Thank you for the information Richard. I will check the Baker Rolls. Think I have already done that. Tks, Sam Arkansas ----- Original Message ----- From: "csmoke" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 9:10 PM Subject: Re: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Need help with a mystery > Yes, > early decades of 1800 to 1836 , Cherokees were in the southeast. When > this > govt removed about 16,000 to Oklahoma Territory ( about 1/4 of that number > died on the trail.. and of course did not arrive.) > > During your time slot.... 1817 to about 1828 , there were Cherokees > resettling to north central Arkansas (reservation land..) . And , just > prior to removal in 1835/36/37 , about 1100 or so in the southeast > "escaped > to the hills" rather than be removed. These 1100 are the Eastern > Cherokees > and many family names will later show up on their roll .. the Baker Roll. > > Richard B. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "CheeryFats" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 7:06 PM > Subject: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Need help with a mystery > > >> In 1824 in Early County, GA, Elizabeth Boles married Abraham Warren. >> Abraham is a ggggguncle of mine. Just a few months ago I met, over >> the internet, a direct descendant of Elizabeth and Abraham (and >> several other folks, from whom I descend too). My new-found cousin >> wanted to know if I had any info on Elizabeth, who was American >> Indian according to family lore. I didn't even know her last name, >> so my new-found cousin was way ahead of me. And that is how I have >> become interested in these Boles. >> >> Elizabeth and Abraham moved to Coffee County, AL and spent several >> decades there, then followed their children to Henderson County, TX. >> The last time I can find them in the census is in 1870 in Athens, >> Henderson County, TX., though in 1880 Elizabeth (then a widow) was >> living with their son James. >> >> There were other Boles in Coffee County, AL during those early years, >> but there were many more in Henderson County, TX, and they were >> living near (because they were related through marriages) some >> Cadenheads. >> >> I figured that the Boles in Early County GA, Coffee County AL and >> Henderson County TX were most likely Creeks. Indeed, an early (no >> pun intended) brief history of Early County, GA stated that: >> >> "Unlike the other counties, it [Early] had within its borders a few >> Indian towns, where some small bodies of "Creeks" had their homes." >> http://genforum.genealogy.com/sheffield/messages/1936.html >> >> As I continued searching, I came across information that the >> Henderson County TX Boles, along with the Cadenheads who were their >> relatives and neighbors, were Cherokees. Data I have seen over the >> internet (not the actual documents) includes this example: >> >> "BOLES/CADENHEAD APPLICATION FOR MEMBERSHIP, CHEROKEE NATION 1896 >> All persons named in this application are members of one large >> extended family, related by blood and marriage. This information was >> received from the National Archives in Fort Worth, Texas. It >> consisted of 42 legal size photocopied pages of documents relating to >> the applications and appeal of denied citizenship. Denial was based >> on the fact that James Boles' name was not on one of the official >> Cherokee Census rolls taken in 1835, 1848, 1851 or 1852 and that >> James Boles never resided in Indian Territory. All persons named in >> this are all members of one extended family and the report proves >> thier lineage and relationship to each other." >> >> This application contained numerous statements from witnesses that >> the Boles and Cadenheads involved were indeed Cherokee. >> >> Now back to Elizabeth Boles who married my Abraham Warren. I have >> gotten no further in determining her ancestry, let alone whether she >> was related to the Boles who were in Henderson County, TX, though >> there is a hint or two that she may have been. What I would >> appreciate knowing from any of you is whether there is any record of >> the names of the Creek families who supposedly were in Early County >> GA in the first few decades of 1800. And, while this seems far- >> fetched to me, do any of you know if any Cherokees were there at that >> time? >> >> Many thanks. >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >> > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Carol, Loves fried sweet potatoes. Tks, Sam ----- Original Message ----- From: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 9:32 PM Subject: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Fried Sweet Potatos are a traditional Creek food > Hey Richard B. > > There is a Native Sweet Potato in the Southeast that was eaten by the > Creeks. That is why there was a "Potato Clan." It was either baked in > coals or > fried in hickory nut oil. The indigenous Sweet Potato like its South > American > cousin (which is cultivated now) was a member of the Morning Glory > family. > The flowers and leafs are almost identical to a Morning Glory, but form a > bush > shape like a bean plant. The Southeastern Sweet Potato only has one > potato > per plant, whereas the South American cultivated Sweet Potato has > multiple > potato. > > Richard T. > > > > **************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your > budget? > Read reviews on AOL Autos. > (http://autos.aol.com/cars-Volkswagen-Jetta-2009/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00030000000007 > ) > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

