It does what it says on the title and it's updated every year. We put one in our Welcome Bags for our U3A Peak District Family History conference. Still a few tickets left for this September's and non-u3a members are welcome. (They had priority until the end of May) Email me if you'd like the flier. Carole Sent from my iPhone > On 10 Jun 2017, at 15:40, Joan M via DERBYSGEN <[email protected]> wrote: > > This may be of interest from the Federation of Family History Societies - > www.ffhs.org.uk 'our really useful information leaflet 2016'. > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

This may be of interest from the Federation of Family History Societies - www.ffhs.org.uk 'our really useful information leaflet 2016'.

That should have come out: http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/DBY/Pentrich#History Lou ----- Original Message ----- From: "derbysgen" <[email protected]> To: "derbysgen" <[email protected]> Cc: "louis mills" <[email protected]> Sent: Saturday, June 10, 2017 11:58:02 AM Subject: Re: [DBY] DERBYSGEN Digest, Vol 12, Issue 148 Seek and ye shall find:  GENUKI: Pentrich, Derbyshire | | | GENUKI: Pentrich, Derbyshire Pentrich Derbyshire genealogy | | |       Lou Mills Date: Fri, 9 Jun 2017 00:20:32 -0700 From: Eileen Stonely Phelps <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [DBY] The Pentrich Rebellion ? Bicentenary commemorations Message-ID:     <[email protected]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed I would be interested to know if there is a list of names of people involved who might have been imprisoned or deported. ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

There is a full list of revolutionaries at http://www.spanglefish.com/pentrichrevolution/index.asp?pageid=293038 John Leadbeater

Dear Prunella I have an Elias Taylor and a James Taylor who were in Pentrich at the time and were FWK's. Are either or both of them in the lists? John Bulger -----Original Message----- From: DERBYSGEN [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of pabradshaw--- via DERBYSGEN Sent: Friday, June 09, 2017 3:30 AM To: Derbyshire genealogy Cc: [email protected] Subject: Re: [DBY] The Pentrich Rebellion ? Bicentenary commemorations Eileen, I have a list of those who were Hanged, Transported and Jailed - none of those names you listed appear in my list. Sorry Prunella ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Eileen, I have a list of those who were Hanged, Transported and Jailed - none of those names you listed appear in my list. Sorry Prunella

I would be interested to know if there is a list of names of people involved who might have been imprisoned or deported. I have a number of ancestors who lived in Alfreton in the 1700's and whose surnames seem to be common enough, and who seem to be of the working class who might have nieces and nephews, etc. who could have been involved. My families seem to have settled in Stapleford & Nottingham, so they would still have cared greatly about this event a couple of generations later. I have read several things about framework knitters and similar occupations and they had a miserable time of it. Surnames of my Alfreton "residents" include Singleton, Denham, and Poyser. Eileen Phelps in California

Mavis. In your search did you come across a Elizabeth( I think that was her name, but not sure) SALT married to one of the men who took part in the rebellion? Thank you Gill Salt Sent from my iPad On 8 Jun 2017, at 10:50, MAVIS JOHNSON via DERBYSGEN <[email protected]> wrote: Prunella - I agree. It is the 200th Anniversary tomorrow - Friday, 9th June. No doubt will be overwhelmed by post-election news and only hit local media. I have related ancestors and am still finding out more about them as more becomes available via internest sources. It is a MUST for serious genealogists and social/economic historians. There are a lot of commemorative walks and events if you live in Derbyshire! Mavis, (in Somerset) ----Original message---- >From : [email protected] Date : 08/06/2017 - 09:04 (GMTDT) To : [email protected] Cc : [email protected] Subject : Re: [DBY] The Pentrich Rebellion – Bicentenary commemorations I have a very interesting book - England's Last Revolution Pentrich 1817 by John Stevens, it is an excellent read. I also have a Pentrich Revolution Trail leaflet which is also very good. It is published by Pentrich Historical Society. Prunella ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Prunella - I agree. It is the 200th Anniversary tomorrow - Friday, 9th June. No doubt