Robert, thanks for those sites. I didn't know what a "roux" was until I was an adult. My mom and grandma always said "Eimprem" and in many of my Croatian and Slovenian church cookbooks, it is spelled "Eimprem" or "Aimprem". It was only in the past few years that I knew it was "Einbrenne" in German and I lived in Germany for 3 years in the 60's. I guess I was too busy tending to my 3 little children and didn't pay attention to the relatives. I did pick up a lot of words then, though. I do have some Slovenian to English and Croation to English and vice versa dictionaries that I need to find and use more often. I knew about "speck" or Spek and shincken and sunka and my dad called polenta "gonca". in Slovenian which would be like the zgonci that you mentioned. God bless, Margaret ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Jerin" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Friday, April 01, 2005 5:00 AM Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Croatian recipe links > Margaret, > > Aha, I have never heard that term. Evidently it is a German word... roux > = die Einbrenne in German Of course I know about roux as one of my > favorite dishes to make is Jambalya, which begins with a roux ... takes > the better part of a day. Interesting how words are exchanged amongst > peoples... my Grandmother called her homemade cottage cheese Schmierkase > > But even in the Croatian language there are some borrowed words... > > For instance German for bacon is spek, one Croatian word is spek, ham is > shincken in German and sunka in Croatian, polenta is used by many > Croaitans but is an Italian word but the real Croatian word zgonci (not > certain of the spelling) is in Bosnia they call it pule or pure, this is > great with a veal stew over the top.... mmm... > > Here are some links Croatian recipes > > http://www.croatianmall.com/croatia/food/34_croatian_recipes.htm > > http://www.balkanweb.com/kroacia/recipes.htm > > http://www.gourmed.gr/recipes/croatian/?gid=1&nodeid=13 > > http://www.pitt.edu/~slavic/sli/admin/croatcook.html > > http://www.hvar.hr/Default.aspx?tabid=640 > > http://fooddownunder.com/cgi-bin/search.cgi?q=croatian > > http://www.recipesource.com/ethnic/europe/croatian/ > > http://www.croatianmall.com/croatia/food/Index.htm > > Dobar tek! > > Robert > > > > > Jerome Buza <[email protected]> wrote: > Hi Robert, Eimprem or Einbren is what my grandmother called "roux". > Margaret > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Robert Jerin" > To: > Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 7:24 PM > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > > >> Hi Margaret, >> >> Sounds good! >> >> What is Eimprem? >> >> Robert >> >> Jerome Buza wrote: >> Thanks Robert, I will read that page and enjoy it, I am sure. My family >> always made the Sarma with sauerkraut, no tomatoes, and that is the way I >> love it. Of course, there was an Eimprem, too. While living in Turkey, I >> ate their Sarma and it was different,but we grew to love it. Mom just >> boiled the leaves in vinegar water and when I was young, the produce man >> at >> the local A & P store gave my mom the outer leaves. Now, they don't have >> them available. So, growing the cabbages in our garden at our mountain >> cabin in AZ has become our way of having the larger leaves of cabbage to >> use. >> Margaret >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Robert Jerin" >> To: >> Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 5:42 AM >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >> >> >>> Ahh.... just had some REAL Croatian Sarma at Marie's Restaurant on St >>> Clair in Cleveland. The owners are the family Sabalic from Ljubuski, >>> Hercegovina. REAL sarma must always be made using "soured leaves", which >>> we can purchase at Zagreb Meats on St Clair. If you can not purchase >>> "soured cabbage" then par boiling the leaves in vinegar water may work. >>> For many years I did not like sarma, then I discovered that many (most >>> immigrants I know here in Cleveland) do not add tomatoes, and that is >>> what >>> I did not like! Most here will make a rue and then add paprika and a bit >>> of water to make a delicous sauce to pour over the sarma and mashed >>> potatoes or dumplings. >>> >>> My experience with the (too) many Croatian functions that I attend is >>> that >>> if there are many immigrants the food is authentic and if the majority >>> are >>> American born the food has some resemblance to the authentic stuff but >>> does not come close. >>> >>> Here is a recipe that I have found to my taste from the Embassy web >>> page. >>> >>> http://www.croatiaemb.org/basic_facts/christmas97.htm >>> >>> Robert >>> >>> Karen Heiser wrote: >>> Dear List - I think the "western expansion" did in a lot of our families >>> and >>> traditions. Traveling 30 miles for the family reunion is a lot easier >>> and >>> cheaper than travelling 2500 miles. And then there is the marriage >>> thing...not many of us were able to marry within our ethnicity, so then >>> you >>> have another whole set of traditions to work with. >>> But if you don't stop talking about lamb and sarma, the drooling is >>> going >>> to >>> ruin my keyboard! >>> Karen Heiser >>> Weed, Siskiyou, CA >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Jerome Buza" >>> To: >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 9:58 PM >>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>> >>> >>>> Another reason for the demise of many of the family customs is the way >>>> we >>>> travel around and move far away. We try to keep up our family customs >>> even >>>> though we are in AZ and most of the family is in MI or IL. However, >>>> many >>> of >>>> my aunts and uncles married people that were not that interested and >>>> now >>> the >>>> kids aren't either. My generation knows that my mom cooked like Grandma >>> and >>>> that I cook like mom and are asking me for recipes. However, many >>>> didn't >>>> have the traditions followed all their lives like I did with my mother >>>> and >>>> my husband did with his part of the Polish family. Our own daughter has >>>> been living in TX for 20 of her 21 years of married life and doesn't >>> follow >>>> our traditions. Her kids are fussy and wouldn't eat the food anyway. >>>> Margaret >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "al toennies" >>>> To: >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 4:25 PM >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>> >>>> >>>> > Good question Joy! I think a bunch of siblings (like these folks >>>> > were) >>>> > can keep it together naturally but when they start to fade away and >>>> > you >>>> > are left with cousins and a collection of spouses with family ties of >>>> > their own, you need a catalytic agent of some sort - maybe a person >>>> > or >>>> > a >>>> > group of people that pulls or pushes the different family members >>>> > together. They have to be either loved or feared or so much of a pain >>> it >>>> > the butt that everybody gives in to avoid further hassles. I watched >>>> > my >>>> > mother's Swedish family gatherings wither away after my Grandmother >>> died - >>>> > she was a catalyst of a sort and no one replaced her. >>>> > >>>> > Al in Music City >>>> > ----- Original Message ----- >>>> > >>>> > From: "Joy Durrett" >>>> > To: >>>> > Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 8:57 AM >>>> > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>> > >>>> > >>>> >> Why didn't the next generation keep it going? Sounds like a great >>>> >> way >>> to >>>> >> keep the family together. >>>> >> >>>> >> Joy >>>> >> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> >> From: "al toennies" >>>> >> To: >>>> >> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 2:52 AM >>>> >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >>> My wife's family (all of Croatian descent) used to have a picnic at >>>> >>> a >>>> >>> summer home in Silver Lake, WI (we were all from Chicago) and >>>> >>> roasted >>> a >>>> >>> whole lamb over charcoal in a 55 gallon drum split lengthwise with >>>> >>> a >>>> >>> home-made turning mechanism >>>> >>> doing all the heavy work. I was never a big fan of lamb but I made >>>> >>> an >>>> >>> exception for that - Most of those folks are gone now but the >>>> >>> memories >>>> >>> remain including the best lamb I have ever eaten. >>>> >>> >>>> >>> Al in Music City >>>> >>> >>>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> >>> From: "Robert Jerin" >>>> >>> To: >>>> >>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 12:44 PM >>>> >>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>>> Nick, >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I must admit that I roasted just a leg and used my Weber with nice >>> hot >>>> >>>> coals on the side. Pleeeze don't tell any real Croatians about my >>>> >>>> "unorthodox" method of using a Weber! Everyone here loves roast >>>> >>>> lamb >>>> >>>> except the wife. So it was enough for the gang. But IMHO the >>>> >>>> secret >>>> >>>> is selecting the right piece, trimming much of the fact and then >>>> >>>> coating the lamb with olive oil, salt (I use Croatian Podravka >>> Vegeta), >>>> >>>> pepper, fresh chopped garlic and rosemary and let it marinate in >>>> >>>> the >>>> >>>> fridge for a day or more... then setting the piece out about 2 >>>> >>>> hours >>>> >>>> before placing on the grill. Oh the other trick is slow roasting, >>>> >>>> no >>>> >>>> flame, just hot coals and not too close to the coals....mmmm.... >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> It has been several years since our Junior tammie group here in >>>> >>>> Cleveland had a picnic... at that time we would take most of Sat >>>> >>>> afternoon to set up 8 whole lambs and 9 pigs on spits, then season >>> them >>>> >>>> and put them in the cooler for Sun am.. after that we would feast >>>> >>>> on >>>> >>>> gulas that I would make along with salad, some wine and slivovitz >>>> >>>> and >>>> >>>> one of the father's, who has since passed away would play his >>> harmonika >>>> >>>> (accordian) and all the guys would dance to his Bosanac songs! >>>> >>>> What >>> a >>>> >>>> sight! Then at 4 AM on Sunday I would meet my friend Mato Vrbic at >>> the >>>> >>>> picnic center to prepare the fire... then a little coffee with >>>> >>>> slivovitz of course... and about 6AM we would consider the coals >>>> >>>> and >>>> >>>> the brick lined floor hot enough to place the first few pieces on >>>> >>>> the >>>> >>>> spit... then about 11:30 ish the first ones would come off to be >>>> >>>> cut >>>> >>>> and served.... that Sunday would finish up at about 10-11 PM >>>> >>>> making >>>> >>>> sure the center was left in better condition than we found it! >>>> >>>> Lots >>>> >>>> of work but I miss those ! >>>> >>>> days... >>>> >>>> as they brought back memories of my Grandparent's PLASAJ (Mirko >>>> >>>> and >>>> >>>> Mary) and my cousin's BAKALE (Ivan and Johanna)farms in PA and the >>>> >>>> picnics we would have there. But they are all gone now so we try >>>> >>>> to >>>> >>>> carry on some semblance of those traditions..... >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.podravka.com/en/products/index.php?if=new_products.php >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Here is a photo that may bring back some memories >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.members.shaw.ca/rogergou/bast4.jpeg >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Robert >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> nharamija wrote: >>>> >>>> Robert; Let us see your grille and how you set it up. >>>> >>>> Nick >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> >>>> From: "Robert Jerin" >>>> >>>> To: >>>> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 11:50 AM >>>> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> My wife did those things! I was busy roasting.... lamb! >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Jerome Buza wrote: >>>> >>>> That's right!!! We were all busy baking and cooking and dying eggs >>> and >>>> >>>> cleaning the house for company. >>>> >>>> Margaret >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> >>>> From: "dave mothkovich" >>>> >>>> To: >>>> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 2:32 AM >>>> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> Everybody got busy, and then the holiday came, it happens. >>>> >>>>> Christmas >>>> >>>>> was >>>> >>>>> different, everyone had time to chat it up. >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> Dave >>>> >>>>> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 17:45:41 +0800 "John Stefanac" >>>> >>>>> writes: >>>> >>>>>> Is it just quiet on this list or have I somehow been kicked off >>>> >>>>>> it >>>> >>>>>> again >>>> >>>>>> >>>> >>>>>> >>>> >>>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> -- >>>> >>>>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>>> >>>>> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>>> >>>>> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: >>>> >>>>> 3/27/2005 >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >>>> >>>> about a >>>> >>>> wonderful tour of Croatia! >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >>>> >>>> about a wonderful tour of Croatia! >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>>> >> >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > -- >>>> > No virus found in this incoming message. >>>> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>>> > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 >>>> > >>>> > >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out about >>> a wonderful tour of Croatia! >>> >>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 >>> >>> >> >> >> >> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out about >> a wonderful tour of Croatia! >> >> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >> >> >> >> -- >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 >> >> > > > > Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out about > a wonderful tour of Croatia! > > http://www.kollander-travel.com/ > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.9.1 - Release Date: 4/1/2005 > >