The thought of home made fried sweet potato pie makes me salivate. S At 08:21 AM 8/17/2008, you wrote: >Good Morning again! > >My Creek grandmother really was a master fried pie maker. By the 1970s she >was making over $7000 a year selling home-made dried fruit pies at my >grandfather's general store. That is the equivalent of about $30,000 >a year today. >All of us cousins would go to stay with my grandparents in >the summer to help >pick apples, peaches and pears. We would cut and dry the fruit on >corrugated steel panels in back of the house. > >Now, in regard to tracing back Upper Creek ancestors, who always said they >were Cherokee, but looked very Upper Creek. Upper Creeks look like >eagles, by >the way. Hitchiti's look like Chief Tomochichi. > >First of all, I have found proof that Muskogean villages in Western North >Carolina and Eastern Tennessee split into factions when the >Cherokees arrived >on the scene in the early 1700s. Traditionalists and the elite often >immigrated to Alabama and set up towns with the same name. Those >who were "lower >down the totem pole" tended to stay put and join the Cherokee Alliance, beca >use the Cherokees had a more egalitarian culture at that time. They >were a new >hybrid ethnic group without a hereditary leadership once their >Kitani priests >were assasinated. > >When the Cherokees moved down into NW Georgia at the close of the American >Revolution, they did not displace existing Abikara & Kusa Creek villages >located in the vicinity of Rome, Cartersville, LaFayatte, Cedartown and >Tallapoosa, GA. Oceola was born in an Upper Creek town >near Tallapoosa. In fact, the >Abikara Creeks continued to be allies of the Chickamauga Cherokees in the >bloody war that continued with the Tennessee Militia until 1793. >Chickamauga was >originally a Muskogean village. It was the Abikara Creeks who attacked >Nashville during this war. Andy Jackson was involved in the defense of Fort >Davidson and hated Upper Creeks ever afterward. The Abikara were >based in the >Muscle Shoals, AL area, which was then part of Georgia. The >Cherokee word for >Creek Indian today is Kusa-agi (Kusa-agi) They use a different word for >Muskogees. In other words, from the late Revolutionary War period >forward, the >Upper Creeks were allies of the Cherokees. > >An interesting fact is that I can find no record of Chickamauga Cherokees or >Abikara Creeks attacking Georgia settlements, even though the Chickamauga >villages were located in Georgia. Abikara Creeks were a hybrid ethnic group >themselves, composed of the remnants of various Muskogean towns in Tennessee >that included true Creeks, Koasati, Alabama, Chickasaw and Yuchi >elements. That >is why their war was entirely with the Tennessee, not with the Georgia. The >Abikara claimed Tennessee as their traditional motherland. > >By the 1830s, at least 3000 Upper Creeks were living in the Georgia >Cherokee Nation. The US Army built a fort in Rome, GA specifically >to try to stem >the tide of Alabama Creeks fleeing into the Cherokee Nation after >the Red Stick >War. The Hitchiti-speaking Georgia Creeks generally wanted nothing to do >with the Cherokees and went their own way. Distinct Abikara Creek villages >still stood in the Cherokee Nation until the eve of the >actual Trail of Tears. >Most Abikara and Kusa Creeks were not listed as Cherokee citizens and >therefore, were not on the soldiers pickup list. Some cast their >fate with the >Cherokees and their descendants are now enrolled as Oklahoma >Cherokees. Some >fled back into Alabama or to regions of Georgia and South Carolina >occupied by >Friendly Creek state citizens. Many fled into the rugged mountains of NW >Georgia (where the alleged Bigfoot body was found!) Their >descendants never left >the region. Until recently, they would tell people they were Cherokees, >because Creeks have a reputation for not taking guff off of anybody >(who? moi?) > More recently some Upper Creek families have come out of the closet and >admitted that they are actually bloodthirsty Creeks rather than nice, >submissive Cherokees. LOL > >So, if you have an ancestor who was living in Murray, Fannin, Gilmer, >Pickens, Union or Gordon Counties in Georgia, or Polk County >in Tennessee, who >look Upper Creek, but at times told people they >were Cherokees, the chances >are that their ancestors were actually Upper Creek refugees from >the Cherokee >Trail of Tears, who originally hid out in the Cohutta Mountains. > >Richard T. > > > > > >**************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your budget? >Read reviews on AOL Autos. >(http://autos.aol.com/cars-Volkswagen-Jetta-2009/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00030000000007 >) > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >[email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' >without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > >-- >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG. >Version: 7.5.526 / Virus Database: 270.6.4/1616 - Release Date: >8/16/2008 5:12 PM -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.526 / Virus Database: 270.6.4/1616 - Release Date: 8/16/2008 5:12 PM

