Family legend is that Henrietta was from "the reservation" or from Carthage, Ms. She married David Monroe Holt 1873 in Warren Co., Ms. She was not buried in Vicksburg City Cemetery, as was her husband, and it has been speculated that she may have been interred on the reservation. During a recent visit to the reservation at Philadelphia, Ms., I was told that if her name was Alexander, she would not have been buried in any of the res's cemeteries. How do I go about tracing her parents, etc., when I have no idea of their Native American names? Any advice on how to proceed would be greatly appreciated. [email protected]

Halito Angelyn: The group of people I have were turned down because the ancestor they enrolled under was turned down by the corrupt alcoholic William Ward. As you are aware, there were investigations into his conduct and many wrongdoings were found, such as being in league with corrupt attorneys who were speculating in Indian land. Ward would deny Choctaw he believed to be full bloods, because he thought it was easier to cheat full bloods. He would then give their land scrip to these attorneys who would sell it to whites. This is why there were whites settled on Choctaw land before the Choctaw even arrived in Oklahoma. So there could possibly be whites in Oklahoma who have inherited through the years, land that should have gone to my ancestors. Unfortunately, my ancestors were full bloods so they got the shaft. Although, the investigations found these wrongdoings they never allowed the victims any redress and the matter is closed for all time. In the microfilm of the Dawes' applications I have seen considerable evidence for the Choctaw heritage of my people. There were witnesses, other than family, who were of advanced age and knew John and Mary Ann Harper personally.They indicated they were full blood Choctaw, spoke the Choctaw language and that all of their children spoke the Choctaw language. They further indicated that they always spoke Choctaw when speaking amongst themselves or when speaking to Choctaw friends. They also indicated that John Harper was also known as Johnny Hopiah. The interviewers basically called them liars. I believe this is the case, because after the investigations of William Ward were closed and despite the overwhelming evidence of wrongdoing, the congress decided not to give the victims any redress. The results of the Dawes' commission then could not conflict with this, so they denied everyone who was a descendant of anyone denied by William Ward. In effect having to make up reasons to deny them, even if it meant essentially calling them liars or saying that they didn't look Indian, etc. I found further evidence of their heritage in my researches. For example, on the Kentucky tax lists, they are the only couple who had all of their property, including land and livestock listed in the wife's name, which we know to be Choctaw Custom. This would be very unusual at that time, as we know the Southeastern people came under tremendous criticism for having the females own all of the property. I am certain that old John Harper received great criticism for allowing his wife to own all of the property. Imafo [email protected] wrote: Thank you, thank you, thank you! I will forward this to someone petitioning the BIA to explain why a family member was rejected: "Dawes couldn't just say 'You're rejected' without giving a reason FOR the rejection". This will be very helpful to this family. Angelyn ---- Sharon Morgan wrote: > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of [email protected] > Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 13:59 > To: [email protected] > Subject: [CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST] MCR list > > Is there an online web site where you can view the MCR list? > > ------------------------------- > > > > > Go to www.archives.gov. Search "Dawes Final Rolls". There is an alphabetical > list. I used it & then sent off for the related folders, which had > transcripts of testimonies. > > > Dawes Rolls > More than 95% of the letters received by the Fort Worth Branch of the > National Archives relate to the Five Civilized Tribes and most of those > pertain to the Cherokee. If you are tracing a Cherokee ancestor, the place > to begin is with the Final Rolls of the Five Civilized Tribes (commonly > called the Dawes rolls). They contain the names of more than 101,000 people > enrolled under an act of Congress of June 27, 1898 (30 Stat. 459) which > authorized a Commission to the Five Civilized Tribes (under the chairmanship > of Senator Henry L. Dawes) to determine who was eligible for tribal > membership and thus entitled to an allotment of land. In 1887 the Federal > government embarked on the policy of extinguishing tribal title to land and > allotting it to individual Indians so there is generally a similar "final > roll" or allotment roll for most tribes. Tracing your ancestry to someone on > a "final roll" is usually the key to recognition by the Bureau of Indian > Affairs. > > The Dawes rolls only include people who were alive during the 1898-1907 > enrollment period. The index to the Dawes roll has been reproduced on roll 1 > of National Archives Microfilm Publication M1186 and many libraries in > Oklahoma have copies of the index printed by the BIA. If you find your > ancestor' s name, their Dawes roll number is the key to various other > records. Unlike most other "roll numbers", it was used by the BIA as a means > of positive identification (thus it is something like a social security > number). > Census Cards and Application Jackets > The Dawes roll number will lead you to a "census card" which contains > information about other family members who might have been enrolled, > references to earlier rolls used to verify eligibility (such as the 1880 > Cherokee census), and the names of the enrollee's parents (which will take > you one generation farther back, but no farther). The cards were prepared by > the Dawes Commission to enable the staff to keep track of the status of > enrollment applications and the originals were hauled around Indian > Territory in wagons as the staff gathered applications and took testimony. > The cards have also been reproduced on M1186. > For each card there is usually an application jacket which contains > transcripts of any testimony taken by the Commission, birth and death > affidavits, marriage licenses (sometimes), and correspondence between the > Commission and the applicants, their attorneys, and tribal officials. These > application jackets are microfilmed as M1301. In general, the more > controversial the applicant's claim the thicker the jacket. The jackets for > many full-bloods whose claim to membership was not disputed by the tribal > government usually contain very little genealogical information. > > Land Allotment Jackets > Once a person was enrolled they were eligible to select the land they wanted > as their allotment. The amount of land each person received varied from > tribe to tribe but generally consisted of a "homestead" which was > inalienable for a period of time and "surplus" which was often quickly sold > or leased. For each person enrolled, there is an "allotment jacket" which > contains an application giving the legal description of the land selected > and information about improvements on it and related documents such as plat > maps showing the location. The allotment jackets seldom contain much > genealogical information. In many cases, the Indian agency supervised the > subsequent sale or lease of allotted land but the records relating to these > transactions have very little genealogical value. > The fact that an ancestor "got land" in Oklahoma does not prove they were an > Indian because many non-Indians bought lots in townsites or purchased > "surplus" land from allotted Indians or "unallotted land" directly from the > Federal government. > The Dawes Commission rejected the applications of almost two out of every > three persons who applied so don't be surprised if your ancestor is not > listed in the "final roll". There is no comprehensive index to all the > rejected applicants but there are partial indexes to persons rejected as > Cherokee or Choctaw. For each rejected applicant there is a "census card" > and an "application jacket" but the catch here is that you have to know (or > find out) the census card number to find the records. > The best source of information about the allotment of the Five Civilized > Tribes is And Still the Waters Run by Angie Debo. For information about > allotment of other tribes see The Dawes Act and the Allotment of Indian > Lands by D. S. Otis. Most tribal histories also contain a chapter or two > about allotment. > > SOURCE: www.archives.gov > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message --------------------------------- Get your own web address for just $1.99/1st yr. We'll help. Yahoo! Small Business.

