........flushes out the nasty taste........just like wild hogs......it's not the fat one is concerned about. TT ----- Original Message ----- From: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Cc: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 3:11 PM Subject: Re: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] In looking for ancestors always checkout Arkansas, Louisiana and Texas > Richard T, are you pulling our appendages?? ha > > If you are purposfully feeding said possum the buttermilk and cornbread, > which evidently causes fat, and you are parboiling it to get rid of the > excess fat, what is the purpose ? Is MOST of the cornbread and > buttermilk making better/tastier/more MEAT (a la feeding beef to the > Kobe or corn to the U.S. beeves) ?? and just part of it is considered > excess fat? Whew ! > > On a more serious note, can you tell me the general location where the > friendly Creeks settled in Texas? > > (The Alabama-Coushattas are in East Texas, which we've discussed > before.) > > Thanks, as always, Richard T ! > > gmw > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Mr. Thornton ; Hensci Tecak'kvte I am Selakseket Lv'mhe Tv'stvnvk'ke from TAMA Tribal Town in Whigham, Georgia. I would like very much to have a copy of the pictures of " OLD TAMA Town " Model that you have reproduced. I would also like any information you have about Old Tama Town . Thank you S.L.T. My e'mail ( [email protected] ) >> The big model of Tama O'la-mikko is now on permanent display in the >> Capitol >> of the Muscogee (Creek) Nation in Okmulgee, OK. Since this town was the >> original Tama, I thought for sure that Tama Macuse would want some photos >> of the >> model to put on their tribal bulletin board or web site. However, there >> has >> been no response from a snail mail letter and two emails concerning that >> offer. In the snail mail letter, I mentioned tht the model would be in >> my >> workshop for about another month, if any one wanted to see it. Too late >> now. If >> you are a member of Tama Tribal Town, I can send the photos via email >> and >> then maybe you can find someone in the tribal leadership, who could use >> them. >> >> Mvto! >> >> Richard Thornton

gmw, Richard B. here,... about that "dead" possum, he/she was not really dead , just "playing possum" , its something they do.. :o) . Sometimes they lay "dead" in the open like this (on their back..) to attract vultures. When the vultures come down (from circling..) , with the element of surprise the possom lunges at the vulture, catching it by the neck and then eats it. They get much of their food this way,.."only an indian would know that". I'm sorry, but this message does not seem to have any redeeming value, other than cooking your own possom... I think you can now purchase it canned. Richard T. did not post this. ----- Original Message ----- From: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Cc: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 2:54 PM Subject: Re: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Where the Creeks went in Texas > I'm sorry--I thought that the cornbread and buttermilk were causing some > of the fat. > > Gotcha now----thanks. > > Once a possum came in our garage and ate gobs of bird food which the > (dumb) owners had left out, in a plastic bag. The ole possum ate itself > to death, and died lying on its back with all four legs pointing at the > sky, stomach bulging. My dogs were running in a circle around Ole Pos, > barking their heads off !! > > Didn't eat it. > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > >

