BLACK BOXES TRANSCRIBED AND OTHER MATERIAL FROM DAVID PERRIN On pages given me from David Perrin there is a photocopied sheet of entries from the Black Boxes. However, at the top of one of these pages there is a copy taken from The Louisiana Historical Quarterly which reads: DEGUA, Sr. [Lieutenant] 1718-1728. L.H.Q. Vol. 15, #3, Page 462. Listed as passenger leaving France for Louisiana May 28, 1719. Embarked on the vessel, UNION, Commander Mr. Grane [Crane?] ------------------------------------------------------- Following are some of the texts from the sources mentioned above... FROM THE LOUISIANA HISTORICAL QUARTERLY 1932: VOLUME 15, ISSUE 3 PAGE 463: SHIP LISTS OF PASSENGERS LEAVING FRANCE FOR LOUISIANA, 1718-1724 THIRD INSTALLMENT (CONTINUED FROM QUARTERLY, JANUARY 1932) Transcribed from the copies of the originals obtained in France for the Louisiana Historical Society and now in its library in the Cabildo in New Orleans in a bound volume Louisiane. Passagers. 1718-1724. Translated by Albert Laplace Dart of New Orleans 17 ON PAGE 462 [OF THE MANUSCRIPT ITSELF; PAGE 472 OF THE LA HIST QUART THE FOLLOWING NAME APPEARS [IN THE SECTION ENTITLED: 462 The Louisiana Historical Quarterly CONCESSIONNAIRES-Continued Concession du Sr Caze (Concession of Sr. Caze):] Le Sr. Degua, id (ditto) .......... 1 FROM 1932: VOLUME 15, ISSUE 3 PAGE 472 (I the undersigned director of the Company of the West certify the present List real for the number of one hundred and ninety-three persons embarked on the vessel The Union under the commandment of Mr. de la Manceliere Gran6. Done at La Rochelle May 27, 1719. LESTOBEC It is permitted to the aforesaid captain to pass in his vessel The Union the one hundred and ninety-three persons named in the present list on condition that he will observe the ordinances of the King. Done at La Rochelle May 27, 1719.) HURLOT (To be continued) =========================================================

I know that Pierre Verloin Degruy was listed as a veteran of the War of 1812 as his wife, Francoise Azelie Daspit St. Amant, put in for a widow's pension. The listing is at the Louisiana State Archives, at least. Wally -----Original Message----- From: cmj@acsalaska.net [mailto:cmj@acsalaska.net] Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 12:43 PM To: DEGRUY-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Fw: Gulf Coast Colonials entry In 1792, Juan Baptista Degrui, previously a 1st Lieteneant in the German Coast Disciplined Provincial Militia was "breveted" (promoted to) captain of the Militia. This means Jean Baptiste was actually in the Spanish military. I think Antoine Dufouchard was also in teh militia duringthe time of the American revolution - but Louisiana was a French/Spanish colony. I think those men who fought with Galvez, for example, against the Brittish during the revolution are recognized as having participated, even tho they were not art of the Continental Army. Celine ----- Original Message ----- From: "R. Hotard, Degruy List Administrator [Please do not send me anonymous, forwarded, chain emails. Thank you.]" <degruylist@earthlink.net> To: <DEGRUY-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 6:40 PM Subject: Gulf Coast Colonials entry Hi, Now, here's a question for you..... Were any of our Degruys in the Revolutionary War? Why I ask is that I did took a very brief look at Winston deVille's "Louisiana Soldiers in the American Revolution" and didn't see any Degruy names in it......maybe I missed something. Does anyone know if there are any Degruy DAR members????? Renee ============================== Search the US Census Collection. Over 140 million records added in the last 12 months. Largest online collection in the world. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13965/rd.ashx ============================== Find your ancestors in the Birth, Marriage and Death Records. New content added every business day. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13964/rd.ashx

In 1792, Juan Baptista Degrui, previously a 1st Lieteneant in the German Coast Disciplined Provincial Militia was "breveted" (promoted to) captain of the Militia. This means Jean Baptiste was actually in the Spanish military. I think Antoine Dufouchard was also in teh militia duringthe time of the American revolution - but Louisiana was a French/Spanish colony. I think those men who fought with Galvez, for example, against the Brittish during the revolution are recognized as having participated, even tho they were not art of the Continental Army. Celine ----- Original Message ----- From: "R. Hotard, Degruy List Administrator [Please do not send me anonymous, forwarded, chain emails. Thank you.]" <degruylist@earthlink.net> To: <DEGRUY-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 6:40 PM Subject: Gulf Coast Colonials entry Hi, Now, here's a question for you..... Were any of our Degruys in the Revolutionary War? Why I ask is that I did took a very brief look at Winston deVille's "Louisiana Soldiers in the American Revolution" and didn't see any Degruy names in it......maybe I missed something. Does anyone know if there are any Degruy DAR members????? Renee ============================== Search the US Census Collection. Over 140 million records added in the last 12 months. Largest online collection in the world. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13965/rd.ashx

So we meet in New Orleans this year and Paris next? :-) ----- Original Message ----- From: "R. Hotard, Degruy List Administrator [Please do not send me anonymous, forwarded, chain emails. Thank you.]" <degruylist@earthlink.net> Date: Thursday, July 21, 2005 3:09 am Subject: response from Carl Ekberg > Hi All, > I sent the same message about Grandfather Antoine's fate that I > sent to > you to Carl Ekberg and Robert de Berardinis. Got this from Carl > Ekberg > this morning.... and thought you'd enjoy: > > Degruy Gang: > > We know with absolute certainty that soldiers from Fort de > Chartres were > involved in the engagement outside Fort Niagara in July 1759, but > I have > never seen a muster roll of those who went. It surely does make > sense that > this is what happened to Antoine, but it would be nice to pin it > down. Deep > research in the French military archives out at the Château de > Vincennes in > Paris (Métro line #1) might resolve this issue, and there's a good > bistrotright across the street for lunch! > > > Carl Ekberg > > > > > > > ============================== > Census images 1901, 1891, 1881 and 1871, plus so much more. > Ancestry.com's United Kingdom & Ireland Collection. Learn more: > http://www.ancestry.com/s13968/rd.ashx >