Fran, I followed your directions and removed the / at end of address. I clicked on several of the sites and contents. Some of the sites came up just fine, but not the books. Please try it and let me know what I am doing wrong. I am especially interested in the N.A.Missionary records. Thanks for your help, Jackie

Thank you, thank you, thank you! I will forward this to someone petitioning the BIA to explain why a family member was rejected: "Dawes couldn't just say 'You're rejected' without giving a reason FOR the rejection". This will be very helpful to this family. Angelyn ---- Sharon Morgan <[email protected]> wrote: > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of [email protected] > Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 13:59 > To: [email protected] > Subject: [CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST] MCR list > > Is there an online web site where you can view the MCR list? > > ------------------------------- > > > > > Go to www.archives.gov. Search "Dawes Final Rolls". There is an alphabetical > list. I used it & then sent off for the related folders, which had > transcripts of testimonies. > > > Dawes Rolls > More than 95% of the letters received by the Fort Worth Branch of the > National Archives relate to the Five Civilized Tribes and most of those > pertain to the Cherokee. If you are tracing a Cherokee ancestor, the place > to begin is with the Final Rolls of the Five Civilized Tribes (commonly > called the Dawes rolls). They contain the names of more than 101,000 people > enrolled under an act of Congress of June 27, 1898 (30 Stat. 459) which > authorized a Commission to the Five Civilized Tribes (under the chairmanship > of Senator Henry L. Dawes) to determine who was eligible for tribal > membership and thus entitled to an allotment of land. In 1887 the Federal > government embarked on the policy of extinguishing tribal title to land and > allotting it to individual Indians so there is generally a similar "final > roll" or allotment roll for most tribes. Tracing your ancestry to someone on > a "final roll" is usually the key to recognition by the Bureau of Indian > Affairs. > > The Dawes rolls only include people who were alive during the 1898-1907 > enrollment period. The index to the Dawes roll has been reproduced on roll 1 > of National Archives Microfilm Publication M1186 and many libraries in > Oklahoma have copies of the index printed by the BIA. If you find your > ancestor' s name, their Dawes roll number is the key to various other > records. Unlike most other "roll numbers", it was used by the BIA as a means > of positive identification (thus it is something like a social security > number). > Census Cards and Application Jackets > The Dawes roll number will lead you to a "census card" which contains > information about other family members who might have been enrolled, > references to earlier rolls used to verify eligibility (such as the 1880 > Cherokee census), and the names of the enrollee's parents (which will take > you one generation farther back, but no farther). The cards were prepared by > the Dawes Commission to enable the staff to keep track of the status of > enrollment applications and the originals were hauled around Indian > Territory in wagons as the staff gathered applications and took testimony. > The cards have also been reproduced on M1186. > For each card there is usually an application jacket which contains > transcripts of any testimony taken by the Commission, birth and death > affidavits, marriage licenses (sometimes), and correspondence between the > Commission and the applicants, their attorneys, and tribal officials. These > application jackets are microfilmed as M1301. In general, the more > controversial the applicant's claim the thicker the jacket. The jackets for > many full-bloods whose claim to membership was not disputed by the tribal > government usually contain very little genealogical information. > > Land Allotment Jackets > Once a person was enrolled they were eligible to select the land they wanted > as their allotment. The amount of land each person received varied from > tribe to tribe but generally consisted of a "homestead" which was > inalienable for a period of time and "surplus" which was often quickly sold > or leased. For each person enrolled, there is an "allotment jacket" which > contains an application giving the legal description of the land selected > and information about improvements on it and related documents such as plat > maps showing the location. The allotment jackets seldom contain much > genealogical information. In many cases, the Indian agency supervised the > subsequent sale or lease of allotted land but the records relating to these > transactions have very little genealogical value. > The fact that an ancestor "got land" in Oklahoma does not prove they were an > Indian because many non-Indians bought lots in townsites or purchased > "surplus" land from allotted Indians or "unallotted land" directly from the > Federal government. > The Dawes Commission rejected the applications of almost two out of every > three persons who applied so don't be surprised if your ancestor is not > listed in the "final roll". There is no comprehensive index to all the > rejected applicants but there are partial indexes to persons rejected as > Cherokee or Choctaw. For each rejected applicant there is a "census card" > and an "application jacket" but the catch here is that you have to know (or > find out) the census card number to find the records. > The best source of information about the allotment of the Five Civilized > Tribes is And Still the Waters Run by Angie Debo. For information about > allotment of other tribes see The Dawes Act and the Allotment of Indian > Lands by D. S. Otis. Most tribal histories also contain a chapter or two > about allotment. > > SOURCE: www.archives.gov > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

