Hello Don, It looks as though Randle JUDGSON may have been married previously (1761) to a Martha Laurence? (same occupation and same parish) The marriage entry to Margaret Hornby unfortunately does not give a marital status of either party, so Margaret Hornby could have been a widow and although at that time she was of the parish of Bunbury, it may not have been her place of birth. So you may be looking for a baptism under a different surname or in a different parish. Does she marry again in 1798 to a Richard Read? regards, Elaine. -----Original Message----- From: Don Tomkinson Sent: Saturday, October 26, 2013 3:07 PM To: CHESHIRE List message Subject: [CHS] MARGARET HORNBY I'm interested in finding the origins of Margaret HORNBY, born Bunbury and married Randle JUDSON in Nantwich 19 August 1776. She doesn't show up in the Bunbury baptisms on the CPR data base or Family Search, except for the marriage. I'd be grateful to hear of any connections. DON TOMKINSON ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to CHESHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I'm interested in finding the origins of Margaret HORNBY, born Bunbury and married Randle JUDSON in Nantwich 19 August 1776. She doesn't show up in the Bunbury baptisms on the CPR data base or Family Search, except for the marriage. I'd be grateful to hear of any connections. DON TOMKINSON

Is Elizabeth still on the list? Anyone have a current email address for her? Thanks, Lyn

Sent from my iPad Begin forwarded message: > From: Gill Gladwin <maygladwin@gmail.com> > Date: 24 October 2013 19:05:49 BST > To: "CANAL-PEOPLE-L@rootsweb.com" <CANAL-PEOPLE-L@rootsweb.com> > Subject: Runcorn,Manchester Ship Canal,Bridgewater Canal > > Hello fellow researchers, > My family interest is in a"Brown" family".....there are lots of them all in or around Runcorn Cheshire UK. > > The earliest one I can definitely claim is Peter Brown married to Elizabeth Nicholas. On 1871 census there is a Peter of the right age master of a boat The Countess of Ellesmere. I can't establish what type of vessel this was. His son George and grandson George Alfred kept records of their workmates,boats and their cargoes going from Runcorn to Manchester .the record is dated 1899 to 1915. > The original is in the Ellesmere Port Museum. I have a paper copy which I can search if anyone thinks a relative will be there. > I also have some lists relating to a school in Ellesmere Port 1873 to 1906 which record details of boatmen and their families,again I would be willing to search. > Best wishes > May > > Sent from my iPad

Thanks for the information - much appreciated Hope this gets through as I don't see a "reply" facility Cliff

Guy, Thanks for the info. I will look into it in more detail later but my first thought is that the farm is much nearer Gawsworth than Mutlow so is unlikely to be one of the farms referred to. A pity as it was a nice suggestion. But I will check on the ownership of the farm later. Thanks again, Christine From: Guy Lawton Sent: Tuesday, October 22, 2013 9:49 AM To: Christine Benson ; cheshire@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [CHS] Marking on parish burial register Christine Herewith the information I promised you a couple of days ago. Mutlow ecclesiastical location: The Gawsworth entry in “Notitia Cestriensis” of Bishop Gastrell [1714-1725], Chetham Socy vol VIII (1845), page 272 states “3 houses in [the] townsp. of Marton, in a place called Mutlaw, belong to this par.” White’s “History, Gazetteer and Directory of Cheshire” (1860), page 668 states “At Mutlow...are three farms which pay church rates, poor rates and tithes to Gawsworth, and highway rates to Marton. These farms are the property of A. H. Davenport, Esq”. “The Place-Names of Cheshire”, vol I (1970), page 81 makes clear that Mutlow is a detached part of Gawsworth parish lying within Marton parish. I hope this information is of help Guy

Thanks Alan, that explains the apparent anomaly in the records, and, together with Ruth's reply, confirms Sutton as the marriage place. Christine -----Original Message----- From: Alan Bennett Sent: Tuesday, October 22, 2013 6:58 AM To: Christine Benson Cc: CHESHIRE mailing list Subject: Re: [CHS] Joshua WHITAKERS' marriage Sutton was a. Chapel of Ease for St Michael. As such the marriage was at Sutton but had to be also recorded at St Michael.

