The problem arises when two groups of descendants from two different groups of emigrees discuss what they are. I never heard a reference to Czech in my home in family context. It referred to a country in Europe. I did always hear that I was Bohemian, that my father's parents came from Bohemia (and like almost everyone else from that time period, the classic place seemed to be from "near Prague"). Finally in research, I obtained the death certificates of my grandparents, my father was the informer on the certificates, he said that his parents were born in Czechoslovakia (they died in 1922 and 1935). Of course, they had not. They both had been born in the Empire and came with their parents leaving behind status as subjects of the Emperor. Those, however, who came later appear to have had a different sense of definition about who they were. They think in terms of Czech. The earlier group thinks in terms of Bohemia. Dreaming? I dream in Wisconsin and Minnesota, never in Virginia. I grew up with snow and bluffs and huge evergreen trees and rivers and lakes. Why on earth would I dream in Virginia? Fifty years in the Virginia heat has not changed that for me. What do I talk? I suspect I still talk Wisconsinite. What has been my most treasured find in research? A small book "Bohemian Flats" about the settlers in the 1860s along the water in Minneapolis. http://www1.umn.edu/urelate/kiosk/0703kiosk/mississippi.html My grandparents owned a home, not at Bohemian Flats, but I hold that place near and dear. "Pobuda said, “I started to research my own Bohemian heritage. At the [University of Minnesota], I learned of the Bohemian Flats. I began to realize how many Czechs and Slovaks and Bohemians were connected to this area. As an artist, I created work about the Flats and immigration. … Even though the borders change and you’re an American, you’re still part of where you came from.” She said she hopes that next year, more nationalities will participate." http://www.readthebridge.info/node/23 Elaine TV is chewing gum for the eyes. --Frank Lloyd Wright Hello john On Sunday, April 9, 2006, you wrote > Another for instance. It has been stated by > both my dad's immediate > family in Indiana and his uncle in Wisconsin's children, that their > grandmother spoke only Bohemian. Never said > Czech, so is Bohemian just > another dialect of the Czech language? Boy am I > confusing the issue even > MORE or WHAT? HA HA. sorry folks... > Ron and Betty Mlejnek wrote: >> Everything would be correct when using geographical points of >> reference. However, I do not think that Czechs from Bohemia >> considered themselves identical to Germans from Bohemia. Ethnically >> and linguistically they are different because the had "dreams" in >> different languages. A person from Armenia might call himself an >> Armenian even if he lived in Prague. :-D >>

since Czechoslovakia never existed in that name until 1918.......then what they spoke prior to that was ?????? It was the Kingdom of Bohemia......wouldn't they then speak BOHEMIAN??? Barbara ----- Original Message ----- From: "john" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, April 09, 2006 7:00 PM Subject: Re: [CZ] Czech / Bohemian language > Another for instance. It has been stated by both my dad's immediate > family in Indiana and his uncle in Wisconsin's children, that their > grandmother spoke only Bohemian. Never said Czech, so is Bohemian just > another dialect of the Czech language? Boy am I confusing the issue even > MORE or WHAT? HA HA. sorry folks... > > > Ron and Betty Mlejnek wrote: > >> Everything would be correct when using geographical points of reference. >> However, I do not think that Czechs from Bohemia considered themselves >> identical to Germans from Bohemia. Ethnically and linguistically they >> are different because the had "dreams" in different languages. A person >> from Armenia might call himself an Armenian even if he lived in Prague. >> :-D >> >> As for "Czech" meaning "Bohemian" in the Czech language when used as an >> adjective, I doubt that statement. I have been told there is no such >> word as "Bohemian" in the Czech language. For example, Böhmisch-Leipa is >> the same as Ceska Lipa. The first is Anglicized German and the second is >> Anglicized Czech. >> >> In modern Czech, there might be an adoption of the word "Bohemian" as a >> colloquial term, just like Webster's dictionary eventually accepts slang >> as "proper usage", but in the 1800's I doubt if that term meant anything >> to anyone except an American working in the Immigration Services. >> >> Of course there is always the dreadful Boehmisch language controversy: >> >> http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/read/GERMAN-BOHEMIAN/2000-04/0956165740 >> >> One might want to follow this thread for "relief" that was carried on by >> Karen Hobbs, Lavrentiy Krupnak, and Frank Soural who are all people I >> highly admire. These Germans from Bohemia are always looking at things >> from the German viewpoint, so I see the Boehmisch language as a German >> invention. :'( >> >> ron >> >> >> At 05:22 PM 04/09/2006, you wrote: >> >>> The list dances around this periodically. What do >>> you call the subjects of the Emperor who came to >>> America in the mid-1800s from the historical >>> region of Bohemia? Is this a true statement? >>> >>> "In the Czech language, there is no distinction >>> between the adjectives Bohemian and Czech >>> (ceský)." >>> >>> http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/reference/bohemia >>> >>> Elaine >>> >>> Education is the jewel casting brilliance >>> into the future. --Mari Evans >>> >>> Hello Ron >>> >>> On Sunday, April 9, 2006, you wrote >>> >>> > This issue of language and ethnicity seems to come up over and over >>> > on this Mail List and it never seems to be >>> > resolved. It is like the >>> > question "Is James the American version of Vaclav?" Probably the >>> > best answer is go search the archives of this list. >>> >>> > The term "Bohemian" and the "Bohemian language" seems so deeply >>> > rooted in our psyche that we refuse to "let it go" despite good >>> > arguments to the contrary. Indeed, why not call this list the >>> > "Bohemian Mail List". The reason it is not >>> > called the Bohemian List >>> > is that it is an inaccurate term to apply to our ancestors if they >>> > lived in Bohemia and Moravia. >>> >>> > When our great great grandparents went to >>> > school, what language do >>> > you think they were taught? Can you imagine >>> > their teacher using the >>> > Czech language or the German language to tell >>> > their students to begin >>> > their exercises in "Bohemian"? I think that would be absurd! :'( >>> >>> > I have pointed out before that immigrants >>> > coming to the US (and other >>> > countries) for the first time encountered the word "Bohemian" in the >>> > English language. It may have been in other languages too, but >>> > "Bohemian" is not a word in the Czech language! They encountered >>> > that term on American Manifests where it was >>> > incorrectly listed as an >>> > "Ethnic Group" or "Race of Peoples". There was no such term or >>> > choice as "Czech". >>> >>> > An immigrant not knowing the English language would certainly be >>> > expected to accept a term that was "close >>> > enough". Like working for >>> > the Government! If you lived in Bohemia, you might be a >>> > "Bohemian". <:-| Unfortunately, if you lived in Paris and you were >>> > an enlightened freethinker or some other type >>> > of social maverick, you >>> > would also be called a "Bohemian". >>> >>> > The second problem is how languages change. If anyone educated in >>> > the US picked up a handwritten text from the "Colonial Period", I >>> > would bet they could not read it even though it was written in the >>> > best English known at that time. Language and the use of language >>> > changes with time. >>> >>> > I grew up in Omaha, NE and the only "accent" I knew about was one >>> > called "Southern". My cousins from Florida did not speak the same >>> > language when they visited. After about a >>> > week, I finally figured >>> > out what they were saying. "Goin' fer a rod" was taking the bikes >>> > out. I was later told that the Midwestern >>> > accent (which is spoken in >>> > Chicago, Omaha, Kansas City, and elsewhere) was the most common >>> > one. That made me feel a whole lot better. :-) >>> >>> > Unfortunately, due to circumstances beyond my control, I was forced >>> > to move to rural Nebraska. I worked with a >>> > fellow born in Aurora, NE >>> > and educated at the University of Nebraska who I could barely >>> > understand. I thought I had died and moved to Texas! X;{ >>> > . Everybody spoke "texan" in rural Nebraska! After 30 years I still >>> > cannot get used to it! >>> >>> > Anyway, from my very limited point of view (on the high plains of >>> > North Texas), I know that languages evolve and they do so very >>> > quickly. I was told that at one time by a liguist, the Slavic >>> > language of Slovakia and the Slavic language of Greater Moravia and >>> > even Bohemia was the same language. I have a strong suspicion that >>> > that language (whatever it was called) was over an even broader area >>> > than that. >>> >>> > Today, the National Language of the Czech Republic is called >>> > Czech. For those of us who had families from Bohemia, parts of >>> > Silesia, and Moravia; our breathing and living cousins are speaking >>> > and writing in Czech and not "Bohemian". >>> > However, there are distinct >>> > differences. For example, I have taken a >>> > personal interest in the >>> > the Moravske-Slovako area called the Hornacko: >>> >>> > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~mlejnek/Hornacko.htm >>> >>> > In that region, the customs and the language >>> > are not the same as used >>> > in Prague. It is not even the same as the one in Brno. It is a rich >>> > mixture of Czech and Slovak and some words not known in "Modern >>> > Czech". They still use the "w" in their >>> > surnames. A young Czech >>> > told me I was "full of it" until I sent him a list of surnames from >>> > the region. They have to use the "w" because they border on states >>> > that use it! In the past these artificial >>> > boundaries meant nothing >>> > when it came to language and customs. >>> >>> > Even though I am still not able to figure out the Czech language (an >>> > never will), I at least accept that what means something in one >>> > locale may not be the same in another. I accept that the Czech >>> > heritage is a very rich and lasting one and I >>> > am not leaving the word >>> > "bohemian" in any of my children's vocabulary except as person of a >>> > free spirit like myself. >>> >>> > ron >> >> >> >> >> ==== CZECH Mailing List ==== >> Czech Message Boards are at >> http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec?htx=board&r=rw&p=topics.ethnic >> >> >

