I am not a student of anthroplogy so I looked it up in the dictionary!! anthropology = the study of man, esp. of variety, physical and cultural characteristics, distribution, customs, social relationships, etc. of mankind: often restricted to the study of the institutions, myths, etc. of nonliterate peoples. Hmmmm As for "Flight or Fight", I never thought of it as a "human" trait, but as an animal one. You pray to the "sprit" of a cow, pig, chicken, egg, etc. for them being so nice as to allow themselves to be killed so that you can eat them? WOW!!! Jim jmorsn@coastalnet.com http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 12:34 PM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > Halito Jim > Grandfather is a term that we use in respect for the Creator of life. > And as a student of anthroplogy I also know about the flight or fight > reasoning that humans have. This instinct is what has enabled our species > to survive. The offering that I refer to is the respect that we give to the > animals spirit and acknowledging that we all are part of the circle of life. > Walk in Beauty > Elkdreamer > > >From: "Jim Morrison, Jr." <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > >Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2001 08:42:23 -0400 > > > >Elk > >Is your "Grand Father" the same as mine? Who is your supreme being? > > > >An "offering" would be like a "gift". The only animal that has the > >intelligence to make that decission is "MAN". We have a natural instinct > >called "Flight or Fight". All "animals" will rather fight than die!! > >Jim > > > >jmorsn@coastalnet.com > >http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > >Sent: Monday, April 02, 2001 6:19 AM > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > Halito Jim > > > #1 question > > > Another word for the supreme being > > > #2 the offering of its life > > > Walk in Beauty > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > >From: "Jim Morrison, Jr." <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > >Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 01:23:34 -0400 > > > > > > > >Two quick questions: > > > >1) Who is "Grand Father"? > > > >2) The ANIMAL is giving an offering when IT is killed? > > > >Jim > > > > > > > >jmorsn@coastalnet.com > > > >http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > >From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > >Sent: Saturday, March 31, 2001 10:36 PM > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Dennis > > > > > I am sorry if I offended you in anyway. My intrest is in all > >things > > > > > Choctaw. and Spirituality is one of the aspects of it. To understand > > > >Indian > > > > > people you have to dig deep into their thought pattern. When they > >killed > > > > > animals for food and clothing they said a prayer To Grandfather for > >the > > > > > offering that the animal gave and gave respect to the animal also. > >When > > > >they > > > > > did beadwork they put part of their spirit in it also. when a object > >was > > > > > discarded it was done with respect. Spirtuality was considered in > >all > > > >things > > > > > done. That is one of the reasons that the Europeans that came here > > > > > misunderstood our people and their ways. > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: Dennis Boswell <dennisb@primenet.com> > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > >Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 09:56:57 -0800 > > > > > > > > > > > >Message for Elkdreamer and Dusty: > > > > > > > > > > > >Regarding who subscribes to CHAHTA-L and why, permit me to suggest > >that > > > > > >this list very likely has Choctaw and non-Choctaw subscribers. > >Among > > > >both > > > > > >groups, there are those who have an exclusive interest in religion > >all > > > >the > > > > > >way to those who have an exclusive interest in some other aspect of > > > >Choctaw > > > > > >life but no interest at all in religion. > > > > > > > > > > > >In my case, I find Choctaw religious beliefs and the recent > >discussion > > > > > >surrounding them educational and thought provoking. However, my > > > >personal > > > > > >interest does not directly concern Choctaw religion. It is very > >narrow > > > >and > > > > > >concerns central Mississippi, pre-removal Choctaw social and family > > > > > >customs, very narrowly defined examples of the Choctaw language as > > > >about > > > > > >1800, relationships with early white settlers, trails and paths > > > >followed > > > >by > > > > > >these Choctaw in relationship to today's central Mississippi county > > > > > >boundaries and the impact of removal on these same Choctaw with > > > >specific > > > > > >emphasis on the Durant Choctaw clan. > > > > > > > > > > > >If I unsubscribe, which I will do one day (to return at a later > >date), > > > >it > > > > > >will have nothing to do with whether I do or do not "learn other > > > >religious > > > > > >views," "heat in the kitchen" or "sensitive subjects." It will have > > > > > >everything to do with the fact that I subscribe to about > >thirty-five > > > >lists, > > > > > >receive mountains of email and have priorities on my time and my > > > >interests > > > > > >that are quite different than anyone else on this list - a comment > >that > > > > > >about everyone of you can make. > > > > > > > > > > > >Recognize that one of the wonderful aspects of CHAHTA-L (in > >comparison > > > >with > > > > > >virtually all na hollo lists) is the diversity of thought, > >background, > > > > > >education and perspective it offers. Were I to make one suggestion > >to > > > >those > > > > > >of you who clearly dominate this list, please guard against > >becoming > > > >too > > > > > >clannish lest the very diversity that enriches this site might in > >time > > > > > >vanish leaving something less in its wake than you enjoy today. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >At 08:50 AM 03/31/2001 -0800, you wrote: > > > > > >>Halito Dusty and All list members > > > > > >> I believe that we all have the right to believe in the way that > >we > > > >want > > > > > >>to. And in this aspect the right to discuss our and each others > >views > > > >in > > > > > >>a intellegent and Adult way. Aparentlly the ones that left will in > >no > > > >way > > > > > >>ever learn that there are other views than their own. Like I have > > > >always > > > > > >>been told if you can't stand the heat get out of the kitchen. I > >guess > > > > > >>that is what they did. Lets keep up the heat I'm having fun. > > > > > >> Walk in Beauty > > > > > >> Elkdreamer > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >>>From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > > > > > >>>Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > >>>To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > >>>Subject: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > >>>Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 09:38:58 -0600 > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>>We lost another 5 listmembers this morning. Don't know for what > > > >reason. > > > > > >>>While I suspect sensitive subject matter may be the reason, this > >is > > > >only > > > > > >>>a > > > > > >>>supposition on my part. I have absolutely no objection to the > >topic > > > > > >>>continuing if that's what you guys want. Among other > >peculiarities > > > >and > > > > > >>>character faults, I happen to wholeheartedly support the First > > > >Amendment > > > > > >>>on > > > > > >>>this particular topic. What do you guys think?? > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>>dusty > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > >Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > Got a GRIPE?? Got a PROBLEM?? Just wanna' WHINE? Don't post it to > >the > > > >list...write me, dusty (list administrator) at > > > >CHAHTA-L-admin@cultures.rootsweb.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > >Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > Choctaw Home Page: > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > >Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > Need more CHOCTAW information. Visit Rusty Lang's pages at http://www.choctaw-web.com for articles, censuses, etc. > >

Dusty, what do you know about your Smith Choctaw family? At 11:11 PM 04/06/2001 -0500, you wrote: >The offer still stands!!!! > >dusty >----- Original Message ----- >From: faynshep <faynshep@telapex.com> >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> >Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 11:55 PM >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Re: THANKS TO OUR ANCESTORS > > > > Dusty said one time if we could find her "Smith" Choctaw family she would > > put us in her will, all I want is her books. LOL > > Fay > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Dennis Boswell <dennisb@primenet.com> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 7:11 PM > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Re: THANKS TO OUR ANCESTORS > > > > > > > Dusty, several times a day, I am amazed at your personal warehouse of > > > historic and legal knowledge about Choctaw history. I cannot imagine how > > > many shelves, boxes and stacks of information you likely surround >yourself > > > with in your home, or is it all in your head?. > > > > > > At 08:28 PM 04/06/2001 -0500, you wrote: > > > >Those limitations on being able to do business without a legal guardian > > for > > > >1/2 or fullbloods were called "restrictions", and that law as formally > > > >struck down around the turn of the century, I believe. I can't put my > > hand > > > >on the exact date at the moment. > > > > > > > >dusty > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > > >Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Dennis K. Boswell > > > 301 Crow Canyon Drive > > > Folsom, CA 95630 > > > > > > Tel: (916) 987-3599 > > > Fax: (916) 987-3555 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > Choctaw Home Page: > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > Need more CHOCTAW information. Visit Rusty Lang's pages at >http://www.choctaw-web.com for articles, censuses, etc. > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: >Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... Regards, Dennis K. Boswell 301 Crow Canyon Drive Folsom, CA 95630 Tel: (916) 987-3599 Fax: (916) 987-3555

Patsy: Choctaw is a language that was, like other native languages, translated as best the translator could manage, which was to spell it phonetically, or how it sounded to him. That's why you will find many words that sound the same when spoken, but are spelled differently. Examples: Houma, humma, homma or the example we used of the word Chahta/Chata/Chatah/Chahta, etc. The language classes use both spoken words and written words,depending on how the class is delivered. A child beginning to speak learns language from repeating spoken words. When a medium like the internet is used and the language cannot be spoken, words are spelled out. There are courses available that use both written words and tapes of the language being spoken, so that proper pronunciation may be heard. IMHO a serious student needs both. I also feel one cannot learn a language unless there is someone to speak it to, and to hear it from. In the 1800's there were a couple of Choctaw"dictionaries" written that translated the spoken word into writing in an attempt to catalog the language into a form that could be understood by non-speaking peoples. Those dictionaries, particularly the Byington version, are frequently used today by students. dusty ----- Original Message ----- From: Patsy Caleb <studentarchaeologist@home.com> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 