To be fair it should be mentioned that when Catholics were in power in Scotland, they persecuted non-Catholics, causing many to go to N. Ireland so they would not have to sign a declaration of faith for the Catholic religion. I was reading online last week about the Agnews of Wigtown on the southern coast of Scotland. The Agnews had been hereditary Sheriffs there for several generations. When Sir Andrew Agnew was the Sheriff he was scolded by the government for not enforcing the rule requiring all subjects to sign the declaration and finally removed as Sheriff and Catholic Highland soldiers were sent to enforce the rule. To avoid having to sign the declaration, Sir Andrew went to his N. Ireland lands for a good while as did several other protestants from Southern Scotland. As I see it, a lot of the religious persecution was done for political purposes by all sides, the Protestants, Catholics and Church of England which I think is a shame since all 3 are Christians in basic beliefs. In my Kincaid family, they left Scotland for Ulster after the Uprising of 1688 since they were on the losing side. They then came to the then Colonies in mid 1700's. My father told me we were Scots-Irish-Welsh but I have never found the Welsh connection. Also have not found Joseph Kincaid's parents in Ulster. His name was spelled Kinkead on some early documents in the Colony of Virginia. Don W. Kincaid Texas, USA ----- Original Message ----- From: Mary LaValley To: amroche1@aol.com Cc: cotyroneireland@rootsweb.com ; joyhogghwh@yahoo.com Sent: Thursday, January 29, 2009 7:40 AM Subject: Re: [CoTyIre] BMD - Bayne, Hogg, Farrell A number of reasons. Just a few to start - It wasn't unusual - The Irish and Scottish had been cross migrating for centuries. One can see Scotland from Giant's Causeway. The economy was horrendous. The English historically persecuted Scottish Catholics ( not sure of the McClelland religion) so many left. The English were still recruiting Lowland Scots ( not Catholics) to settle in Ireland in order to eliminate Catholicism and native Irish culture. This overlaps with the English effort to settle the migration of Protestants escaping wars on the European continent and to settle the US colonies. Hope this helps. Mary On Thursday, January 29, 2009, at 09:13AM, <amroche1@aol.com> wrote: > > Hello all! I am also interested in why Scots would leave Scotland for Ireland in the mid to late 1700s. My McClellands (2 brothers) left Scotland for Co Tyrone about 1760. When replying to Joy, please "reply to all." >Thanks! >Alice > > > > > > > >-----Original Message----- >From: Joy Hogg <joyhogghwh@yahoo.com> >To: cotyroneireland@rootsweb.com >Sent: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 5:32 am >Subject: [CoTyIre] BMD - Bayne, Hogg, Farrell > > > > > > > > > > >Dear folks, I'd like to thank the volunteers who have been transcribing and >entering thousands of names and dates for historical purposes. What a wonderful >generous way to spend time. >Also, I am catching bits of great advice, especially about ages. Do you think a >disregard to exact age was common all over the place? I have a British person in >Canada whose age seemed to have declined about 12 years upon remarriage >after?losing the first wife. >?Could you walk me through the instructions for accessing the new information? >Is this at the LDS site or somewhere else? >Also, I continue to need any assistance for Bayne, Hogg and Farrell.I can >picture a young James Hogg walking to Tyrone County from Scotland, and >eventually marrying a Sarah McKee in the late 1700's. From historical >conjecture, put your thinking caps on for me. Why would Scots leave Scotland at >that time? How would he have been received by the people in the area? Would a >single man have traveled alone or always with a group of relatives? Did the >Scots retain their "Scots" demeanor and speech, or assimilate? >As a Canadian in the US, I will help re: history on this side of the pond... >Joy Hogg > >------------- >Our community web-site: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~cotyroneireland > > > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to COTYRONEIRELAND-request@rootsweb.com >with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of >the message > > > > > > >------------- >Our community web-site: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~cotyroneireland > > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to COTYRONEIRELAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > ------------- Our community web-site: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~cotyroneireland ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to COTYRONEIRELAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Other peoples have left their homelands over the centuries for one primary reason - increasing population density resulted in the land not being able to support them. This led to hostile movements (wars) into neighboring countries. In the casea