We got a few new ones to take the DNA with the grant that FTDNA put up. and one of them is already back. it is beleived to be on the Group 5 But it is only a 12y dna and it does have a mutation where it should not have. if it was not for our sequence of number that are rare then it would not be counted in group 5. It would be interesting to see if it could follow on out with the 25. I have been talking to some of the other surname admin and they will not even try to group a 12 y test any more and are after the 37 marker test. They claim it is the best for puting families together. If anyone is really up on this DNA thing jump in here and help me out. I can see how it can be good for us but I can't explain it. Bill Couch