Richard T., when cooking the Opossom, I guess my ggrandmother forgot to "parboil" and went straight to the oven. Grease/oil level was half up in the baking pan, but I think they used to dip their homemade bread in that. That was one of the few foods I tried and did not acquire a taste for. (too much oil..). How do you get those roadkills to eat the buttermilk/etc??? In locations for natives,.. remember that about 1817 was a treaty for the Cherokees (referred to as Old Settlers) to self emigrate to their Reservation in north central Arkansas. (they stayed there until about 1830) when the reservation was dissolved in another treaty and the Old Settlers went to Ind Territory. 1817 look for "passport" allowing Inds (reds...:o) to travel. Sam Huston , the Texican, was very hooked to the Cherokees, he was known as "The Raven" & book title same name , .. in his biography you see much. (one of my family names chief (John Jolly) , adopted him, but others claim not the same person. Neither of us can "proove" yes/no , but I have some paper trial for that!! Also, along with your good information, you did not mention 1811 earthquake SE Missouri "bootheel" , Cherokee living there with chief "Bowl" , fled to TX , they considered the ground shake a bad medicine message or something. Quiz.. : Feds made 40 treaties with the Cherokee,.. how many of the treaty conditions were kept by this govt ?? (tune in this theatre next week for the answer..)!! Richard B. ----- Original Message ----- From: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 12:22 PM Subject: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] In looking for ancestors always check outArkansas, Louisiana and Texas > The mention about the new museum In Fort Smith, AK reminded of something > I > discovered in my research in the past. I found that thousands and > thousands > of Creeks and Cherokees went west prior to the Trail of Tears in the late > 1830s. Very few went initially to Oklahoma because it was claimed by > other > tribes. Cherokees and Upper Creeks often went to Arkansas, sometimes to > Missouri. > Lower Creeks, Alabamas, and Koasati's went to Louisiana, Texas and > Mexico - > perhaps also to the southern tip of Arkansas. Some Cherokees went to > Texas > and then to Mexico. Most Cherokees were chased out of Texas after it > became a > Republic. However, a considerable number of Alabamas, Koasati's and > Lower > Creeks were allowed to stay in Texas because they had fought along side > the > Texans against the Mexicans. > > As I mentioned last week, also look for Friendly "Georgia" Creeks in > Texas. > The Friendly (Hitchiti-speaking) Creeks were promised that they could > keep > their farms in Georgia and South Carolina, but many were either illegally > dispossessed or felt insecure in an anti-Indian political environment. > The > Friendly Creeks carried with them a hybrid culture that was a mixture of > the > Mound-Builders and Scottish frontiersmen. Many also has aspirations of > being > planters or ranchers in Texas. Their descendants tended to blend in with > the > Texans since Creeks are not that different in appearance from Mexican > Mestizos. > > Also, when planning to serve possum for prominent guests or wedding > parties, > be sure and feed the possum cornbread and buttermilk for a couple of > weeks > before dressing them. Parboiling the possum for awhile will get rid of > the > excess fat created by the cornbread and buttermilk. > > Richard T. > > > > **************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your > budget? > Read reviews on AOL Autos. > (http://autos.aol.com/cars-BMW-128-2008/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00050000000017 > ) > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > >> >

