Jack, I have some real privacy issues with what is going on at MyFamily, which is the umbrella company which controls all of this. MyFamily is not a public corporation but a privately held corporation in which the major stockholders are not known but we both know who really owns it. This privately held corporation is in the process of linking all of the information about our ancestors (and us) into one gigantic database that they and they alone control and are able to sell access to. They started realizing about 15 or so years ago that they were sitting on a gold mine of information about our ancestors, even if some of it was wrong. All of this is nothing more than a 21st Century extension of what they have been doing for the past 150 years -- tracing the ancestry of each and every member of their body. Now, they cannot only trace their bunch but yours and mine, as well. I have nothing against any corporation providing this genealogical service, far from it. However, that corporation better be a public corporation, so we know who to go after should they become abusive in their pursuits. With this corporation, you do not have that capability. Also, when that corporation is nothing more than an extension of a religious body, I have real problems with them. As I told a friend, previously, in 49 out of 50 states we have a definite separation of church and state but in UT there is no separation of church and state, because the church is the state. Do you have any idea the uproar that would be heard across this land if all of our genealogical records were under the control of, let's say, the Catholic Church? Or, even the Methodist or Baptist Churches. People would be screaming to the high heaven. I think the last time something like this happened we called it the Reformation. This is not just a matter of us searching for our ancestors. This is about someone's use of our personal family information, much of which we have provided, unknowingly, by a corporation controlled by a single religious body whose sole intent in this pursuit is to make money off of this information. Do you think they have limits to whom they will sell this information? Not likely.... They will sell it to you, to insurance companies who may be considering selling you an insurance policy, to employers who may be considering hiring you or anyone else who is able to throw a buck or two on the table. As we both know, acorns do not fall very far very far from the tree and what happened to your ancestors during their lives will probably be what happens to you. Knowing this information about you, beforehand, can save these companies big bucks down the road and simplify personnel choices. We may have privacy statues covering information about you that can be released about you by the federal and state governments but there are no regulations governing what can be released to others about you by this privately held company. We live in an "Information Age" where information about you or me is not only knowledge but money. I am not so much worried about what they will do with this information but what others will do with this information. I think in our single minded, blind pursuit of our ancestors we have unknowingly created a monster that will come back to bite us in the rear end. John R. Clarke Thomasville, GA ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jack V Butler" <JackVButler@comcast.net> To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, May 04, 2004 10:07 PM Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Ancestry.com charging for One World Tree > One entity controlling all of the genealogical information? Are you > tripping, John? The information is still out there, in the State > Archives, > the Courthouses, in the Churches, the City Halls. Believe me, I have gone > and found it there. Been to the National Archives, too. All of that cost > me a whole lot of money in travel, lodging and meals on the road - and > most > of it was fishing trips, going to where I THOUGHT that I might find my > ancestors records. > > Now, I pay a little money and sit in the convenience of my own home, in a > comfortable chair, with my shoes off, while I look at scans of original > census records at 10:00 p.m. at night. In short, I pay for the > convenience > of easy multiple searches and of ease of delivery. I don't HAVE to go to > these sources, I could go back and do it the old way - indeed, I often do. > But now I almost always have much better leads when I go to a courthouse > because I have often found a transcript or original record to point me in > the right direction. > > Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against free resources - I have > volunteered to digitize records for several county sites and will probably > do so again. But I certainly don't begrudge the fees that I pay to the > folks who went to the trouble to collect into a single location large > quantities of the kind of records that I want to see. > > Nobody is forced to use the subscription services - but I cannot imagine > why > they wouldn't. > > Jack Butler > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "John R. Clarke" <jclarke@rose.net> > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Tuesday, May 04, 2004 9:46 PM > Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Ancestry.com charging for One World Tree > > >> Bill, >> I am sorry but I have always felt that genealogical information > belongs >> to the families involved and not some commercial entity. I do not think > you >> have ever seen this old boy recommend resorting to a professional >> genealogist, have you? >> Maybe it takes me a little longer than by paying some person to do > this >> work for me but the "thrill of the chase" is