At the NOPL today, I checked the listing for DeGruy tombs in Vol. 4 - it is exactly the same information as is in Vol. 22, Issue 86, p.204. Wally -----Original Message----- From: R. Hotard, Degruy List Administrator [Please do not send me anonymous, forwarded, chain emails. Thank you.] [mailto:degruylist@earthlink.net] Sent: Saturday, July 16, 2005 7:29 PM To: DEGRUY-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Genesis articles and Aufrere papers Fabulous information! Thank you, Wally, as always. Re the Aufrere Papers... appreciate the look-up. I have ordered these through Interlibrary Loan... a long time ago and they've never come. I don't even know if they are pertinent to us. If they ever arrive and they seem relevant, I'll let you know immediately. If any of you ever visit the Degruy tombs and find out anything about Pierre Huxelle Degruy and his two wives Julie Evelina Boutte and Marie Cecilia Cunningham [who may have remarried after his death], I'd be so very interested to learn what you discover. My Big Stumbling Blocks... along with the parents of Albert Degruy's wife, Marie Ruth: John Ruth and Pauline Herzog. But I can't imagine how the location of Albert will give information on the Ruths [Roths?] or Herzogs.... so that's probably a dead end, pun intended. I wonder [Celine?] if there is a way on the web site to form links between chunks of information.... in other words, to have a link from the birth record of Henry Degruy > to his death record> to his interment record in Cemetery #2....... Or, if we do a search on Henry, will it pull up all these records and the link will be formed like that???? One of my questions is if you can only search within news or within photos or within files or if the entire web site can be searched at one time. Well, enough for now. My Hurt and Doss lines are calling! Renee slideaus wrote: >The Slidell library has most, but not all of the issues. They are >missing Vol 4 and 12-19. > >I did check on the Vol. 22 items, which are not listed in the indexes of >the individual issues. > >Items in […] below are my personal notes - Wally > >Vol. 22, Issue 85, p. 93: > >INTERMENTS - ST. LOUIS CEMETERY NO. 2 > >Henry DeGRUY, 48 years, died 15 July 1876 [s/o Etienne Bernard DeGruy] >Pierre Denis FOUCHER, 54 years, died 10 November 1877 >Marie Edwige GARIC, 7 months, died 6 August 1878 >Ledia FOUCHER, 4 May 1886 >Marie Idea GARIC, 3 months, 12 June 1887 >G. MAZARAT, 24 years, 29 August 1892 >P. MAZARAT, 2 ½ years, 26 October 1892 >Henry FOUCHER, 39 years, 13 July 1898 >Felide CHARBONNET, 64 years, 20 July 1900 [w/o Etienne Bernard Joseph >DeGruy] >Marie A. BROWN, 55 years, 3 December 1900 [see note below] >Mrs. A. DeGRUY, 61 years, 8 March 1902 >Frank TABONY, 60 years, 23 October, 1906 >Mildrait H. DeGRUY, 33 years, 4 September 1907 >Madame Aida P. PLANCHARD, 25 years, 15 April 1908 >Mrs. Widow J. J. Edgar PLANCHARD (nee Amelia DeGRUY), 19 May 1909 [nee >Marie Antoinette Amelia DeGruy, d/o Etienne Bernard DeGruy & Marie >Azelie Bachemin] >Sidney F. DeGRUY, 49 years, 21 July 1918 >Mrs. L. NUNEZ, 45 years, 22 April 1923 >Mrs. Widow Eugene TABONEY, 67 years, 12 February 1935 >Joseph Daracourt PLANCHARD, 58 years, 14 October 1936 >Josephine R. O. PLANCHARD, 66 years, 9 March 1937 >Mrs. Antoine KERN, 57 years, 30 April 1940 >Fernand DeGRUY, 76 years, 7 November 1948 >George J. MAZARET, 57 years, 23 February 1949 >Inez de GRUI CREED, 88 years, 16 January 1964 > >(The entries are exactly as they appear in Genesis, including spelling >differences.) > > >Vol. 22, Issue 86, p. 204: > >TOMBSTONE INSCRIPTION – ST. LOUIS CEMETERY NO. 2 > >LOUIS A. DeGRUY – ETIENNE DeGRUY >Lot No. 19 – Center Aisle LS. C Sq. 2 > >H. Margaret LAYSSARD [w/o Antoine Dufouchard DeGruy] >Widow of Antoine DeGRUY born 1758 died 5 April 1830 > >Louise Antoine DeGRUY [s/o of Etienne Bernard DeGruy & Marie Azelie >Bachemin] >Born August 25, 1821 – Died 1 November 1836 > >Alphonse DeGRUY [s/o Etienne Bernard DeGruy & Marie Azelie Bachemin] >Died 12 August 1867 > >Etienne Bernard DeGRUY [s/o Antoine Dufouchard DeGruy & H. Margaret >Layssard] >Died 3 October 1867 >And his wife >Marie Azelie BACHEMIN died 7 October 1868 > >Anais DeGRUY >Beloved wife of M. A. BROWN >Died 3 December 1900 – age 55 years > >(NOTE: both tombstones list a 55-year-old woman with the surname Brown >who died on 3 December 1900. This is the same individual – Marie Anaise >DeGruy, d/o Etienne Bernard DeGruy and Marie Azelie Bachemin. She was >born 7 September 1844 and was married to Defauchard Nicholas Brown on 2 >September 1869 in Point Coupee, according to my records.) > >Wally in Slidell > > > ============================== Search the US Census Collection. Over 140 million records added in the last 12 months. Largest online collection in the world. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13965/rd.ashx