Recently , I heard of making sweet potato "french fries". These were cooked by a white princess for a Cherokee husband. Princess is not the first or last name in this case...:o) Richard B. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Sokol" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 8:33 PM Subject: Re: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Serious comment for a change - if you are looking for Upper Creek ancestors > The thought of home made fried sweet potato pie makes me salivate. > > S > > > > > > At 08:21 AM 8/17/2008, you wrote: > >>Good Morning again! >> >>My Creek grandmother really was a master fried pie maker. By the 1970s >>she >>was making over $7000 a year selling home-made dried fruit pies at my >>grandfather's general store. That is the equivalent of about $30,000 >>a year today. >>All of us cousins would go to stay with my grandparents in >>the summer to help >>pick apples, peaches and pears. We would cut and dry the fruit on >>corrugated steel panels in back of the house. >> >>Now, in regard to tracing back Upper Creek ancestors, who always said they >>were Cherokee, but looked very Upper Creek. Upper Creeks look like >>eagles, by >>the way. Hitchiti's look like Chief Tomochichi. >> >>First of all, I have found proof that Muskogean villages in Western >>North >>Carolina and Eastern Tennessee split into factions when the >>Cherokees arrived >>on the scene in the early 1700s. Traditionalists and the elite often >>immigrated to Alabama and set up towns with the same name. Those >>who were "lower >>down the totem pole" tended to stay put and join the Cherokee Alliance, >>beca >>use the Cherokees had a more egalitarian culture at that time. They >>were a new >>hybrid ethnic group without a hereditary leadership once their >>Kitani priests >>were assasinated. >> >>When the Cherokees moved down into NW Georgia at the close of the American >>Revolution, they did not displace existing Abikara & Kusa Creek villages >>located in the vicinity of Rome, Cartersville, LaFayatte, Cedartown and >>Tallapoosa, GA. Oceola was born in an Upper Creek town >>near Tallapoosa. In fact, the >>Abikara Creeks continued to be allies of the Chickamauga Cherokees in the >>bloody war that continued with the Tennessee Militia until 1793. >>Chickamauga was >>originally a Muskogean village. It was the Abikara Creeks who attacked >>Nashville during this war. Andy Jackson was involved in the defense of >>Fort >>Davidson and hated Upper Creeks ever afterward. The Abikara were >>based in the >>Muscle Shoals, AL area, which was then part of Georgia. The >>Cherokee word for >>Creek Indian today is Kusa-agi (Kusa-agi) They use a different word for >>Muskogees. In other words, from the late Revolutionary War period >>forward, the >>Upper Creeks were allies of the Cherokees. >> >>An interesting fact is that I can find no record of Chickamauga Cherokees >>or >>Abikara Creeks attacking Georgia settlements, even though the Chickamauga >>villages were located in Georgia. Abikara Creeks were a hybrid ethnic >>group >>themselves, composed of the remnants of various Muskogean towns in >>Tennessee >>that included true Creeks, Koasati, Alabama, Chickasaw and Yuchi >>elements. That >>is why their war was entirely with the Tennessee, not with the Georgia. >>The >>Abikara claimed Tennessee as their traditional motherland. >> >>By the 1830s, at least 3000 Upper Creeks were living in the Georgia >>Cherokee Nation. The US Army built a fort in Rome, GA specifically >>to try to stem >>the tide of Alabama Creeks fleeing into the Cherokee Nation after >>the Red Stick >>War. The Hitchiti-speaking Georgia Creeks generally wanted nothing to do >>with the Cherokees and went their own way. Distinct Abikara Creek >>villages >>still stood in the Cherokee Nation until the eve of the >>actual Trail of Tears. >>Most Abikara and Kusa Creeks were not listed as Cherokee citizens and >>therefore, were not on the soldiers pickup list. Some cast their >>fate with the >>Cherokees and their descendants are now enrolled as Oklahoma >>Cherokees. Some >>fled back into Alabama or to regions of Georgia and South Carolina >>occupied by >>Friendly Creek state citizens. Many fled into the rugged mountains of NW >>Georgia (where the alleged Bigfoot body was found!) Their >>descendants never left >>the region. Until recently, they would tell people they were Cherokees, >>because Creeks have a reputation for not taking guff off of anybody >>(who? moi?) >> More recently some Upper Creek families have come out of the closet >> and >>admitted that they are actually bloodthirsty Creeks rather than nice, >>submissive Cherokees. LOL >> >>So, if you have an ancestor who was living in Murray, Fannin, Gilmer, >>Pickens, Union or Gordon Counties in Georgia, or Polk County >>in Tennessee, who >>look Upper Creek, but at times told people they >>were Cherokees, the chances >>are that their ancestors were actually Upper Creek refugees from >>the Cherokee >>Trail of Tears, who originally hid out in the Cohutta Mountains. >> >>Richard T. >> >> >> >> >> >>**************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your >>budget? >>Read reviews on AOL Autos. >>(http://autos.aol.com/cars-Volkswagen-Jetta-2009/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00030000000007 >>) >> >>------------------------------- >>To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>[email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' >>without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >>-- >>No virus found in this incoming message. >>Checked by AVG. >>Version: 7.5.526 / Virus Database: 270.6.4/1616 - Release Date: >>8/16/2008 5:12 PM > > > -- > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG. > Version: 7.5.526 / Virus Database: 270.6.4/1616 - Release Date: 8/16/2008 > 5:12 PM > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > >

Yes, I got that. I have also encountered the King last name in Cherokee families listed in Emmett Starr's book. Richard B. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Judy White" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 8:18 PM Subject: Re: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Indian Princess > You missunderstand what I wrote, I was not saying there was royality, I am > saying there were Surnames King, Queen, Prince and Princess. Why couldn't > someone say my grandmother was a Creek Princess, just like I would say my > grandmother was a Creek Wallis for example. > > Judy > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 5:31 PM, <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Judy, >> >> There was no such thing as hereditary royalty among the Creeks or the >> Cherokees. Mikkos were elected on the basis of their proven leadership >> skills. >> Their daughters might have been more prestigious and affluent brides >> than >> others, but they had no special title of nobility, >> >> Richard T. >> >> >> >> **************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your >> budget? >> Read reviews on AOL Autos. >> ( >> http://autos.aol.com/cars-Volkswagen-Jetta-2009/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00030000000007) >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > >

Yes, early decades of 1800 to 1836 , Cherokees were in the southeast. When this govt removed about 16,000 to Oklahoma Territory ( about 1/4 of that number died on the trail.. and of course did not arrive.) During your time slot.... 1817 to about 1828 , there were Cherokees resettling to north central Arkansas (reservation land..) . And , just prior to removal in 1835/36/37 , about 1100 or so in the southeast "escaped to the hills" rather than be removed. These 1100 are the Eastern Cherokees and many family names will later show up on their roll .. the Baker Roll. Richard B. ----- Original Message ----- From: "CheeryFats" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 7:06 PM Subject: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Need help with a mystery > In 1824 in Early County, GA, Elizabeth Boles married Abraham Warren. > Abraham is a ggggguncle of mine. Just a few months ago I met, over > the internet, a direct descendant of Elizabeth and Abraham (and > several other folks, from whom I descend too). My new-found cousin > wanted to know if I had any info on Elizabeth, who was American > Indian according to family lore. I didn't even know her last name, > so my new-found cousin was way ahead of me. And that is how I have > become interested in these Boles. > > Elizabeth and Abraham moved to Coffee County, AL and spent several > decades there, then followed their children to Henderson County, TX. > The last time I can find them in the census is in 1870 in Athens, > Henderson County, TX., though in 1880 Elizabeth (then a widow) was > living with their son James. > > There were other Boles in Coffee County, AL during those early years, > but there were many more in Henderson County, TX, and they were > living near (because they were related through marriages) some > Cadenheads. > > I figured that the Boles in Early County GA, Coffee County AL and > Henderson County TX were most likely Creeks. Indeed, an early (no > pun intended) brief history of Early County, GA stated that: > > "Unlike the other counties, it [Early] had within its borders a few > Indian towns, where some small bodies of "Creeks" had their homes." > http://genforum.genealogy.com/sheffield/messages/1936.html > > As I continued searching, I came across information that the > Henderson County TX Boles, along with the Cadenheads who were their > relatives and neighbors, were Cherokees. Data I have seen over the > internet (not the actual documents) includes this example: > > "BOLES/CADENHEAD APPLICATION FOR MEMBERSHIP, CHEROKEE NATION 1896 > All persons named in this application are members of one large > extended family, related by blood and marriage. This information was > received from the National Archives in Fort Worth, Texas. It > consisted of 42 legal size photocopied pages of documents relating to > the applications and appeal of denied citizenship. Denial was based > on the fact that James Boles' name was not on one of the official > Cherokee Census rolls taken in 1835, 1848, 1851 or 1852 and that > James Boles never resided in Indian Territory. All persons named in > this are all members of one extended family and the report proves > thier lineage and relationship to each other." > > This application contained numerous statements from witnesses that > the Boles and Cadenheads involved were indeed Cherokee. > > Now back to Elizabeth Boles who married my Abraham Warren. I have > gotten no further in determining her ancestry, let alone whether she > was related to the Boles who were in Henderson County, TX, though > there is a hint or two that she may have been. What I would > appreciate knowing from any of you is whether there is any record of > the names of the Creek families who supposedly were in Early County > GA in the first few decades of 1800. And, while this seems far- > fetched to me, do any of you know if any Cherokees were there at that > time? > > Many thanks. > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > >

This could explain some of the occurrences. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Judy White" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 8:18 PM Subject: Re: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Indian Princess > You missunderstand what I wrote, I was not saying there was royality, I am > saying there were Surnames King, Queen, Prince and Princess. Why couldn't > someone say my grandmother was a Creek Princess, just like I would say my > grandmother was a Creek Wallis for example. > > Judy > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 5:31 PM, <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Judy, >> >> There was no such thing as hereditary royalty among the Creeks or the >> Cherokees. Mikkos were elected on the basis of their proven leadership >> skills. >> Their daughters might have been more prestigious and affluent brides >> than >> others, but they had no special title of nobility, >> >> Richard T. >> >> >> >> **************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your >> budget? >> Read reviews on AOL Autos. >> ( >> http://autos.aol.com/cars-Volkswagen-Jetta-2009/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00030000000007) >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.6.4/1617 - Release Date: 8/17/2008 > 12:58 PM > > >

My grandfather "appearance" eagle face... he looked like the man on the back side of the old buffalo nickel, but he did not wear his hair long. He had black hair, much darker face, and short small person like some of the Euchee I have seen. But, he was much darker than any of the modern Euchee I have seen. I have seen Cheyenne as dark and some cuzns claimed we are, but some cuzns say Black Dutch. Yuck! Nuts!!! Richard B. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tim Timothy" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 6:19 PM Subject: Re: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Serious comment for a change - if youarelookingfor Upper Creek ancestors > OK....I'm bite....Upper Creeks look like >> eagles, by >> the way. Hitchiti's look like Chief Tomochichi......what does a person >> look like other than a hooked nose and what does Chief Tomochichi look >> like??? Someone have pictures to illustrate? TT > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "csmoke" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 6:39 PM > Subject: Re: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Serious comment for a change - if you > arelookingfor Upper Creek ancestors > > >>I think maybe you convince me my ancestors were upper Creek, my >>grandfather >> had the eagle face. My aunt would not tell me why , but when "someone" >> heard I was searching, I was told to inquire about the Chicamaugua >> Cherokee. >> Have no paper, but still think the "mysterious" gave correct information. >> >> Richard B. >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: <[email protected]> >> To: <[email protected]> >> Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 7:21 AM >> Subject: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Serious comment for a change - if you are >> lookingfor Upper Creek ancestors >> >> >>> Good Morning again! >>> >>> My Creek grandmother really was a master fried pie maker. By the 1970s >>> she >>> was making over $7000 a year selling home-made dried fruit pies at my >>> grandfather's general store. That is the equivalent of about $30,000 a >>> year today. >>> All of us cousins would go to stay with my grandparents in the summer >>> to >>> help >>> pick apples, peaches and pears. We would cut and dry the fruit on >>> corrugated steel panels in back of the house. >>> >>> Now, in regard to tracing back Upper Creek ancestors, who always said >>> they >>> were Cherokee, but looked very Upper Creek. Upper Creeks look like >>> eagles, by >>> the way. Hitchiti's look like Chief Tomochichi. >>> >>> First of all, I have found proof that Muskogean villages in Western >>> North >>> Carolina and Eastern Tennessee split into factions when the Cherokees >>> arrived >>> on the scene in the early 1700s. Traditionalists and the elite often >>> immigrated to Alabama and set up towns with the same name. Those who >>> were "lower >>> down the totem pole" tended to stay put and join the Cherokee Alliance, >>> beca >>> use the Cherokees had a more egalitarian culture at that time. They >>> were >>> a new >>> hybrid ethnic group without a hereditary leadership once their Kitani >>> priests >>> were assasinated. >>> >>> When the Cherokees moved down into NW Georgia at the close of the >>> American >>> Revolution, they did not displace existing Abikara & Kusa Creek >>> villages >>> located in the vicinity of Rome, Cartersville, LaFayatte, Cedartown and >>> Tallapoosa, GA. Oceola was born in an Upper Creek town near Tallapoosa. >>> In fact, the >>> Abikara Creeks continued to be allies of the Chickamauga Cherokees in >>> the >>> bloody war that continued with the Tennessee Militia until 1793. >>> Chickamauga was >>> originally a Muskogean village. It was the Abikara Creeks who attacked >>> Nashville during this war. Andy Jackson was involved in the defense of >>> Fort >>> Davidson and hated Upper Creeks ever afterward. The Abikara were based >>> in the >>> Muscle Shoals, AL area, which was then part of Georgia. The Cherokee >>> word for >>> Creek Indian today is Kusa-agi (Kusa-agi) They use a different word >>> for >>> Muskogees. In other words, from the late Revolutionary War period >>> forward, the >>> Upper Creeks were allies of the Cherokees. >>> >>> An interesting fact is that I can find no record of Chickamauga >>> Cherokees >>> or >>> Abikara Creeks attacking Georgia settlements, even though the >>> Chickamauga >>> villages were located in Georgia. Abikara Creeks were a hybrid ethnic >>> group >>> themselves, composed of the remnants of various Muskogean towns in >>> Tennessee >>> that included true Creeks, Koasati, Alabama, Chickasaw and Yuchi >>> elements. >>> That >>> is why their war was entirely with the Tennessee, not with the Georgia. >>> The >>> Abikara claimed Tennessee as their traditional motherland. >>> >>> By the 1830s, at least 3000 Upper Creeks were living in the Georgia >>> Cherokee Nation. The US Army built a fort in Rome, GA specifically to >>> try >>> to stem >>> the tide of Alabama Creeks fleeing into the Cherokee Nation after the >>> Red >>> Stick >>> War. The Hitchiti-speaking Georgia Creeks generally wanted nothing to >>> do >>> with the Cherokees and went their own way. Distinct Abikara Creek >>> villages >>> still stood in the Cherokee Nation until the eve of the actual Trail of >>> Tears. >>> Most Abikara and Kusa Creeks were not listed as Cherokee citizens and >>> therefore, were not on the soldiers pickup list. Some cast their fate >>> with the >>> Cherokees and their descendants are now enrolled as Oklahoma Cherokees. >>> Some >>> fled back into Alabama or to regions of Georgia and South Carolina >>> occupied by >>> Friendly Creek state citizens. Many fled into the rugged mountains of >>> NW >>> Georgia (where the alleged Bigfoot body was found!) Their descendants >>> never left >>> the region. Until recently, they would tell people they were >>> Cherokees, >>> because Creeks have a reputation for not taking guff off of anybody >>> (who? >>> moi?) >>> More recently some Upper Creek families have come out of the closet >>> and >>> admitted that they are actually bloodthirsty Creeks rather than nice, >>> submissive Cherokees. LOL >>> >>> So, if you have an ancestor who was living in Murray, Fannin, Gilmer, >>> Pickens, Union or Gordon Counties in Georgia, or Polk County in >>> Tennessee, who >>> look Upper Creek, but at times told people they were Cherokees, the >>> chances >>> are that their ancestors were actually Upper Creek refugees from the >>> Cherokee >>> Trail of Tears, who originally hid out in the Cohutta Mountains. >>> >>> Richard T. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> **************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your >>> budget? >>> Read reviews on AOL Autos. >>> (http://autos.aol.com/cars-Volkswagen-Jetta-2009/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00030000000007 >>> ) >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >>> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > >

Judy, There was no such thing as hereditary royalty among the Creeks or the Cherokees. Mikkos were elected on the basis of their proven leadership skills. Their daughters might have been more prestigious and affluent brides than others, but they had no special title of nobility, Richard T. **************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your budget? Read reviews on AOL Autos. (http://autos.aol.com/cars-Volkswagen-Jetta-2009/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00030000000007 )

We have discussed before that Friendly Creeks in Georgia often left the state for Alabama because Georgia passed a law forbidding Indians from owning real estate. I also mentioned about a week ago that I had found evidence that many, many mixed heritage Friendly Creeks ended up in Texas, because the Creeks had helped the Texans in the War of Texas Independence, and therefore were welcomed into the state. There was not a whole lot of difference in appearance between a Mexico mestizo and a mixed blood Creek. Richard T. **************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your budget? Read reviews on AOL Autos. (http://autos.aol.com/cars-Volkswagen-Jetta-2009/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00030000000007 )

For those interested in the typical Hitchiti appearance of Chief Tomochichi, just google his name on a web search. He was a famous leader of the Coastal Creeks when Georgia was founded. Real cool guy. **************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your budget? Read reviews on AOL Autos. (http://autos.aol.com/cars-Volkswagen-Jetta-2009/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00030000000007 )

Many many thanks! I will certainly check them. On Aug 17, 2008, at 7:55 PM, Sam Gipson wrote: > Thank you for the information Richard. > I will check the Baker Rolls. Think I have > already done that. > > Tks, Sam Arkansas > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "csmoke" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 9:10 PM > Subject: Re: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Need help with a mystery > > >> Yes, >> early decades of 1800 to 1836 , Cherokees were in the southeast. >> When >> this >> govt removed about 16,000 to Oklahoma Territory ( about 1/4 of >> that number >> died on the trail.. and of course did not arrive.) >> >> During your time slot.... 1817 to about 1828 , there were Cherokees >> resettling to north central Arkansas (reservation land..) . >> And , just >> prior to removal in 1835/36/37 , about 1100 or so in the southeast >> "escaped >> to the hills" rather than be removed. These 1100 are the Eastern >> Cherokees >> and many family names will later show up on their roll .. the >> Baker Roll. >> >> Richard B. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "CheeryFats" <[email protected]> >> To: <[email protected]> >> Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 7:06 PM >> Subject: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Need help with a mystery >> >> >>> In 1824 in Early County, GA, Elizabeth Boles married Abraham Warren. >>> Abraham is a ggggguncle of mine. Just a few months ago I met, over >>> the internet, a direct descendant of Elizabeth and Abraham (and >>> several other folks, from whom I descend too). My new-found cousin >>> wanted to know if I had any info on Elizabeth, who was American >>> Indian according to family lore. I didn't even know her last name, >>> so my new-found cousin was way ahead of me. And that is how I have >>> become interested in these Boles. >>> >>> Elizabeth and Abraham moved to Coffee County, AL and spent several >>> decades there, then followed their children to Henderson County, TX. >>> The last time I can find them in the census is in 1870 in Athens, >>> Henderson County, TX., though in 1880 Elizabeth (then a widow) was >>> living with their son James. >>> >>> There were other Boles in Coffee County, AL during those early >>> years, >>> but there were many more in Henderson County, TX, and they were >>> living near (because they were related through marriages) some >>> Cadenheads. >>> >>> I figured that the Boles in Early County GA, Coffee County AL and >>> Henderson County TX were most likely Creeks. Indeed, an early (no >>> pun intended) brief history of Early County, GA stated that: >>> >>> "Unlike the other counties, it [Early] had within its borders a few >>> Indian towns, where some small bodies of "Creeks" had their homes." >>> http://genforum.genealogy.com/sheffield/messages/1936.html >>> >>> As I continued searching, I came across information that the >>> Henderson County TX Boles, along with the Cadenheads who were their >>> relatives and neighbors, were Cherokees. Data I have seen over the >>> internet (not the actual documents) includes this example: >>> >>> "BOLES/CADENHEAD APPLICATION FOR MEMBERSHIP, CHEROKEE NATION 1896 >>> All persons named in this application are members of one large >>> extended family, related by blood and marriage. This information >>> was >>> received from the National Archives in Fort Worth, Texas. It >>> consisted of 42 legal size photocopied pages of documents >>> relating to >>> the applications and appeal of denied citizenship. Denial was based >>> on the fact that James Boles' name was not on one of the official >>> Cherokee Census rolls taken in 1835, 1848, 1851 or 1852 and that >>> James Boles never resided in Indian Territory. All persons named in >>> this are all members of one extended family and the report proves >>> thier lineage and relationship to each other." >>> >>> This application contained numerous statements from witnesses that >>> the Boles and Cadenheads involved were indeed Cherokee. >>> >>> Now back to Elizabeth Boles who married my Abraham Warren. I have >>> gotten no further in determining her ancestry, let alone whether she >>> was related to the Boles who were in Henderson County, TX, though >>> there is a hint or two that she may have been. What I would >>> appreciate knowing from any of you is whether there is any >>> record of >>> the names of the Creek families who supposedly were in Early County >>> GA in the first few decades of 1800. And, while this seems far- >>> fetched to me, do any of you know if any Cherokees were there at >>> that >>> time? >>> >>> Many thanks. >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' >>> without >>> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without >> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to CREEK- > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