In the "Cities", in South St. Paul, there is a VFW affectionately called the "Cro". It is the only place I know that still serves Croatian food in the Twin Cities area. -----Original Message----- From: Robert Jerin [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 8:32 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast Don, Talk about people knowing how to live! When we lived in "The Cities" 1980-1984 (Minnesotan for The Twin Cities aka Minneapolis St Paul) we enjoyed driving or taking the train to Dulut (no h !) there was a small "Yugoslav" restaurant in Dulut, can not recall the name. Just wondered if it is still there. I was amazed at the connection that Dulut and Cleveland, Cleveland Cliffs and other ore shipping etc.. Robert Donald Marinkovich <[email protected]> wrote: I ran, TO THE STORE, Paul Bizals finer meats and klobase, in Chisholm of course. The sarma was always covered with kraut in our house. I remember a woman asking for fifteen cents soup bone. I was told that Coldagelli bought Postudensheks recepe, he could even have been related. I read somewhere that there is no such thing as a melting pot. We have it here. A friend told me that his kids are three forths bohunk and they have a Finnlander name. His mother and his wife were both Slovenian and his father was Finn, he was the model for the iron man statue, and he was the president of our local union when I worked there. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Reuter, Patty" To: Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 10:42 AM Subject: RE: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > Don, > > What is the name of the store that you ran? Was it in Chisholm? My > granparents always got their sausage from Coldageliis. We would have it > every time we came up from the cities. We have a Sarma recipie from the > Perpich's that says we should cover the sarma in sour kraut and then bake > it. Has anyone tried that? > > -----Original Message----- > From: Donald Marinkovich [mailto:[email protected]] > Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 10:25 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > > > In the days, before home refridgerators, it was my job to run to the > store. > When Ma made sarmas that ment 1/3 gd beef, 1/3 gd pork, 1/3 gd ham. > Kisele > glavice came from the barrel in the basement. Eventually I made my own > sour > kraut. and I would include a few heads for sarmas but for my use a crock > was big enough. Once I tasted sarmas wraped in leaves from a frozen head > I > decided that souring heads was no longer worth the bother. I have a son > living in Denver. When he comes to the iron range he has to get enough > blood sausage (krvavice)for him and a buddy with an Italian last name but > had a Slovenian mother. There are still a few places where they still > have > good Slovenian Polish sausage. On the range every thing geets mixed up. > One > of the better places to get Polish sausage was at Coldagelilis in Eveleth. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jerome Buza" > To: > Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 9:58 AM > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > > >> Thanks Robert, I will read that page and enjoy it, I am sure. My family >> always made the Sarma with sauerkraut, no tomatoes, and that is the way I >> love it. Of course, there was an Eimprem, too. While living in Turkey, >> I >> ate their Sarma and it was different,but we grew to love it. Mom just >> boiled the leaves in vinegar water and when I was young, the produce man >> at the local A & P store gave my mom the outer leaves. Now, they don't >> have them available. So, growing the cabbages in our garden at our >> mountain cabin in AZ has become our way of having the larger leaves of >> cabbage to use. >> Margaret >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Robert Jerin" >> To: >> Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 5:42 AM >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >> >> >>> Ahh.... just had some REAL Croatian Sarma at Marie's Restaurant on St >>> Clair in Cleveland. The owners are the family Sabalic from Ljubuski, >>> Hercegovina. REAL sarma must always be made using "soured leaves", >>> which >>> we can purchase at Zagreb Meats on St Clair. If you can not purchase >>> "soured cabbage" then par boiling the leaves in vinegar water may work. >>> For many years I did not like sarma, then I discovered that many (most >>> immigrants I know here in Cleveland) do not add tomatoes, and that is >>> what I did not like! Most here will make a rue and then add paprika and >>> a bit of water to make a delicous sauce to pour over the sarma and >>> mashed >>> potatoes or dumplings. >>> >>> My experience with the (too) many Croatian functions that I attend is >>> that if there are many immigrants the food is authentic and if the >>> majority are American born the food has some resemblance to the >>> authentic >>> stuff but does not come close. >>> >>> Here is a recipe that I have found to my taste from the Embassy web >>> page. >>> >>> http://www.croatiaemb.org/basic_facts/christmas97.htm >>> >>> Robert >>> >>> Karen Heiser wrote: >>> Dear List - I think the "western expansion" did in a lot of our families >>> and >>> traditions. Traveling 30 miles for the family reunion is a lot easier >>> and >>> cheaper than travelling 2500 miles. And then there is the marriage >>> thing...not many of us were able to marry within our ethnicity, so then >>> you >>> have another whole set of traditions to work with. >>> But if you don't stop talking about lamb and sarma, the drooling is >>> going >>> to >>> ruin my keyboard! >>> Karen Heiser >>> Weed, Siskiyou, CA >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Jerome Buza" >>> To: >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 9:58 PM >>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>> >>> >>>> Another reason for the demise of many of the family customs is the way >>>> we >>>> travel around and move far away. We try to keep up our family customs >>> even >>>> though we are in AZ and most of the family is in MI or IL. However, >>>> many >>> of >>>> my aunts and uncles married people that were not that interested and >>>> now >>> the >>>> kids aren't either. My generation knows that my mom cooked like Grandma >>> and >>>> that I cook like mom and are asking me for recipes. However, many >>>> didn't >>>> have the traditions followed all their lives like I did with my mother >>>> and >>>> my husband did with his part of the Polish family. Our own daughter has >>>> been living in TX for 20 of her 21 years of married life and doesn't >>> follow >>>> our traditions. Her kids are fussy and wouldn't eat the food anyway. >>>> Margaret >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "al toennies" >>>> To: >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 4:25 PM >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>> >>>> >>>> > Good question Joy! I think a bunch of siblings (like these folks >>>> > were) >>>> > can keep it together naturally but when they start to fade away and >>>> > you >>>> > are left with cousins and a collection of spouses with family ties of >>>> > their own, you need a catalytic agent of some sort - maybe a person >>>> > or >>>> > a >>>> > group of people that pulls or pushes the different family members >>>> > together. They have to be either loved or feared or so much of a pain >>> it >>>> > the butt that everybody gives in to avoid further hassles. I watched >>>> > my >>>> > mother's Swedish family gatherings wither away after my Grandmother >>> died - >>>> > she was a catalyst of a sort and no one replaced her. >>>> > >>>> > Al in Music City >>>> > ----- Original Message ----- >>>> > >>>> > From: "Joy Durrett" >>>> > To: >>>> > Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 8:57 AM >>>> > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>> > >>>> > >>>> >> Why didn't the next generation keep it going? Sounds like a great >>>> >> way >>> to >>>> >> keep the family together. >>>> >> >>>> >> Joy >>>> >> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> >> From: "al toennies" >>>> >> To: >>>> >> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 2:52 AM >>>> >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >>> My wife's family (all of Croatian descent) used to have a picnic at >>>> >>> a >>>> >>> summer home in Silver Lake, WI (we were all from Chicago) and >>>> >>> roasted >>> a >>>> >>> whole lamb over charcoal in a 55 gallon drum split lengthwise with >>>> >>> a >>>> >>> home-made turning mechanism >>>> >>> doing all the heavy work. I was never a big fan of lamb but I made >>>> >>> an >>>> >>> exception for that - Most of those folks are gone now but the >>>> >>> memories >>>> >>> remain including the best lamb I have ever eaten. >>>> >>> >>>> >>> Al in Music City >>>> >>> >>>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> >>> From: "Robert Jerin" >>>> >>> To: >>>> >>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 12:44 PM >>>> >>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>>> Nick, >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I must admit that I roasted just a leg and used my Weber with nice >>> hot >>>> >>>> coals on the side. Pleeeze don't tell any real Croatians about my >>>> >>>> "unorthodox" method of using a Weber! Everyone here loves roast >>>> >>>> lamb >>>> >>>> except the wife. So it was enough for the gang. But IMHO the >>>> >>>> secret >>>> >>>> is selecting the right piece, trimming much of the fact and then >>>> >>>> coating the lamb with olive oil, salt (I use Croatian Podravka >>> Vegeta), >>>> >>>> pepper, fresh chopped garlic and rosemary and let it marinate in >>>> >>>> the >>>> >>>> fridge for a day or more... then setting the piece out about 2 >>>> >>>> hours >>>> >>>> before placing on the grill. Oh the other trick is slow roasting, >>>> >>>> no >>>> >>>> flame, just hot coals and not too close to the coals....mmmm.... >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> It has been several years since our Junior tammie group here in >>>> >>>> Cleveland had a picnic... at that time we would take most of Sat >>>> >>>> afternoon to set up 8 whole lambs and 9 pigs on spits, then season >>> them >>>> >>>> and put them in the cooler for Sun am.. after that we would feast >>>> >>>> on >>>> >>>> gulas that I would make along with salad, some wine and slivovitz >>>> >>>> and >>>> >>>> one of the father's, who has since passed away would play his >>> harmonika >>>> >>>> (accordian) and all the guys would dance to his Bosanac songs! >>>> >>>> What >>> a >>>> >>>> sight! Then at 4 AM on Sunday I would meet my friend Mato Vrbic at >>> the >>>> >>>> picnic center to prepare the fire... then a little coffee with >>>> >>>> slivovitz of course... and about 6AM we would consider the coals >>>> >>>> and >>>> >>>> the brick lined floor hot enough to place the first few pieces on >>>> >>>> the >>>> >>>> spit... then about 11:30 ish the first ones would come off to be >>>> >>>> cut >>>> >>>> and served.... that Sunday would finish up at about 10-11 PM >>>> >>>> making >>>> >>>> sure the center was left in better condition than we found it! >>>> >>>> Lots >>>> >>>> of work but I miss those ! >>>> >>>> days... >>>> >>>> as they brought back memories of my Grandparent's PLASAJ (Mirko >>>> >>>> and >>>> >>>> Mary) and my cousin's BAKALE (Ivan and Johanna)farms in PA and the >>>> >>>> picnics we would have there. But they are all gone now so we try >>>> >>>> to >>>> >>>> carry on some semblance of those traditions..... >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.podravka.com/en/products/index.php?if=new_products.php >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Here is a photo that may bring back some memories >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.members.shaw.ca/rogergou/bast4.jpeg >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Robert >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> nharamija wrote: >>>> >>>> Robert; Let us see your grille and how you set it up. >>>> >>>> Nick >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> >>>> From: "Robert Jerin" >>>> >>>> To: >>>> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 11:50 AM >>>> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> My wife did those things! I was busy roasting.... lamb! >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Jerome Buza wrote: >>>> >>>> That's right!!! We were all busy baking and cooking and dying eggs >>> and >>>> >>>> cleaning the house for company. >>>> >>>> Margaret >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> >>>> From: "dave mothkovich" >>>> >>>> To: >>>> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 2:32 AM >>>> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> Everybody got busy, and then the holiday came, it happens. >>>> >>>>> Christmas >>>> >>>>> was >>>> >>>>> different, everyone had time to chat it up. >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> Dave >>>> >>>>> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 17:45:41 +0800 "John Stefanac" >>>> >>>>> writes: >>>> >>>>>> Is it just quiet on this list or have I somehow been kicked off >>>> >>>>>> it >>>> >>>>>> again >>>> >>>>>> >>>> >>>>>> >>>> >>>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> -- >>>> >>>>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>>> >>>>> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>>> >>>>> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: >>>> >>>>> 3/27/2005 >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >>>> >>>> about a >>>> >>>> wonderful tour of Croatia! >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >>>> >>>> about a wonderful tour of Croatia! >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>>> >> >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > -- >>>> > No virus found in this incoming message. >>>> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>>> > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 >>>> > >>>> > >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >>> about >>> a wonderful tour of Croatia! >>> >>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 >>> >>> >> >> > > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs SkyScan > service. For more information on a proactive anti-virus service working > around the clock, around the globe, visit www.messagelabs.com. > ________________________________________________________________________ > > ________________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs SkyScan > service. For more information on a proactive anti-virus service working > around the clock, around the globe, visit www.messagelabs.com. > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out about a wonderful tour of Croatia! http://www.kollander-travel.com/ ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs SkyScan service. For more information on a proactive anti-virus service working around the clock, around the globe, visit www.messagelabs.com. ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs SkyScan service. 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Pray tell What Is "Smetana"? Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Jerin" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 9:24 PM Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast

Margaret, Aha, I have never heard that term. Evidently it is a German word... roux = die Einbrenne in German Of course I know about roux as one of my favorite dishes to make is Jambalya, which begins with a roux ... takes the better part of a day. Interesting how words are exchanged amongst peoples... my Grandmother called her homemade cottage cheese Schmierkase But even in the Croatian language there are some borrowed words... For instance German for bacon is spek, one Croatian word is �pek, ham is shincken in German and �unka in Croatian, polenta is used by many Croaitans but is an Italian word but the real Croatian word zgonci (not certain of the spelling) is in Bosnia they call it pule or pure, this is great with a veal stew over the top.... mmm... Here are some links Croatian recipes http://www.croatianmall.com/croatia/food/34_croatian_recipes.htm http://www.balkanweb.com/kroacia/recipes.htm http://www.gourmed.gr/recipes/croatian/?gid=1&nodeid=13 http://www.pitt.edu/~slavic/sli/admin/croatcook.html http://www.hvar.hr/Default.aspx?tabid=640 http://fooddownunder.com/cgi-bin/search.cgi?q=croatian http://www.recipesource.com/ethnic/europe/croatian/ http://www.croatianmall.com/croatia/food/Index.htm Dobar tek! Robert Jerome Buza <[email protected]> wrote: Hi Robert, Eimprem or Einbren is what my grandmother called "roux". Margaret ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Jerin" To: Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 7:24 PM Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > Hi Margaret, > > Sounds good! > > What is Eimprem? > > Robert > > Jerome Buza wrote: > Thanks Robert, I will read that page and enjoy it, I am sure. My family > always made the Sarma with sauerkraut, no tomatoes, and that is the way I > love it. Of course, there was an Eimprem, too. While living in Turkey, I > ate their Sarma and it was different,but we grew to love it. Mom just > boiled the leaves in vinegar water and when I was young, the produce man > at > the local A & P store gave my mom the outer leaves. Now, they don't have > them available. So, growing the cabbages in our garden at our mountain > cabin in AZ has become our way of having the larger leaves of cabbage to > use. > Margaret > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Robert Jerin" > To: > Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 5:42 AM > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > > >> Ahh.... just had some REAL Croatian Sarma at Marie's Restaurant on St >> Clair in Cleveland. The owners are the family Sabalic from Ljubuski, >> Hercegovina. REAL sarma must always be made using "soured leaves", which >> we can purchase at Zagreb Meats on St Clair. If you can not purchase >> "soured cabbage" then par boiling the leaves in vinegar water may work. >> For many years I did not like sarma, then I discovered that many (most >> immigrants I know here in Cleveland) do not add tomatoes, and that is >> what >> I did not like! Most here will make a rue and then add paprika and a bit >> of water to make a delicous sauce to pour over the sarma and mashed >> potatoes or dumplings. >> >> My experience with the (too) many Croatian functions that I attend is >> that >> if there are many immigrants the food is authentic and if the majority >> are >> American born the food has some resemblance to the authentic stuff but >> does not come close. >> >> Here is a recipe that I have found to my taste from the Embassy web page. >> >> http://www.croatiaemb.org/basic_facts/christmas97.htm >> >> Robert >> >> Karen Heiser wrote: >> Dear List - I think the "western expansion" did in a lot of our families >> and >> traditions. Traveling 30 miles for the family reunion is a lot easier and >> cheaper than travelling 2500 miles. And then there is the marriage >> thing...not many of us were able to marry within our ethnicity, so then >> you >> have another whole set of traditions to work with. >> But if you don't stop talking about lamb and sarma, the drooling is going >> to >> ruin my keyboard! >> Karen Heiser >> Weed, Siskiyou, CA >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Jerome Buza" >> To: >> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 9:58 PM >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >> >> >>> Another reason for the demise of many of the family customs is the way >>> we >>> travel around and move far away. We try to keep up our family customs >> even >>> though we are in AZ and most of the family is in MI or IL. However, many >> of >>> my aunts and uncles married people that were not that interested and now >> the >>> kids aren't either. My generation knows that my mom cooked like Grandma >> and >>> that I cook like mom and are asking me for recipes. However, many didn't >>> have the traditions followed all their lives like I did with my mother >>> and >>> my husband did with his part of the Polish family. Our own daughter has >>> been living in TX for 20 of her 21 years of married life and doesn't >> follow >>> our traditions. Her kids are fussy and wouldn't eat the food anyway. >>> Margaret >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "al toennies" >>> To: >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 4:25 PM >>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>> >>> >>> > Good question Joy! I think a bunch of siblings (like these folks were) >>> > can keep it together naturally but when they start to fade away and >>> > you >>> > are left with cousins and a collection of spouses with family ties of >>> > their own, you need a catalytic agent of some sort - maybe a person or >>> > a >>> > group of people that pulls or pushes the different family members >>> > together. They have to be either loved or feared or so much of a pain >> it >>> > the butt that everybody gives in to avoid further hassles. I watched >>> > my >>> > mother's Swedish family gatherings wither away after my Grandmother >> died - >>> > she was a catalyst of a sort and no one replaced her. >>> > >>> > Al in Music City >>> > ----- Original Message ----- >>> > >>> > From: "Joy Durrett" >>> > To: >>> > Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 8:57 AM >>> > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>> > >>> > >>> >> Why didn't the next generation keep it going? Sounds like a great way >> to >>> >> keep the family together. >>> >> >>> >> Joy >>> >> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >> From: "al toennies" >>> >> To: >>> >> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 2:52 AM >>> >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>> >> >>> >> >>> >>> My wife's family (all of Croatian descent) used to have a picnic at >>> >>> a >>> >>> summer home in Silver Lake, WI (we were all from Chicago) and >>> >>> roasted >> a >>> >>> whole lamb over charcoal in a 55 gallon drum split lengthwise with a >>> >>> home-made turning mechanism >>> >>> doing all the heavy work. I was never a big fan of lamb but I made >>> >>> an >>> >>> exception for that - Most of those folks are gone now but the >>> >>> memories >>> >>> remain including the best lamb I have ever eaten. >>> >>> >>> >>> Al in Music City >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >>> From: "Robert Jerin" >>> >>> To: >>> >>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 12:44 PM >>> >>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>> Nick, >>> >>>> >>> >>>> I must admit that I roasted just a leg and used my Weber with nice >> hot >>> >>>> coals on the side. Pleeeze don't tell any real Croatians about my >>> >>>> "unorthodox" method of using a Weber! Everyone here loves roast >>> >>>> lamb >>> >>>> except the wife. So it was enough for the gang. But IMHO the secret >>> >>>> is selecting the right piece, trimming much of the fact and then >>> >>>> coating the lamb with olive oil, salt (I use Croatian Podravka >> Vegeta), >>> >>>> pepper, fresh chopped garlic and rosemary and let it marinate in >>> >>>> the >>> >>>> fridge for a day or more... then setting the piece out about 2 >>> >>>> hours >>> >>>> before placing on the grill. Oh the other trick is slow roasting, >>> >>>> no >>> >>>> flame, just hot coals and not too close to the coals....mmmm.... >>> >>>> >>> >>>> It has been several years since our Junior tammie group here in >>> >>>> Cleveland had a picnic... at that time we would take most of Sat >>> >>>> afternoon to set up 8 whole lambs and 9 pigs on spits, then season >> them >>> >>>> and put them in the cooler for Sun am.. after that we would feast >>> >>>> on >>> >>>> gulas that I would make along with salad, some wine and slivovitz >>> >>>> and >>> >>>> one of the father's, who has since passed away would play his >> harmonika >>> >>>> (accordian) and all the guys would dance to his Bosanac songs! What >> a >>> >>>> sight! Then at 4 AM on Sunday I would meet my friend Mato Vrbic at >> the >>> >>>> picnic center to prepare the fire... then a little coffee with >>> >>>> slivovitz of course... and about 6AM we would consider the coals >>> >>>> and >>> >>>> the brick lined floor hot enough to place the first few pieces on >>> >>>> the >>> >>>> spit... then about 11:30 ish the first ones would come off to be >>> >>>> cut >>> >>>> and served.... that Sunday would finish up at about 10-11 PM making >>> >>>> sure the center was left in better condition than we found it! Lots >>> >>>> of work but I miss those ! >>> >>>> days... >>> >>>> as they brought back memories of my Grandparent's PLASAJ (Mirko and >>> >>>> Mary) and my cousin's BAKALE (Ivan and Johanna)farms in PA and the >>> >>>> picnics we would have there. But they are all gone now so we try to >>> >>>> carry on some semblance of those traditions..... >>> >>>> >>> >>>> http://www.podravka.com/en/products/index.php?if=new_products.php >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Here is a photo that may bring back some memories >>> >>>> >>> >>>> http://www.members.shaw.ca/rogergou/bast4.jpeg >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Robert >>> >>>> >>> >>>> nharamija wrote: >>> >>>> Robert; Let us see your grille and how you set it up. >>> >>>> Nick >>> >>>> >>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >>>> From: "Robert Jerin" >>> >>>> To: >>> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 11:50 AM >>> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> My wife did those things! I was busy roasting.... lamb! >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Jerome Buza wrote: >>> >>>> That's right!!! We were all busy baking and cooking and dying eggs >> and >>> >>>> cleaning the house for company. >>> >>>> Margaret >>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >>>> From: "dave mothkovich" >>> >>>> To: >>> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 2:32 AM >>> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>>> Everybody got busy, and then the holiday came, it happens. >>> >>>>> Christmas >>> >>>>> was >>> >>>>> different, everyone had time to chat it up. >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> Dave >>> >>>>> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 17:45:41 +0800 "John Stefanac" >>> >>>>> writes: >>> >>>>>> Is it just quiet on this list or have I somehow been kicked off >>> >>>>>> it >>> >>>>>> again >>> >>>>>> >>> >>>>>> >>> >>>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> -- >>> >>>>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>> >>>>> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>> >>>>> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: >>> >>>>> 3/27/2005 >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >>> >>>> about a >>> >>>> wonderful tour of Croatia! >>> >>>> >>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >>> >>>> about a wonderful tour of Croatia! >>> >>>> >>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >> >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > -- >>> > No virus found in this incoming message. >>> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>> > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 >>> > >>> > >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out about >> a wonderful tour of Croatia! >> >> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >> >> >> >> -- >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 >> >> > > > > Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out about > a wonderful tour of Croatia! > > http://www.kollander-travel.com/ > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 > > Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out about a wonderful tour of Croatia! http://www.kollander-travel.com/