In a message dated 9/13/2006 1:43:14 P.M. Central Standard Time, [email protected] writes: Judy, I tried all the books on the genealogylibrary.org and message page cannot be displayed came up every time. What am I doing wrong? Jackie Jackie, I tried the site and it loaded fine for me. Make sure you are not including the / at the end of the URL, when you copy and paste . Fran Bolton

Thank you Jackie. De lorra

Judy, I tried all the books on the genealogylibrary.org and message page cannot be displayed came up every time. What am I doing wrong? Jackie ----- Original Message ----- From: "Judy White" <[email protected]> To: "Choctaw Mailing list" <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, September 07, 2006 9:38 AM Subject: Re: [CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST] New Online books > The American Indian as Participant in the Civil War > http://www.nanations.com/civil-war-participant.htm This is a very well > documented book, when you consider there are more footnotes than pages. > When reading, be sure to check the footnotes, a great deal of information > is provided in them. There is a map of border Warfare and the location of > tribes within the Indian Country. > > The Micmac Indians at Bay D'Espoir, > http://www.canadiangenealogy.net/micmac-indians.htm this is a letter from > the Secretary of State, but does list the names and number of family > members living on the reservation in 1908. > > Native Americans in the Census 1960-1890, > http://www.nanations.com/native-americans-census.htm information on how > the census information was gathered in regards to Indians. > > The Seminole Indians of Florida > http://www.nanations.com/seminole_indians_florida.htm Provides > information on the personal characteristics, clothing, adornment, Society, > and tribal organization. > > Code Talkers, our latest website http://www.codetalkers.info/ > > Genealogy Library http://www.genealogylibrary.org/ At present this lists > only our books. I am working on a form that will allow anyone to list > their books online. At present if you have any you would like included, > please just sent me an email and I will get them listed for you. > > Thanks > Judy > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

I'M NOT SURE IF ANY OF MY ANCESTORS MIGHT BE ON THE MCR, BUT I WAS JUST GOING TO LOOK THRU IT. I UNEXPECTEDLY FOUND SOME POSSIBLE ANCESTORS ON THE CHICKASAW DAWES ROLLS..........IN THE 'TYPE' COLUMN, DOES ANYONE KNOW WHAT THE LETTER 'C' MEANS? I ASSUME IF YOU WANT TO SEE AN ENROLLMENT CARD, YOU NEED TO ORDER IT FROM THE ARCHIVES, OR MAYBE I CAN GET IT FROM THE OKLAHOMA HISTORICAL SOCIETY.

THANK YOU!

Is there an online web site where you can view the MCR list?

-----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of [email protected] Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 13:59 To: [email protected] Subject: [CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST] MCR list Is there an online web site where you can view the MCR list? ------------------------------- Here's an even better (faster) source: http://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/finalroll.php Click "Dawes Final Rolls" -- fill in the family name -- the list will pop up. Dawes Final Rolls of the Five Civilized Tribes New: Final Roll Index| 1896 Census Applications | Guion Miller Roll Index | 1880 Cherokee Census Native American Rolls: Armstrong | Baker | Dawes Final Rolls | Kern | Reservation | Settlers | Ute | Wallace Criminal Records: Fort Smith Arkansas Criminal Records 1866-1900 Dawes is a list of those members of the Five Civilized Tribes who removed to Indian Territory (Oklahoma) during the 1800's and were living there during the above dates. IF YOUR ANCESTOR WAS NOT LIVING IN INDIAN TERRITORY DURING 1898-1914 THEY WILL NOT BE LISTED ON DAWES!! Only those Indians who RECEIVED LAND under the provisions of the Dawes Act are listed. It also lists those Freedmen who received land allotments as provided for in the Dawes Act. These pages can be searched to discover the enrollee's name, age, sex, blood degree, type, census card number and roll number. Check the headings in each column. Type denotes whether the record is from a Dawes card. Guide to the Final Rolls of the Five Civilized Tribes General Allotment Act or Dawes Act