In a message dated 7/30/2008 3:04:47 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [email protected] writes: Some of the McGhee's changed there names back to the grandmothers maiden name and did not tell anyone. That name was Martin. Check my Tree out. I have a lot on The Seminoles,Yutsi,Creek,and Musckogee Creek. There are a lot of pics on there too. Make yourself at home. Could you send the weblink? Would love to see the pictures. EagleLittle **************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your budget? Read reviews on AOL Autos. (http://autos.aol.com/cars-Volkswagen-Jetta-2009/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00030000000007 )

unsubscribe. **************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your budget? Read reviews on AOL Autos. (http://autos.aol.com/cars-Volkswagen-Jetta-2009/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00030000000007 )

OK....I'm bite....Upper Creeks look like > eagles, by > the way. Hitchiti's look like Chief Tomochichi......what does a person > look like other than a hooked nose and what does Chief Tomochichi look > like??? Someone have pictures to illustrate? TT ----- Original Message ----- From: "csmoke" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 6:39 PM Subject: Re: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Serious comment for a change - if you arelookingfor Upper Creek ancestors >I think maybe you convince me my ancestors were upper Creek, my grandfather > had the eagle face. My aunt would not tell me why , but when "someone" > heard I was searching, I was told to inquire about the Chicamaugua > Cherokee. > Have no paper, but still think the "mysterious" gave correct information. > > Richard B. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 7:21 AM > Subject: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Serious comment for a change - if you are > lookingfor Upper Creek ancestors > > >> Good Morning again! >> >> My Creek grandmother really was a master fried pie maker. By the 1970s >> she >> was making over $7000 a year selling home-made dried fruit pies at my >> grandfather's general store. That is the equivalent of about $30,000 a >> year today. >> All of us cousins would go to stay with my grandparents in the summer to >> help >> pick apples, peaches and pears. We would cut and dry the fruit on >> corrugated steel panels in back of the house. >> >> Now, in regard to tracing back Upper Creek ancestors, who always said >> they >> were Cherokee, but looked very Upper Creek. Upper Creeks look like >> eagles, by >> the way. Hitchiti's look like Chief Tomochichi. >> >> First of all, I have found proof that Muskogean villages in Western >> North >> Carolina and Eastern Tennessee split into factions when the Cherokees >> arrived >> on the scene in the early 1700s. Traditionalists and the elite often >> immigrated to Alabama and set up towns with the same name. Those who >> were "lower >> down the totem pole" tended to stay put and join the Cherokee Alliance, >> beca >> use the Cherokees had a more egalitarian culture at that time. They were >> a new >> hybrid ethnic group without a hereditary leadership once their Kitani >> priests >> were assasinated. >> >> When the Cherokees moved down into NW Georgia at the close of the >> American >> Revolution, they did not displace existing Abikara & Kusa Creek villages >> located in the vicinity of Rome, Cartersville, LaFayatte, Cedartown and >> Tallapoosa, GA. Oceola was born in an Upper Creek town near Tallapoosa. >> In fact, the >> Abikara Creeks continued to be allies of the Chickamauga Cherokees in >> the >> bloody war that continued with the Tennessee Militia until 1793. >> Chickamauga was >> originally a Muskogean village. It was the Abikara Creeks who attacked >> Nashville during this war. Andy Jackson was involved in the defense of >> Fort >> Davidson and hated Upper Creeks ever afterward. The Abikara were based >> in the >> Muscle Shoals, AL area, which was then part of Georgia. The Cherokee >> word for >> Creek Indian today is Kusa-agi (Kusa-agi) They use a different word for >> Muskogees. In other words, from the late Revolutionary War period >> forward, the >> Upper Creeks were allies of the Cherokees. >> >> An interesting fact is that I can find no record of Chickamauga Cherokees >> or >> Abikara Creeks attacking Georgia settlements, even though the Chickamauga >> villages were located in Georgia. Abikara Creeks were a hybrid ethnic >> group >> themselves, composed of the remnants of various Muskogean towns in >> Tennessee >> that included true Creeks, Koasati, Alabama, Chickasaw and Yuchi >> elements. >> That >> is why their war was entirely with the Tennessee, not with the Georgia. >> The >> Abikara claimed Tennessee as their traditional motherland. >> >> By the 1830s, at least 3000 Upper Creeks were living in the Georgia >> Cherokee Nation. The US Army built a fort in Rome, GA specifically to try >> to stem >> the tide of Alabama Creeks fleeing into the Cherokee Nation after the Red >> Stick >> War. The Hitchiti-speaking Georgia Creeks generally wanted nothing to do >> with the Cherokees and went their own way. Distinct Abikara Creek >> villages >> still stood in the Cherokee Nation until the eve of the actual Trail of >> Tears. >> Most Abikara and Kusa Creeks were not listed as Cherokee citizens and >> therefore, were not on the soldiers pickup list. Some cast their fate >> with the >> Cherokees and their descendants are now enrolled as Oklahoma Cherokees. >> Some >> fled back into Alabama or to regions of Georgia and South Carolina >> occupied by >> Friendly Creek state citizens. Many fled into the rugged mountains of >> NW >> Georgia (where the alleged Bigfoot body was found!) Their descendants >> never left >> the region. Until recently, they would tell people they were Cherokees, >> because Creeks have a reputation for not taking guff off of anybody >> (who? >> moi?) >> More recently some Upper Creek families have come out of the closet and >> admitted that they are actually bloodthirsty Creeks rather than nice, >> submissive Cherokees. LOL >> >> So, if you have an ancestor who was living in Murray, Fannin, Gilmer, >> Pickens, Union or Gordon Counties in Georgia, or Polk County in >> Tennessee, who >> look Upper Creek, but at times told people they were Cherokees, the >> chances >> are that their ancestors were actually Upper Creek refugees from the >> Cherokee >> Trail of Tears, who originally hid out in the Cohutta Mountains. >> >> Richard T. >> >> >> >> >> >> **************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your >> budget? >> Read reviews on AOL Autos. >> (http://autos.aol.com/cars-Volkswagen-Jetta-2009/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00030000000007 >> ) >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >> > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Judy, Come to think of it, the Surname Queen is a surname found in the area where the Cherokee reservation is, it is basically a surname in the White communities, but evidently a Whiteman with the surname Queen did marry into the Eastern Band, as there are Indians with the Surname Queen listed on the roll. I think that in the colonies the settlers would attach titles to certain Indian leaders such as King Phillip, or King Haigler when dealing with the native people, and then given the Hollywood created images of Native people, people often have a created fantasy of grandma as being a Cherokee princess. I had one co-worker inform me that her husbands grandfather had kidnapped his wife off the Cherokee reservation, and married her...lol I wanted to tell her, that the man would never had made it off the reservation alive. --- On Sun, 8/17/08, Judy White <[email protected]> wrote: > From: Judy White <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Indian Princess > To: [email protected] > Date: Sunday, August 17, 2008, 8:15 PM > >From the last bunch of records I put online, I > discovered something that > gave me pause for thought. I found King, Prince, Princess, > Queen, all > surnames. Now my grandmother was an Indian Princess, do > you think it is > possible some people are saying her last name was > Princess?? Don't > missunderstand I know the stories, and know some believe > grandma was a > princess, but what I am saying maybe she was a Queen or > Princess, they just > didn't get the jist of the story the first time it was > told. > > Something new for you to look at > http://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/pension/ This is > from a Senate > document Alleged Frauds Aganst Certain Indian Soldiers. > There is much more > to come. > > Feel free to pass the link on. > > Judy > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 4:38 PM, Leon Beard > <[email protected]>wrote: > > > I know one time back in the 1980's my Mom was > working as a desk clerk at a > > motel there on the reservation, and the liliy white > white haired lady came > > in the office, and proudly tells my mom that her > grandmother was a Cherokee > > indian Princess, and my Mom without blinking looks at > the woman and said > > well mine was a indian w---e ( slang for prostitute ) > > I think I was just as stunned as the white > lady.....after the lady left > > the office, my Mom said she was just tired of hearing > about everybody's > > grandmother being a Indian princess...lol > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word > 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and > the body of the message