Hi Ruth, Many thanks for that. When I looked yesterday I did not find the original or the licence, only the typed “original”. And I was looking with wildcards because of the various spellings so I can’t think why I didn’t find them. And it confirms Sutton as the marriage place. I agree with you it is the 14th and I can see where 17th and 19th have come from with people’s different interpretation of that entry. Thanks again, Christine From: Ruth J Sent: Tuesday, October 22, 2013 11:00 AM To: Cheshire ; christinebenson313@btinternet.com Subject: Joshua WHITAKERS' marriage FMP has the original Macclesfield entry written by the Curate so I guess that that is as original as it gets (meaning that the Curate could have written it at the actual time of the marriage, or copied it later from notes made at the time or remembered by him hours, weeks or months later - we will never know). FMP also shows the licence issued to the couple which states that 'their said Marriage to be openly solemnized in the Face of the Chapells of Congleton, Wincle or Sutton between the Hours of Eight and Twelve of the Clock in the Forenoon'. It is dated 31 October 1726. The marriage entry in Macclesfield Parish Register is dated 14 November 'Lica vi apud Sutton per Jon: Hanson' (Licence at Sutton by Jon[athan] Hanson'. Jonathan Hanson was the Curate at Macclesfield. When he writes numbers his 9s are rounded and his 4s are square. Ruth

FMP has the original Macclesfield entry written by the Curate so I guess that that is as original as it gets (meaning that the Curate could have written it at the actual time of the marriage, or copied it later from notes made at the time or remembered by him hours, weeks or months later - we will never know). FMP also shows the licence issued to the couple which states that 'their said Marriage to be openly solemnized in the Face of the Chapells of Congleton, Wincle or Sutton between the Hours of Eight and Twelve of the Clock in the Forenoon'. It is dated 31 October 1726. The marriage entry in Macclesfield Parish Register is dated 14 November 'Lica vi apud Sutton per Jon: Hanson' (Licence at Sutton by Jon[athan] Hanson'. Jonathan Hanson was the Curate at Macclesfield. When he writes numbers his 9s are rounded and his 4s are square. Ruth

Sutton was a. Chapel of Ease for St Michael. As such the marriage was at Sutton but had to be also recorded at St Michael. Sent from my iPhone > On 21 Oct 2013, at 23:28, "Christine Benson" <christinebenson313@btinternet.com> wrote: > > Hi All, > > According to FamilySearch Joshua WHITAKERS (various spellings) married > Rebecca HAMMOND (various spellings) in November 1726 on the 14th, 17th or > 19th. They married at St Michael, Macclesfield. That agrees with FMP's > transcription but the "original" says they married at Sutton and St Michael > is not at Sutton to the best of my belief. And the "original" is not an > original but a later typed up copy which appears to merge sources. > > I suspect the correct date is the 19th but can anyone confirm that and say > where they married and/or explain the anomalies in the records. > > Thanks for any help. > > Christine > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to CHESHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi All, According to FamilySearch Joshua WHITAKERS (various spellings) married Rebecca HAMMOND (various spellings) in November 1726 on the 14th, 17th or 19th. They married at St Michael, Macclesfield. That agrees with FMP's transcription but the "original" says they married at Sutton and St Michael is not at Sutton to the best of my belief. And the "original" is not an original but a later typed up copy which appears to merge sources. I suspect the correct date is the 19th but can anyone confirm that and say where they married and/or explain the anomalies in the records. Thanks for any help. Christine

Hello Cliff I think you will find that widow died at a date between the first and second probate and because she hadn't completed dealing with her late husband's estate it was necessary for someone else to take up where she left off. Probably as simple as one item that couldn't be dealt with without the second probate. Mike Shropshire, UK ____________________________________ On 21/10/2013 14:28, Cliff Jones wrote: > Hi folks > > I have found a entry in the NCP where probate was granted to an > ancestor's widow a couple of months after his death There is another > entry five years later where administration (with will) is granted to > his sister-in-law - the NCP shows the following footnote : Former > grant P R [date] The effects in the second entry are about 20% of > those in the first entry > > Would appreciate some indication of what the story is here, please > > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please > send an email to CHESHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word > 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the > message > >