P.S. There is a sister list to the Czech list. [email protected] Elaine >> The term "Bohemian" and the "Bohemian language" >> seems so deeply rooted in our psyche that we >> refuse to "let it go" despite good arguments to >> the contrary. Indeed, why not call this list >> the "Bohemian Mail List".

I think the spoke "Czechoslovakian". That is why they formed the country of Czechoslovakia. :-D At 07:01 PM 04/09/2006, you wrote: >since Czechoslovakia never existed in that name >until 1918.......then what they spoke prior to >that was ?????? It was the Kingdom of >Bohemia......wouldn't they then speak BOHEMIAN??? >Barbara >----- Original Message ----- From: "john" <[email protected]> >To: <[email protected]> >Sent: Sunday, April 09, 2006 7:00 PM >Subject: Re: [CZ] Czech / Bohemian language > > >>Another for instance. It has been stated by >>both my dad's immediate family in Indiana and >>his uncle in Wisconsin's children, that their >>grandmother spoke only Bohemian. Never said >>Czech, so is Bohemian just another dialect of >>the Czech language? Boy am I confusing the >>issue even MORE or WHAT? HA HA. sorry folks... >> >> >>Ron and Betty Mlejnek wrote: >> >>>Everything would be correct when using >>>geographical points of reference. However, I >>>do not think that Czechs from Bohemia >>>considered themselves identical to Germans >>>from Bohemia. Ethnically and linguistically >>>they are different because the had "dreams" in >>>different languages. A person from Armenia >>>might call himself an Armenian even if he lived in Prague. :-D >>> >>>As for "Czech" meaning "Bohemian" in the Czech >>>language when used as an adjective, I doubt >>>that statement. I have been told there is no >>>such word as "Bohemian" in the Czech >>>language. For example, Böhmisch-Leipa is the >>>same as Ceska Lipa. The first is Anglicized >>>German and the second is Anglicized Czech. >>> >>>In modern Czech, there might be an adoption of >>>the word "Bohemian" as a colloquial term, just >>>like Webster's dictionary eventually accepts >>>slang as "proper usage", but in the 1800's I >>>doubt if that term meant anything to anyone >>>except an American working in the Immigration Services. >>> >>>Of course there is always the dreadful Boehmisch language controversy: >>> >>>http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/read/GERMAN-BOHEMIAN/2000-04/0956165740 >>> >>>One might want to follow this thread for >>>"relief" that was carried on by Karen Hobbs, >>>Lavrentiy Krupnak, and Frank Soural who are >>>all people I highly admire. These Germans >>>from Bohemia are always looking at things from >>>the German viewpoint, so I see the Boehmisch >>>language as a German invention. :'( >>> >>>ron >>> >>> >>>At 05:22 PM 04/09/2006, you wrote: >>> >>>>The list dances around this periodically. What do >>>>you call the subjects of the Emperor who came to >>>>America in the mid-1800s from the historical >>>>region of Bohemia? Is this a true statement? >>>> >>>>"In the Czech language, there is no distinction >>>>between the adjectives Bohemian and Czech >>>>(ceský)." >>>> >>>>http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/reference/bohemia >>>> >>>>Elaine >>>> >>>>Education is the jewel casting brilliance >>>>into the future. --Mari Evans >>>> >>>>Hello Ron >>>> >>>>On Sunday, April 9, 2006, you wrote >>>> >>>> > This issue of language and ethnicity seems to come up over and over >>>> > on this Mail List and it never seems to be >>>> > resolved. It is like the >>>> > question "Is James the American version of Vaclav?" Probably the >>>> > best answer is go search the archives of this list. >>>> >>>> > The term "Bohemian" and the "Bohemian language" seems so deeply >>>> > rooted in our psyche that we refuse to "let it go" despite good >>>> > arguments to the contrary. Indeed, why not call this list the >>>> > "Bohemian Mail List". The reason it is not >>>> > called the Bohemian List >>>> > is that it is an inaccurate term to apply to our ancestors if they >>>> > lived in Bohemia and Moravia. >>>> >>>> > When our great great grandparents went to >>>> > school, what language do >>>> > you think they were taught? Can you imagine >>>> > their teacher using the >>>> > Czech language or the German language to tell >>>> > their students to begin >>>> > their exercises in "Bohemian"? I think that would be absurd! :'( >>>> >>>> > I have pointed out before that immigrants >>>> > coming to the US (and other >>>> > countries) for the first time encountered the word "Bohemian" in the >>>> > English language. It may have been in other languages too, but >>>> > "Bohemian" is not a word in the Czech language! They encountered >>>> > that term on American Manifests where it was >>>> > incorrectly listed as an >>>> > "Ethnic Group" or "Race of Peoples". There was no such term or >>>> > choice as "Czech". >>>> >>>> > An immigrant not knowing the English language would certainly be >>>> > expected to accept a term that was "close >>>> > enough". Like working for >>>> > the Government! If you lived in Bohemia, you might be a >>>> > "Bohemian". <:-| Unfortunately, if you lived in Paris and you were >>>> > an enlightened freethinker or some other type >>>> > of social maverick, you >>>> > would also be called a "Bohemian". >>>> >>>> > The second problem is how languages change. If anyone educated in >>>> > the US picked up a handwritten text from the "Colonial Period", I >>>> > would bet they could not read it even though it was written in the >>>> > best English known at that time. Language and the use of language >>>> > changes with time. >>>> >>>> > I grew up in Omaha, NE and the only "accent" I knew about was one >>>> > called "Southern". My cousins from Florida did not speak the same >>>> > language when they visited. After about a >>>> > week, I finally figured >>>> > out what they were saying. "Goin' fer a rod" was taking the bikes >>>> > out. I was later told that the Midwestern >>>> > accent (which is spoken in >>>> > Chicago, Omaha, Kansas City, and elsewhere) was the most common >>>> > one. That made me feel a whole lot better. :-) >>>> >>>> > Unfortunately, due to circumstances beyond my control, I was forced >>>> > to move to rural Nebraska. I worked with a >>>> > fellow born in Aurora, NE >>>> > and educated at the University of Nebraska who I could barely >>>> > understand. I thought I had died and moved to Texas! X;{ >>>> > . Everybody spoke "texan" in rural Nebraska! After 30 years I still >>>> > cannot get used to it! >>>> >>>> > Anyway, from my very limited point of view (on the high plains of >>>> > North Texas), I know that languages evolve and they do so very >>>> > quickly. I was told that at one time by a liguist, the Slavic >>>> > language of Slovakia and the Slavic language of Greater Moravia and >>>> > even Bohemia was the same language. I have a strong suspicion that >>>> > that language (whatever it was called) was over an even broader area >>>> > than that. >>>> >>>> > Today, the National Language of the Czech Republic is called >>>> > Czech. For those of us who had families from Bohemia, parts of >>>> > Silesia, and Moravia; our breathing and living cousins are speaking >>>> > and writing in Czech and not "Bohemian". >>>> > However, there are distinct >>>> > differences. For example, I have taken a >>>> > personal interest in the >>>> > the Moravske-Slovako area called the Hornacko: >>>> >>>> > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~mlejnek/Hornacko.htm >>>> >>>> > In that region, the customs and the language >>>> > are not the same as used >>>> > in Prague. It is not even the same as the one in Brno. It is a rich >>>> > mixture of Czech and Slovak and some words not known in "Modern >>>> > Czech". They still use the "w" in their >>>> > surnames. A young Czech >>>> > told me I was "full of it" until I sent him a list of surnames from >>>> > the region. They have to use the "w" because they border on states >>>> > that use it! In the past these artificial >>>> > boundaries meant nothing >>>> > when it came to language and customs. >>>> >>>> > Even though I am still not able to figure out the Czech language (an >>>> > never will), I at least accept that what means something in one >>>> > locale may not be the same in another. I accept that the Czech >>>> > heritage is a very rich and lasting one and I >>>> > am not leaving the word >>>> > "bohemian" in any of my children's vocabulary except as person of a >>>> > free spirit like myself. >>>> >>>> > ron >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>==== CZECH Mailing List ==== >>>Czech Message Boards are at >>>http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec?htx=board&r=rw&p=topics.ethnic >>> > > >==== CZECH Mailing List ==== >To unsubscribe from this list click on >mailto:[email protected]?subject=unsubscribe (list mode) or >mailto:[email protected]?subject=unsubscribe (digest mode) >Contact [email protected] for list related problems >For the CZECH-L archives, go to http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/czech

