I am not Sean, but this is my understanding. Choctaw is written with letters from the Roman alphabet as is English. Much of the work done on written Choctaw was done by Cyrus Byington. If you are referring to the story of Seqouia "inventing" a writing system for the Cherokee, you might be interested to know that some traditinal Cherokee claim that the writing system pre-dates European contact. Apparently, it was used only by medicine people. Part of the reason, the Cherokee re-acted so badly to what Sequoia did was that they felt that he had betrayed their traditions. Sequoia was of mixed-racial descent and Christian. He gave the syllabary (symbols matching the syallables in the language) to Christian missionaries. Cherokee is an Iroquois Language. I have talked to some traditional Onandagas (also Iroquois language) and they say that they indeed did have writing before Europeans came. George Ann >From: JohnnyMikeCraven@aol.com >Reply-To: CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L@rootsweb.com >To: CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [CHOCTAW-SE] parts of speech, word definitions, etc. >Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 02:27:35 EDT > >Hello Sean, > > thanks for the very informative email you sent me on grammar. I am >not as confused as I was. I've reprinted your email below so that others >who >may have missed it will be able to read it in its entirety since a lot of >us >on the list are having some trouble with names and their meanings, ect. > > Would you be able to put on the list a listing of all the >"articles" >that the Choctaw used in their sentences? > > Also, is the written language of the Choctaws a fairly recent >development, meaning within the last couple of hundred years or so? Was >there any one Choctaw considered most responsible for creating the Choctaw >language? > > John Craven > New Orleans > >In a message dated 7/24/2002 11:21:59 PM Central Daylight Time, >seanps@george.net writes: > > > > Yes John, > > > > The same word could be used at the beginning of a sentence, as a noun, >or > > at the end of a sentence, as a verb. Though I don't know what "hopiah" > > means myself, if it does mean "leader," it could also be used in verb >form > > meaning "to lead." > > > > Frequently in Choctaw the distinction between verb form (e.g., "to >lead") > > and noun form (e.g., "leader") is made my adding the prefix "na" or >"nan" > > (depending on whether the root word starts with a noun or a consonant). >For > > example, I was taught that the word for "to learn" is "ikhvna" and the >word > > for "student" (i.e., a learner) is "nanikhvna." I have however, also >seen > > the word "ikhvna" used to mean "student" without the "nan-" prefix. >Because > > of the way Choctaw sentences are constructed, if a word shows up in a > > certain place in the sentence, you know it has to be a noun (or verb, or > > whatever, depending on its > > position). English works the same way. > > > > In English, we usually add "-er" to a verb in order to make it a noun > > (e.g., lead...leader), but sometimes not. For example, a man can be a > > father or he can father a child (no change in word form). >Coincidentally, > > you can even do that with the word "lead," since someone can be the >"lead" > > in a given situation (most often used in reference to acting, but > > exclusively). As with Choctaw, where the word occurs in the sentence >gives > > you the context to determine whether it is a noun, verb, etc. ("He will > > lead us." as opposed to "He is the lead.") > > > > As for articles, in English those would be words like "the," "a," "an," > > "this," "that," and number words, which invariably come at the beginning >of > > a noun phrase. A "noun phrase" would be something like, "that big >house," > > where we have an article ("that") followed by an adjective ("big"), both >of > > which describe the noun ("house"). Which house? That big one. > > Interestingly (as George Ann pointed out), in Choctaw, noun phrases are > > constructed in EXACTLY the opposite order of how they would be >constructed > > in English, i.e., noun-adjective-article. So in Choctaw, "that big >house" > > would be correctly translated as "chukka chito > > yvmma" but, if you break it apart literally, "chukka" means "house" (the > > noun), "chito" means "big" (the adjective), and "yvmma" means "that one" > > (the article). > > > > The Choctaw language however, doesn't use articles as much as English. > > They/we really only use "yvmma" ("that"), "ilvppa" ("this"), and number > > words, and basically have no equivalents for "a," "an," and "the." >Instead > > of saying "the rabbit hopped" or "a rabbit hopped," they/we just say > > "rabbit hopped," and if you aren't sure which rabbit someone is talking > > about, they say "that white one over there." > > > > OK, enough grammar-babble from me for now. I am curious about the >"leader" > > vs. "bone-picker" dilemma over "hopiah," though. It could very well be a > > case of dual meaning depending on context but I would love to know for >sure. > > > > Hachi-pisa-l'achike. > > > > --Sean > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/22/2002 10:14:42 AM Central Daylight Time, > > > wood_owl@hotmail.com writes: > > > > > > > Choctaw is a noun-adjective-article language. > > > > That would be the significance of the location of word order. Also, >the > > > > verb always comes at the end of the sentence. > > > > > > > > George Ann > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, George Ann, > > > > > > if I understand what you are saying correctly, if Hopia occurs >at > > the > > > beginning of a name then it designates what that person was, such as >if > > Hopia > > > occurred at the beginning it means either "leader" or "bone picker" >but > > if it > > > occurs at the end it designates what a person did or how the person >did > > what > > > he did? I'm still a bit confused because I take article and noun to >mean > > the > > > same thing, that is that neither is a verb. > > > > > > Or are you saying that if Hopia occurs at the end then it is the > > verb > > > form of "leader" of "bone picker" and means "leads" or "picks bones"? > > > > > > Or am I just confused right now. > > > > > > John Craven > > > New Orleans > > > > > > > > >==== CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Mailing List ==== >Need more CHOCTAW information?? Try Rusty Lang's website at >http://www.choctaw-web.com for censuses, genealogy lessons, articles, etc. _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com