cited here we have another reason - there were opportunities elsewhere that were heavily promoted by the British government. This was not a spontaneous movement prompted primarily by starvation or dwindling resources. It was the result of the government reaching out to satisfy their own political agenda. They needed people who were sympathetic to their cause in foreign lands. Cliff. Johnston "May the best you've ever seen, Be the worst you'll ever see;" from A Scots Toast by Allan Ramsay ----- Original Message ----- From: <amroche1@aol.com> To: <joyhogghwh@yahoo.com>; <cotyroneireland@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, January 29, 2009 8:13 AM Subject: Re: [CoTyIre] BMD - Bayne, Hogg, Farrell > > Hello all! I am also interested in why Scots would leave Scotland for > Ireland in the mid to late 1700s. My McClellands (2 brothers) left > Scotland for Co Tyrone about 1760. When replying to Joy, please "reply to > all." > Thanks! > Alice > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Joy Hogg <joyhogghwh@yahoo.com> > To: cotyroneireland@rootsweb.com > Sent: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 5:32 am > Subject: [CoTyIre] BMD - Bayne, Hogg, Farrell > > > > > > > > > > > Dear folks, I'd like to thank the volunteers who have been transcribing > and > entering thousands of names and dates for historical purposes. What a > wonderful > generous way to spend time. > Also, I am catching bits of great advice, especially about ages. Do you > think a > disregard to exact age was common all over the place? I have a British > person in > Canada whose age seemed to have declined about 12 years upon remarriage > after?losing the first wife. > ?Could you walk me through the instructions for accessing the new > information? > Is this at the LDS site or somewhere else? > Also, I continue to need any assistance for Bayne, Hogg and Farrell.I can > picture a young James Hogg walking to Tyrone County from Scotland, and > eventually marrying a Sarah McKee in the late 1700's. From historical > conjecture, put your thinking caps on for me. Why would Scots leave > Scotland at > that time? How would he have been received by the people in the area? > Would a > single man have traveled alone or always with a group of relatives? Did > the > Scots retain their "Scots" demeanor and speech, or assimilate? > As a Canadian in the US, I will help re: history on this side of the > pond... > Joy Hogg > > ------------- > Our community web-site: > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~cotyroneireland > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > COTYRONEIRELAND-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body > of > the message > > > > > > > ------------- > Our community web-site: > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~cotyroneireland > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > COTYRONEIRELAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

http://www.turtlebunbury.com/biography.html   Turtle Bunbury and I have been happily pursuing dead Bunburys from Ireland together, and I have been digging up Gerrards from Meath. Turtle wrote The Irish Pub and clearly would be the man to rewrite history properly, from a pub perspective. I will forward him our little discussion. Joy Hogg If you take pity on this displaced Canadian, living in northern Michigan, my Hoggs seem to end with James Hogg and Sarah McKee having spawned a Robert Hogg, 1814 to 1890, married to an Agnes Nancy Bayne. His son Samuel, 1855 to 1922, wore himself out with three successive wives and died before his last one, Sarah Jane Farrell 1873-1944. My husband David seems much calmer. Joy Hogg  

Hello all! I am also interested in why Scots would leave Scotland for Ireland in the mid to late 1700s. My McClellands (2 brothers) left Scotland for Co Tyrone about 1760. When replying to Joy, please "reply to all." Thanks! Alice -----Original Message----- From: Joy Hogg <joyhogghwh@yahoo.com> To: cotyroneireland@rootsweb.com Sent: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 5:32 am Subject: [CoTyIre] BMD - Bayne, Hogg, Farrell Dear folks, I'd like to thank the volunteers who have been transcribing and entering thousands of names and dates for historical purposes. What a wonderful generous way to spend time. Also, I am catching bits of great advice, especially about ages. Do you think a disregard to exact age was common all over the place? I have a British person in Canada whose age seemed to have declined about 12 years upon remarriage after?losing the first wife. ?Could you walk me through the instructions for accessing the new information? Is this at the LDS site or somewhere else? Also, I continue to need any assistance for Bayne, Hogg and Farrell.I can picture a young James Hogg walking to Tyrone County from Scotland, and eventually marrying a Sarah McKee in the late 1700's. From historical conjecture, put your thinking caps on for me. Why would Scots leave Scotland at that time? How