Interesting article about Bohemia and the Boii people. http://www.britannica.com/ebi/article-9273272 john wrote: > Another for instance. It has been stated by both my dad's immediate > family in Indiana and his uncle in Wisconsin's children, that their > grandmother spoke only Bohemian. Never said Czech, so is Bohemian > just another dialect of the Czech language? Boy am I confusing the > issue even MORE or WHAT? HA HA. sorry folks... > > > Ron and Betty Mlejnek wrote: > >> Everything would be correct when using geographical points of >> reference. However, I do not think that Czechs from Bohemia >> considered themselves identical to Germans from Bohemia. Ethnically >> and linguistically they are different because the had "dreams" in >> different languages. A person from Armenia might call himself an >> Armenian even if he lived in Prague. :-D >> >> As for "Czech" meaning "Bohemian" in the Czech language when used as >> an adjective, I doubt that statement. I have been told there is no >> such word as "Bohemian" in the Czech language. For example, >> Böhmisch-Leipa is the same as Ceska Lipa. The first is Anglicized >> German and the second is Anglicized Czech. >> >> In modern Czech, there might be an adoption of the word "Bohemian" as >> a colloquial term, just like Webster's dictionary eventually accepts >> slang as "proper usage", but in the 1800's I doubt if that term meant >> anything to anyone except an American working in the Immigration >> Services. >> >> Of course there is always the dreadful Boehmisch language controversy: >> >> http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/read/GERMAN-BOHEMIAN/2000-04/0956165740 >> >> One might want to follow this thread for "relief" that was carried on >> by Karen Hobbs, Lavrentiy Krupnak, and Frank Soural who are all >> people I highly admire. These Germans from Bohemia are always >> looking at things from the German viewpoint, so I see the Boehmisch >> language as a German invention. :'( >> >> ron >> >> >> At 05:22 PM 04/09/2006, you wrote: >> >>> The list dances around this periodically. What do >>> you call the subjects of the Emperor who came to >>> America in the mid-1800s from the historical >>> region of Bohemia? Is this a true statement? >>> >>> "In the Czech language, there is no distinction >>> between the adjectives Bohemian and Czech >>> (ceský)." >>> >>> http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/reference/bohemia >>> >>> Elaine >>> >>> Education is the jewel casting brilliance >>> into the future. --Mari Evans >>> >>> Hello Ron >>> >>> On Sunday, April 9, 2006, you wrote >>> >>> > This issue of language and ethnicity seems to come up over and over >>> > on this Mail List and it never seems to be >>> > resolved. It is like the >>> > question "Is James the American version of Vaclav?" Probably the >>> > best answer is go search the archives of this list. >>> >>> > The term "Bohemian" and the "Bohemian language" seems so deeply >>> > rooted in our psyche that we refuse to "let it go" despite good >>> > arguments to the contrary. Indeed, why not call this list the >>> > "Bohemian Mail List". The reason it is not >>> > called the Bohemian List >>> > is that it is an inaccurate term to apply to our ancestors if they >>> > lived in Bohemia and Moravia. >>> >>> > When our great great grandparents went to >>> > school, what language do >>> > you think they were taught? Can you imagine >>> > their teacher using the >>> > Czech language or the German language to tell >>> > their students to begin >>> > their exercises in "Bohemian"? I think that would be absurd! :'( >>> >>> > I have pointed out before that immigrants >>> > coming to the US (and other >>> > countries) for the first time encountered the word "Bohemian" in the >>> > English language. It may have been in other languages too, but >>> > "Bohemian" is not a word in the Czech language! They encountered >>> > that term on American Manifests where it was >>> > incorrectly listed as an >>> > "Ethnic Group" or "Race of Peoples". There was no such term or >>> > choice as "Czech". >>> >>> > An immigrant not knowing the English language would certainly be >>> > expected to accept a term that was "close >>> > enough". Like working for >>> > the Government! If you lived in Bohemia, you might be a >>> > "Bohemian". <:-| Unfortunately, if you lived in Paris and you were >>> > an enlightened freethinker or some other type >>> > of social maverick, you >>> > would also be called a "Bohemian". >>> >>> > The second problem is how languages change. If anyone educated in >>> > the US picked up a handwritten text from the "Colonial Period", I >>> > would bet they could not read it even though it was written in the >>> > best English known at that time. Language and the use of language >>> > changes with time. >>> >>> > I grew up in Omaha, NE and the only "accent" I knew about was one >>> > called "Southern". My cousins from Florida did not speak the same >>> > language when they visited. After about a >>> > week, I finally figured >>> > out what they were saying. "Goin' fer a rod" was taking the bikes >>> > out. I was later told that the Midwestern >>> > accent (which is spoken in >>> > Chicago, Omaha, Kansas City, and elsewhere) was the most common >>> > one. That made me feel a whole lot better. :-) >>> >>> > Unfortunately, due to circumstances beyond my control, I was forced >>> > to move to rural Nebraska. I worked with a >>> > fellow born in Aurora, NE >>> > and educated at the University of Nebraska who I could barely >>> > understand. I thought I had died and moved to Texas! X;{ >>> > . Everybody spoke "texan" in rural Nebraska! After 30 years I still >>> > cannot get used to it! >>> >>> > Anyway, from my very limited point of view (on the high plains of >>> > North Texas), I know that languages evolve and they do so very >>> > quickly. I was told that at one time by a liguist, the Slavic >>> > language of Slovakia and the Slavic language of Greater Moravia and >>> > even Bohemia was the same language. I have a strong suspicion that >>> > that language (whatever it was called) was over an even broader area >>> > than that. >>> >>> > Today, the National Language of the Czech Republic is called >>> > Czech. For those of us who had families from Bohemia, parts of >>> > Silesia, and Moravia; our breathing and living cousins are speaking >>> > and writing in Czech and not "Bohemian". >>> > However, there are distinct >>> > differences. For example, I have taken a >>> > personal interest in the >>> > the Moravske-Slovako area called the Hornacko: >>> >>> > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~mlejnek/Hornacko.htm >>> >>> > In that region, the customs and the language >>> > are not the same as used >>> > in Prague. It is not even the same as the one in Brno. It is a rich >>> > mixture of Czech and Slovak and some words not known in "Modern >>> > Czech". They still use the "w" in their >>> > surnames. A young Czech >>> > told me I was "full of it" until I sent him a list of surnames from >>> > the region. They have to use the "w" because they border on states >>> > that use it! In the past these artificial >>> > boundaries meant nothing >>> > when it came to language and customs. >>> >>> > Even though I am still not able to figure out the Czech language (an >>> > never will), I at least accept that what means something in one >>> > locale may not be the same in another. I accept that the Czech >>> > heritage is a very rich and lasting one and I >>> > am not leaving the word >>> > "bohemian" in any of my children's vocabulary except as person of a >>> > free spirit like myself. >>> >>> > ron >> >> >> >> >> >> ==== CZECH Mailing List ==== >> Czech Message Boards are at >> http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec?htx=board&r=rw&p=topics.ethnic >> >> > > > ==== CZECH Mailing List ==== > The mailing list is configured to reply only to the list. If you are > making a personal reply to a poster, it will be necessary to delete > the list address and add the individual's address. > >

