Halito Barbara, Gemma And Dusty Last night I was talking to my nephew about the problem that we are having of our kids getting involved with gangs and such. I was looking back on my life and the road that I took and tried to explain why It took that course. In my experience I believe Indian people have a innerself that needs to be a part of a tribe, this is our makeup our genetic being and our ancestors survival trait. In this day and age a lot of us being removed from the tribal closeness that were searching for took a lot of different roads. Luckly some of us finally found the Red road and are coming back to the home fires of our people. When the rest finally find their way back we need to be there to help them. For seven generations Walk in Beauty Elkdreamer >From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] twinkies >Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 14:01:33 -0500 > >Those who have grown up in Indian communities but seem to have no knowledge >of their own spirituality are still aware of something inside that is >different, even if they don't know what it is.(Because of the thick >assimilation) >And it is my hope that more of our people will recognise that we are not >"second class" and that our spirituality is not just a matter of "beliefs", >and that it is not "inferior" to the spirituality any other race of >people...It is also my hope that those non-Indians who can learn a better >way of living in balance from Indians, or whoever, will do so... >B. >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Gemma West" <gemmawest@usa.net> >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> >Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 1:35 PM >Subject: [CHAHTA] twinkies > > > > What has happened for many people is that they wander through life >trying >to > > figure out what is wrong...trying to figure out why they don't fit in. > > Attempts are made to mold themselves into someone else's defintions of >good > > and bad. These attempts fail. Finally that person decides to look to >their > > ancestors. They find themselves. They finally feel comfortable. It is > > obvious to all that ancestors shape our biological characteristics. It >is > > obvious to me that ancestors shape our spirituality. The sad thing is >that > > sometimes the assimilation is so thick that you can grow up around >Indians >and > > still not know your own spirituality. The beautiful thing is finding >the >few > > who have refused assimilation and are willing to share knowledge. > > > > When non-Indian people ask to be allowed into the community it causes us >to > > question ourselves. Does community still exist? What are they here to >get? > > Are we really different from them? I think the great thing about this >reverse > > acculturation is that it is spurring some of us to re-embrace our own > > ancestors. It is removing the shame that our elders had to live with. >This > > shame had no place and that is becoming clear to new generations. If we >can > > influence people to live a balanced life then that is a great thing. >After > > all, our children and their children will have to live in a world shaped >by > > the parents. We can not afford to be selfish with principles of >balance. >It > > seems that they need these principles much more than we do. > > > > > > > > Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> wrote: > > "Our spirituality" is not "just an idea" and it is not something we went >to > > class and learned somewhere, or got off the internet...it is born in us > > (which is obvious to those Indians who were raised surrounded by a white > > society) and a non-Indian may be able to learn from us some things, but >they > > cannot "acquire" what they are not born with, and their attempts to put > > themselves on an "equal footing", with Indians, so to speak, is at best > > futile...and at worst, an attempt at cultural theft... > > B. > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:59 PM > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > I shall play devil's advocate again and expose my rear to everyone's > > slings > > > and arrows... > > > > > > What about those people who do not "want to be NA", but just think >our > > > spirituality, philosophy and way of life is a good idea. I've had > > countless > > > elders tell me, "I don't care what kind of blood you have, as long as >it's > > > human". Just because an Anglo wants to practice our ways because it >works > > > for them, doesn't mean they deserve to be belittled by a derogatory >name. > > > Are there really that many among us that are so arrogant to do so. > > > > > > Where did we ever get the idea that that we were so exclusive? Isn't >that > > > TRUE racism? > > > > > > dusty > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: John & Arla Williams <jaws@crosstel.net> > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:45 PM > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > Elkdreamer, Where did the term come from? Arla > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:38 PM > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Fay > > > > > Mostly people that want to be N/A and really have no Indian blood >at > > all > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: > > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the >quotes > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > Choctaw Home Page: > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at > > http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________ > > Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== >Choctaw Home Page: >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

