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    1. [CLOOZ] Can Clooz handle documents about relationships etc.?
    2. Jan Murphy via
    3. Ralf -- You say "In essence a marriage record often proves a three generation family tree." I am not familiar with the kind of marriage you are talking about that would list more than two generations (the married couple and their parents). But putting that aside for a moment -- One record is not proof. You have a record that makes a claim about a family tree. Just because it is written in a record, that doesn't make it so. I have a probate record that describes three generations of a family -- a man leaving shares in his estate to his grand-daughters (daughters of his daughter) with two of his sons acting as executors of the estate. This record confirmed a hypothesis I had made, but I had already built up a body of indirect evidence as part of my attempt at a proof. Documents have information in them. Genealogists write proof statements. For another family, I have a newspaper article about a funeral where two of the men who acted as bearers for the deceased are described as his nephews. From other information I have in my file, I know that it is far more likely that they are two of his grandsons. If I put these documents into Clooz first, before sending them over to Family Historian, I need to preserve the information about these claims somewhere. But I don't want Clooz to lock me into the relationships stated in the document, because the documents might not state the real relationship. Proving the real relationship is my job -- not the source's job. Best, Jan Jan Murphy [email protected] On Wed, Mar 23, 2016 at 12:00 AM, <[email protected]> wrote: > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Can Clooz handle documents about relationships etc.? (Ralf M.) > 2. Re: Can Clooz handle documents about relationships etc.? > (Terri Brown's Genealogy) > 3. Re: Can Clooz handle documents about relationships etc.? > (Rich Thomas) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2016 22:22:49 +0100 > From: "Ralf M." <[email protected]> > Subject: [CLOOZ] Can Clooz handle documents about relationships etc.? > To: [email protected] > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed > > Hello all, > > Recently I asked on a mailing list how to enter information of different > documents into a genealogy software and then have the software help me > draw conclusions how to put together the pieces to form a family tree > (as opposed to having to draw my conclusions "offline" and enter the > results into the software). I was told to have a look at Clooz (and > Evidentia). > > Watching the introductory videos Evidentia seems to require a lot of > typing, so I rather had a closer look at Clooz. By now I have watched > all the Clooz videos and read nearly the complete manual. At first Clooz > looked very promising, but then doubts started whether the software > really helps with what I would like to achieve. So I decided to ask here > about it rather than try the software not knowing how to use it. > > Among several concerns my main worry is the following: > > Clooz seems to be geared towards documents that contain details about > people (and cover a single event). Census data are like that, and the > examples in the videos use census data. > However, most of my documents are register records and focus on > relationships between people (parents and child, spouses with their > parents and possibly children, ...). There are also population register > records that typically document multiple events. > > Does Clooz handle such documents properly? > > E.g. I enter a birth record into Clooz (newborn and parents) and export > that to GEDCOM. Will the GEDCOM contain the fact that the newborn is the > child of the parents? After all a birth record is the most official > document I will ever get for the fact who the parents of the newborn are. > I am somewhat doubtful due to the explanations in the "Families Tab" > section of the manual. > > Things get even worse for a marriage record, which documents the married > couple and the parents of bride and groom, often supplemented by > information about children of the couple. In essence a marriage record > often proves a three generation family tree. And thus I expect the > GEDCOM which Clooz generates from such a marriage record to contain the > three generation family tree. > > Does Clooz work like that? > > Finally an example of a population register record. These were often > kept on index cards. The front side of such an index card contains > information about the people, like > Husband Adam Schmitt, born 21.3.1895 Berlin > Wife Berta Schmitt nee Meyer born 18.5.1899 Berlin > Child 1 Charlotte born 13.8.1920 Berlin > Child 2 David born 7.7.1922 Berlin > Child ... > (This does not necessarily imply that husband and wife are the parents > of the children, only that the children live in the household.) > The back side of such an index card contains information about their > moves. A card from Hamburg might look like > 15.9.1930 Adam from Berlin to Nordkanalstr. 25 > 1.12.1930 Adam from Nordkanalstr. 25 to Altonaer Str. 77 > 1.1.1931 Berta, Charlotte, David from Berlin to Altonaer Str. 77 > 1.5.1932 Family from Altonaer Str. 77 to Kanalstr. 8 > 27.3.1936 Charlotte from Kanalstr. 8 to Kiel > 9.8.1936 Charlotte from Kiel to Kanalstr. 8 > 1.8.1940 David from Kanalstr. 8 to Wilhelmshafen (military service) > 23.3.1941 Charlotte from Kanalstr. 8 to Billstr. 15 (now own card) > ... > There are occasionally further information on these index cards; I have > seen changes of religion and changes of citizenchip (both with a date). > > Is it possible to enter the content of such an index card (including the > back side) as a document in Clooz? > > > I'd be happy about any answers and how-to-explanations. > > Best regards, > Ralf M. >

    03/23/2016 02:24:50