Yah yu betcha, that is Minestotian dialect, oofdah :) Robert Donald Marinkovich <[email protected]> wrote: You'r talking iron rang dialect. I once asked a bus driver, does dis bus go to Dulut? He said No this bus goes beep beep. Maybe you were in Nuni Stojanofs place in Gary. He had a tambura combo too. When I was a kid railroad passenger cars were being eliminated and i told my mother that I had never ridden on a train. She came back right away. Da Da je si se na trenu se vozio. I said No Ma I never rode on a train. Da Da again. I said When did I ever ride on a train? She said when I was three weeks old Pa was in the county jail u Dulutu. sto je rakiju peka. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Jerin" To: Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 8:32 PM Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > Don, > > Talk about people knowing how to live! > > When we lived in "The Cities" 1980-1984 (Minnesotan for The Twin Cities > aka Minneapolis St Paul) we enjoyed driving or taking the train to Dulut > (no h !) there was a small "Yugoslav" restaurant in Dulut, can not recall > the name. Just wondered if it is still there. I was amazed at the > connection that Dulut and Cleveland, Cleveland Cliffs and other ore > shipping etc.. > > Robert > > Donald Marinkovich wrote: > I ran, TO THE STORE, Paul Bizals finer meats and klobase, in Chisholm of > course. The sarma was always covered with kraut in our house. I remember a > woman asking for fifteen cents soup bone. I was told that Coldagelli > bought > Postudensheks recepe, he could even have been related. I read somewhere > that there is no such thing as a melting pot. We have it here. A friend > told me that his kids are three forths bohunk and they have a Finnlander > name. His mother and his wife were both Slovenian and his father was Finn, > he was the model for the iron man statue, and he was the president of our > local union when I worked there. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Reuter, Patty" > > To: > Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 10:42 AM > Subject: RE: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > > >> Don, >> >> What is the name of the store that you ran? Was it in Chisholm? My >> granparents always got their sausage from Coldageliis. We would have it >> every time we came up from the cities. We have a Sarma recipie from the >> Perpich's that says we should cover the sarma in sour kraut and then bake >> it. Has anyone tried that? >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Donald Marinkovich [mailto:[email protected]] >> Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 10:25 AM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >> >> >> In the days, before home refridgerators, it was my job to run to the >> store. >> When Ma made sarmas that ment 1/3 gd beef, 1/3 gd pork, 1/3 gd ham. >> Kisele >> glavice came from the barrel in the basement. Eventually I made my own >> sour >> kraut. and I would include a few heads for sarmas but for my use a crock >> was big enough. Once I tasted sarmas wraped in leaves from a frozen head >> I >> decided that souring heads was no longer worth the bother. I have a son >> living in Denver. When he comes to the iron range he has to get enough >> blood sausage (krvavice)for him and a buddy with an Italian last name but >> had a Slovenian mother. There are still a few places where they still >> have >> good Slovenian Polish sausage. On the range every thing geets mixed up. >> One >> of the better places to get Polish sausage was at Coldagelilis in >> Eveleth. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Jerome Buza" >> To: >> Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 9:58 AM >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >> >> >>> Thanks Robert, I will read that page and enjoy it, I am sure. My family >>> always made the Sarma with sauerkraut, no tomatoes, and that is the way >>> I >>> love it. Of course, there was an Eimprem, too. While living in Turkey, >>> I >>> ate their Sarma and it was different,but we grew to love it. Mom just >>> boiled the leaves in vinegar water and when I was young, the produce man >>> at the local A & P store gave my mom the outer leaves. Now, they don't >>> have them available. So, growing the cabbages in our garden at our >>> mountain cabin in AZ has become our way of having the larger leaves of >>> cabbage to use. >>> Margaret >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Robert Jerin" >>> To: >>> Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 5:42 AM >>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>> >>> >>>> Ahh.... just had some REAL Croatian Sarma at Marie's Restaurant on St >>>> Clair in Cleveland. The owners are the family Sabalic from Ljubuski, >>>> Hercegovina. REAL sarma must always be made using "soured leaves", >>>> which >>>> we can purchase at Zagreb Meats on St Clair. If you can not purchase >>>> "soured cabbage" then par boiling the leaves in vinegar water may work. >>>> For many years I did not like sarma, then I discovered that many (most >>>> immigrants I know here in Cleveland) do not add tomatoes, and that is >>>> what I did not like! Most here will make a rue and then add paprika and >>>> a bit of water to make a delicous sauce to pour over the sarma and >>>> mashed >>>> potatoes or dumplings. >>>> >>>> My experience with the (too) many Croatian functions that I attend is >>>> that if there are many immigrants the food is authentic and if the >>>> majority are American born the food has some resemblance to the >>>> authentic >>>> stuff but does not come close. >>>> >>>> Here is a recipe that I have found to my taste from the Embassy web >>>> page. >>>> >>>> http://www.croatiaemb.org/basic_facts/christmas97.htm >>>> >>>> Robert >>>> >>>> Karen Heiser wrote: >>>> Dear List - I think the "western expansion" did in a lot of our >>>> families >>>> and >>>> traditions. Traveling 30 miles for the family reunion is a lot easier >>>> and >>>> cheaper than travelling 2500 miles. And then there is the marriage >>>> thing...not many of us were able to marry within our ethnicity, so then >>>> you >>>> have another whole set of traditions to work with. >>>> But if you don't stop talking about lamb and sarma, the drooling is >>>> going >>>> to >>>> ruin my keyboard! >>>> Karen Heiser >>>> Weed, Siskiyou, CA >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Jerome Buza" >>>> To: >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 9:58 PM >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>> >>>> >>>>> Another reason for the demise of many of the family customs is the way >>>>> we >>>>> travel around and move far away. We try to keep up our family customs >>>> even >>>>> though we are in AZ and most of the family is in MI or IL. However, >>>>> many >>>> of >>>>> my aunts and uncles married people that were not that interested and >>>>> now >>>> the >>>>> kids aren't either. My generation knows that my mom cooked like >>>>> Grandma >>>> and >>>>> that I cook like mom and are asking me for recipes. However, many >>>>> didn't >>>>> have the traditions followed all their lives like I did with my mother >>>>> and >>>>> my husband did with his part of the Polish family. Our own daughter >>>>> has >>>>> been living in TX for 20 of her 21 years of married life and doesn't >>>> follow >>>>> our traditions. Her kids are fussy and wouldn't eat the food anyway. >>>>> Margaret >>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>> From: "al toennies" >>>>> To: >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 4:25 PM >>>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> > Good question Joy! I think a bunch of siblings (like these folks >>>>> > were) >>>>> > can keep it together naturally but when they start to fade away and >>>>> > you >>>>> > are left with cousins and a collection of spouses with family ties >>>>> > of >>>>> > their own, you need a catalytic agent of some sort - maybe a person >>>>> > or >>>>> > a >>>>> > group of people that pulls or pushes the different family members >>>>> > together. They have to be either loved or feared or so much of a >>>>> > pain >>>> it >>>>> > the butt that everybody gives in to avoid further hassles. I watched >>>>> > my >>>>> > mother's Swedish family gatherings wither away after my Grandmother >>>> died - >>>>> > she was a catalyst of a sort and no one replaced her. >>>>> > >>>>> > Al in Music City >>>>> > ----- Original Message ----- >>>>> > >>>>> > From: "Joy Durrett" >>>>> > To: >>>>> > Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 8:57 AM >>>>> > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> >> Why didn't the next generation keep it going? Sounds like a great >>>>> >> way >>>> to >>>>> >> keep the family together. >>>>> >> >>>>> >> Joy >>>>> >> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>> >> From: "al toennies" >>>>> >> To: >>>>> >> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 2:52 AM >>>>> >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >>> My wife's family (all of Croatian descent) used to have a picnic >>>>> >>> at >>>>> >>> a >>>>> >>> summer home in Silver Lake, WI (we were all from Chicago) and >>>>> >>> roasted >>>> a >>>>> >>> whole lamb over charcoal in a 55 gallon drum split lengthwise with >>>>> >>> a >>>>> >>> home-made turning mechanism >>>>> >>> doing all the heavy work. I was never a big fan of lamb but I made >>>>> >>> an >>>>> >>> exception for that - Most of those folks are gone now but the >>>>> >>> memories >>>>> >>> remain including the best lamb I have ever eaten. >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> Al in Music City >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>> >>> From: "Robert Jerin" >>>>> >>> To: >>>>> >>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 12:44 PM >>>>> >>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>>> Nick, >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> I must admit that I roasted just a leg and used my Weber with >>>>> >>>> nice >>>> hot >>>>> >>>> coals on the side. Pleeeze don't tell any real Croatians about my >>>>> >>>> "unorthodox" method of using a Weber! Everyone here loves roast >>>>> >>>> lamb >>>>> >>>> except the wife. So it was enough for the gang. But IMHO the >>>>> >>>> secret >>>>> >>>> is selecting the right piece, trimming much of the fact and then >>>>> >>>> coating the lamb with olive oil, salt (I use Croatian Podravka >>>> Vegeta), >>>>> >>>> pepper, fresh chopped garlic and rosemary and let it marinate in >>>>> >>>> the >>>>> >>>> fridge for a day or more... then setting the piece out about 2 >>>>> >>>> hours >>>>> >>>> before placing on the grill. Oh the other trick is slow roasting, >>>>> >>>> no >>>>> >>>> flame, just hot coals and not too close to the coals....mmmm.... >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> It has been several years since our Junior tammie group here in >>>>> >>>> Cleveland had a picnic... at that time we would take most of Sat >>>>> >>>> afternoon to set up 8 whole lambs and 9 pigs on spits, then >>>>> >>>> season >>>> them >>>>> >>>> and put them in the cooler for Sun am.. after that we would feast >>>>> >>>> on >>>>> >>>> gulas that I would make along with salad, some wine and slivovitz >>>>> >>>> and >>>>> >>>> one of the father's, who has since passed away would play his >>>> harmonika >>>>> >>>> (accordian) and all the guys would dance to his Bosanac songs! >>>>> >>>> What >>>> a >>>>> >>>> sight! Then at 4 AM on Sunday I would meet my friend Mato Vrbic >>>>> >>>> at >>>> the >>>>> >>>> picnic center to prepare the fire... then a little coffee with >>>>> >>>> slivovitz of course... and about 6AM we would consider the coals >>>>> >>>> and >>>>> >>>> the brick lined floor hot enough to place the first few pieces on >>>>> >>>> the >>>>> >>>> spit... then about 11:30 ish the first ones would come off to be >>>>> >>>> cut >>>>> >>>> and served.... that Sunday would finish up at about 10-11 PM >>>>> >>>> making >>>>> >>>> sure the center was left in better condition than we found it! >>>>> >>>> Lots >>>>> >>>> of work but I miss those ! >>>>> >>>> days... >>>>> >>>> as they brought back memories of my Grandparent's PLASAJ (Mirko >>>>> >>>> and >>>>> >>>> Mary) and my cousin's BAKALE (Ivan and Johanna)farms in PA and >>>>> >>>> the >>>>> >>>> picnics we would have there. But they are all gone now so we try >>>>> >>>> to >>>>> >>>> carry on some semblance of those traditions..... >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> http://www.podravka.com/en/products/index.php?if=new_products.php >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> Here is a photo that may bring back some memories >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> http://www.members.shaw.ca/rogergou/bast4.jpeg >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> Robert >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> nharamija wrote: >>>>> >>>> Robert; Let us see your grille and how you set it up. >>>>> >>>> Nick >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>> >>>> From: "Robert Jerin" >>>>> >>>> To: >>>>> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 11:50 AM >>>>> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> My wife did those things! I was busy roasting.... lamb! >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> Jerome Buza wrote: >>>>> >>>> That's right!!! We were all busy baking and cooking and dying >>>>> >>>> eggs >>>> and >>>>> >>>> cleaning the house for company. >>>>> >>>> Margaret >>>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>> >>>> From: "dave mothkovich" >>>>> >>>> To: >>>>> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 2:32 AM >>>>> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>> Everybody got busy, and then the holiday came, it happens. >>>>> >>>>> Christmas >>>>> >>>>> was >>>>> >>>>> different, everyone had time to chat it up. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Dave >>>>> >>>>> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 17:45:41 +0800 "John Stefanac" >>>>> >>>>> writes: >>>>> >>>>>> Is it just quiet on this list or have I somehow been kicked off >>>>> >>>>>> it >>>>> >>>>>> again >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> >>>>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>>>> >>>>> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>>>> >>>>> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: >>>>> >>>>> 3/27/2005 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find >>>>> >>>> out >>>>> >>>> about a >>>>> >>>> wonderful tour of Croatia! >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find >>>>> >>>> out >>>>> >>>> about a wonderful tour of Croatia! >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> >> >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > -- >>>>> > No virus found in this incoming message. >>>>> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>>>> > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >>>> about >>>> a wonderful tour of Croatia! >>>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>>> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>>> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> ________________________________________________________________________ >> This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs SkyScan >> service. For more information on a proactive anti-virus service working >> around the clock, around the globe, visit www.messagelabs.com. >> ________________________________________________________________________ >> >> ________________________________________________________________________ >> This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs SkyScan >> service. For more information on a proactive anti-virus service working >> around the clock, around the globe, visit www.messagelabs.com. >> ________________________________________________________________________ >> >> > > > > > Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out about > a wonderful tour of Croatia! > > http://www.kollander-travel.com/ > > Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out about a wonderful tour of Croatia! http://www.kollander-travel.com/

HELLO.REALLY NOT.YOU SENT The MAIL To the DIRECTION THAT I GAVE YOU. ERIKA >Hi! > >I was wondering if anyone is researching this family? > >Thanks, >Amy > _________________________________________________________________ Consigue aquí las mejores y mas recientes ofertas de trabajo en América Latina y USA: http://latam.msn.com/empleos/