i had to choose an extracurricular activity i choose gang rehabilitation they remain a gang and friends but do things differently ----- Original Message ----- From: Elkdreamer Wilkins <elkdremr@hotmail.com> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 7:36 PM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] twinkies > Halito Barbara, Gemma And Dusty > Last night I was talking to my nephew about the problem that we are having > of our kids getting involved with gangs and such. I was looking back on my > life and the road that I took and tried to explain why It took that course. > In my experience I believe Indian people have a innerself that needs to be a > part of a tribe, this is our makeup our genetic being and our ancestors > survival trait. In this day and age a lot of us being removed from the > tribal closeness that were searching for took a lot of different roads. > Luckly some of us finally found the Red road and are coming back to the home > fires of our people. > When the rest finally find their way back we need to be there to help > them. > For seven generations > Walk in Beauty > Elkdreamer > > >From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] twinkies > >Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 14:01:33 -0500 > > > >Those who have grown up in Indian communities but seem to have no knowledge > >of their own spirituality are still aware of something inside that is > >different, even if they don't know what it is.(Because of the thick > >assimilation) > >And it is my hope that more of our people will recognise that we are not > >"second class" and that our spirituality is not just a matter of "beliefs", > >and that it is not "inferior" to the spirituality any other race of > >people...It is also my hope that those non-Indians who can learn a better > >way of living in balance from Indians, or whoever, will do so... > >B. > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Gemma West" <gemmawest@usa.net> > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > >Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 1:35 PM > >Subject: [CHAHTA] twinkies > > > > > > > What has happened for many people is that they wander through life > >trying > >to > > > figure out what is wrong...trying to figure out why they don't fit in. > > > Attempts are made to mold themselves into someone else's defintions of > >good > > > and bad. These attempts fail. Finally that person decides to look to > >their > > > ancestors. They find themselves. They finally feel comfortable. It is > > > obvious to all that ancestors shape our biological characteristics. It > >is > > > obvious to me that ancestors shape our spirituality. The sad thing is > >that > > > sometimes the assimilation is so thick that you can grow up around > >Indians > >and > > > still not know your own spirituality. The beautiful thing is finding > >the > >few > > > who have refused assimilation and are willing to share knowledge. > > > > > > When non-Indian people ask to be allowed into the community it causes us > >to > > > question ourselves. Does community still exist? What are they here to > >get? > > > Are we really different from them? I think the great thing about this > >reverse > > > acculturation is that it is spurring some of us to re-embrace our own > > > ancestors. It is removing the shame that our elders had to live with. > >This > > > shame had no place and that is becoming clear to new generations. If we > >can > > > influence people to live a balanced life then that is a great thing. > >After > > > all, our children and their children will have to live in a world shaped > >by > > > the parents. We can not afford to be selfish with principles of > >balance. > >It > > > seems that they need these principles much more than we do. > > > > > > > > > > > > Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> wrote: > > > "Our spirituality" is not "just an idea" and it is not something we went > >to > > > class and learned somewhere, or got off the internet...it is born in us > > > (which is obvious to those Indians who were raised surrounded by a white > > > society) and a non-Indian may be able to learn from us some things, but > >they > > > cannot "acquire" what they are not born with, and their attempts to put > > > themselves on an "equal footing", with Indians, so to speak, is at best > > > futile...and at worst, an attempt at cultural theft... > > > B. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:59 PM > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > I shall play devil's advocate again and expose my rear to everyone's > > > slings > > > > and arrows... > > > > > > > > What about those people who do not "want to be NA", but just think > >our > > > > spirituality, philosophy and way of life is a good idea. I've had > > > countless > > > > elders tell me, "I don't care what kind of blood you have, as long as > >it's > > > > human". Just because an Anglo wants to practice our ways because it > >works > > > > for them, doesn't mean they deserve to be belittled by a derogatory > >name. > > > > Are there really that many among us that are so arrogant to do so. > > > > > > > > Where did we ever get the idea that that we were so exclusive? Isn't > >that > > > > TRUE racism? > > > > > > > > dusty > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: John & Arla Williams <jaws@crosstel.net> > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:45 PM > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > Elkdreamer, Where did the term come from? Arla > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:38 PM > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Fay > > > > > > Mostly people that want to be N/A and really have no Indian blood > >at > > > all > > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: > > > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the > >quotes > > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > Choctaw Home Page: > > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at > > > http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________ > > > Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > >Choctaw Home Page: > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... >