The new books is FREE ONLINE at www.CDIBthebook.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Wilson" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 12:13 PM Subject: Re: [CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST] New book by Jackie Matte I have the other book and will definitely purchase this one. Jackie is "good People". Jackie Matte <[email protected]> wrote: Fay, I really appreciate your kind words. Thank you, Jackie ----- Original Message ----- From: "Faye Ratcliff" To: Sent: Thursday, August 31, 2006 10:21 PM Subject: Re: [CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST] New book by Jackie Matte > Jackie, > One of my most prized possessions is my copy of your book, "They Say The > Wind Is Red" and the personal note you wrote in it to me. Bless you for > the > love in your heart and the work in your hands. > Fay > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jackie Matte" > To: > Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2006 8:23 PM > Subject: Re: [CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST] New book by Jackie Matte > > >> Dusty, you are a true and valued friend. THANK YOU! Your support is very >> much appreciated. I continue to hope that if we make enough noise we >> will >> eventually get long overdue federal recognition. >> >> Blessings to you, Jackie >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: >> To: ; >> Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2006 5:31 PM >> Subject: [CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST] New book by Jackie Matte >> >> >> > To all: >> > >> > I received a message today from our dear Jackie Matte, Historian for >> > the >> > MOWA Choctaw of Alabama, that she and the tribal leaders have produced >> > another book in response to the government's refusal to give that group >> > official federal recognition, the result of a 25-year long effort of >> > the >> > part of the MOWA. The new book is entitled "CDIB (Corruption, Deceit, >> > Identity and Bureaucracy) In Indian Country". As some of you know, >> > Jackie is also the author of "They Say The Wind Is Red", chronicalling > the >> > 200-year history of the MOWA Choctaw in Alabama. You can access the > book >> > on-line at: >> > >> > http://www.cdibthebook.com >> > >> > Well worth the read!! >> > >> > dusty >> > List Admin. >> > >> > ------------------------------- >> > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' > without >> > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message --------------------------------- Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min. ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

James, here is another mention of a Cornelia Johnson: WINN, EDGAR 21 JOHNSON, CORNELIA MRS 24 1 DEC 1897 SHAWNEETOWN MC7©632 _http://www.rootsweb.com/~okgarvin/kinard/chockwmarr.htm_ (http://www.rootsweb.com/~okgarvin/kinard/chockwmarr.htm) Fran Bolton

James, while this is in no way proof that this is the same Cordelia Johnson you ask about, this article does mention that name, and a Patton: _http://iaphs.org/panola/chapter-1.html_ (http://iaphs.org/panola/chapter-1.html) One of the most successful academies of the 1840s was a small school opened in 1845 by Mrs N. Patton [26]. Mrs Patton's School for Young Ladies consisted of the following course of study: [27] Having a natural fondness for the sublime and beautiful my friend S. and myself procured a horse and buggy, on Friday ... and had the satisfaction of landing safely at Eureka Academy about sunset. This institution, under the care of Rev H.M. Morrison, assisted by Capt. Cannon has been ably conducted for the past session and liberally patronized. The music department, in charge of Miss Cornelia Johnson has been managed with unparalleled success. . This last exerpt is the last paragraph of the article, just before the NOTES to CHAPTER 1. I hope this will give you new leads to pursue. Fran Bolton

Was Johnson her married name? When did she live? My ggfather was named Columbus Johnson and I can't find him or his brothers and sisters. He was supposed to have been 1/2 choctaw (cherokee?) and 1/2 scottish. His wife was named Rene Worthy Johnson and was full choctaw. They were born and lived about the 1850-70's near what is now Antlers, OK. I hope this is not more confusion for you-- Johnsons among natives is like Chins for the chinese. Good Luck! Patricia Johnson ----- Original Message ----- From: James Brown<mailto:[email protected]> To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 7:43 AM Subject: [CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST] cornelia johnson I recently was told the name of my great grandfather's ( Choctaw Census# 2968 )sister. It was cornelia Johnson, does anyone have any information on this name? James ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