You'r talking iron rang dialect. I once asked a bus driver, does dis bus go to Dulut? He said No this bus goes beep beep. Maybe you were in Nuni Stojanofs place in Gary. He had a tambura combo too. When I was a kid railroad passenger cars were being eliminated and i told my mother that I had never ridden on a train. She came back right away. Da Da je si se na trenu se vozio. I said No Ma I never rode on a train. Da Da again. I said When did I ever ride on a train? She said when I was three weeks old Pa was in the county jail u Dulutu. sto je rakiju peka. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Jerin" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 8:32 PM Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > Don, > > Talk about people knowing how to live! > > When we lived in "The Cities" 1980-1984 (Minnesotan for The Twin Cities > aka Minneapolis St Paul) we enjoyed driving or taking the train to Dulut > (no h !) there was a small "Yugoslav" restaurant in Dulut, can not recall > the name. Just wondered if it is still there. I was amazed at the > connection that Dulut and Cleveland, Cleveland Cliffs and other ore > shipping etc.. > > Robert > > Donald Marinkovich <[email protected]> wrote: > I ran, TO THE STORE, Paul Bizals finer meats and klobase, in Chisholm of > course. The sarma was always covered with kraut in our house. I remember a > woman asking for fifteen cents soup bone. I was told that Coldagelli > bought > Postudensheks recepe, he could even have been related. I read somewhere > that there is no such thing as a melting pot. We have it here. A friend > told me that his kids are three forths bohunk and they have a Finnlander > name. His mother and his wife were both Slovenian and his father was Finn, > he was the model for the iron man statue, and he was the president of our > local union when I worked there. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Reuter, Patty" > > To: > Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 10:42 AM > Subject: RE: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > > >> Don, >> >> What is the name of the store that you ran? Was it in Chisholm? My >> granparents always got their sausage from Coldageliis. We would have it >> every time we came up from the cities. We have a Sarma recipie from the >> Perpich's that says we should cover the sarma in sour kraut and then bake >> it. Has anyone tried that? >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Donald Marinkovich [mailto:[email protected]] >> Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 10:25 AM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >> >> >> In the days, before home refridgerators, it was my job to run to the >> store. >> When Ma made sarmas that ment 1/3 gd beef, 1/3 gd pork, 1/3 gd ham. >> Kisele >> glavice came from the barrel in the basement. Eventually I made my own >> sour >> kraut. and I would include a few heads for sarmas but for my use a crock >> was big enough. Once I tasted sarmas wraped in leaves from a frozen head >> I >> decided that souring heads was no longer worth the bother. I have a son >> living in Denver. When he comes to the iron range he has to get enough >> blood sausage (krvavice)for him and a buddy with an Italian last name but >> had a Slovenian mother. There are still a few places where they still >> have >> good Slovenian Polish sausage. On the range every thing geets mixed up. >> One >> of the better places to get Polish sausage was at Coldagelilis in >> Eveleth. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Jerome Buza" >> To: >> Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 9:58 AM >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >> >> >>> Thanks Robert, I will read that page and enjoy it, I am sure. My family >>> always made the Sarma with sauerkraut, no tomatoes, and that is the way >>> I >>> love it. Of course, there was an Eimprem, too. While living in Turkey, >>> I >>> ate their Sarma and it was different,but we grew to love it. Mom just >>> boiled the leaves in vinegar water and when I was young, the produce man >>> at the local A & P store gave my mom the outer leaves. Now, they don't >>> have them available. So, growing the cabbages in our garden at our >>> mountain cabin in AZ has become our way of having the larger leaves of >>> cabbage to use. >>> Margaret >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Robert Jerin" >>> To: >>> Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 5:42 AM >>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>> >>> >>>> Ahh.... just had some REAL Croatian Sarma at Marie's Restaurant on St >>>> Clair in Cleveland. The owners are the family Sabalic from Ljubuski, >>>> Hercegovina. REAL sarma must always be made using "soured leaves", >>>> which >>>> we can purchase at Zagreb Meats on St Clair. If you can not purchase >>>> "soured cabbage" then par boiling the leaves in vinegar water may work. >>>> For many years I did not like sarma, then I discovered that many (most >>>> immigrants I know here in Cleveland) do not add tomatoes, and that is >>>> what I did not like! Most here will make a rue and then add paprika and >>>> a bit of water to make a delicous sauce to pour over the sarma and >>>> mashed >>>> potatoes or dumplings. >>>> >>>> My experience with the (too) many Croatian functions that I attend is >>>> that if there are many immigrants the food is authentic and if the >>>> majority are American born the food has some resemblance to the >>>> authentic >>>> stuff but does not come close. >>>> >>>> Here is a recipe that I have found to my taste from the Embassy web >>>> page. >>>> >>>> http://www.croatiaemb.org/basic_facts/christmas97.htm >>>> >>>> Robert >>>> >>>> Karen Heiser wrote: >>>> Dear List - I think the "western expansion" did in a lot of our >>>> families >>>> and >>>> traditions. Traveling 30 miles for the family reunion is a lot easier >>>> and >>>> cheaper than travelling 2500 miles. And then there is the marriage >>>> thing...not many of us were able to marry within our ethnicity, so then >>>> you >>>> have another whole set of traditions to work with. >>>> But if you don't stop talking about lamb and sarma, the drooling is >>>> going >>>> to >>>> ruin my keyboard! >>>> Karen Heiser >>>> Weed, Siskiyou, CA >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Jerome Buza" >>>> To: >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 9:58 PM >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>> >>>> >>>>> Another reason for the demise of many of the family customs is the way >>>>> we >>>>> travel around and move far away. We try to keep up our family customs >>>> even >>>>> though we are in AZ and most of the family is in MI or IL. However, >>>>> many >>>> of >>>>> my aunts and uncles married people that were not that interested and >>>>> now >>>> the >>>>> kids aren't either. My generation knows that my mom cooked like >>>>> Grandma >>>> and >>>>> that I cook like mom and are asking me for recipes. However, many >>>>> didn't >>>>> have the traditions followed all their lives like I did with my mother >>>>> and >>>>> my husband did with his part of the Polish family. Our own daughter >>>>> has >>>>> been living in TX for 20 of her 21 years of married life and doesn't >>>> follow >>>>> our traditions. Her kids are fussy and wouldn't eat the food anyway. >>>>> Margaret >>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>> From: "al toennies" >>>>> To: >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 4:25 PM >>>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> > Good question Joy! I think a bunch of siblings (like these folks >>>>> > were) >>>>> > can keep it together naturally but when they start to fade away and >>>>> > you >>>>> > are left with cousins and a collection of spouses with family ties >>>>> > of >>>>> > their own, you need a catalytic agent of some sort - maybe a person >>>>> > or >>>>> > a >>>>> > group of people that pulls or pushes the different family members >>>>> > together. They have to be either loved or feared or so much of a >>>>> > pain >>>> it >>>>> > the butt that everybody gives in to avoid further hassles. I watched >>>>> > my >>>>> > mother's Swedish family gatherings wither away after my Grandmother >>>> died - >>>>> > she was a catalyst of a sort and no one replaced her. >>>>> > >>>>> > Al in Music City >>>>> > ----- Original Message ----- >>>>> > >>>>> > From: "Joy Durrett" >>>>> > To: >>>>> > Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 8:57 AM >>>>> > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> >> Why didn't the next generation keep it going? Sounds like a great >>>>> >> way >>>> to >>>>> >> keep the family together. >>>>> >> >>>>> >> Joy >>>>> >> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>> >> From: "al toennies" >>>>> >> To: >>>>> >> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 2:52 AM >>>>> >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >>> My wife's family (all of Croatian descent) used to have a picnic >>>>> >>> at >>>>> >>> a >>>>> >>> summer home in Silver Lake, WI (we were all from Chicago) and >>>>> >>> roasted >>>> a >>>>> >>> whole lamb over charcoal in a 55 gallon drum split lengthwise with >>>>> >>> a >>>>> >>> home-made turning mechanism >>>>> >>> doing all the heavy work. I was never a big fan of lamb but I made >>>>> >>> an >>>>> >>> exception for that - Most of those folks are gone now but the >>>>> >>> memories >>>>> >>> remain including the best lamb I have ever eaten. >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> Al in Music City >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>> >>> From: "Robert Jerin" >>>>> >>> To: >>>>> >>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 12:44 PM >>>>> >>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>>> Nick, >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> I must admit that I roasted just a leg and used my Weber with >>>>> >>>> nice >>>> hot >>>>> >>>> coals on the side. Pleeeze don't tell any real Croatians about my >>>>> >>>> "unorthodox" method of using a Weber! Everyone here loves roast >>>>> >>>> lamb >>>>> >>>> except the wife. So it was enough for the gang. But IMHO the >>>>> >>>> secret >>>>> >>>> is selecting the right piece, trimming much of the fact and then >>>>> >>>> coating the lamb with olive oil, salt (I use Croatian Podravka >>>> Vegeta), >>>>> >>>> pepper, fresh chopped garlic and rosemary and let it marinate in >>>>> >>>> the >>>>> >>>> fridge for a day or more... then setting the piece out about 2 >>>>> >>>> hours >>>>> >>>> before placing on the grill. Oh the other trick is slow roasting, >>>>> >>>> no >>>>> >>>> flame, just hot coals and not too close to the coals....mmmm.... >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> It has been several years since our Junior tammie group here in >>>>> >>>> Cleveland had a picnic... at that time we would take most of Sat >>>>> >>>> afternoon to set up 8 whole lambs and 9 pigs on spits, then >>>>> >>>> season >>>> them >>>>> >>>> and put them in the cooler for Sun am.. after that we would feast >>>>> >>>> on >>>>> >>>> gulas that I would make along with salad, some wine and slivovitz >>>>> >>>> and >>>>> >>>> one of the father's, who has since passed away would play his >>>> harmonika >>>>> >>>> (accordian) and all the guys would dance to his Bosanac songs! >>>>> >>>> What >>>> a >>>>> >>>> sight! Then at 4 AM on Sunday I would meet my friend Mato Vrbic >>>>> >>>> at >>>> the >>>>> >>>> picnic center to prepare the fire... then a little coffee with >>>>> >>>> slivovitz of course... and about 6AM we would consider the coals >>>>> >>>> and >>>>> >>>> the brick lined floor hot enough to place the first few pieces on >>>>> >>>> the >>>>> >>>> spit... then about 11:30 ish the first ones would come off to be >>>>> >>>> cut >>>>> >>>> and served.... that Sunday would finish up at about 10-11 PM >>>>> >>>> making >>>>> >>>> sure the center was left in better condition than we found it! >>>>> >>>> Lots >>>>> >>>> of work but I miss those ! >>>>> >>>> days... >>>>> >>>> as they brought back memories of my Grandparent's PLASAJ (Mirko >>>>> >>>> and >>>>> >>>> Mary) and my cousin's BAKALE (Ivan and Johanna)farms in PA and >>>>> >>>> the >>>>> >>>> picnics we would have there. But they are all gone now so we try >>>>> >>>> to >>>>> >>>> carry on some semblance of those traditions..... >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> http://www.podravka.com/en/products/index.php?if=new_products.php >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> Here is a photo that may bring back some memories >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> http://www.members.shaw.ca/rogergou/bast4.jpeg >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> Robert >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> nharamija wrote: >>>>> >>>> Robert; Let us see your grille and how you set it up. >>>>> >>>> Nick >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>> >>>> From: "Robert Jerin" >>>>> >>>> To: >>>>> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 11:50 AM >>>>> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> My wife did those things! I was busy roasting.... lamb! >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> Jerome Buza wrote: >>>>> >>>> That's right!!! We were all busy baking and cooking and dying >>>>> >>>> eggs >>>> and >>>>> >>>> cleaning the house for company. >>>>> >>>> Margaret >>>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>> >>>> From: "dave mothkovich" >>>>> >>>> To: >>>>> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 2:32 AM >>>>> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>> Everybody got busy, and then the holiday came, it happens. >>>>> >>>>> Christmas >>>>> >>>>> was >>>>> >>>>> different, everyone had time to chat it up. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Dave >>>>> >>>>> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 17:45:41 +0800 "John Stefanac" >>>>> >>>>> writes: >>>>> >>>>>> Is it just quiet on this list or have I somehow been kicked off >>>>> >>>>>> it >>>>> >>>>>> again >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> >>>>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>>>> >>>>> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>>>> >>>>> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: >>>>> >>>>> 3/27/2005 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find >>>>> >>>> out >>>>> >>>> about a >>>>> >>>> wonderful tour of Croatia! >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find >>>>> >>>> out >>>>> >>>> about a wonderful tour of Croatia! >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> >> >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > -- >>>>> > No virus found in this incoming message. >>>>> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>>>> > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >>>> about >>>> a wonderful tour of Croatia! >>>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>>> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>>> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> ________________________________________________________________________ >> This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs SkyScan >> service. For more information on a proactive anti-virus service working >> around the clock, around the globe, visit www.messagelabs.com. >> ________________________________________________________________________ >> >> ________________________________________________________________________ >> This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs SkyScan >> service. For more information on a proactive anti-virus service working >> around the clock, around the globe, visit www.messagelabs.com. >> ________________________________________________________________________ >> >> > > > > > Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out about > a wonderful tour of Croatia! > > http://www.kollander-travel.com/ > >

Hi Robert, Eimprem or Einbren is what my grandmother called "roux". Margaret ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Jerin" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 7:24 PM Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > Hi Margaret, > > Sounds good! > > What is Eimprem? > > Robert > > Jerome Buza <[email protected]> wrote: > Thanks Robert, I will read that page and enjoy it, I am sure. My family > always made the Sarma with sauerkraut, no tomatoes, and that is the way I > love it. Of course, there was an Eimprem, too. While living in Turkey, I > ate their Sarma and it was different,but we grew to love it. Mom just > boiled the leaves in vinegar water and when I was young, the produce man > at > the local A & P store gave my mom the outer leaves. Now, they don't have > them available. So, growing the cabbages in our garden at our mountain > cabin in AZ has become our way of having the larger leaves of cabbage to > use. > Margaret > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Robert Jerin" > To: > Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 5:42 AM > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > > >> Ahh.... just had some REAL Croatian Sarma at Marie's Restaurant on St >> Clair in Cleveland. The owners are the family Sabalic from Ljubuski, >> Hercegovina. REAL sarma must always be made using "soured leaves", which >> we can purchase at Zagreb Meats on St Clair. If you can not purchase >> "soured cabbage" then par boiling the leaves in vinegar water may work. >> For many years I did not like sarma, then I discovered that many (most >> immigrants I know here in Cleveland) do not add tomatoes, and that is >> what >> I did not like! Most here will make a rue and then add paprika and a bit >> of water to make a delicous sauce to pour over the sarma and mashed >> potatoes or dumplings. >> >> My experience with the (too) many Croatian functions that I attend is >> that >> if there are many immigrants the food is authentic and if the majority >> are >> American born the food has some resemblance to the authentic stuff but >> does not come close. >> >> Here is a recipe that I have found to my taste from the Embassy web page. >> >> http://www.croatiaemb.org/basic_facts/christmas97.htm >> >> Robert >> >> Karen Heiser wrote: >> Dear List - I think the "western expansion" did in a lot of our families >> and >> traditions. Traveling 30 miles for the family reunion is a lot easier and >> cheaper than travelling 2500 miles. And then there is the marriage >> thing...not many of us were able to marry within our ethnicity, so then >> you >> have another whole set of traditions to work with. >> But if you don't stop talking about lamb and sarma, the drooling is going >> to >> ruin my keyboard! >> Karen Heiser >> Weed, Siskiyou, CA >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Jerome Buza" >> To: >> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 9:58 PM >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >> >> >>> Another reason for the demise of many of the family customs is the way >>> we >>> travel around and move far away. We try to keep up our family customs >> even >>> though we are in AZ and most of the family is in MI or IL. However, many >> of >>> my aunts and uncles married people that were not that interested and now >> the >>> kids aren't either. My generation knows that my mom cooked like Grandma >> and >>> that I cook like mom and are asking me for recipes. However, many didn't >>> have the traditions followed all their lives like I did with my mother >>> and >>> my husband did with his part of the Polish family. Our own daughter has >>> been living in TX for 20 of her 21 years of married life and doesn't >> follow >>> our traditions. Her kids are fussy and wouldn't eat the food anyway. >>> Margaret >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "al toennies" >>> To: >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 4:25 PM >>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>> >>> >>> > Good question Joy! I think a bunch of siblings (like these folks were) >>> > can keep it together naturally but when they start to fade away and >>> > you >>> > are left with cousins and a collection of spouses with family ties of >>> > their own, you need a catalytic agent of some sort - maybe a person or >>> > a >>> > group of people that pulls or pushes the different family members >>> > together. They have to be either loved or feared or so much of a pain >> it >>> > the butt that everybody gives in to avoid further hassles. I watched >>> > my >>> > mother's Swedish family gatherings wither away after my Grandmother >> died - >>> > she was a catalyst of a sort and no one replaced her. >>> > >>> > Al in Music City >>> > ----- Original Message ----- >>> > >>> > From: "Joy Durrett" >>> > To: >>> > Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 8:57 AM >>> > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>> > >>> > >>> >> Why didn't the next generation keep it going? Sounds like a great way >> to >>> >> keep the family together. >>> >> >>> >> Joy >>> >> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >> From: "al toennies" >>> >> To: >>> >> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 2:52 AM >>> >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>> >> >>> >> >>> >>> My wife's family (all of Croatian descent) used to have a picnic at >>> >>> a >>> >>> summer home in Silver Lake, WI (we were all from Chicago) and >>> >>> roasted >> a >>> >>> whole lamb over charcoal in a 55 gallon drum split lengthwise with a >>> >>> home-made turning mechanism >>> >>> doing all the heavy work. I was never a big fan of lamb but I made >>> >>> an >>> >>> exception for that - Most of those folks are gone now but the >>> >>> memories >>> >>> remain including the best lamb I have ever eaten. >>> >>> >>> >>> Al in Music City >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >>> From: "Robert Jerin" >>> >>> To: >>> >>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 12:44 PM >>> >>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>> Nick, >>> >>>> >>> >>>> I must admit that I roasted just a leg and used my Weber with nice >> hot >>> >>>> coals on the side. Pleeeze don't tell any real Croatians about my >>> >>>> "unorthodox" method of using a Weber! Everyone here loves roast >>> >>>> lamb >>> >>>> except the wife. So it was enough for the gang. But IMHO the secret >>> >>>> is selecting the right piece, trimming much of the fact and then >>> >>>> coating the lamb with olive oil, salt (I use Croatian Podravka >> Vegeta), >>> >>>> pepper, fresh chopped garlic and rosemary and let it marinate in >>> >>>> the >>> >>>> fridge for a day or more... then setting the piece out about 2 >>> >>>> hours >>> >>>> before placing on the grill. Oh the other trick is slow roasting, >>> >>>> no >>> >>>> flame, just hot coals and not too close to the coals....mmmm.... >>> >>>> >>> >>>> It has been several years since our Junior tammie group here in >>> >>>> Cleveland had a picnic... at that time we would take most of Sat >>> >>>> afternoon to set up 8 whole lambs and 9 pigs on spits, then season >> them >>> >>>> and put them in the cooler for Sun am.. after that we would feast >>> >>>> on >>> >>>> gulas that I would make along with salad, some wine and slivovitz >>> >>>> and >>> >>>> one of the father's, who has since passed away would play his >> harmonika >>> >>>> (accordian) and all the guys would dance to his Bosanac songs! What >> a >>> >>>> sight! Then at 4 AM on Sunday I would meet my friend Mato Vrbic at >> the >>> >>>> picnic center to prepare the fire... then a little coffee with >>> >>>> slivovitz of course... and about 6AM we would consider the coals >>> >>>> and >>> >>>> the brick lined floor hot enough to place the first few pieces on >>> >>>> the >>> >>>> spit... then about 11:30 ish the first ones would come off to be >>> >>>> cut >>> >>>> and served.... that Sunday would finish up at about 10-11 PM making >>> >>>> sure the center was left in better condition than we found it! Lots >>> >>>> of work but I miss those ! >>> >>>> days... >>> >>>> as they brought back memories of my Grandparent's PLASAJ (Mirko and >>> >>>> Mary) and my cousin's BAKALE (Ivan and Johanna)farms in PA and the >>> >>>> picnics we would have there. But they are all gone now so we try to >>> >>>> carry on some semblance of those traditions..... >>> >>>> >>> >>>> http://www.podravka.com/en/products/index.php?if=new_products.php >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Here is a photo that may bring back some memories >>> >>>> >>> >>>> http://www.members.shaw.ca/rogergou/bast4.jpeg >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Robert >>> >>>> >>> >>>> nharamija wrote: >>> >>>> Robert; Let us see your grille and how you set it up. >>> >>>> Nick >>> >>>> >>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >>>> From: "Robert Jerin" >>> >>>> To: >>> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 11:50 AM >>> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> My wife did those things! I was busy roasting.... lamb! >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Jerome Buza wrote: >>> >>>> That's right!!! We were all busy baking and cooking and dying eggs >> and >>> >>>> cleaning the house for company. >>> >>>> Margaret >>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >>>> From: "dave mothkovich" >>> >>>> To: >>> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 2:32 AM >>> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>>> Everybody got busy, and then the holiday came, it happens. >>> >>>>> Christmas >>> >>>>> was >>> >>>>> different, everyone had time to chat it up. >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> Dave >>> >>>>> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 17:45:41 +0800 "John Stefanac" >>> >>>>> writes: >>> >>>>>> Is it just quiet on this list or have I somehow been kicked off >>> >>>>>> it >>> >>>>>> again >>> >>>>>> >>> >>>>>> >>> >>>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> -- >>> >>>>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>> >>>>> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>> >>>>> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: >>> >>>>> 3/27/2005 >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >>> >>>> about a >>> >>>> wonderful tour of Croatia! >>> >>>> >>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >>> >>>> about a wonderful tour of Croatia! >>> >>>> >>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >> >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > -- >>> > No virus found in this incoming message. >>> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>> > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 >>> > >>> > >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out about >> a wonderful tour of Croatia! >> >> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >> >> >> >> -- >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 >> >> > > > > Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out about > a wonderful tour of Croatia! > > http://www.kollander-travel.com/ > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 > >

Amy There was a Glad family in Steelton PA in the 40-50's. The father's name was Adam. He had a son and three daughters. I used to deliver their paper. Tony On Mar 31, 2005, at 3:46 PM, [email protected] wrote: > Hello Amy, > Jim GLAD is working on GLAD from IL, originally Jablan. Jablan > (population > 235) is near Vrbovsko and currently there are 5 GLAD tel listed there. > In > Vrbovsko (population 1963) there are 3 GLAD. They are all in Senjsko > part of > Vrbovsko. Senjsko was a village before. > http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/message/an/surnames.glad/19.1.2.1.1 > > GLAD are recorded in Vrbovsko since 1763 (Stephanus= Stephan) and in > Jablan > since 1756.(Matthaeus= Mathias). > > Tatjana >