will be overwhelmed by post-election news and only hit local media. I have related ancestors and am still finding out more about them as more becomes available via internest sources. It is a MUST for serious genealogists and social/economic historians. There are a lot of commemorative walks and events if you live in Derbyshire! Mavis, (in Somerset) ----Original message---- >From : [email protected] Date : 08/06/2017 - 09:04 (GMTDT) To : [email protected] Cc : [email protected] Subject : Re: [DBY] The Pentrich Rebellion – Bicentenary commemorations I have a very interesting book - England's Last Revolution Pentrich 1817 by John Stevens, it is an excellent read. I also have a Pentrich Revolution Trail leaflet which is also very good. It is published by Pentrich Historical Society. Prunella ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

>I hope this is of interest to some Derbygeners - Annette > >Karen, Archivist posted: " What do Napoleon >Bonaparte, the French Revolution, an Indonesian >volcano and Derbyshire framework knitters have >in common? They all played their part in one of >the first truly working class rebellions in >British History. This June marks the bicentenary" >Respond to this post by replying above this line > > >New post on Derbyshire Record Office > > > >[] > ><https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/author/karriem/> >[] > > ><https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/2017/06/07/the-pentrich-rebellion-bicentenary-commemorations/>The >Pentrich Rebellion – Bicentenary commemorations > > > >by ><https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/author/karriem/>Karen, >Archivist ><https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/2017/06/07/the-pentrich-rebellion-bicentenary-commemorations/jeremiah/> >[] > ><https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/2017/06/07/the-pentrich-rebellion-bicentenary-commemorations/pent-1/> >[] > ><https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/2017/06/07/the-pentrich-rebellion-bicentenary-commemorations/pent-2/> >[] > > >What do Napoleon Bonaparte, the French >Revolution, an Indonesian volcano and Derbyshire >framework knitters have in common? They all >played their part in one of the first truly >working class rebellions in British History. > >This June marks the bicentenary of the Pentrich Rebellion. > >In April 1815 Mount Tambora in Indonesia >erupted. This volcanic eruption was one of the >most powerful in recorded history and resulted >in two years of poor harvests, due to sulphur >dioxide in the atmosphere preventing sunlight >from reaching the earth’s surface. Sir Henry >FitzHertbert of Tissington Hall wrote in his >dairy, which forms part of the FitzHerbert >family papers held at the record office: > >“This was the worst year which was ever >recollected. The Spring was most severely cold, >the snow falling as late as the 7th of June; and >there was no grass till the end of June.” > >As a result harvests failed and people could not >produce bread to feed themselves or their families. > >British soldiers returning from the Napoleonic >Wars found an economic crisis at home and very >few jobs to return to. Due to the Industrial >Revolution new trades were emerging, demanding >new skills, served by semi-skilled factory >workers. Demand in some long established crafts >decreased and many craftsmen lost their >livelihood. Nowhere were the changes more marked >than in the East Midlands, traditional home of framework knitting. > >Unrest was growing. The success of the French >Revolution led to the spread of revolutionary >ideals across much of Europe. This brought fresh >fears to the British monarchy and landowning >classes, who stamped down on and severely >punished any opposition to their authority. > >It was within this atmosphere of unrest that on >the night of 9th June 1817 men from villages on >the Derbyshire-Nottinghamshire border, including >Pentrich, South Wingfield and Alfreton, set out >to march to Nottingham. They believed they were >part of a general rising across the North and >Midlands to bring down the unjust and oppressive >government.  