-----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of [email protected] Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 13:59 To: [email protected] Subject: [CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST] MCR list Is there an online web site where you can view the MCR list? ------------------------------- Go to www.archives.gov. Search "Dawes Final Rolls". There is an alphabetical list. I used it & then sent off for the related folders, which had transcripts of testimonies. Dawes Rolls More than 95% of the letters received by the Fort Worth Branch of the National Archives relate to the Five Civilized Tribes and most of those pertain to the Cherokee. If you are tracing a Cherokee ancestor, the place to begin is with the Final Rolls of the Five Civilized Tribes (commonly called the Dawes rolls). They contain the names of more than 101,000 people enrolled under an act of Congress of June 27, 1898 (30 Stat. 459) which authorized a Commission to the Five Civilized Tribes (under the chairmanship of Senator Henry L. Dawes) to determine who was eligible for tribal membership and thus entitled to an allotment of land. In 1887 the Federal government embarked on the policy of extinguishing tribal title to land and allotting it to individual Indians so there is generally a similar "final roll" or allotment roll for most tribes. Tracing your ancestry to someone on a "final roll" is usually the key to recognition by the Bureau of Indian Affairs. The Dawes rolls only include people who were alive during the 1898-1907 enrollment period. The index to the Dawes roll has been reproduced on roll 1 of National Archives Microfilm Publication M1186 and many libraries in Oklahoma have copies of the index printed by the BIA. If you find your ancestor' s name, their Dawes roll number is the key to various other records. Unlike most other "roll numbers", it was used by the BIA as a means of positive identification (thus it is something like a social security number). Census Cards and Application Jackets The Dawes roll number will lead you to a "census card" which contains information about other family members who might have been enrolled, references to earlier rolls used to verify eligibility (such as the 1880 Cherokee census), and the names of the enrollee's parents (which will take you one generation farther back, but no farther). The cards were prepared by the Dawes Commission to enable the staff to keep track of the status of enrollment applications and the originals were hauled around Indian Territory in wagons as the staff gathered applications and took testimony. The cards have also been reproduced on M1186. For each card there is usually an application jacket which contains transcripts of any testimony taken by the Commission, birth and death affidavits, marriage licenses (sometimes), and correspondence between the Commission and the applicants, their attorneys, and tribal officials. These application jackets are microfilmed as M1301. In general, the more controversial the applicant's claim the thicker the jacket. The jackets for many full-bloods whose claim to membership was not disputed by the tribal government usually contain very little genealogical information. Land Allotment Jackets Once a person was enrolled they were eligible to select the land they wanted as their allotment. The amount of land each person received varied from tribe to tribe but generally consisted of a "homestead" which was inalienable for a period of time and "surplus" which was often quickly sold or leased. For each person enrolled, there is an "allotment jacket" which contains an application giving the legal description of the land selected and information about improvements on it and related documents such as plat maps showing the location. The allotment jackets seldom contain much genealogical information. In many cases, the Indian agency supervised the subsequent sale or lease of allotted land but the records relating to these transactions have very little genealogical value. The fact that an ancestor "got land" in Oklahoma does not prove they were an Indian because many non-Indians bought lots in townsites or purchased "surplus" land from allotted Indians or "unallotted land" directly from the Federal government. The Dawes Commission rejected the applications of almost two out of every three persons who applied so don't be surprised if your ancestor is not listed in the "final roll". There is no comprehensive index to all the rejected applicants but there are partial indexes to persons rejected as Cherokee or Choctaw. For each rejected applicant there is a "census card" and an "application jacket" but the catch here is that you have to know (or find out) the census card number to find the records. The best source of information about the allotment of the Five Civilized Tribes is And Still the Waters Run by Angie Debo. For information about allotment of other tribes see The Dawes Act and the Allotment of Indian Lands by D. S. Otis. Most tribal histories also contain a chapter or two about allotment. SOURCE: www.archives.gov