I would not worry about copyright problems if there is no mention of a copyright in the title pages at the beginning of the book, even then, there is such a thing as casual use of material and posting of the stuff on our website would meet this criteria since access to it is restricted, only allowed members would be able to see the information. Just give credit, as any good genealogist does, to the source of the information and there should be no problem. I'm not speaking from a professional legal standpoint, but from past practices that I have encountered using copyrighted material. Yes there were copyrights in 1940 and way before that. Best I can remember a copyright was good for 28 years and renewable once for another 28. So if the Society did not renew then they are probably no longer protected anyways. POST IT! -----Original Message----- From: R. Hotard, Degruy List Administrator [Please do not send me anonymous, forwarded, chain emails. Thank you.] [mailto:degruylist@earthlink.net] Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 9:21 PM To: DEGRUY-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: Huguenot fellow is trying to help us with Aufreres Great help with Aufrere... Thanks Wally and Bill. Don't expect that pedigree chart soon. My Huguenot connection says I'll get into copyright problems.... I don't know how I could have known about copyright problems with the Huguenot Society because there is nothing on any of the pages of this book about any copyright notices. The book was published in 1940. Were there copyright laws at that time? If he thinks it will do any good I will write a formal letter requesting the society to allow us to publish just that chart to our private web site.... But it might not work. At the least I can transcribe some of the English commentary.... Will keep you posted. Renee slideaus wrote: >I have a photocopy of a page from the Louisiana Genealogical Register >which has the following information: > >(DEGRUIS) VERLOIN, Joseph, Jr. & Maria Luisa SOLÉ, 19 Sept. 1800, >third degree. (The groom's surname is given as Degruis on the calendar >cards, but is shown under Verloin in the index.) Jose Degruis, age 19, >of Ph. Of St. Charles of the First German Coast, is s/o Maria COUTURIER >and Jose Degruis; s/o Pedro Degruis & Maria OFRE; d/o Mr. Ofre of Paris >& Degruis' grandmother whose name he does not know. Maria Luisa, who >has two sisters and is a native of St. Louis Ph. Of New Orleans, is d/o >of Tomas Solé & Maria Teresa PERY; d/o Mr. Pery & Teresa Ofre; d/o >Degruis’ grandparents. The proposed marriage is with consent of their >parents and was announced publicly a year ago. Witnesses, Joseph >BONNEVILLE, aged 34; Alexandro DILHOMME, aged 22. Granted. > >This appears to be the grant of a dispensation due to consanguinity – >they were 2nd cousins. > >Note that “Mr. Ofre” (Antoine Aufrere) is identified as “of Paris.” > >I will try to track down the specific volume and issue; it is on page >303. > >Wally > >-----Original Message----- >From: Bill Richardson [mailto:wrichardson@dcnet2000.com] >Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 11:33 PM >To: DEGRUY-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: RE: Huguenot fellow is trying to help us with Aufreres > >Sacramental records of Antoine's death does not indicate his origins >but does give his age at 80 at death in Sep 1775. Other citations I >have from census records and colonial record extracts in Louisiana >Historical Quarterly do not indicate origin. I do not have him from >Paris, so I did not run across that city in my limited research. > >If Marie Mathurin was from Quebec she should be easily found in either >Jette or Tanguay volumes on French Canada. I doubt this as this would >have been a bit early for Quebecois to be migrating to La. Something >which did not occur for the most part until after the Seven Years >(French and Indian) War which ended in 1763, which also concided with >the Acadian migration to Louisiana and movement down the Mississippi >after the French loss of their forts and settlements in the war. > > > > ============================== Search Family and Local Histories for stories about your family and the areas they lived. Over 85 million names added in the last 12 months. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13966/rd.ashx

I checked today and I found it in the Louisiana Genealogical Register, Vol. XVIII, No. 4, which came out in December, 1971 – page 303! It is under a continuation of an article titled “Genealogical Data from Records of the Diocese of Louisiana and the Floridas” submitted by Elizabeth Becker Gianelli. The beginning of the article (in the September, 1971 issue) notes that microfilm copies of the original records are at the University of Notre Dame and at the Louisiana State Archives. -----Original Message----- From: Isabel [mailto:gathrightis@sbcglobal.net] Sent: Wednesday, July 06, 2005 9:37 AM To: slideaus Subject: Marriage Dispensation of Jose Degruis and Maria Luisa Sole Hi Wally, The book Marriage Dispensations in the Diocese of Louisiana and the Floridas 1786-1803 by Shirley Chaisson Bourquard has information on this dispensation on page 42, too. Do you have access to that book at the library? it is not worded exactly as what you list, but it serves the same purpose. Thanks for the info, Isabel Marriage Dispensations in the Diocese of Louisiana and the Floridas: 1786-1803 by Shirley Chaisson Bourquard Page 42 September 19, 1800 Jose Degruis, age 19, of St. Charles of the First German Coast requests dispensation to marry Maria Luisa Sole to whom he is related in the third grade. He is the son of Maria Couturier and Jose Degruis, son of Pedro Degruis and Maria Ofre, daughter of Mr. Ofre of Paris and Degruis' grandmother whose name he does not know. Maria Luisa is the daughter of Thomas Sole and Maria Teresa Pery, daughter of Mr. Pery and Teresa Ofre, daughter of Degruis' grandparents. This marriage is with their parents consent and announced publicly a year ago. Witnesses: Joseph Boneville, age 34, (signs Joseph Bonneville) and Alexandro Delhomme who also stated that Maria Luisa is a native of St. Louis Parish, New Orleans. Delhomme is 22 and signs Alexandre Delhomme. Granted. (DEGRUIS) VERLOIN, Joseph, Jr. & Maria Luisa SOLÉ, 19 Sept. 1800, third degree. (The groom's surname is given as Degruis on the calendar cards, but is shown under Verloin in the index.) Jose Degruis, age 19, of Ph. Of St. Charles of the First German Coast, is s/o Maria COUTURIER and Jose Degruis; s/o Pedro Degruis & Maria OFRE; d/o Mr. Ofre of Paris & Degruis' grandmother whose name he does not know. Maria Luisa, who has two sisters and is a native of St. Louis Ph. Of New Orleans, is d/o of Tomas Solé & Maria Teresa PERY; d/o Mr. Pery & Teresa Ofre; d/o Degruis’ grandparents. The proposed marriage is with consent of their parents and was announced publicly a year ago. Witnesses, Joseph BONNEVILLE, aged 34; Alexandro DILHOMME, aged 22. Granted. This appears to be the grant of a dispensation due to consanguinity – they were 2nd cousins. Note that “Mr. Ofre” (Antoine Aufrere) is identified as “of Paris.” I will try to track down the specific volume and issue; it is on page 303. Wally -----Original Message----- From: Bill Richardson [mailto:wrichardson@dcnet2000.com] Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 11:33 PM To: DEGRUY-L@rootsweb.com Subject: RE: Huguenot fellow is trying to help us with Aufreres Sacramental records of Antoine's death does not indicate his origins but does give his age at 80 at death in Sep 1775. Other citations I have from census records and colonial record extracts in Louisiana Historical Quarterly do not indicate origin. I do not have him from Paris, so I did not run across that city in my limited research. If Marie Mathurin was from Quebec she should be easily found in either Jette or Tanguay volumes on French Canada. I doubt this as this would have been a bit early for Quebecois to be migrating to La. Something which did not occur for the most part until after the Seven Years (French and Indian) War which ended in 1763, which also concided with the Acadian migration to Louisiana and movement down the Mississippi after the French loss of their forts and settlements in the war. -----Original Message----- From: R. Hotard, Degruy List Administrator [Please do not send me anonymous, forwarded, chain emails. Thank you.] [mailto:degruylist@earthlink.net] Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 6:42 AM To: DEGRUY-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Huguenot fellow is trying to help us with Aufreres OK.... need some help from you Aufrere researchers.... I'm corresponding with the person from the Huguenot society... He is trying to help me figure out if Antoine Aufrere was the first to come over.... Below is the exchange....Feel free to help out with any part of it. I 'll put an "H" before his words and an "R" before mine since boldface and italics don't show up in Degruy-L postings..... H: Ok, couple of thoughts........ R: "I would love to find out if her father, Antoine François Aufrere, who came over from Paris, was or was not the first Aufrere in America. Also curious as to how he met Marie Mathurine if she was born in Quebec. Of course she could have moved to Louisiana and Antoine met her there." H: What source do you have showing him coming from Paris? The Aufrere family which came to the UK was also Parisienne so there may be a way of establishing a link there. Have you thought about Marie Mathurine being Arcadian? Mathurine is a well known French name and features heavily in Huguenot records - I'd look at Arcadian records which may throw some light on that. R: "Since the first Aufrere that I know of in the US was named Antoine ... is there any chance he was the son of Rev. Israel Anthoine and Sarah Amsincq? Do you have a list of their children and their birth dates????? We have our Antoine's birth date as 1695, but that could be a mistake.... " H: I think that if the Paris link is proved without doubt there is a strong case for your Antoine being related to the UK branch. It could well be that the American Aufrere is a cousin. What is there to suggest that the American Antoine's birth date may be incorrect? Israel Antoine was a Pastor, very devout from a family of pastors, whose sons and daughters became church men or married church men. His date of marriage is absolutely sound so unless you have something to question the American Antoine's birth date I wouldn't entertain that as a possibility. It's more likely that he is the son of a cousin of Israel's, the use of given names in the French church is well understood now and it could be that Israel's father, Antoine, could have been your Antoine's godfather, which was very common, naming god children for the principle godparent was the norm. -------------------------------------------- R: My problem: I don't remember where I got the note that Antoine Aufrere was from Paris and Marie Mathurine Guillemet dit La Lande was from Quebec ... [another note says Paris]. It was quite a while after entering data into my genealogy program that I learned how to enter "sources"... so I have an ongoing job of backtracking to add sources later. Sometimes I remember the sources and sometimes I don't. It might have been from one of the Conrad books - or the Sacramental Records. I used those a lot. But maybe one of you has a source and can tell us quickly..... I know some of you are concentrating on Aufreres.... Ann? Any answers here? I'll report to him what you say. Thanks, Renee ============================== Search the US Census Collection. Over 140 million records added in the last 12 months. Largest online collection in the world. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13965/rd.ashx ============================== Jumpstart your genealogy with OneWorldTree. Search not only for ancestors, but entire generations. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13972/rd.ashx ============================== Jumpstart your genealogy with OneWorldTree. Search not only for ancestors, but entire generations. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13972/rd.ashx