Well, the contract was voided because of complications in the agreement. It has not been started as of yet. Expected to begin in Sept., 2008. Possible locations: 3 story building to overlook the Arkansas River. #2. A block or two from Judge Parker's, famous gallows is located. Thanks, Sam ----- Original Message ----- From: "csmoke" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 4:04 PM Subject: Re: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Family stories > When will the Marshall museum be finished? > > Richard B. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Sam Gipson" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 11:12 AM > Subject: Re: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Family stories > > >> Another event has come to Ft. Smith, Arkansas. >> The US Marshall's Museum is being built there. >> Would be a wonderful place to visit and the town also. >> >> Thanks, Sam >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "csmoke" <[email protected]> >> To: <[email protected]> >> Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 5:56 AM >> Subject: Re: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Family stories >> >> >>> Evelyn, >>> Emmett Dalton's book "Beyond the Law" is a self biography of the >>> "gang"... >>> sort of a who / why/ how. He does not mention Emmett Starr that I >>> recall. >>> (Dr.) Emmett Strarr , of course is noted for his book(s) on History of >>> the >>> Cherokee , written about 1914 (?) and later published, The Notes of Dr. >>> Emmett Starr. If you seek out Starr's book on the Cherokees, look for >>> the >>> later republished version "indexed" by Dorothy "Tincup" Mauldin. First >>> published not indexed!! >>> >>> Some of the Daltons (Frank) (& couple others) were U.S. Marshalls from >>> the >>> court in Ft. Smith, AR. There were Starr "Boys" outlaw(s) (& Belle >>> Starr). >>> I think I recall that the outlaw Starrs were half breed Cherokees, but >>> do >>> not take that to the bank :o) There are online court cases for Ft. >>> Smith, >>> AR. I once visited the court there and they have a (reconstucted ??) >>> gallows for hanging. >>> >>> Richard B. >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Evelyn S. Leslie" <[email protected]> >>> To: <[email protected]> >>> Sent: Monday, August 04, 2008 1:29 PM >>> Subject: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Family stories >>> >>> >>>> Richard wrote: << The "skeletons" have really came out of the closet >>>> with >>>> this genealogy business, >>>> I think my relatives just did not know their family very well. I >>>> recently >>>> find in my father's mother's line (Moore) is her aunt was member of >>>> Dalton >>>> Gang , according to Emmett Dalton's book about the hard cases. Emmett >>>> gives >>>> her as Eugenia Moore , .. I have some letters and I think one from >>>> Eugenia >>>> from I.T. to her family (my father's grandmother) here in MO. >>>> I think it is good that we do not (R.I.P.) let them be forgotten.>> >>>> >>>> Richard, that is so true and I think that's what keeps it interesting! >>>> Is >>>> there anything about Emmett Starr in Dalton's book? I ran across >>>> something on some Creek testimony in Okmulgee, OK IT last week and I >>>> keep >>>> wanting to think he was a known western character. Come to think of >>>> it, >>>> I >>>> guess I could just google that name. Anyway, I do agree >>>> wholeheartedly >>>> with you about the skeletons out of the closet. I think because of >>>> internet research and the world seeming to be so much smaller nowadays, >>>> the later generations are not so hung up on proving how prestigious and >>>> important their ancestors were and are accepting the facts, good or >>>> bad, >>>> and this has in turn made us all much more tolerant........at least I >>>> like >>>> to think so :-) >>>> Regards, >>>> Evelyn >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>> without >>>> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >>> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >> > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I will have to check and let you know. It was started in Feb, 08, if I am not mistaken. I will check and see. Thanks, Sam ----- Original Message ----- From: "csmoke" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 4:04 PM Subject: Re: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Family stories > When will the Marshall museum be finished? > > Richard B. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Sam Gipson" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 11:12 AM > Subject: Re: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Family stories > > >> Another event has come to Ft. Smith, Arkansas. >> The US Marshall's Museum is being built there. >> Would be a wonderful place to visit and the town also. >> >> Thanks, Sam >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "csmoke" <[email protected]> >> To: <[email protected]> >> Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 5:56 AM >> Subject: Re: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Family stories >> >> >>> Evelyn, >>> Emmett Dalton's book "Beyond the Law" is a self biography of the >>> "gang"... >>> sort of a who / why/ how. He does not mention Emmett Starr that I >>> recall. >>> (Dr.) Emmett Strarr , of course is noted for his book(s) on History of >>> the >>> Cherokee , written about 1914 (?) and later published, The Notes of Dr. >>> Emmett Starr. If you seek out Starr's book on the Cherokees, look for >>> the >>> later republished version "indexed" by Dorothy "Tincup" Mauldin. First >>> published not indexed!! >>> >>> Some of the Daltons (Frank) (& couple others) were U.S. Marshalls from >>> the >>> court in Ft. Smith, AR. There were Starr "Boys" outlaw(s) (& Belle >>> Starr). >>> I think I recall that the outlaw Starrs were half breed Cherokees, but >>> do >>> not take that to the bank :o) There are online court cases for Ft. >>> Smith, >>> AR. I once visited the court there and they have a (reconstucted ??) >>> gallows for hanging. >>> >>> Richard B. >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Evelyn S. Leslie" <[email protected]> >>> To: <[email protected]> >>> Sent: Monday, August 04, 2008 1:29 PM >>> Subject: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Family stories >>> >>> >>>> Richard wrote: << The "skeletons" have really came out of the closet >>>> with >>>> this genealogy business, >>>> I think my relatives just did not know their family very well. I >>>> recently >>>> find in my father's mother's line (Moore) is her aunt was member of >>>> Dalton >>>> Gang , according to Emmett Dalton's book about the hard cases. Emmett >>>> gives >>>> her as Eugenia Moore , .. I have some letters and I think one from >>>> Eugenia >>>> from I.T. to her family (my father's grandmother) here in MO. >>>> I think it is good that we do not (R.I.P.) let them be forgotten.>> >>>> >>>> Richard, that is so true and I think that's what keeps it interesting! >>>> Is >>>> there anything about Emmett Starr in Dalton's book? I ran across >>>> something on some Creek testimony in Okmulgee, OK IT last week and I >>>> keep >>>> wanting to think he was a known western character. Come to think of >>>> it, >>>> I >>>> guess I could just google that name. Anyway, I do agree >>>> wholeheartedly >>>> with you about the skeletons out of the closet. I think because of >>>> internet research and the world seeming to be so much smaller nowadays, >>>> the later generations are not so hung up on proving how prestigious and >>>> important their ancestors were and are accepting the facts, good or >>>> bad, >>>> and this has in turn made us all much more tolerant........at least I >>>> like >>>> to think so :-) >>>> Regards, >>>> Evelyn >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>> without >>>> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >>> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >> > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

