Drury Daniel is named as a son of William Daniel in this will abstract. Will of William Daniel, dated 6 Feb 1796, proved at Feb Court 1800 ; daughter Winnie Sexton (?) 5 shillings besides what she has already received from my estate. Daughter Ritter Saxon, Elizabeth Daniel and Patty Daniel 1 negro etc each. Son-in-law Calip Crief and son Lewis Daniel 5 shillings each. Daughter Frances Knight 5 shillings and 1 negro etc and at her decease the said Negro and her increase to be divided between the said Frances children. Son Archibald Daniel land and plantation whereon he now lives and 1 negro. Sons William Daniel and Drury Daniel manor plantation and land thereto belonging and one tract in Granville and Negroes when both arrive at lawful age; grandson Arthur Crief 1 negro; grandson John Massey £25. Wit: William Daniel; Willie Daniel; Allen Daniel; Thomas Crawford. Extrs: my sons Willie and Archibald. Jack Butler ----- Original Message ----- From: <JetPilotUSAF100@cs.com> To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, December 22, 2003 7:13 PM Subject: [DANIEL-L] Someone asked about Drewry DANIEL > GENERATIONS ~ [Catch the Drewry DANIEL at Number Eight] > > 1. Robert COLEMAN, bc: 1620, + Elizabeth GRIZZEL Mott > Deed dated 02 AUG 1658: Francis CARPENTER conveyed a tract of land in > Westmoreland County to Robert COLEMAN of Mobjack Bay, Gloucester County, VA [Deed > and Will Book 1, pg 103, Westmoreland County Records] > NOTE: Their son, Robert, bc: 1652, married Anne SPILSBY ~ See note below. > > > 2. Thomas COLEMAN, bc: 1655, VA + and Rebecca UNKNOWN > > > 3. John COLEMAN, b: 1699, Hanover, Goochland, VA + Grace UNKNOWN > > > 4. Richard COLEMAN, b: 1722, VA ~ d: 1791 Rutherford County, NC + Johanna > CLARK > > > 5. Elizabeth COLEMAN + John CLAYTON Sr. [NOTE: Child 4 and 5, were right > there in NC in the middle of my NJ Quakers ~ also where there were DANIELs and > STOCKTONs, of which one Stockton family went on to Tennessee with some in this > same family on to Missouri] > > > 6. Soloman CLAYTON SR. + Francis CARVER in Person County, NC > > > 7. Simeon Thomas CLAYTON + Mary PAINTER Brown > > > 8. Frances S. CLAYTON, bc: 1842 ~ Married (1) Calvin McKISSACK ~ Married (2) > DREWRY DANIEL > > ```````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````` > > 1810 Census Halifax County, North Carolina ~ Roll 38, Book 1, pg 123 > Drewry DANIEL 1 (under 5) ~ ~ 1 (15/20) ~ 1 (30/40) ~ 1 (50/60) ~ (60/70) ~ > (70/80) > > 1830 Census Halifax County, North Carolina, Roll 121, Bk 1, pg 290a > Drewry DANIEL, age 40 to 50 years, pg 290a ~ on pg 290b males & females > listed in numbers, but no name on this "b" page to correspond back to the name for > that line. grrr... > Leonard DANIEL lived down the road, age 30 to 40, pg 290a > Margaret DANIEL, pg 291a ~ and next to her is a James McDANIEL ... hmmm > Isham DANIEL, pg 296a ~ unreadable > EdWARD DANIEL, pg 297a ~ unreadable > Walton [?] DANIEL, pg 297a > Wincey DANIEL, next door > skip a name [Willie Manley] > skip a name [Hartwell Hathcock] > Isham DANIEL, pg 297a > Robert B. DANIEL, pg 310a = 1 (under 5) 1 (5/10) 2 (10/15) 1 (15/20) ~ ~ 1 > (40/50); females 1 (10/15) and 1 (30/40) > Above [from first page] to page 315a. > `````````````````````````````````````````````````````` > 1830 Census Fayette County, Tennessee, Roll 176, BK 1 pg 44a > Drewry DANIEL, 1 (age 20/30) 1 female (under 5) and 1 female (20/30) > ```````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````` `` > ``````````````````````` > > BACK TO THE COLEMANs in the GENERATIONS above. > Child of Robert COLEMAN and Anne SPILSBY: > Spilsbe COLEMAN, Spotsylvania County, VA. ~ d: 23 MAR 1757 ~ WILL ~ Witness > Wm. DAVENPORT....Exec. brother, Thomas Coleman. Leg. brother-in-law WILLIAM > DANIEL; brother Robert Coleman; brother John Coleman; brother Richard Coleman. > The lease bought of Zachary TALIAFERRO to be sold and proceeds distributed > amongst the poor of the parish. To brother, Thomas Coleman, remainder of estate. > [Virginia County Records Spotsylvania County 1721-1800 Will Book B 1749-1759 > pg 311] > > Spilsbe COLEMAN indeed had a sister named Elizabeth ~ but she [according to > others supposedly] married Daniel BROWN in 1714.... and I believe this is the > Elizabeth COLEMAN who married William DANIEL [maybe "also"] and became the > brother-in-law mentioned by Spilsbe COLEMAN. His sister, Anne, married William > COVINGTON ~ and sister, Grizzell, married (1) Thomas HARDY and (2) John > CHAMBERLAIN. ~ And, note that DAVENPORT name... Due to the time frame of 1757, I > suspect he was part of the NJ Francis DAVENPORT's family, Quakers, and most > influential amongst their peers. > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > DO NOT FORGET: This is a Genealogical Mailing List and the posting of messages that do not relate to the DANIEL Family, its collateral families or those of a historical nature relating to genealogical research -- are not allowed on this list. >

Jack, Don't guess you would know the birth year of the son, William, of this father, William. I notice he also has a daughter, Elizabeth, which was one of my Daniel names. However, who didn't have an Elizabeth and a William?!! Lucy ----- Original Message ----- From: Jack V Butler To: DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com Sent: Monday, December 22, 2003 8:02 PM Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Someone asked about Drewry DANIEL Drury Daniel is named as a son of William Daniel in this will abstract. Will of William Daniel, dated 6 Feb 1796, proved at Feb Court 1800 ; daughter Winnie Sexton (?) 5 shillings besides what she has already received from my estate. Daughter Ritter Saxon, Elizabeth Daniel and Patty Daniel 1 negro etc each. Son-in-law Calip Crief and son Lewis Daniel 5 shillings each. Daughter Frances Knight 5 shillings and 1 negro etc and at her decease the said Negro and her increase to be divided between the said Frances children. Son Archibald Daniel land and plantation whereon he now lives and 1 negro. Sons William Daniel and Drury Daniel manor plantation and land thereto belonging and one tract in Granville and Negroes when both arrive at lawful age; grandson Arthur Crief 1 negro; grandson John Massey £25. Wit: William Daniel; Willie Daniel; Allen Daniel; Thomas Crawford. Extrs: my sons Willie and Archibald. Jack Butler ----- Original Message ----- From: <JetPilotUSAF100@cs.com> To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, December 22, 2003 7:13 PM Subject: [DANIEL-L] Someone asked about Drewry DANIEL > GENERATIONS ~ [Catch the Drewry DANIEL at Number Eight] > > 1. Robert COLEMAN, bc: 1620, + Elizabeth GRIZZEL Mott > Deed dated 02 AUG 1658: Francis CARPENTER conveyed a tract of land in > Westmoreland County to Robert COLEMAN of Mobjack Bay, Gloucester County, VA [Deed > and Will Book 1, pg 103, Westmoreland County Records] > NOTE: Their son, Robert, bc: 1652, married Anne SPILSBY ~ See note below. > > > 2. Thomas COLEMAN, bc: 1655, VA + and Rebecca UNKNOWN > > > 3. John COLEMAN, b: 1699, Hanover, Goochland, VA + Grace UNKNOWN > > > 4. Richard COLEMAN, b: 1722, VA ~ d: 1791 Rutherford County, NC + Johanna > CLARK > > > 5. Elizabeth COLEMAN + John CLAYTON Sr. [NOTE: Child 4 and 5, were right > there in NC in the middle of my NJ Quakers ~ also where there were DANIELs and > STOCKTONs, of which one Stockton family went on to Tennessee with some in this > same family on to Missouri] > > > 6. Soloman CLAYTON SR. + Francis CARVER in Person County, NC > > > 7. Simeon Thomas CLAYTON + Mary PAINTER Brown > > > 8. Frances S. CLAYTON, bc: 1842 ~ Married (1) Calvin McKISSACK ~ Married (2) > DREWRY DANIEL > > ```````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````` > > 1810 Census Halifax County, North Carolina ~ Roll 38, Book 1, pg 123 > Drewry DANIEL 1 (under 5) ~ ~ 1 (15/20) ~ 1 (30/40) ~ 1 (50/60) ~ (60/70) ~ > (70/80) > > 1830 Census Halifax County, North Carolina, Roll 121, Bk 1, pg 290a > Drewry DANIEL, age 40 to 50 years, pg 290a ~ on pg 290b males & females > listed in numbers, but no name on this "b" page to correspond back to the name for > that line. grrr... > Leonard DANIEL lived down the road, age 30 to 40, pg 290a > Margaret DANIEL, pg 291a ~ and next to her is a James McDANIEL ... hmmm > Isham DANIEL, pg 296a ~ unreadable > EdWARD DANIEL, pg 297a ~ unreadable > Walton [?] DANIEL, pg 297a > Wincey DANIEL, next door > skip a name [Willie Manley] > skip a name [Hartwell Hathcock] > Isham DANIEL, pg 297a > Robert B. DANIEL, pg 310a = 1 (under 5) 1 (5/10) 2 (10/15) 1 (15/20) ~ ~ 1 > (40/50); females 1 (10/15) and 1 (30/40) > Above [from first page] to page 315a. > `````````````````````````````````````````````````````` > 1830 Census Fayette County, Tennessee, Roll 176, BK 1 pg 44a > Drewry DANIEL, 1 (age 20/30) 1 female (under 5) and 1 female (20/30) > ```````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````` `` > ``````````````````````` > > BACK TO THE COLEMANs in the GENERATIONS above. > Child of Robert COLEMAN and Anne SPILSBY: > Spilsbe COLEMAN, Spotsylvania County, VA. ~ d: 23 MAR 1757 ~ WILL ~ Witness > Wm. DAVENPORT....Exec. brother, Thomas Coleman. Leg. brother-in-law WILLIAM > DANIEL; brother Robert Coleman; brother John Coleman; brother Richard Coleman. > The lease bought of Zachary TALIAFERRO to be sold and proceeds distributed > amongst the poor of the parish. To brother, Thomas Coleman, remainder of estate. > [Virginia County Records Spotsylvania County 1721-1800 Will Book B 1749-1759 > pg 311] > > Spilsbe COLEMAN indeed had a sister named Elizabeth ~ but she [according to > others supposedly] married Daniel BROWN in 1714.... and I believe this is the > Elizabeth COLEMAN who married William DANIEL [maybe "also"] and became the > brother-in-law mentioned by Spilsbe COLEMAN. His sister, Anne, married William > COVINGTON ~ and sister, Grizzell, married (1) Thomas HARDY and (2) John > CHAMBERLAIN. ~ And, note that DAVENPORT name... Due to the time frame of 1757, I > suspect he was part of the NJ Francis DAVENPORT's family, Quakers, and most > influential amongst their peers. > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > DO NOT FORGET: This is a Genealogical Mailing List and the posting of messages that do not relate to the DANIEL Family, its collateral families or those of a historical nature relating to genealogical research -- are not allowed on this list. > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== Going on Vacation for longer than 5 days? Please unsubscribe Click on the following link and your message is ready to send Mail Mode: mailto:DANIEL-L-request@rootsweb.com?subject=unsubscribe or- Digest Mode: mailto:DANIEL-D-request@rootsweb.com?subject=unsubscribe

Anne, Ok, here we go. Charles DANIEL is a given name in the Thomas DANIEL and Sarah BURNEY/RANDLE family however he was not born until 1773, according to some, and died ABT 1800. I have the exact time frame if you want it. What your information is telling me is that a Charles DANIEL is alive an well by 1769. Was this the same Charles DANIEL who some say was a son of Thomas DANIEL and Sarah BURNEY/RANDLE or was it another Charles. For Charles to be at least 21 in 1769, this means he was born at least before 1749 which tell me that this Charles may have been a brother of Thomas and Edmund. This would be the reason that Thomas and Sarah named one of their kids, born 1773, after him. Do you not agree? There is also the possibility that Charles was not born in 1773 but was born much earlier. I like the former thought on this, myself -- he was their brother. I still think the CUNNINGHAMS may play into this because Charles DANIEL (1773-ABT 1800) the son of Thomas and Sarah of Greene County, GA, married Elizabeth COFFEE and the COFFEES, CUNNINGHAMS and Kelso-Daniels are all over each other. My thought is -- to get into this Peter COFFEE family of Greene County, GA you have to be out of the same Kelso-Daniel-Cunningham bunch they were tied to, which points to Caroline and then PE County, VA, as I remember. Charlotte County, VA was the location for Cub Creek Church, owned and operated by the Cunningham's but James DANIEL who married Jane KELSO lived in Amelia County, VA at some point and Amelia DANIEL was one of the names of the first girls in my DANIEL bunch in Burke County, GA. I do not know if Caroline County, VA is your answer or not. These northern VA counties were often pass through counties that families stopped in for a few years on their way south into NC and, later, GA. I do not know on this one. Caroline is also an extension of the Essex County, VA DANIEL family. Have you ruled out that bunch, yet? I am looking for a DANIEL family with Robert as a given name and C. as a middle initial that has links to both Greene, Oglethorpe, Wilkes and Burke County, GA in the post 1800 time frame. I am also looking for one that has ties to the WISE and ERWIN families and meets a pre-set profile of being better educated than most and wealthier than most. I will look up your DAVIS and see what I can find. I have the details on this JV DAVIS already locked into my database tied to Temperance DANIEL, d/o Henning DANIEL. I will tell you the DAVIS and Madison, GA does not know my socks off. There were DAVIS's there, later, but not early. I will look thus name up and get back with you. From Louise McHenry HICKEY's book, Rambles through Morgan County, GA, p. 27, as relates to the community of Buckhead, she states the following "Among the names of old settlers are: FITZPATRICK, SAFFOLD, McWHORTER, PASCHAL, PORTER, McREE, ALFORD........ The BELLS from north Georgia and the DAVIS families from North Carolina (also an older DAVIS family) are well known families, here." You might also want to look at the family of a Wilson DAVIS who married a Mary WRIGHT, d/o Robert WRIGHT, Jr. (1785-1864) of Fluvanna County, VA and later, Greene County, GA. His parents were Robert WRIGHT, Sr. (1736-1831) and Mary Perrine FITZPATRICK and anybody tied to the FITZPATRICKS is fair game in this bunch. All I know about Wilson DAVIS is they had a daughter named, Emmie, who married a William Crawford STEVENS and CRAWFORD is another name all over this bunch and is tied back to the family of William H. CRAWFORD, son of Joel CRAWFORD and Frances HARRIS of Amherst/Hanover County, VA. Rev. William Bibb CRAWFORD, his son, married my grand uncle, William Russell DANIEL (1853-1903) and his first wife, a Yankee from NY, Florence A. FISK (1852-1896), in Madison, GA in 1879. Some say her mother was a Relief HOLMES, another Quaker name. I do not have anything additional on this FISK family except they were from Wellsville, Allegany County, NY in 1879 and they were not po....... The Yankee part was bad enough around this CSA bunch without combining it with the "po" part, too. <grin> I think this FISK girl was a probably a school teacher at the Methodist Female College in Madison, GA before she married WRD and probably afterwards, because we have some graduation type documents from this school which lists the name of a Mrs. DANIEL on them. John R. Clarke Thomasville, GA ----- Original Message ----- From: <JetPilotUSAF100@cs.com> To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, December 22, 2003 2:23 PM Subject: [DANIEL-L] DANIEL ~ RANDLE, MURDEN ~ ASBURY John wrote: "Vincent SANFORD (1777-1859) married, 2nd, Cynthia Ann COLEMAN, widow of James Hunter RALLS, Sr. of Greene County, GA. Cynthia was the d/o Eden COLEMAN and Nancy DANIEL, d/o Thomas DANIEL of Greene County, GA and Sarah, whomever -- BURNEY or RANDLE. Vincent married, first, Priscilla PALMER, d/o Samuel PALMER, Sr. and an Elizabeth HESKETT." The HESKETT names were mentioned... and GRAVES... especially the HESKETT name, by my mother regarding these families. But, it would take two forevers to find that, and I'm having hard enuff time with all my paternal DANIEL and maternal DANIEL(S) right now. <g> >From Payne's Website: 56. Thomas DANIEL, bc: 1743, VA ~ d: 1813, Greene County, GA 1397(302) James Staunton and Elizabeth, his wife, of Northampton to Thomas Daniel of Halifax Co. [no day] FEB 1769 £164 VA. Money 300 acres on N side of Fishing Creek joining Jeremiah Malpas said Thomas Daniel, **MURDEN**, James Staunton, Elizabeth (X) Staunton. Wit: Chas. Daniel, Edmund DANIEL ~ FEB court 1769. The **MURDEN** without a christian name mentioned above was MOST probably Malachi MURDEN, SR., the first husband of Elizabeth TEMBTE, and who had recently [c: 1767] purchased land in the Halifax County, NC area just before he died, as had Dr. Henning TEMBTE just a little earlier. I think his grandson, James AULD had steered him to the area. Dr. TEMBTE, who owned large tracts of land in Talbot County, Maryland; IOW, Northampton and Richmond areas of Virginia and who knows where else. The Edmund DANIEL noted as one of the witnesses would soon marry Elizabeth TEMBTE and he wasn't originally from Halifax either. It is my understanding of these families that none of the parties had been long time residents of Halifax County, NC. I don't know who the Charles DANIEL may have been as there is no record of a Charles having been in the family... maybe he was the real estate salesman. <g> Anyway, this is the Thomas DANIEL that married Sarah RANDLE or RANDELL or RANSDELL... and I doubt very much if he also married a Sarah BURNEY. Did the Thomas DANIEL who married Sarah BURNEY, do so in Georgia? If so, when? Also, Thomas, who married the RANDLE, [etc. spelling] lady, was the brother to Edmund DANIEL who married Elizabeth TEMBTE Murden, widow of Malachi MURDEN, SR. Edmund and Elizabeth raised the MURDEN children and they ended up marrying some of the same lines. ```````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````` `` `````````` John wrote: "General Jeptha V. HARRIS is buried a stone's throw from my RICHTER family in Madison, Morgan County, GA and the HARRIS family is all over the FITZPATRICKS and CALLAWAYS. My grand uncle, William Russell DANIEL (1853-1904) married Clara A. VINING, as his second wife. He was a widower." John, Do you have any Georgia area DAVIS families connected to the above? The son of William M. DAVIS, SR, b: 1765, Orange County, VA ~ d: 1831, GA and Nancy EASTON ~ William M, the son of Reverend Jonathan DAVIS [Baptist, in GA] d: GA. and his Lucy GIBBS [Quaker] was named Jeptha Vining DAVIS, b: 1801.... and he married two of these same paternal DANIELs. First to Tembte [or Temperance] "Tempy" DANIEL, daughter of Henning DANIEL and Hannah ASBURY... and secondly to Sarah A. "Sally" DANIEL, daughter of Cordial DANIEL and Anne Elizabeth WATTS... Cordial, the son of Henning DANIEL. I am also paternally connected directly through a sibling of Jeptha Vining DAVIS... William M. DAVIS, JR, b: 1796 who married Joice JOHNSON... their daughter, Elizabeth DAVIS, b: 1820 GA married Allen BOONE, b: 1812, my g-grandparents.... and then their son, James K. BOONE, b: 1849, married Elizabeth Gatlin T embte DANIEL, my grandparents. Elizabeth G. T. DANIEL was the youngest daughter of Edmund Samuel DANIEL, b: 1800, the eldest son of Henning DANIEL and Hannah ASBURY. Anne ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== DO NOT FORGET: This is a Genealogical Mailing List and the posting of messages that do not relate to the DANIEL Family, its collateral families or those of a historical nature relating to genealogical research -- are not allowed on this list.