Another for instance. It has been stated by both my dad's immediate family in Indiana and his uncle in Wisconsin's children, that their grandmother spoke only Bohemian. Never said Czech, so is Bohemian just another dialect of the Czech language? Boy am I confusing the issue even MORE or WHAT? HA HA. sorry folks... Ron and Betty Mlejnek wrote: > Everything would be correct when using geographical points of > reference. However, I do not think that Czechs from Bohemia > considered themselves identical to Germans from Bohemia. Ethnically > and linguistically they are different because the had "dreams" in > different languages. A person from Armenia might call himself an > Armenian even if he lived in Prague. :-D > > As for "Czech" meaning "Bohemian" in the Czech language when used as > an adjective, I doubt that statement. I have been told there is no > such word as "Bohemian" in the Czech language. For example, > Böhmisch-Leipa is the same as Ceska Lipa. The first is Anglicized > German and the second is Anglicized Czech. > > In modern Czech, there might be an adoption of the word "Bohemian" as > a colloquial term, just like Webster's dictionary eventually accepts > slang as "proper usage", but in the 1800's I doubt if that term meant > anything to anyone except an American working in the Immigration > Services. > > Of course there is always the dreadful Boehmisch language controversy: > > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/read/GERMAN-BOHEMIAN/2000-04/0956165740 > > One might want to follow this thread for "relief" that was carried on > by Karen Hobbs, Lavrentiy Krupnak, and Frank Soural who are all people > I highly admire. These Germans from Bohemia are always looking at > things from the German viewpoint, so I see the Boehmisch language as a > German invention. :'( > > ron > > > At 05:22 PM 04/09/2006, you wrote: > >> The list dances around this periodically. What do >> you call the subjects of the Emperor who came to >> America in the mid-1800s from the historical >> region of Bohemia? Is this a true statement? >> >> "In the Czech language, there is no distinction >> between the adjectives Bohemian and Czech >> (ceský)." >> >> http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/reference/bohemia >> >> Elaine >> >> Education is the jewel casting brilliance >> into the future. --Mari Evans >> >> Hello Ron >> >> On Sunday, April 9, 2006, you wrote >> >> > This issue of language and ethnicity seems to come up over and over >> > on this Mail List and it never seems to be >> > resolved. It is like the >> > question "Is James the American version of Vaclav?" Probably the >> > best answer is go search the archives of this list. >> >> > The term "Bohemian" and the "Bohemian language" seems so deeply >> > rooted in our psyche that we refuse to "let it go" despite good >> > arguments to the contrary. Indeed, why not call this list the >> > "Bohemian Mail List". The reason it is not >> > called the Bohemian List >> > is that it is an inaccurate term to apply to our ancestors if they >> > lived in Bohemia and Moravia. >> >> > When our great great grandparents went to >> > school, what language do >> > you think they were taught? Can you imagine >> > their teacher using the >> > Czech language or the German language to tell >> > their students to begin >> > their exercises in "Bohemian"? I think that would be absurd! :'( >> >> > I have pointed out before that immigrants >> > coming to the US (and other >> > countries) for the first time encountered the word "Bohemian" in the >> > English language. It may have been in other languages too, but >> > "Bohemian" is not a word in the Czech language! They encountered >> > that term on American Manifests where it was >> > incorrectly listed as an >> > "Ethnic Group" or "Race of Peoples". There was no such term or >> > choice as "Czech". >> >> > An immigrant not knowing the English language would certainly be >> > expected to accept a term that was "close >> > enough". Like working for >> > the Government! If you lived in Bohemia, you might be a >> > "Bohemian". <:-| Unfortunately, if you lived in Paris and you were >> > an enlightened freethinker or some other type >> > of social maverick, you >> > would also be called a "Bohemian". >> >> > The second problem is how languages change. If anyone educated in >> > the US picked up a handwritten text from the "Colonial Period", I >> > would bet they could not read it even though it was written in the >> > best English known at that time. Language and the use of language >> > changes with time. >> >> > I grew up in Omaha, NE and the only "accent" I knew about was one >> > called "Southern". My cousins from Florida did not speak the same >> > language when they visited. After about a >> > week, I finally figured >> > out what they were saying. "Goin' fer a rod" was taking the bikes >> > out. I was later told that the Midwestern >> > accent (which is spoken in >> > Chicago, Omaha, Kansas City, and elsewhere) was the most common >> > one. That made me feel a whole lot better. :-) >> >> > Unfortunately, due to circumstances beyond my control, I was forced >> > to move to rural Nebraska. I worked with a >> > fellow born in Aurora, NE >> > and educated at the University of Nebraska who I could barely >> > understand. I thought I had died and moved to Texas! X;{ >> > . Everybody spoke "texan" in rural Nebraska! After 30 years I still >> > cannot get used to it! >> >> > Anyway, from my very limited point of view (on the high plains of >> > North Texas), I know that languages evolve and they do so very >> > quickly. I was told that at one time by a liguist, the Slavic >> > language of Slovakia and the Slavic language of Greater Moravia and >> > even Bohemia was the same language. I have a strong suspicion that >> > that language (whatever it was called) was over an even broader area >> > than that. >> >> > Today, the National Language of the Czech Republic is called >> > Czech. For those of us who had families from Bohemia, parts of >> > Silesia, and Moravia; our breathing and living cousins are speaking >> > and writing in Czech and not "Bohemian". >> > However, there are distinct >> > differences. For example, I have taken a >> > personal interest in the >> > the Moravske-Slovako area called the Hornacko: >> >> > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~mlejnek/Hornacko.htm >> >> > In that region, the customs and the language >> > are not the same as used >> > in Prague. It is not even the same as the one in Brno. It is a rich >> > mixture of Czech and Slovak and some words not known in "Modern >> > Czech". They still use the "w" in their >> > surnames. A young Czech >> > told me I was "full of it" until I sent him a list of surnames from >> > the region. They have to use the "w" because they border on states >> > that use it! In the past these artificial >> > boundaries meant nothing >> > when it came to language and customs. >> >> > Even though I am still not able to figure out the Czech language (an >> > never will), I at least accept that what means something in one >> > locale may not be the same in another. I accept that the Czech >> > heritage is a very rich and lasting one and I >> > am not leaving the word >> > "bohemian" in any of my children's vocabulary except as person of a >> > free spirit like myself. >> >> > ron > > > > > ==== CZECH Mailing List ==== > Czech Message Boards are at > http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec?htx=board&r=rw&p=topics.ethnic > >