When will the Marshall museum be finished? Richard B. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sam Gipson" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 11:12 AM Subject: Re: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Family stories > Another event has come to Ft. Smith, Arkansas. > The US Marshall's Museum is being built there. > Would be a wonderful place to visit and the town also. > > Thanks, Sam > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "csmoke" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 5:56 AM > Subject: Re: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Family stories > > >> Evelyn, >> Emmett Dalton's book "Beyond the Law" is a self biography of the >> "gang"... >> sort of a who / why/ how. He does not mention Emmett Starr that I >> recall. >> (Dr.) Emmett Strarr , of course is noted for his book(s) on History of >> the >> Cherokee , written about 1914 (?) and later published, The Notes of Dr. >> Emmett Starr. If you seek out Starr's book on the Cherokees, look for >> the >> later republished version "indexed" by Dorothy "Tincup" Mauldin. First >> published not indexed!! >> >> Some of the Daltons (Frank) (& couple others) were U.S. Marshalls from >> the >> court in Ft. Smith, AR. There were Starr "Boys" outlaw(s) (& Belle >> Starr). >> I think I recall that the outlaw Starrs were half breed Cherokees, but do >> not take that to the bank :o) There are online court cases for Ft. >> Smith, >> AR. I once visited the court there and they have a (reconstucted ??) >> gallows for hanging. >> >> Richard B. >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Evelyn S. Leslie" <[email protected]> >> To: <[email protected]> >> Sent: Monday, August 04, 2008 1:29 PM >> Subject: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Family stories >> >> >>> Richard wrote: << The "skeletons" have really came out of the closet >>> with >>> this genealogy business, >>> I think my relatives just did not know their family very well. I >>> recently >>> find in my father's mother's line (Moore) is her aunt was member of >>> Dalton >>> Gang , according to Emmett Dalton's book about the hard cases. Emmett >>> gives >>> her as Eugenia Moore , .. I have some letters and I think one from >>> Eugenia >>> from I.T. to her family (my father's grandmother) here in MO. >>> I think it is good that we do not (R.I.P.) let them be forgotten.>> >>> >>> Richard, that is so true and I think that's what keeps it interesting! >>> Is >>> there anything about Emmett Starr in Dalton's book? I ran across >>> something on some Creek testimony in Okmulgee, OK IT last week and I >>> keep >>> wanting to think he was a known western character. Come to think of it, >>> I >>> guess I could just google that name. Anyway, I do agree wholeheartedly >>> with you about the skeletons out of the closet. I think because of >>> internet research and the world seeming to be so much smaller nowadays, >>> the later generations are not so hung up on proving how prestigious and >>> important their ancestors were and are accepting the facts, good or bad, >>> and this has in turn made us all much more tolerant........at least I >>> like >>> to think so :-) >>> Regards, >>> Evelyn >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >>> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > >

That's interesting. I think Billy Bowlegs was also a son of William Augustus Bowles. There's a little picture of him you can find online if you look (or maybe I have it in a book)....which Billy signed. And his signature? You can't tell if it says Bowlegs or Bowles. And how did he learn to write, except that perhaps his mother taught him? And who taught her? Probably WAB. There weren't any schools around at that time in Western Florida. Looking at the first Billy's times and seasons in history, he was the right age to have been fathered by WAB and was born in the area where WAB was tramping around. There were three Billy Bowlegs, I think....maybe two. I recorded as much genealogical data as I could find on him in the process of working on the Phillips genealogy. In their Poarch Creek applications, the Phillips families claimed descent from Billy Bowlegs. To this date, we have not yet determined how that connection came about. I have heard that Chief Bowl's name is longer than what we have and that it has to do with the bowl that is passed with the black drink in it. His history is an interesting one, for sure. Kathie ----- Original Message ----- From: Robert Page To: [email protected] Cc: Mary Blount Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 3:40 PM Subject: Re: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] In looking for ancestors alwayscheckoutArkansas, Louisiana and Texas I believe Chief Bowl was the son of British William A. Bowles and his first wife that was Cherokee. ----- Original Message ----- From: "csmoke" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 5:29 PM Subject: Re: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] In looking for ancestors always checkoutArkansas, Louisiana and Texas > Richard T., when cooking the Opossom, I guess my ggrandmother forgot to > "parboil" and went straight to the oven. Grease/oil level was half up in > the baking pan, but I think they used to dip their homemade bread in that. > That was one of the few foods I tried and did not acquire a taste for. > (too > much oil..). How do you get those roadkills to eat the buttermilk/etc??? > > In locations for natives,.. remember that about 1817 was a treaty for the > Cherokees (referred to as Old Settlers) to self emigrate to their > Reservation in north central Arkansas. (they stayed there until about > 1830) > when the reservation was dissolved in another treaty and the Old Settlers > went to Ind Territory. 1817 look for "passport" allowing Inds (reds...:o) > to travel. > > Sam Huston , the Texican, was very hooked to the Cherokees, he was known > as > "The Raven" & book title same name , .. in his biography you see much. > (one of my family names chief (John Jolly) , adopted him, but others claim > not the same person. Neither of us can "proove" yes/no , but I have some > paper trial for that!! > > Also, along with your good information, you did not mention 1811 > earthquake > SE Missouri "bootheel" , Cherokee living there with chief "Bowl" , fled to > TX , they considered the ground shake a bad medicine message or something. > Quiz.. : Feds made 40 treaties with the Cherokee,.. how many of the > treaty > conditions were kept by this govt ?? (tune in this theatre next week for > the answer..)!! > > Richard B. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 12:22 PM > Subject: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] In looking for ancestors always check > outArkansas, Louisiana and Texas > > >> The mention about the new museum In Fort Smith, AK reminded of something >> I >> discovered in my research in the past. I found that thousands and >> thousands >> of Creeks and Cherokees went west prior to the Trail of Tears in the >> late >> 1830s. Very few went initially to Oklahoma because it was claimed by >> other >> tribes. Cherokees and Upper Creeks often went to Arkansas, sometimes to >> Missouri. >> Lower Creeks, Alabamas, and Koasati's went to Louisiana, Texas and >> Mexico - >> perhaps also to the southern tip of Arkansas. Some Cherokees went to >> Texas >> and then to Mexico. Most Cherokees were chased out of Texas after it >> became a >> Republic. However, a considerable number of Alabamas, Koasati's and >> Lower >> Creeks were allowed to stay in Texas because they had fought along side >> the >> Texans against the Mexicans. >> >> As I mentioned last week, also look for Friendly "Georgia" Creeks in >> Texas. >> The Friendly (Hitchiti-speaking) Creeks were promised that they could >> keep >> their farms in Georgia and South Carolina, but many were either >> illegally >> dispossessed or felt insecure in an anti-Indian political environment. >> The >> Friendly Creeks carried with them a hybrid culture that was a mixture of >> the >> Mound-Builders and Scottish frontiersmen. Many also has aspirations of >> being >> planters or ranchers in Texas. Their descendants tended to blend in >> with >> the >> Texans since Creeks are not that different in appearance from Mexican >> Mestizos. >> >> Also, when planning to serve possum for prominent guests or wedding >> parties, >> be sure and feed the possum cornbread and buttermilk for a couple of >> weeks >> before dressing them. Parboiling the possum for awhile will get rid of >> the >> excess fat created by the cornbread and buttermilk. >> >> Richard T. >> >> >> >> **************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your >> budget? >> Read reviews on AOL Autos. >> (http://autos.aol.com/cars-BMW-128-2008/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00050000000017 >> ) >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >>> >> > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

>From what I could tell in the books, the Muscogee Creeks went to those areas of eastern Texas that looked like the Georgia and Alabama Piedmont - you know where pine trees grow. Lowland Creeks went farther south along the coast where there were environments like the Gulf Coast. Each branch went to where they would be in familiar ecological environments. Some Creeks also merged with Muskogean tribes in Louisiana. In a message dated 8/5/2008 2:11:59 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [email protected] writes: Richard T, are you pulling our appendages?? ha If you are purposfully feeding said possum the buttermilk and cornbread, which evidently causes fat, and you are parboiling it to get rid of the excess fat, what is the purpose ? Is MOST of the cornbread and buttermilk making better/tastier/more MEAT (a la feeding beef to the Kobe or corn to the U.S. beeves) ?? and just part of it is considered excess fat? Whew ! Cornbread and buttermilk diets get rid of the wild taste in such animals as possums, ground hogs and turtles. Soaking venison and bear meat in buttermilk will also get rid of the gamey taste. Roast possum and ground hog are too greasy for my taste without parboiling first. In the old days, the diets of most Creeks were deficient of fats, so they wanted to consume the fats. Lack of fat is not a problem for most Americans today. **************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your budget? Read reviews on AOL Autos. (http://autos.aol.com/cars-BMW-128-2008/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00050000000017 )

I'm sorry--I thought that the cornbread and buttermilk were causing some of the fat. Gotcha now----thanks. Once a possum came in our garage and ate gobs of bird food which the (dumb) owners had left out, in a plastic bag. The ole possum ate itself to death, and died lying on its back with all four legs pointing at the sky, stomach bulging. My dogs were running in a circle around Ole Pos, barking their heads off !! Didn't eat it.