Halito Elkdreamer, I just finished reading a most interesting book - "Searching for the Bright Path, the Mississippi Choctaw from Prehistory to Removal," by James Taylor Carson, 1999, University of Nebraska Press, ISBN 0-8032-1503-7. On the inside front cover appears the following, "... Blending an engaging narrative style with broader theoretical considerations, James Taylor Carson offers the most complete history of the Mississippi Choctaws to date. He traces the story of the Choctaws from their origins in the Mississippian cultures of late prehistory through their varied encounters with the French, Spanish, English, Africans, and Americans, concluding with their forced removal to Indian Territory in the early nineteenth century. Carson shows how the Choctaws struggled to adapt to life in a New World altered radically by contact while retaining their sense of identify and place. Despite changes in subsistence practices and material culture, the Choctaws made every effort to retain certain core cultural beliefs and sensibilities, a strategy they conceived of as following 'the straight bright path'." For those interested in the old ways and your origins, I heartily recommend it. I found myself asking is the "straight bright path" of the old ones what you refer to today as the "red road," or is there a difference? At 07:36 PM 04/05/2001 -0700, you wrote: >Halito Barbara, Gemma And Dusty > Last night I was talking to my nephew about the problem that we are > having of our kids getting involved with gangs and such. I was looking > back on my life and the road that I took and tried to explain why It took > that course. In my experience I believe Indian people have a innerself > that needs to be a part of a tribe, this is our makeup our genetic being > and our ancestors survival trait. In this day and age a lot of us being > removed from the tribal closeness that were searching for took a lot of > different roads. Luckly some of us finally found the Red road and are > coming back to the home fires of our people. > When the rest finally find their way back we need to be there to help them. > For seven generations > Walk in Beauty > Elkdreamer > >>From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> >>Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com >>To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com >>Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] twinkies >>Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 14:01:33 -0500 >> >>Those who have grown up in Indian communities but seem to have no knowledge >>of their own spirituality are still aware of something inside that is >>different, even if they don't know what it is.(Because of the thick >>assimilation) >>And it is my hope that more of our people will recognise that we are not >>"second class" and that our spirituality is not just a matter of "beliefs", >>and that it is not "inferior" to the spirituality any other race of >>people...It is also my hope that those non-Indians who can learn a better >>way of living in balance from Indians, or whoever, will do so... >>B. >>----- Original Message ----- >>From: "Gemma West" <gemmawest@usa.net> >>To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> >>Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 1:35 PM >>Subject: [CHAHTA] twinkies >> >> >> > What has happened for many people is that they wander through life trying >>to >> > figure out what is wrong...trying to figure out why they don't fit in. >> > Attempts are made to mold themselves into someone else's defintions of >>good >> > and bad. These attempts fail. Finally that person decides to look to >>their >> > ancestors. They find themselves. They finally feel comfortable. It is >> > obvious to all that ancestors shape our biological characteristics. It is >> > obvious to me that ancestors shape our spirituality. The sad thing is >>that >> > sometimes the assimilation is so thick that you can grow up around Indians >>and >> > still not know your own spirituality. The beautiful thing is finding the >>few >> > who have refused assimilation and are willing to share knowledge. >> > >> > When non-Indian people ask to be allowed into the community it causes us >>to >> > question ourselves. Does community still exist? What are they here to >>get? >> > Are we really different from them? I think the great thing about this >>reverse >> > acculturation is that it is spurring some of us to re-embrace our own >> > ancestors. It is removing the shame that our elders had to live with. >>This >> > shame had no place and that is becoming clear to new generations. If we >>can >> > influence people to live a balanced life then that is a great thing. >>After >> > all, our children and their children will have to live in a world shaped >>by >> > the parents. We can not afford to be selfish with principles of balance. >>It >> > seems that they need these principles much more than we do. >> > >> > >> > >> > Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> wrote: >> > "Our spirituality" is not "just an idea" and it is not something we went >>to >> > class and learned somewhere, or got off the internet...it is born in us >> > (which is obvious to those