Thank you Ron. I have never seen this issue presented more thoroughly

The list dances around this periodically. What do you call the subjects of the Emperor who came to America in the mid-1800s from the historical region of Bohemia? Is this a true statement? "In the Czech language, there is no distinction between the adjectives Bohemian and Czech (ceský)." http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/reference/bohemia Elaine Education is the jewel casting brilliance into the future. --Mari Evans Hello Ron On Sunday, April 9, 2006, you wrote > This issue of language and ethnicity seems to come up over and over > on this Mail List and it never seems to be > resolved. It is like the > question "Is James the American version of Vaclav?" Probably the > best answer is go search the archives of this list. > The term "Bohemian" and the "Bohemian language" seems so deeply > rooted in our psyche that we refuse to "let it go" despite good > arguments to the contrary. Indeed, why not call this list the > "Bohemian Mail List". The reason it is not > called the Bohemian List > is that it is an inaccurate term to apply to our ancestors if they > lived in Bohemia and Moravia. > When our great great grandparents went to > school, what language do > you think they were taught? Can you imagine > their teacher using the > Czech language or the German language to tell > their students to begin > their exercises in "Bohemian"? I think that would be absurd! :'( > I have pointed out before that immigrants > coming to the US (and other > countries) for the first time encountered the word "Bohemian" in the > English language. It may have been in other languages too, but > "Bohemian" is not a word in the Czech language! They encountered > that term on American Manifests where it was > incorrectly listed as an > "Ethnic Group" or "Race of Peoples". There was no such term or > choice as "Czech". > An immigrant not knowing the English language would certainly be > expected to accept a term that was "close > enough". Like working for > the Government! If you lived in Bohemia, you might be a > "Bohemian". <:-| Unfortunately, if you lived in Paris and you were > an enlightened freethinker or some other type > of social maverick, you > would also be called a "Bohemian". > The second problem is how languages change. If anyone educated in > the US picked up a handwritten text from the "Colonial Period", I > would bet they could not read it even though it was written in the > best English known at that time. Language and the use of language > changes with time. > I grew up in Omaha, NE and the only "accent" I knew about was one > called "Southern". My cousins from Florida did not speak the same > language when they visited. After about a > week, I finally figured > out what they were saying. "Goin' fer a rod" was taking the bikes > out. I was later told that the Midwestern > accent (which is spoken in > Chicago, Omaha, Kansas City, and elsewhere) was the most common > one. That made me feel a whole lot better. :-) > Unfortunately, due to circumstances beyond my control, I was forced > to move to rural Nebraska. I worked with a > fellow born in Aurora, NE > and educated at the University of Nebraska who I could barely > understand. I thought I had died and moved to Texas! X;{ > . Everybody spoke "texan" in rural Nebraska! After 30 years I still > cannot get used to it! > Anyway, from my very limited point of view (on the high plains of > North Texas), I know that languages evolve and they do so very > quickly. I was told that at one time by a liguist, the Slavic > language of Slovakia and the Slavic language of Greater Moravia and > even Bohemia was the same language. I have a strong suspicion that > that language (whatever it was called) was over an even broader area > than that. > Today, the National Language of the Czech Republic is called > Czech. For those of us who had families from Bohemia, parts of > Silesia, and Moravia; our breathing and living cousins are speaking > and writing in Czech and not "Bohemian". > However, there are distinct > differences. For example, I have taken a > personal interest in the > the Moravske-Slovako area called the Hornacko: > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~mlejnek/Hornacko.htm > In that region, the customs and the language > are not the same as used > in Prague. It is not even the same as the one in Brno. It is a rich > mixture of Czech and Slovak and some words not known in "Modern > Czech". They still use the "w" in their > surnames. A young Czech > told me I was "full of it" until I sent him a list of surnames from > the region. They have to use the "w" because they border on states > that use it! In the past these artificial > boundaries meant nothing > when it came to language and customs. > Even though I am still not able to figure out the Czech language (an > never will), I at least accept that what means something in one > locale may not be the same in another. I accept that the Czech > heritage is a very rich and lasting one and I > am not leaving the word > "bohemian" in any of my children's vocabulary except as person of a > free spirit like myself. > ron