You missunderstand what I wrote, I was not saying there was royality, I am saying there were Surnames King, Queen, Prince and Princess. Why couldn't someone say my grandmother was a Creek Princess, just like I would say my grandmother was a Creek Wallis for example. Judy On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 5:31 PM, <[email protected]> wrote: > Judy, > > There was no such thing as hereditary royalty among the Creeks or the > Cherokees. Mikkos were elected on the basis of their proven leadership > skills. > Their daughters might have been more prestigious and affluent brides than > others, but they had no special title of nobility, > > Richard T. > > > > **************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your budget? > Read reviews on AOL Autos. > ( > http://autos.aol.com/cars-Volkswagen-Jetta-2009/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00030000000007) > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

I think maybe you convince me my ancestors were upper Creek, my grandfather had the eagle face. My aunt would not tell me why , but when "someone" heard I was searching, I was told to inquire about the Chicamaugua Cherokee. Have no paper, but still think the "mysterious" gave correct information. Richard B. ----- Original Message ----- From: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 7:21 AM Subject: [CREEK-SOUTHEAST] Serious comment for a change - if you are lookingfor Upper Creek ancestors > Good Morning again! > > My Creek grandmother really was a master fried pie maker. By the 1970s > she > was making over $7000 a year selling home-made dried fruit pies at my > grandfather's general store. That is the equivalent of about $30,000 a > year today. > All of us cousins would go to stay with my grandparents in the summer to > help > pick apples, peaches and pears. We would cut and dry the fruit on > corrugated steel panels in back of the house. > > Now, in regard to tracing back Upper Creek ancestors, who always said they > were Cherokee, but looked very Upper Creek. Upper Creeks look like > eagles, by > the way. Hitchiti's look like Chief Tomochichi. > > First of all, I have found proof that Muskogean villages in Western > North > Carolina and Eastern Tennessee split into factions when the Cherokees > arrived > on the scene in the early 1700s. Traditionalists and the elite often > immigrated to Alabama and set up towns with the same name. Those who > were "lower > down the totem pole" tended to stay put and join the Cherokee Alliance, > beca > use the Cherokees had a more egalitarian culture at that time. They were > a new > hybrid ethnic group without a hereditary leadership once their Kitani > priests > were assasinated. > > When the Cherokees moved down into NW Georgia at the close of the American > Revolution, they did not displace existing Abikara & Kusa Creek villages > located in the vicinity of Rome, Cartersville, LaFayatte, Cedartown and > Tallapoosa, GA. Oceola was born in an Upper Creek town near Tallapoosa. > In fact, the > Abikara Creeks continued to be allies of the Chickamauga Cherokees in the > bloody war that continued with the Tennessee Militia until 1793. > Chickamauga was > originally a Muskogean village. It was the Abikara Creeks who attacked > Nashville during this war. Andy Jackson was involved in the defense of > Fort > Davidson and hated Upper Creeks ever afterward. The Abikara were based > in the > Muscle Shoals, AL area, which was then part of Georgia. The Cherokee > word for > Creek Indian today is Kusa-agi (Kusa-agi) They use a different word for > Muskogees. In other words, from the late Revolutionary War period > forward, the > Upper Creeks were allies of the Cherokees. > > An interesting fact is that I can find no record of Chickamauga Cherokees > or > Abikara Creeks attacking Georgia settlements, even though the Chickamauga > villages were located in Georgia. Abikara Creeks were a hybrid ethnic > group > themselves, composed of the remnants of various Muskogean towns in > Tennessee > that included true Creeks, Koasati, Alabama, Chickasaw and Yuchi elements. > That > is why their war was entirely with the Tennessee, not with the Georgia. > The > Abikara claimed Tennessee as their traditional motherland. > > By the 1830s, at least 3000 Upper Creeks were living in the Georgia > Cherokee Nation. The US Army built a fort in Rome, GA specifically to try > to stem > the tide of Alabama Creeks fleeing into the Cherokee Nation after the Red > Stick > War. The Hitchiti-speaking Georgia Creeks generally wanted nothing to do > with the Cherokees and went their own way. Distinct Abikara Creek > villages > still stood in the Cherokee Nation until the eve of the actual Trail of > Tears. > Most Abikara and Kusa Creeks were not listed as Cherokee citizens and > therefore, were not on the soldiers pickup list. Some cast their fate > with the > Cherokees and their descendants are now enrolled as Oklahoma Cherokees. > Some > fled back into Alabama or to regions of Georgia and South Carolina > occupied by > Friendly Creek state citizens. Many fled into the rugged mountains of NW > Georgia (where the alleged Bigfoot body was found!) Their descendants > never left > the region. Until recently, they would tell people they were Cherokees, > because Creeks have a reputation for not taking guff off of anybody (who? > moi?) > More recently some Upper Creek families have come out of the closet and > admitted that they are actually bloodthirsty Creeks rather than nice, > submissive Cherokees. LOL > > So, if you have an ancestor who was living in Murray, Fannin, Gilmer, > Pickens, Union or Gordon Counties in Georgia, or Polk County in > Tennessee, who > look Upper Creek, but at times told people they were Cherokees, the > chances > are that their ancestors were actually Upper Creek refugees from the > Cherokee > Trail of Tears, who originally hid out in the Cohutta Mountains. > > Richard T. > > > > > > **************Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your > budget? > Read reviews on AOL Autos. > (http://autos.aol.com/cars-Volkswagen-Jetta-2009/expert-review?ncid=aolaut00030000000007 > ) > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > >

>From the last bunch of records I put online, I discovered something that gave me pause for thought. I found King, Prince, Princess, Queen, all surnames. Now my grandmother was an Indian Princess, do you think it is possible some people are saying her last name was Princess?? Don't missunderstand I know the stories, and know some believe grandma was a princess, but what I am saying maybe she was a Queen or Princess, they just didn't get the jist of the story the first time it was told. Something new for you to look at http://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/pension/ This is from a Senate document Alleged Frauds Aganst Certain Indian Soldiers. There is much more to come. Feel free to pass the link on. Judy On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 4:38 PM, Leon Beard <[email protected]>wrote: > I know one time back in the 1980's my Mom was working as a desk clerk at a > motel there on the reservation, and the liliy white white haired lady came > in the office, and proudly tells my mom that her grandmother was a Cherokee > indian Princess, and my Mom without blinking looks at the woman and said > well mine was a indian w---e ( slang for prostitute ) > I think I was just as stunned as the white lady.....after the lady left > the office, my Mom said she was just tired of hearing about everybody's > grandmother being a Indian princess...lol > >

In 1824 in Early County, GA, Elizabeth Boles married Abraham Warren. Abraham is a ggggguncle of mine. Just a few months ago I met, over the internet, a direct descendant of Elizabeth and Abraham (and several other folks, from whom I descend too). My new-found cousin wanted to know if I had any info on Elizabeth, who was American Indian according to family lore. I didn't even know her last name, so my new-found cousin was way ahead of me. And that is how I have become interested in these Boles. Elizabeth and Abraham moved to Coffee County, AL and spent several decades there, then followed their children to Henderson County, TX. The last time I can find them in the census is in 1870 in Athens, Henderson County, TX., though in 1880 Elizabeth (then a widow) was living with their son James. There were other Boles in Coffee County, AL during those early years, but there were many more in Henderson County, TX, and they were living near (because they were related through marriages) some Cadenheads. I figured that the Boles in Early County GA, Coffee County AL and Henderson County TX were most likely Creeks. Indeed, an early (no pun intended) brief history of Early County, GA stated that: "Unlike the other counties, it [Early] had within its borders a few Indian towns, where some small bodies of "Creeks" had their homes." http://genforum.genealogy.com/sheffield/messages/1936.html As I continued searching, I came across information that the Henderson County TX Boles, along with the Cadenheads who were their relatives and neighbors, were Cherokees. Data I have seen over the internet (not the actual documents) includes this example: "BOLES/CADENHEAD APPLICATION FOR MEMBERSHIP, CHEROKEE NATION 1896 All persons named in this application are members of one large extended family, related by blood and marriage. This information was received from the National Archives in Fort Worth, Texas. It consisted of 42 legal size photocopied pages of documents relating to the applications and appeal of denied citizenship. Denial was based on the fact that James Boles' name was not on one of the official Cherokee Census rolls taken in 1835, 1848, 1851 or 1852 and that James Boles never resided in Indian Territory. All persons named in this are all members of one extended family and the report proves thier lineage and relationship to each other." This application contained numerous statements from witnesses that the Boles and Cadenheads involved were indeed Cherokee. Now back to Elizabeth Boles who married my Abraham Warren. I have gotten no further in determining her ancestry, let alone whether she was related to the Boles who were in Henderson County, TX, though there is a hint or two that she may have been. What I would appreciate knowing from any of you is whether there is any record of the names of the Creek families who supposedly were in Early County GA in the first few decades of 1800. And, while this seems far- fetched to me, do any of you know if any Cherokees were there at that time? Many thanks.