GENERATIONS ~ [Catch the Drewry DANIEL at Number Eight] 1. Robert COLEMAN, bc: 1620, + Elizabeth GRIZZEL Mott Deed dated 02 AUG 1658: Francis CARPENTER conveyed a tract of land in Westmoreland County to Robert COLEMAN of Mobjack Bay, Gloucester County, VA [Deed and Will Book 1, pg 103, Westmoreland County Records] NOTE: Their son, Robert, bc: 1652, married Anne SPILSBY ~ See note below. 2. Thomas COLEMAN, bc: 1655, VA + and Rebecca UNKNOWN 3. John COLEMAN, b: 1699, Hanover, Goochland, VA + Grace UNKNOWN 4. Richard COLEMAN, b: 1722, VA ~ d: 1791 Rutherford County, NC + Johanna CLARK 5. Elizabeth COLEMAN + John CLAYTON Sr. [NOTE: Child 4 and 5, were right there in NC in the middle of my NJ Quakers ~ also where there were DANIELs and STOCKTONs, of which one Stockton family went on to Tennessee with some in this same family on to Missouri] 6. Soloman CLAYTON SR. + Francis CARVER in Person County, NC 7. Simeon Thomas CLAYTON + Mary PAINTER Brown 8. Frances S. CLAYTON, bc: 1842 ~ Married (1) Calvin McKISSACK ~ Married (2) DREWRY DANIEL ```````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````` 1810 Census Halifax County, North Carolina ~ Roll 38, Book 1, pg 123 Drewry DANIEL 1 (under 5) ~ ~ 1 (15/20) ~ 1 (30/40) ~ 1 (50/60) ~ (60/70) ~ (70/80) 1830 Census Halifax County, North Carolina, Roll 121, Bk 1, pg 290a Drewry DANIEL, age 40 to 50 years, pg 290a ~ on pg 290b males & females listed in numbers, but no name on this "b" page to correspond back to the name for that line. grrr... Leonard DANIEL lived down the road, age 30 to 40, pg 290a Margaret DANIEL, pg 291a ~ and next to her is a James McDANIEL ... hmmm Isham DANIEL, pg 296a ~ unreadable EdWARD DANIEL, pg 297a ~ unreadable Walton [?] DANIEL, pg 297a Wincey DANIEL, next door skip a name [Willie Manley] skip a name [Hartwell Hathcock] Isham DANIEL, pg 297a Robert B. DANIEL, pg 310a = 1 (under 5) 1 (5/10) 2 (10/15) 1 (15/20) ~ ~ 1 (40/50); females 1 (10/15) and 1 (30/40) Above [from first page] to page 315a. `````````````````````````````````````````````````````` 1830 Census Fayette County, Tennessee, Roll 176, BK 1 pg 44a Drewry DANIEL, 1 (age 20/30) 1 female (under 5) and 1 female (20/30) `````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````` ``````````````````````` BACK TO THE COLEMANs in the GENERATIONS above. Child of Robert COLEMAN and Anne SPILSBY: Spilsbe COLEMAN, Spotsylvania County, VA. ~ d: 23 MAR 1757 ~ WILL ~ Witness Wm. DAVENPORT....Exec. brother, Thomas Coleman. Leg. brother-in-law WILLIAM DANIEL; brother Robert Coleman; brother John Coleman; brother Richard Coleman. The lease bought of Zachary TALIAFERRO to be sold and proceeds distributed amongst the poor of the parish. To brother, Thomas Coleman, remainder of estate. [Virginia County Records Spotsylvania County 1721-1800 Will Book B 1749-1759 pg 311] Spilsbe COLEMAN indeed had a sister named Elizabeth ~ but she [according to others supposedly] married Daniel BROWN in 1714.... and I believe this is the Elizabeth COLEMAN who married William DANIEL [maybe "also"] and became the brother-in-law mentioned by Spilsbe COLEMAN. His sister, Anne, married William COVINGTON ~ and sister, Grizzell, married (1) Thomas HARDY and (2) John CHAMBERLAIN. ~ And, note that DAVENPORT name... Due to the time frame of 1757, I suspect he was part of the NJ Francis DAVENPORT's family, Quakers, and most influential amongst their peers.

<<< RE: Also, your so right about chasing the collaterals... if one doesn't chase 'em, they will never see the whole picture in order to really understand their ancestors. Tories or Patriots... Black Sheep and Angels... Native Americans and English, French, etc. <<< Anne, Dat's right..... <grin> I want to know a little more about your STOCKTONS, if you have a good handle on them. I need a Samuel STOCKTON born ABT 1780 (or before) with possibly a LOCKE tied to that family in some way and the name, Mary or Elizabeth LNU as the wife. Possible locations are the Holston River area of VA/TN in the 1829 time frame. There would probably have been some NORRIS, although some say MORRIS, and RAMSEY activity around this STOCKTON family. However, I think NORRIS is correct. I have looked at Thomas STOCKTON of Augusta County, VA as a possible parent but the name, Thomas, does not float down in my family. I do not know exactly where Elizabeth STOCKTON (1808-1888) married Russell RENEAU (1807-1865) but they were married on 7 Jul 1829 and that you can take to the bank. His father, the Hon. Louis L. RENEAU, Esq., was a TN State Representative representing the French Broad River area of Jefferson County, TN in that same time frame, as well as being an attorney. You are exactly right about the causes for so few divorces -- their early death due to complications from child birth being one of the major ones. However, I don't think many in my bunch died from slopping the hogs because that is rather easy work and a lot easier than toting all of the garbage out to the garbage can, these days. <grin> I would say the next most common reasons for their early death and the remarriage of their husbands were -- malaria, yellow fever, cholera, typhoid, etc. but these diseases also got the boys, too. John R. Clarke Thomasville, GA ----- Original Message ----- From: <JetPilotUSAF100@cs.com> To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, December 22, 2003 2:23 PM Subject: [DANIEL-L] Keeping Marriages in the family. > In a message dated 12/22/2003 7:01:09 AM Central Standard Time, > jclarke@rose.net writes: > > The more or less typical approved marriage of Colonial times was at a > > second cousin level with first cousins not outside the realm of possibility. > > John, Thanks, I needed that whole message. But, gotta tell ya, even the > Quakers approved of a second cousin level marriage... and, about the divorce rate > being almost nonexistent... heck, mostly the poor wives just plain ole died, > if not from childbirth, then from doing all the labor in both home and > field... down to slopping the hogs... no need for a divorce. <g> I believe the > "cousin marriages" probably had better chance of survival... compatibility through > their genes. > > And, as usual, you lost me on some of these names... You seem to have the > capacity to remember them, while I don't. TOMLINSON, DAME, SIRMAN, HARDEMAN, > MOORES, FIVASH, STALVEY, etc. Now, the TOMLINSON name, I know is connected > somewhere... and right now I'm thinking back to some of the lesser known STOCKTONs > from my maternal side. > > Also, your so right about chasing the collaterals... if one doesn't chase > 'em, they will never see the whole picture in order to really understand their > ancestors. Tories or Patriots... Black Sheep and Angels... Native Americans and > English, French, etc. > Anne > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > Don't forget to change the Subject line of your message when you change the subject of a reply message. > >

Anne, Re: Thomas DANIEL & Sarah RANDLE (& all variations). If this is true, than very probably there were two Thomas DANIELS in Greene County, GA.. Simon BURNEY mentions his son-in-law Rev. Thomas DANIEL in his will (Greene Cty., GA, Jan 1792) so it is very probable this Thomas married Sarah BURNEY. I believe this Thomas was a brother of Charles DANIEL as stated in the History of NC Baptists when referring to Halifax County churches: This Col William HORN (of the Falls of Tar River church) coming to the defense of his view got into a heated argument with Elder Thomas DANIEL, who had suceeded his brother, Rev. Charles DANIEL, as pastor of the church at Lower Fishing Creek. I note also that Thomas & Edmund and Charles' wife Amy witnessed the 1764 will of Susannah Reed, formerly Susannah WEST (widow of Henry WEST) and Charles was executoi of the will. So I guess the question is were there two Thomases or one Thomas that married both ladies (RANDLE & BURNEY). I believe we may be getting somewhere on thia thanks to your posting. Mike Daniel

Vincent COX, bc: 1633, Bedfordshire England ~ The emmigrant [1649] ~ d: 1698, Yoacomaco in Copely Parish, Westmoreland County, Virginia ~ Witnesses to Vincent COX's Will, d: 05 JUL 1698 ~ proved 26 OCT 1698 were: Henry ROSE, Robert BENNETT and Mary BENNETT... I don't know from where the *Vincent* name came. Child of VINCENT COX and (1) UNKNOWN: 2.a.* Hannah COX, bc: 1654, Westmoreland County, Virginia ~ d. SEP 1744, Westmoreland ~ Married (1) circa JAN 1671/2 Westmoreland to George LAMKIN, Sr. ~ b: 1650, Yoacomaco, Northumberland County, Virginia ~ d: 1689/90. Hannah married (2) circa 1690/1 Westmoreland to Samuel DAMOURVELLE/DEMOVILLE, bc: 1655, France ~ Physician ~ d: Westmoreland. Children of VINCENT COX and (2) ANNE [probably] CHARNOCK, bc: 1640, Westmoreland ~ db: 1698 ~ Daughter of Christopher CHARNOCK: 2.b.* Vincent COX, JR., b: 1670, Cople or Copely Parish, Virginia ~ d: 01 APR 1713, Cople Parish, Virginia. ~ Married (1) circa 1697 to Anne PAYNE, bc: 1678/80, Westmoreland County, Virginia ~ db: 1702/03 ~ Married (2) circa 1704/05 to Jane UNKNOWN 2.c.* Charnock COX, SR., bc: 1675, Westmoreland County, Virginia ~ d. MAR 1750/51, Yoacomaco, Northumberland County, Virginia ~ Will made 03 MAR 1751 ~ probated 26 MAR 1751 ~ Married circa 1690, Weston, Virginia, to Mary PRESLEY, bc: 1675, Northumberland County, Virginia ~ daughter of Peter PRESLEY, Sr. and Elizabeth THOMPSON ~ Daughter of Richard Thompson, bc: 1613, Norwich, Norfolk, England ~ d: 1648 Northumberland County, Virginia, and Ursula BISCHE, daughter of Philip BISCHE. Peter PRESLEY was the son of William Presley and Jane NEWMAN. Charnock COX and Mary PRESLEY Child: William COX ~ Married Elizabeth THORNTON. 2.d.* ANNE COX, b. 1680, St. Mary's County, Maryland or Westmoreland, Virginia ~ d. St. Mary's ~ Married JOHN REDMAN, Jr., bc: 1667, Westmoreland. Child: Vincent REDMAN b: 1700 ~ d: 1740, St. Mary's County, Maryland ~ Married Hannah ATWELL ~ John REDMAN, JR, ~ Son of John, SR. and Mary HARRIS ~ [2.d.] My paternal line to the DANIELs. 2.e.* Elizabeth COX, bc. 1686, Weston, Cople Parish, Westmoreland County, VA ~ Married (1) circa 1715 Westmoreland to William LEWIS, bc: 1675, Weston, Cople Parish, Westmoreland County, Virginia ~ dc: 1719. She married (2) circa 1720 to John PAYNE, bc: 1680, Weston, Cople Parish, Westmoreland County, Virginia 2.f. Thomas COX 2.g. Martha COX ~ Married (1) John FOOTMAN, Jr. ~ Married (2) Francis WRIGHT ~ NOTE: Francis WRIGHT, d: 1713, son of Richard Whittington WRIGHT and Ann MOTTROM. Francis WRIGHT, married, 1) Anne WASHINGTON, daughter of John WASHINGTON and Anne POPE ~ and married secondly to Martha COX. `````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````` `````````

In a message dated 12/22/2003 7:01:09 AM Central Standard Time, jclarke@rose.net writes: > The more or less typical approved marriage of Colonial times was at a > second cousin level with first cousins not outside the realm of possibility. John, Thanks, I needed that whole message. But, gotta tell ya, even the Quakers approved of a second cousin level marriage... and, about the divorce rate being almost nonexistent... heck, mostly the poor wives just plain ole died, if not from childbirth, then from doing all the labor in both home and field... down to slopping the hogs... no need for a divorce. <g> I believe the "cousin marriages" probably had better chance of survival... compatibility through their genes. And, as usual, you lost me on some of these names... You seem to have the capacity to remember them, while I don't. TOMLINSON, DAME, SIRMAN, HARDEMAN, MOORES, FIVASH, STALVEY, etc. Now, the TOMLINSON name, I know is connected somewhere... and right now I'm thinking back to some of the lesser known STOCKTONs from my maternal side. Also, your so right about chasing the collaterals... if one doesn't chase 'em, they will never see the whole picture in order to really understand their ancestors. Tories or Patriots... Black Sheep and Angels... Native Americans and English, French, etc. Anne

John wrote: "Vincent SANFORD (1777-1859) married, 2nd, Cynthia Ann COLEMAN, widow of James Hunter RALLS, Sr. of Greene County, GA. Cynthia was the d/o Eden COLEMAN and Nancy DANIEL, d/o Thomas DANIEL of Greene County, GA and Sarah, whomever -- BURNEY or RANDLE. Vincent married, first, Priscilla PALMER, d/o Samuel PALMER, Sr. and an Elizabeth HESKETT." The HESKETT names were mentioned... and GRAVES... especially the HESKETT name, by my mother regarding these families. But, it would take two forevers to find that, and I'm having hard enuff time with all my paternal DANIEL and maternal DANIEL(S) right now. <g> >From Payne's Website: 56. Thomas DANIEL, bc: 1743, VA ~ d: 1813, Greene County, GA 1397(302) James Staunton and Elizabeth, his wife, of Northampton to Thomas Daniel of Halifax Co. [no day] FEB 1769 £164 VA. Money 300 acres on N side of Fishing Creek joining Jeremiah Malpas said Thomas Daniel, **MURDEN**, James Staunton, Elizabeth (X) Staunton. Wit: Chas. Daniel, Edmund DANIEL ~ FEB court 1769. The **MURDEN** without a christian name mentioned above was MOST probably Malachi MURDEN, SR., the first husband of Elizabeth TEMBTE, and who had recently [c: 1767] purchased land in the Halifax County, NC area just before he died, as had Dr. Henning TEMBTE just a little earlier. I think his grandson, James AULD had steered him to the area. Dr. TEMBTE, who owned large tracts of land in Talbot County, Maryland; IOW, Northampton and Richmond areas of Virginia and who knows where else. The Edmund DANIEL noted as one of the witnesses would soon marry Elizabeth TEMBTE and he wasn't originally from Halifax either. It is my understanding of these families that none of the parties had been long time residents of Halifax County, NC. I don't know who the Charles DANIEL may have been as there is no record of a Charles having been in the family... maybe he was the real estate salesman. <g> Anyway, this is the Thomas DANIEL that married Sarah RANDLE or RANDELL or RANSDELL... and I doubt very much if he also married a Sarah BURNEY. Did the Thomas DANIEL who married Sarah BURNEY, do so in Georgia? If so, when? Also, Thomas, who married the RANDLE, [etc. spelling] lady, was the brother to Edmund DANIEL who married Elizabeth TEMBTE Murden, widow of Malachi MURDEN, SR. Edmund and Elizabeth raised the MURDEN children and they ended up marrying some of the same lines. `````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````` `````````` John wrote: "General Jeptha V. HARRIS is buried a stone's throw from my RICHTER family in Madison, Morgan County, GA and the HARRIS family is all over the FITZPATRICKS and CALLAWAYS. My grand uncle, William Russell DANIEL (1853-1904) married Clara A. VINING, as his second wife. He was a widower." John, Do you have any Georgia area DAVIS families connected to the above? The son of William M. DAVIS, SR, b: 1765, Orange County, VA ~ d: 1831, GA and Nancy EASTON ~ William M, the son of Reverend Jonathan DAVIS [Baptist, in GA] d: GA. and his Lucy GIBBS [Quaker] was named Jeptha Vining DAVIS, b: 1801.... and he married two of these same paternal DANIELs. First to Tembte [or Temperance] "Tempy" DANIEL, daughter of Henning DANIEL and Hannah ASBURY... and secondly to Sarah A. "Sally" DANIEL, daughter of Cordial DANIEL and Anne Elizabeth WATTS... Cordial, the son of Henning DANIEL. I am also paternally connected directly through a sibling of Jeptha Vining DAVIS... William M. DAVIS, JR, b: 1796 who married Joice JOHNSON... their daughter, Elizabeth DAVIS, b: 1820 GA married Allen BOONE, b: 1812, my g-grandparents.... and then their son, James K. BOONE, b: 1849, married Elizabeth Gatlin T embte DANIEL, my grandparents. Elizabeth G. T. DANIEL was the youngest daughter of Edmund Samuel DANIEL, b: 1800, the eldest son of Henning DANIEL and Hannah ASBURY. Anne

Good boy. <grin> Sounds reasonable to me..... John R. Clarke Thomasville, GA ----- Original Message ----- From: "Payne Daniel" <gpdfla@tampabay.rr.com> To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, December 22, 2003 11:58 AM Subject: [DANIEL-L] NOTICE a change is made. > All, the following reassignment has come about as a result of an email I received from a non Daniel-List person who thought I might wish to consider his facts. Since I have the concurrence of a Daniel-List contributor, as well, and in order to keep folks informed, I submit the following: > > Roger Daniell Family of Warwick County, Virginia. > > I have removed Peter Daniel from the William and Martha Field Allen Daniel family and reassigned him to the family of David Daniel and Margaret Lynch. Peter was married to Sarah/Sally Lofton. > > The details are on the web page at http://www.paynedaniel.com Roger Daniell Family and I will provide notes and such upon request. > > Constructive input will be appreciated. Such as, did William and Martha have a son Peter? > > Aha, a nice warm cup of hot tea is a must on a chilly day here in Tampa. Payne > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > IF YOU MISS ANY MESSAGE: You can easily search the DANIEL List Archives at: > http://listsearches.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/listsearch.pl?list=DANIEL > >