They were met, however, by >military forces, who had known about the >uprising thanks to a network of government >spies, sent all over the country to uncover >rebel plots. The punishment was severe; for >some, such as rebel leader Jeremiah Brandreth, >it meant death, for others transportation to Australia. > >There is, of course, much more to the story so >come along to the record office to delve deeper >into this fascinating aspect of Derbyshire’s >history. We are holding an exhibition featuring >original material from the time which runs from >the beginning of June until the end of September. > >Or why not join us at the Bicentenary >Commemorative Day event being held by the >Pentrich and South Wingfield Revolution Group, >which takes place this Saturday (10th June) at >the Social Club in South Wingfield. We‘ll be >there from 1pm till 5pm with lots of information >on our collections and services, along with some >original archive material taken from our exhibition. > >For more information on the Bicentenary >Commemorative Day see the Pentrich and South >Wingfield Revolution Group’s website ><http://www.pentrichrevolution.org.uk/events>www.pentrichrevolution.org.uk/events ><https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/author/karriem/>Karen, >Archivist | 7 June 2017 at 12:14 pm | >Categories: ><https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/category/news/>News >| URL: <http://wp.me/p1jCye-354>http://wp.me/p1jCye-354 > ><https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/2017/06/07/the-pentrich-rebellion-bicentenary-commemorations/#respond>Comment ><https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/2017/06/07/the-pentrich-rebellion-bicentenary-commemorations/#comments>See >all comments > ><https://subscribe.wordpress.com/?key=bba82ab2519c1b6a78d8a94fa8662ac9&email=annete%40aapt.net.au&b=CfuRrr%3F1.7%2BY%5DKA3l%25h%2Bd_yFbG9cgW5Gjt%7CRrJs-GwFdKRmLz>Unsubscribe >to no longer receive posts from Derbyshire >Record Office. Change your email settings at ><https://subscribe.wordpress.com/?key=bba82ab2519c1b6a78d8a94fa8662ac9&email=annete%40aapt.net.au>Manage >Subscriptions. > >Trouble clicking? Copy and paste this URL into your browser: ><https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/2017/06/07/the-pentrich-rebellion-bicentenary-commemorations/>https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/2017/06/07/the-pentrich-rebellion-bicentenary-commemorations/ > ><https://wordpress.com>Thanks for flying with >[] ><https://wordpress.com> WordPress.com

I have a very interesting book - England's Last Revolution Pentrich 1817 by John Stevens, it is an excellent read. I also have a Pentrich Revolution Trail leaflet which is also very good. It is published by Pentrich Historical Society. Prunella

Many thanks for the info. Sent from my iPad > On 8 Jun 2017, at 01:01, Annette Watson via DERBYSGEN <[email protected]> wrote: > > >> I hope this is of interest to some Derbygeners - Annette >> >> Karen, Archivist posted: " What do Napoleon Bonaparte, the French Revolution, an Indonesian volcano and Derbyshire framework knitters have in common? They all played their part in one of the first truly working class rebellions in British History. This June marks the bicentenary" >> Respond to this post by replying above this line >> >> >> New post on Derbyshire Record Office >> >> >> >> [] >> >> <https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/author/karriem/> >> [] >> >> >> <https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/2017/06/07/the-pentrich-rebellion-bicentenary-commemorations/>The Pentrich Rebellion – Bicentenary commemorations >> >> >> >> by <https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/author/karriem/>Karen, Archivist <https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/2017/06/07/the-pentrich-rebellion-bicentenary-commemorations/jeremiah/> >> [] >> <https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/2017/06/07/the-pentrich-rebellion-bicentenary-commemorations/pent-1/> >> [] >> <https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/2017/06/07/the-pentrich-rebellion-bicentenary-commemorations/pent-2/> >> [] >> >> >> What do Napoleon Bonaparte, the French Revolution, an Indonesian volcano and Derbyshire framework knitters have in common? They all played their part in one of the first truly working class rebellions in British History. >> >> This June marks the bicentenary of the Pentrich Rebellion. >> >> In April 1815 Mount Tambora in Indonesia erupted. This volcanic eruption was one of the most powerful in recorded history and resulted in two years of poor harvests, due to sulphur dioxide in the atmosphere preventing sunlight from reaching the earth’s surface. Sir Henry FitzHertbert of Tissington Hall wrote in his dairy, which forms part of the FitzHerbert family papers held at the record office: >> >> “This was the worst year which was ever recollected. The Spring was most severely cold, the snow falling as late