Everything would be correct when using geographical points of reference. However, I do not think that Czechs from Bohemia considered themselves identical to Germans from Bohemia. Ethnically and linguistically they are different because the had "dreams" in different languages. A person from Armenia might call himself an Armenian even if he lived in Prague. :-D As for "Czech" meaning "Bohemian" in the Czech language when used as an adjective, I doubt that statement. I have been told there is no such word as "Bohemian" in the Czech language. For example, Böhmisch-Leipa is the same as Ceska Lipa. The first is Anglicized German and the second is Anglicized Czech. In modern Czech, there might be an adoption of the word "Bohemian" as a colloquial term, just like Webster's dictionary eventually accepts slang as "proper usage", but in the 1800's I doubt if that term meant anything to anyone except an American working in the Immigration Services. Of course there is always the dreadful Boehmisch language controversy: http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/read/GERMAN-BOHEMIAN/2000-04/0956165740 One might want to follow this thread for "relief" that was carried on by Karen Hobbs, Lavrentiy Krupnak, and Frank Soural who are all people I highly admire. These Germans from Bohemia are always looking at things from the German viewpoint, so I see the Boehmisch language as a German invention. :'( ron At 05:22 PM 04/09/2006, you wrote: >The list dances around this periodically. What do >you call the subjects of the Emperor who came to >America in the mid-1800s from the historical >region of Bohemia? Is this a true statement? > >"In the Czech language, there is no distinction >between the adjectives Bohemian and Czech >(ceský)." > >http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/reference/bohemia > >Elaine > >Education is the jewel casting brilliance >into the future. --Mari Evans > >Hello Ron > >On Sunday, April 9, 2006, you wrote > > > This issue of language and ethnicity seems to come up over and over > > on this Mail List and it never seems to be > > resolved. It is like the > > question "Is James the American version of Vaclav?" Probably the > > best answer is go search the archives of this list. > > > The term "Bohemian" and the "Bohemian language" seems so deeply > > rooted in our psyche that we refuse to "let it go" despite good > > arguments to the contrary. Indeed, why not call this list the > > "Bohemian Mail List". The reason it is not > > called the Bohemian List > > is that it is an inaccurate term to apply to our ancestors if they > > lived in Bohemia and Moravia. > > > When our great great grandparents went to > > school, what language do > > you think they were taught? Can you imagine > > their teacher using the > > Czech language or the German language to tell > > their students to begin > > their exercises in "Bohemian"? I think that would be absurd! :'( > > > I have pointed out before that immigrants > > coming to the US (and other > > countries) for the first time encountered the word "Bohemian" in the > > English language. It may have been in other languages too, but > > "Bohemian" is not a word in the Czech language! They encountered > > that term on American Manifests where it was > > incorrectly listed as an > > "Ethnic Group" or "Race of Peoples". There was no such term or > > choice as "Czech". > > > An immigrant not knowing the English language would certainly be > > expected to accept a term that was "close > > enough". Like working for > > the Government! If you lived in Bohemia, you might be a > > "Bohemian". <:-| Unfortunately, if you lived in Paris and you were > > an enlightened freethinker or some other type > > of social maverick, you > > would also be called a "Bohemian". > > > The second problem is how languages change. If anyone educated in > > the US picked up a handwritten text from the "Colonial Period", I > > would bet they could not read it even though it was written in the > > best English known at that time. Language and the use of language > > changes with time. > > > I grew up in Omaha, NE and the only "accent" I knew about was one > > called "Southern". My cousins from Florida did not speak the same > > language when they visited. After about a > > week, I finally figured > > out what they were saying. "Goin' fer a rod" was taking the bikes > > out. I was later told that the Midwestern > > accent (which is spoken in > > Chicago, Omaha, Kansas City, and elsewhere) was the most common > > one. That made me feel a whole lot better. :-) > > > Unfortunately, due to circumstances beyond my control, I was forced > > to move to rural Nebraska. I worked with a > > fellow born in Aurora, NE > > and educated at the University of Nebraska who I could barely > > understand. I thought I had died and moved to Texas! X;{ > > . Everybody spoke "texan" in rural Nebraska! After 30 years I still > > cannot get used to it! > > > Anyway, from my very limited point of view (on the high plains of > > North Texas), I know that languages evolve and they do so very > > quickly. I was told that at one time by a liguist, the Slavic > > language of Slovakia and the Slavic language of Greater Moravia and > > even Bohemia was the same language. I have a strong suspicion that > > that language (whatever it was called) was over an even broader area > > than that. > > > Today, the National Language of the Czech Republic is called > > Czech. For those of us who had families from Bohemia, parts of > > Silesia, and Moravia; our breathing and living cousins are speaking > > and writing in Czech and not "Bohemian". > > However, there are distinct > > differences. For example, I have taken a > > personal interest in the > > the Moravske-Slovako area called the Hornacko: > > > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~mlejnek/Hornacko.htm > > > In that region, the customs and the language > > are not the same as used > > in Prague. It is not even the same as the one in Brno. It is a rich > > mixture of Czech and Slovak and some words not known in "Modern > > Czech". They still use the "w" in their > > surnames. A young Czech > > told me I was "full of it" until I sent him a list of surnames from > > the region. They have to use the "w" because they border on states > > that use it! In the past these artificial > > boundaries meant nothing > > when it came to language and customs. > > > Even though I am still not able to figure out the Czech language (an > > never will), I at least accept that what means something in one > > locale may not be the same in another. I accept that the Czech > > heritage is a very rich and lasting one and I > > am not leaving the word > > "bohemian" in any of my children's vocabulary except as person of a > > free spirit like myself. > > > ron

This issue of language and ethnicity seems to come up over and over on this Mail List and it never seems to be resolved. It is like the question "Is James the American version of Vaclav?" Probably the best answer is go search the archives of this list. The term "Bohemian" and the "Bohemian language" seems so deeply rooted in our psyche that we refuse to "let it go" despite good arguments to the contrary. Indeed, why not call this list the "Bohemian Mail List". The reason it is not called the Bohemian List is that it is an inaccurate term to apply to our ancestors if they lived in Bohemia and Moravia. When our great great grandparents went to school, what language do you think they were taught? Can you imagine their teacher using the Czech language or the German language to tell their students to begin their exercises in "Bohemian"? I think that would be absurd! :'( I have pointed out before that immigrants coming to the US (and other countries) for the first time encountered the word "Bohemian" in the English language. It may have been in other languages too, but "Bohemian" is not a word in the Czech language! They encountered that term on American Manifests where it was incorrectly listed as an "Ethnic Group" or "Race of Peoples". There was no such term or choice as "Czech". An immigrant not knowing the English language would certainly be expected to accept a term that was "close enough". Like working for the Government! If you lived in Bohemia, you might be a "Bohemian". <:-| Unfortunately, if you lived in Paris and you were an enlightened freethinker or some other type of social maverick, you would also be called a "Bohemian". The second problem is how languages change. If anyone educated in the US picked up a handwritten text from the "Colonial Period", I would bet they could not read it even though it was written in the best English known at that time. Language and the use of language changes with time. I grew up in Omaha, NE and the only "accent" I knew about was one called "Southern". My cousins from Florida did not speak the same language when they visited. After about a week, I finally figured out what they were saying. "Goin' fer a rod" was taking the bikes out. I was later told that the Midwestern accent (which is spoken in Chicago, Omaha, Kansas City, and elsewhere) was the most common one. That made me feel a whole lot better. :-) Unfortunately, due to circumstances beyond my control, I was forced to move to rural Nebraska. I worked with a fellow born in Aurora, NE and educated at the University of Nebraska who I could barely understand. I thought I had died and moved to Texas! X;{ . Everybody spoke "texan" in rural Nebraska! After 30 years I still cannot get used to it! Anyway, from my very limited point of view (on the high plains of North Texas), I know that languages evolve and they do so very quickly. I was told that at one time by a liguist, the Slavic language of Slovakia and the Slavic language of Greater Moravia and even Bohemia was the same language. I have a strong suspicion that that language (whatever it was called) was over an even broader area than that. Today, the National Language of the Czech Republic is called Czech. For those of us who had families from Bohemia, parts of Silesia, and Moravia; our breathing and living cousins are speaking and writing in Czech and not "Bohemian". However, there are distinct differences. For example, I have taken a personal interest in the the Moravske-Slovako area called the Hornacko: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~mlejnek/Hornacko.htm In that region, the customs and the language are not the same as used in Prague. It is not even the same as the one in Brno. It is a rich mixture of Czech and Slovak and some words not known in "Modern Czech". They still use the "w" in their surnames. A young Czech told me I was "full of it" until I sent him a list of surnames from the region. They have to use the "w" because they border on states that use it! In the past these artificial boundaries meant nothing when it came to language and customs. Even though I am still not able to figure out the Czech language (an never will), I at least accept that what means something in one locale may not be the same in another. I accept that the Czech heritage is a very rich and lasting one and I am not leaving the word "bohemian" in any of my children's vocabulary except as person of a free spirit like myself. ron