would he have been received by the people in the area? Would a single man have traveled alone or always with a group of relatives? Did the Scots retain their "Scots" demeanor and speech, or assimilate? As a Canadian in the US, I will help re: history on this side of the pond... Joy Hogg ------------- Our community web-site: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~cotyroneireland ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to COTYRONEIRELAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I have not read the book Salt but understand that is a version of history where the need and pursuit of salt directed some historical migrations and commerce - thus affecting history! I'd love to see history rewritten based on the need and pursuit of great grog!   History is always being rewritten! When my daughter took a Women's Studies course, my husband growled "Where is the Men's Studies course?" I told him there always has been one, and it is called His Story..."   Now, after all the amusement, help me with the Hogg, Bayne and Farrell story! Who the heck were they? Joy

Good morning; If you have any surnames like Jones, Davies or Rees, chances are that you have Welsh, Protestant ties. John C. Hall, Petaluma, California ----- Original Message ----- From: "Don W. Kincaid" <donwkincaid@cox.net> To: "Mary LaValley" <marylongstreth@mac.com>; <amroche1@aol.com> Cc: <cotyroneireland@rootsweb.com>; <joyhogghwh@yahoo.com> Sent: Thursday, January 29, 2009 8:23 AM Subject: Re: [CoTyIre] BMD - Bayne, Hogg, Farrell > To be fair it should be mentioned that when Catholics were in power in > Scotland, they persecuted non-Catholics, causing many to go to N. Ireland > so they would not have to sign a declaration of faith for the Catholic > religion. I was reading online last week about the Agnews of Wigtown on > the southern coast of Scotland. The Agnews had been hereditary Sheriffs > there for several generations. When Sir Andrew Agnew was the Sheriff he > was scolded by the government for not enforcing the rule requiring all > subjects to sign the declaration and finally removed as Sheriff and > Catholic Highland soldiers were sent to enforce the rule. To avoid having > to sign the declaration, Sir Andrew went to his N. Ireland lands for a > good while as did several other protestants from Southern Scotland. As I > see it, a lot of the religious persecution was done for political purposes > by all sides, the Protestants, Catholics and Church of England which I > think is a shame since all 3 are Christians in basic b! > eliefs. > > In my Kincaid family, they left Scotland for Ulster after the Uprising of > 1688 since they were on the losing side. They then came to the then > Colonies in mid 1700's. My father told me we were Scots-Irish-Welsh but I > have never found the Welsh connection. Also have not found Joseph > Kincaid's parents in Ulster. His name was spelled Kinkead on some early > documents in the Colony of Virginia. > > Don W. Kincaid > Texas, USA > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Mary LaValley > To: amroche1@aol.com > Cc: cotyroneireland@rootsweb.com ; joyhogghwh@yahoo.com > Sent: Thursday, January 29, 2009 7:40 AM > Subject: Re: [CoTyIre] BMD - Bayne, Hogg, Farrell > > > A number of reasons. Just a few to start - It wasn't unusual - The Irish > and Scottish had been cross migrating for centuries. One can see Scotland > from Giant's Causeway. The economy was horrendous. The English > historically persecuted Scottish Catholics ( not sure of the McClelland > religion) so many left. The English were still recruiting Lowland Scots > ( not Catholics) to settle in Ireland in order to eliminate Catholicism > and native Irish culture. This overlaps with the English effort to settle > the migration of Protestants escaping wars on the European continent and > to settle the US colonies. Hope this helps. > Mary > On Thursday, January 29, 2009, at 09:13AM, <amroche1@aol.com> wrote: > > > > Hello all! I am also interested in why Scots would leave Scotland for > Ireland in the mid to late 1700s. My McClellands (2 brothers) left > Scotland for Co Tyrone about 1760. When replying to Joy, please "reply to > all." > >Thanks! > >Alice > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: Joy Hogg <joyhogghwh@yahoo.com> > >To: cotyroneireland@rootsweb.com > >Sent: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 5:32 am > >Subject: [CoTyIre] BMD - Bayne, Hogg, Farrell > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Dear folks, I'd like to thank the volunteers who have been transcribing > and > >entering thousands of names and dates for historical purposes. What a > wonderful > >generous way to spend time. > >Also, I am catching bits of great advice, especially about ages. Do you > think a > >disregard to exact age was common all over the place? I have a British > person in > >Canada whose age seemed to have declined about 12 years upon remarriage > >after?losing the first wife. > >?Could