as the 7th of June; and there was no grass till the end of June.” >> >> As a result harvests failed and people could not produce bread to feed themselves or their families. >> >> British soldiers returning from the Napoleonic Wars found an economic crisis at home and very few jobs to return to. Due to the Industrial Revolution new trades were emerging, demanding new skills, served by semi-skilled factory workers. Demand in some long established crafts decreased and many craftsmen lost their livelihood. Nowhere were the changes more marked than in the East Midlands, traditional home of framework knitting. >> >> Unrest was growing. The success of the French Revolution led to the spread of revolutionary ideals across much of Europe. This brought fresh fears to the British monarchy and landowning classes, who stamped down on and severely punished any opposition to their authority. >> >> It was within this atmosphere of unrest that on the night of 9th June 1817 men from villages on the Derbyshire-Nottinghamshire border, including Pentrich, South Wingfield and Alfreton, set out to march to Nottingham. They believed they were part of a general rising across the North and Midlands to bring down the unjust and oppressive government.  They were met, however, by military forces, who had known about the uprising thanks to a network of government spies, sent all over the country to uncover rebel plots. The punishment was severe; for some, such as rebel leader Jeremiah Brandreth, it meant death, for others transportation to Australia. >> >> There is, of course, much more to the story so come along to the record office to delve deeper into this fascinating aspect of Derbyshire’s history. We are holding an exhibition featuring original material from the time which runs from the beginning of June until the end of September. >> >> Or why not join us at the Bicentenary Commemorative Day event being held by the Pentrich and South Wingfield Revolution Group, which takes place this Saturday (10th June) at the Social Club in South Wingfield. We‘ll be there from 1pm till 5pm with lots of information on our collections and services, along with some original archive material taken from our exhibition. >> >> For more information on the Bicentenary Commemorative Day see the Pentrich and South Wingfield Revolution Group’s website <http://www.pentrichrevolution.org.uk/events>www.pentrichrevolution.org.uk/events >> <https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/author/karriem/>Karen, Archivist | 7 June 2017 at 12:14 pm | Categories: <https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/category/news/>News | URL: <http://wp.me/p1jCye-354>http://wp.me/p1jCye-354 >> >> <https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/2017/06/07/the-pentrich-rebellion-bicentenary-commemorations/#respond>Comment <https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/2017/06/07/the-pentrich-rebellion-bicentenary-commemorations/#comments>See all comments >> >> <https://subscribe.wordpress.com/?key=bba82ab2519c1b6a78d8a94fa8662ac9&email=annete%40aapt.net.au&b=CfuRrr%3F1.7%2BY%5DKA3l%25h%2Bd_yFbG9cgW5Gjt%7CRrJs-GwFdKRmLz>Unsubscribe to no longer receive posts from Derbyshire Record Office. Change your email settings at <https://subscribe.wordpress.com/?key=bba82ab2519c1b6a78d8a94fa8662ac9&email=annete%40aapt.net.au>Manage Subscriptions. >> >> Trouble clicking? Copy and paste this URL into your browser: >> <https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/2017/06/07/the-pentrich-rebellion-bicentenary-commemorations/>https://recordoffice.wordpress.com/2017/06/07/the-pentrich-rebellion-bicentenary-commemorations/ >> <https://wordpress.com>Thanks for flying with >> [] >> <https://wordpress.com> WordPress.com > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Annette Thanks for sharing. I find this a fascinating story.( I am descended from a long line of William Booths, from Pentrich). A couple of points stand out for me in the story . The first is the extent that the event has prompted by the agent provocateur "Oliver The Spy " In March that year , William Richards had offered his services to the government, promising to gain the confidence of the leading radicals and feed the information he acquired back to the Home Office. Secondly, the 1821 Census recorded a decrease in Pentrich’s population of a third because the Duke of Devonshire's agents destroyed many houses after insurrection. Nicholas -----Original Message----- From: DERBYSGEN [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Annette Watson