Ok, thanks ! I apologize to all for the double whammy--something's amiss with my e-mail Reply system, I guess gmw

Richard T, are you pulling our appendages?? ha If you are purposfully feeding said possum the buttermilk and cornbread, which evidently causes fat, and you are parboiling it to get rid of the excess fat, what is the purpose ? Is MOST of the cornbread and buttermilk making better/tastier/more MEAT (a la feeding beef to the Kobe or corn to the U.S. beeves) ?? and just part of it is considered excess fat? Whew ! On a more serious note, can you tell me the general location where the friendly Creeks settled in Texas? (The Alabama-Coushattas are in East Texas, which we've discussed before.) Thanks, as always, Richard T ! gmw

Richard T, are you pulling our appendages?? ha If you are purposfully feeding said possum the buttermilk and cornbread, which evidently causes fat, and you are parboiling it to get rid of the excess fat, what is the purpose ? Is MOST of the cornbread and buttermilk making better/tastier/more MEAT (a la feeding beef to the Kobe or corn to the U.S. beeves) ?? and just part of it is considered excess fat? Whew ! On a more serious note, can you tell me the general location where the friendly Creeks settled in Texas? (The Alabama-Coushattas are in East Texas, which we've discussed before.) Thanks, as always, Richard T ! gmw

http://cache.search.yahoo.net/search/cache?ei=UTF-8&p=Reconstructing+Proto-Muskogean+Language+and+Prehistory&y=Search&fr=yfp-t-501&u=www.albany.edu/anthro/fac/broadwell/flora.pdf&w=reconstructing+proto+muskogean+language+prehistory+%22pre+history%22&d=Ps3nSC72RE5A&icp=1&.intl=us    

The mention about the new museum In Fort Smith, AK reminded of something I discovered in my research in the past. I found that thousands and thousands of Creeks and Cherokees went west prior to the Trail of Tears in the late 1830s. Very few went initially to Oklahoma because it was claimed by other tribes. Cherokees and Upper Creeks often went to Arkansas, sometimes to Missouri. Lower Creeks, Alabamas, and Koasati's went to Louisiana, Texas and Mexico - perhaps also to the southern tip of Arkansas. Some Cherokees went to Texas and then to Mexico. Most Cherokees were chased out of Texas after it became a Republic. However, a considerable number of Alabamas, Koasati's and Lower Creeks were allowed to stay in Texas because they had fought along side the Texans against the Mexicans. As I mentioned last week, also look for Friendly "Georgia" Creeks in Texas. The Friendly (Hitchiti-speaking) Creeks were promised that they could keep their farms in Georgia and South Carolina, but many were either illegally dispossessed or felt insecure in an anti-Indian political environment. The Friendly Creeks carried with them a hybrid culture that was a mixture of the Mound-Builders and Scottish frontiersmen. Many also has aspirations of being planters or ranchers in Texas. Their descendants tended to blend in with the Texans since Creeks are not that different in appearance from Mexican Mestizos. Also, when planning to serve possum for prominent guests or wedding parties, be sure and feed the possum cornbread and buttermilk for a couple of weeks before dressing them. Parboiling the possum for awhile will get rid of the excess fat created by the cornbread and buttermilk. Richard T. **************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your budget? Read reviews on AOL Autos. (http://autos.aol.com/cars-BMW-128-2008/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00050000000017 )