Hi All, I sent the same message about Grandfather Antoine's fate that I sent to you to Carl Ekberg and Robert de Berardinis. Got this from Carl Ekberg this morning.... and thought you'd enjoy: Degruy Gang: We know with absolute certainty that soldiers from Fort de Chartres were involved in the engagement outside Fort Niagara in July 1759, but I have never seen a muster roll of those who went. It surely does make sense that this is what happened to Antoine, but it would be nice to pin it down. Deep research in the French military archives out at the Château de Vincennes in Paris (Métro line #1) might resolve this issue, and there's a good bistrot right across the street for lunch! Carl Ekberg

Great help with Aufrere... Thanks Wally and Bill. Don't expect that pedigree chart soon. My Huguenot connection says I'll get into copyright problems.... I don't know how I could have known about copyright problems with the Huguenot Society because there is nothing on any of the pages of this book about any copyright notices. The book was published in 1940. Were there copyright laws at that time? If he thinks it will do any good I will write a formal letter requesting the society to allow us to publish just that chart to our private web site.... But it might not work. At the least I can transcribe some of the English commentary.... Will keep you posted. Renee slideaus wrote: >I have a photocopy of a page from the Louisiana Genealogical Register >which has the following information: > >(DEGRUIS) VERLOIN, Joseph, Jr. & Maria Luisa SOLÉ, 19 Sept. 1800, third >degree. (The groom's surname is given as Degruis on the calendar cards, >but is shown under Verloin in the index.) Jose Degruis, age 19, of Ph. >Of St. Charles of the First German Coast, is s/o Maria COUTURIER and >Jose Degruis; s/o Pedro Degruis & Maria OFRE; d/o Mr. Ofre of Paris & >Degruis' grandmother whose name he does not know. Maria Luisa, who has >two sisters and is a native of St. Louis Ph. Of New Orleans, is d/o of >Tomas Solé & Maria Teresa PERY; d/o Mr. Pery & Teresa Ofre; d/o >Degruis’ grandparents. The proposed marriage is with consent of their >parents and was announced publicly a year ago. Witnesses, Joseph >BONNEVILLE, aged 34; Alexandro DILHOMME, aged 22. Granted. > >This appears to be the grant of a dispensation due to consanguinity – >they were 2nd cousins. > >Note that “Mr. Ofre” (Antoine Aufrere) is identified as “of Paris.” > >I will try to track down the specific volume and issue; it is on page >303. > >Wally > >-----Original Message----- >From: Bill Richardson [mailto:wrichardson@dcnet2000.com] >Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 11:33 PM >To: DEGRUY-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: RE: Huguenot fellow is trying to help us with Aufreres > >Sacramental records of Antoine's death does not indicate his origins but >does give his age at 80 at death in Sep 1775. Other citations I have >from census records and colonial record extracts in Louisiana Historical >Quarterly do not indicate origin. I do not have him from Paris, so I >did not run across that city in my limited research. > >If Marie Mathurin was from Quebec she should be easily found in either >Jette or Tanguay volumes on French Canada. I doubt this as this would >have been a bit early for Quebecois to be migrating to La. Something >which did not occur for the most part until after the Seven Years >(French and Indian) War which ended in 1763, which also concided with >the Acadian migration to Louisiana and movement down the Mississippi >after the French loss of their forts and settlements in the war. > > > >