you walk me through the instructions for accessing the new > information? > >Is this at the LDS site or somewhere else? > >Also, I continue to need any assistance for Bayne, Hogg and Farrell.I > can > >picture a young James Hogg walking to Tyrone County from Scotland, and > >eventually marrying a Sarah McKee in the late 1700's. From historical > >conjecture, put your thinking caps on for me. Why would Scots leave > Scotland at > >that time? How would he have been received by the people in the area? > Would a > >single man have traveled alone or always with a group of relatives? Did > the > >Scots retain their "Scots" demeanor and speech, or assimilate? > >As a Canadian in the US, I will help re: history on this side of the > pond... > >Joy Hogg > > > >------------- > >Our community web-site: > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~cotyroneireland > > > > > > > >------------------------------- > >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > COTYRONEIRELAND-request@rootsweb.com > >with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the > body of > >the message > > > > > > > > > > > > > >------------- > >Our community web-site: > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~cotyroneireland > > > > > >------------------------------- > >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > COTYRONEIRELAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > ------------- > Our community web-site: > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~cotyroneireland > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > COTYRONEIRELAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > ------------- > Our community web-site: > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~cotyroneireland > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > COTYRONEIRELAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

I had a family of Kirkpatrick who came from Scotland say 1800 or so and eventually settled in Fermanagh. Maguiresbridge area. Not a clue as to why though. Other lines in this area - McCoy in Tyrone and Jackson in Fermanagh. My Hogg line stayed in Scotland - Hawick where my GF was born 1876. -----Original Message----- From: cotyroneireland-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:cotyroneireland-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of amroche1@aol.com Sent: Thursday, January 29, 2009 8:14 AM To: joyhogghwh@yahoo.com; cotyroneireland@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [CoTyIre] BMD - Bayne, Hogg, Farrell Hello all! I am also interested in why Scots would leave Scotland for Ireland in the mid to late 1700s. My McClellands (2 brothers) left Scotland for Co Tyrone about 1760. When replying to Joy, please "reply to all." Thanks! Alice -----Original Message----- From: Joy Hogg <joyhogghwh@yahoo.com> To: cotyroneireland@rootsweb.com Sent: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 5:32 am Subject: [CoTyIre] BMD - Bayne, Hogg, Farrell Dear folks, I'd like to thank the volunteers who have been transcribing and entering thousands of names and dates for historical purposes. What a wonderful generous way to spend time. Also, I am catching bits of great advice, especially about ages. Do you think a disregard to exact age was common all over the place? I have a British person in Canada whose age seemed to have declined about 12 years upon remarriage after?losing the first wife. ?Could you walk me through the instructions for accessing the new information? Is this at the LDS site or somewhere else? Also, I continue to need any assistance for Bayne, Hogg and Farrell.I can picture a young James Hogg walking to Tyrone County from Scotland, and eventually marrying a Sarah McKee in the late 1700's. From historical conjecture, put your thinking caps on for me. Why would Scots leave Scotland at that time? How would he have been received by the people in the area? Would a single man have traveled alone or always with a group of relatives? Did the Scots retain their "Scots" demeanor and speech, or assimilate? As a Canadian in the US, I will help re: history on this side of the pond... Joy Hogg ------------- Our community web-site: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~cotyroneireland ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to COTYRONEIRELAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------- Our community web-site: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~cotyroneireland ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to COTYRONEIRELAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

There is a lot of information available about why the Scots moved to Ireland (other than for the Guinness). Check out sites like this:   http://www.ulsterancestry.com/ulster-scots.html   Diane B. __________________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Canada Toolbar: Search from anywhere on the web, and bookmark your favourite sites. Download it now at http://ca.toolbar.yahoo.com.