Hello Amy, Jim GLAD is working on GLAD from IL, originally Jablan. Jablan (population 235) is near Vrbovsko and currently there are 5 GLAD tel listed there. In Vrbovsko (population 1963) there are 3 GLAD. They are all in Senjsko part of Vrbovsko. Senjsko was a village before. http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/message/an/surnames.glad/19.1.2.1.1 GLAD are recorded in Vrbovsko since 1763 (Stephanus= Stephan) and in Jablan since 1756.(Matthaeus= Mathias). Tatjana

Don, Talk about people knowing how to live! When we lived in "The Cities" 1980-1984 (Minnesotan for The Twin Cities aka Minneapolis St Paul) we enjoyed driving or taking the train to Dulut (no h !) there was a small "Yugoslav" restaurant in Dulut, can not recall the name. Just wondered if it is still there. I was amazed at the connection that Dulut and Cleveland, Cleveland Cliffs and other ore shipping etc.. Robert Donald Marinkovich <[email protected]> wrote: I ran, TO THE STORE, Paul Bizals finer meats and klobase, in Chisholm of course. The sarma was always covered with kraut in our house. I remember a woman asking for fifteen cents soup bone. I was told that Coldagelli bought Postudensheks recepe, he could even have been related. I read somewhere that there is no such thing as a melting pot. We have it here. A friend told me that his kids are three forths bohunk and they have a Finnlander name. His mother and his wife were both Slovenian and his father was Finn, he was the model for the iron man statue, and he was the president of our local union when I worked there. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Reuter, Patty" To: Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 10:42 AM Subject: RE: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > Don, > > What is the name of the store that you ran? Was it in Chisholm? My > granparents always got their sausage from Coldageliis. We would have it > every time we came up from the cities. We have a Sarma recipie from the > Perpich's that says we should cover the sarma in sour kraut and then bake > it. Has anyone tried that? > > -----Original Message----- > From: Donald Marinkovich [mailto:[email protected]] > Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 10:25 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > > > In the days, before home refridgerators, it was my job to run to the > store. > When Ma made sarmas that ment 1/3 gd beef, 1/3 gd pork, 1/3 gd ham. > Kisele > glavice came from the barrel in the basement. Eventually I made my own > sour > kraut. and I would include a few heads for sarmas but for my use a crock > was big enough. Once I tasted sarmas wraped in leaves from a frozen head > I > decided that souring heads was no longer worth the bother. I have a son > living in Denver. When he comes to the iron range he has to get enough > blood sausage (krvavice)for him and a buddy with an Italian last name but > had a Slovenian mother. There are still a few places where they still > have > good Slovenian Polish sausage. On the range every thing geets mixed up. > One > of the better places to get Polish sausage was at Coldagelilis in Eveleth. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jerome Buza" > To: > Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 9:58 AM > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > > >> Thanks Robert, I will read that page and enjoy it, I am sure. My family >> always made the Sarma with sauerkraut, no tomatoes, and that is the way I >> love it. Of course, there was an Eimprem, too. While living in Turkey, >> I >> ate their Sarma and it was different,but we grew to love it. Mom just >> boiled the leaves in vinegar water and when I was young, the produce man >> at the local A & P store gave my mom the outer leaves. Now, they don't >> have them available. So, growing the cabbages in our garden at our >> mountain cabin in AZ has become our way of having the larger leaves of >> cabbage to use. >> Margaret >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Robert Jerin" >> To: >> Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 5:42 AM >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >> >> >>> Ahh.... just had some REAL Croatian Sarma at Marie's Restaurant on St >>> Clair in Cleveland. The owners are the family Sabalic from Ljubuski, >>> Hercegovina. REAL sarma must always be made using "soured leaves", >>> which >>> we can purchase at Zagreb Meats on St Clair. If you can not purchase >>> "soured cabbage" then par boiling the leaves in vinegar water may work. >>> For many years I did not like sarma, then I discovered that many (most >>> immigrants I know here in Cleveland) do not add tomatoes, and that is >>> what I did not like! Most here will make a rue and then add paprika and >>> a bit of water to make a delicous sauce to pour over the sarma and >>> mashed >>> potatoes or dumplings. >>> >>> My experience with the (too) many Croatian functions that I attend is >>> that if there are many immigrants the food is authentic and if the >>> majority are American born the food has some resemblance to the >>> authentic >>> stuff but does not come close. >>> >>> Here is a recipe that I have found to my taste from the Embassy web >>> page. >>> >>> http://www.croatiaemb.org/basic_facts/christmas97.htm >>> >>> Robert >>> >>> Karen Heiser wrote: >>> Dear List - I think the "western expansion" did in a lot of our families >>> and >>> traditions. Traveling 30 miles for the family reunion is a lot easier >>> and >>> cheaper than travelling 2500 miles. And then there is the marriage >>> thing...not many of us were able to marry within our ethnicity, so then >>> you >>> have another whole set of traditions to work with. >>> But if you don't stop talking about lamb and sarma, the drooling is >>> going >>> to >>> ruin my keyboard! >>> Karen Heiser >>> Weed, Siskiyou, CA >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Jerome Buza" >>> To: >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 9:58 PM >>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>> >>> >>>> Another reason for the demise of many of the family customs is the way >>>> we >>>> travel around and move far away. We try to keep up our family customs >>> even >>>> though we are in AZ and most of the family is in MI or IL. However, >>>> many >>> of >>>> my aunts and uncles married people that were not that interested and >>>> now >>> the >>>> kids aren't either. My generation knows that my mom cooked like Grandma >>> and >>>> that I cook like mom and are asking me for recipes. However, many >>>> didn't >>>> have the traditions followed all their lives like I did with my mother >>>> and >>>> my husband did with his part of the Polish family. Our own daughter has >>>> been living in TX for 20 of her 21 years of married life and doesn't >>> follow >>>> our traditions. Her kids are fussy and wouldn't eat the food anyway. >>>> Margaret >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "al toennies" >>>> To: >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 4:25 PM >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>> >>>> >>>> > Good question Joy! I think a bunch of siblings (like these folks >>>> > were) >>>> > can keep it together naturally but when they start to fade away and >>>> > you >>>> > are left with cousins and a collection of spouses with family ties of >>>> > their own, you need a catalytic agent of some sort - maybe a person >>>> > or >>>> > a >>>> > group of people that pulls or pushes the different family members >>>> > together. They have to be either loved or feared or so much of a pain >>> it >>>> > the butt that everybody gives in to avoid further hassles. I watched >>>> > my >>>> > mother's Swedish family gatherings wither away after my Grandmother >>> died - >>>> > she was a catalyst of a sort and no one replaced her. >>>> > >>>> > Al in Music City >>>> > ----- Original Message ----- >>>> > >>>> > From: "Joy Durrett" >>>> > To: >>>> > Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 8:57 AM >>>> > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>> > >>>> > >>>> >> Why didn't the next generation keep it going? Sounds like a great >>>> >> way >>> to >>>> >> keep the family together. >>>> >> >>>> >> Joy >>>> >> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> >> From: "al toennies" >>>> >> To: >>>> >> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 2:52 AM >>>> >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >>> My wife's family (all of Croatian descent) used to have a picnic at >>>> >>> a >>>> >>> summer home in Silver Lake, WI (we were all from Chicago) and >>>> >>> roasted >>> a >>>> >>> whole lamb over charcoal in a 55 gallon drum split lengthwise with >>>> >>> a >>>> >>> home-made turning mechanism >>>> >>> doing all the heavy work. I was never a big fan of lamb but I made >>>> >>> an >>>> >>> exception for that - Most of those folks are gone now but the >>>> >>> memories >>>> >>> remain including the best lamb I have ever eaten. >>>> >>> >>>> >>> Al in Music City >>>> >>> >>>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> >>> From: "Robert Jerin" >>>> >>> To: >>>> >>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 12:44 PM >>>> >>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>>> Nick, >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I must admit that I roasted just a leg and used my Weber with nice >>> hot >>>> >>>> coals on the side. Pleeeze don't tell any real Croatians about my >>>> >>>> "unorthodox" method of using a Weber! Everyone here loves roast >>>> >>>> lamb >>>> >>>> except the wife. So it was enough for the gang. But IMHO the >>>> >>>> secret >>>> >>>> is selecting the right piece, trimming much of the fact and then >>>> >>>> coating the lamb with olive oil, salt (I use Croatian Podravka >>> Vegeta), >>>> >>>> pepper, fresh chopped garlic and rosemary and let it marinate in >>>> >>>> the >>>> >>>> fridge for a day or more... then setting the piece out about 2 >>>> >>>> hours >>>> >>>> before placing on the grill. Oh the other trick is slow roasting, >>>> >>>> no >>>> >>>> flame, just hot coals and not too close to the coals....mmmm.... >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> It has been several years since our Junior tammie group here in >>>> >>>> Cleveland had a picnic... at that time we would take most of Sat >>>> >>>> afternoon to set up 8 whole lambs and 9 pigs on spits, then season >>> them >>>> >>>> and put them in the cooler for Sun am.. after that we would feast >>>> >>>> on >>>> >>>> gulas that I would make along with salad, some wine and slivovitz >>>> >>>> and >>>> >>>> one of the father's, who has since passed away would play his >>> harmonika >>>> >>>> (accordian) and all the guys would dance to his Bosanac songs! >>>> >>>> What >>> a >>>> >>>> sight! Then at 4 AM on Sunday I would meet my friend Mato Vrbic at >>> the >>>> >>>> picnic center to prepare the fire... then a little coffee with >>>> >>>> slivovitz of course... and about 6AM we would consider the coals >>>> >>>> and >>>> >>>> the brick lined floor hot enough to place the first few pieces on >>>> >>>> the >>>> >>>> spit... then about 11:30 ish the first ones would come off to be >>>> >>>> cut >>>> >>>> and served.... that Sunday would finish up at about 10-11 PM >>>> >>>> making >>>> >>>> sure the center was left in better condition than we found it! >>>> >>>> Lots >>>> >>>> of work but I miss those ! >>>> >>>> days... >>>> >>>> as they brought back memories of my Grandparent's PLASAJ (Mirko >>>> >>>> and >>>> >>>> Mary) and my cousin's BAKALE (Ivan and Johanna)farms in PA and the >>>> >>>> picnics we would have there. But they are all gone now so we try >>>> >>>> to >>>> >>>> carry on some semblance of those traditions..... >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.podravka.com/en/products/index.php?if=new_products.php >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Here is a photo that may bring back some memories >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.members.shaw.ca/rogergou/bast4.jpeg >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Robert >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> nharamija wrote: >>>> >>>> Robert; Let us see your grille and how you set it up. >>>> >>>> Nick >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> >>>> From: "Robert Jerin" >>>> >>>> To: >>>> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 11:50 AM >>>> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> My wife did those things! I was busy roasting.... lamb! >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Jerome Buza wrote: >>>> >>>> That's right!!! We were all busy baking and cooking and dying eggs >>> and >>>> >>>> cleaning the house for company. >>>> >>>> Margaret >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> >>>> From: "dave mothkovich" >>>> >>>> To: >>>> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 2:32 AM >>>> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> Everybody got busy, and then the holiday came, it happens. >>>> >>>>> Christmas >>>> >>>>> was >>>> >>>>> different, everyone had time to chat it up. >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> Dave >>>> >>>>> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 17:45:41 +0800 "John Stefanac" >>>> >>>>> writes: >>>> >>>>>> Is it just quiet on this list or have I somehow been kicked off >>>> >>>>>> it >>>> >>>>>> again >>>> >>>>>> >>>> >>>>>> >>>> >>>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> -- >>>> >>>>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>>> >>>>> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>>> >>>>> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: >>>> >>>>> 3/27/2005 >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >>>> >>>> about a >>>> >>>> wonderful tour of Croatia! >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >>>> >>>> about a wonderful tour of Croatia! >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>>> >> >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > -- >>>> > No virus found in this incoming message. >>>> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>>> > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 >>>> > >>>> > >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >>> about >>> a wonderful tour of Croatia! >>> >>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 >>> >>> >> >> > > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs SkyScan > service. For more information on a proactive anti-virus service working > around the clock, around the globe, visit www.messagelabs.com. > ________________________________________________________________________ > > ________________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs SkyScan > service. For more information on a proactive anti-virus service working > around the clock, around the globe, visit www.messagelabs.com. > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out about a wonderful tour of Croatia! http://www.kollander-travel.com/

Hi Margaret, Sounds good! What is Eimprem? Robert Jerome Buza <[email protected]> wrote: Thanks Robert, I will read that page and enjoy it, I am sure. My family always made the Sarma with sauerkraut, no tomatoes, and that is the way I love it. Of course, there was an Eimprem, too. While living in Turkey, I ate their Sarma and it was different,but we grew to love it. Mom just boiled the leaves in vinegar water and when I was young, the produce man at the local A & P store gave my mom the outer leaves. Now, they don't have them available. So, growing the cabbages in our garden at our mountain cabin in AZ has become our way of having the larger leaves of cabbage to use. Margaret ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Jerin" To: Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 5:42 AM Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > Ahh.... just had some REAL Croatian Sarma at Marie's Restaurant on St > Clair in Cleveland. The owners are the family Sabalic from Ljubuski, > Hercegovina. REAL sarma must always be made using "soured leaves", which > we can purchase at Zagreb Meats on St Clair. If you can not purchase > "soured cabbage" then par boiling the leaves in vinegar water may work. > For many years I did not like sarma, then I discovered that many (most > immigrants I know here in Cleveland) do not add tomatoes, and that is what > I did not like! Most here will make a rue and then add paprika and a bit > of water to make a delicous sauce to pour over the sarma and mashed > potatoes or dumplings. > > My experience with the (too) many Croatian functions that I attend is that > if there are many immigrants the food is authentic and if the majority are > American born the food has some resemblance to the authentic stuff but > does not come close. > > Here is a recipe that I have found to my taste from the Embassy web page. > > http://www.croatiaemb.org/basic_facts/christmas97.htm > > Robert > > Karen Heiser wrote: > Dear List - I think the "western expansion" did in a lot of our families > and > traditions. Traveling 30 miles for the family reunion is a lot easier and > cheaper than travelling 2500 miles. And then there is the marriage > thing...not many of us were able to marry within our ethnicity, so then > you > have another whole set of traditions to work with. > But if you don't stop talking about lamb and sarma, the drooling is going > to > ruin my keyboard! > Karen Heiser > Weed, Siskiyou, CA > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jerome Buza" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 9:58 PM > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > > >> Another reason for the demise of many of the family customs is the way we >> travel around and move far away. We try to keep up our family customs > even >> though we are in AZ and most of the family is in MI or IL. However, many > of >> my aunts and uncles married people that were not that interested and now > the >> kids aren't either. My generation knows that my mom cooked like Grandma > and >> that I cook like mom and are asking me for recipes. However, many didn't >> have the traditions followed all their lives like I did with my mother >> and >> my husband did with his part of the Polish family. Our own daughter has >> been living in TX for 20 of her 21 years of married life and doesn't > follow >> our traditions. Her kids are fussy and wouldn't eat the food anyway. >> Margaret >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "al toennies" >> To: >> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 4:25 PM >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >> >> >> > Good question Joy! I think a bunch of siblings (like these folks were) >> > can keep it together naturally but when they start to fade away and you >> > are left with cousins and a collection of spouses with family ties of >> > their own, you need a catalytic agent of some sort - maybe a person or >> > a >> > group of people that pulls or pushes the different family members >> > together. They have to be either loved or feared or so much of a pain > it >> > the butt that everybody gives in to avoid further hassles. I watched my >> > mother's Swedish family gatherings wither away after my Grandmother > died - >> > she was a catalyst of a sort and no one replaced her. >> > >> > Al in Music City >> > ----- Original Message ----- >> > >> > From: "Joy Durrett" >> > To: >> > Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 8:57 AM >> > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >> > >> > >> >> Why didn't the next generation keep it going? Sounds like a great way > to >> >> keep the family together. >> >> >> >> Joy >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> >> From: "al toennies" >> >> To: >> >> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 2:52 AM >> >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >> >> >> >> >> >>> My wife's family (all of Croatian descent) used to have a picnic at a >> >>> summer home in Silver Lake, WI (we were all from Chicago) and roasted > a >> >>> whole lamb over charcoal in a 55 gallon drum split lengthwise with a >> >>> home-made turning mechanism >> >>> doing all the heavy work. I was never a big fan of lamb but I made an >> >>> exception for that - Most of those folks are gone now but the >> >>> memories >> >>> remain including the best lamb I have ever eaten. >> >>> >> >>> Al in Music City >> >>> >> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >> >>> From: "Robert Jerin" >> >>> To: >> >>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 12:44 PM >> >>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >> >>> >> >>> >> >>>> Nick, >> >>>> >> >>>> I must admit that I roasted just a leg and used my Weber with nice > hot >> >>>> coals on the side. Pleeeze don't tell any real Croatians about my >> >>>> "unorthodox" method of using a Weber! Everyone here loves roast lamb >> >>>> except the wife. So it was enough for the gang. But IMHO the secret >> >>>> is selecting the right piece, trimming much of the fact and then >> >>>> coating the lamb with olive oil, salt (I use Croatian Podravka > Vegeta), >> >>>> pepper, fresh chopped garlic and rosemary and let it marinate in the >> >>>> fridge for a day or more... then setting the piece out about 2 hours >> >>>> before placing on the grill. Oh the other trick is slow roasting, no >> >>>> flame, just hot coals and not too close to the coals....mmmm.... >> >>>> >> >>>> It has been several years since our Junior tammie group here in >> >>>> Cleveland had a picnic... at that time we would take most of Sat >> >>>> afternoon to set up 8 whole lambs and 9 pigs on spits, then season > them >> >>>> and put them in the cooler for Sun am.. after that we would feast on >> >>>> gulas that I would make along with salad, some wine and slivovitz >> >>>> and >> >>>> one of the father's, who has since passed away would play his > harmonika >> >>>> (accordian) and all the guys would dance to his Bosanac songs! What > a >> >>>> sight! Then at 4 AM on Sunday I would meet my friend Mato Vrbic at > the >> >>>> picnic center to prepare the fire... then a little coffee with >> >>>> slivovitz of course... and about 6AM we would consider the coals and >> >>>> the brick lined floor hot enough to place the first few pieces on >> >>>> the >> >>>> spit... then about 11:30 ish the first ones would come off to be cut >> >>>> and served.... that Sunday would finish up at about 10-11 PM making >> >>>> sure the center was left in better condition than we found it! Lots >> >>>> of work but I miss those ! >> >>>> days... >> >>>> as they brought back memories of my Grandparent's PLASAJ (Mirko and >> >>>> Mary) and my cousin's BAKALE (Ivan and Johanna)farms in PA and the >> >>>> picnics we would have there. But they are all gone now so we try to >> >>>> carry on some semblance of those traditions..... >> >>>> >> >>>> http://www.podravka.com/en/products/index.php?if=new_products.php >> >>>> >> >>>> Here is a photo that may bring back some memories >> >>>> >> >>>> http://www.members.shaw.ca/rogergou/bast4.jpeg >> >>>> >> >>>> Robert >> >>>> >> >>>> nharamija wrote: >> >>>> Robert; Let us see your grille and how you set it up. >> >>>> Nick >> >>>> >> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >> >>>> From: "Robert Jerin" >> >>>> To: >> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 11:50 AM >> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> My wife did those things! I was busy roasting.... lamb! >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> Jerome Buza wrote: >> >>>> That's right!!! We were all busy baking and cooking and dying eggs > and >> >>>> cleaning the house for company. >> >>>> Margaret >> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >> >>>> From: "dave mothkovich" >> >>>> To: >> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 2:32 AM >> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>>> Everybody got busy, and then the holiday came, it happens. >> >>>>> Christmas >> >>>>> was >> >>>>> different, everyone had time to chat it up. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Dave >> >>>>> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 17:45:41 +0800 "John Stefanac" >> >>>>> writes: >> >>>>>> Is it just quiet on this list or have I somehow been kicked off it >> >>>>>> again >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> -- >> >>>>> No virus found in this incoming message. >> >>>>> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >> >>>>> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: >> >>>>> 3/27/2005 >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >> >>>> about a >> >>>> wonderful tour of Croatia! >> >>>> >> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >> >>>> about a wonderful tour of Croatia! >> >>>> >> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >> >>>> >> >>> >> >> >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > No virus found in this incoming message. >> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >> > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 >> > >> > >> >> > > > > > Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out about > a wonderful tour of Croatia! > > http://www.kollander-travel.com/ > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 > > Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out about a wonderful tour of Croatia! http://www.kollander-travel.com/