I have a photocopy of a page from the Louisiana Genealogical Register which has the following information: (DEGRUIS) VERLOIN, Joseph, Jr. & Maria Luisa SOLÉ, 19 Sept. 1800, third degree. (The groom's surname is given as Degruis on the calendar cards, but is shown under Verloin in the index.) Jose Degruis, age 19, of Ph. Of St. Charles of the First German Coast, is s/o Maria COUTURIER and Jose Degruis; s/o Pedro Degruis & Maria OFRE; d/o Mr. Ofre of Paris & Degruis' grandmother whose name he does not know. Maria Luisa, who has two sisters and is a native of St. Louis Ph. Of New Orleans, is d/o of Tomas Solé & Maria Teresa PERY; d/o Mr. Pery & Teresa Ofre; d/o Degruis’ grandparents. The proposed marriage is with consent of their parents and was announced publicly a year ago. Witnesses, Joseph BONNEVILLE, aged 34; Alexandro DILHOMME, aged 22. Granted. This appears to be the grant of a dispensation due to consanguinity – they were 2nd cousins. Note that “Mr. Ofre” (Antoine Aufrere) is identified as “of Paris.” I will try to track down the specific volume and issue; it is on page 303. Wally -----Original Message----- From: Bill Richardson [mailto:wrichardson@dcnet2000.com] Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 11:33 PM To: DEGRUY-L@rootsweb.com Subject: RE: Huguenot fellow is trying to help us with Aufreres Sacramental records of Antoine's death does not indicate his origins but does give his age at 80 at death in Sep 1775. Other citations I have from census records and colonial record extracts in Louisiana Historical Quarterly do not indicate origin. I do not have him from Paris, so I did not run across that city in my limited research. If Marie Mathurin was from Quebec she should be easily found in either Jette or Tanguay volumes on French Canada. I doubt this as this would have been a bit early for Quebecois to be migrating to La. Something which did not occur for the most part until after the Seven Years (French and Indian) War which ended in 1763, which also concided with the Acadian migration to Louisiana and movement down the Mississippi after the French loss of their forts and settlements in the war. -----Original Message----- From: R. Hotard, Degruy List Administrator [Please do not send me anonymous, forwarded, chain emails. Thank you.] [mailto:degruylist@earthlink.net] Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 6:42 AM To: DEGRUY-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Huguenot fellow is trying to help us with Aufreres OK.... need some help from you Aufrere researchers.... I'm corresponding with the person from the Huguenot society... He is trying to help me figure out if Antoine Aufrere was the first to come over.... Below is the exchange....Feel free to help out with any part of it. I 'll put an "H" before his words and an "R" before mine since boldface and italics don't show up in Degruy-L postings..... H: Ok, couple of thoughts........ R: "I would love to find out if her father, Antoine François Aufrere, who came over from Paris, was or was not the first Aufrere in America. Also curious as to how he met Marie Mathurine if she was born in Quebec. Of course she could have moved to Louisiana and Antoine met her there." H: What source do you have showing him coming from Paris? The Aufrere family which came to the UK was also Parisienne so there may be a way of establishing a link there. Have you thought about Marie Mathurine being Arcadian? Mathurine is a well known French name and features heavily in Huguenot records - I'd look at Arcadian records which may throw some light on that. R: "Since the first Aufrere that I know of in the US was named Antoine ... is there any chance he was the son of Rev. Israel Anthoine and Sarah Amsincq? Do you have a list of their children and their birth dates????? We have our Antoine's birth date as 1695, but that could be a mistake.... " H: I think that if the Paris link is proved without doubt there is a strong case for your Antoine being related to the UK branch. It could well be that the American Aufrere is a cousin. What is there to suggest that the American Antoine's birth date may be incorrect? Israel Antoine was a Pastor, very devout from a family of pastors, whose sons and daughters became church men or married church men. His date of marriage is absolutely sound so unless you have something to question the American Antoine's birth date I wouldn't entertain that as a possibility. It's more likely that he is the son of a cousin of Israel's, the use of given names in the French church is well understood now and it could be that Israel's father, Antoine, could have been your Antoine's godfather, which was very common, naming god children for the principle godparent was the norm. -------------------------------------------- R: My problem: I don't remember where I got the note that Antoine Aufrere was from Paris and Marie Mathurine Guillemet dit La Lande was from Quebec ... [another note says Paris]. It was quite a while after entering data into my genealogy program that I learned how to enter "sources"... so I have an ongoing job of backtracking to add sources later. Sometimes I remember the sources and sometimes I don't. It might have been from one of the Conrad books - or the Sacramental Records. I used those a lot. But maybe one of you has a source and can tell us quickly..... I know some of you are concentrating on Aufreres.... Ann? Any answers here? I'll report to him what you say. Thanks, Renee ============================== Search the US Census Collection. Over 140 million records added in the last 12 months. Largest online collection in the world. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13965/rd.ashx ============================== Jumpstart your genealogy with OneWorldTree. Search not only for ancestors, but entire generations. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13972/rd.ashx

Hi.... Well, lo and behold, my Interlibrary Loan which is usually very sluggish has produced a gem for me in short time: "The Aufrere Papers"! So I have this book in my possession until the end of July. I will copy the English portions but doubt the book could withstand photocopying the entire thing...seeing as it was published in 1940 and is only a couple of years older than I.... Look for a pedigree chart to become available soon on our Degruy web site..... I'm not sure that this Antoine Aufrere is directly connected to us... but the name is fairly rare and so I think it should, at least, be of interest. Renee

Hi, Here's something to keep your imagination busy...... Do you remember my saying that in one of his emails scholar Winston de Ville suggested that 6th or so Great Grandfather, Antoine Degruÿsverloin, might have been one of the soldiers sent to Fort Niagara [And remember that David Perrin has always said that Antoine died in July of 1759 in the French Indian wars]. I thought that an interesting possibility... but how on earth could we ever "prove" it.... are there any records? I've sort of been "working" on that this week.... and I haven't found anything but I did come across this and so I'm passing it along.... with this thought... did he die there? Any chance he could have been taken prisoner and transported somewhere else????? If he died there, would anyone have recorded it? If transported, would anyone have recorded it? I'm wondering if there are any clues in the writings of Sir William Johnson Renee ------------------------------------- Action During the French and Indian War "During the French and Indian War (about 1755-60), Fort Niagara underwent one of the most classic sieges in the military history of North America. In 1755 a large body of regular French troops under the command of Captain Pierre Pouchot arrived at the Fort with orders to transform the post into a defensible position. By the spring of 1756, the Fort was greatly enlarged with new earthworks to supplement the "Castle". For the next two years, the Fort's French garrison supported their Indian allies in their raids against the British colonies as far south as Pennsylvania and Virginia. Early in the summer of 1759, a British army under Brigadier General John Prideaux began moving west from Albany, New York. On July 6th, the British army of some 2,000 regular soldiers and 1,500 Iroquois warriors arrived at the Fort and began to lay siege to the post. For more than two weeks, the six hundred-man French garrison resisted the British efforts. But the British dug trenches toward the walls and placed heavy guns within 100 yards of the Fort and slowly pounded Fort Niagara to pieces. By July 24th, the trenches were only 80 yards from the Fort and the French were near collapse. Finally, after hearing that his "relief column" had been routed in a sharp struggle with the British and Iroquois only a mile from the fort, Captain Pouchot asked for terms of surrender. On July 25th, Fort Niagara became British." ----------------------------------------

