Plymouth and the distinction may (or may not) be relevant. > > Thanks, > John > Vancouver Island. > > > > -- *Want to unsubscribe? Drop me an 'e'.* For details of this week's hike visit *arramblers.ca <http://arramblers.ca>* *John** Arbutus Ridge Ramblers urlKing*

I am sure that many of the occupations you see written down are how the person chose to describe themselves rather than the result of any formal system. I have seen this discussed elsewhere and it may have been that a mariner had some navigational skills but that is far from conclusive. 'Sailor' is another term that you may come across. I am sure that if someone in merchant service or the Royal Navy had an actual rank they would use this instead. In the period you are looking at I am sure that a fishing vessel would not be very large but could well have a master and mates. Mike -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of John Bartlett via Sent: 05 April 2016 19:09 To: [email protected] Subject: [DEV] Terminology - Mariner vs. Fisherman ​Has anyone any idea how interchangeable the terms 'Mariner' and 'Fisherman' were in the late 1800s? I have a somewhat tenuous link ​between Ramsgate and Plymouth and the distinction may (or may not) be relevant. Thanks, John Vancouver Island. ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/DEV/ and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index?list=devon ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

5 Feb 1867 - Western TimesBIDLAKE - Jan 30 at Breinton, Hereford, John Bidlake, late of Whitely, Totnes - aged 41.In sure and certain hope of the resurrection to eternal life. This might be a clue!? Ken On Tuesday, 5 April 2016, 20:26, Paul Hockie via <[email protected]> wrote: Bev, I don't think anyone gave this a go. Did you know Alfred D, with whom she was living in 1861, moved to Stroud in Gloucester by 1871. He seems to have given up the farm and become a cloth merchant. His birthplace in 1871 is given as Darlington, Co Durham and not Dartington, Devon. The question becomes  - did she die in Devon, die en-route (possibly in Wales) or die in Stroud. Unlike a birth or marriage, it is difficult to avoid registering a death. Probability is that the name is either incorrectly transcribed or recorded. I tried several variations in FMP, Freebmd etc but no luck. Cheers Paul -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Beverley Edmonds via Sent: 26 March 2016 21:39 To: [email protected] Subject: [DEV] Sarah BIDLAKE [nee ISBELL] c 1784 5th attempt: ) Morning/Afternoon all, I have been unable to find the burial for the above lass Sarah ISBELL who married John BIDLAKE in 1814 . John BIDLAKE died in 1860 but so far I have been unable to find when/where Sarah died or is buried. Her last known residence was at Whitely in Harberton in 1861. Would anyone have the Harberton Prs/burials past this date and who would do a look up for me please? Would a local Newspaper have her death recorded I wonder?? Regards Bev Edmonds Happy Easter ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/DEV/ and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index?list=devon ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------------------ The DEVON-L mailing list is co-sponsored by GENUKI/Devon http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/DEV/ and the Devon FHS (http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/ ) List archive for Devon can be found at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/index?list=devon ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message