Hello Anettka I am quite aware that the priest may be busy with more than one parish as I have communcated with him in the past and my parents are familiar with the way things are done in that part of Croatia but it would be nice of the priest to write back either way to say what he can and can not do. I have received emails from the priest with information on direct line from my father's side and Tom on his visit to Croatia has visited him in the past on my behalf and on all occasions I have sent him money for his troubles. I am one of the unfortunate ones who would go to the LDS and hire films but the villages my parents and their parents came from are not listed or recorded by the LDS. regards Mary ____________________________________ -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Thursday, 31 March 2005 12:31 PM To: [email protected] Subject: [CROATIA-L] Re: CROATIA-D Digest V05 #81 In a message dated 3/30/2005 5:57:10 PM Pacific Standard Time, Mary writes: Have contacted the priest a number of times to see if I can get both grandmother's lines sent but he at this stage has not written back, Mary, You have to remember a couple things about the priest. First, they are in short supply in any area they reside and often have to cover more than one parishes, which means that they are busy doing the work they promised to God. Secondly, anything they do related to genealogy is if and when they have time - genealogy is not their primary interest; you can't expect them to provide family trees for you. If you wrote and asked about a specific person's records, what ever it is, they may answer, but asking for a line might is probably more than they are willing to take on.... It is always more incentive if there is a person there who can encourage them on or get the information once the priest provides a book, or will give them a little for the church or take them to dinner to encourage cooperation in the venture; I wouldn't expect much from them, not only in Croatia, or, based on past experience in other countries, more than a record at at time. Anettka ________________________________________________________________ This email and any attachments are confidential and/or contain confidential information. If you are not the intended recipient of this email, any use, interference with, disclosure or copying of this material is unauthorised and prohibited. If you have received this email in error please immediately advise the sender by return email and delete this message from your system. WALTER Construction Group (Administrators appointed) ________________________________________________________________

I ran, TO THE STORE, Paul Bizals finer meats and klobase, in Chisholm of course. The sarma was always covered with kraut in our house. I remember a woman asking for fifteen cents soup bone. I was told that Coldagelli bought Postudensheks recepe, he could even have been related. I read somewhere that there is no such thing as a melting pot. We have it here. A friend told me that his kids are three forths bohunk and they have a Finnlander name. His mother and his wife were both Slovenian and his father was Finn, he was the model for the iron man statue, and he was the president of our local union when I worked there. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Reuter, Patty" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 10:42 AM Subject: RE: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > Don, > > What is the name of the store that you ran? Was it in Chisholm? My > granparents always got their sausage from Coldageliis. We would have it > every time we came up from the cities. We have a Sarma recipie from the > Perpich's that says we should cover the sarma in sour kraut and then bake > it. Has anyone tried that? > > -----Original Message----- > From: Donald Marinkovich [mailto:[email protected]] > Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 10:25 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > > > In the days, before home refridgerators, it was my job to run to the > store. > When Ma made sarmas that ment 1/3 gd beef, 1/3 gd pork, 1/3 gd ham. > Kisele > glavice came from the barrel in the basement. Eventually I made my own > sour > kraut. and I would include a few heads for sarmas but for my use a crock > was big enough. Once I tasted sarmas wraped in leaves from a frozen head > I > decided that souring heads was no longer worth the bother. I have a son > living in Denver. When he comes to the iron range he has to get enough > blood sausage (krvavice)for him and a buddy with an Italian last name but > had a Slovenian mother. There are still a few places where they still > have > good Slovenian Polish sausage. On the range every thing geets mixed up. > One > of the better places to get Polish sausage was at Coldagelilis in Eveleth. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jerome Buza" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 9:58 AM > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > > >> Thanks Robert, I will read that page and enjoy it, I am sure. My family >> always made the Sarma with sauerkraut, no tomatoes, and that is the way I >> love it. Of course, there was an Eimprem, too. While living in Turkey, >> I >> ate their Sarma and it was different,but we grew to love it. Mom just >> boiled the leaves in vinegar water and when I was young, the produce man >> at the local A & P store gave my mom the outer leaves. Now, they don't >> have them available. So, growing the cabbages in our garden at our >> mountain cabin in AZ has become our way of having the larger leaves of >> cabbage to use. >> Margaret >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Robert Jerin" <[email protected]> >> To: <[email protected]> >> Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 5:42 AM >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >> >> >>> Ahh.... just had some REAL Croatian Sarma at Marie's Restaurant on St >>> Clair in Cleveland. The owners are the family Sabalic from Ljubuski, >>> Hercegovina. REAL sarma must always be made using "soured leaves", >>> which >>> we can purchase at Zagreb Meats on St Clair. If you can not purchase >>> "soured cabbage" then par boiling the leaves in vinegar water may work. >>> For many years I did not like sarma, then I discovered that many (most >>> immigrants I know here in Cleveland) do not add tomatoes, and that is >>> what I did not like! Most here will make a rue and then add paprika and >>> a bit of water to make a delicous sauce to pour over the sarma and >>> mashed >>> potatoes or dumplings. >>> >>> My experience with the (too) many Croatian functions that I attend is >>> that if there are many immigrants the food is authentic and if the >>> majority are American born the food has some resemblance to the >>> authentic >>> stuff but does not come close. >>> >>> Here is a recipe that I have found to my taste from the Embassy web >>> page. >>> >>> http://www.croatiaemb.org/basic_facts/christmas97.htm >>> >>> Robert >>> >>> Karen Heiser <[email protected]> wrote: >>> Dear List - I think the "western expansion" did in a lot of our families >>> and >>> traditions. Traveling 30 miles for the family reunion is a lot easier >>> and >>> cheaper than travelling 2500 miles. And then there is the marriage >>> thing...not many of us were able to marry within our ethnicity, so then >>> you >>> have another whole set of traditions to work with. >>> But if you don't stop talking about lamb and sarma, the drooling is >>> going >>> to >>> ruin my keyboard! >>> Karen Heiser >>> Weed, Siskiyou, CA >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Jerome Buza" >>> To: >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 9:58 PM >>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>> >>> >>>> Another reason for the demise of many of the family customs is the way >>>> we >>>> travel around and move far away. We try to keep up our family customs >>> even >>>> though we are in AZ and most of the family is in MI or IL. However, >>>> many >>> of >>>> my aunts and uncles married people that were not that interested and >>>> now >>> the >>>> kids aren't either. My generation knows that my mom cooked like Grandma >>> and >>>> that I cook like mom and are asking me for recipes. However, many >>>> didn't >>>> have the traditions followed all their lives like I did with my mother >>>> and >>>> my husband did with his part of the Polish family. Our own daughter has >>>> been living in TX for 20 of her 21 years of married life and doesn't >>> follow >>>> our traditions. Her kids are fussy and wouldn't eat the food anyway. >>>> Margaret >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "al toennies" >>>> To: >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 4:25 PM >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>> >>>> >>>> > Good question Joy! I think a bunch of siblings (like these folks >>>> > were) >>>> > can keep it together naturally but when they start to fade away and >>>> > you >>>> > are left with cousins and a collection of spouses with family ties of >>>> > their own, you need a catalytic agent of some sort - maybe a person >>>> > or >>>> > a >>>> > group of people that pulls or pushes the different family members >>>> > together. They have to be either loved or feared or so much of a pain >>> it >>>> > the butt that everybody gives in to avoid further hassles. I watched >>>> > my >>>> > mother's Swedish family gatherings wither away after my Grandmother >>> died - >>>> > she was a catalyst of a sort and no one replaced her. >>>> > >>>> > Al in Music City >>>> > ----- Original Message ----- >>>> > >>>> > From: "Joy Durrett" >>>> > To: >>>> > Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 8:57 AM >>>> > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>> > >>>> > >>>> >> Why didn't the next generation keep it going? Sounds like a great >>>> >> way >>> to >>>> >> keep the family together. >>>> >> >>>> >> Joy >>>> >> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> >> From: "al toennies" >>>> >> To: >>>> >> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 2:52 AM >>>> >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >>> My wife's family (all of Croatian descent) used to have a picnic at >>>> >>> a >>>> >>> summer home in Silver Lake, WI (we were all from Chicago) and >>>> >>> roasted >>> a >>>> >>> whole lamb over charcoal in a 55 gallon drum split lengthwise with >>>> >>> a >>>> >>> home-made turning mechanism >>>> >>> doing all the heavy work. I was never a big fan of lamb but I made >>>> >>> an >>>> >>> exception for that - Most of those folks are gone now but the >>>> >>> memories >>>> >>> remain including the best lamb I have ever eaten. >>>> >>> >>>> >>> Al in Music City >>>> >>> >>>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> >>> From: "Robert Jerin" >>>> >>> To: >>>> >>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 12:44 PM >>>> >>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>>> Nick, >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I must admit that I roasted just a leg and used my Weber with nice >>> hot >>>> >>>> coals on the side. Pleeeze don't tell any real Croatians about my >>>> >>>> "unorthodox" method of using a Weber! Everyone here loves roast >>>> >>>> lamb >>>> >>>> except the wife. So it was enough for the gang. But IMHO the >>>> >>>> secret >>>> >>>> is selecting the right piece, trimming much of the fact and then >>>> >>>> coating the lamb with olive oil, salt (I use Croatian Podravka >>> Vegeta), >>>> >>>> pepper, fresh chopped garlic and rosemary and let it marinate in >>>> >>>> the >>>> >>>> fridge for a day or more... then setting the piece out about 2 >>>> >>>> hours >>>> >>>> before placing on the grill. Oh the other trick is slow roasting, >>>> >>>> no >>>> >>>> flame, just hot coals and not too close to the coals....mmmm.... >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> It has been several years since our Junior tammie group here in >>>> >>>> Cleveland had a picnic... at that time we would take most of Sat >>>> >>>> afternoon to set up 8 whole lambs and 9 pigs on spits, then season >>> them >>>> >>>> and put them in the cooler for Sun am.. after that we would feast >>>> >>>> on >>>> >>>> gulas that I would make along with salad, some wine and slivovitz >>>> >>>> and >>>> >>>> one of the father's, who has since passed away would play his >>> harmonika >>>> >>>> (accordian) and all the guys would dance to his Bosanac songs! >>>> >>>> What >>> a >>>> >>>> sight! Then at 4 AM on Sunday I would meet my friend Mato Vrbic at >>> the >>>> >>>> picnic center to prepare the fire... then a little coffee with >>>> >>>> slivovitz of course... and about 6AM we would consider the coals >>>> >>>> and >>>> >>>> the brick lined floor hot enough to place the first few pieces on >>>> >>>> the >>>> >>>> spit... then about 11:30 ish the first ones would come off to be >>>> >>>> cut >>>> >>>> and served.... that Sunday would finish up at about 10-11 PM >>>> >>>> making >>>> >>>> sure the center was left in better condition than we found it! >>>> >>>> Lots >>>> >>>> of work but I miss those ! >>>> >>>> days... >>>> >>>> as they brought back memories of my Grandparent's PLASAJ (Mirko >>>> >>>> and >>>> >>>> Mary) and my cousin's BAKALE (Ivan and Johanna)farms in PA and the >>>> >>>> picnics we would have there. But they are all gone now so we try >>>> >>>> to >>>> >>>> carry on some semblance of those traditions..... >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.podravka.com/en/products/index.php?if=new_products.php >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Here is a photo that may bring back some memories >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.members.shaw.ca/rogergou/bast4.jpeg >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Robert >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> nharamija wrote: >>>> >>>> Robert; Let us see your grille and how you set it up. >>>> >>>> Nick >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> >>>> From: "Robert Jerin" >>>> >>>> To: >>>> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 11:50 AM >>>> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> My wife did those things! I was busy roasting.... lamb! >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Jerome Buza wrote: >>>> >>>> That's right!!! We were all busy baking and cooking and dying eggs >>> and >>>> >>>> cleaning the house for company. >>>> >>>> Margaret >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> >>>> From: "dave mothkovich" >>>> >>>> To: >>>> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 2:32 AM >>>> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> Everybody got busy, and then the holiday came, it happens. >>>> >>>>> Christmas >>>> >>>>> was >>>> >>>>> different, everyone had time to chat it up. >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> Dave >>>> >>>>> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 17:45:41 +0800 "John Stefanac" >>>> >>>>> writes: >>>> >>>>>> Is it just quiet on this list or have I somehow been kicked off >>>> >>>>>> it >>>> >>>>>> again >>>> >>>>>> >>>> >>>>>> >>>> >>>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> -- >>>> >>>>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>>> >>>>> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>>> >>>>> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: >>>> >>>>> 3/27/2005 >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >>>> >>>> about a >>>> >>>> wonderful tour of Croatia! >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >>>> >>>> about a wonderful tour of Croatia! >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>>> >> >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > -- >>>> > No virus found in this incoming message. >>>> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>>> > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 >>>> > >>>> > >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >>> about >>> a wonderful tour of Croatia! >>> >>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 >>> >>> >> >> > > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs SkyScan > service. For more information on a proactive anti-virus service working > around the clock, around the globe, visit www.messagelabs.com. > ________________________________________________________________________ > > ________________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs SkyScan > service. For more information on a proactive anti-virus service working > around the clock, around the globe, visit www.messagelabs.com. > ________________________________________________________________________ > >