via DERBYSGEN Sent: 08 June 2017 01:02 To: [email protected] Cc: Annette Watson <[email protected]> Subject: [DBY] The Pentrich Rebellion – Bicentenary commemorations >I hope this is of interest to some Derbygeners - Annette > >Karen, Archivist posted: " What do Napoleon Bonaparte, the French >Revolution, an Indonesian volcano and Derbyshire framework knitters >have in common? They all played their part in one of the first truly >working class rebellions in British History. This June marks the >bicentenary" >Respond to this post by replying above this line > > >New post on Derbyshire Record Office > > > >[] > ><https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Frecordoffice.wordpress.com%2Fauthor%2Fkarriem%2F&data=01%7C01%7CNicholas.Shorthose%40shell.com%7C009d050c1bd74702445308d4ae01999c%7Cdb1e96a8a3da442a930b235cac24cd5c%7C0&sdata=tCxf0QuorNESq31KO5a3bP34R47Oaf%2FZ0y2TqzFXIdE%3D&reserved=0> >[] > > ><https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Frecordoffice.wordpress.com%2F2017%2F06%2F07%2Fthe-pentrich-rebellion-bicentenary-commemorations%2F&data=01%7C01%7CNicholas.Shorthose%40shell.com%7C009d050c1bd74702445308d4ae01999c%7Cdb1e96a8a3da442a930b235cac24cd5c%7C0&sdata=X2xM1qvavlSGxa1I9qfwz1BuON2VH8kAz1WH5Z4y0JQ%3D&reserved=0>The >Pentrich Rebellion – Bicentenary commemorations > > > >by ><https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Frecordoffice.wordpress.com%2Fauthor%2Fkarriem%2F&data=01%7C01%7CNicholas.Shorthose%40shell.com%7C009d050c1bd74702445308d4ae01999c%7Cdb1e96a8a3da442a930b235cac24cd5c%7C0&sdata=tCxf0QuorNESq31KO5a3bP34R47Oaf%2FZ0y2TqzFXIdE%3D&reserved=0>Karen, >Archivist ><https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Frecordoffice.wordpress.com%2F2017%2F06%2F07%2Fthe-pentrich-rebellion-bicentenary-commemorations%2Fjeremiah%2F&data=01%7C01%7CNicholas.Shorthose%40shell.com%7C009d050c1bd74702445308d4ae01999c%7Cdb1e96a8a3da442a930b235cac24cd5c%7C0&sdata=H%2B7ZDMydGcWTWDL5QaKRwpo397wTNK%2FFWcapy6UV1qc%3D&reserved=0> >[] > ><https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Frecordoffice.wordpress.com%2F2017%2F06%2F07%2Fthe-pentrich-rebellion-bicentenary-commemorations%2Fpent-1%2F&data=01%7C01%7CNicholas.Shorthose%40shell.com%7C009d050c1bd74702445308d4ae01999c%7Cdb1e96a8a3da442a930b235cac24cd5c%7C0&sdata=vFqceepfyVpmJKHy4n3ewkUenGZn56VDForqmUSzLhw%3D&reserved=0> >[] > ><https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Frecordoffice.wordpress.com%2F2017%2F06%2F07%2Fthe-pentrich-rebellion-bicentenary-commemorations%2Fpent-2%2F&data=01%7C01%7CNicholas.Shorthose%40shell.com%7C009d050c1bd74702445308d4ae01999c%7Cdb1e96a8a3da442a930b235cac24cd5c%7C0&sdata=W04rf5CFakdKzUGVU%2FoVwRAc%2BPEecml13Tlw0jsvmw0%3D&reserved=0> >[] > > >What do Napoleon Bonaparte, the French >Revolution, an Indonesian volcano and Derbyshire >framework knitters have in common? They all >played their part in one of the first truly >working class rebellions in British History. > >This June marks the bicentenary of the Pentrich Rebellion. > >In April 1815 Mount Tambora in Indonesia >erupted. This volcanic eruption was one of the >most powerful in recorded history and resulted >in two years of poor harvests, due to sulphur >dioxide in the atmosphere preventing sunlight >from reaching the earth’s surface. Sir Henry >FitzHertbert of Tissington Hall wrote in his >dairy, which forms part of the FitzHerbert >family papers held at the record office: > >“This was the worst year which was ever >recollected. The Spring was most severely cold, >the snow falling as late as the 7th of June; and >there was no grass till the end of June.” > >As a result harvests failed and people could not >produce bread to feed themselves or their families. > >British soldiers returning from the Napoleonic >Wars found an economic crisis at home and very >few jobs to return to. Due to the Industrial >Revolution new trades were emerging, demanding >new skills, served by semi-skilled factory >workers. Demand in some long established crafts >decreased and many craftsmen lost their >livelihood. Nowhere were the changes more marked >than in the East Midlands, traditional home of framework knitting. > >Unrest was growing. The success of the French >Revolution led to the spread of revolutionary >ideals across much of Europe. This brought fresh >fears to the British monarchy and landowning >classes, who stamped down on and severely >punished any opposition to their authority. > >It was within this atmosphere of unrest that on >the night of 9th June 1817 men from villages on >the Derbyshire-Nottinghamshire border, including >Pentrich, South Wingfield and Alfreton, set out >to march to Nottingham. They believed they were >part of a general rising across the North and >Midlands to bring down the unjust and oppressive >government.  