as important as the end > results >> of that chase. Plus, I have made lots of friends in the process, persons >> that I never would have known, otherwise. >> As for the LDS Church owning most of everything as relates to the >> genealogical records of this nation, I have real problems with that and > not >> just because of privacy issues, either. Employers, insurance companies, >> etc.do not have to have your medical records, they can get a lot of >> information about you and your family strictly from the history of your >> family, e.g. their typical life spans, their cause of death, etc. > Normally, >> this information is pretty well protected because these entities do not > know >> your family history but put it all in one location and watch out. Let > them >> get a hold of your DNA information and really watch out. >> Here we have a tax exempt organization, the LDS Church, using tax > exempt >> NPO's, like Rootsweb and probably Ancestry, to increase their overall > wealth >> through commercialization and not having to pay corporate taxes on any of >> it. Now, do you understand why members of this church are the richest >> of >> any organized religion in this country -- they use our tax laws to their >> benefit. I guess you could say, they are also a whole lot smarter than > the >> rest of us in this regard. >> I did not know they were in the gaming and casino business until I >> was >> in Las Vegas covering the Shot Show for my publication a few years ago >> and >> read in their local paper an investigative report done one of their staff >> writers on this matter. It really surprised me, too, because I never >> associated any organized religion with this type of business. I also > assume >> you know they also own Novell and Word Perfect, or did at one time. >> In this country we have laws to protect each of our individual > religious >> beliefs or even to protect us from religion if you believe some, but to > have >> one specific religious body controlling all of the genealogical > information >> of this country, I find appalling. I also feel that government will > sooner >> or later step in because of the privacy issues involved. >> It is one thing to be a repository of historical facts, as they are > and >> have been, but it is quite another to be able to tie all of these > historical >> facts, together, as we easily do for them. When you put "historical > facts" >> and the links that tie them to specific families, as is the case with any >> GEDCOMS you submit to them, and put all of this under a religious > umbrella, >> then you have created the situation where your family information can be >> sold to other parties, parties you never intended to have that family >> information....... >> >> John R. Clarke >> Thomasville, GA >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Bill Brewer" <wwb@ix.netcom.com> >> To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> >> Sent: Tuesday, May 04, 2004 8:37 PM >> Subject: [DANIEL-L] Ancestry.com charging for One World Tree >> >> >> > This whole discussion is getting a little silly. Yes, Ancestry.com >> > collects information, which they then turn around and sell. What do >> > you >> > expect? Do you think any company, or anyone else for that matter, >> > would >> > do your research for you for free? What do you think professional >> > genealogists have been doing for years? They have been collecting >> > information and selling it to you. >> > >> > Personally, I have submitted my information to World Connects. I sent > it >> > prior to Ancestry taking over Rootsweb, but I have continued to update > it >> > since, and will continue to do so. I have benefited immensely by so > doing >> > in that mistakes have been corrected, and I have found many new friends >> > and relatives researching the same line. My research has expanded by >> > leaps and bounds. >> > >> > While we're on the subject, have you ever wondered why Ancestry took > over >> > Rootsweb? We, the genealogical public, never supported Rootsweb > strongly >> > enough for it to survive as a non-profit organization. It depended on > our >> > contributions, both money and data. I contributed both, but not enough > of >> > us supported them monetarily. >> > >> > As to Ancestry having no competitors...What about GenCircles, Family > Tree >> > Maker, GenServe, National Genealogical Society, etc., etc.? There are >> > many sources out there, Ancestry is just one, and they have never >> > forced >> > anyone to contribute to their data bases. If you don't want to share > your >> > "hard-earned data" with them, don't. I have and will continue to do >> > so. >> > We'll see who benefits the most in the long run. >> > >> > Finally, no, I didn't know the owners of Ancestry were the biggest > owners >> > of gambling enterprises on the strip in Las Vegas, and now that I have >> > been told, my next question is...so what? What does that have to do > with >> > anything? >> > >> > Do we really want to go back to the "good old days," where we each had > to >> > travel to the countless archives scattered around the country (not to >> > mention the world)? In my humble opinion, the answer is a resounding >> > "NO!" >> > >> > Bill >> > >> > >> > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== >> > Going on Vacation for longer than 5 days? Please unsubscribe >> > Click on the following link and your message is ready to send >> > Mail Mode: >> > mailto:DANIEL-L-request@rootsweb.com?subject=unsubscribe >> > or- >> > Digest Mode: >> > mailto:DANIEL-D-request@rootsweb.com?subject=unsubscribe >> > >> > >> >> >> >> ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== >> Going on Vacation for longer than 5 days? 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