Bill, Read what I said -- I said that was Payne's name for your families DANIEL line, at least at one time and that is still how I still carry it. My definition of "mess" means your family is questionable and while you may think you know who your ancestors were, you do not seem to have a lot of early documentation for this line, do you? I think you said in one post, you thought your DANIEL ancestor was a illegitimate son of one of these DANIELS, did you not? That, in itself, makes your line rather questionable to me. Do you have any DNA support for this assignment or is this just a hypothesis? Let me explain something to some of you. I know it is hard for some not to "wear their families on their sleeves" but that is not how historical or genealogical research is best handled. None of this is personal and if you make it so, then you are just hurting yourself in the search for the truth. I never made any point about where your family located except to say that many families who migrated to KY from VA or TN also later crossed the Ohio River into OH. IN and IL. Are you trying to tell me your family crossed over into IN without first crossing the Ohio River? Just exactly where was I in error in this statement? I also think you will find that any significant "permanent" migration to IN or those points west of OH would probably have been after the War of 1812, because the British led Indians were really working over the American inhabitants who lived to the west of a north-south line passing through the Cincinnati, OH area during the War of 1812. And, IN is to the west of OH, so if they lived in the IN area during the War of 1812, it would have been a rather risky endeavor, unless they wanted their scalps to end up being sold in Detroit. Afterwards, a little easier. John R. Clarke Thomasville, GA ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Brewer" <wwb@ix.netcom.com> To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, December 22, 2003 11:53 AM Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] The Old Fence Sitter And I, John, would like an explanation of the comment.."Bill Brewer's Questionable Line?" What is questionable or messy about my line? As I said in my last message to you, I have documentation of everything back to Benjamin Daniel being a son of William Daniel and Mary Snead. What is questionable about it. We don't know WHICH William Daniel, but I've made that very clear. Yes, some of the Sneads and Daniels went to Kentucky (along with the Browns, Mundays, and Noels), and yes, my branch of the Daniel family eventually ended up in Madison, Indiana. I don't know what your point was about that, but it did happen. Bill Brewer ----- Original Message ----- From: "Payne Daniel" <gpdfla@tampabay.rr.com> To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, December 22, 2003 6:57 AM Subject: [DANIEL-L] The Old Fence Sitter > Alas John, you are never at a loss for words. I reserve the right to change > my web page anytime there is some good reason to do so. To me the mention > that something is a mess in the context that you use it is bothersome. By > whose standards do you judge someone's work since everything is not as neat > and tidy as you would like. My web page changes that are Daniel-List driven > aren't as frequent as you make out and come only after careful consultation > with you, Jack, Mike, Robert, Joe, Ruth, Diane, Randy, etc., etc., etc. > > Additionally, many of my changes come about from sources that you and the > List are unaware of. My work is a compilation from all sources and makes no > claim to absolute authority. One researcher has asked me several pointed > questions about my Caroline connection and the proof thereof. We will work > on this inquiry out of the spot light and if there is something that needs > to be brought to your attention as the Daniel List Master, we will. > > If I recall, it was not I who had to change his position on several issues > such as the William Daniel who married Lucretia Bell and their connection to > the O'Daniels. I don't think you are still comfortable with my Middlesex > assignments, but be assured that I will at least consider your ideas, before > I make any notable changes. > > Anyway, sometime today or tomorrow I am going to unsubscribe from the List > until after Christmas. I need to do some reorganizing of my thoughts and > respond to several inquiries that are time consuming. Be kind to me while I > am away and if you think that something is a mess let me know. > > BTW, thanks for your thoughts on the Burney/Randle issue. > > MERRY CHRISTMAS ALL and stay in touch. > > The Old Fence Sitter in Tampa. Payne > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "John R. Clarke" <jclarke@rose.net> > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Monday, December 22, 2003 12:27 AM > Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > > > > Payne, > > Webster's defines "mess" as a "disorderly accumulation" among one of > its > > various meanings. From what I know about this particular DANIEL line, > that > > definition probably describes our knowledge of this DANIEL line about as > > well as any descriptor I have ever seen affixed to any DANIEL line, unless > > you are privy to something I am not. What was it you used to call part of > > this DANIEL line -- the "Bill Brewer Questionable Line?" > > As you know, I like things neat and orderly. I like families that > marry > > into the same families their cousins, aunts and uncles married into. > Makes > > things, like key assignment and family inter-family relationships, a > little > > easier to understand. Do you not agree? > > As for your website, you seem to change things so often in the past > > several years, I sometimes cannot always keep up with your current > > assignments. One time I go to your website and you have this Daniel boy > > assigned to one family and the next time I go to your website, you have > him > > assigned to some completely different DANIEL family. I can understand > some > > minor variations in family assignments, within a certain DANIEL family, > but > > I do not understand these changes when these variations cross family > > boundaries. Early researchers were sometimes a little wrong on who a > > particular boy or girl were a son of but they were usually in the right > ball > > park, even if they were not in the right section, row and aisle. > > Several or more times a year I go to your website and try to reconcile > > our differences, noting them to you, but when one has thousands and > > thousands of DANIELS, as I do, it is hard to keep up with these changes, > > especially to key assignments. > > We have made some key assignment changes in the past several years. > One > > was the straightening out of the mess in the Middlesex bunch, i.e. James > > DANIEL and Jane HICKS, Chesley DANIEL and Judith, et. al., as well as some > > of the major changes in the Thomas DANIEL and Elizabeth line out of > Tyrrell > > County, NC and the Simon and Elizabeth line out of Edgecombe but some of > the > > changes I have seen recently on you website are completely outside of my > > database. > > Much of this put of different information into an apples and oranges > > situation, sometimes. I see apples and you are talking about oranges. > This > > may be one of those times. > > As for the BREWERS, I have lots of BREWERS tied to various families > very > > close to my DANIEL bunch. They are tied to the REIDS, WYCHES, WALTONS and > > even to a maternal great-grand uncle, George M. DAME of Montgomery County, > > GA. The DAMES lived in Middlesex County, VA before migrating to Dodge > > County, GA. The WYCHES, WALTONS and REIDS are all over my paternal Morgan > > County, GA family, which includes the DANIELS. > > I have looked at this COLEMAN-DANIEL line, very closely in the past, > > because of the Eden COLEMAN who ties into the Thomas DANIEL and Sarah > > BURNEY/RANDLE line in Greene County, GA. I assume you still have this > > "Bill Brewer Questionable Line" tied to the William DANIEL and Elizabeth > > COLEMAN out of Caroline County, VA? Anyway, that was where it was the > > last time I reconciled my information against yours and assume it is still > > there. Regardless, that is where I have it in my information. If you > have > > moved it to another DANIEL family or sub-family, please advise, because I > > like for our key assignment information to agree. > > We both know the SNEADS went to KY and any family that usually went to > > KY had a good chance to floating across the Ohio River into either OH, IN > or > > IL. I have nothing against being related to the SNEADS, at all. Swinging > > Sammy and I were born on the same day, the 27th of May, and we are both > > pretty good golfers. <grin> I do not even have anything against being > > related to the GILBERTS, another KY family, either. Larry GILBERT and I > > played a round a few years ago and he beat me one stroke on the last hole > > but I did not hold it against him. <grin> Larry was a nice fellow and a > > gentleman, as I assume Sammy was, and the world is lesser place for their > > passing. > > Do not think that I did not read about the Sen. Strom THURMAN > situation > > with some degree of apprehension, especially since two of the surnames > > listed for two of his nieces were identical to those of close families and > > especially since one of the daughters of one of my great-grand uncles, a > > RENO, married a THURMAN. Nor the fact I have some family pictures taken > in > > the 1850's in this same RENEAU family that don't look exactly Kosher. > > <grin> I thought this may have been something only attributable to that > one > > RENO family until a cousin told me she had similar pictures in her family > > albums from the same period. We all know this kind of stuff went on in > the > > days before the Civil War and I assume at least as late as 1924 in SC. > > <grin> > > As for facts, I wish I had some to offer you on the RANDLE-BURNEY > > possibilities, but I do not. I can only say, if the mother of the > children > > of Thomas DANIEL of Greene County, GA was a Sarah BURNEY, the d/o Simon, > Sr. > > and Elizabeth HARDY, then that points to Eastern NC for his origins. If > she > > was a RANDLE, a real possibility, that points to VA for his origins, so > take > > your pick. My best guess is she was a RANDLE but I have his wife, > > currently, as Sarah BURNEY........ > > > > John R. Clarke > > Thomasville, GA > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Payne Daniel" <gpdfla@tampabay.rr.com> > > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2003 9:34 AM > > Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > > > > > > Morning John , I am pleased that you visit my web site and find items of > > interest to share with the List. Howsoever: > > > > Joe Daniel and I put the "Bill Brewer" line where it is after some > > consultation with Bill. "Cobbled Up", even Bill is not 100% happy with the > > assignment, but a mess in his work, I can't buy that. If you have some > > constructive input to help us clear up the so called mess??, please let us > > know in detail. > > > > So far I subscribe to the position that Burney and Randall gals were > married > > to Thomas Daniel. When I review your most recent ideas about that > > possibility, I may change my mind. We need some facts man! > > > > Aha, TV basket ball today to cleanse the little gray cells from all this > > genealogical morass. I am a DUKIE and Robert is a GATOR, so John bring on > > the DAWGS. > > > > Talk to ya'll later. Payne > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "John R. Clarke" <jclarke@rose.net> > > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Friday, December 19, 2003 1:03 PM > > Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > > > > > > > Payne, > > > One researcher has Thomas DANIEL of Greene County, GA married to a > > Sarah > > > RANDLE and Sarah BURNEY with the kids being shown as the children of > Sarah > > > BURNEY. They also have this Thomas the son of William DANIEL and > > Elizabeth > > > COLEMAN of Caroline County, VA. What a cobbled up line, that is - that > is > > > the Bill BREWER line and talk about a mess, that is it..... > > > It almost seems that some, when they cannot put their known ancestor > > > with a specific line, they find the line with the most question marks > and > > > "bingo," they have an instant ancestor. <grin> I think there were > > probably > > > two Thomas DANIELS in Greene County -- one, a part of that Kelso-Daniel > > line > > > and another from NC. One married a RANDLE and one married a BURNEY. > > > The only possibility is that BURNEY was not BURNEY but BIRNEY and > > > floated out of that Northern VA and Maryland BIRNEY family. I know that > > > part of that family migrated from MD/PA/VA to KY and then back into > > Northern > > > Alabama. Because of their opposition to slavery they later peddled > their > > > way back north to the Washington, DC area. > > > This BIRNEY family is tied to my bunch - the son of General William > > > BIRNEY and Catherine HOFFMAN of Prince Frederick County, MD, Theodore > Weld > > > BIRNEY (1854-1897), married my second cousin, Alice Josephine McCLELLAN > > > (1858-1907) in 1892 as her second husband. Her mother was a TATUM and > > her > > > grandmother a POTTER, a younger sister of my GGM, Anne Eliza POTTER. > > Alice > > > also married a WHITE from Charleston, SC as her first husband but is > most > > > remembered for her latter marriage and name, Alice McClellan BIRNEY.. > > > This was why I made the note about the McCLELLANDS of Augusta > County, > > VA > > > in the note about the McDONALDS, O'DONALDS and DONNELLYS the other day. > > The > > > spelling of their name was butchered by civil servants, too.. > > > I do not know about this bunch in Greene County, GA. A lot of their > > > links do not make sense but they are tied all over the FITZPATRICKS and > > any > > > family tied to that bunch has links back to Goochland, Cumberland, > > Fauquier > > > and even Augusta County, VA. > > > I know I am starting to see a pattern here that makes sense. This > > > Thomas could be a Woodson-Daniel descendant or he could be a part of > that > > > Kelso-Daniel bunch. I do not know but I would like to look at the > > > possibility they are all related. This is the simplest solution but > that > > > may not be the case. > > > In fact, one of these may be a DONALD, McDONALD, DONALDSON, DONELLY > or > > > something along these lines and to make things simple down in Greene > > County, > > > they just shortened their name to DANIEL. Regardless, they all seem to > be > > > of the same financial and educational profiles. > > > If I was going to guess, I would say that one of these Greene > County, > > > GA families was out of Lancaster, PA and/or Frederick County, MD area > and > > > was originally a McDONALD, DONELLY, O'DONALD or something along those > > lines, > > > which is why we cannot trace them back as a DANIEL. My bet is McDONALD > > and > > > the name change occurred around the time of the RW because of the > Loyalist > > > McDONALD family. In fact, some of this bunch may have been loyalists > and > > > dumped the name and took up DANIEL to keep this association out of > > > subsequent generations. > > > Personally, I never understand why the CUNNINGHAMS kept their name > > since > > > the "Butcher of SC" was a CUNNINGHAM and these folks in Greene County, > GA > > > had to know the hard feelings this name had for many who also migrated > > from > > > SC to GA in the years after the RW. This may account for the reason the > > > CUNNINGHAMS married "so close" - none of the other folks in the area > would > > > have anything to do with them. You know the South, as I do -- hard > > feelings > > > and family hatreds linger on for years, regardless of how much money you > > > have. <grin> > > > > > > John R. Clarke > > > Thomasville, GA > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Payne Daniel" <gpdfla@tampabay.rr.com> > > > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Friday, December 19, 2003 11:32 AM > > > Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > > > > > > > > > Can we have the best of both worlds. That is, Thomas was married to both > > > gals. What stats do you have on the Burney gal and likewise on the > Randall > > > gal? Can they co-mingle in a relationship with Thomas? I enjoyed your > > > possibilities and I will keep chewing on this stuff. > > > > > > Thanks to John and Mike for their thoughts on my Peter Daniel delema and > > to > > > those of you who chipped in on my Marmaduke study. > > > > > > Lunch time ya'll. Payne > > > > > > "The supreme irony of life is that hardly anyone gets out of it alive." > > > -- Robert Heinlein, "Job", 1984 > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "John R. Clarke" <jclarke@rose.net> > > > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Friday, December 19, 2003 10:29 AM > > > Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > > > > > > > > > > Well, Payne, you know how I closely watch family associations in these > > > > DANIEL families and Charles DANIEL (1773-ABT 1800) of Greene County, > GA > > > > being a son of Thomas DANIEL and Sarah BURNEY of NC, makes no sense > > > > whatsoever to me, if he married Elizabeth COFFEE, d/o Peter COFFEE. > > > > However, it does make sense if Charles's mother was a RANDLE and > Thomas > > > was > > > > a VA DANIEL and not a NC DANIEL, which the BURNEY link seems to imply. > > > > > > > > Also note the many Charleston, SC connections in the family of William > > > > Coffee DANIEL (son of Charles and Elizabeth COFFEE of Greene County, > > > GA) -- > > > > he married a SCREVEN girl whose family was out of Charleston and > > > Charleston > > > > families are a big link in my bunch. Dr. William Coffee DANIEL I am > > pretty > > > > sure was the GA Senator William DANIEL of Savannah who interceded with > > the > > > > senate on behalf of the Methodist preacher, whom Judge L. Q. C. LAMAR > of > > > > Milledgeville, GA had condemned to death in 1832, only to find out > > later, > > > he > > > > was innocent. Remember also, that Professor Winfield Montgomery > RIVERS, > > > who > > > > married the widow of Robert W. DANIEL (my GGF), was living with Sarah > > > > Williamson Bird LAMAR, Judge LAMAR's widow, in Newton County, GA in > > 1850. > > > > > > > > As you will note, my DANIEL bunch of Burke, later Jefferson County, GA > > > > matches the profile of this bunch from Greene County, GA to a tee and > > one > > > of > > > > this Thomas and Sarah's kids of Greene County, GA were the > > > > great-grandparents of a girl, Mary Lou HUNTER, who married directly > into > > > my > > > > RICHTER family in Madison, through the RALLS (also a VA family), > > COLEMANS > > > > and DANIEL of Greensboro, Greene County, GA. So, I am already > connected > > > to > > > > this DANIEL bunch in Greene County, GA in one way but tis the other > that > > > > interests me..... > > > > > > > > My bet is that my family of Burke County, GA is related in some way to > > > these > > > > Greene County, GA folks, either through Thomas and Sarah or through > the > > > > CUNNINGHAM-DANIEL bunch. However, it could be a class thing and not a > > > > family thing. > > > > > > > > However, there is a pretty good possibility that my bunch had links to > > the > > > > Upper Neck area of VA, maybe even Augusta County, VA, which may > explain > > > the > > > > RENEAU connection in this family. Also, Robert DANIELL's "O'DANIEL > > family > > > > of Fairfax County, VA" seems to be the only DANIEL related family that > > has > > > > links to both the names, ERWIN, TAYLOR and WISE, that I need for my > > bunch > > > in > > > > Burke County, GA to fly. We also know this O'DANIEL family was from > > > Fairfax > > > > County, VA, met the profile of my bunch and probably had many links > into > > > the > > > > Upper Neck area of VA. They later migrated down to GA through NC and > my > > > > DANIEL or DANIELL bunch may well be a part of this migration but we > > cannot > > > > find the name, Robert, in this bunch. > > > > > > > > I think the answer to my bunch may be in correcting the DANIEL > families > > of > > > > Greene County, GA - both of them. I think they are cobbled up, as > they > > > now > > > > stand, primarily because they do not make sense. > > > > > > > > John R. Clarke > > > > Thomasville, GA > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Payne Daniel" <gpdfla@tampabay.rr.com> > > > > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > Sent: Friday, December 19, 2003 9:33 AM > > > > Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes I noticed. I remain interested in the Randle and Burney > connections > > > and > > > > the will you mentioned. > > > > > > > > Payne > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "John R. Clarke" <jclarke@rose.net> > > > > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2003 6:37 PM > > > > Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > > > > > > > > > > > > > Payne, > > > > > Did you happen to notice the given name, Charles, all over that > > > > DONELLY, > > > > > McDONALD and other DANIEL related information from Upper Neck and > > > Augusta > > > > > County, VA which I posted, yesterday? > > > > > I am still trying to figure out who this DONELLY bunch was but I > > > know > > > > > they are all over the LEWIS, CAMPBELL and CROW families of that > area, > > a > > > > lot > > > > > of which later migrated into the OH territory. From what I do know, > > > this > > > > > bunch migrated from Scotland to Ireland and then to Botetourt > County, > > > VA, > > > > > later Augusta County, VA. I would almost bet this DONELLY, or > > O'DONALD > > > as > > > > > they are sometimes referred to in these civil records, came with > them, > > > > > before or after. > > > > > This DONELLY, O'DONALD or McDONALD family I think had links to > the > > > > > Lancaster County, PA area or had ties to that area. I also think > > there > > > is > > > > a > > > > > good possibility they were probably tied in some way to that BOONES > > and > > > > > BRYAN bunch from that same general area. > > > > > The reason I ask about the name, Charles, is Charles is not a > > given > > > > name > > > > > in any of the families I know which later migrated into Greene and > > > Wilkes > > > > > County, GA. I cannot say these families in Augusta County, VA are > > > around > > > > > the CUNNINGHAMS of that area but they sure were in the same general > > > area, > > > > at > > > > > one point, and we know that bunch later migrated south into VA from > > PA. > > > > > I want to see that will of Thomas DANIEL of Greene County, GA, > > that > > > > > confirms the Charles DANIEL (1773-1803) who married Elizabeth > COFFEE, > > > was > > > > a > > > > > son of Thomas DANIEL and Sarah BURNEY of Greene County, GA if > someone > > > has > > > > > it. The given name, Charles, just does not fit this family nor does > a > > > link > > > > > to the COFFEES. > > > > > The reason I say it does not fit is -- (1) These VA families > > tended > > > to > > > > > marry only into what were, once, VA families (2) These families > > married > > > > all > > > > > over each other -- cousins married cousins. > > > > > For Peter COFFEE to let his daughter break with tradition and > > marry > > > > into > > > > > a NC family does not match their profile at all, unless Thomas > DANIEL > > > was > > > > > out of this same DANIEL line that came south with them and the > > > CUNNINHJAMS > > > > > from VA....... > > > > > If the latter, then I think Thomas DANIEL of Greene County, GA > was > > > > > really married to a Sarah RANDLE, something that others have > reported > > > > > because the RANDLE name is all over this bunch, later. If later, > then > > > > > possibly, earlier, too........ > > > > > For what it is worth, I think the COFFEE/COFFEY family followed > > the > > > > > CUNNINGHAMS from Ireland to PA, then to PE County, VA and finally to > > > > Wilkes > > > > > and Greene County, GA. The HEARDS and even the FITZPATRICKS may > have > > > been > > > > a > > > > > part of this group, too. > > > > > > > > > > <<<< > > > > > IE: > > > > > > > > > > Page 25.--26th February, 1762. Francis Tyler to Israel Christian, > £40, > > > > > a negro slave Hanna. Teste: W. Christian, Charles Donelly. > > > > > > > > > > Page 305.--22d June, 1763. Daniel Harrison and Sarah to James Green, > > > > > £9, 100 acres in north fork of Linwell's Creek. Teste: James > Gamwill, > > > > > Charles Donnelly. > > > > > > > > > > Page 289.--18th March, 1768. George Wilson and Elizabeth, of > > Hampshire, > > > > > to Charles Donnelly, £90, 234 acres by patent 10th August, 1759, on > > > > > Stewart's Creek above. Delivered to Charles Donnelly, March, 1778. > > > > > > > > > > MARCH 18, 1768 > > > > > (521) Commission ordered to privily examine Elizabeth, wife of > George > > > > > Wilson, to deed to Charles Donnelly > > > > > > > > > > Page 106.--17th May, 1768. James Hugart's estate appraisement, by > > James > > > > > McCoy, Charles Donnerley, John Cartmill, recorded. > > > > > > > > > > MARCH 25, 1769 > > > > > (125) Charles Donnerly and John McCreery appointed surveyors of > road > > > from > > > > > Capt. Charles Lewis's to, the Fork of Dickinson's Road. > > > > > > > > > > Page 219.--24th February, 1770. Patrick Davis and Esther to James > > > > > Millican, £30, 44 acres by patent dated 10th September, 1767, on > > > > > Cowpasture River. Teste: Charles Lewis, Charles and Andrew Donnelly. > > > > > Delivered: Andrew Donnelly, December, 1775. > > > > > > > > > > AUGUST 20, 1772 > > > > > (409) Charles Lewis qualified Lieutenant Colonel of County. > > > > > (411) Charles O'Donald, aged 17, orphan of Michael O'Donald, chose > > > Thomas > > > > > Stuart guardian. > > > > > > > > > > Page 9.--20th August, 1772. Thomas Stewart's bond (with George > > Mathews, > > > > > David Henderson) as guardian to Charles O'Donald, orphan of Michael > > > > > O'Donald. > > > > > > > > > > Page 182.--4th December, 1772. William Sitlington's estate appraised > > > > > by Charles Donelly, Ralph Laverty, William Reach--1 servant man > > > appraised > > > > > to Dorby Dedy, £18.00.0; 1 servant man. named Joseph, appraised > > > > > to Blackhouse £15.10.0; 1 servant man, named Augustine Picket, > > £14.00.0; > > > > > 1 servant man, named Richard, appraised to Edwards, £14.00.0; 1 > > servant > > > > > woman appraised to £12.00.0. > > > > > > > > > > Page 208.--8th October, 1781. Elizabeth (mark) dark's will--To > > daughter, > > > > > Jean Elliot's heirs; to well beloved Elizabeth Breath (Reath, > Reoth?); > > > > > to daughter, Sarah Elliot; to daughter, Anne Dounlap; to daughter, > > > Margret > > > > > Clenkaid; to son, John Gridle; to son, James; to son, Alexander and > > > > > to Alexander's wife; to four daughters; to son, Samuel; to son, > > > William's > > > > > heirs; to son, Robert. Executors, son Robert Clark and William > Reaoh. > > > > > Teste: Charles Donally, James McCleerey, Robt. Patterson, Geo. > Berry. > > > > > Proved, 20th November, 1781, by McCleerey and Berry. Robert Clark > > > > > qualifies. > > > > > > > > > > Page 383.--25th October, 1781. Jane McCoy, of Greenbrier, widow and > > > > > sole executrix of James McCoy, to Andrew and Charles Donnerley, > > patented > > > > > 10th August, 1759, to said James on Stewart's Creek. Teste: Hugh > > > > > Brown, Andrew Sitlington, Nathan Crawford. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Page 308.--16th June, 1783. Mary (mark) Donnelly relinquishes her > > > > > right to administration on her husband's, Charles Donnelly's, estate > > and > > > > > nominates Andrew Donnelly, of Greenbrier, and her son, Andrew > > Donnelly. > > > > > Teste: James Bleake, William (mark) Gillespey. > > > > > > > > > > Page 308.--15th February, 1779. Charles Donnelly's will (of Cow > > > > > Pasture)--To wife, Mary; to daughters, Jean Bleake, Mary Brown; to > > other > > > > > four children, viz: Andrew, Charles, Ann, Catherine; to sons, Andrew > > and > > > > > Charles Donnally, Jr. Executrix, Mary and Col. Andrew Donnally and > > > > > son Andrew. Teste: James Bleke, John Gay, Wm. (mark) Gillespy. > > > > > Proved, 17th June, 1783, by Blake and Gillespy. Gay is since dead. > The > > > > > two Andrews qualify. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > John R. Clarke > > > > > Thomasville, GA > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: "Payne Daniel" <gpdfla@tampabay.rr.com> > > > > > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2003 3:55 PM > > > > > Subject: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Afternoon John and all, I have a puzzler. Even an "I think" or an > "I > > > > told > > > > > > you so" will be appreciated. Payne > > > > > > > > > > > > The Peter Daniel who married Sarah/Sally Lofton has been assigned > to > > > > > William > > > > > > Daniel and Martha Field Allen Daniel. This assignment and the > > > > possibility > > > > > > that he was Peter Mickelborough Daniel the son of Charles Daniel > and > > > > Sarah > > > > > > Tate is questionable. Even though PMD has the same stats as the > > Peter > > > > > Daniel > > > > > > who was the s/o William and Martha, the Peter who was the son of > > > Charles > > > > > and > > > > > > Sarah was not the same individual. That Peter married Jane Ann > > > Mayfield > > > > > and > > > > > > Elizabeth Piner. Does all of this sound familiar : ) ? > > > > > > > > > > > > Now another scenerio. The Peter Daniel who was the son of David > > Daniel > > > > and > > > > > > Margaret Lynch was most likley the Peter who married Sally Lofton. > > > > There > > > > > > are many collateral ties between the Loftins and the Lynchs and > the > > > > > Daniels > > > > > > of Davidson County to support this connection. Ref: Jersey Baptist > > > > Meeting > > > > > > House Records in Davidson County where Peter, Charity and Mary > made > > > > > > applications in 1802. Had to be the son of David? > > > > > > > > > > > > Which Peter married Sally Lofton? We have at least two Peters > > sharing > > > > that > > > > > > distinction and both can't have the same date of birth, but they > do? > > > > > > > > > > > > Peter Daniel (Is this fact or fiction) Father: William DANIEL b: > > 1740 > > > > in, > > > > > > Cumberland, Virginia - Mother: Pattie ALLEN b: Abt 1746 in > > Cumberland, > > > > > > Virginia - Marriage 1 Sarah LOFTON b: 1786 in, Montgomery, North > > > > Carolina > > > > > > Married: 28 MAR 1803 in Rowan, North Carolina - Sealing Spouse: 13 > > MAR > > > > > 1981 > > > > > > in OGDEN Children: 1. Drury DANIEL b: Abt 1809 in Rowan, North > > > Carolina. > > > > > 2. > > > > > > John T. DANIEL b: 1819 in Tennessee. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > > > > > > If you are have any problems receiving the DANIEL List, would like > > to > > > > > change your subscription method or email address or you have a > > > suggestion > > > > > you think would improve the operation of the DANIEL list -- feel > free > > to > > > > > contact me at any time - My email address is JClarke@rose.net > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > > > > > If you are have any problems receiving the DANIEL List, would like > to > > > > change your subscription method or email address or you have a > > suggestion > > > > you think would improve the operation of the DANIEL list -- feel free > to > > > > contact me at any time - My email address is JClarke@rose.net > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > > > > IF YOU MISS ANY MESSAGE: You can easily search the DANIEL List > Archives > > > at: > > > > http://listsearches.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/listsearch.pl?list=DANIEL > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > > > > Going on Vacation for longer than 5 days? Please unsubscribe > > > > Click on the following link and your message is ready to send > > > > Mail Mode: > > > > mailto:DANIEL-L-request@rootsweb.com?subject=unsubscribe > > > > or- > > > > Digest Mode: > > > > mailto:DANIEL-D-request@rootsweb.com?subject=unsubscribe > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > > > DO NOT FORGET: This is a Genealogical Mailing List and the posting of > > > messages that do not relate to the DANIEL Family, its collateral > families > > or > > > those of a historical nature relating to genealogical research -- are > not > > > allowed on this list. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > > > If you are have any problems receiving the DANIEL List, would like to > > change your subscription method or email address or you have a suggestion > > you think would improve the operation of the DANIEL list -- feel free to > > contact me at any time - My email address is JClarke@rose.net > > > > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > > IF YOU MISS ANY MESSAGE: You can easily search the DANIEL List Archives > at: > > http://listsearches.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/listsearch.pl?list=DANIEL > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > > DO NOT FORGET: This is a Genealogical Mailing List and the posting of > messages that do not relate to the DANIEL Family, its collateral families or > those of a historical nature relating to genealogical research -- are not > allowed on this list. > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > Going on Vacation for longer than 5 days? Please unsubscribe > Click on the following link and your message is ready to send > Mail Mode: > mailto:DANIEL-L-request@rootsweb.com?subject=unsubscribe > or- > Digest Mode: > mailto:DANIEL-D-request@rootsweb.com?subject=unsubscribe > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== Going on Vacation for longer than 5 days? Please unsubscribe Click on the following link and your message is ready to send Mail Mode: mailto:DANIEL-L-request@rootsweb.com?subject=unsubscribe or- Digest Mode: mailto:DANIEL-D-request@rootsweb.com?subject=unsubscribe

