On 7 Dec 99, at 16:11, Alexandra Robbin <[email protected]> wrote: > If it's possible, would the listowner please start putting an automatic > identification of this list at the bottom, to differentiate it from other > lists that don't have identification either. > Not exactly sure what you mean here. Every list is identified uniquely in the headers using the TO: line. The other thing that can be done is that SmartList mail has a lovely line to filter on if you have decent email software, utilise the X-Mailing-List line, for this list X-Mailing-List: <[email protected]>* depending on one's software in use. > Also -- how can one gain access to the archives? > I have added the archive URLs to some of the taglines at the bottom of the messages and also added that information into the administrivia of the digest file. > Thank you. > > > ============================== > Free Web space. ANY amount. ANY subject. > RootsWeb's Freepages put you in touch with millions. > http://cgi.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/acctform.cgi >

You got that right. I had similiar problem just last week and had to put a damper on it. Practically unsubbed two subscribers and invited another one to leave Rootsweb (they would not abide by Rootsweb AUP). W. David Samuelsen Patricia Tidmarsh wrote: > > I sent a private message to a list member saying that I found the use of a > word inflamatory. The listmember sent the original post to the list and > apologized. I then sent a second warning that my personal mail was > copyrighted and my copyright had been violated. The listmember resonded > that since it was an official message from the List Admininstrator it was > not a copyright violation. > > I have now instituted a rule that no private email may be forwarded > without the express written permission of the copyright holder -- > > Any comments? > > Thanks for your attention > > ============================== > Free Web space. ANY amount. ANY subject. > RootsWeb's Freepages put you in touch with millions. > http://cgi.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/acctform.cgi

If it's possible, would the listowner please start putting an automatic identification of this list at the bottom, to differentiate it from other lists that don't have identification either. Also -- how can one gain access to the archives? Thank you.

Glenn--I must correct myself. The offending word was "quoted" as was my message, so it is probably not a violation of copyright. Your comment is interesting. Thanks for your thoughts on the matter. On Tue, 7 Dec 1999, Glenn Randers-Pehrson wrote: > At 02:47 PM 12/7/99 -0500, you wrote: > > > >I sent a private message to a list member saying that I found the use of a > >word inflamatory. The listmember sent the original post to the list and > >apologized. I then sent a second warning that my personal mail was > >copyrighted and my copyright had been violated. The listmember resonded > >that since it was an official message from the List Admininstrator it was > >not a copyright violation. > > > >I have now instituted a rule that no private email may be forwarded > >without the express written permission of the copyright holder -- > > > >Any comments? > > I think you were on firm legal ground and your list member (or more likely, > former list member) was not. > > However... it also seems to me to be a pointless escalation of the problem, > probably more on your part than the list member's. > > Glenn > > > ============================== > Free Web space. ANY amount. ANY subject. > RootsWeb's Freepages put you in touch with millions. > http://cgi.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/acctform.cgi >

At 02:47 PM 12/7/99 -0500, you wrote: > >I sent a private message to a list member saying that I found the use of a >word inflamatory. The listmember sent the original post to the list and >apologized. I then sent a second warning that my personal mail was >copyrighted and my copyright had been violated. The listmember resonded >that since it was an official message from the List Admininstrator it was >not a copyright violation. > >I have now instituted a rule that no private email may be forwarded >without the express written permission of the copyright holder -- > >Any comments? I think you were on firm legal ground and your list member (or more likely, former list member) was not. However... it also seems to me to be a pointless escalation of the problem, probably more on your part than the list member's. Glenn

