Hi, everybody. The post regarding evidence was very good. For the newer genealogists among us I'd like to add something. Please bear in mind that not all vital records are primary evidence of all vital events. For example, a death certificate is primary evidence of a death. It is secondary evidence for all other events and is only indirect proof that the person was born and/or married even if the person's spouse provided the information on the death certificate. A birth certificate is primary evidence of both a person's birth and that person's parentage. A marriage certificate is primary evidence that two people got married. As an example, please do not think that because a death certificate was issued in the name of John Smith that Mr. Smith was either born or married under that name. You may find that he was born as George John Smith and was married as George Smith. These are the fun sort of things that keep genealogists going -- and talking to themselves. :-) Tom Duda lves. :-) Tom Duda

Ginger: Your note reminds me of some of my delimas. In one of them, my mother-in-law, stated that she was born in Comanche, OK. When she is 5 months old I find her in the Bridgeport, TX census, one of her parents (or whomever spoke to the census taker) states she was born in TX. 60 years later, her delayed birth certificate, signed by her mother stated Comanche, OK as her birthplace. Now, they did relocate soon after her birth to Comanche, OK, she was probably 6-7 months old. So, was she really born in TX and it "seemed to her" as if she had always been at Comance, OK, so it was where she thought she was born and perhaps filled out the papers for her delayed certificate, and her mother thought "what the heck" and signed them.....or was she born on a visit to Comanche, OK and after her birth returned to Bridgeport, TX ? I will not bore you with the others, but it can be quite frustrating at times. If you have an opinion, please send it.<G> Carla

Dear Judy, E-mail me. I have a few Tyrell County items to attach for you. Carol

I need some help here also. My Davenport was James Madison Davenport b1742 who married Elizabeth Gilliam and I am confused about who were his parents. I thought it was Joseph but after some more in-depth reading of the Newberry Davenports it looks like they were Francis s/o Issac. Any one who can help me I'll be appreciative. Thanks Ann Fitzpatrick Graham address thifol26@softdisk.com -----Original Message----- From: Yogagolf@aol.com <Yogagolf@aol.com> To: DAVENPORT-L@rootsweb.com <DAVENPORT-L@rootsweb.com> Date: Thursday, June 10, 1999 10:16 PM Subject: [DAVENPORT-L] "To the other Ellen: re Newberry Davenports >In a message dated 06/10/1999 7:30:24 PM Pacific Daylight Time, >Wellann2@aol.com writes: > ><< > I found what Betty had sent me and her notes were about the Newberrys. Her > family was in Greenville. When I found her several years ago she was that > Davenport family Historian. > Posting is a good idea. > Sorry I could not help you, > The other Ellen not Venable. > >> > >To: The "other Ellen not Venable" - could you post the information about the >Newberry's? I am certain that all of us would appreciate it if it is >possible. Thanks, Adrienne - a Newberry (Sarah Davenport <1764-1843>, d/o of >Francis, who married Samuel Beeks/Beakes <1752-1814>) > > >==== DAVENPORT Mailing List ==== >Visit our Genealogy Page at >http://users.intercomm.com/nvjack/davnport/davnport.htm > >

In a message dated 6/10/99 10:48:46 PM US Mountain Standard Time, tomwduda@home.com writes: << only indirect proof that the person was born >> Tom, Hmmmmmm not to get nitpicky here.... but if you have a cooling body... you can be pretty sure they were born..... might not know where... but its a pretty good guess they existed <g> But even other primary sources can be incorrect. My father's birth certificate was filled out by his grandmother (it's my understanding) and she states that my grandmother was born in Alabama, but the lady in question has always said she was born in Georgia. She has no birth certificate on record in Georgia and so I have yet to prove that, but I'll be working on that this weekend. Unfortunately, she was born in 1922, so census work is out of the question, but both parents died apparently within a couple of months of each other leaving her and her sister parentless, so I'll be looking through newspaper films this Saturday to try to find information. (Interestingly enough, my father's initial SS card was issued in his stepfather's last name, and was changed when he was about 17). Another question is my grandfather's SSN application -- it lists his birthday a year earlier than my grandmother, great aunt and great grandmother's bible... of course, everyone says he was born in Tennessee and yet his application says he was born in Alabama... so it never hurts to get verifying information. Just my .02 worth, Ginger