I am getting GREAT reflections regarding  my question about why a Scots would leave Scotland in the late 1700s and migrate to Tyrone. What was the economy like and what sort of work would a young man get upon arriving? Ag lab?  As I do my histories, I am trying to put context with the lists. What was life like for our folks in Tyrone in the early 1800's? What did they wear, eat, do for a living? What were the controversies and conflicts of the times? Did The Troubles affect them much in this area? My husband tells me his family, calling themselves Ulstermen, left Ireland in the early 1900's and retained a grim attitude towards The Troubles even while they lived in the US and Canada. I hope we will discuss some of the social and historical underpinnings of the times so we can understand the why as well as the who. And for those of us who have never lived or visited Ireland, this kind of information would be really welcome. I do hope to visit within the next few years after we stop putting kids through college! (Of course, I was a history graduate...) Joy Hogg

Dear folks, I'd like to thank the volunteers who have been transcribing and entering thousands of names and dates for historical purposes. What a wonderful generous way to spend time. Also, I am catching bits of great advice, especially about ages. Do you think a disregard to exact age was common all over the place? I have a British person in Canada whose age seemed to have declined about 12 years upon remarriage after losing the first wife.  Could you walk me through the instructions for accessing the new information? Is this at the LDS site or somewhere else? Also, I continue to need any assistance for Bayne, Hogg and Farrell.I can picture a young James Hogg walking to Tyrone County from Scotland, and eventually marrying a Sarah McKee in the late 1700's. From historical conjecture, put your thinking caps on for me. Why would Scots leave Scotland at that time? How would he have been received by the people in the area? Would a single man have traveled alone or always with a group of relatives? Did the Scots retain their "Scots" demeanor and speech, or assimilate? As a Canadian in the US, I will help re: history on this side of the pond... Joy Hogg

I'm sorry so many of you are disappointed with the results of your search. I agree with Jim, however that you should leave your search as wide as possible. Registation Districts, cross parish boundaries and it may well be that the registration office was in fact in a bordering county. For example, Strabane was where birth, marriages and deaths for part of Tyrone were registered, but also parts of Donegal. Some of my own searches showed this - where ancestors were born in Co Tyrone near to the border with Fermanagh , the registration office was in Enniskillen so the records come under Enniskillen in Co Fermanagh. I only insert the person's name and Tyrone, Ireland in the search boxes and I find it gives me those born in Co Tyrone who are registered in Tyrone, as well as those born in Tyrone but registered in a district which crosses the county boundary - Armagh, Enniskillen to name two that came up for me. I dont ask for exact matches in Name spellings either as most surnames are spelled in various ways, depending on who scribes the information, usually the registrar. You may find a record that puzzles you like the example below: Name: Mary Ann (1913) McSorley Registration district: Cookstown Record type: BIRTHS Registration date - quarter and year: Oct - Dec 1915 Estimated birth year: Age: Mother surnames: Film number: 101076 Volume: 1 Page: 438 Digital GS number: 4194695 Image number: 00255 Collection: Ireland, Civil Registration Indexes 1845-1958 The record has (1913) in brackets after the person's name because there were quite a number of people who did not register the birth at the right time. In this example the birth wasnt registered until Oct - Dec quarter, 1915 so it appeared in the index for 1915 with 1913 beside it. We transcribed it exactly as we found it so if applying for a certificate for this birth you would indicate this in the application otherwise GRO would look at 1913 records and be unable to find it. Remember, too, some births were never registered. I have been told, but cannot say if this is correct, that late registration incurred a fine so some people didnt bother if they had missed the deadline. Dont rely on the year of birth that is given on the death certificate of a person as being the correct year. This was arrived at by deducting the age of death as given by the informant from the year of death. Often the informant didnt know the person's correct age. Indeed often the person himself didnt!! Also if you are searching a specific year, which you've arrived at by using the age a person gave in a census then you may not find that person