All, the following reassignment has come about as a result of an email I received from a non Daniel-List person who thought I might wish to consider his facts. Since I have the concurrence of a Daniel-List contributor, as well, and in order to keep folks informed, I submit the following: Roger Daniell Family of Warwick County, Virginia. I have removed Peter Daniel from the William and Martha Field Allen Daniel family and reassigned him to the family of David Daniel and Margaret Lynch. Peter was married to Sarah/Sally Lofton. The details are on the web page at http://www.paynedaniel.com Roger Daniell Family and I will provide notes and such upon request. Constructive input will be appreciated. Such as, did William and Martha have a son Peter? Aha, a nice warm cup of hot tea is a must on a chilly day here in Tampa. Payne

John, Benjamin Daniel married Margaret Brown in Caroline County, VA on 8 Sep 1790. This is documented in "Marriages of Some Virginia Residents, 1607-1800," Series I, Vol. 2, compiled by Dorothy Ford Wulfeck and published 1963:Naugatuck, Conn. (page 216); in "Forks of Elkhorn Church" by Ermina Jett Darnell, 1980:Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc., Baltimore (page 117). Benjamin's wife is also identified in papers filed in Mercer County, KY courthouse, said papers entitled "A Division Of Land Between Part of Benjamin Daniel's Heirs," Book 12, pages 161-163, Mercer County Will Books. Coleman Daniel is identified as Benjamin and Margaret's son in these same papers. Admittedly, the documentation identifying Benjamin as a son of William Daniel and Mary Snead is shaky, which is why I have always been careful to point out the weaknesses. In the Madison, IN public library are papers, in the Daniel Family Folder of their genealogical section, which appear to have been copied from a family Bible. I can't be sure of this, as none of the current staff (or current when I was there in 1990) have any knowledge of how the library came into possession of the papers. That said, the papers themselves contain the following entries: Page 1: Under the heading of "DEATHS:" "William Daniel departed this life 11th of March 1817 and was buried at John Yeatman's in Franklin Co. Ky. Mary Daniel departed this life 11th of December 1789 in Caroline County, Virginia." "Tabitha Buckner departed this life, September 19th 1838. "Benjamin Daniel departed this life at his residence in Mercer Co. Ky. May 19th, 1843, age 74 yrs. 7 mos. 1 day. ... "Margaret Daniel, mother of Coleman Daniel, departed this life in Mercer Co. Ky. Feb. 15th 1857." Page 2: Under the heading "BIRTHS:" "William Daniel was born in Caroline Co. Virginia Mar. 1st 1734. Salie Daniel was born in Caroline Co. Virginia Jan. 15th 1756 Benjamin Daniel was born in Caroline Co. Virginia Oct. 18th 1769." Page 3: Under the heading of "MARRIAGES:" "William Daniel was married to Mary Snead, daughter of John Snead of Caroline Co. Virginia on the 6th day of April 1764. Benjamin Daniel was married to Margaret Brown Jan. 1, 1790 in Caroline County, Virginia [the year is correct, but the day of the marriage varies substantially from the official records.]." As I said, this last document is at best secondary (or even fourthly) information, and as such is not very strong. I have never been able to find any record of William Daniel's purported marriage to Mary Snead. It is well documented in histories of the area that John Snead operated a tavern near the mill operated by William Daniel at this time. I have also found, in "Virginia Publick Claims, Caroline County," transcribed and compiled by Janice L. Abercrombie and Richard Slatten, published by Iberian Publishing Co., Athens GA (page 24) the following: "Sneed, Mary assne of Wm. Daniel 180# beef 1-17-6." Since these "Publick Claims" were submitted to the U. S. government as Revolutionary War claims, it seems that either 1)this was a different Mary Sneed than the one William Daniel married; or 2)William Daniel and Mary Sneed were never married and Benjamin was illegitimate. This is the basis for my statement the he might have been illegitimate. At this point, I have no idea. No, I have no DNA support, since I know of no living, unbroken male line of this branch. Obviously, I'm not. The last surnamed Daniel in my line was my great-grandmother, Virginia Wickliffe Daniel, who married John King Weyer in Madison, IN on 14 Oct 1873. She was the daughter of William A. Daniel, a grandson of Benjamin. In any case, I think the evidence suggests that Benjamin Daniel was a son of one of the (many) William Daniel's. Along with many other people, I sincerely hope that some day it can be established which William Daniel, but until then, I think my documentation is as good as anyone has been able to find so far...and I don't think I'm "wearing my family on my sleeve." I have conducted a lot of research in my family lines, and where I think the evidence is shaky, I am very careful to point it out. Bill ----- Original Message ----- From: "John R. Clarke" <jclarke@rose.net> To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, December 22, 2003 10:23 AM Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] The Old Fence Sitter > Bill, > Read what I said -- I said that was Payne's name for your families > DANIEL line, at least at one time and that is still how I still carry it. > My definition of "mess" means your family is questionable and while you may > think you know who your ancestors were, you do not seem to have a lot of > early documentation for this line, do you? > I think you said in one post, you thought your DANIEL ancestor was a > illegitimate son of one of these DANIELS, did you not? That, in itself, > makes your line rather questionable to me. Do you have any DNA support for > this assignment or is this just a hypothesis? > Let me explain something to some of you. I know it is hard for some not > to "wear their families on their sleeves" but that is not how historical or > genealogical research is best handled. None of this is personal and if you > make it so, then you are just hurting yourself in the search for the truth. > I never made any point about where your family located except to say > that many families who migrated to KY from VA or TN also later crossed the > Ohio River into OH. IN and IL. Are you trying to tell me your family > crossed over into IN without first crossing the Ohio River? Just exactly > where was I in error in this statement? > I also think you will find that any significant "permanent" migration to > IN or those points west of OH would probably have been after the War of > 1812, because the British led Indians were really working over the American > inhabitants who lived to the west of a north-south line passing through the > Cincinnati, OH area during the War of 1812. And, IN is to the west of OH, > so if they lived in the IN area during the War of 1812, it would have been a > rather risky endeavor, unless they wanted their scalps to end up being sold > in Detroit. Afterwards, a little easier. > > John R. Clarke > Thomasville, GA >

