here's the entire message for those of you who are interested...I'm going to have to email him to see where that pie chart is... ----Original Message Follows---- From: "Malcolm Dodd" <[email protected]> Reply-To: [email protected] To: [email protected] Subject: RE: [DNA] in light of Red Lake - DNAPrint Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 20:53:31 -0000 Ellen and others, Let us get some simple common sense into this discussion. Can DNA testing provide evidence (not proof, but evidence) of Native American affiliation. The answer in my opinion is yes, as set out in postings by Ann and me. It is up to the USA, Canadian and Mexican governments and BIA and others whether they use this new tool and that is outside the terms of this list. They will have to take into account that the tests are not infallible. The Irish are the least admixed population because of their geographical isolation. A high proportion of Jewish people have the R1a haplogroup and their origins are in central Eurasia. Take a look at the pie chart of Y and Mito haplogroups at World Families and you will see a completely different picture to that of Ireland. Note that if we sampled Western Ireland rather than the whole of the Island we would see an even greater singularity. This is what DNAPrint have found Group European....African.... E Asian.... N American Irish 96.4%.......0.7%........1.2%........1.7% Ashkenazi + M Eastern 85.4%.......6.4%........3.8%........4.4% Ashkenazi 86.8%.......4.7%........2.0%........6.6% Do you find it surprising that the Irish show so little African, Asian and N American? Do you think that because Jewish persons test with 6.6% N American they have a right to claim descendancy from American tribes? Their ancestors almost certainly lived with the ancestors of the Native Americans some 12,000 years ago in central Asia (in a shtetl I expect). Our origins go back over 150,000 years to Africa and the 12,000 year separation between those Amerindians and Jewish populations from Asia is much smaller than the likely 40,000 years between Western Europeans in Ireland and Asians. I do not have all the answers and we have much to learn about the migration of populations. Why DNAPrint find 4.7% African affiliation in Jewish populations I can not explain. However I note that an amalgamation with other Middle Eastern populations greatly increases the African affiliation, and that seems to make sense, given geographic proximity. Malcolm ============================== Census images 1901, 1891, 1881 and 1871, plus so much more. Ancestry.com's United Kingdom & Ireland Collection. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13968/rd.ashx