They were met, however, by >military forces, who had known about the >uprising thanks to a network of government >spies, sent all over the country to uncover >rebel plots. The punishment was severe; for >some, such as rebel leader Jeremiah Brandreth, >it meant death, for others transportation to Australia. > >There is, of course, much more to the story so >come along to the record office to delve deeper >into this fascinating aspect of Derbyshire’s >history. We are holding an exhibition featuring >original material from the time which runs from >the beginning of June until the end of September. > >Or why not join us at the Bicentenary >Commemorative Day event being held by the >Pentrich and South Wingfield Revolution Group, >which takes place this Saturday (10th June) at >the Social Club in South Wingfield. We‘ll be >there from 1pm till 5pm with lots of information >on our collections and services, along with some >original archive material taken from our exhibition. > >For more information on the Bicentenary >Commemorative Day see the Pentrich and South >Wingfield Revolution Group’s website ><https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pentrichrevolution.org.uk%2Fevents&data=01%7C01%7CNicholas.Shorthose%40shell.com%7C009d050c1bd74702445308d4ae01999c%7Cdb1e96a8a3da442a930b235cac24cd5c%7C0&sdata=sKhh2rv17ejSA24HepxM%2BbB7ghoszUlZQKrPYy%2FdN8E%3D&reserved=0>https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=www.pentrichrevolution.org.uk%2Fevents&data=01%7C01%7CNicholas.Shorthose%40shell.com%7C009d050c1bd74702445308d4ae01999c%7Cdb1e96a8a3da442a930b235cac24cd5c%7C0&sdata=CCdROeVrdhrOkSgKud1ils5Fe5exhphkhZzcc6j2SPY%3D&reserved=0 ><https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Frecordoffice.wordpress.com%2Fauthor%2Fkarriem%2F&data=01%7C01%7CNicholas.Shorthose%40shell.com%7C009d050c1bd74702445308d4ae01999c%7Cdb1e96a8a3da442a930b235cac24cd5c%7C0&sdata=tCxf0QuorNESq31KO5a3bP34R47Oaf%2FZ0y2TqzFXIdE%3D&reserved=0>Karen, >Archivist | 7 June 2017 at 12:14 pm | >Categories: ><https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Frecordoffice.wordpress.com%2Fcategory%2Fnews%2F&data=01%7C01%7CNicholas.Shorthose%40shell.com%7C009d050c1bd74702445308d4ae01999c%7Cdb1e96a8a3da442a930b235cac24cd5c%7C0&sdata=hPUBgyGtzMgYgSAH7hbt8SV8olSkUJwv7ALBEFrqnVg%3D&reserved=0>News >| URL: <https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwp.me%2Fp1jCye-354&data=01%7C01%7CNicholas.Shorthose%40shell.com%7C009d050c1bd74702445308d4ae01999c%7Cdb1e96a8a3da442a930b235cac24cd5c%7C0&sdata=kktI6YHqQ5D9pNGeYEPjuSvoDuBKD3baGZo1HNSnj4o%3D&reserved=0>https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwp.me%2Fp1jCye-354&data=01%7C01%7CNicholas.Shorthose%40shell.com%7C009d050c1bd74702445308d4ae01999c%7Cdb1e96a8a3da442a930b235cac24cd5c%7C0&sdata=kktI6YHqQ5D9pNGeYEPjuSvoDuBKD3baGZo1HNSnj4o%3D&reserved=0 > ><https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Frecordoffice.wordpress.com%2F2017%2F06%2F07%2Fthe-pentrich-rebellion-bicentenary-commemorations%2F%23respond&data=01%7C01%7CNicholas.Shorthose%40shell.com%7C009d050c1bd74702445308d4ae01999c%7Cdb1e96a8a3da442a930b235cac24cd5c%7C0&sdata=GoakXvUlrP4V6dNMRo91jjSpCDpd7dNnKMQU3oApgII%3D&reserved=0>Comment ><https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Frecordoffice.wordpress.com%2F2017%2F06%2F07%2Fthe-pentrich-rebellion-bicentenary-commemorations%2F%23comments&data=01%7C01%7CNicholas.Shorthose%40shell.com%7C009d050c1bd74702445308d4ae01999c%7Cdb1e96a8a3da442a930b235cac24cd5c%7C0&sdata=sq3PJs4B5rGGUq0HDkbkzyR2Jf5cvCfZrSZ92Q%2F5iIM%3D&reserved=0>See >all comments > ><https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fsubscribe.wordpress.com%2F%3Fkey%3Dbba82ab2519c1b6a78d8a94fa8662ac9%26email%3Dannete%2540aapt.net.au%26b%3DCfuRrr%253F1.7%252BY%255DKA3l%2525h%252Bd_yFbG9cgW5Gjt%257CRrJs-GwFdKRmLz&data=01%7C01%7CNicholas.Shorthose%40shell.com%7C009d050c1bd74702445308d4ae01999c%7Cdb1e96a8a3da442a930b235cac24cd5c%7C0&sdata=KfgI2ervICpyU82zcuTQFXRCYTWDkdpZFNL5xmKByIU%3D&reserved=0>Unsubscribe >to no longer receive posts from Derbyshire >Record Office. 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Nicholas asked the question, *Is any anywhere of academic research on illegitimacy in C18-19s ?