My Davenport ancestors are from Greenville, SC. My great grandfather was John Davenport (12/21/1842-8/1/1926) married to Elizabeth Riddle (5/8/1853-11/17/1920). His father was Willis Davenport - no dates, no further inforamtion. They had 8 children that I know of: James Allen Davenport (1875), Dora Davenport (1878), Corrie Davenport (1880) (my grandmother), Mattie Davenport (1882), John Benson Davenport (1885), Estelle Elizabeth Davenport (1892), Edward Poole Davenport (1894), and Henrietta Davenport. I can trace all/many to the present, but not back futher than Willis, my great grandfather. Any help would be appreciated. Sandra Spillers Davis -----Original Message----- From: Jenny Edwards <JLTEDWARDS@compuserve.com> To: DAVENPORT-L@rootsweb.com <DAVENPORT-L@rootsweb.com> Date: Thursday, June 10, 1999 1:48 PM Subject: [DAVENPORT-L] Lucy >Ellen Poteet, > >Were there other Davenports that went to Spartanburg with Lucy and Joseph >Ven.? My last link is in Greenville Co., right next door. > >Jenny > > >==== DAVENPORT Mailing List ==== >View the Cousins Directory at http://users.intercomm.com/nvjack/davnport/others.htm >

i'll post the papers Betty sent me tomorrow. Ellen in Idaho

I will post what Betty sent me tomorrow. The other Ellen who is Ellen in Idaho

In a message dated 06/10/1999 7:30:24 PM Pacific Daylight Time, Wellann2@aol.com writes: << I found what Betty had sent me and her notes were about the Newberrys. Her family was in Greenville. When I found her several years ago she was that Davenport family Historian. Posting is a good idea. Sorry I could not help you, The other Ellen not Venable. >> To: The "other Ellen not Venable" - could you post the information about the Newberry's? I am certain that all of us would appreciate it if it is possible. Thanks, Adrienne - a Newberry (Sarah Davenport <1764-1843>, d/o of Francis, who married Samuel Beeks/Beakes <1752-1814>)

Jenny, I found what Betty had sent me and her notes were about the Newberrys. Her family was in Greenville. When I found her several years ago she was that Davenport family Historian. Posting is a good idea. Sorry I could not help you, The other Ellen not Venable.

Roy Davenport is looking for a Willis. Your material is great. a Betty Davenport in Greenville sent me a whole bunch of names from that family. I am afraid I did not keep them, but will look for them. The other Ellen

Thanks . We needed that. Ellen

Jersey Doc has left the building. He unsubscribed from DAVENPORT-L earlier this afternoon. Please do not discuss this fact on the list. Nevada Jack nvjack@intercomm.com

To RHilands: Thanks for the documentation notes, they're very helpful. I printed them and will keep them in my research notebooks. MargoBelle

This was on HALL List. Passing it on to other lists. Very helpful. ========================================= EVIDENCE FOR PROOF Evidence is the means of proving or disproving a fact. There are five types of evidence: 1. PRIMARY: Primary evidence is that from a record when the record itself is the cause or result of the action or fact to be proved. Examples are: Vital records, Wills, Church Records, Tombstones etc., This is the best evidence. 2. COLLATERAL: Collateral evidence is when it is collateral to the purpose of the records but never the less an integral part of the record: Example: If a man speaks of his daughter by her married name, it signifies a marriage when no marriage record can be found. 3. SECONDARY: Evidence consists of statements made by persons of facts they know of their own knowledge: Examples: Oaths, Old Letters, Depositions. 4. CIRCUMSTANTIAL: If two or more facts are so related, that if one which can be proved by a higher type of evidence is true. When the other is necessarily, true. Example: Record shows a daughter of a man and later he marries someone, it shows he was married before and had at least one daughter. 5. REPORTED: Rumor, Hearsay, County Histories, and Many Biographies. These are the least trustworthy but good for clues. SOURCES OF GENEALOGICAL MATERIALS 1. PRIVATE: Family Bibles, Ledgers, Diaries, Photograph Albums, Samplers, Old Silver, Fly Leaves of old Books, Old Letters, Old Wills, Diplomas, Citations, Discharge Papers, School Records, Insurance Claims, Baby Books, Grandmother Bracelets, Etc. 2. PUBLIC: Census, Pension, Military, Land Tax, Deeds, Laws, Church Records, Court, Probate, Vital Records, Mortality, Immigration, Naturalization, Obituary Notices, Cemetery Records and Tombstones, Register of Voters, Maps, and Plat Books. City Directories and Telephone Books. 3. COMPILED: Printed Genealogies, County & Local Histories, Periodicals, Compiled Tax Lists, Cemetery, Etc., Newspapers - Articles, Brand Books. ===========================================================