Anne, Now we are starting to get somewhere. I knew there was an HARRIS connection to this bunch and the connection appears to be the Walton HARRIS (1739-1795) and Rebecca LANIER family of Greene County, GA. I have the names of some of their kids but I do not like some of the dates I have for some of this HARRIS family but that is what I have. Rebecca was the d/o Sampson LANIER and Elizabeth CHAMBERLAIN of Brunswick County, VA. Walton was the son of Nathan HARRIS and Catherine WALTON of Greenville County, VA. This line of WALTONS is tied to my bunch. Nathan was the son of George WALTON and Elizabeth ROWE of Brunswick County, Va. She was the daughter of Thomas ROWE and Mary of Middlesex County, VA. However, Walton and Rebecca's son, Buckner HARRIS (1761-1821) married a Nancy EARLY. I have known the Buckner name was around some of my bunch for a long time. Bucker's brother, Gen. Jeptha Vining HARRIS (1782-1856) married a Sarah HUNT, d/o Richardson HUNT and Nancy Martin CARTER. Brother, Walton HARRIS, Jr. married Virginia Beverly BILLUPS who I will bet she is out of the BILLUPS family that was in partnership with the BRASWELL family of Madison, GA - attorneys. Another sibling, Augustine HARRIS, married Anna BYNE, d/o of Rev. Edmund BYNE and Sarah LEWIS. The BYNES were from Ireland and tie into the FANNIN family and others of Morgan County, GA but originally lived in Burke County, GA. General Jeptha V. HARRIS is buried a stone's throw from my RICHTER family in Madison, Morgan County, GA and the HARRIS family is all over the FITZPATRICKS and CALLAWAYS. My grand uncle, William Russell DANIEL (1853-1904) married Clara A. VINING, as his second wife. He was a widower. Who were the parents of that EARLY girl that married Thomas WATTS, if you know? I think we are going down the right road on this one..... John R. Clarke Thomasville, GA ----- Original Message ----- From: <JetPilotUSAF100@cs.com> To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2003 11:18 PM Subject: [DANIEL-L] Thomas DANIEL ~ RANDLE, ASBURY and CORDIAL name associations > "Thomas DANIEL of Greene County married Sarah RANDLE" ~ I like the idea of > two Thomas DANIELs in Green County ~ the same as I like the idea of two or more > William DANIELs who married an Elizabeth COLEMAN. <g> And speaking of the > RANDLE marriages in Georgia... look at the ones below. > > Greene County, Georgia > James G. RANDLE m. Sally COLEMAN, 26 JAN 1808 > Susan RANDLE m. Asbury DANIEL, 22 SEP 1830 ~ Son of Henning DANIEL > Zymonia A. RANDLE m. William R. THORNTON, 5 NOV 1835 > Augustus Henry RANDLE m. Emily Reid ASBURY, 27 JUL 1836 > > Emily Reid (Reade) ASBURY, b: 28 DEC 1820, above ~ was the half-sister to > Hannah ASBURY who married HENNING DANIEL, son of Edmund DANIEL and Elizabeth > TEMBTE Murden, b: Maryland and widow of Malachi MURDEN > > Emily ASBURY's mother was Mrs. Sarah WATTS, widow, and 3rd spouse of Lt. > Richard ASBURY, b: 13 FEB 1761, Richmond, VA ~ [married 3rd in 1820 Georgia]. > Hannah ASBURY's mother was (1) Elizabeth THORNTON. > > Parents of Richard ASBURY were THOMAS ASBURY, JR, b: 19 OCT 1725, Overwharton > Parish, Stafford County, Virginia ~ d: 1776, Richmond County, Virginia ~ > Married circa 1745, Overwharton Parish, to ANNE READE, bc: 1730, Overwharton > Parish ~ d: 1796, Richmond, Virginia ~ Daughter of COLEMAN READE and RUTH BRAGG. A > number of these same ASBURYs also went to [now West] Virginia and Kentucky > ```````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````` `` > ````````````````````` > The CORDIAL or CORDIL name association > Johnson County, Kentucky ~ Rev John Asbury DANIEL, b: 28 JUN 1881 + Rebecca > Jane CORDIAL ~ Son of Rev. Wyatt Winston DANIEL ~ Son of David DANIEL. From > where did these DANIELs come to Kentucky? Tazwell County, [area portion now > possibly West] VA? Which DANIEL group? > > The name "Cordial" as a christian name has come down in several generations > of Edmund DANIEL and Elizabeth TEMBTE Murden's families who moved to Georgia > late 1780s. I realize this Reverend DANIEL and his CORDIAL lady were born > nearly 100 years later, but isn't this West Virginia area also the same as from > where the Revolutionary Soldier, Spilsby DANIEL married Sally ASBURY? > > "Spilsby" as in Spilsby COLEMAN from the COLEMANs of King & Queen, Caroline > and later Richmond County, Virginia and with some family members also in > Maryland where Dr. Henning TEMBTE is first found in the early 1700s. > > And, seems this Rebecca CORDIAL or CORDIL or CORDLE's family were in > Wilkes/Rowan county area of North Carolina before/by 1800 with some also in Tazwell... > and then to Kentucky and Georgia. DANIELs were in this same NC area also, > but where were the CORDIAL families from before 1760s, as that might prove > interesting. > > Anne > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > If you are have any problems receiving the DANIEL List, would like to change your subscription method or email address or you have a suggestion you think would improve the operation of the DANIEL list -- feel free to contact me at any time - My email address is JClarke@rose.net > >

Anne, I assume you know that Vincent was a given name in the SANFORD family of Greene County, GA and Vincent SANFORD (1777-1859) married, 2nd, Cynthia Ann COLEMAN, widow of James Hunter RALLS, Sr. of Greene County, GA. Cynthia was the d/o Eden COLEMAN and Nancy DANIEL, d/o Thomas DANIEL of Greene County, GA and Sarah, whomever -- BURNEY or RANDLE. Vincent married, first, Priscilla PALMER, d/o Samuel PALMER, Sr. and an Elizabeth HESKETT. This Elizabeth has to be out of that HESKETT bunch of Charleston, SC, formerly of Boston, MA. And my guess is that Vincent was part of the Jeremiah SANFORD family of Loudon County, VA. Jeremiah was married to a Mary MODESETTE and guess who I have tied all over some of my bunch down in Burke County, GA --- more MODESETTES. To show you how it all folds all into my Morgan County, GA bunch. The daughter of Cynthia Ann COLEMAN and James Hunter RALLS, Sr, Anne Eliza RALLS, married the Hon. Elisha Sparks HUNTER, Jr. of Greensboro, Greene County, GA. Their daughter, Mary Lou HUNTER (1848-1917), married my grand uncle, Professor Charles W. RICHTER, Jr. (1837-1907) of Madison. His younger brother, John C. (1848-1907) married Alice DANIEL...... Elisha's sister, Miriam HUNTER, married Thomas Washington RANDLE, the son of James Graves RANDLE and Sarah C. COLEMAN, Cynthia's sister. James Graves RANDLE was the son of James RANDLE II and Rosanna GRAVES of Hancock County, GA, formerly of the Louisa Co, Virginia. Other siblings of Elisha Sparks HUNTER, Jr married into the SHACKLEFORD, FITZPATRICK, HEARD, STILLWELL and CALLAWAY families. Boy, do some of these names ring a bell. <grin> If I am reading this right, your Henning DANIEL line folds back into the William DANIEL, Sr. and Elizabeth COLEMAN line out of Caroline County, VA. Based on everything I see, Thomas DANIEL of Greene County, GA was probably a VA DANIEL of some variety and was probably married to a RANDLE. However, this could be a cross-DANIEL line because that HESKETT and PALMER marriage troubles me because I have a pretty good idea where the HESKETTS point back to -- Charleston, SC and before that, Boston. I have looked at this COLEMAN-DANIEL line very closely in the past because my Robert C. DANIEL of Burke County, GA (ABT 1765-AFT 1830) would fold into this DANIEL family in a heart beat but researchers of this family swear on a stack of Bibles, ten miles high, their Robert Coleman DANIEL bailed out of VA to KY and never even looked at GA, let alone moved there. <grin> If this is so, why do we now find so much of his family sitting down in Greene County, GA sipping mint juleps while they watched their plantation workers, of dubious ancestral progeny, pick cotton? <grin> I do assume there must be something more here, than meets the eye.... We are close to solving some the mystery of this one DANIEL line but there is still a bit of information needed. Right now, it does not quite make sense and when it does not make sense, I ponder and look for other corroborative information in the genealogical records of other known collaterals. John R. Clarke Thomasville, GA ----- Original Message ----- From: <JetPilotUSAF100@cs.com> To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, December 22, 2003 2:12 AM Subject: [DANIEL-L] RANDLE ~ THORNTON ~ ASBURY ~ DANIEL > RANDLE/RANSDELL/RANDELL mentioned earlier... all from the same "Stew Pot" ~ > so, 100 years isn't all that long when it comes to keeping marriages within > families, as mentioned earlier.... same thing with the COLEMANs. > > Children of Luke THORNTON, JR and Margaret [probably] JAMES: > 1. William THORNTON, bc: 1702 ~ Married Elizabeth RANSDELL or RANDELL or > RANDLE, bc: 1710, Richmond ~ sister to Millicent who married Luke THORNTON, > brother of William. > > 2. James THORNTON, bc: 1704, Richmond ~ dc: 1749, Orange County, VA > > 3. Luke THORNTON, III, bc: 1706 ~ dc: 1749 ~ Married 02 JAN 1727/28, to > Millicent RANSDELL Longworth, widow of William LONGWORTH and daughter of Edward > and Mary Ransdell. Children: (1) Luke, (2) Presley, (3) John; (4) William > THORNTON > > 4. Thomas THORNTON, bc: 1708/11, Richmond County ~ d: 1763, Richmond County > ~ Married Elizabeth 'Betsy' DAVIS, bc: 1718, Richmond County ~ d: 1793/94 > [Will probated 06 JAN 1794] ~ Daughter of Richard DAVIS, b: 05 SEP 1687, and [M: > FEB 1716, Richmond] to Mary BERRICK or DERRICK who married circa 1720 to > Robert THORNTON after the death of Richard DAVIS. Richard, the son of William > DAVIS and [M: 23 APR 1677, NFParish] to Elizabeth THRIFT. > > NEXT GENERATION ~ > 1. William THORNTON, bc: 1702 ~ db: 03 AUG 1741, Richmond County, Virginia > Son of Luke THORNTON, JR, b: 1676, Old Rappahannock County, Virginia and > Margaret [probably] JAMES, bc: 1680 ~ Married 10 AUG 1727, North Farnham Parish, > Warsaw, Richmond County, Virginia, to Elizabeth RANSDELL Talbot, widow of > Samuel TALBOT ~ Daughter of Edward and Mary RANSDELL or RANDELL. or RANDLE > > Child of William THORNTON and Elizabeth RANSDELL or RANDELL > 1.a. Jesse THORNTON, bc: 1735, Richmond ~ dc: 1778 ~ married Hannah REDMAN > ~ Daughter of Vincent REDMON(D) and Hannah ATWELL ~ Children of Jesse and > Hannah: (1) ELIZABETH THORNTON married RICHARD ASBURY, d: GA, (2) Vincent, (3) > Stuart, (4) Hannah, d: 1852, Griffin Spaulding, Baldwin County, GA married 25 > JAN 1782, NFParish, to Richard SISSON, b: 1760, London; (5) Winifred, (6) Redmon > THORNTON, d: GA > > Child (1) Elizabeth THORNTON and Richard ASBURY's daughter, Hannah ASBURY > married HENNING DANIEL. > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > Going on Vacation for longer than 5 days? Please unsubscribe > Click on the following link and your message is ready to send > Mail Mode: > mailto:DANIEL-L-request@rootsweb.com?subject=unsubscribe > or- > Digest Mode: > mailto:DANIEL-D-request@rootsweb.com?subject=unsubscribe > >