I think you will find that the so called "high" Czech is merely a function of education and thus the size and context of the words used by the better educated as compared to the less or non educated. The differences are pretty much like the differences you would find among those speaking "high American" and "low American." Nice pix, Judi. Brought back fond memories. Joe judi wrote: >I have found out recently that there is a "high" Czech and a "low" Czech....or at least there used to be. My family insists that they spoke "Bohemian" and that they couldn't understand the "high" Czech or Bohemian. What are the differences? This would explain why my mom cannot understand much of what I am saying in Czech (the "modern" version on tape/CD) >thanks >judi > > >==== CZECH Mailing List ==== >RootsWeb forbids posting of copyrighted material without >permission of the author. Read RootsWeb's Acceptable Use >Policy at http://www.rootsweb.com/rootsweb/aup.html. > > > > >

----- Original Message ----- From: judi To: Ron and Betty Mlejnek Sent: Sunday, April 09, 2006 3:53 PM Subject: Re: [CZ] czech / bohemian language my mom's cousin said that she, too, spoke "low Czech or Bohemian" and that when she went to Jan Hus, she couldn't understand the "high" Czech (or Bohemian). Both she and my mom still insist they spoke "Bohemian". judi

I have found out recently that there is a "high" Czech and a "low" Czech....or at least there used to be. My family insists that they spoke "Bohemian" and that they couldn't understand the "high" Czech or Bohemian. What are the differences? This would explain why my mom cannot understand much of what I am saying in Czech (the "modern" version on tape/CD) thanks judi

Thank you, Honza. This helps a lot. It appears to have taken a slow cyber-trip to the list <g>. Elaine When you're the top dog, everybody wants to put you in the pound. --Charles Barkley Hello Honza On Thursday, April 6, 2006, you wrote > An online phone book for the Czech Republic is > at http://phone.quick.cz/ > . It seems they don't offer an English > interface, but searching is > fairly straight forward. You need to enter: > 1) SURNAME (Prijmeni:) > 2) PLACE- town/village (Obec:) > 3) Uncheck the "Pouzivam diakritiku" checkbox > (unless you use the exact > Czech spelling) > 4) Click "Vyhledat" > This search will yield only home numbers that are available in phone > books. No unlisted numbers and no cell phone numbers. > Honza > [email protected] wrote: >> This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. >> >> Surnames: SLEPICKA, HRUSKA, CHICKEN, HOSEK, SACK >> Classification: Query >> >> Message Board URL: >> >> http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/lRC.2ACE/3494 >> >> Message Board Post: >> >> Is there an on line phone book for this area? >> >> Elaine >> >> >> ==== CZECH Mailing List ==== >> Czech Message Boards are at >> http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec?htx=board&r=rw&p=topics.ethnic >> >> >> > ==== CZECH Mailing List ==== > To unsubscribe from this list click on > mailto:[email protected]?subject=unsubscribe (list mode) or > mailto:[email protected]?subject=unsubscribe (digest mode) > Contact [email protected] for list related problems > For the CZECH-L archives, go to > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/czech

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Surnames: Fukala Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/lRC.2ACE/3447.7 Message Board Post: Linnea, your original information was correct. The name FUKALA has its origin in Silesia, in this case in fromer Austrian (Czechoslovak) Silesia. The village of origin is STONAVA, in German STEINAU, a village with parrochial cath. Maria Magdalene church (parish since 1866) in district KARVINA. The vital registers are in the Silesian Land Archives in OPAVA. Address of the archives: Zemsky Archiv v Opave Snemovni 1 746 22 Opava Director: Karel Muller +420-553 623 364, Tel+Fax: +420-553 623 476 I personally know one D. Radek FUKALA who teaches history at the SILESIAN UNIVERSITY at OPAVA (www.slu.cz). Try to contact him at [email protected] Since he is a historian, it is high probable that he knows his family history as well as the origin of his surname. Karel

Czech Republic paying tribute to WWII heroes Stars and Stripes - Washington,D.C.,USA RUSOV, Czech Republic ? For 45 years, nobody visited this small village where 2nd Cavalry Regiment soldier Pfc. Raymond Manz was ... <http://www.estripes.com/article.asp?section=104&article=36364>

Oh, do I remember that Disney movie from when I was a little girl. Great story! Thanks for sharing. ----- Original Message ----- From: "ETM" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Saturday, April 08, 2006 4:13 PM Subject: [CZ] WWII heroes > > Czech Republic paying tribute to WWII heroes > Stars and Stripes - Washington,D.C.,USA > RUSOV, Czech Republic ? For 45 years, nobody visited this small village > where 2nd Cavalry Regiment soldier Pfc. Raymond Manz was ... > <http://www.estripes.com/article.asp?section=104&article=36364> > > > > > ==== CZECH Mailing List ==== > All matters pertaining to list administration are exclusively > handled by the List Administrator. If you have personal > problems, questions or suggestions about list mail send an > email to the administrator. The subject is not appropriate > for list discussion.

The url should be http://www.rootsweb.com/~wacsig/ Elaine Hello List On Saturday, April 8, 2006, you wrote > This is a forwarded message > From: helene cincebeaux <[email protected]> > _ If you have friends or relatives in > Seattle, Washington let them know there are a > number of events scheduled there from April 21 > thru 30; a folk dress exhibit, talks, Slavic > Day, etc and then a big Zabava/Majales ? Slovak > and Czech party on Sat., April 29. Web site > www.rootsweb.com-wacsig/ > > Then a big Czech & Slovak folk party - > you are invited - in Silver Spring MD on Fri., > May 5 and a concert and mini exhibit and a > reception in Hopewell VA on Sun., May 7. > > E mail me at [email protected] for more info. > > helene >

Thanks, John. And for the mailing list subscribers who may not be familiar with the Message Boards, simply click on the link in a gatewayed message and it will take you to the Message Board. Mailing lists will not transmit images. But the Boards do allow uploading images pertinent to the focus of the Board. The page referred to in John's gatewayed message below is at http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/lRC.2ACE/3496.1.2.1.1 Elaine He who has a 'why' to live, can bear with almost any 'how'. --Friedrich Nietzsche (1844-1900) Hello john On Saturday, April 8, 2006, you wrote > This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. > Surnames: DVORAK, KUBIK, etc > Classification: Immigration > Message Board URL: > http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/lRC.2ACE/3496.1.2.1.1 > Message Board Post: > This is the page I have with my family so far > as I can ascertain. It also includes other names > of interest to the group. I hope you can find > your family on this page. It is the only manifest page I own.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/lRC.2ACE/3447.6.1 Message Board Post: Hi, IŽve sent those translations to your e-mail.