Enjoyed your letter, but I have been a Davenport for nearly 85 years, and all that I have known were stubborn. But that doesn't mean nasty. Regards, Dean Steward -----Original Message----- From: Robert D. Brooke <rdb18@csufresno.edu> To: DAVENPORT-L@rootsweb.com <DAVENPORT-L@rootsweb.com> Date: Wednesday, June 09, 1999 9:32 PM Subject: Re: [DAVENPORT-L] NO MORE FLAMES! >Good post. Strong, but tactful and not without some touch of humor. >I especially liked your message to our newbies. > >Good show. Now I just hope you won't have to unsub a stubborn in-law. >It would have to be an in-law, right? True Davenports can't be >stubborn!!! > >bgbob. > >"Jack W. Ralph" wrote: >> >> OK folks, enough is enough! I cannot allow this "flame war" to continue >> and I insist that you cease and desist. I am being swamped with private >> complaints and several people have already unsubscribed from the list >> because of it. None of you are "right" or "wrong" regarding your >> opinion, but each of you who posted one were "wrong" to do it publicly, >> and not privately. The sad thing is that all of your messages are >> stored in the RootsWeb Archives, and can be viewed by the entire world, >> now and forever, including our descendants. You wouldn't want a great >> great grandchild to find it and add it to their database, would you? >> >> As a dear friend and fellow listmember wrote me last night: >> "Genealogy is what Davenport-L is all about, not about personalities. >> And a moment's reflection will tell us that the ancestors we are so >> eagerly seeking had varying personalities. If Davis Davenport should >> emerge as a curmudgeon with a spirit of humanity akin to Ebenezer >> Scrooge, we would note it and move on without clogging the list for days >> on end with issues that have nothing to do with genealogy." >> >> What will happen if this "war" continues? I'm not sure, but I don't >> like my choices. For one thing, I could turn this into a "moderated >> list", which means that I would receive all messages first, review them >> for appropriateness, and then either reject them or release them to the >> rest of you. The bad thing, besides being a lot more work for me, is >> that none of you would receive any messages on this list until after I >> got home from work (sometimes very late), and occasionally none for >> several days if I am out of town. I don't think you guys would like >> that. My other choice is to unsubscribe any offenders and put them on >> the "reject list". This would not make me happy, but I will do it if >> necessary to maintain peace on this list. Remember, at least half of >> the members of this list don't know, or care, what you are complaining >> about. Plus, new people join this list every day and it must be very >> confusing and disconcerting for them to walk into the middle of a "war". >> >> To our newest members: This is the first time that we have had a flame >> war since the list was created, and hopefully the last time. We are >> normally a peaceful and generous group. I *know* that we will return to >> that norm (or heads will roll :-) Please stay with us. >> >> DAVENPORT-L doesn't need a "Golden Rule", but perhaps we could use a >> "Prime Directive". If you have an opinion about the correctness of >> someone's data, and you have documentation to back it up, please share >> it with all of us. If you have an opinion about someone's personality, >> tell them "face-to-face", privately, and not in front of the entire >> group. >> >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >> Jack W. Ralph, AKA Nevada Jack of Carson City >> Proud RootsWeb Donor >> Owner of BEEDE-L, DAVENPORT-L & PHILBRICK-L >> Visit Nevada Jack's Place at: http://users.intercomm.com/nvjack >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >> Currently Researching: >> BEEDE / BEEDY, PHILBRICK / PHILBROOK & DAVENPORT >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >> >> ==== DAVENPORT Mailing List ==== >> Visit our Genealogy Page at >> http://users.intercomm.com/nvjack/davnport/davnport.htm > > >==== DAVENPORT Mailing List ==== >Concerned about computer viruses, cookies, copyright, spam? >See Internet Stuff You Need To Know at >http://www.cyndislist.com/internet.htm > > >

Ellen Poteet, Were there other Davenports that went to Spartanburg with Lucy and Joseph Ven.? My last link is in Greenville Co., right next door. Jenny

Seek info on father of Wm Davenport, b.1755,d.1847 Pitt/Kinston,NC. Children - 7. Allen, b.1807,d.1895 Stewart Cty, GA. My grandfather was Wm Allen Sr, b.1858, d.1950 Phenix City, AL. My father was youngest son, Samuel T Davenport, b. 1913 GA, d.1993 Columbus, GA. Help appreciated to me, Judy Davenport Davis (gjdavis.cybrtyme.com)

Hi Judy! My name is Sandy Lunsford and my grandfather was Stephen Franklin Davenport of Stewart County Georgia. His father was George Manual Davenport. George Manual was an older brother of your William Allen Davenport, Sr b. Oct. 18, 1858 in Louvale, Stewart Co., GA Apparently you are stuck on William Davenport of Pitt Co., NC also. I have info on his children and have found a cousin who still lives in Lenoir Co., NC near the old home place. Also have a copy of William application for pension as a Revolutionary Soldier. Will be more than happy to share what I have. On the other hand you may have more information than I do...Do you share? <grin> Looking forward to hearing from you. In fact I think we met at the Davenport Reunion last summer, did we not? Anyway, please let me hear from you soon. Your cousin, Sandy

Please do not exclude me too. Ruth