Sacramental records of Antoine's death does not indicate his origins but does give his age at 80 at death in Sep 1775. Other citations I have from census records and colonial record extracts in Louisiana Historical Quarterly do not indicate origin. I do not have him from Paris, so I did not run across that city in my limited research. If Marie Mathurin was from Quebec she should be easily found in either Jette or Tanguay volumes on French Canada. I doubt this as this would have been a bit early for Quebecois to be migrating to La. Something which did not occur for the most part until after the Seven Years (French and Indian) War which ended in 1763, which also concided with the Acadian migration to Louisiana and movement down the Mississippi after the French loss of their forts and settlements in the war. -----Original Message----- From: R. Hotard, Degruy List Administrator [Please do not send me anonymous, forwarded, chain emails. Thank you.] [mailto:degruylist@earthlink.net] Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 6:42 AM To: DEGRUY-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Huguenot fellow is trying to help us with Aufreres OK.... need some help from you Aufrere researchers.... I'm corresponding with the person from the Huguenot society... He is trying to help me figure out if Antoine Aufrere was the first to come over.... Below is the exchange....Feel free to help out with any part of it. I 'll put an "H" before his words and an "R" before mine since boldface and italics don't show up in Degruy-L postings..... H: Ok, couple of thoughts........ R: "I would love to find out if her father, Antoine François Aufrere, who came over from Paris, was or was not the first Aufrere in America. Also curious as to how he met Marie Mathurine if she was born in Quebec. Of course she could have moved to Louisiana and Antoine met her there." H: What source do you have showing him coming from Paris? The Aufrere family which came to the UK was also Parisienne so there may be a way of establishing a link there. Have you thought about Marie Mathurine being Arcadian? Mathurine is a well known French name and features heavily in Huguenot records - I'd look at Arcadian records which may throw some light on that. R: "Since the first Aufrere that I know of in the US was named Antoine ... is there any chance he was the son of Rev. Israel Anthoine and Sarah Amsincq? Do you have a list of their children and their birth dates????? We have our Antoine's birth date as 1695, but that could be a mistake.... " H: I think that if the Paris link is proved without doubt there is a strong case for your Antoine being related to the UK branch. It could well be that the American Aufrere is a cousin. What is there to suggest that the American Antoine's birth date may be incorrect? Israel Antoine was a Pastor, very devout from a family of pastors, whose sons and daughters became church men or married church men. His date of marriage is absolutely sound so unless you have something to question the American Antoine's birth date I wouldn't entertain that as a possibility. It's more likely that he is the son of a cousin of Israel's, the use of given names in the French church is well understood now and it could be that Israel's father, Antoine, could have been your Antoine's godfather, which was very common, naming god children for the principle godparent was the norm. -------------------------------------------- R: My problem: I don't remember where I got the note that Antoine Aufrere was from Paris and Marie Mathurine Guillemet dit La Lande was from Quebec ... [another note says Paris]. It was quite a while after entering data into my genealogy program that I learned how to enter "sources"... so I have an ongoing job of backtracking to add sources later. Sometimes I remember the sources and sometimes I don't. It might have been from one of the Conrad books - or the Sacramental Records. I used those a lot. But maybe one of you has a source and can tell us quickly..... I know some of you are concentrating on Aufreres.... Ann? Any answers here? I'll report to him what you say. Thanks, Renee ============================== Search the US Census Collection. Over 140 million records added in the last 12 months. Largest online collection in the world. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13965/rd.ashx

OK.... need some help from you Aufrere researchers.... I'm corresponding with the person from the Huguenot society... He is trying to help me figure out if Antoine Aufrere was the first to come over.... Below is the exchange....Feel free to help out with any part of it. I 'll put an "H" before his words and an "R" before mine since boldface and italics don't show up in Degruy-L postings..... H: Ok, couple of thoughts........ R: "I would love to find out if her father, Antoine François Aufrere, who came over from Paris, was or was not the first Aufrere in America. Also curious as to how he met Marie Mathurine if she was born in Quebec. Of course she could have moved to Louisiana and Antoine met her there." H: What source do you have showing him coming from Paris? The Aufrere family which came to the UK was also Parisienne so there may be a way of establishing a link there. Have you thought about Marie Mathurine being Arcadian? Mathurine is a well known French name and features heavily in Huguenot records - I'd look at Arcadian records which may throw some light on that. R: "Since the first Aufrere that I know of in the US was named Antoine ... is there any chance he was the son of Rev. Israel Anthoine and Sarah Amsincq? Do you have a list of their children and their birth dates????? We have our Antoine's birth date as 1695, but that could be a mistake.... " H: I think that if the Paris link is proved without doubt there is a strong case for your Antoine being related to the UK branch. It could well be that the American Aufrere is a cousin. What is there to suggest that the American Antoine's birth date may be incorrect? Israel Antoine was a Pastor, very devout from a family of pastors, whose sons and daughters became church men or married church men. His date of marriage is absolutely sound so unless you have something to question the American Antoine's birth date I wouldn't entertain that as a possibility. It's more likely that he is the son of a cousin of Israel's, the use of given names in the French church is well understood now and it could be that Israel's father, Antoine, could have been your Antoine's godfather, which was very common, naming god children for the principle godparent was the norm. -------------------------------------------- R: My problem: I don't remember where I got the note that Antoine Aufrere was from Paris and Marie Mathurine Guillemet dit La Lande was from Quebec ... [another note says Paris]. It was quite a while after entering data into my genealogy program that I learned how to enter "sources"... so I have an ongoing job of backtracking to add sources later. Sometimes I remember the sources and sometimes I don't. It might have been from one of the Conrad books - or the Sacramental Records. I used those a lot. But maybe one of you has a source and can tell us quickly..... I know some of you are concentrating on Aufreres.... Ann? Any answers here? I'll report to him what you say. Thanks, Renee

