MGC: One of my strong feelings I am getting in this region of Lynch/Linch, firstly I am not sure if I have 2 separate lines here or what, but, whatever that case, there must be between 2-4 links or associations to Bishops + Archbishops (!!!), and the descendants of Bishops and Archdeacons and other high church positions. But certainly Bishops. I don't know the exact links, but it must be there: Lynch - Kyng - Beadle - Others. This will pertain mainly to the Collins side coming into the DDM tree. Also, the name of 'Rowland' wherever it comes in. And I am almost certain that this 'Rowland' name is coming from a Bishop or similar. And anywhere around you see it, record it and post it. We have to look 'UP' for this tree, who were the mayors, bishops, town clerks, commissioners, etc. Also too: Where a higher gentry m. into their servant lines, like Francklin into Cory. I see virtually every single person mentioned anywhere around Daniel Collins as being related, they are all very closely related. These people have servants, not tents. This Martha Collins could well be someone quite high up, and we need a list of every single Martha Collins ever known of, that we can find. Also that Thomas Dove I think also became a Bishop or so, Bishops in Ireland for Lynch too. That Williamson note I gave out, that must be the fore-runner to the line of 'Mrs. Markham (Penrose)' which I also said before seems to be seriously close and descending from an Arch/Bishop line. Anwers: I can't make connection until we get a proper Collins list made out. That is a lot of work, but you have to make it up some time or another. Here is the tool I would use to start that list off with, and you can get all the church names etc. from it, but you must also make a list of ''associated surnames'' to check for each place as well. These ''associated surnames'' would increase as one would make the list up, that would also be a nagging problem. This is the most excellent tool: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~hughwallis/IGIBatchNumbers/CountryEngland.htm#PageTitle I have not written anything off. But, I want to zero in as per my last post and concentrate on the items I set out, where you were called. I can look at a lot of Collins, but I can only say the ones I can recognise at this point, they seem obvious ones. But what we are finding, is that is a huge number of relatives all around DDM and Martha Collins and in EC. Cory in EC must be listed. Phillipps, and so, all these people are relatives. Several clusters from several trees have to added in all round, and I have given out things things as I go along. My last post yesterday is where I am zooming in. Those are the things we need to zoom into. We actually have a lot of information near Martha Collins now, that is for sure. Also, and I nearly forgot, this Davis family must also be included too. === === === <<< Granted that in the same pedigree, Daniel Collins calls his father-in-law "Thos. Franklyn," whom we now know should be Thos. Francknell, ... but we all make mistakes .... So, what are you saying? You do not consider this a valid reference or information provided by Daniel Collins himself? >>>: I am going to answer your whole post, but only here. OK, let us go one step here at a time. The Francknell family is in the St. Peter le Poer church. The question is simple: [Daniel Collins calls his father-in-law "Thos. Franklyn," whom we now know should be Thos. Francknell]: Can we get the will of DC and read for ourselves who he says his FiL is ?. I have his w. as [Sybill Francklin]. As I explained, [Katherine Francknell] is DC's [sister(-in-law?)]. This will happen in time. [and his [DC's] niece Sibill Linch]: I want to know which brother? of DC has a dg named [Sibel Colenes][Sibill Collens; Collins][Sibill Linch]. Sibill Linch from London visits her sister 'Goodwife Markham' in EC. At least here you have her husband's name, relationships, etc. A lot to go on. This is why we need to stop and look in here. Lastly, who is the 'Weaver' ?. Is Martha Collins the w. of the Weaver or the Attorney ?. You see, Jas Markham, both of them, did live in EC for quite some time. The Weaver did have a son Mathew Markham. Dale: Could you just remind me if you don't mind, how do we know it is the Attorney Jas Markham who m. Martha Collins who had a son Daniel Markham ?. - S.K.M. - [!!!] ====================