Hi folks I have found a entry in the NCP where probate was granted to an ancestor's widow a couple of months after his death There is another entry five years later where administration (with will) is granted to his sister-in-law - the NCP shows the following footnote : Former grant P R [date] The effects in the second entry are about 20% of those in the first entry Would appreciate some indication of what the story is here, please

These are a few of the lines I'm researching. Denyse Bonney in Queensland. -- Abraham BOULDERSTONE marr Sarah CARTWRIGHT 11 Aug 1777 Sandbach .. chn William, Ann, Samuel, Sarah, Abraham, Mary, John. Richard CREWE marr Mary WALLEY 13 Apr 1739 Bunbury .. chn Elizabeth, Ann, Robert, Hannah, Richard, Hannah, Samuel, John. James HARDING marr Ann DENTITH 27 Aug 1730 Bunbury .. James, Ann, Martha, Richard, William, John.

Norris, I have FOX in the same area John (of Haslington) b 1815 m Mary MOSES 1843 , 7 Children. Father Timothy. but I think we have said this before in 2004. I have a few hundred MOSES connections. Regards Eric Millward ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2014.0.4158 / Virus Database: 3614/6766 - Release Date: 10/20/13

Eric Millward's request for the location of Sandy Brow (Stockport) has proved quite interesting. Not so much as to where it was, but for what it was (a meeting place and especially a protest meeting place in 1818-1829). Let me first of all confirm Sandy Brow was that area from (approximately) Duke Street to Stopford House, Piccadilly (see Steve Cliffe, STOCKPORT History & Guide). A few months before ‘Peterloo’ (August 1819) a large protest meeting took place on Sandy Brow (February 1819). William Astle tells us (in THE HISTORY OF STOCKPORT 1922) that the protesters “"resisted, and the authorities were defied"” (p.10). To celebrate this victory a poem entitled Sandy Brow was published and the following being an extract (sic): Hail! Sacred spot, to truth and virtue dear, Where freedom’s truths have often charmed my ear, Hail! Sacred spot, where freedom’s standard wavered, And all the force of proud oppression braved. Let ages yet unborn hear, when and how, The sons of freedom fought on Sandy brow. An online search turned up (on liveauctioneers.com) a copy of this poem (to be auctioned) with the description: O'Bryan (Henry Ross) Sandy-Brow, a Poem, only edition, some foxing and browning, ink signature of Aircraftsman A.W. Bowyer of the RAF based at Bedford and with pencil notes of various towns in the UK dated 30 January 1945, a few pencil sketches on blank ff. at end, later morocco-backed cloth, [no other copy traced], 8vo, Manchester, Printed at the Observer Office... and Published by the Author, 1819. A radical poem of the large gathering at Sandy Brow in Stockport 1819. This is not the poem written and published (1819-1822) by Samuel Bamford, incidentally, entitled The Fray at Stockport. The auction for the Henry Ross-O’Bryan poem was in 2010 and the expected price was to be £400-£600. I don’t know if it was sold or if it was, to whom. All very interesting. David Gilligan Sent from Samsung Galaxy Note -------- Original message -------- From: Eric Millward <bruckshaw1@tiscali.co.uk> Date: 20/10/2013 21:35 (GMT+00:00) To: Cheshire List <cheshire@rootsweb.com> Subject: [CHS] Sandy Brow, Stockport Re my earlier request, you can all stop searching. Many thanks but I have found it in a 2011 report about conservation in the Market Place area of Stockport. It refers to: "" a large reservoir ‘at the foot of Sandy Brow, now Duke Street’"" I know it well. Eric Millward ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2014.0.4158 / Virus Database: 3614/6766 - Release Date: 10/20/13 ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to CHESHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Eric Millward’s request for the location of Sandy Brow (Stockport) has proved quite interesting. Not so much as to where it was but for what it was (a meeting place and especially a protest meeting place in 1818-1829). A few months before ‘Peterloo’ (August 1819) a large meeting took place on Sandy Brow (February 1819) to protest about the Corn Laws. William Astle tells us (in The History of Stockport 1922) that the protesters “resisted, and the authorities were defied” (p.10). To celebrate this victory a poem entitled Sandy Brow was published and the following being an extract: Hail! Sacred spot, to truth and virtue dear, Where freedom’s truths have often charmed my ear, Hail! Sacred spot, where freedom’s standard wavered, And all the force of proud oppression braved. Let ages yet unborn hear, when and how, The sons of freedom fought on Sandy brow.   An online search turned up (on liveauctioneers.com) a copy of this poem with the description: O'Bryan (Henry Ross) Sandy-Brow, a Poem, only edition, some foxing and browning, ink signature of Aircraftsman A.W. Bowyer of the RAF based at Bedford and with pencil notes of various towns in the UK dated 30 January 1945, a few pencil sketches on blank ff. at end, later morocco-backed cloth, [no other copy traced], 8vo, Manchester, Printed at the Observer Office... and Published by the Author, 1819. A radical poem of the large gathering at Sandy Brow in Stockport 1819.   The auction was in 2010 and the expected price was to be between £400-£600. I don’t know if it was sold or if it was to whom.   All very interesting.   David Gilligan Sent from Samsung Galaxy Note -------- Original message -------- From: Eric Millward <bruckshaw1@tiscali.co.uk> Date: 20/10/2013 21:35 (GMT+00:00) To: Cheshire List <cheshire@rootsweb.com> Subject: [CHS] Sandy Brow, Stockport Re my earlier request, you can all stop searching. Many thanks but I have found it in a 2011 report about conservation in the Market Place area of Stockport. It refers to: "" a large reservoir ‘at the foot of Sandy Brow, now Duke Street’"" I know it well. Eric Millward ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2014.0.4158 / Virus Database: 3614/6766 - Release Date: 10/20/13 ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to CHESHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Re my earlier request, you can all stop searching. Many thanks but I have found it in a 2011 report about conservation in the Market Place area of Stockport. It refers to: "" a large reservoir ‘at the foot of Sandy Brow, now Duke Street’"" I know it well. Eric Millward ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2014.0.4158 / Virus Database: 3614/6766 - Release Date: 10/20/13