* A classic text is Lawrence Stone's *The Family, Sex and Marriage in England 1500-1800* first published in 1977 and still in print (my copy by Penguin in 1990). Also it's available on Kindle. The blurb on the back cover reads, *An analysis of the sexual mores of our ancestors which is often surprising, sometimes diverting, always thought-provokling.* Research based, it gets mixed reviews on Amazon however. But for me it's a great book for dipping into at times like this and is relevant to any county. It contains graphs which people may be interested to see: one is of Illegitimacy Rates and one of Prenuptial Conception Rates between 1600 and 1800. I know that attachments won't appear on Rootsweb. So I've taken the liberty of sending them to everyone named above taken from the lengthy correspondence on the Forum. If you're not one of those and would like copies please let me know. Ruth

Thank you Ruth. very interesting... Not Derbyshire, but I imagine rural areas cannot have been very different. In Warwickshire, there has been a lot of research on marriages ages and illegitimacy rates because of Shakespeare's famously early marriage (he was 18 and his bride 24, and 3 months pregnant). I came across this, which bears out some of the info in Ruth's text that marriages were not made between young people, as a rule. "Another illuminating statistic has been deduced by local historian Jeanne Jones from records curated by the Shakespeare Birthplace Trust. Between 1570 and 1630 the average age for men to marry in Stratford-upon-Avon was 24. In that 60-year period, and out of 106 cases, there were only three men who married under the age of 20. Of those three, Shakespeare was the youngest and the only one whose wife was already pregnant." Margaret On 05/06/2017 13:19, Ruth Genda via DERBYSGEN wrote: Nicholas asked the question, *Is any anywhere of academic research on illegitimacy in C18-19s ?* A classic text is Lawrence Stone's *The Family, Sex and Marriage in England 1500-1800* first published in 1977 and still in print (my copy by Penguin in 1990). Also it's available on Kindle. The blurb on the back cover reads, *An analysis of the sexual mores of our ancestors which is often surprising, sometimes diverting, always thought-provokling.* Research based, it gets mixed reviews on Amazon however. But for me it's a great book for dipping into at times like this and is relevant to any county. It contains graphs which people may be interested to see: one is of Illegitimacy Rates and one of Prenuptial Conception Rates between 1600 and 1800. I know that attachments won't appear on Rootsweb. So I've taken the liberty of sending them to everyone named above taken from the lengthy correspondence on the Forum. If you're not one of those and would like copies please let me know. Ruth ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Fortunately for me Disley Register is quite specific when my GGGGrandfather David WHIT(T)AKER fathered an illegitimate child. Thomas MARSLAND ` an illegitimate child born out of the Canons of Marriage` born 27 Nov 1814 bapt 12 Feb 1815 mother was Maria MARSLAND spinster of Disley & the father was David Whittaker `a Gamekeeper lately resident of Disley but at the time of the child`s baptism in Gloucestershire` An * against Maria`s name leads to a note saying `Declared at the Communion Table` Also states `Proper sponsors produced` This information led to me finding David`s marriage to my ancestor Elizabeth COOK in Cirencester. They eventually returned to Disley. Marjorie Ward Derbyshire, UK Sources for Disley; Lyme Handley; Taxal & Whaley www.disley.net Sources for NWDby incl Chapel; Charlesworth; Chinley; Fernilee; Glossop; Hayfield; Hope Valley; Mellor & New Mills http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~dusk John Ward Paintings: www.johnward-art.com

Hi Bob Unless you know the child Grace was baptised at age +1 or two I am unsure how it answers the question of who the father was, if, like most children she was baptised within weeks of birth, it tells you who the father wasn't ;-) Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) On 05-Jun-17 10:19 AM, BobJ via DERBYSGEN wrote: > In the PR Bapts. of Newington Parish, Oxfordshire, I have -- > > > “Oct 13th 1805 Grace Jennings daughter of Catherine of Brookhampton, whose husband was sentenced to transportation two years ago” > > And - > > “June 5th 1808 Susannah Jennings dau. of Catherine of Brookhampton. See Oct. 13 1805.” > > > Catherine’s husband William Jennings had opted to join the Royal African Corps (of Convicts) as an alternative to being hanged for theft. He died of fever in the West Indies. > > Bob Jennings.