Hi, Offering this for anyone who may not already have it: It is from Gulf Coast Colonials by Winston DeVille: Page 25 "JEAN CARMOUCHE dit LORAIN - Locksmith for the Company. ANNE ALEXANDRE CHENET JEAN BAPTISTE - Baptized 27 May 1727. CLAUDE - Born 5 July 1729. JEAN BAPTIST - Born 21 September 1731. ANNE - Baptized 14 November 1734. [Note: Robert Talon is listed as the children's uncle; Marie Praux, their grandmother.]" Note: pay attention to that Jean Carmouche dit Lorain...Interesting, huh? ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Background: Azelie St. Amand, who was married to Pierre Verloin Degruy, was the daughter of Michael St. Amand and Françoise Zeringue. Michael St. Amand was the son of Pierre Daspit St. Amand and Marianne Carmouche. Marie Anne Carmouche was the daughter of Jean Baptist Carmouche and Anne Alexander Chenet. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Now, here's a question for you..... Were any of our Degruys in the Revolutionary War? Why I ask is that I did took a very brief look at Winston deVille's "Louisiana Soldiers in the American Revolution" and didn't see any Degruy names in it......maybe I missed something. Does anyone know if there are any Degruy DAR members????? Renee

Hi Renee, Thanks for the info on the Aufrere papers. Since I do not speak or read French, I would be of no help in looking over the 240 page collection. I will try to contact the SCGS to see if they have these on microfilm. Since they are available at a California site they appear to have been microfilmed. It shows Aufrere Papers, Edited by the Huguenot Society of London. It has 240 pages, acquisition number 2548. Love to All, Isabel

Hi List, Got the following information from one of the Council Members of the Huguenot Society of Great Britain. It helps us understand what is in the Aufrere Papers. If any of you are really interested in this I suppose I could ask if we could pay him to make photocopies. Only the introduction is in English. The bulk is in French. Let me know. R ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The Aufrere Papers are the family papers of one Rev. Israel Anthoine Aufrere, born Paris in 1667, ordained in The Hague in 1696, moved to England in 1700, where he was naturalized. He then became the Minister of two of the central London Huguenot/French churches and he lived in London until his death aged 90. He was the son of Antoine A (of Paris, escaped to The Hague, 1687, died London 7 Sept 1701) and Antoinette Gervaise. He married Sarah Amsincq (1670-1754) on 18 April 1700. The papers are essentially all his business papers over a period of 70 years, very little on his work as a Pastor though there are 70 pages of letters on his relationship with his family and about his in-laws. You should also know that carrying out an electronic search on the Huguenot records that I have shows 236 hits in 26 different documents or books, though many of those will be records where the Rev Aufrere officiated at baptisms and marriages. There is also an Aufrere pedigree in the Wagner Collection at the Huguenot Library in London though that is not accessible at the moment, nor will it be until at least mid-September, as the Library is closed for the indefinite future to researchers and Huguenot Society fellows alike. There is a reference to Israel Antony A in one of Henry Wagner's published pedigrees which I have in my collection, which shows a link to the Du Moulin family. I have a substantial amount of information on that family if you have any links to them. Hope this helps from 2nd email: The name Aufrere appears in 14 volumes of the Hug Soc of GB's Proceedings, each volume comprising 5 or 6 annual editions. The name also appears once on page 964 of the 1987 Cahiers du Centre de genealogie Francaise, which is published in Paris.

The chart that I use shows Pierre Verloin DeGruy as the son of Joseph Verloin DeGruy and Marianne Couturier. You cannot find his birth record as (I assume) it is one of the records destroyed in the great New Orleans fire in the 1780s. However, you can find information on him in the Sacramental Records which note his parentage. Look in the volume for 1816 and you will see his marriage to Francoise Azelie Daspit St. Amant (his second wife). Subsequent volumes show the baptismal records of their children and the records of the parents and grandparents. Look in the volumes for 1800-1805 and you will find the records of the birth of his children by his first wife, Jeanne Glapion, and the record of her burial in 1805. Both Renee and I are descended from him through his marriage to Francoise Azelie St. Amant, so we have an interest in that part of the DeGruy family. There is a portrait of him in the Cabildo. Wally in Slidell -----Original Message----- From: Bill Richardson [mailto:wrichardson@dcnet2000.com] Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2005 2:25 PM To: DEGRUY-L@rootsweb.com Subject: RE: another poor anonymous female Someone out there help me with some confusion. I keep seeing various Degruy names on the list, especially early ones such as mentioned here and I try to connect to what little information I have and find discrepancies. For instance the Pierre Verloin Degruy mentioned below does not appear in my records, but I do have Julia Delphin as the daughter of Joseph Verloin Degruy. All the records I have encountered have shown his name as such. I have not run into an instance where Pierre is mentioned. For instance Julia's baptismal record from vol 5. of Sacramental Records of the diocese is as noted below: DEGRUY, Julia Delphina (Josef and Mariana Couturier, both of this parish), b. Dec. 17, 1792, bn. Aug. 1, 1792, pgp. Juan Bautista DE GRUY and Maria Theresa AUFRENE, native of Dauphine in France, mgp. Pedro COUTURIER and Francisca DUPONT, s. Juan Bautista LABATUT and Julia DURIEUX, residents of this parish (SLC, B11, 230); Sacramental Records of the Archdiocese of New Orleans, vol.5, 1791-1795, p.105 -----Original Message----- From: cmj@acsalaska.net [mailto:cmj@acsalaska.net] Sent: Monday, June 27, 2005 11:05 PM To: DEGRUY-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: another poor anonymous female She was Julia Delphine Verloin DeGruy, born August 1, 1792. Julia married Jean Phillipe Boutte on 21 May 1812. ----- Original Message ----- From: "R. Hotard, Degruy List Administrator [Please do not send me anonymous, forwarded, chain emails. Thank you.]" <degruylist@earthlink.net> To: <DEGRUY-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2005 5:56 AM Subject: another poor anonymous female > Ok... who can help me with another of these poor anonymous females who > were known only by which males they were married to and which males > they were daughters of ;-) > > We have Mrs Philippe Boute who was the daughter of Pierre Verloin > Degruy. > > Can someone please give this poor woman an identity all her own????? > > Her death date was 8-26-1845 Citation 9 823 > > Thanks! > > Renee > > > > ============================== > New! Family Tree Maker 2005. Build your tree and search for your > ancestors at the same time. Share your tree with family and friends. Learn more: http://landing.ancestry.com/familytreemaker/2005/tour.aspx?sourceid=1459 9 <http://landing.ancestry.com/familytreemaker/2005/tour.aspx?sourceid=145 99&targetid=5429> &targetid=5429 > ============================== New! Family Tree Maker 2005. Build your tree and search for your ancestors at the same time. Share your tree with family and friends. Learn more: http://landing.ancestry.com/familytreemaker/2005/tour.aspx?sourceid=1459 9 <http://landing.ancestry.com/familytreemaker/2005/tour.aspx?sourceid=145 99&targetid=5429> &targetid=5429 ============================== Search the US Census Collection. Over 140 million records added in the last 12 months. Largest online collection in the world. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13965/rd.ashx