Indians who were raised surrounded by a white >> > society) and a non-Indian may be able to learn from us some things, but >>they >> > cannot "acquire" what they are not born with, and their attempts to put >> > themselves on an "equal footing", with Indians, so to speak, is at best >> > futile...and at worst, an attempt at cultural theft... >> > B. >> > ----- Original Message ----- >> > From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> >> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> >> > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:59 PM >> > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies >> > >> > >> > > I shall play devil's advocate again and expose my rear to everyone's >> > slings >> > > and arrows... >> > > >> > > What about those people who do not "want to be NA", but just think >>our >> > > spirituality, philosophy and way of life is a good idea. I've had >> > countless >> > > elders tell me, "I don't care what kind of blood you have, as long as >>it's >> > > human". Just because an Anglo wants to practice our ways because it >>works >> > > for them, doesn't mean they deserve to be belittled by a derogatory >>name. >> > > Are there really that many among us that are so arrogant to do so. >> > > >> > > Where did we ever get the idea that that we were so exclusive? Isn't >>that >> > > TRUE racism? >> > > >> > > dusty >> > > >> > > >> > > ----- Original Message ----- >> > > From: John & Arla Williams <jaws@crosstel.net> >> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> >> > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:45 PM >> > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies >> > > >> > > >> > > > Elkdreamer, Where did the term come from? Arla >> > > > ----- Original Message ----- >> > > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> >> > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> >> > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:38 PM >> > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > Halito Fay >> > > > > Mostly people that want to be N/A and really have no Indian blood at >> > all >> > > > > Walk in Beauty >> > > > > Elkdreamer >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== >> > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: >> > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com >> > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes >> > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... >> > > > >> > > >> > > >> > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== >> > > Choctaw Home Page: >> > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ >> > > >> > >> > >> > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== >> > Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at >> > http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. >> > >> > >> > ____________________________________________________________________ >> > Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 >> > >> > >> > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== >> > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: >> > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com >> > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes >> > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... >> > >> >> >>==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== >>Choctaw Home Page: >>http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > >_________________________________________________________________ >Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== >TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: >Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > Regards, Dennis K. Boswell 301 Crow Canyon Drive Folsom, CA 95630 Tel: (916) 987-3599 Fax: (916) 987-3555

I agree with everything you say. Unfortunately, there are those who do not want us back. They reject us as having been "tainted" by too much white blood, too much white ideas, and a million other excuses. dusty ----- Original Message ----- From: Elkdreamer Wilkins <elkdremr@hotmail.com> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 9:36 PM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] twinkies > Halito Barbara, Gemma And Dusty > Last night I was talking to my nephew about the problem that we are having > of our kids getting involved with gangs and such. I was looking back on my > life and the road that I took and tried to explain why It took that course. > In my experience I believe Indian people have a innerself that needs to be a > part of a tribe, this is our makeup our genetic being and our ancestors > survival trait. In this day and age a lot of us being removed from the > tribal closeness that were searching for took a lot of different roads. > Luckly some of us finally found the Red road and are coming back to the home > fires of our people. > When the rest finally find their way back we need to be there to help > them. > For seven generations > Walk in Beauty > Elkdreamer > > >From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] twinkies > >Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 14:01:33 -0500 > > > >Those who have grown up in Indian communities but seem to have no knowledge > >of their own spirituality are still aware of something inside that is > >different, even if they don't know what it is.