Many libraries or state archives have sets of the orginal publication of American State Papers. I was fortunate to use these back in 1980s and copy whatever I wanted. Now these volumes may be in the "rare" book collection. However, to use volumes now,I simply put "American State Papers" into Google and came up with the websites for them. American State Papers Homepage U.S. Congressional Documents. Click on that and it takes you to the cite with instructions on how to find whatever you are looking for. Also, it gives you address of Davidson Library, click on that and again you have resources to help you locate specific topics. For example I have a hard copy of Public Lands, Document 1230, 23rd Cong. 1st Session from Volume VII; this has the 1831 Choctaw Roll, plus all the litigation surrounding Indian land and removal. There are 38 volumes and each category is listed, you can jump to any topic you are interested in, plus it allows you to "turn the page" WOW! This site is wonderful! Good luck, Jackie I wish all this had been available 25 years ago!! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Wilson" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 11:58 AM Subject: Re: [CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST] 1874 selected names San Bois Halito Jackie: It has been a while since we talked. I have been ill, plus my computer crashed. I wondered if you would mind giving us a quick tutorial on using the "American State Paters". Also, a list of American Indian, especially Choctaw, information that might be in them. I understand that there is considerable information in there, e.g. the investigation into the corruption of William Ward with witness testimony. Yakoke. Imafo Jackie Matte <[email protected]> wrote: Jennifer, What a great addition to Choctaw rcords. Joseph Kribbs below is from Mobile, Alabama area. The family name is actually spelled Krebs. In the 1831 Armstrong Roll it is spelled "Placed Crapes" on p. 36 and "Plasseed Crapes" on p. 136. Placide Krebs m. a Choctaw woman and went West. Stephen Crapes (Krebs) is listed just below him. The Krebs family was in Mobile area during Colonial era. The following is from American State Papers, Public Lands, Vol. 1: "P. 66 Frances Krebs, husband of the widow, Madame Lame, daughter of Madame Mauran, owner of Round Island 16 leagues from Mobile & 30 leagues from New Orleans, was given a grant to the land 12/12/1783 by Grimarest. The original grant had been made in 1745 as was testified to by Messrs. Chastang, Dubroca & Daset, old inhabitants of the neighborhood." Hope this helps some of the Krebs descendants! Jackie ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Friday, September 01, 2006 9:58 AM Subject: [CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST] 1874 selected names San Bois > Jennifer: > > Thanks for all your work. This is valuable information. > > dusty > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jennifer Mieirs" > To: > Cc: > Sent: Thursday, August 31, 2006 11:59 PM > Subject: [CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST] 1874 selected names San Bois > > >> This comes from the Oklahoma Historical Society, it is a faded microfilm > roll at the Arkansas Historical Commission, there are three rolls (between > all the counties) with dated and undated census, including the 1896...the > film is hard to read, there is no call number for this microfilm... >> >> Below are extractions of some selected names....I will get more as I > can... >> >> Name, <10, 10-18, 18-21, 21-45, >45, Fe <16, Fe >16 >> David Colbert, 1, 1, 0, 0, 1, 2, 1 >> Mckee King, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 4, 2 >> Tecumseh King, 2, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 0 >> William Cooper, 0, 1, 1, 0, 1, 0, 1 >> Henry Cooper, 2, 0, 0, 1, 0, 0, 1 >> Alexander Cooper, 1, 0, 0, 1, 0, 0, 1 >> Susan Walls, 1, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1 >> Colwell Cooper, 1, 0, 1, 1, 0, 1, 1 >> Leonidus Colbert, 2, 0, 0, 1, 0, 3, 1 >> Sam Cooper, 0, 1, 0, 1, 0, 0, 1 >> B. A. Lowrey, 0, 1, 1, 1, 0, 2, 3 >> Moses Riddle, 1, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 2 >> Harris Kincaid, 0, 0, 0, 1, 1, 1, 1 >> Lucy Serret, 2, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 1 >> Edmond Gardner, 0, 1, 1, 0, 1, 3, 2 >> James Bumgarner >> (wife Susan Walker), 0, 1, 0, 1, 0, 0, 2 >> M(?r or s) Wall, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 3, 3 >> Thomas Folsom, 2, 0, 2, 1, 0, 0, 3 >> Thomas Walls, 2, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 1 >> Millie(?) King, 1, 1, 0, 3, 0, 2, 2 >> Jesse Jones, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1 >> Jefferson Perry, 2, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 1 >> Commondor Perry, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 2 >> Mrs D. Folsom, 0, 1, 2, 1, 0, 2, 2 >> Ward Garland, 1, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 2 >> Isaac Garland, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 3 >> Mrs. J. Jones, 0, 0, 0, 2, 0, 0, 3 >> Solomon Folsom, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 2, 3 >> Peter Garland, 1, 1, 0, 1, 0, 2, 2 >> M. Garland, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 0, 2 >> J. Garland, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 0, 1 >> S. Fulsom, 0, 0, 0, 2, 0, 0, 1 >> Eli Perry, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1 >> James King, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 0, 1 >> James Garland, 1, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 1 >> >> The Following had no date, and nothing for the columns, again, it is not > the whole page, based on my gedcom, I am estimating the date to be before > 1863, as Edmond McCurtain has no children, and his first child was born in > 1863 >> Mckee King 1001042 >> William Cooper 0301002 >> Courwill (?) Cooper 0010001 >> Sam Cooper 0010000 >> Susan E. Cooper 0000011 >> Joseph Kribbs 1001004 >> James King 3010041 >> Lewis Cass 0031001 >> Edmond McCurtain 0001001 >> Sallis James 0001001 >> Eli Perry 0001011 >> >> Jennifer Mieirs >> My genealogy home page: >> http://jenniferhsrn2.homestead.com >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message --------------------------------- How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! 