In the PR Bapts. of Newington Parish, Oxfordshire, I have -- “Oct 13th 1805 Grace Jennings daughter of Catherine of Brookhampton, whose husband was sentenced to transportation two years ago” And - “June 5th 1808 Susannah Jennings dau. of Catherine of Brookhampton. See Oct. 13 1805.” Catherine’s husband William Jennings had opted to join the Royal African Corps (of Convicts) as an alternative to being hanged for theft. He died of fever in the West Indies. Bob Jennings.

I have in my family where no father was listed on birth or his marriage certificate, his mother was married at the time of his birth He had her married name but no maiden name given on the birth certificate. Took a while to sort out who the mother really was On the 1891 census he was living with a lady who said he was her grandson, but I have been unable to find a connection. However on the 1901 census he was living with the sister of his mother. I have come to the conclusion that I will never know his real father Jen NSW > On 4 Jun 2017, at 10:30 PM, Nivard Ovington via DERBYSGEN <[email protected]> wrote: > > Like you I have poured over many a parish register, and have seen all varieties from the whimsical to the downright vicious comments in the margin > > But when the father is known, and they are a couple I would say most mention that father, sometimes in both names, others as though they were married already > > But when the father isn't mentioned at all it suggests to me illegitimacy > >> > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hello, As others have pointed out, much has to do with local custom when it comes to parish records, and how much was known about the circumstances. I have quite a number of illegitimate births in my family tree, typically recorded with a ‘reputed child of ‘ or similar phrase. My most amusing case is a great great grandmother; ‘naughty Ellen’ I call her: Married in 1840s, already pregnant, child baptised in local parish church with both parents named, as you would expect - surname Davies Second ‘Davies’ child baptised in the same church 4 yrs later, but only the mother’s name given – this suggests that her husband has disappeared/died, everyone knows that he is not the father (including the Rector) and so no father’s name given. 3 more illegitimate ‘Davies’ children born over the following decade – Heaven knows who fathered them! Child number 6 probably fathered by a man surnamed Morgan Child 7 (my great grandmother) definitely the daughter of this Morgan chap – Ellen audacious enough to go and register the birth presenting herself as ‘Mrs Morgan’ Ellen appears in census in 1851, 61, 71 and 81 and always as a ‘widow’, and until the 1881, with more children than she had in the previous census. So, never appears in a census with a husband. Uses the surname ‘Morgan’ in 1871, but otherwise uses ‘Davies’ . The point is, once she started living in the neighbouring town, rather than her native village, she could get away with the dishonesty. Her older sister had four illegitimate children, but she stayed in the village so her circumstances were generally known, and with one exception, the census enumerator recorded her as ‘Unmarried’. Susan Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Liz via DERBYSGEN Sent: 04 June 2017 09:46 To: 'Derbyshire genealogy' Cc: Liz Subject: Re: [DBY] Baptisms where father isn't named The vicar went off to wet the baby's head and when it came to fill in the details he had forgotten the dad's name!!! It could also be that the husband was dead and the vicar thought the father was a different person in the village/town or the father was absent abroad. Liz -----Original Message----- From: DERBYSGEN [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Joan M via DERBYSGEN Sent: 03 June 2017 15:15 To: 'Derbyshire genealogy' Cc: Joan M Subject: [DBY] Baptisms where father isn't named Hi, Apart from illegitimacy, is there any other reason that the father wouldn't be named? Thanks Joan ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message --- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. http://www.avg.com ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message