either. There can be a difference of 5 to 10 years between their census age and real age. In fact some people only age 4 years between censuses whilst others age 15!! Finally, yes we may have inadvertantly missed people out and if we did, may I apologise. If I remember rightly some indexes had 375 names on them and often there was more than one person with the same name so it could easily be someone was missed out. There wasnt an exact number on each page . It certainly is much easier with the censuses which have got 30 to a page to know if anyone was missing. However, each page is transcribed separately by two people and if they dont match up an assessor goes through and checks. Hopefully most of you will find those ancestors ......... fingers crossed! Theresa _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live Messenger just got better .Video display pics, contact updates & more. http://www.download.live.com/messenger

Another way to avoid the fine was to change the date of birth so that it conformed to the deadline in effect at the time the report was made. I have seen cases where the subject was baptized before being born (or so the records would imply). James P. Murphy Princeton, NJ 08542 jpmurphy@jpmurphy.com   -----Original Message----- From: cotyroneireland-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:cotyroneireland-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Theresa Forsyth Sent: Wednesday, January 28, 2009 11:16 AM To: Mailing Tyrone Subject: [CoTyIre] Irish BMD Indexes I'm sorry so many of you are disappointed with the results of your search. I agree with Jim, however that you should leave your search as wide as possible. Registation Districts, cross parish boundaries and it may well be that the registration office was in fact in a bordering county. For example, Strabane was where birth, marriages and deaths for part of Tyrone were registered, but also parts of Donegal. Some of my own searches showed this - where ancestors were born in Co Tyrone near to the border with Fermanagh , the registration office was in Enniskillen so the records come under Enniskillen in Co Fermanagh. I only insert the person's name and Tyrone, Ireland in the search boxes and I find it gives me those born in Co Tyrone who are registered in Tyrone, as well as those born in Tyrone but registered in a district which crosses the county boundary - Armagh, Enniskillen to name two that came up for me. I dont ask for exact matches in Name spellings either as most surnames are spelled in various ways, depending on who scribes the information, usually the registrar. You may find a record that puzzles you like the example below: Name: Mary Ann (1913) McSorley Registration district: Cookstown Record type: BIRTHS Registration date - quarter and year: Oct - Dec 1915 Estimated birth year: Age: Mother surnames: Film number: 101076 Volume: 1 Page: 438 Digital GS number: 4194695 Image number: 00255 Collection: Ireland, Civil Registration Indexes 1845-1958 The record has (1913) in brackets after the person's name because there were quite a number of people who did not register the birth at the right time. In this example the birth wasnt registered until Oct - Dec quarter, 1915 so it appeared in the index for 1915 with 1913 beside it. We transcribed it exactly as we found it so if applying for a certificate for this birth you would indicate this in the application otherwise GRO would look at 1913 records and be unable to find it. Remember, too, some births were never registered. I have been told, but cannot say if this is correct, that late registration incurred a fine so some people didnt bother if they had missed the deadline. Dont rely on the year of birth that is given on the death certificate of a person as being the correct year. This was arrived at by deducting the age of death as given by the informant from the year of death. Often the informant didnt know the person's correct age. Indeed often the person himself didnt!! Also if you are searching a specific year, which you've arrived at by using the age a person gave in a census then you may not find that person either. There can be a difference of 5 to 10 years between their census age and real age. In fact some people only age 4 years between censuses whilst others age 15!! Finally, yes we may have inadvertantly missed people out and if we did, may I apologise. If I remember rightly some indexes had 375 names on them and often there was more than one person with the same name so it could easily be someone was missed out. There wasnt an exact number on each page . It certainly is much easier with the censuses which have got 30 to a page to know if anyone was missing. However, each page is transcribed separately by two people and if they dont match up an assessor goes through and checks. Hopefully most of