Thanks Heide -- I should include the word "another persons" private email. I am under the impression that once something is written it is copyrighted, although registration is required if legal action is contemplated to defend the commercial value of the material. Of course, I am not a lawyer and this is not a legal opinion. Thanks for you input. Regards, Patricia On Tue, 7 Dec 1999, Heide Sciacca wrote: > I don't understand most of this copyright stuff, but I was under the > impression that in order for material to be protected under the laws of > copyright, some kind of formal paperwork had to be submitted? > > While I can understand why the incident you described had upset you as we > don't intend our personal email messages to be seen by everyone, it seems the > person responding did it with good intentions and without malice. In addition, > I personally think attaching the copyright note to your messages as you > described would be a little unsettling and I would think twice about future > correspondence for fear of being sued. > > Just my thoughts, > Heide > > Patricia Tidmarsh wrote: > > > I sent a private message to a list member saying that I found the use of a > > word inflamatory. The listmember sent the original post to the list and > > apologized. I then sent a second warning that my personal mail was > > copyrighted and my copyright had been violated. The listmember resonded > > that since it was an official message from the List Admininstrator it was > > not a copyright violation. > > > > I have now instituted a rule that no private email may be forwarded > > without the express written permission of the copyright holder -- > > > > Any comments? > > > > Thanks for your attention > > > > ============================== > > Free Web space. ANY amount. ANY subject. > > RootsWeb's Freepages put you in touch with millions. > > http://cgi.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/acctform.cgi > > > ============================== > Free Web space. ANY amount. ANY subject. > RootsWeb's Freepages put you in touch with millions. > http://cgi.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/acctform.cgi >

I don't understand most of this copyright stuff, but I was under the impression that in order for material to be protected under the laws of copyright, some kind of formal paperwork had to be submitted? While I can understand why the incident you described had upset you as we don't intend our personal email messages to be seen by everyone, it seems the person responding did it with good intentions and without malice. In addition, I personally think attaching the copyright note to your messages as you described would be a little unsettling and I would think twice about future correspondence for fear of being sued. Just my thoughts, Heide Patricia Tidmarsh wrote: > I sent a private message to a list member saying that I found the use of a > word inflamatory. The listmember sent the original post to the list and > apologized. I then sent a second warning that my personal mail was > copyrighted and my copyright had been violated. The listmember resonded > that since it was an official message from the List Admininstrator it was > not a copyright violation. > > I have now instituted a rule that no private email may be forwarded > without the express written permission of the copyright holder -- > > Any comments? > > Thanks for your attention > > ============================== > Free Web space. ANY amount. ANY subject. > RootsWeb's Freepages put you in touch with millions. > http://cgi.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/acctform.cgi

I sent a private message to a list member saying that I found the use of a word inflamatory. The listmember sent the original post to the list and apologized. I then sent a second warning that my personal mail was copyrighted and my copyright had been violated. The listmember resonded that since it was an official message from the List Admininstrator it was not a copyright violation. I have now instituted a rule that no private email may be forwarded without the express written permission of the copyright holder -- Any comments? Thanks for your attention

The way I see it the person was extremely gracious by apologizing in public to the whole list and needed to share the reprimand emailed to them so the rest of us would have a reference for the apology. It makes perfect sense to me but I'm mental too...just ask my husband. Everyone should be entitled to their own opinions. Someone may be more sensitive than another about a certain subject. We just need to exercise the delete key when this happens with the exception of vulgarity. That is the one area most of the list members seem to feel strongly about. Think about it, we don't know each other and so we don't have any idea about anyone's likes, dislikes, marital status, political or religious affiliations. "Can't we all just get along?" Who said that? WOW...Flame war...that's a cute phrase. :)

More information about Copyright and Fair Use, from Stanford University Libraries: http://fairuse.stanford.edu/