Alas John, you are never at a loss for words. I reserve the right to change my web page anytime there is some good reason to do so. To me the mention that something is a mess in the context that you use it is bothersome. By whose standards do you judge someone's work since everything is not as neat and tidy as you would like. My web page changes that are Daniel-List driven aren't as frequent as you make out and come only after careful consultation with you, Jack, Mike, Robert, Joe, Ruth, Diane, Randy, etc., etc., etc. Additionally, many of my changes come about from sources that you and the List are unaware of. My work is a compilation from all sources and makes no claim to absolute authority. One researcher has asked me several pointed questions about my Caroline connection and the proof thereof. We will work on this inquiry out of the spot light and if there is something that needs to be brought to your attention as the Daniel List Master, we will. If I recall, it was not I who had to change his position on several issues such as the William Daniel who married Lucretia Bell and their connection to the O'Daniels. I don't think you are still comfortable with my Middlesex assignments, but be assured that I will at least consider your ideas, before I make any notable changes. Anyway, sometime today or tomorrow I am going to unsubscribe from the List until after Christmas. I need to do some reorganizing of my thoughts and respond to several inquiries that are time consuming. Be kind to me while I am away and if you think that something is a mess let me know. BTW, thanks for your thoughts on the Burney/Randle issue. MERRY CHRISTMAS ALL and stay in touch. The Old Fence Sitter in Tampa. Payne ----- Original Message ----- From: "John R. Clarke" <jclarke@rose.net> To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, December 22, 2003 12:27 AM Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > Payne, > Webster's defines "mess" as a "disorderly accumulation" among one of its > various meanings. From what I know about this particular DANIEL line, that > definition probably describes our knowledge of this DANIEL line about as > well as any descriptor I have ever seen affixed to any DANIEL line, unless > you are privy to something I am not. What was it you used to call part of > this DANIEL line -- the "Bill Brewer Questionable Line?" > As you know, I like things neat and orderly. I like families that marry > into the same families their cousins, aunts and uncles married into. Makes > things, like key assignment and family inter-family relationships, a little > easier to understand. Do you not agree? > As for your website, you seem to change things so often in the past > several years, I sometimes cannot always keep up with your current > assignments. One time I go to your website and you have this Daniel boy > assigned to one family and the next time I go to your website, you have him > assigned to some completely different DANIEL family. I can understand some > minor variations in family assignments, within a certain DANIEL family, but > I do not understand these changes when these variations cross family > boundaries. Early researchers were sometimes a little wrong on who a > particular boy or girl were a son of but they were usually in the right ball > park, even if they were not in the right section, row and aisle. > Several or more times a year I go to your website and try to reconcile > our differences, noting them to you, but when one has thousands and > thousands of DANIELS, as I do, it is hard to keep up with these changes, > especially to key assignments. > We have made some key assignment changes in the past several years. One > was the straightening out of the mess in the Middlesex bunch, i.e. James > DANIEL and Jane HICKS, Chesley DANIEL and Judith, et. al., as well as some > of the major changes in the Thomas DANIEL and Elizabeth line out of Tyrrell > County, NC and the Simon and Elizabeth line out of Edgecombe but some of the > changes I have seen recently on you website are completely outside of my > database. > Much of this put of different information into an apples and oranges > situation, sometimes. I see apples and you are talking about oranges. This > may be one of those times. > As for the BREWERS, I have lots of BREWERS tied to various families very > close to my DANIEL bunch. They are tied to the REIDS, WYCHES, WALTONS and > even to a maternal great-grand uncle, George M. DAME of Montgomery County, > GA. The DAMES lived in Middlesex County, VA before migrating to Dodge > County, GA. The WYCHES, WALTONS and REIDS are all over my paternal Morgan > County, GA family, which includes the DANIELS. > I have looked at this COLEMAN-DANIEL line, very closely in the past, > because of the Eden COLEMAN who ties into the Thomas DANIEL and Sarah > BURNEY/RANDLE line in Greene County, GA. I assume you still have this > "Bill Brewer Questionable Line" tied to the William DANIEL and Elizabeth > COLEMAN out of Caroline County, VA? Anyway, that was where it was the > last time I reconciled my information against yours and assume it is still > there. Regardless, that is where I have it in my information. If you have > moved it to another DANIEL family or sub-family, please advise, because I > like for our key assignment information to agree. > We both know the SNEADS went to KY and any family that usually went to > KY had a good chance to floating across the Ohio River into either OH, IN or > IL. I have nothing against being related to the SNEADS, at all. Swinging > Sammy and I were born on the same day, the 27th of May, and we are both > pretty good golfers. <grin> I do not even have anything against being > related to the GILBERTS, another KY family, either. Larry GILBERT and I > played a round a few years ago and he beat me one stroke on the last hole > but I did not hold it against him. <grin> Larry was a nice fellow and a > gentleman, as I assume Sammy was, and the world is lesser place for their > passing. > Do not think that I did not read about the Sen. Strom THURMAN situation > with some degree of apprehension, especially since two of the surnames > listed for two of his nieces were identical to those of close families and > especially since one of the daughters of one of my great-grand uncles, a > RENO, married a THURMAN. Nor the fact I have some family pictures taken in > the 1850's in this same RENEAU family that don't look exactly Kosher. > <grin> I thought this may have been something only attributable to that one > RENO family until a cousin told me she had similar pictures in her family > albums from the same period. We all know this kind of stuff went on in the > days before the Civil War and I assume at least as late as 1924 in SC. > <grin> > As for facts, I wish I had some to offer you on the RANDLE-BURNEY > possibilities, but I do not. I can only say, if the mother of the children > of Thomas DANIEL of Greene County, GA was a Sarah BURNEY, the d/o Simon, Sr. > and Elizabeth HARDY, then that points to Eastern NC for his origins. If she > was a RANDLE, a real possibility, that points to VA for his origins, so take > your pick. My best guess is she was a RANDLE but I have his wife, > currently, as Sarah BURNEY........ > > John R. Clarke > Thomasville, GA > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Payne Daniel" <gpdfla@tampabay.rr.com> > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2003 9:34 AM > Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > > > Morning John , I am pleased that you visit my web site and find items of > interest to share with the List. Howsoever: > > Joe Daniel and I put the "Bill Brewer" line where it is after some > consultation with Bill. "Cobbled Up", even Bill is not 100% happy with the > assignment, but a mess in his work, I can't buy that. If you have some > constructive input to help us clear up the so called mess??, please let us > know in detail. > > So far I subscribe to the position that Burney and Randall gals were married > to Thomas Daniel. When I review your most recent ideas about that > possibility, I may change my mind. We need some facts man! > > Aha, TV basket ball today to cleanse the little gray cells from all this > genealogical morass. I am a DUKIE and Robert is a GATOR, so John bring on > the DAWGS. > > Talk to ya'll later. Payne > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "John R. Clarke" <jclarke@rose.net> > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, December 19, 2003 1:03 PM > Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > > > > Payne, > > One researcher has Thomas DANIEL of Greene County, GA married to a > Sarah > > RANDLE and Sarah BURNEY with the kids being shown as the children of Sarah > > BURNEY. They also have this Thomas the son of William DANIEL and > Elizabeth > > COLEMAN of Caroline County, VA. What a cobbled up line, that is - that is > > the Bill BREWER line and talk about a mess, that is it..... > > It almost seems that some, when they cannot put their known ancestor > > with a specific line, they find the line with the most question marks and > > "bingo," they have an instant ancestor. <grin> I think there were > probably > > two Thomas DANIELS in Greene County -- one, a part of that Kelso-Daniel > line > > and another from NC. One married a RANDLE and one married a BURNEY. > > The only possibility is that BURNEY was not BURNEY but BIRNEY and > > floated out of that Northern VA and Maryland BIRNEY family. I know that > > part of that family migrated from MD/PA/VA to KY and then back into > Northern > > Alabama. Because of their opposition to slavery they later peddled their > > way back north to the Washington, DC area. > > This BIRNEY family is tied to my bunch - the son of General William > > BIRNEY and Catherine HOFFMAN of Prince Frederick County, MD, Theodore Weld > > BIRNEY (1854-1897), married my second cousin, Alice Josephine McCLELLAN > > (1858-1907) in 1892 as her second husband. Her mother was a TATUM and > her > > grandmother a POTTER, a younger sister of my GGM, Anne Eliza POTTER. > Alice > > also married a WHITE from Charleston, SC as her first husband but is most > > remembered for her latter marriage and name, Alice McClellan BIRNEY.. > > This was why I made the note about the McCLELLANDS of Augusta County, > VA > > in the note about the McDONALDS, O'DONALDS and DONNELLYS the other day. > The > > spelling of their name was butchered by civil servants, too.. > > I do not know about this bunch in Greene County, GA. A lot of their > > links do not make sense but they are tied all over the FITZPATRICKS and > any > > family tied to that bunch has links back to Goochland, Cumberland, > Fauquier > > and even Augusta County, VA. > > I know I am starting to see a pattern here that makes sense. This > > Thomas could be a Woodson-Daniel descendant or he could be a part of that > > Kelso-Daniel bunch. I do not know but I would like to look at the > > possibility they are all related. This is the simplest solution but that > > may not be the case. > > In fact, one of these may be a DONALD, McDONALD, DONALDSON, DONELLY or > > something along these lines and to make things simple down in Greene > County, > > they just shortened their name to DANIEL. Regardless, they all seem to be > > of the same financial and educational profiles. > > If I was going to guess, I would say that one of these Greene County, > > GA families was out of Lancaster, PA and/or Frederick County, MD area and > > was originally a McDONALD, DONELLY, O'DONALD or something along those > lines, > > which is why we cannot trace them back as a DANIEL. My bet is McDONALD > and > > the name change occurred around the time of the RW because of the Loyalist > > McDONALD family. In fact, some of this bunch may have been loyalists and > > dumped the name and took up DANIEL to keep this association out of > > subsequent generations. > > Personally, I never understand why the CUNNINGHAMS kept their name > since > > the "Butcher of SC" was a CUNNINGHAM and these folks in Greene County, GA > > had to know the hard feelings this name had for many who also migrated > from > > SC to GA in the years after the RW. This may account for the reason the > > CUNNINGHAMS married "so close" - none of the other folks in the area would > > have anything to do with them. You know the South, as I do -- hard > feelings > > and family hatreds linger on for years, regardless of how much money you > > have. <grin> > > > > John R. Clarke > > Thomasville, GA > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Payne Daniel" <gpdfla@tampabay.rr.com> > > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Friday, December 19, 2003 11:32 AM > > Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > > > > > > Can we have the best of both worlds. That is, Thomas was married to both > > gals. What stats do you have on the Burney gal and likewise on the Randall > > gal? Can they co-mingle in a relationship with Thomas? I enjoyed your > > possibilities and I will keep chewing on this stuff. > > > > Thanks to John and Mike for their thoughts on my Peter Daniel delema and > to > > those of you who chipped in on my Marmaduke study. > > > > Lunch time ya'll. Payne > > > > "The supreme irony of life is that hardly anyone gets out of it alive." > > -- Robert Heinlein, "Job", 1984 > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "John R. Clarke" <jclarke@rose.net> > > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Friday, December 19, 2003 10:29 AM > > Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > > > > > > > Well, Payne, you know how I closely watch family associations in these > > > DANIEL families and Charles DANIEL (1773-ABT 1800) of Greene County, GA > > > being a son of Thomas DANIEL and Sarah BURNEY of NC, makes no sense > > > whatsoever to me, if he married Elizabeth COFFEE, d/o Peter COFFEE. > > > However, it does make sense if Charles's mother was a RANDLE and Thomas > > was > > > a VA DANIEL and not a NC DANIEL, which the BURNEY link seems to imply. > > > > > > Also note the many Charleston, SC connections in the family of William > > > Coffee DANIEL (son of Charles and Elizabeth COFFEE of Greene County, > > GA) -- > > > he married a SCREVEN girl whose family was out of Charleston and > > Charleston > > > families are a big link in my bunch. Dr. William Coffee DANIEL I am > pretty > > > sure was the GA Senator William DANIEL of Savannah who interceded with > the > > > senate on behalf of the Methodist preacher, whom Judge L. Q. C. LAMAR of > > > Milledgeville, GA had condemned to death in 1832, only to find out > later, > > he > > > was innocent. Remember also, that Professor Winfield Montgomery RIVERS, > > who > > > married the widow of Robert W. DANIEL (my GGF), was living with Sarah > > > Williamson Bird LAMAR, Judge LAMAR's widow, in Newton County, GA in > 1850. > > > > > > As you will note, my DANIEL bunch of Burke, later Jefferson County, GA > > > matches the profile of this bunch from Greene County, GA to a tee and > one > > of > > > this Thomas and Sarah's kids of Greene County, GA were the > > > great-grandparents of a girl, Mary Lou HUNTER, who married directly into > > my > > > RICHTER family in Madison, through the RALLS (also a VA family), > COLEMANS > > > and DANIEL of Greensboro, Greene County, GA. So, I am already connected > > to > > > this DANIEL bunch in Greene County, GA in one way but tis the other that > > > interests me..... > > > > > > My bet is that my family of Burke County, GA is related in some way to > > these > > > Greene County, GA folks, either through Thomas and Sarah or through the > > > CUNNINGHAM-DANIEL bunch. However, it could be a class thing and not a > > > family thing. > > > > > > However, there is a pretty good possibility that my bunch had links to > the > > > Upper Neck area of VA, maybe even Augusta County, VA, which may explain > > the > > > RENEAU connection in this family. Also, Robert DANIELL's "O'DANIEL > family > > > of Fairfax County, VA" seems to be the only DANIEL related family that > has > > > links to both the names, ERWIN, TAYLOR and WISE, that I need for my > bunch > > in > > > Burke County, GA to fly. We also know this O'DANIEL family was from > > Fairfax > > > County, VA, met the profile of my bunch and probably had many links into > > the > > > Upper Neck area of VA. They later migrated down to GA through NC and my > > > DANIEL or DANIELL bunch may well be a part of this migration but we > cannot > > > find the name, Robert, in this bunch. > > > > > > I think the answer to my bunch may be in correcting the DANIEL families > of > > > Greene County, GA - both of them. I think they are cobbled up, as they > > now > > > stand, primarily because they do not make sense. > > > > > > John R. Clarke > > > Thomasville, GA > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Payne Daniel" <gpdfla@tampabay.rr.com> > > > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Friday, December 19, 2003 9:33 AM > > > Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > > > > > > > > > Yes I noticed. I remain interested in the Randle and Burney connections > > and > > > the will you mentioned. > > > > > > Payne > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "John R. Clarke" <jclarke@rose.net> > > > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2003 6:37 PM > > > Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > > > > > > > > > > Payne, > > > > Did you happen to notice the given name, Charles, all over that > > > DONELLY, > > > > McDONALD and other DANIEL related information from Upper Neck and > > Augusta > > > > County, VA which I posted, yesterday? > > > > I am still trying to figure out who this DONELLY bunch was but I > > know > > > > they are all over the LEWIS, CAMPBELL and CROW families of that area, > a > > > lot > > > > of which later migrated into the OH territory. From what I do know, > > this > > > > bunch migrated from Scotland to Ireland and then to Botetourt County, > > VA, > > > > later Augusta County, VA. I would almost bet this DONELLY, or > O'DONALD > > as > > > > they are sometimes referred to in these civil records, came with them, > > > > before or after. > > > > This DONELLY, O'DONALD or McDONALD family I think had links to the > > > > Lancaster County, PA area or had ties to that area. I also think > there > > is > > > a > > > > good possibility they were probably tied in some way to that BOONES > and > > > > BRYAN bunch from that same general area. > > > > The reason I ask about the name, Charles, is Charles is not a > given > > > name > > > > in any of the families I know which later migrated into Greene and > > Wilkes > > > > County, GA. I cannot say these families in Augusta County, VA are > > around > > > > the CUNNINGHAMS of that area but they sure were in the same general > > area, > > > at > > > > one point, and we know that bunch later migrated south into VA from > PA. > > > > I want to see that will of Thomas DANIEL of Greene County, GA, > that > > > > confirms the Charles DANIEL (1773-1803) who married Elizabeth COFFEE, > > was > > > a > > > > son of Thomas DANIEL and Sarah BURNEY of Greene County, GA if someone > > has > > > > it. The given name, Charles, just does not fit this family nor does a > > link > > > > to the COFFEES. > > > > The reason I say it does not fit is -- (1) These VA families > tended > > to > > > > marry only into what were, once, VA families (2) These families > married > > > all > > > > over each other -- cousins married cousins. > > > > For Peter COFFEE to let his daughter break with tradition and > marry > > > into > > > > a NC family does not match their profile at all, unless Thomas DANIEL > > was > > > > out of this same DANIEL line that came south with them and the > > CUNNINHJAMS > > > > from VA....... > > > > If the latter, then I think Thomas DANIEL of Greene County, GA was > > > > really married to a Sarah RANDLE, something that others have reported > > > > because the RANDLE name is all over this bunch, later. If later, then > > > > possibly, earlier, too........ > > > > For what it is worth, I think the COFFEE/COFFEY family followed > the > > > > CUNNINGHAMS from Ireland to PA, then to PE County, VA and finally to > > > Wilkes > > > > and Greene County, GA. The HEARDS and even the FITZPATRICKS may have > > been > > > a > > > > part of this group, too. > > > > > > > > <<<< > > > > IE: > > > > > > > > Page 25.--26th February, 1762. Francis Tyler to Israel Christian, £40, > > > > a negro slave Hanna. Teste: W. Christian, Charles Donelly. > > > > > > > > Page 305.--22d June, 1763. Daniel Harrison and Sarah to James Green, > > > > £9, 100 acres in north fork of Linwell's Creek. Teste: James Gamwill, > > > > Charles Donnelly. > > > > > > > > Page 289.--18th March, 1768. George Wilson and Elizabeth, of > Hampshire, > > > > to Charles Donnelly, £90, 234 acres by patent 10th August, 1759, on > > > > Stewart's Creek above. Delivered to Charles Donnelly, March, 1778. > > > > > > > > MARCH 18, 1768 > > > > (521) Commission ordered to privily examine Elizabeth, wife of George > > > > Wilson, to deed to Charles Donnelly > > > > > > > > Page 106.--17th May, 1768. James Hugart's estate appraisement, by > James > > > > McCoy, Charles Donnerley, John Cartmill, recorded. > > > > > > > > MARCH 25, 1769 > > > > (125) Charles Donnerly and John McCreery appointed surveyors of road > > from > > > > Capt. Charles Lewis's to, the Fork of Dickinson's Road. > > > > > > > > Page 219.--24th February, 1770. Patrick Davis and Esther to James > > > > Millican, £30, 44 acres by patent dated 10th September, 1767, on > > > > Cowpasture River. Teste: Charles Lewis, Charles and Andrew Donnelly. > > > > Delivered: Andrew Donnelly, December, 1775. > > > > > > > > AUGUST 20, 1772 > > > > (409) Charles Lewis qualified Lieutenant Colonel of County. > > > > (411) Charles O'Donald, aged 17, orphan of Michael O'Donald, chose > > Thomas > > > > Stuart guardian. > > > > > > > > Page 9.--20th August, 1772. Thomas Stewart's bond (with George > Mathews, > > > > David Henderson) as guardian to Charles O'Donald, orphan of Michael > > > > O'Donald. > > > > > > > > Page 182.--4th December, 1772. William Sitlington's estate appraised > > > > by Charles Donelly, Ralph Laverty, William Reach--1 servant man > > appraised > > > > to Dorby Dedy, £18.00.0; 1 servant man. named Joseph, appraised > > > > to Blackhouse £15.10.0; 1 servant man, named Augustine Picket, > £14.00.0; > > > > 1 servant man, named Richard, appraised to Edwards, £14.00.0; 1 > servant > > > > woman appraised to £12.00.0. > > > > > > > > Page 208.--8th October, 1781. Elizabeth (mark) dark's will--To > daughter, > > > > Jean Elliot's heirs; to well beloved Elizabeth Breath (Reath, Reoth?); > > > > to daughter, Sarah Elliot; to daughter, Anne Dounlap; to daughter, > > Margret > > > > Clenkaid; to son, John Gridle; to son, James; to son, Alexander and > > > > to Alexander's wife; to four daughters; to son, Samuel; to son, > > William's > > > > heirs; to son, Robert. Executors, son Robert Clark and William Reaoh. > > > > Teste: Charles Donally, James McCleerey, Robt. Patterson, Geo. Berry. > > > > Proved, 20th November, 1781, by McCleerey and Berry. Robert Clark > > > > qualifies. > > > > > > > > Page 383.--25th October, 1781. Jane McCoy, of Greenbrier, widow and > > > > sole executrix of James McCoy, to Andrew and Charles Donnerley, > patented > > > > 10th August, 1759, to said James on Stewart's Creek. Teste: Hugh > > > > Brown, Andrew Sitlington, Nathan Crawford. > > > > > > > > > > > > Page 308.--16th June, 1783. Mary (mark) Donnelly relinquishes her > > > > right to administration on her husband's, Charles Donnelly's, estate > and > > > > nominates Andrew Donnelly, of Greenbrier, and her son, Andrew > Donnelly. > > > > Teste: James Bleake, William (mark) Gillespey. > > > > > > > > Page 308.--15th February, 1779. Charles Donnelly's will (of Cow > > > > Pasture)--To wife, Mary; to daughters, Jean Bleake, Mary Brown; to > other > > > > four children, viz: Andrew, Charles, Ann, Catherine; to sons, Andrew > and > > > > Charles Donnally, Jr. Executrix, Mary and Col. Andrew Donnally and > > > > son Andrew. Teste: James Bleke, John Gay, Wm. (mark) Gillespy. > > > > Proved, 17th June, 1783, by Blake and Gillespy. Gay is since dead. The > > > > two Andrews qualify. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > John R. Clarke > > > > Thomasville, GA > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Payne Daniel" <gpdfla@tampabay.rr.com> > > > > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2003 3:55 PM > > > > Subject: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > > > > > > > > > > > > > Afternoon John and all, I have a puzzler. Even an "I think" or an "I > > > told > > > > > you so" will be appreciated. Payne > > > > > > > > > > The Peter Daniel who married Sarah/Sally Lofton has been assigned to > > > > William > > > > > Daniel and Martha Field Allen Daniel. This assignment and the > > > possibility > > > > > that he was Peter Mickelborough Daniel the son of Charles Daniel and > > > Sarah > > > > > Tate is questionable. Even though PMD has the same stats as the > Peter > > > > Daniel > > > > > who was the s/o William and Martha, the Peter who was the son of > > Charles > > > > and > > > > > Sarah was not the same individual. That Peter married Jane Ann > > Mayfield > > > > and > > > > > Elizabeth Piner. Does all of this sound familiar : ) ? > > > > > > > > > > Now another scenerio. The Peter Daniel who was the son of David > Daniel > > > and > > > > > Margaret Lynch was most likley the Peter who married Sally Lofton. > > > There > > > > > are many collateral ties between the Loftins and the Lynchs and the > > > > Daniels > > > > > of Davidson County to support this connection. Ref: Jersey Baptist > > > Meeting > > > > > House Records in Davidson County where Peter, Charity and Mary made > > > > > applications in 1802. Had to be the son of David? > > > > > > > > > > Which Peter married Sally Lofton? We have at least two Peters > sharing > > > that > > > > > distinction and both can't have the same date of birth, but they do? > > > > > > > > > > Peter Daniel (Is this fact or fiction) Father: William DANIEL b: > 1740 > > > in, > > > > > Cumberland, Virginia - Mother: Pattie ALLEN b: Abt 1746 in > Cumberland, > > > > > Virginia - Marriage 1 Sarah LOFTON b: 1786 in, Montgomery, North > > > Carolina > > > > > Married: 28 MAR 1803 in Rowan, North Carolina - Sealing Spouse: 13 > MAR > > > > 1981 > > > > > in OGDEN Children: 1. Drury DANIEL b: Abt 1809 in Rowan, North > > Carolina. > > > > 2. > > > > > John T. DANIEL b: 1819 in Tennessee. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > > > > > If you are have any problems receiving the DANIEL List, would like > to > > > > change your subscription method or email address or you have a > > suggestion > > > > you think would improve the operation of the DANIEL list -- feel free > to > > > > contact me at any time - My email address is JClarke@rose.net > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > > > > If you are have any problems receiving the DANIEL List, would like to > > > change your subscription method or email address or you have a > suggestion > > > you think would improve the operation of the DANIEL list -- feel free to > > > contact me at any time - My email address is JClarke@rose.net > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > > > IF YOU MISS ANY MESSAGE: You can easily search the DANIEL List Archives > > at: > > > http://listsearches.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/listsearch.pl?list=DANIEL > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > > > Going on Vacation for longer than 5 days? Please unsubscribe > > > Click on the following link and your message is ready to send > > > Mail Mode: > > > mailto:DANIEL-L-request@rootsweb.com?subject=unsubscribe > > > or- > > > Digest Mode: > > > mailto:DANIEL-D-request@rootsweb.com?subject=unsubscribe > > > > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > > DO NOT FORGET: This is a Genealogical Mailing List and the posting of > > messages that do not relate to the DANIEL Family, its collateral families > or > > those of a historical nature relating to genealogical research -- are not > > allowed on this list. > > > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > > If you are have any problems receiving the DANIEL List, would like to > change your subscription method or email address or you have a suggestion > you think would improve the operation of the DANIEL list -- feel free to > contact me at any time - My email address is JClarke@rose.net > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > IF YOU MISS ANY MESSAGE: You can easily search the DANIEL List Archives at: > http://listsearches.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/listsearch.pl?list=DANIEL > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > DO NOT FORGET: This is a Genealogical Mailing List and the posting of messages that do not relate to the DANIEL Family, its collateral families or those of a historical nature relating to genealogical research -- are not allowed on this list. > >