Another event has come to Ft. Smith, Arkansas. The US Marshall's Museum is being built there. Would be a wonderful place to visit and the town also. Thanks, Sam ----- Original Message ----- From: "csmoke" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 5:56 AM Subject: Re: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Family stories > Evelyn, > Emmett Dalton's book "Beyond the Law" is a self biography of the "gang"... > sort of a who / why/ how. He does not mention Emmett Starr that I recall. > (Dr.) Emmett Strarr , of course is noted for his book(s) on History of > the > Cherokee , written about 1914 (?) and later published, The Notes of Dr. > Emmett Starr. If you seek out Starr's book on the Cherokees, look for the > later republished version "indexed" by Dorothy "Tincup" Mauldin. First > published not indexed!! > > Some of the Daltons (Frank) (& couple others) were U.S. Marshalls from the > court in Ft. Smith, AR. There were Starr "Boys" outlaw(s) (& Belle > Starr). > I think I recall that the outlaw Starrs were half breed Cherokees, but do > not take that to the bank :o) There are online court cases for Ft. > Smith, > AR. I once visited the court there and they have a (reconstucted ??) > gallows for hanging. > > Richard B. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Evelyn S. Leslie" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Monday, August 04, 2008 1:29 PM > Subject: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Family stories > > >> Richard wrote: << The "skeletons" have really came out of the closet with >> this genealogy business, >> I think my relatives just did not know their family very well. I >> recently >> find in my father's mother's line (Moore) is her aunt was member of >> Dalton >> Gang , according to Emmett Dalton's book about the hard cases. Emmett >> gives >> her as Eugenia Moore , .. I have some letters and I think one from >> Eugenia >> from I.T. to her family (my father's grandmother) here in MO. >> I think it is good that we do not (R.I.P.) let them be forgotten.>> >> >> Richard, that is so true and I think that's what keeps it interesting! >> Is >> there anything about Emmett Starr in Dalton's book? I ran across >> something on some Creek testimony in Okmulgee, OK IT last week and I keep >> wanting to think he was a known western character. Come to think of it, >> I >> guess I could just google that name. Anyway, I do agree wholeheartedly >> with you about the skeletons out of the closet. I think because of >> internet research and the world seeming to be so much smaller nowadays, >> the later generations are not so hung up on proving how prestigious and >> important their ancestors were and are accepting the facts, good or bad, >> and this has in turn made us all much more tolerant........at least I >> like >> to think so :-) >> Regards, >> Evelyn >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >> > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Now if I had known genealogy was a sport, I'd have trained to be?a genealogy jock YEARS ago....wonder if it is too late. -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] To: [email protected] Sent: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 2:56 pm Subject: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Discerning Richard B. and Richard T. Folks, When asking questions to one of the Richards, please add the B or the T. Richard B. is the genealogy jock from Missouri (with family ties in Oklahoma) Richard T. is the expert on recipes for cooking possum and turtle from Jawja - and is pretty much worthless when it comes to tracing family names. Mvto Richard T. **************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your budget? Read reviews on AOL Autos. (http://autos.aol.com/cars-BMW-128-2008/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00050000000017 ) ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Folks, When asking questions to one of the Richards, please add the B or the T. Richard B. is the genealogy jock from Missouri (with family ties in Oklahoma) Richard T. is the expert on recipes for cooking possum and turtle from Jawja - and is pretty much worthless when it comes to tracing family names. Mvto Richard T. **************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your budget? Read reviews on AOL Autos. (http://autos.aol.com/cars-BMW-128-2008/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00050000000017 )

Well, shoot. I just googled Emmett Starr and answered my own question. I don't do a lot of Cherokee research but I knew there was a reason the name was familiar. Senior moment. Evelyn

Richard wrote: << The "skeletons" have really came out of the closet with this genealogy business, I think my relatives just did not know their family very well. I recently find in my father's mother's line (Moore) is her aunt was member of Dalton Gang , according to Emmett Dalton's book about the hard cases. Emmett gives her as Eugenia Moore , .. I have some letters and I think one from Eugenia from I.T. to her family (my father's grandmother) here in MO. I think it is good that we do not (R.I.P.) let them be forgotten.>> Richard, that is so true and I think that's what keeps it interesting! Is there anything about Emmett Starr in Dalton's book? I ran across something on some Creek testimony in Okmulgee, OK IT last week and I keep wanting to think he was a known western character. Come to think of it, I guess I could just google that name. Anyway, I do agree wholeheartedly with you about the skeletons out of the closet. I think because of internet research and the world seeming to be so much smaller nowadays, the later generations are not so hung up on proving how prestigious and important their ancestors were and are accepting the facts, good or bad, and this has in turn made us all much more tolerant........at least I like to think so :-) Regards, Evelyn