I just found this helpful advice on another e-list, following a subscriber's mistaken posting of copyrighted material. The listowner wrote, For copyright information, visit: [email protected] (subscribe address [email protected]) Or check the web: Copyright Basics: http://www.w3px.com/~docs/cpyright.htm Copyright Laws on the Internet: http://www.pitt.edu/~skvarka/education/copyright/ Ten Myths about copyright explained: http://www.templetons.com/brad/copymyths.html Yvonne Oliver Bowers, Listmom, GenConnect Administratior, Proud Rootsweb Sponsor NORCAL, SOCAL, CA-GOLDRUSH, CA-EARTHQUAKE-L NORCAL Library http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~yvonne/norcallib.html NORCAL Genealogy Index http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~yvonne/NORCAL%20index/ CA-GOLDRUSH Most Wanted: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~yvonne/CAGOLDRUSH/goldrushdigest.html ==== CA-GOLDRUSH Mailing List ==== Automatic Administrative Reminder: Please DO NOT post to multiple lists with one email; this can cause bounced-mail problems for Rootsweb and for us; and those looking for answers but are not subscribed to this list will not get replies. This also occurs when non-lister's messages are forwarded to the list.

Hi, You are talking about copyright registration. Everything written that contains some degree of originality is protected by copyright and "is copyrighted" at the time is created. What copyright registration are gets you is the right to statuatory damages and attorney's fees out of a successful copyright lawsuit. Checkout my copyright site at http://www.rootsweb.com/~mikegoad/copyright1.htm and particularly my page on copyright infringement remedies at http://www.rootsweb.com/~mikegoad/html/copyright13.htm I'm also made significant additions to my genealogy resources page at http://www.cswnet.com/~mgoad/html/genealogy_resources.htm Mike Goad At 08:03 AM 11/30/99 -0500, [email protected] wrote: >Just a thought here... > >In all that has been said, and I may have missed this, but no one seems to >have mentioned the simple thing ... DID she SIGN her name on the application >for a copyright? If not, how is her name included in the copyright? > >All books I have copyrighted, required my signature on the application to >enable me to get the copyright ...even forgot to sign one, one time, and it >was returned to me for my signature. > > >============================== >Free Web space. ANY amount. ANY subject. >RootsWeb's Freepages put you in touch with millions. >http://cgi.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/acctform.cgi

I would think that whoever actually took the pictures would again, automatically, own the copyright. Your having the originals doesn't necessarily mean you are the original owner--are you? Were they given to you are were they always yours? If so, you may need to register them if you feel there is going to be a problem. Yvonne In a message dated 12/1/99 2:19:59 AM Central Standard Time, [email protected] writes: << But I am unclear as to whether or not he can copyright scanned photos that I gave him. I have the originals. >>

Anything you write is automatically copyrighted. What you are talking about is registering a copyright and I would think this would require both signatures. Yvonne In a message dated 12/1/99 2:19:59 AM Central Standard Time, [email protected] writes: << In all that has been said, and I may have missed this, but no one seems to have mentioned the simple thing ... DID she SIGN her name on the application for a copyright? If not, how is her name included in the copyright? >>

Laura, it sounds as if by including photos, you have added a "modicum of creativity" to your "mere facts" -- meaning that the whole of what you've created has copyright protection already by common law. How about hurrying to register your copyright, as explained in the Hoffman article? Phone your library to see whether they have the necessary form(s) to photocopy and mail to the Register of Copyrights in Washington, DC. (By the same token, if he rushes to copyright first, I would think you'd have to get permission to use your own material.) On every photo and ged-com, have a copyright line: (c) Copyright 1 September 1999, Laura Koehn, all rights reserved worldwide. You might add a further statement, such as AUTHOR'S NOTICE: These pages may NOT be reproduced in any format.. Persons or organizations desiring to use this material must obtain the written consent of the owner. If you can, have the family member return all the material you've given him, and give him one with your copyright and permission notices on it.