Thanks to all who have replied and , in particular, to Mike who sent me the 1894 map. My local history book says that Sandy Brow was near to the Windmill Room and there is a Windmill Street adjoining Edward Street, (incidentally it is adjacent to Michael St where I was born). We are close there I think. I have ancestors in almost every street on that map Mike. Many thanks. I have just Googled for Windmill Room and found that it was a non-conformist meeting room on Edward St. By 1818 it was Congregational. The protesters I mentioned earlier used it as a base for meetings. There is a Congregational Chapel on Windmill St and it is possible that this was the site of the Windmill Room. The sand pit looks a little far away from Windmill St but is an interesting possibilty. Eric Millward ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2014.0.4158 / Virus Database: 3614/6766 - Release Date: 10/20/13

It is enumerated on the 1851 census There are three properties on the page 11 Duke Street 13 Kershaw Street and 14 Sandy Brow The next page has Kershaws Row And the previous one has Duke Street. Does this help Antony Lambert -----Original Message----- From: cheshire-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:cheshire-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Mike Morris Sent: 20 October 2013 19:47 To: Eric Millward; cheshire@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [CHS] Sandy Brow, Stockport Hi Eric Following the line of Edward street to the east and you will come to Gorsey Brow running almost in a south direction. Just across this and inline with Edward was a Sandpit. It was so big they put it on the map. My thinking is Sandy Brow was related to that area a short distance from Edward. I have sent you a copy of this map dated around 1894. Regards Mike Morris Toronto Canada >________________________________ > From: Eric Millward <bruckshaw1@tiscali.co.uk> >To: Cheshire List <cheshire@rootsweb.com> >Sent: Sunday, October 20, 2013 12:41:41 PM >Subject: [CHS] Sandy Brow, Stockport > >84 years in Stockport and I do not know where Sandy Brow was/is! From a >local history book I learn it was not far from Edward Street <snip> > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to CHESHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message