you will find those ancestors ......... fingers crossed! Theresa _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live Messenger just got better .Video display pics, contact updates & more. http://www.download.live.com/messenger ------------- Our community web-site: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~cotyroneireland ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to COTYRONEIRELAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Nikki First, I am not searching the surname Carroll and have no further information. If your ancestors are like mine, they all fib about their birth dates, even the males. My grandfather claimed a birth date of 13 Jun 1883 everywhere but I finally found his birth to be 13 June 1875. Searching births 1859-1867, I did not find any 1863 births, here is what I found: County Tyrone Civil Parish: CLOGHER McCarroll James 1867 McCarroll Ellen Jane 1864 McCarroll Ellen 1866 McCarroll Ellen 1871 Civil Parish: BERAGH McCarroll James 1859 Co. Tyrone No Ellen's Civil Parish: DRUMQUIN CASTLEDERG Carril James 1866 No Ellen If you have evidence better then a US census and your are positive that he was born in 1863, here are possibilities in other counties: Church Baptisms 1863 Carrol James 1863 Co. Galway Carrol James 1863 Co. Cork (2) Carroll James 1863 Co. Wicklow (2) Carroll James 1863 Co. Kilkenny Carroll James 1863 Co. Mayo (2) Carroll James 1863 Co. Antrim Carroll James 1863 Co. Limerick Carroll James 1863 Co. Louth (4) By the way, stone masonry was a family necessity, not a trade, for most Irish. Happy Hunting Bill Hazelton Memphis ----- Message: 4 Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2009 13:49:47 -0500 From: Nicole Wenzel <nmwenzel@verizon.net> Subject: [CoTyIre] Co tyrone To: "COTYRONEIRELAND.com" <COTYRONEIRELAND@rootsweb.com> Message-ID: <497F574B.3000105@verizon.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Hello, I am wondering if anyone might be able to point me in the right direction. Seeking information on James Frances Carroll, born December, 1863 in Co. Tyrone. My grandmother reports that he had at least two sisters, one we believe was Ellen, who both joined the convent(which convent, we do not know and there were quite a few of them at that time. My grandmother also believes she heard that James left home/ran away at a young age (12-15 years of age). He subsequently fought in the first Boer War. James came to Philadelphia in 1883/4, where he married and had four daughters. In Philadelphia, James was a stone mason (we do not know if this was a family trade or not.) He passed in 1923. Thank you for any help or guidance. Nikki Wenzel -**********************

The LDS index site is fantastic but surely not complete even thought the project notes list it as so? I entered info from two certificates I have to verify (a death and a marriage 1875 and 1876) and neither showed up. Maybe I am doing something wrong? Linda

Sorry Guys I'm not getting it? Here are the steps I am taking.. Once the image can be viewed I have options Print and beside that Save.. If I just click on the Save arrow, NO option or pop-up is given When I right click on Save a window pops up for adoble flash player settings? I have checked my Pictures and also Documents and I can't find any file. Sorry to going on about this but I am finding quite frustration. Marilyn > Hi Theresa > Thank you for the instructions, I tried everything I could think of last > night with no luck. I am no whiz on the computer so I am grateful for any > and all help. So help !!! I can't seem to save an image, or if I am saving > it I can't find it. I'm not sure if the problem is I am using Vista, but I > have looked and can't find the image. Can you give me any more help with > this problem. > Thanks again > Marilyn > > Hi again > > Claire, I should have said in my original message, that since you are > having difficulty accessing the records, LDS rely on being told this. If > you press the Feedback button at the top of the page and let them know > then > they'll fix it. > > Secondly I should also have said that you can copy the text and the image > to your own pc. When you click on a person's name the record details are > displayed. If you click on Copy to clipboard you can then paste the > details > to a document and save. When you load the image, just click on Save and > the > image will be saved to your documents folder. This saves transcribing > the > data and means that you can access it again easily whenever you want from > your saved copies on your pc. > > Hope this helps > Theresa > > > ------------- > Our community web-site: > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~cotyroneireland > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > COTYRONEIRELAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Sorry just reading my