Thank you everyone, for pointing me to the right source for my copyright questions. I have checked the US Copyright homepage, and still cannot find answers to a couple of questions. Can anyone on the list educate me further? If I've missed something on the homepage, please feel free to chastise! If I gave another person a ged-com, without any notes, sources, or documentation, I understand that neither he nor I can copyright that. But I am unclear as to whether or not he can copyright scanned photos that I gave him. I have the originals. Here is my dilemma. I gave my family member a ged-com and some scanned photos. Against my wished he is now publishing these on CD's that he plans to distribute on his own. He says that he is going to copyright the CD's in BOTH of our names. I understand that he is mistaken about being able to officially copyright in MY name. I would have to give my own signature for that. But, according to the information I just read on the Copyright site, all he has to do is "claim" the work as being copyrighted. He does NOT have to send in an application (although this is advisable). Do I tell him that my ged-com and original photos are already copyrighted, even though the ged-com cannot technically be copyrighted? If he copyrights the CD's in his own name, without my name on them, won't that mean I am infringing on HIS copyright when I reprint my own data in my own book? Although I told him that it is only ethical to include my name as the source for the genealogy, I do NOT want my name associated with publishing the CD's. But, I don't want this trouble-making family member to sue me later for infringing on HIS copyright. By the way, I sure do appreciate all of the good advice that everyone on the list has been giving me through all of my mess. What a great collaboration of people! Laura

unsubscribe ----- Original Message ----- From: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Monday, November 29, 1999 4:19 AM Subject: COPYRIGHT-D Digest V99 #70

Richard A. McCool <[email protected]> wrote: > > MERELY to publish a book? > > Holy mackerel. > > Richard > Richard My feelings exactly! First, writing a book is not easy --- if one assumes it is a well documented, well researched book! Second, what better way to pass on all that wonderful information to the most people possible ---- in book form complete with footnotes, sources --- in short a SCHOLARLY ENDEAVOUR that is well worth being read by other descendants. Lorine McGinnis Schulze [email protected] ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ The Olive Tree Genealogy http://www.rootsweb.com/~ote/ The Canadian Military Heritage Project http://www.rootsweb.com/~canmil/ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Laura, I read this after sending the re-posting of Copyright/Ethics/Accuracy. If I were you, I'd try getting in touch with Gary B Hoffman and the other two copyright specialists who wrote those articles. Your query doesn't seem easy to answer, unless it's covered in the articles. I too would fear that I couldn't copyright my own work. I still think you should put communication with this person into writing, as he appears capable of twisting your words; it then becomes a matter of "he says, she says." Good luck. --------------- dsOn Mon, 29 Nov 1999 17:46:49 -0600 "Laura & Brad Koehn" <[email protected]> writes: Regarding the case of my family member publishing my work on CD's. He says that he is going to copyright the work in his own name and also in mine. (Keep in mind that I expressly told him NOT to publish MY work.) Should I let him go ahead and copyright his CD's in my name. Or should I tell him NOT to copyright in my name? Can he even do that? Shouldn't I do that myself? If he copyrights the ged-com information that I gave him before me, how does that affect my own copyright when I publish my book? Laura [email protected]

In case the following information was erased, here it is again. Good articles about copyright, ethics, and accuracy. Click on the blue URL under the title. Laura, I couldn't tell whether your query appeared here or on another e-list. You can find how-to advice in the Hoffman article. Restoring Ethics to Genealogy, by Barbara Brown http://www.iigs.org/newsletter/9904news/ethics.htm.en This is from the August Co, VA, GenWeb-- INTERNET GENEALOGY - WHAT'S GOOD! WHAT'S NOT! . . . AND WHAT ARE WE GOING TO DO ABOUT IT? by Bettie Cummings Cook, CG [Published in The Packet, Tri-State Genealogical Society, Evansville, IN, vol.XXII, no. 2(Dec. 1998)] http://www.rootsweb.com/~vaaugust/cook.htm These two are from the Oldham Co, KY, GenWeb -- Who Owns Genealogy? by Gary B Hoffman http://rootsweb.net/~kyoldham/gcopyright.html Database Copyrights, by Edmund B Burke http://rootsweb.net/~kyoldham/copyright.html We can also get information on U.S. and foreign copyrights through Mike Goad's "Linked Index to the U.S. Copyright Code" on his copyright site. http://www.rootsweb.com/~mikegoad/html/code.htm