Someone out there help me with some confusion. I keep seeing various Degruy names on the list, especially early ones such as mentioned here and I try to connect to what little information I have and find discrepancies. For instance the Pierre Verloin Degruy mentioned below does not appear in my records, but I do have Julia Delphin as the daughter of Joseph Verloin Degruy. All the records I have encountered have shown his name as such. I have not run into an instance where Pierre is mentioned. For instance Julia's baptismal record from vol 5. of Sacramental Records of the diocese is as noted below: DEGRUY, Julia Delphina (Josef and Mariana Couturier, both of this parish), b. Dec. 17, 1792, bn. Aug. 1, 1792, pgp. Juan Bautista DE GRUY and Maria Theresa AUFRENE, native of Dauphine in France, mgp. Pedro COUTURIER and Francisca DUPONT, s. Juan Bautista LABATUT and Julia DURIEUX, residents of this parish (SLC, B11, 230); Sacramental Records of the Archdiocese of New Orleans, vol.5, 1791-1795, p.105 -----Original Message----- From: cmj@acsalaska.net [mailto:cmj@acsalaska.net] Sent: Monday, June 27, 2005 11:05 PM To: DEGRUY-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: another poor anonymous female She was Julia Delphine Verloin DeGruy, born August 1, 1792. Julia married Jean Phillipe Boutte on 21 May 1812. ----- Original Message ----- From: "R. Hotard, Degruy List Administrator [Please do not send me anonymous, forwarded, chain emails. Thank you.]" <degruylist@earthlink.net> To: <DEGRUY-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2005 5:56 AM Subject: another poor anonymous female > Ok... who can help me with another of these poor anonymous females who > were known only by which males they were married to and which males > they were daughters of ;-) > > We have Mrs Philippe Boute who was the daughter of Pierre Verloin > Degruy. > > Can someone please give this poor woman an identity all her own????? > > Her death date was 8-26-1845 Citation 9 823 > > Thanks! > > Renee > > > > ============================== > New! Family Tree Maker 2005. Build your tree and search for your > ancestors at the same time. Share your tree with family and friends. Learn more: http://landing.ancestry.com/familytreemaker/2005/tour.aspx?sourceid=1459 9 <http://landing.ancestry.com/familytreemaker/2005/tour.aspx?sourceid=145 99&targetid=5429> &targetid=5429 > ============================== New! Family Tree Maker 2005. Build your tree and search for your ancestors at the same time. Share your tree with family and friends. Learn more: http://landing.ancestry.com/familytreemaker/2005/tour.aspx?sourceid=1459 9 <http://landing.ancestry.com/familytreemaker/2005/tour.aspx?sourceid=145 99&targetid=5429> &targetid=5429

Along this line, there supposedly was a tradition that children were brought back to the church of their maternal grandmother for baptism in Louisiana. Don't know how true this is but I have seen a couple of cases where this could have been the case. And what Fr. Belsome says below is what happened in the case of the two Degruy females marrying the two Boutte men. The marriage record is recorded at St. Martinville, 13 Jul 1778, but based upon the land grant records the Degruy family lived at Fausse Point, a good distance away. It was known that the priest at St. Martinville ministered as far away as Natchitoches and Pointe Coupee (Fausse Point). The Degruy/Boutte marriages are not even fully cited by the priest, the late Fr. Donald Hebert had the following citation in Southwest Louisiana Records-Vol.1A. P.230 "DEGRUIS, two sisters m. 13 Jul 1778 BOUTET, two brothers. Fr. Louis MARIE, Cure of Opelousas (SM Ch.: Folio B-1, Marriages and SM Church v.1p.59)" So here we have a priest assigned to Opelousas, performing a marriage probably in the Pointe Coupee area and recording the event in St. Martinville church records. No wonder the names were not entered he had probably forgetten them by the time he recorded the event. We are able to determine who the four were by later birth records from these two marriages. I have the revised versions of Fr. Hebert's SWLR, which covers from 1750 to 1825 or so)...several Degruy entries besides one mentioned. Don't know if the information contained has been posted on web site. Will do any other type lookup for those interested. -----Original Message----- From: GaryB0612@aol.com [mailto:GaryB0612@aol.com] Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 1:43 PM To: DEGRUY-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: wow... The Dutch Connection..... & births and marriages of Degruy childr... Hi, Gary Belsome here. A new member of the group. And to be honest up front, a Roman Catholic priest. I mention this because of the awareness that brings me concerning the birth place and baptism place of our ancestors. In the early days of the Louisiana, Arkansas and Illinois settlements, Catholic prists traveled great distances to provide ceremonies for Catholic settlers. In other cases, families traveled to the mother church, St. Louis in New Orleans for example, and may have had several sacraments celebrated on the same day. For instance, in the Pizani family I have ancestors who were married, and stood as the godparents for two babies being baptized on the same day at St. Louis although they may have lived in Barataria. Point being, it was possible to be both a native of Islas Negras and have a baptism recorded at St. Louis in New Orleans, or to be born at Kaskaskia and have a baptism recorded at the Little Red Church in St. Charles. It also meant that multiple family sacramental celebrations were celebrated on the same day. The lesson for me has been to not make assumptions concerning the place of birth based on the place where the baptism is recorded. A person born at Kaskaskia may have been baptized at the Arkansas settlement by a traveling priest from New Orleans who recorded the baptism at St. Louis. I hope this doesn't muddy the waters too much, but were are on the Mississippi. Gary Belsome ============================== Find your ancestors in the Birth, Marriage and Death Records. New content added every business day. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13964/rd.ashx