(Because of the thick > >assimilation) > >And it is my hope that more of our people will recognise that we are not > >"second class" and that our spirituality is not just a matter of "beliefs", > >and that it is not "inferior" to the spirituality any other race of > >people...It is also my hope that those non-Indians who can learn a better > >way of living in balance from Indians, or whoever, will do so... > >B. > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Gemma West" <gemmawest@usa.net> > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > >Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 1:35 PM > >Subject: [CHAHTA] twinkies > > > > > > > What has happened for many people is that they wander through life > >trying > >to > > > figure out what is wrong...trying to figure out why they don't fit in. > > > Attempts are made to mold themselves into someone else's defintions of > >good > > > and bad. These attempts fail. Finally that person decides to look to > >their > > > ancestors. They find themselves. They finally feel comfortable. It is > > > obvious to all that ancestors shape our biological characteristics. It > >is > > > obvious to me that ancestors shape our spirituality. The sad thing is > >that > > > sometimes the assimilation is so thick that you can grow up around > >Indians > >and > > > still not know your own spirituality. The beautiful thing is finding > >the > >few > > > who have refused assimilation and are willing to share knowledge. > > > > > > When non-Indian people ask to be allowed into the community it causes us > >to > > > question ourselves. Does community still exist? What are they here to > >get? > > > Are we really different from them? I think the great thing about this > >reverse > > > acculturation is that it is spurring some of us to re-embrace our own > > > ancestors. It is removing the shame that our elders had to live with. > >This > > > shame had no place and that is becoming clear to new generations. If we > >can > > > influence people to live a balanced life then that is a great thing. > >After > > > all, our children and their children will have to live in a world shaped > >by > > > the parents. We can not afford to be selfish with principles of > >balance. > >It > > > seems that they need these principles much more than we do. > > > > > > > > > > > > Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> wrote: > > > "Our spirituality" is not "just an idea" and it is not something we went > >to > > > class and learned somewhere, or got off the internet...it is born in us > > > (which is obvious to those Indians who were raised surrounded by a white > > > society) and a non-Indian may be able to learn from us some things, but > >they > > > cannot "acquire" what they are not born with, and their attempts to put > > > themselves on an "equal footing", with Indians, so to speak, is at best > > > futile...and at worst, an attempt at cultural theft... > > > B. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:59 PM > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > I shall play devil's advocate again and expose my rear to everyone's > > > slings > > > > and arrows... > > > > > > > > What about those people who do not "want to be NA", but just think > >our > > > > spirituality, philosophy and way of life is a good idea. I've had > > > countless > > > > elders tell me, "I don't care what kind of blood you have, as long as > >it's > > > > human". Just because an Anglo wants to practice our ways because it > >works > > > > for them, doesn't mean they deserve to be belittled by a derogatory > >name. > > > > Are there really that many among us that are so arrogant to do so. > > > > > > > > Where did we ever get the idea that that we were so exclusive? Isn't > >that > > > > TRUE racism? > > > > > > > > dusty > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: John & Arla Williams <jaws@crosstel.net> > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:45 PM > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > Elkdreamer, Where did the term come from? Arla > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:38 PM > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Fay > > > > > > Mostly people that want to be N/A and really have no Indian blood > >at > > > all > > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: > > > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the > >quotes > > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > Choctaw Home Page: > > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at > > > http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________ > > > Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > >Choctaw Home Page: > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... >

If I may ask, who might "those" be? Are there Choctaws included in "those?" At 09:59 PM 04/05/2001 -0500, you wrote: >I agree with everything you say. Unfortunately, there are those who do not >want us back. They reject us as having been "tainted" by too much white >blood, too much white ideas, and a million other excuses. > >dusty >----- Original Message ----- >From: Elkdreamer Wilkins <elkdremr@hotmail.com> >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> >Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 9:36 PM >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] twinkies > > > > Halito Barbara, Gemma And Dusty > > Last night I was talking to my nephew about the problem that we are >having > > of our kids getting involved with gangs and such. I was looking back on my > > life and the road that I took and tried to explain why It took that >course. > > In my experience I believe Indian people have a innerself that needs to be >a > > part of a tribe, this is our makeup our genetic being and our ancestors > > survival trait. In this day and age a lot of us being removed from the > > tribal closeness that were searching for took a lot of different roads. > > Luckly some of us finally found the Red road and are coming back to the >home > > fires of our people. > > When the rest finally find their way back we need to be there to help > > them. > > For seven generations > > Walk in Beauty > > Elkdreamer > > > > >From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] twinkies > > >Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 14:01:33 -0500 > > > > > >Those who have grown up in Indian communities but seem to have no >knowledge > > >of their own spirituality are still aware of something inside that is > > >different, even if they don't know what it is.