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Jackie, that would be very nice and helpful. James ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Wilson" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 11:58 AM Subject: Re: [CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST] 1874 selected names San Bois Halito Jackie: It has been a while since we talked. I have been ill, plus my computer crashed. I wondered if you would mind giving us a quick tutorial on using the "American State Paters". Also, a list of American Indian, especially Choctaw, information that might be in them. I understand that there is considerable information in there, e.g. the investigation into the corruption of William Ward with witness testimony. Yakoke. Imafo Jackie Matte <[email protected]> wrote: Jennifer, What a great addition to Choctaw rcords. Joseph Kribbs below is from Mobile, Alabama area. The family name is actually spelled Krebs. In the 1831 Armstrong Roll it is spelled "Placed Crapes" on p. 36 and "Plasseed Crapes" on p. 136. Placide Krebs m. a Choctaw woman and went West. Stephen Crapes (Krebs) is listed just below him. The Krebs family was in Mobile area during Colonial era. The following is from American State Papers, Public Lands, Vol. 1: "P. 66 Frances Krebs, husband of the widow, Madame Lame, daughter of Madame Mauran, owner of Round Island 16 leagues from Mobile & 30 leagues from New Orleans, was given a grant to the land 12/12/1783 by Grimarest. The original grant had been made in 1745 as was testified to by Messrs. Chastang, Dubroca & Daset, old inhabitants of the neighborhood." Hope this helps some of the Krebs descendants! Jackie ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Friday, September 01, 2006 9:58 AM Subject: [CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST] 1874 selected names San Bois > Jennifer: > > Thanks for all your work. This is valuable information. > > dusty > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jennifer Mieirs" > To: > Cc: > Sent: Thursday, August 31, 2006 11:59 PM > Subject: [CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST] 1874 selected names San Bois > > >> This comes from the Oklahoma Historical Society, it is a faded microfilm > roll at the Arkansas Historical Commission, there are three rolls (between > all the counties) with dated and undated census, including the 1896...the > film is hard to read, there is no call number for this microfilm... >> >> Below are extractions of some selected names....I will get more as I > can... >> >> Name, <10, 10-18, 18-21, 21-45, >45, Fe <16, Fe >16 >> David Colbert, 1, 1, 0, 0, 1, 2, 1 >> Mckee King, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 4, 2 >> Tecumseh King, 2, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 0 >> William Cooper, 0, 1, 1, 0, 1, 0, 1 >> Henry Cooper, 2, 0, 0, 1, 0, 0, 1 >> Alexander Cooper, 1, 0, 0, 1, 0, 0, 1 >> Susan Walls, 1, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1 >> Colwell Cooper, 1, 0, 1, 1, 0, 1, 1 >> Leonidus Colbert, 2, 0, 0, 1, 0, 3, 1 >> Sam Cooper, 0, 1, 0, 1, 0, 0, 1 >> B. A. Lowrey, 0, 1, 1, 1, 0, 2, 3 >> Moses Riddle, 1, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 2 >> Harris Kincaid, 0, 0, 0, 1, 1, 1, 1 >> Lucy Serret, 2, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 1 >> Edmond Gardner, 0, 1, 1, 0, 1, 3, 2 >> James Bumgarner >> (wife Susan Walker), 0, 1, 0, 1, 0, 0, 2 >> M(?r or s) Wall, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 3, 3 >> Thomas Folsom, 2, 0, 2, 1, 0, 0, 3 >> Thomas Walls, 2, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 1 >> Millie(?) King, 1, 1, 0, 3, 0, 2, 2 >> Jesse Jones, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1 >> Jefferson Perry, 2, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 1 >> Commondor Perry, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 2 >> Mrs D. Folsom, 0, 1, 2, 1, 0, 2, 2 >> Ward Garland, 1, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 2 >> Isaac Garland, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 3 >> Mrs. J. Jones, 0, 0, 0, 2, 0, 0, 3 >> Solomon Folsom, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 2, 3 >> Peter Garland, 1, 1, 0, 1, 0, 2, 2 >> M. Garland, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 0, 2 >> J. Garland, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 0, 1 >> S. Fulsom, 0, 0, 0, 2, 0, 0, 1 >> Eli Perry, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1 >> James King, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 0, 1 >> James Garland, 1, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 1 >> >> The Following had no date, and nothing for the columns, again, it is not > the whole page, based on my gedcom, I am estimating the date to be before > 1863, as Edmond McCurtain has no children, and his first child was born in > 1863 >> Mckee King 1001042 >> William Cooper 0301002 >> Courwill (?) Cooper 0010001 >> Sam Cooper 0010000 >> Susan E. Cooper 0000011 >> Joseph Kribbs 1001004 >> James King 3010041 >> Lewis Cass 0031001 >> Edmond McCurtain 0001001 >> Sallis James 0001001 >> Eli Perry 0001011 >> >> Jennifer Mieirs >> My genealogy home page: >> http://jenniferhsrn2.homestead.com >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message --------------------------------- How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messenger's low PC-to-Phone call rates. ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I have the other book and will definitely purchase this one. Jackie is "good People". Jackie Matte <[email protected]> wrote: Fay, I really appreciate your kind words. Thank you, Jackie ----- Original Message ----- From: "Faye Ratcliff" To: Sent: Thursday, August 31, 2006 10:21 PM Subject: Re: [CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST] New book by Jackie Matte > Jackie, > One of my most prized possessions is my copy of your book, "They Say The > Wind Is Red" and the personal note you wrote in it to me. Bless you for > the > love in your heart and the work in your hands. > Fay > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jackie Matte" > To: > Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2006 8:23 PM > Subject: Re: [CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST] New book by Jackie Matte > > >> Dusty, you are a true and valued friend. THANK YOU! Your support is very >> much appreciated. I continue to hope that if we make enough noise we >> will >> eventually get long overdue federal recognition. >> >> Blessings to you, Jackie >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: >> To: ; >> Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2006 5:31 PM >> Subject: [CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST] New book by Jackie Matte >> >> >> > To all: >> > >> > I received a message today from our dear Jackie Matte, Historian for >> > the >> > MOWA Choctaw of Alabama, that she and the tribal leaders have produced >> > another book in response to the government's refusal to give that group >> > official federal recognition, the result of a 25-year long effort of >> > the >> > part of the MOWA. The new book is entitled "CDIB (Corruption, Deceit, >> > Identity and Bureaucracy) In Indian Country". As some of you know, >> > Jackie is also the author of "They Say The Wind Is Red", chronicalling > the >> > 200-year history of the MOWA Choctaw in Alabama. You can access the > book >> > on-line at: >> > >> > http://www.cdibthebook.com >> > >> > Well worth the read!! >> > >> > dusty >> > List Admin. >> > >> > ------------------------------- >> > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' > without >> > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message --------------------------------- Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min.