Anne, I assume you know this is getting real close to my bunch. Harrison WATTS, a son of Thomas WATTS and Sarah EARLY, married Col. Rene FITZPATRICK (b. ABT 1785), the nephew of Capt. Benjamin FITZPATRICK RS-VA (1745-1821) of Greene County, GA, according to my information. Rene was the son of Joseph FITZPATRICK, Jr. and Elizabeth JONES, d/o Thomas JONES. Col. Rene who died in TX was named for his uncle, Rene who married Mary "Mollie" HARDWICK, and this Rene (the nephew) also married Mildred MAHONE and I have no idea who her parents were. I took a little look at this WATTS family and Col. Rene's daughter by Mary BIDDLE, Caroline Cornelia FITZPATRICK (1819-1905) married Dr. Stephen HORTON, Jr. MD, later of Holmes County, MS. Dr. HORTON's mother was a Judith HARDWICK and this all smells to be of the same bunch to me. We also know the EARLYS were from VA, the FITZPATRICKS were from VA and my bet is this whole bunch was from VA and they were probably all over each other, back there, too..... <grin> I also have an Emily HORTON born 1833, probably in Wilkes County, GA, who married Reuben F. STROZIER (1825-1892), s/o Reuben STROZIER and Pheriby CALLAWAY of Wilkes, later Meriwether County, GA. Pheriby was the d/o John Farrar CALLAWAY (1745-1821) and Bethany ARNOLD of Wilkes County, GA and her brother was John F. CALLAWAY, Jr. who married Mary MILNER. John, Jr and Mary were the parents of the Hon. Judge Elmore CALLAWAY of Eatonton, Putnam County, GA who married Cynthia Ann WILLIAMS, d/o Stephen WILLIAMS and Elizabeth THOMPSON of Little River, Putnam County, Ga. Judge Elmore CALLAWAY and Cynthia were the parents of Adeline Julia CALLOWAY (1833-1895) who married Capt. Benjamin William FITZPATRICK, CSA (1826-1885) of Madison, Morgan County, GA. Capt. Benjamin's mother was a HARRIS and his father was James FITZPATRICK, son of Capt. Benjamin FITZPATRICK RS-VA, Col. Rene FITZPATRICK's uncle. Benjamin and Julia's son, Henry Harris FITZPATRICK (1863-1934), married my aunt, Ida Reneau RICHTER (1879-1968) of Madison in 1903. Henry, a prosperous merchant in Madison, GA, and Ida lived most of their married life in the big six column white ante-bellum home on West Main in Madison, formerly the WADE, PORTER and MUSTIN home. The MUSTINS are a collateral family of the RICHTERS. There has been some mention that my POTTER family of St. Croix may have actually been PORTER at some point. This possibility is because the crimson and gold colors are common to both family crests. Family researchers are looking at that very possibility. We also already know the PORTER and OLIVER connections to many of this same bunch....... John R. Clarke Thomasville, GA ----- Original Message ----- From: <JetPilotUSAF100@cs.com> To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, December 22, 2003 2:59 AM Subject: [DANIEL-L] CORDIAL DANIEL ~ Keeping Marriages in the family. > Keeping Marriages In The Family ~ > > The 3rd spouse of Richard ASBURY, Mrs. Sarah WATTS, mentioned earlier... > > She was Sarah SHERRILL, b: 1786, Wilkes County, GA ~ Daughter of David WATTS. > Her 1st husband had been Archibald WATTS, d: JUL 1818, Greene County, GA > whom she married 16 DEC 1799, Green County, GA ~ Son of Thomas WATTS and Sarah > EARLY. > > Child of Sarah SHERRILL and Archibald WATTS: > Anne Elizabeth WATTS, bc: 1808 ~ married 17 APR 1824, to CORDIAL DANIEL ~ Son > of HENNING DANIEL and HANNAH ASBURY. > > So, John, I must agree with you regarding family associations and their > marriages down through the years... up to a 100 years at least, and maybe even near > 200. Think about the time I came along, my grams, b: 1869, had had enough... > wouldn't even let me play with my male cousins. > > Anne > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > Don't forget to change the Subject line of your message when you change the subject of a reply message. > >

And I, John, would like an explanation of the comment.."Bill Brewer's Questionable Line?" What is questionable or messy about my line? As I said in my last message to you, I have documentation of everything back to Benjamin Daniel being a son of William Daniel and Mary Snead. What is questionable about it. We don't know WHICH William Daniel, but I've made that very clear. Yes, some of the Sneads and Daniels went to Kentucky (along with the Browns, Mundays, and Noels), and yes, my branch of the Daniel family eventually ended up in Madison, Indiana. I don't know what your point was about that, but it did happen. Bill Brewer ----- Original Message ----- From: "Payne Daniel" <gpdfla@tampabay.rr.com> To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, December 22, 2003 6:57 AM Subject: [DANIEL-L] The Old Fence Sitter > Alas John, you are never at a loss for words. I reserve the right to change > my web page anytime there is some good reason to do so. To me the mention > that something is a mess in the context that you use it is bothersome. By > whose standards do you judge someone's work since everything is not as neat > and tidy as you would like. My web page changes that are Daniel-List driven > aren't as frequent as you make out and come only after careful consultation > with you, Jack, Mike, Robert, Joe, Ruth, Diane, Randy, etc., etc., etc. > > Additionally, many of my changes come about from sources that you and the > List are unaware of. My work is a compilation from all sources and makes no > claim to absolute authority. One researcher has asked me several pointed > questions about my Caroline connection and the proof thereof. We will work > on this inquiry out of the spot light and if there is something that needs > to be brought to your attention as the Daniel List Master, we will. > > If I recall, it was not I who had to change his position on several issues > such as the William Daniel who married Lucretia Bell and their connection to > the O'Daniels. I don't think you are still comfortable with my Middlesex > assignments, but be assured that I will at least consider your ideas, before > I make any notable changes. > > Anyway, sometime today or tomorrow I am going to unsubscribe from the List > until after Christmas. I need to do some reorganizing of my thoughts and > respond to several inquiries that are time consuming. Be kind to me while I > am away and if you think that something is a mess let me know. > > BTW, thanks for your thoughts on the Burney/Randle issue. > > MERRY CHRISTMAS ALL and stay in touch. > > The Old Fence Sitter in Tampa. Payne > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "John R. Clarke" <jclarke@rose.net> > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Monday, December 22, 2003 12:27 AM > Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > > > > Payne, > > Webster's defines "mess" as a "disorderly accumulation" among one of > its > > various meanings. From what I know about this particular DANIEL line, > that > > definition probably describes our knowledge of this DANIEL line about as > > well as any descriptor I have ever seen affixed to any DANIEL line, unless > > you are privy to something I am not. What was it you used to call part of > > this DANIEL line -- the "Bill Brewer Questionable Line?" > > As you know, I like things neat and orderly. I like families that > marry > > into the same families their cousins, aunts and uncles married into. > Makes > > things, like key assignment and family inter-family relationships, a > little > > easier to understand. Do you not agree? > > As for your website, you seem to change things so often in the past > > several years, I sometimes cannot always keep up with your current > > assignments. One time I go to your website and you have this Daniel boy > > assigned to one family and the next time I go to your website, you have > him > > assigned to some completely different DANIEL family. I can understand > some > > minor variations in family assignments, within a certain DANIEL family, > but > > I do not understand these changes when these variations cross family > > boundaries. Early researchers were sometimes a little wrong on who a > > particular boy or girl were a son of but they were usually in the right > ball > > park, even if they were not in the right section, row and aisle. > > Several or more times a year I go to your website and try to reconcile > > our differences, noting them to you, but when one has thousands and > > thousands of DANIELS, as I do, it is hard to keep up with these changes, > > especially to key assignments. > > We have made some key assignment changes in the past several years. > One > > was the straightening out of the mess in the Middlesex bunch, i.e. James > > DANIEL and Jane HICKS, Chesley DANIEL and Judith, et. al., as well as some > > of the major changes in the Thomas DANIEL and Elizabeth line out of > Tyrrell > > County, NC and the Simon and Elizabeth line out of Edgecombe but some of > the > > changes I have seen recently on you website are completely outside of my > > database. > > Much of this put of different information into an apples and oranges > > situation, sometimes. I see apples and you are talking about oranges. > This > > may be one of those times. > > As for the BREWERS, I have lots of BREWERS tied to various families > very > > close to my DANIEL bunch. They are tied to the REIDS, WYCHES, WALTONS and > > even to a maternal great-grand uncle, George M. DAME of Montgomery County, > > GA. The DAMES lived in Middlesex County, VA before migrating to Dodge > > County, GA. The WYCHES, WALTONS and REIDS are all over my paternal Morgan > > County, GA family, which includes the DANIELS. > > I have looked at this COLEMAN-DANIEL line, very closely in the past, > > because of the Eden COLEMAN who ties into the Thomas DANIEL and Sarah > > BURNEY/RANDLE line in Greene County, GA. I assume you still have this > > "Bill Brewer Questionable Line" tied to the William DANIEL and Elizabeth > > COLEMAN out of Caroline County, VA? Anyway, that was where it was the > > last time I reconciled my information against yours and assume it is still > > there. Regardless, that is where I have it in my information. If you > have > > moved it to another DANIEL family or sub-family, please advise, because I > > like for our key assignment information to agree. > > We both know the SNEADS went to KY and any family that usually went to > > KY had a good chance to floating across the Ohio River into either OH, IN > or > > IL. I have nothing against being related to the SNEADS, at all. Swinging > > Sammy and I were born on the same day, the 27th of May, and we are both > > pretty good golfers. <grin> I do not even have anything against being > > related to the GILBERTS, another KY family, either. Larry GILBERT and I > > played a round a few years ago and he beat me one stroke on the last hole > > but I did not hold it against him. <grin> Larry was a nice fellow and a > > gentleman, as I assume Sammy was, and the world is lesser place for their > > passing. > > Do not think that I did not read about the Sen. Strom THURMAN > situation > > with some degree of apprehension, especially since two of the surnames > > listed for two of his nieces were identical to those of close families and > > especially since one of the daughters of one of my great-grand uncles, a > > RENO, married a THURMAN. Nor the fact I have some family pictures taken > in > > the 1850's in this same RENEAU family that don't look exactly Kosher. > > <grin> I thought this may have been something only attributable to that > one > > RENO family until a cousin told me she had similar pictures in her family > > albums from the same period. We all know this kind of stuff went on in > the > > days before the Civil War and I assume at least as late as 1924 in SC. > > <grin> > > As for facts, I wish I had some to offer you on the RANDLE-BURNEY > > possibilities, but I do not. I can only say, if the mother of the > children > > of Thomas DANIEL of Greene County, GA was a Sarah BURNEY, the d/o Simon, > Sr. > > and Elizabeth HARDY, then that points to Eastern NC for his origins. If > she > > was a RANDLE, a real possibility, that points to VA for his origins, so > take > > your pick. My best guess is she was a RANDLE but I have his wife, > > currently, as Sarah BURNEY........ > > > > John R. Clarke > > Thomasville, GA > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Payne Daniel" <gpdfla@tampabay.rr.com> > > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2003 9:34 AM > > Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > > > > > > Morning John , I am pleased that you visit my web site and find items of > > interest to share with the List. Howsoever: > > > > Joe Daniel and I put the "Bill Brewer" line where it is after some > > consultation with Bill. "Cobbled Up", even Bill is not 100% happy with the > > assignment, but a mess in his work, I can't buy that. If you have some > > constructive input to help us clear up the so called mess??, please let us > > know in detail. > > > > So far I subscribe to the position that Burney and Randall gals were > married > > to Thomas Daniel. When I review your most recent ideas about that > > possibility, I may change my mind. We need some facts man! > > > > Aha, TV basket ball today to cleanse the little gray cells from all this > > genealogical morass. I am a DUKIE and Robert is a GATOR, so John bring on > > the DAWGS. > > > > Talk to ya'll later. Payne > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "John R. Clarke" <jclarke@rose.net> > > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Friday, December 19, 2003 1:03 PM > > Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > > > > > > > Payne, > > > One researcher has Thomas DANIEL of Greene County, GA married to a > > Sarah > > > RANDLE and Sarah BURNEY with the kids being shown as the children of > Sarah > > > BURNEY. They also have this Thomas the son of William DANIEL and > > Elizabeth > > > COLEMAN of Caroline County, VA. What a cobbled up line, that is - that > is > > > the Bill BREWER line and talk about a mess, that is it..... > > > It almost seems that some, when they cannot put their known ancestor > > > with a specific line, they find the line with the most question marks > and > > > "bingo," they have an instant ancestor. <grin> I think there were > > probably > > > two Thomas DANIELS in Greene County -- one, a part of that Kelso-Daniel > > line > > > and another from NC. One married a RANDLE and one married a BURNEY. > > > The only possibility is that BURNEY was not BURNEY but BIRNEY and > > > floated out of that Northern VA and Maryland BIRNEY family. I know that > > > part of that family migrated from MD/PA/VA to KY and then back into > > Northern > > > Alabama. Because of their opposition to slavery they later peddled > their > > > way back north to the Washington, DC area. > > > This BIRNEY family is tied to my bunch - the son of General William > > > BIRNEY and Catherine HOFFMAN of Prince Frederick County, MD, Theodore > Weld > > > BIRNEY (1854-1897), married my second cousin, Alice Josephine McCLELLAN > > > (1858-1907) in 1892 as her second husband. Her mother was a TATUM and > > her > > > grandmother a POTTER, a younger sister of my GGM, Anne Eliza POTTER. > > Alice > > > also married a WHITE from Charleston, SC as her first husband but is > most > > > remembered for her latter marriage and name, Alice McClellan BIRNEY.. > > > This was why I made the note about the McCLELLANDS of Augusta > County, > > VA > > > in the note about the McDONALDS, O'DONALDS and DONNELLYS the other day. > > The > > > spelling of their name was butchered by civil servants, too.. > > > I do not know about this bunch in Greene County, GA. A lot of their > > > links do not make sense but they are tied all over the FITZPATRICKS and > > any > > > family tied to that bunch has links back to Goochland, Cumberland, > > Fauquier > > > and even Augusta County, VA. > > > I know I am starting to see a pattern here that makes sense. This > > > Thomas could be a Woodson-Daniel descendant or he could be a part of > that > > > Kelso-Daniel bunch. I do not know but I would like to look at the > > > possibility they are all related. This is the simplest solution but > that > > > may not be the case. > > > In fact, one of these may be a DONALD, McDONALD, DONALDSON, DONELLY > or > > > something along these lines and to make things simple down in Greene > > County, > > > they just shortened their name to DANIEL. Regardless, they all seem to > be > > > of the same financial and educational profiles. > > > If I was going to guess, I would say that one of these Greene > County, > > > GA families was out of Lancaster, PA and/or Frederick County, MD area > and > > > was originally a McDONALD, DONELLY, O'DONALD or something along those > > lines, > > > which is why we cannot trace them back as a DANIEL. My bet is McDONALD > > and > > > the name change occurred around the time of the RW because of the > Loyalist > > > McDONALD family. In fact, some of this bunch may have been loyalists > and > > > dumped the name and took up DANIEL to keep this association out of > > > subsequent generations. > > > Personally, I never understand why the CUNNINGHAMS kept their name > > since > > > the "Butcher of SC" was a CUNNINGHAM and these folks in Greene County, > GA > > > had to know the hard feelings this name had for many who also migrated > > from > > > SC to GA in the years after the RW. This may account for the reason the > > > CUNNINGHAMS married "so close" - none of the other folks in the area > would > > > have anything to do with them. You know the South, as I do -- hard > > feelings > > > and family hatreds linger on for years, regardless of how much money you > > > have. <grin> > > > > > > John R. Clarke > > > Thomasville, GA > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Payne Daniel" <gpdfla@tampabay.rr.com> > > > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Friday, December 19, 2003 11:32 AM > > > Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > > > > > > > > > Can we have the best of both worlds. That is, Thomas was married to both > > > gals. What stats do you have on the Burney gal and likewise on the > Randall > > > gal? Can they co-mingle in a relationship with Thomas? I enjoyed your > > > possibilities and I will keep chewing on this stuff. > > > > > > Thanks to John and Mike for their thoughts on my Peter Daniel delema and > > to > > > those of you who chipped in on my Marmaduke study. > > > > > > Lunch time ya'll. Payne > > > > > > "The supreme irony of life is that hardly anyone gets out of it alive." > > > -- Robert Heinlein, "Job", 1984 > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "John R. Clarke" <jclarke@rose.net> > > > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Friday, December 19, 2003 10:29 AM > > > Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > > > > > > > > > > Well, Payne, you know how I closely watch family associations in these > > > > DANIEL families and Charles DANIEL (1773-ABT 1800) of Greene County, > GA > > > > being a son of Thomas DANIEL and Sarah BURNEY of NC, makes no sense > > > > whatsoever to me, if he married Elizabeth COFFEE, d/o Peter COFFEE. > > > > However, it does make sense if Charles's mother was a RANDLE and > Thomas > > > was > > > > a VA DANIEL and not a NC DANIEL, which the BURNEY link seems to imply. > > > > > > > > Also note the many Charleston, SC connections in the family of William > > > > Coffee DANIEL (son of Charles and Elizabeth COFFEE of Greene County, > > > GA) -- > > > > he married a SCREVEN girl whose family was out of Charleston and > > > Charleston > > > > families are a big link in my bunch. Dr. William Coffee DANIEL I am > > pretty > > > > sure was the GA Senator William DANIEL of Savannah who interceded with > > the > > > > senate on behalf of the Methodist preacher, whom Judge L. Q. C. LAMAR > of > > > > Milledgeville, GA had condemned to death in 1832, only to find out > > later, > > > he > > > > was innocent. Remember also, that Professor Winfield Montgomery > RIVERS, > > > who > > > > married the widow of Robert W. DANIEL (my GGF), was living with Sarah > > > > Williamson Bird LAMAR, Judge LAMAR's widow, in Newton County, GA in > > 1850. > > > > > > > > As you will note, my DANIEL bunch of Burke, later Jefferson County, GA > > > > matches the profile of this bunch from Greene County, GA to a tee and > > one > > > of > > > > this Thomas and Sarah's kids of Greene County, GA were the > > > > great-grandparents of a girl, Mary Lou HUNTER, who married directly > into > > > my > > > > RICHTER family in Madison, through the RALLS (also a VA family), > > COLEMANS > > > > and DANIEL of Greensboro, Greene County, GA. So, I am already > connected > > > to > > > > this DANIEL bunch in Greene County, GA in one way but tis the other > that > > > > interests me..... > > > > > > > > My bet is that my family of Burke County, GA is related in some way to > > > these > > > > Greene County, GA folks, either through Thomas and Sarah or through > the > > > > CUNNINGHAM-DANIEL bunch. However, it could be a class thing and not a > > > > family thing. > > > > > > > > However, there is a pretty good possibility that my bunch had links to > > the > > > > Upper Neck area of VA, maybe even Augusta County, VA, which may > explain > > > the > > > > RENEAU connection in this family. Also, Robert DANIELL's "O'DANIEL > > family > > > > of Fairfax County, VA" seems to be the only DANIEL related family that > > has > > > > links to both the names, ERWIN, TAYLOR and WISE, that I need for my > > bunch > > > in > > > > Burke County, GA to fly. We also know this O'DANIEL family was from > > > Fairfax > > > > County, VA, met the profile of my bunch and probably had many links > into > > > the > > > > Upper Neck area of VA. They later migrated down to GA through NC and > my > > > > DANIEL or DANIELL bunch may well be a part of this migration but we > > cannot > > > > find the name, Robert, in this bunch. > > > > > > > > I think the answer to my bunch may be in correcting the DANIEL > families > > of > > > > Greene County, GA - both of them. I think they are cobbled up, as > they > > > now > > > > stand, primarily because they do not make sense. > > > > > > > > John R. Clarke > > > > Thomasville, GA > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Payne Daniel" <gpdfla@tampabay.rr.com> > > > > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > Sent: Friday, December 19, 2003 9:33 AM > > > > Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes I noticed. I remain interested in the Randle and Burney > connections > > > and > > > > the will you mentioned. > > > > > > > > Payne > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "John R. Clarke" <jclarke@rose.net> > > > > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2003 6:37 PM > > > > Subject: Re: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > > > > > > > > > > > > > Payne, > > > > > Did you happen to notice the given name, Charles, all over that > > > > DONELLY, > > > > > McDONALD and other DANIEL related information from Upper Neck and > > > Augusta > > > > > County, VA which I posted, yesterday? > > > > > I am still trying to figure out who this DONELLY bunch was but I > > > know > > > > > they are all over the LEWIS, CAMPBELL and CROW families of that > area, > > a > > > > lot > > > > > of which later migrated into the OH territory. From what I do know, > > > this > > > > > bunch migrated from Scotland to Ireland and then to Botetourt > County, > > > VA, > > > > > later Augusta County, VA. I would almost bet this DONELLY, or > > O'DONALD > > > as > > > > > they are sometimes referred to in these civil records, came with > them, > > > > > before or after. > > > > > This DONELLY, O'DONALD or McDONALD family I think had links to > the > > > > > Lancaster County, PA area or had ties to that area. I also think > > there > > > is > > > > a > > > > > good possibility they were probably tied in some way to that BOONES > > and > > > > > BRYAN bunch from that same general area. > > > > > The reason I ask about the name, Charles, is Charles is not a > > given > > > > name > > > > > in any of the families I know which later migrated into Greene and > > > Wilkes > > > > > County, GA. I cannot say these families in Augusta County, VA are > > > around > > > > > the CUNNINGHAMS of that area but they sure were in the same general > > > area, > > > > at > > > > > one point, and we know that bunch later migrated south into VA from > > PA. > > > > > I want to see that will of Thomas DANIEL of Greene County, GA, > > that > > > > > confirms the Charles DANIEL (1773-1803) who married Elizabeth > COFFEE, > > > was > > > > a > > > > > son of Thomas DANIEL and Sarah BURNEY of Greene County, GA if > someone > > > has > > > > > it. The given name, Charles, just does not fit this family nor does > a > > > link > > > > > to the COFFEES. > > > > > The reason I say it does not fit is -- (1) These VA families > > tended > > > to > > > > > marry only into what were, once, VA families (2) These families > > married > > > > all > > > > > over each other -- cousins married cousins. > > > > > For Peter COFFEE to let his daughter break with tradition and > > marry > > > > into > > > > > a NC family does not match their profile at all, unless Thomas > DANIEL > > > was > > > > > out of this same DANIEL line that came south with them and the > > > CUNNINHJAMS > > > > > from VA....... > > > > > If the latter, then I think Thomas DANIEL of Greene County, GA > was > > > > > really married to a Sarah RANDLE, something that others have > reported > > > > > because the RANDLE name is all over this bunch, later. If later, > then > > > > > possibly, earlier, too........ > > > > > For what it is worth, I think the COFFEE/COFFEY family followed > > the > > > > > CUNNINGHAMS from Ireland to PA, then to PE County, VA and finally to > > > > Wilkes > > > > > and Greene County, GA. The HEARDS and even the FITZPATRICKS may > have > > > been > > > > a > > > > > part of this group, too. > > > > > > > > > > <<<< > > > > > IE: > > > > > > > > > > Page 25.--26th February, 1762. Francis Tyler to Israel Christian, > £40, > > > > > a negro slave Hanna. Teste: W. Christian, Charles Donelly. > > > > > > > > > > Page 305.--22d June, 1763. Daniel Harrison and Sarah to James Green, > > > > > £9, 100 acres in north fork of Linwell's Creek. Teste: James > Gamwill, > > > > > Charles Donnelly. > > > > > > > > > > Page 289.--18th March, 1768. George Wilson and Elizabeth, of > > Hampshire, > > > > > to Charles Donnelly, £90, 234 acres by patent 10th August, 1759, on > > > > > Stewart's Creek above. Delivered to Charles Donnelly, March, 1778. > > > > > > > > > > MARCH 18, 1768 > > > > > (521) Commission ordered to privily examine Elizabeth, wife of > George > > > > > Wilson, to deed to Charles Donnelly > > > > > > > > > > Page 106.--17th May, 1768. James Hugart's estate appraisement, by > > James > > > > > McCoy, Charles Donnerley, John Cartmill, recorded. > > > > > > > > > > MARCH 25, 1769 > > > > > (125) Charles Donnerly and John McCreery appointed surveyors of > road > > > from > > > > > Capt. Charles Lewis's to, the Fork of Dickinson's Road. > > > > > > > > > > Page 219.--24th February, 1770. Patrick Davis and Esther to James > > > > > Millican, £30, 44 acres by patent dated 10th September, 1767, on > > > > > Cowpasture River. Teste: Charles Lewis, Charles and Andrew Donnelly. > > > > > Delivered: Andrew Donnelly, December, 1775. > > > > > > > > > > AUGUST 20, 1772 > > > > > (409) Charles Lewis qualified Lieutenant Colonel of County. > > > > > (411) Charles O'Donald, aged 17, orphan of Michael O'Donald, chose > > > Thomas > > > > > Stuart guardian. > > > > > > > > > > Page 9.--20th August, 1772. Thomas Stewart's bond (with George > > Mathews, > > > > > David Henderson) as guardian to Charles O'Donald, orphan of Michael > > > > > O'Donald. > > > > > > > > > > Page 182.--4th December, 1772. William Sitlington's estate appraised > > > > > by Charles Donelly, Ralph Laverty, William Reach--1 servant man > > > appraised > > > > > to Dorby Dedy, £18.00.0; 1 servant man. named Joseph, appraised > > > > > to Blackhouse £15.10.0; 1 servant man, named Augustine Picket, > > £14.00.0; > > > > > 1 servant man, named Richard, appraised to Edwards, £14.00.0; 1 > > servant > > > > > woman appraised to £12.00.0. > > > > > > > > > > Page 208.--8th October, 1781. Elizabeth (mark) dark's will--To > > daughter, > > > > > Jean Elliot's heirs; to well beloved Elizabeth Breath (Reath, > Reoth?); > > > > > to daughter, Sarah Elliot; to daughter, Anne Dounlap; to daughter, > > > Margret > > > > > Clenkaid; to son, John Gridle; to son, James; to son, Alexander and > > > > > to Alexander's wife; to four daughters; to son, Samuel; to son, > > > William's > > > > > heirs; to son, Robert. Executors, son Robert Clark and William > Reaoh. > > > > > Teste: Charles Donally, James McCleerey, Robt. Patterson, Geo. > Berry. > > > > > Proved, 20th November, 1781, by McCleerey and Berry. Robert Clark > > > > > qualifies. > > > > > > > > > > Page 383.--25th October, 1781. Jane McCoy, of Greenbrier, widow and > > > > > sole executrix of James McCoy, to Andrew and Charles Donnerley, > > patented > > > > > 10th August, 1759, to said James on Stewart's Creek. Teste: Hugh > > > > > Brown, Andrew Sitlington, Nathan Crawford. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Page 308.--16th June, 1783. Mary (mark) Donnelly relinquishes her > > > > > right to administration on her husband's, Charles Donnelly's, estate > > and > > > > > nominates Andrew Donnelly, of Greenbrier, and her son, Andrew > > Donnelly. > > > > > Teste: James Bleake, William (mark) Gillespey. > > > > > > > > > > Page 308.--15th February, 1779. Charles Donnelly's will (of Cow > > > > > Pasture)--To wife, Mary; to daughters, Jean Bleake, Mary Brown; to > > other > > > > > four children, viz: Andrew, Charles, Ann, Catherine; to sons, Andrew > > and > > > > > Charles Donnally, Jr. Executrix, Mary and Col. Andrew Donnally and > > > > > son Andrew. Teste: James Bleke, John Gay, Wm. (mark) Gillespy. > > > > > Proved, 17th June, 1783, by Blake and Gillespy. Gay is since dead. > The > > > > > two Andrews qualify. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > John R. Clarke > > > > > Thomasville, GA > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: "Payne Daniel" <gpdfla@tampabay.rr.com> > > > > > To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2003 3:55 PM > > > > > Subject: [DANIEL-L] Family Puzzler > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Afternoon John and all, I have a puzzler. Even an "I think" or an > "I > > > > told > > > > > > you so" will be appreciated. Payne > > > > > > > > > > > > The Peter Daniel who married Sarah/Sally Lofton has been assigned > to > > > > > William > > > > > > Daniel and Martha Field Allen Daniel. This assignment and the > > > > possibility > > > > > > that he was Peter Mickelborough Daniel the son of Charles Daniel > and > > > > Sarah > > > > > > Tate is questionable. Even though PMD has the same stats as the > > Peter > > > > > Daniel > > > > > > who was the s/o William and Martha, the Peter who was the son of > > > Charles > > > > > and > > > > > > Sarah was not the same individual. That Peter married Jane Ann > > > Mayfield > > > > > and > > > > > > Elizabeth Piner. Does all of this sound familiar : ) ? > > > > > > > > > > > > Now another scenerio. The Peter Daniel who was the son of David > > Daniel > > > > and > > > > > > Margaret Lynch was most likley the Peter who married Sally Lofton. > > > > There > > > > > > are many collateral ties between the Loftins and the Lynchs and > the > > > > > Daniels > > > > > > of Davidson County to support this connection. Ref: Jersey Baptist > > > > Meeting > > > > > > House Records in Davidson County where Peter, Charity and Mary > made > > > > > > applications in 1802. Had to be the son of David? > > > > > > > > > > > > Which Peter married Sally Lofton? We have at least two Peters > > sharing > > > > that > > > > > > distinction and both can't have the same date of birth, but they > do? > > > > > > > > > > > > Peter Daniel (Is this fact or fiction) Father: William DANIEL b: > > 1740 > > > > in, > > > > > > Cumberland, Virginia - Mother: Pattie ALLEN b: Abt 1746 in > > Cumberland, > > > > > > Virginia - Marriage 1 Sarah LOFTON b: 1786 in, Montgomery, North > > > > Carolina > > > > > > Married: 28 MAR 1803 in Rowan, North Carolina - Sealing Spouse: 13 > > MAR > > > > > 1981 > > > > > > in OGDEN Children: 1. Drury DANIEL b: Abt 1809 in Rowan, North > > > Carolina. > > > > > 2. > > > > > > John T. DANIEL b: 1819 in Tennessee. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > > > > > > If you are have any problems receiving the DANIEL List, would like > > to > > > > > change your subscription method or email address or you have a > > > suggestion > > > > > you think would improve the operation of the DANIEL list -- feel > free > > to > > > > > contact me at any time - My email address is JClarke@rose.net > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > > > > > If you are have any problems receiving the DANIEL List, would like > to > > > > change your subscription method or email address or you have a > > suggestion > > > > you think would improve the operation of the DANIEL list -- feel free > to > > > > contact me at any time - My email address is JClarke@rose.net > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > > > > IF YOU MISS ANY MESSAGE: You can easily search the DANIEL List > Archives > > > at: > > > > http://listsearches.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/listsearch.pl?list=DANIEL > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > > > > Going on Vacation for longer than 5 days? Please unsubscribe > > > > Click on the following link and your message is ready to send > > > > Mail Mode: > > > > mailto:DANIEL-L-request@rootsweb.com?subject=unsubscribe > > > > or- > > > > Digest Mode: > > > > mailto:DANIEL-D-request@rootsweb.com?subject=unsubscribe > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > > > DO NOT FORGET: This is a Genealogical Mailing List and the posting of > > > messages that do not relate to the DANIEL Family, its collateral > families > > or > > > those of a historical nature relating to genealogical research -- are > not > > > allowed on this list. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > > > If you are have any problems receiving the DANIEL List, would like to > > change your subscription method or email address or you have a suggestion > > you think would improve the operation of the DANIEL list -- feel free to > > contact me at any time - My email address is JClarke@rose.net > > > > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > > IF YOU MISS ANY MESSAGE: You can easily search the DANIEL List Archives > at: > > http://listsearches.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/listsearch.pl?list=DANIEL > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > > DO NOT FORGET: This is a Genealogical Mailing List and the posting of > messages that do not relate to the DANIEL Family, its collateral families or > those of a historical nature relating to genealogical research -- are not > allowed on this list. > > > > > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > Going on Vacation for longer than 5 days? Please unsubscribe > Click on the following link and your message is ready to send > Mail Mode: > mailto:DANIEL-L-request@rootsweb.com?subject=unsubscribe > or- > Digest Mode: > mailto:DANIEL-D-request@rootsweb.com?subject=unsubscribe >