(Because of the thick > > >assimilation) > > >And it is my hope that more of our people will recognise that we are not > > >"second class" and that our spirituality is not just a matter of >"beliefs", > > >and that it is not "inferior" to the spirituality any other race of > > >people...It is also my hope that those non-Indians who can learn a better > > >way of living in balance from Indians, or whoever, will do so... > > >B. > > >----- Original Message ----- > > >From: "Gemma West" <gemmawest@usa.net> > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > >Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 1:35 PM > > >Subject: [CHAHTA] twinkies > > > > > > > > > > What has happened for many people is that they wander through life > > >trying > > >to > > > > figure out what is wrong...trying to figure out why they don't fit in. > > > > Attempts are made to mold themselves into someone else's defintions of > > >good > > > > and bad. These attempts fail. Finally that person decides to look to > > >their > > > > ancestors. They find themselves. They finally feel comfortable. It >is > > > > obvious to all that ancestors shape our biological characteristics. >It > > >is > > > > obvious to me that ancestors shape our spirituality. The sad thing is > > >that > > > > sometimes the assimilation is so thick that you can grow up around > > >Indians > > >and > > > > still not know your own spirituality. The beautiful thing is finding > > >the > > >few > > > > who have refused assimilation and are willing to share knowledge. > > > > > > > > When non-Indian people ask to be allowed into the community it causes >us > > >to > > > > question ourselves. Does community still exist? What are they here >to > > >get? > > > > Are we really different from them? I think the great thing about this > > >reverse > > > > acculturation is that it is spurring some of us to re-embrace our own > > > > ancestors. It is removing the shame that our elders had to live with. > > >This > > > > shame had no place and that is becoming clear to new generations. If >we > > >can > > > > influence people to live a balanced life then that is a great thing. > > >After > > > > all, our children and their children will have to live in a world >shaped > > >by > > > > the parents. We can not afford to be selfish with principles of > > >balance. > > >It > > > > seems that they need these principles much more than we do. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> wrote: > > > > "Our spirituality" is not "just an idea" and it is not something we >went > > >to > > > > class and learned somewhere, or got off the internet...it is born in >us > > > > (which is obvious to those Indians who were raised surrounded by a >white > > > > society) and a non-Indian may be able to learn from us some things, >but > > >they > > > > cannot "acquire" what they are not born with, and their attempts to >put > > > > themselves on an "equal footing", with Indians, so to speak, is at >best > > > > futile...and at worst, an attempt at cultural theft... > > > > B. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:59 PM > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > I shall play devil's advocate again and expose my rear to everyone's > > > > slings > > > > > and arrows... > > > > > > > > > > What about those people who do not "want to be NA", but just think > > >our > > > > > spirituality, philosophy and way of life is a good idea. I've had > > > > countless > > > > > elders tell me, "I don't care what kind of blood you have, as long >as > > >it's > > > > > human". Just because an Anglo wants to practice our ways because it > > >works > > > > > for them, doesn't mean they deserve to be belittled by a derogatory > > >name. > > > > > Are there really that many among us that are so arrogant to do so. > > > > > > > > > > Where did we ever get the idea that that we were so exclusive? >Isn't > > >that > > > > > TRUE racism? > > > > > > > > > > dusty > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: John & Arla Williams <jaws@crosstel.net> > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:45 PM > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Elkdreamer, Where did the term come from? Arla > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:38 PM > > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Fay > > > > > > > Mostly people that want to be N/A and really have no Indian >blood > > >at > > > > all > > > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: > > > > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the > > >quotes > > > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > Choctaw Home Page: > > > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at > > > > http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________ > > > > Get free email and a permanent address at >http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > >Choctaw Home Page: > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== >Got a GRIPE?? Got a PROBLEM?? Just wanna' WHINE? Don't post it to the >list...write me, dusty (list administrator) at >CHAHTA-L-admin@cultures.rootsweb.com Regards, Dennis K. Boswell 301 Crow Canyon Drive Folsom, CA 95630 Tel: (916) 987-3599 Fax: (916) 987-3555