Halito Jackie: It has been a while since we talked. I have been ill, plus my computer crashed. I wondered if you would mind giving us a quick tutorial on using the "American State Paters". Also, a list of American Indian, especially Choctaw, information that might be in them. I understand that there is considerable information in there, e.g. the investigation into the corruption of William Ward with witness testimony. Yakoke. Imafo Jackie Matte <[email protected]> wrote: Jennifer, What a great addition to Choctaw rcords. Joseph Kribbs below is from Mobile, Alabama area. The family name is actually spelled Krebs. In the 1831 Armstrong Roll it is spelled "Placed Crapes" on p. 36 and "Plasseed Crapes" on p. 136. Placide Krebs m. a Choctaw woman and went West. Stephen Crapes (Krebs) is listed just below him. The Krebs family was in Mobile area during Colonial era. The following is from American State Papers, Public Lands, Vol. 1: "P. 66 Frances Krebs, husband of the widow, Madame Lame, daughter of Madame Mauran, owner of Round Island 16 leagues from Mobile & 30 leagues from New Orleans, was given a grant to the land 12/12/1783 by Grimarest. The original grant had been made in 1745 as was testified to by Messrs. Chastang, Dubroca & Daset, old inhabitants of the neighborhood." Hope this helps some of the Krebs descendants! Jackie ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Friday, September 01, 2006 9:58 AM Subject: [CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST] 1874 selected names San Bois > Jennifer: > > Thanks for all your work. This is valuable information. > > dusty > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jennifer Mieirs" > To: > Cc: > Sent: Thursday, August 31, 2006 11:59 PM > Subject: [CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST] 1874 selected names San Bois > > >> This comes from the Oklahoma Historical Society, it is a faded microfilm > roll at the Arkansas Historical Commission, there are three rolls (between > all the counties) with dated and undated census, including the 1896...the > film is hard to read, there is no call number for this microfilm... >> >> Below are extractions of some selected names....I will get more as I > can... >> >> Name, <10, 10-18, 18-21, 21-45, >45, Fe <16, Fe >16 >> David Colbert, 1, 1, 0, 0, 1, 2, 1 >> Mckee King, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 4, 2 >> Tecumseh King, 2, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 0 >> William Cooper, 0, 1, 1, 0, 1, 0, 1 >> Henry Cooper, 2, 0, 0, 1, 0, 0, 1 >> Alexander Cooper, 1, 0, 0, 1, 0, 0, 1 >> Susan Walls, 1, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1 >> Colwell Cooper, 1, 0, 1, 1, 0, 1, 1 >> Leonidus Colbert, 2, 0, 0, 1, 0, 3, 1 >> Sam Cooper, 0, 1, 0, 1, 0, 0, 1 >> B. A. Lowrey, 0, 1, 1, 1, 0, 2, 3 >> Moses Riddle, 1, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 2 >> Harris Kincaid, 0, 0, 0, 1, 1, 1, 1 >> Lucy Serret, 2, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 1 >> Edmond Gardner, 0, 1, 1, 0, 1, 3, 2 >> James Bumgarner >> (wife Susan Walker), 0, 1, 0, 1, 0, 0, 2 >> M(?r or s) Wall, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 3, 3 >> Thomas Folsom, 2, 0, 2, 1, 0, 0, 3 >> Thomas Walls, 2, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 1 >> Millie(?) King, 1, 1, 0, 3, 0, 2, 2 >> Jesse Jones, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1 >> Jefferson Perry, 2, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 1 >> Commondor Perry, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 2 >> Mrs D. Folsom, 0, 1, 2, 1, 0, 2, 2 >> Ward Garland, 1, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 2 >> Isaac Garland, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 3 >> Mrs. J. Jones, 0, 0, 0, 2, 0, 0, 3 >> Solomon Folsom, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 2, 3 >> Peter Garland, 1, 1, 0, 1, 0, 2, 2 >> M. Garland, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 0, 2 >> J. Garland, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 0, 1 >> S. Fulsom, 0, 0, 0, 2, 0, 0, 1 >> Eli Perry, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1 >> James King, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 0, 1 >> James Garland, 1, 0, 0, 1, 0, 1, 1 >> >> The Following had no date, and nothing for the columns, again, it is not > the whole page, based on my gedcom, I am estimating the date to be before > 1863, as Edmond McCurtain has no children, and his first child was born in > 1863 >> Mckee King 1001042 >> William Cooper 0301002 >> Courwill (?) Cooper 0010001 >> Sam Cooper 0010000 >> Susan E. Cooper 0000011 >> Joseph Kribbs 1001004 >> James King 3010041 >> Lewis Cass 0031001 >> Edmond McCurtain 0001001 >> Sallis James 0001001 >> Eli Perry 0001011 >> >> Jennifer Mieirs >> My genealogy home page: >> http://jenniferhsrn2.homestead.com >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message --------------------------------- How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messenger’s low PC-to-Phone call rates.