Anne, I must have missed this post. If she was Sarah SHERRILL wife of Archibald WATTS, how could she be a daughter of David WATTS? The rest of it makes sense. Was she Sarah SHERRILL, d/o David SHERRILL? That would make more sense. <grin> Since I must have missed this post, drop me a personal note on this bunch, if you would..... I like Wilkes County, GA because it and Oglethorpe County were big VA counties whose descendants later fed into Greene County, as well as my favorite Georgia county, Morgan. I also have lots of links to Oglethorpe and Greene County, GA, which means they also had lots of links into Wilkes. Has anyone ever read the history of Washington, GA? In short, during the RW Stephen HEARD, whose family is all over my Morgan County, GA bunch, was the "de facto" CEO of the State of Georgia after the Georgians were forced to abandon Louisville due to the British capture the City of Augusta and for a short period Stephen HEARD basically ran the government of the State of GA out of Washington, Wilkes County, GA. I think this history also says there something like 58,000 people in Washington County, GA, making it one of the most populous counties in the state and they were all, mostly, of VA origins. John R. Clarke Thomasville, GA ----- Original Message ----- From: <JetPilotUSAF100@cs.com> To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, December 22, 2003 2:59 AM Subject: [DANIEL-L] CORDIAL DANIEL ~ Keeping Marriages in the family. > Keeping Marriages In The Family ~ > > The 3rd spouse of Richard ASBURY, Mrs. Sarah WATTS, mentioned earlier... > > She was Sarah SHERRILL, b: 1786, Wilkes County, GA ~ Daughter of David WATTS. > Her 1st husband had been Archibald WATTS, d: JUL 1818, Greene County, GA > whom she married 16 DEC 1799, Green County, GA ~ Son of Thomas WATTS and Sarah > EARLY. > > Child of Sarah SHERRILL and Archibald WATTS: > Anne Elizabeth WATTS, bc: 1808 ~ married 17 APR 1824, to CORDIAL DANIEL ~ Son > of HENNING DANIEL and HANNAH ASBURY. > > So, John, I must agree with you regarding family associations and their > marriages down through the years... up to a 100 years at least, and maybe even near > 200. Think about the time I came along, my grams, b: 1869, had had enough... > wouldn't even let me play with my male cousins. > > Anne > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > Don't forget to change the Subject line of your message when you change the subject of a reply message. > >

Anne, I just do not see it any other way. Look at my maternal bunch that migrated from the VA area prior to the RW and later through NC and SC to Bulloch County and later Clinch County, GA. Everyone of these folks, which include the TOMLINSON, DAME, SIRMAN, HARDEMAN, MOORES, FIVASH, STALVEY, etc. are all related to me in one way or another and these marriages flowed all the way down to South Georgia and accelerated, there, for the next 100 years. These people were also not part of Erskine CALDWELL's antithesis of Southern Culture, either. <grin> The more or less typical approved marriage of Colonial times was at a second cousin level with first cousins not outside the realm of possibility. I can go right down through hundreds of lines in my data and bingo, bingo, bingo -- cousin marriages all over the place. It has only been in the last 100 years that the gene pool has begun to expand with the exclusion of other families, accelerating after WW II. This was not all bad, either, because the divorce rate was almost non-existent in those days. <grin> I well could have married my second cousin. If I had known how she felt about me, I probably would have since I felt the same about her. However, I never told her and did not find out her feelings about me until some 20 years later after we were both married. Surprising how my wife and my cousin are both blondes, both have about the same disposition and both are Southern ladies, isn't it? Neither one of us have ever been divorced, either. Marriages among family members worked because they generally had more in common, were of a common religion and they also had the pressure and support of the family to help them through the difficult times all marriages face, at one time or another. Momma always said the reasons the TOMLINSONS "kept it close" was to keep the money and land in the family and I assume this was also the reason other families supported these types of marriages. Another reason was mothers were usually the match makers and there were only so many people in the general area and all of them were family of sorts, so the options were generally limited, more so earlier, than later. There is also the old axiom that "water seeks its own level" and people generally marry at their same level. Since there were only so many eligible persons of a certain class in a certain area, their options were also generally limited. This is why I chase collaterals. Not that people always married within these collaterals but like the card dealer at Las Vegas, I play the odds and the odds in that era was that kids married family and if not family, very close friends of family. I think when we get this "mess" straightened out we will find these families married over and over again into the same group of families, just like the MOORES and MOYES of Princess Anne County, VA who followed each other for some 300 years, as the story goes. I am also sure certain lines in these families occasionally broke with convention but you often see the next generation returning to this pattern. I am also sure you will see the same pattern in the "old country," as you later see in the Colonies. My wife and I were talking, yesterday, about the people who settled this country. They were not the "scum of Europe," as some like to depict them. Far from it, they were the best and the brightest of Europe, even in recent times. People came to the colonies for a "new lease on life" and were smart enough to realize the static old ways of their homeland did not offer them what they wanted or needed for themselves or their children. Sure, England lost a whole generation in World War I but their decline had begun some 300 years before, because their best and brightest, as well as the best and brightest of the rest of western Europe, had long since departed to America seeking their fame and fortune. I am also sure the intelligence vacuum in both Germany and Russia created the conditions which allowed the Nazi's and Communists to take over in both of these countries after World War I. A country survives on the collective efforts of its "best and brightest" and without the efforts of these two groups you will see a gradual decline in that countries prominence and. like Rome, its ultimate fate. We now live in an era where government attempts to "legislate equality," but like their failed attempts to "legislate morality" they will find these efforts do not work, either, because none of us are equal, except under the eyes of the law, if then. John R. Clarke Thomasville, GA ----- Original Message ----- From: <JetPilotUSAF100@cs.com> To: <DANIEL-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, December 22, 2003 2:59 AM Subject: [DANIEL-L] CORDIAL DANIEL ~ Keeping Marriages in the family. > Keeping Marriages In The Family ~ > > The 3rd spouse of Richard ASBURY, Mrs. Sarah WATTS, mentioned earlier... > > She was Sarah SHERRILL, b: 1786, Wilkes County, GA ~ Daughter of David WATTS. > Her 1st husband had been Archibald WATTS, d: JUL 1818, Greene County, GA > whom she married 16 DEC 1799, Green County, GA ~ Son of Thomas WATTS and Sarah > EARLY. > > Child of Sarah SHERRILL and Archibald WATTS: > Anne Elizabeth WATTS, bc: 1808 ~ married 17 APR 1824, to CORDIAL DANIEL ~ Son > of HENNING DANIEL and HANNAH ASBURY. > > So, John, I must agree with you regarding family associations and their > marriages down through the years... up to a 100 years at least, and maybe even near > 200. Think about the time I came along, my grams, b: 1869, had had enough... > wouldn't even let me play with my male cousins. > > Anne > > > > ==== DANIEL Mailing List ==== > Don't forget to change the Subject line of your message when you change the subject of a reply message. > >