Yes, we cover the sarma in sauerkraut at our house. First we make a roux (Eimpren) and stir some liquid and sauerkraut into that after it is nice and brown, then a little more kraut, then the sarma, then more kraut. We always rince the kraut first. My mom then put some water over the top of all this to just about the top. I use chicken broth or white wine and water or a little of each. If she was cooking for a large gathering, she did it in a covered roaster in the oven. If it was just for the five of us, she did it on top of the stove on a low flame. This is my favorite way to eat the sarma with a good crusty bread and a glass of wine. Margaret ----- Original Message ----- From: "Reuter, Patty" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 9:42 AM Subject: RE: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > Don, > > What is the name of the store that you ran? Was it in Chisholm? My > granparents always got their sausage from Coldageliis. We would have it > every time we came up from the cities. We have a Sarma recipie from the > Perpich's that says we should cover the sarma in sour kraut and then bake > it. Has anyone tried that? > > -----Original Message----- > From: Donald Marinkovich [mailto:[email protected]] > Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 10:25 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > > > In the days, before home refridgerators, it was my job to run to the > store. > When Ma made sarmas that ment 1/3 gd beef, 1/3 gd pork, 1/3 gd ham. > Kisele > glavice came from the barrel in the basement. Eventually I made my own > sour > kraut. and I would include a few heads for sarmas but for my use a crock > was big enough. Once I tasted sarmas wraped in leaves from a frozen head > I > decided that souring heads was no longer worth the bother. I have a son > living in Denver. When he comes to the iron range he has to get enough > blood sausage (krvavice)for him and a buddy with an Italian last name but > had a Slovenian mother. There are still a few places where they still > have > good Slovenian Polish sausage. On the range every thing geets mixed up. > One > of the better places to get Polish sausage was at Coldagelilis in Eveleth. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jerome Buza" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 9:58 AM > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > > >> Thanks Robert, I will read that page and enjoy it, I am sure. My family >> always made the Sarma with sauerkraut, no tomatoes, and that is the way I >> love it. Of course, there was an Eimprem, too. While living in Turkey, >> I >> ate their Sarma and it was different,but we grew to love it. Mom just >> boiled the leaves in vinegar water and when I was young, the produce man >> at the local A & P store gave my mom the outer leaves. Now, they don't >> have them available. So, growing the cabbages in our garden at our >> mountain cabin in AZ has become our way of having the larger leaves of >> cabbage to use. >> Margaret >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Robert Jerin" <[email protected]> >> To: <[email protected]> >> Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 5:42 AM >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >> >> >>> Ahh.... just had some REAL Croatian Sarma at Marie's Restaurant on St >>> Clair in Cleveland. The owners are the family Sabalic from Ljubuski, >>> Hercegovina. REAL sarma must always be made using "soured leaves", >>> which >>> we can purchase at Zagreb Meats on St Clair. If you can not purchase >>> "soured cabbage" then par boiling the leaves in vinegar water may work. >>> For many years I did not like sarma, then I discovered that many (most >>> immigrants I know here in Cleveland) do not add tomatoes, and that is >>> what I did not like! Most here will make a rue and then add paprika and >>> a bit of water to make a delicous sauce to pour over the sarma and >>> mashed >>> potatoes or dumplings. >>> >>> My experience with the (too) many Croatian functions that I attend is >>> that if there are many immigrants the food is authentic and if the >>> majority are American born the food has some resemblance to the >>> authentic >>> stuff but does not come close. >>> >>> Here is a recipe that I have found to my taste from the Embassy web >>> page. >>> >>> http://www.croatiaemb.org/basic_facts/christmas97.htm >>> >>> Robert >>> >>> Karen Heiser <[email protected]> wrote: >>> Dear List - I think the "western expansion" did in a lot of our families >>> and >>> traditions. Traveling 30 miles for the family reunion is a lot easier >>> and >>> cheaper than travelling 2500 miles. And then there is the marriage >>> thing...not many of us were able to marry within our ethnicity, so then >>> you >>> have another whole set of traditions to work with. >>> But if you don't stop talking about lamb and sarma, the drooling is >>> going >>> to >>> ruin my keyboard! >>> Karen Heiser >>> Weed, Siskiyou, CA >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Jerome Buza" >>> To: >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 9:58 PM >>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>> >>> >>>> Another reason for the demise of many of the family customs is the way >>>> we >>>> travel around and move far away. We try to keep up our family customs >>> even >>>> though we are in AZ and most of the family is in MI or IL. However, >>>> many >>> of >>>> my aunts and uncles married people that were not that interested and >>>> now >>> the >>>> kids aren't either. My generation knows that my mom cooked like Grandma >>> and >>>> that I cook like mom and are asking me for recipes. However, many >>>> didn't >>>> have the traditions followed all their lives like I did with my mother >>>> and >>>> my husband did with his part of the Polish family. Our own daughter has >>>> been living in TX for 20 of her 21 years of married life and doesn't >>> follow >>>> our traditions. Her kids are fussy and wouldn't eat the food anyway. >>>> Margaret >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "al toennies" >>>> To: >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 4:25 PM >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>> >>>> >>>> > Good question Joy! I think a bunch of siblings (like these folks >>>> > were) >>>> > can keep it together naturally but when they start to fade away and >>>> > you >>>> > are left with cousins and a collection of spouses with family ties of >>>> > their own, you need a catalytic agent of some sort - maybe a person >>>> > or >>>> > a >>>> > group of people that pulls or pushes the different family members >>>> > together. They have to be either loved or feared or so much of a pain >>> it >>>> > the butt that everybody gives in to avoid further hassles. I watched >>>> > my >>>> > mother's Swedish family gatherings wither away after my Grandmother >>> died - >>>> > she was a catalyst of a sort and no one replaced her. >>>> > >>>> > Al in Music City >>>> > ----- Original Message ----- >>>> > >>>> > From: "Joy Durrett" >>>> > To: >>>> > Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 8:57 AM >>>> > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>> > >>>> > >>>> >> Why didn't the next generation keep it going? Sounds like a great >>>> >> way >>> to >>>> >> keep the family together. >>>> >> >>>> >> Joy >>>> >> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> >> From: "al toennies" >>>> >> To: >>>> >> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 2:52 AM >>>> >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >>> My wife's family (all of Croatian descent) used to have a picnic at >>>> >>> a >>>> >>> summer home in Silver Lake, WI (we were all from Chicago) and >>>> >>> roasted >>> a >>>> >>> whole lamb over charcoal in a 55 gallon drum split lengthwise with >>>> >>> a >>>> >>> home-made turning mechanism >>>> >>> doing all the heavy work. I was never a big fan of lamb but I made >>>> >>> an >>>> >>> exception for that - Most of those folks are gone now but the >>>> >>> memories >>>> >>> remain including the best lamb I have ever eaten. >>>> >>> >>>> >>> Al in Music City >>>> >>> >>>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> >>> From: "Robert Jerin" >>>> >>> To: >>>> >>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 12:44 PM >>>> >>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>>> Nick, >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I must admit that I roasted just a leg and used my Weber with nice >>> hot >>>> >>>> coals on the side. Pleeeze don't tell any real Croatians about my >>>> >>>> "unorthodox" method of using a Weber! Everyone here loves roast >>>> >>>> lamb >>>> >>>> except the wife. So it was enough for the gang. But IMHO the >>>> >>>> secret >>>> >>>> is selecting the right piece, trimming much of the fact and then >>>> >>>> coating the lamb with olive oil, salt (I use Croatian Podravka >>> Vegeta), >>>> >>>> pepper, fresh chopped garlic and rosemary and let it marinate in >>>> >>>> the >>>> >>>> fridge for a day or more... then setting the piece out about 2 >>>> >>>> hours >>>> >>>> before placing on the grill. Oh the other trick is slow roasting, >>>> >>>> no >>>> >>>> flame, just hot coals and not too close to the coals....mmmm.... >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> It has been several years since our Junior tammie group here in >>>> >>>> Cleveland had a picnic... at that time we would take most of Sat >>>> >>>> afternoon to set up 8 whole lambs and 9 pigs on spits, then season >>> them >>>> >>>> and put them in the cooler for Sun am.. after that we would feast >>>> >>>> on >>>> >>>> gulas that I would make along with salad, some wine and slivovitz >>>> >>>> and >>>> >>>> one of the father's, who has since passed away would play his >>> harmonika >>>> >>>> (accordian) and all the guys would dance to his Bosanac songs! >>>> >>>> What >>> a >>>> >>>> sight! Then at 4 AM on Sunday I would meet my friend Mato Vrbic at >>> the >>>> >>>> picnic center to prepare the fire... then a little coffee with >>>> >>>> slivovitz of course... and about 6AM we would consider the coals >>>> >>>> and >>>> >>>> the brick lined floor hot enough to place the first few pieces on >>>> >>>> the >>>> >>>> spit... then about 11:30 ish the first ones would come off to be >>>> >>>> cut >>>> >>>> and served.... that Sunday would finish up at about 10-11 PM >>>> >>>> making >>>> >>>> sure the center was left in better condition than we found it! >>>> >>>> Lots >>>> >>>> of work but I miss those ! >>>> >>>> days... >>>> >>>> as they brought back memories of my Grandparent's PLASAJ (Mirko >>>> >>>> and >>>> >>>> Mary) and my cousin's BAKALE (Ivan and Johanna)farms in PA and the >>>> >>>> picnics we would have there. But they are all gone now so we try >>>> >>>> to >>>> >>>> carry on some semblance of those traditions..... >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.podravka.com/en/products/index.php?if=new_products.php >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Here is a photo that may bring back some memories >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.members.shaw.ca/rogergou/bast4.jpeg >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Robert >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> nharamija wrote: >>>> >>>> Robert; Let us see your grille and how you set it up. >>>> >>>> Nick >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> >>>> From: "Robert Jerin" >>>> >>>> To: >>>> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 11:50 AM >>>> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> My wife did those things! I was busy roasting.... lamb! >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Jerome Buza wrote: >>>> >>>> That's right!!! We were all busy baking and cooking and dying eggs >>> and >>>> >>>> cleaning the house for company. >>>> >>>> Margaret >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> >>>> From: "dave mothkovich" >>>> >>>> To: >>>> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 2:32 AM >>>> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> Everybody got busy, and then the holiday came, it happens. >>>> >>>>> Christmas >>>> >>>>> was >>>> >>>>> different, everyone had time to chat it up. >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> Dave >>>> >>>>> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 17:45:41 +0800 "John Stefanac" >>>> >>>>> writes: >>>> >>>>>> Is it just quiet on this list or have I somehow been kicked off >>>> >>>>>> it >>>> >>>>>> again >>>> >>>>>> >>>> >>>>>> >>>> >>>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> -- >>>> >>>>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>>> >>>>> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>>> >>>>> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: >>>> >>>>> 3/27/2005 >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >>>> >>>> about a >>>> >>>> wonderful tour of Croatia! >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >>>> >>>> about a wonderful tour of Croatia! >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>>> >> >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > -- >>>> > No virus found in this incoming message. >>>> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>>> > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 >>>> > >>>> > >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >>> about >>> a wonderful tour of Croatia! >>> >>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 >>> >>> >> >> > > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs SkyScan > service. For more information on a proactive anti-virus service working > around the clock, around the globe, visit www.messagelabs.com. > ________________________________________________________________________ > > ________________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs SkyScan > service. For more information on a proactive anti-virus service working > around the clock, around the globe, visit www.messagelabs.com. > ________________________________________________________________________ > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 > >

Patty - I have made sarma by baking it; my Grandma covered hers in sour kraut, but simmered it on top of the stove. And she did not put tomatoes or tomato sauce...no red except paprika over the top layer. Once a year I try to make sarma for my brothers but so far their children have not acquired the taste. Both of my children like it, even to the point of asking, Mom, when are we going to have sarma again? Karen Heiser Weed, Siskiyou, CA ----- Original Message ----- From: "Reuter, Patty" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 8:42 AM Subject: RE: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > Don, > > What is the name of the store that you ran? Was it in Chisholm? My granparents always got their sausage from Coldageliis. We would have it every time we came up from the cities. We have a Sarma recipie from the Perpich's that says we should cover the sarma in sour kraut and then bake it. Has anyone tried that? > > -----Original Message----- > From: Donald Marinkovich [mailto:[email protected]] > Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 10:25 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > > > In the days, before home refridgerators, it was my job to run to the store. > When Ma made sarmas that ment 1/3 gd beef, 1/3 gd pork, 1/3 gd ham. Kisele > glavice came from the barrel in the basement. Eventually I made my own sour > kraut. and I would include a few heads for sarmas but for my use a crock > was big enough. Once I tasted sarmas wraped in leaves from a frozen head I > decided that souring heads was no longer worth the bother. I have a son > living in Denver. When he comes to the iron range he has to get enough > blood sausage (krvavice)for him and a buddy with an Italian last name but > had a Slovenian mother. There are still a few places where they still have > good Slovenian Polish sausage. On the range every thing geets mixed up. One > of the better places to get Polish sausage was at Coldagelilis in Eveleth. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jerome Buza" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 9:58 AM > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > > > > Thanks Robert, I will read that page and enjoy it, I am sure. My family > > always made the Sarma with sauerkraut, no tomatoes, and that is the way I > > love it. Of course, there was an Eimprem, too. While living in Turkey, I > > ate their Sarma and it was different,but we grew to love it. Mom just > > boiled the leaves in vinegar water and when I was young, the produce man > > at the local A & P store gave my mom the outer leaves. Now, they don't > > have them available. So, growing the cabbages in our garden at our > > mountain cabin in AZ has become our way of having the larger leaves of > > cabbage to use. > > Margaret > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Robert Jerin" <[email protected]> > > To: <[email protected]> > > Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 5:42 AM > > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > > > > > >> Ahh.... just had some REAL Croatian Sarma at Marie's Restaurant on St > >> Clair in Cleveland. The owners are the family Sabalic from Ljubuski, > >> Hercegovina. REAL sarma must always be made using "soured leaves", which > >> we can purchase at Zagreb Meats on St Clair. If you can not purchase > >> "soured cabbage" then par boiling the leaves in vinegar water may work. > >> For many years I did not like sarma, then I discovered that many (most > >> immigrants I know here in Cleveland) do not add tomatoes, and that is > >> what I did not like! Most here will make a rue and then add paprika and > >> a bit of water to make a delicous sauce to pour over the sarma and mashed > >> potatoes or dumplings. > >> > >> My experience with the (too) many Croatian functions that I attend is > >> that if there are many immigrants the food is authentic and if the > >> majority are American born the food has some resemblance to the authentic > >> stuff but does not come close. > >> > >> Here is a recipe that I have found to my taste from the Embassy web page. > >> > >> http://www.croatiaemb.org/basic_facts/christmas97.htm > >> > >> Robert > >> > >> Karen Heiser <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Dear List - I think the "western expansion" did in a lot of our families > >> and > >> traditions. Traveling 30 miles for the family reunion is a lot easier and > >> cheaper than travelling 2500 miles. And then there is the marriage > >> thing...not many of us were able to marry within our ethnicity, so then > >> you > >> have another whole set of traditions to work with. > >> But if you don't stop talking about lamb and sarma, the drooling is going > >> to > >> ruin my keyboard! > >> Karen Heiser > >> Weed, Siskiyou, CA > >> ----- Original Message ----- > >> From: "Jerome Buza" > >> To: > >> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 9:58 PM > >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > >> > >> > >>> Another reason for the demise of many of the family customs is the way > >>> we > >>> travel around and move far away. We try to keep up our family customs > >> even > >>> though we are in AZ and most of the family is in MI or IL. However, many > >> of > >>> my aunts and uncles married people that were not that interested and now > >> the > >>> kids aren't either. My generation knows that my mom cooked like Grandma > >> and > >>> that I cook like mom and are asking me for recipes. However, many didn't > >>> have the traditions followed all their lives like I did with my mother > >>> and > >>> my husband did with his part of the Polish family. Our own daughter has > >>> been living in TX for 20 of her 21 years of married life and doesn't > >> follow > >>> our traditions. Her kids are fussy and wouldn't eat the food anyway. > >>> Margaret > >>> ----- Original Message ----- > >>> From: "al toennies" > >>> To: > >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 4:25 PM > >>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > >>> > >>> > >>> > Good question Joy! I think a bunch of siblings (like these folks were) > >>> > can keep it together naturally but when they start to fade away and > >>> > you > >>> > are left with cousins and a collection of spouses with family ties of > >>> > their own, you need a catalytic agent of some sort - maybe a person or > >>> > a > >>> > group of people that pulls or pushes the different family members > >>> > together. They have to be either loved or feared or so much of a pain > >> it > >>> > the butt that everybody gives in to avoid further hassles. I watched > >>> > my > >>> > mother's Swedish family gatherings wither away after my Grandmother > >> died - > >>> > she was a catalyst of a sort and no one replaced her. > >>> > > >>> > Al in Music City > >>> > ----- Original Message ----- > >>> > > >>> > From: "Joy Durrett" > >>> > To: > >>> > Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 8:57 AM > >>> > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > >>> > > >>> > > >>> >> Why didn't the next generation keep it going? Sounds like a great way > >> to > >>> >> keep the family together. > >>> >> > >>> >> Joy > >>> >> ----- Original Message ----- > >>> >> From: "al toennies" > >>> >> To: > >>> >> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 2:52 AM > >>> >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >>> My wife's family (all of Croatian descent) used to have a picnic at > >>> >>> a > >>> >>> summer home in Silver Lake, WI (we were all from Chicago) and > >>> >>> roasted > >> a > >>> >>> whole lamb over charcoal in a 55 gallon drum split lengthwise with a > >>> >>> home-made turning mechanism > >>> >>> doing all the heavy work. I was never a big fan of lamb but I made > >>> >>> an > >>> >>> exception for that - Most of those folks are gone now but the > >>> >>> memories > >>> >>> remain including the best lamb I have ever eaten. > >>> >>> > >>> >>> Al in Music City > >>> >>> > >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- > >>> >>> From: "Robert Jerin" > >>> >>> To: > >>> >>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 12:44 PM > >>> >>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > >>> >>> > >>> >>> > >>> >>>> Nick, > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> I must admit that I roasted just a leg and used my Weber with nice > >> hot > >>> >>>> coals on the side. Pleeeze don't tell any real Croatians about my > >>> >>>> "unorthodox" method of using a Weber! Everyone here loves roast > >>> >>>> lamb > >>> >>>> except the wife. So it was enough for the gang. But IMHO the secret > >>> >>>> is selecting the right piece, trimming much of the fact and then > >>> >>>> coating the lamb with olive oil, salt (I use Croatian Podravka > >> Vegeta), > >>> >>>> pepper, fresh chopped garlic and rosemary and let it marinate in > >>> >>>> the > >>> >>>> fridge for a day or more... then setting the piece out about 2 > >>> >>>> hours > >>> >>>> before placing on the grill. Oh the other trick is slow roasting, > >>> >>>> no > >>> >>>> flame, just hot coals and not too close to the coals....mmmm.... > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> It has been several years since our Junior tammie group here in > >>> >>>> Cleveland had a picnic... at that time we would take most of Sat > >>> >>>> afternoon to set up 8 whole lambs and 9 pigs on spits, then season > >> them > >>> >>>> and put them in the cooler for Sun am.. after that we would feast > >>> >>>> on > >>> >>>> gulas that I would make along with salad, some wine and slivovitz > >>> >>>> and > >>> >>>> one of the father's, who has since passed away would play his > >> harmonika > >>> >>>> (accordian) and all the guys would dance to his Bosanac songs! What > >> a > >>> >>>> sight! Then at 4 AM on Sunday I would meet my friend Mato Vrbic at > >> the > >>> >>>> picnic center to prepare the fire... then a little coffee with > >>> >>>> slivovitz of course... and about 6AM we would consider the coals > >>> >>>> and > >>> >>>> the brick lined floor hot enough to place the first few pieces on > >>> >>>> the > >>> >>>> spit... then about 11:30 ish the first ones would come off to be > >>> >>>> cut > >>> >>>> and served.... that Sunday would finish up at about 10-11 PM making > >>> >>>> sure the center was left in better condition than we found it! Lots > >>> >>>> of work but I miss those ! > >>> >>>> days... > >>> >>>> as they brought back memories of my Grandparent's PLASAJ (Mirko and > >>> >>>> Mary) and my cousin's BAKALE (Ivan and Johanna)farms in PA and the > >>> >>>> picnics we would have there. But they are all gone now so we try to > >>> >>>> carry on some semblance of those traditions..... > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> http://www.podravka.com/en/products/index.php?if=new_products.php > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> Here is a photo that may bring back some memories > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> http://www.members.shaw.ca/rogergou/bast4.jpeg > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> Robert > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> nharamija wrote: > >>> >>>> Robert; Let us see your grille and how you set it up. > >>> >>>> Nick > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- > >>> >>>> From: "Robert Jerin" > >>> >>>> To: > >>> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 11:50 AM > >>> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> My wife did those things! I was busy roasting.... lamb! > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> Jerome Buza wrote: > >>> >>>> That's right!!! We were all busy baking and cooking and dying eggs > >> and > >>> >>>> cleaning the house for company. > >>> >>>> Margaret > >>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- > >>> >>>> From: "dave mothkovich" > >>> >>>> To: > >>> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 2:32 AM > >>> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>>> Everybody got busy, and then the holiday came, it happens. > >>> >>>>> Christmas > >>> >>>>> was > >>> >>>>> different, everyone had time to chat it up. > >>> >>>>> > >>> >>>>> Dave > >>> >>>>> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 17:45:41 +0800 "John Stefanac" > >>> >>>>> writes: > >>> >>>>>> Is it just quiet on this list or have I somehow been kicked off > >>> >>>>>> it > >>> >>>>>> again > >>> >>>>>> > >>> >>>>>> > >>> >>>>>> > >>> >>>>> > >>> >>>>> > >>> >>>>> > >>> >>>>> -- > >>> >>>>> No virus found in this incoming message. > >>> >>>>> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > >>> >>>>> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: > >>> >>>>> 3/27/2005 > >>> >>>>> > >>> >>>>> > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out > >>> >>>> about a > >>> >>>> wonderful tour of Croatia! > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out > >>> >>>> about a wonderful tour of Croatia! > >>> >>>> > >>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ > >>> >>>> > >>> >>> > >>> >> > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > -- > >>> > No virus found in this incoming message. > >>> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > >>> > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > >>> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out about > >> a wonderful tour of Croatia! > >> > >> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> No virus found in this incoming message. > >> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > >> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 > >> > >> > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs SkyScan > service. For more information on a proactive anti-virus service working > around the clock, around the globe, visit www.messagelabs.com. > ________________________________________________________________________ > > ________________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs SkyScan > service. For more information on a proactive anti-virus service working > around the clock, around the globe, visit www.messagelabs.com. ________________________________________________________________________ > >