last email Meant to be age death -----Original Message----- From: cotyroneireland-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:cotyroneireland-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Patricia Moosman Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2009 4:18 PM To: 'Cynthia Russell'; 'Mailing Tyrone' Subject: Re: [CoTyIre] Ireland, Civil Registration Hi Cynthia This would be his death the only extra for is the exact date But you could now order a death cert A marriage record won't give you his mothers unfortunately They only gave fathers names As you have information from headstone do you have at death This could help find marriage for you I am checking on Emerald Ancestors Record Type Wills Calendars Date of Death 10 Mar 1890 Year of Probate 1890 Name William Kerr County Tyrone Residence Tirquin Patricia New Zealand ------------- Our community web-site: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~cotyroneireland ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to COTYRONEIRELAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Cynthia This would be his death the only extra for is the exact date But you could now order a death cert A marriage record won't give you his mothers unfortunately They only gave fathers names As you have information from headstone do you have at death This could help find marriage for you I am checking on Emerald Ancestors Record Type Wills Calendars Date of Death 10 Mar 1890 Year of Probate 1890 Name William Kerr County Tyrone Residence Tirquin Patricia New Zealand

Cynthia, I am wondering if you know of a priest, Father Kerr, who would have been in Pomeroy or it's neighboring areas. I have seen the name Father Kerr in papers given to me. Cate > [Original Message] > From: Cynthia Russell <c.russell@charter.net> > To: Mailing Tyrone <cotyroneireland@rootsweb.com> > Date: 1/26/2009 9:07:12 AM > Subject: [CoTyIre] Ireland, Civil Registration > > > Yesterday I found two records that are important to my research. I am > wondering if there is anyone online who would be able to do lookups for the > complete information? Of course, I can order the films, but I am so > excited! I would like to know all of the information listed for: > > Name: William KERR > Registration District: Omagh > Record Type: DEATHS > Jan-Mar 1890 > Film number: 101596 > Vol 2 > Page 238 > Digital GS number 4200678 > Imagine Number: 00048 > > And, I would love to find a marriage for this same man. On a tombstone at > Cappagh C of I Church it lists William Kerr of Teraquin. His uncles are all > FERGUS men, so I am hoping that his mother was perhaps a FERGUS! > > I've been following all FERGUS listings in Ulster Province for 14 years and > hoping for a break-through soon! > > Cynthia N. Russell > Traverse City, Michigan/USA > Researching in Co Tyrone via PC and in person > > > ------------- > Our community web-site: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~cotyroneireland > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to COTYRONEIRELAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hello, I am wondering if anyone might be able to point me in the right direction. Seeking information on James Frances Carroll, born December, 1863 in Co. Tyrone. My grandmother reports that he had at least two sisters, one we believe was Ellen, who both joined the convent(which convent, we do not know and there were quite a few of them at that time. My grandmother also believes she heard that James left home/ran away at a young age (12-15 years of age). He subsequently fought in the first Boer War. James came to Philadelphia in 1883/4, where he married and had four daughters. In Philadelphia, James was a stone mason (we do not know if this was a family trade or not.) He passed in 1923. Thank you for any help or guidance. Nikki Wenzel

Hi Linda, My first attempts at using the site gave the same disappointing results as your check. However, by inputting less data I found that the expected results came through and gave me reassurance. It may be that in spite of this the index is not as complete as we all would like. Regards Jim. ----- Original Message ----- From: <callagre@iinet.net.au> To: "Mailing Tyrone . . ." <cotyroneireland@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2009 12:17 PM Subject: [CoTyIre] LDS indexes > > The LDS index site is fantastic but surely not complete even thought the > project notes list it as so? > I entered info from two certificates I have to verify (a death and a > marriage 1875 and 1876) and neither showed up. > Maybe I am doing something wrong? > Linda > > ------------- > Our community web-site: > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~cotyroneireland > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > COTYRONEIRELAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message