Don, What is the name of the store that you ran? Was it in Chisholm? My granparents always got their sausage from Coldageliis. We would have it every time we came up from the cities. We have a Sarma recipie from the Perpich's that says we should cover the sarma in sour kraut and then bake it. Has anyone tried that? -----Original Message----- From: Donald Marinkovich [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 10:25 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast In the days, before home refridgerators, it was my job to run to the store. When Ma made sarmas that ment 1/3 gd beef, 1/3 gd pork, 1/3 gd ham. Kisele glavice came from the barrel in the basement. Eventually I made my own sour kraut. and I would include a few heads for sarmas but for my use a crock was big enough. Once I tasted sarmas wraped in leaves from a frozen head I decided that souring heads was no longer worth the bother. I have a son living in Denver. When he comes to the iron range he has to get enough blood sausage (krvavice)for him and a buddy with an Italian last name but had a Slovenian mother. There are still a few places where they still have good Slovenian Polish sausage. On the range every thing geets mixed up. One of the better places to get Polish sausage was at Coldagelilis in Eveleth. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerome Buza" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 9:58 AM Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > Thanks Robert, I will read that page and enjoy it, I am sure. My family > always made the Sarma with sauerkraut, no tomatoes, and that is the way I > love it. Of course, there was an Eimprem, too. While living in Turkey, I > ate their Sarma and it was different,but we grew to love it. Mom just > boiled the leaves in vinegar water and when I was young, the produce man > at the local A & P store gave my mom the outer leaves. Now, they don't > have them available. So, growing the cabbages in our garden at our > mountain cabin in AZ has become our way of having the larger leaves of > cabbage to use. > Margaret > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Robert Jerin" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 5:42 AM > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast > > >> Ahh.... just had some REAL Croatian Sarma at Marie's Restaurant on St >> Clair in Cleveland. The owners are the family Sabalic from Ljubuski, >> Hercegovina. REAL sarma must always be made using "soured leaves", which >> we can purchase at Zagreb Meats on St Clair. If you can not purchase >> "soured cabbage" then par boiling the leaves in vinegar water may work. >> For many years I did not like sarma, then I discovered that many (most >> immigrants I know here in Cleveland) do not add tomatoes, and that is >> what I did not like! Most here will make a rue and then add paprika and >> a bit of water to make a delicous sauce to pour over the sarma and mashed >> potatoes or dumplings. >> >> My experience with the (too) many Croatian functions that I attend is >> that if there are many immigrants the food is authentic and if the >> majority are American born the food has some resemblance to the authentic >> stuff but does not come close. >> >> Here is a recipe that I have found to my taste from the Embassy web page. >> >> http://www.croatiaemb.org/basic_facts/christmas97.htm >> >> Robert >> >> Karen Heiser <[email protected]> wrote: >> Dear List - I think the "western expansion" did in a lot of our families >> and >> traditions. Traveling 30 miles for the family reunion is a lot easier and >> cheaper than travelling 2500 miles. And then there is the marriage >> thing...not many of us were able to marry within our ethnicity, so then >> you >> have another whole set of traditions to work with. >> But if you don't stop talking about lamb and sarma, the drooling is going >> to >> ruin my keyboard! >> Karen Heiser >> Weed, Siskiyou, CA >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Jerome Buza" >> To: >> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 9:58 PM >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >> >> >>> Another reason for the demise of many of the family customs is the way >>> we >>> travel around and move far away. We try to keep up our family customs >> even >>> though we are in AZ and most of the family is in MI or IL. However, many >> of >>> my aunts and uncles married people that were not that interested and now >> the >>> kids aren't either. My generation knows that my mom cooked like Grandma >> and >>> that I cook like mom and are asking me for recipes. However, many didn't >>> have the traditions followed all their lives like I did with my mother >>> and >>> my husband did with his part of the Polish family. Our own daughter has >>> been living in TX for 20 of her 21 years of married life and doesn't >> follow >>> our traditions. Her kids are fussy and wouldn't eat the food anyway. >>> Margaret >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "al toennies" >>> To: >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 4:25 PM >>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>> >>> >>> > Good question Joy! I think a bunch of siblings (like these folks were) >>> > can keep it together naturally but when they start to fade away and >>> > you >>> > are left with cousins and a collection of spouses with family ties of >>> > their own, you need a catalytic agent of some sort - maybe a person or >>> > a >>> > group of people that pulls or pushes the different family members >>> > together. They have to be either loved or feared or so much of a pain >> it >>> > the butt that everybody gives in to avoid further hassles. I watched >>> > my >>> > mother's Swedish family gatherings wither away after my Grandmother >> died - >>> > she was a catalyst of a sort and no one replaced her. >>> > >>> > Al in Music City >>> > ----- Original Message ----- >>> > >>> > From: "Joy Durrett" >>> > To: >>> > Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 8:57 AM >>> > Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>> > >>> > >>> >> Why didn't the next generation keep it going? Sounds like a great way >> to >>> >> keep the family together. >>> >> >>> >> Joy >>> >> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >> From: "al toennies" >>> >> To: >>> >> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 2:52 AM >>> >> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>> >> >>> >> >>> >>> My wife's family (all of Croatian descent) used to have a picnic at >>> >>> a >>> >>> summer home in Silver Lake, WI (we were all from Chicago) and >>> >>> roasted >> a >>> >>> whole lamb over charcoal in a 55 gallon drum split lengthwise with a >>> >>> home-made turning mechanism >>> >>> doing all the heavy work. I was never a big fan of lamb but I made >>> >>> an >>> >>> exception for that - Most of those folks are gone now but the >>> >>> memories >>> >>> remain including the best lamb I have ever eaten. >>> >>> >>> >>> Al in Music City >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >>> From: "Robert Jerin" >>> >>> To: >>> >>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 12:44 PM >>> >>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Lamb Roast >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>> Nick, >>> >>>> >>> >>>> I must admit that I roasted just a leg and used my Weber with nice >> hot >>> >>>> coals on the side. Pleeeze don't tell any real Croatians about my >>> >>>> "unorthodox" method of using a Weber! Everyone here loves roast >>> >>>> lamb >>> >>>> except the wife. So it was enough for the gang. But IMHO the secret >>> >>>> is selecting the right piece, trimming much of the fact and then >>> >>>> coating the lamb with olive oil, salt (I use Croatian Podravka >> Vegeta), >>> >>>> pepper, fresh chopped garlic and rosemary and let it marinate in >>> >>>> the >>> >>>> fridge for a day or more... then setting the piece out about 2 >>> >>>> hours >>> >>>> before placing on the grill. Oh the other trick is slow roasting, >>> >>>> no >>> >>>> flame, just hot coals and not too close to the coals....mmmm.... >>> >>>> >>> >>>> It has been several years since our Junior tammie group here in >>> >>>> Cleveland had a picnic... at that time we would take most of Sat >>> >>>> afternoon to set up 8 whole lambs and 9 pigs on spits, then season >> them >>> >>>> and put them in the cooler for Sun am.. after that we would feast >>> >>>> on >>> >>>> gulas that I would make along with salad, some wine and slivovitz >>> >>>> and >>> >>>> one of the father's, who has since passed away would play his >> harmonika >>> >>>> (accordian) and all the guys would dance to his Bosanac songs! What >> a >>> >>>> sight! Then at 4 AM on Sunday I would meet my friend Mato Vrbic at >> the >>> >>>> picnic center to prepare the fire... then a little coffee with >>> >>>> slivovitz of course... and about 6AM we would consider the coals >>> >>>> and >>> >>>> the brick lined floor hot enough to place the first few pieces on >>> >>>> the >>> >>>> spit... then about 11:30 ish the first ones would come off to be >>> >>>> cut >>> >>>> and served.... that Sunday would finish up at about 10-11 PM making >>> >>>> sure the center was left in better condition than we found it! Lots >>> >>>> of work but I miss those ! >>> >>>> days... >>> >>>> as they brought back memories of my Grandparent's PLASAJ (Mirko and >>> >>>> Mary) and my cousin's BAKALE (Ivan and Johanna)farms in PA and the >>> >>>> picnics we would have there. But they are all gone now so we try to >>> >>>> carry on some semblance of those traditions..... >>> >>>> >>> >>>> http://www.podravka.com/en/products/index.php?if=new_products.php >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Here is a photo that may bring back some memories >>> >>>> >>> >>>> http://www.members.shaw.ca/rogergou/bast4.jpeg >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Robert >>> >>>> >>> >>>> nharamija wrote: >>> >>>> Robert; Let us see your grille and how you set it up. >>> >>>> Nick >>> >>>> >>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >>>> From: "Robert Jerin" >>> >>>> To: >>> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 11:50 AM >>> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> My wife did those things! I was busy roasting.... lamb! >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Jerome Buza wrote: >>> >>>> That's right!!! We were all busy baking and cooking and dying eggs >> and >>> >>>> cleaning the house for company. >>> >>>> Margaret >>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >>>> From: "dave mothkovich" >>> >>>> To: >>> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 2:32 AM >>> >>>> Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] Test >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>>> Everybody got busy, and then the holiday came, it happens. >>> >>>>> Christmas >>> >>>>> was >>> >>>>> different, everyone had time to chat it up. >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> Dave >>> >>>>> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 17:45:41 +0800 "John Stefanac" >>> >>>>> writes: >>> >>>>>> Is it just quiet on this list or have I somehow been kicked off >>> >>>>>> it >>> >>>>>> again >>> >>>>>> >>> >>>>>> >>> >>>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> -- >>> >>>>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>> >>>>> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>> >>>>> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: >>> >>>>> 3/27/2005 >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >>> >>>> about a >>> >>>> wonderful tour of Croatia! >>> >>>> >>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out >>> >>>> about a wonderful tour of Croatia! >>> >>>> >>> >>>> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >> >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > -- >>> > No virus found in this incoming message. >>> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>> > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 >>> > >>> > >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >> Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out about >> a wonderful tour of Croatia! >> >> http://www.kollander-travel.com/ >> >> >> >> -- >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.4 - Release Date: 3/27/2005 >> >> > > ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs SkyScan service. For more information on a proactive anti-virus service working around the clock, around the globe, visit www.messagelabs.com. ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs SkyScan service. For more information on a proactive anti-virus service working around the clock, around the globe, visit www.messagelabs.com. ________________________________________________________________________

Hello my friend Robert, Tell me how your trip for Croatia is going, would love to be with you all perhaps next time. I do hope you have had a great response. regards Mary PS: Perhaps Frank can unsubscribe Eric from his end. -----Original Message----- From: Robert Jerin [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Thursday, 31 March 2005 9:46 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] For Eric Name - Unsubscribing Hi Mary, Don't know what Eric's problem is but I have told him 3 times how to do this... on this List as well as sending him emails.... maybe the 4th time is a charm :) Robert Mary <[email protected]> wrote: please send an email to [email protected] with the word unsubscribe in the subject line. regards Mary ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eric Name" To: Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 10:37 PM Subject: [CROATIA-L] remove > remove > > ___________________________________________________________ > Sent by ePrompter, the premier email notification software. > Free download at http://www.ePrompter.com. > > > Interested in visting Croatia? Click on the link below to find out about a wonderful tour of Croatia! http://www.kollander-travel.com/ ________________________________________________________________ This email and any attachments are confidential and/or contain confidential information. If you are not the intended recipient of this email, any use, interference with, disclosure or copying of this material is unauthorised and prohibited. If you have received this email in error please immediately advise the sender by return email and delete this message from your system. WALTER Construction Group (Administrators appointed) ________________________________________________________________

Hello Tom Hope you have been well. Love the look of your new web page. Though a bit sad not to see my family line photo that you took no longer there. Have contacted the priest a number of times to see if I can get both grandmother's lines sent but he at this stage has not written back, perhaps next time you are back in Croatia you could stop in and see him again and take some more pictures for me. I am more than happy to pay you for your services. regards Mary -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Thursday, 31 March 2005 6:36 AM To: [email protected] Subject: [CROATIA-L] LDS microfilms The heart of any family study, family history, genealogy (whatever you want to call it) has GOT to be the family tree, traced back as far as possible. Few people will argue with this assessment. And it's well known that the only Croatian vital documents outside of Croatia can be found only in the LDS microfilms. So why, on the various Croatian forums, are there so few questions asked about how to read these documents? You would think that every other person would be asking such questions but few do. I have written a short statement about this and would like your feedback. See here: http://www.croatia-in-english.com/QnA/Q-1.html --Tom Ninkovich ________________________________________________________________ This email and any attachments are confidential and/or contain confidential information. If you are not the intended recipient of this email, any use, interference with, disclosure or copying of this material is unauthorised and prohibited. If you have received this email in error please immediately advise the sender by return email and delete this message from your system. WALTER Construction Group (Administrators appointed) ________________________________________________________________

Kathy: If you knew the parish that they belonged to, finding any church records and gravesites would be easy. Wall is in East Pittburgh, next door to Wilmerding (where my mother's Lithuanian family settled down). The Roman Catholic church in Wall was St John the Baptist, or St Jude in Wilmerding; the Holy Trinity Byzantine, where I spent many inscense-infused hours at family events is also nearby. Not sure what denomination your grandparents were. And while there may be 6 degrees of separation across the world, you quickly find out that everyone in Pittsburgh only has 2 degrees of separation, so tracking down relations usually doesn't take too long. Another good source is the Allegheny County public records, in the City County Building on Grant Street. If it's out of the way, they'll look them up for you for a minimal fee (don't use one of those silly online search services, who just file the paperwork for you and charge large fees): http://www.county.allegheny.pa.us/regwills/cert.asp Hope that this helps! Mike -----Original Message----- From: Kathy Chick [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 8:38 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [CROATIA-L] For Eric Name - Unsubscribing-Inappropriate remark The family I am talking about are John Joseph Yedinak and Eva Yedinak whose maiden name was Vugrincic. She died in 1949 and my grandfather about 5 years later. My grandfather immigrated to the US in 1901 and my grandmother in 1908. They married in Pittsburgh in 1911 and evetually ran a hotel in the borough of Wall. Kathy [email protected] wrote:Kathy What were the names you were looking for I also have family in Pittsburgh mine are buried at North Side Catholic Cemetery but it is now called Christ our Redeemer Donna