12:09 AM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Chata vs. Chahta - Meaning ? > Last year they had a language school going on ? How do you learn it if it > is not written anywhere and how do they have these "learn the choctaw > language school > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 9:02 PM > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Chata vs. Chahta - Meaning ? > > > > Chata and Chahta are the same meaning..they mean Choctaw...Some of us > spell > > it one way, some the other.Depends on how we first learned it...Since the > > Choctaw language was not a written language but only a spoken language, > > there are no "absolutely correct" spellings...they have been spelled > mainly > > as they sound, tho in some cases, in my opinion, some letters have been > used > > that are not necessary...hopefully the spellings will be standardized at > > some point, but til then, spelling phonetically usually gets the message > > across.... > > Barbara > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Dennis Boswell" <dennisb@primenet.com> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 10:54 PM > > Subject: [CHAHTA] Chata vs. Chahta - Meaning ? > > > > > > > I have seen this spelled both "Chata" and "Chahta." Which is correct? > > > > > > > > > If the correct spelling is "Chata," then what does "Chahta" mean? > > > > > > > > > > > > Doesn't "Chata" or "Chahta" (whichever is correct) really refer to > > > pre-removal Choctaw instead of post-removal Choctaw or is it used to > refer > > > to Choctaw without regard to either pre- or post-removal? > > > > > > > > > > > > Also, is "Chata" or "Chahta" (whichever is correct) also the name of the > > > language spoken by pre- or post-removal Choctaws ? > > > > > > > > > Sorry for all the questions, but based on what I have seen in some of > the > > > CHAHTA-L traffic lately, I am confused. Somewhere along the line, I got > > the > > > impression that "Chahta" (with an "h") referred to the "old ones" and > the > > > language they spoke. Am I wrong? > > > > > > > > > At 11:26 PM 04/06/2001 -0400, you wrote: > > > >Chata is what the Choctaw call themselves > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > >TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > > >Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the > quotes > > > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Dennis K. Boswell > > > 301 Crow Canyon Drive > > > Folsom, CA 95630 > > > > > > Tel: (916) 987-3599 > > > Fax: (916) 987-3555 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > Got a GRIPE?? Got a PROBLEM?? Just wanna' WHINE? Don't post it to the list...write me, dusty (list administrator) at CHAHTA-L-admin@cultures.rootsweb.com >

Patsy, When we first learned how to speak english, we didn't write it...we learned by sound only, and later we learned what letters were used to write those words....well, Choctaw was not written long ago,but only spoken, until someone came along who knew english and wanted to write what was being said in Choctaw using the same letters as english...so they listened to the way the Choctaw word sounded, and then used letters that came as close as possible to how the Choctaw word sounded...since then, people have been using those same letters to write in Choctaw. Barbara ----- Original Message ----- From: "Patsy Caleb" <studentarchaeologist@home.com> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 12:09 AM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Chata vs. Chahta - Meaning ? > Last year they had a language school going on ? How do you learn it if it > is not written anywhere and how do they have these "learn the choctaw > language school > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 9:02 PM > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Chata vs. Chahta - Meaning ? > > > > Chata and Chahta are the same meaning..they mean Choctaw...Some of us > spell > > it one way, some the other.Depends on how we first learned it...Since the > > Choctaw language was not a written language but only a spoken language, > > there are no "absolutely correct" spellings...they have been spelled > mainly > > as they sound, tho in some cases, in my opinion, some letters have been > used > > that are not necessary...hopefully the spellings will be standardized at > > some point, but til then, spelling phonetically usually gets the message > > across.... > > Barbara > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Dennis Boswell" <dennisb@primenet.com> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 10:54 PM > > Subject: [CHAHTA] Chata vs. Chahta - Meaning ? > > > > > > > I have seen this spelled both "Chata" and "Chahta." Which is correct? > > > > > > > > > If the correct spelling is "Chata," then what does "Chahta" mean? > > > > > > > > > > > > Doesn't "Chata" or "Chahta" (whichever is correct) really refer to > > > pre-removal Choctaw instead of post-removal Choctaw or is it used to > refer > > > to Choctaw without regard to either pre- or post-removal? > > > > > > > > > > > > Also, is "Chata" or "Chahta" (whichever is correct) also the name of the > > > language spoken by pre- or post-removal Choctaws ? > > > > > > > > > Sorry for all the questions, but based on what I have seen in some of > the > > > CHAHTA-L traffic lately, I am confused. Somewhere along the line, I got > > the > > > impression that "Chahta" (with an "h") referred to the "old ones" and > the > > > language they spoke. Am I wrong? > > > > > > > > > At 11:26 PM 04/06/2001 -0400, you wrote: > > > >Chata is what the Choctaw call themselves > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > >TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > > >Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the > quotes > > > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Dennis K. Boswell > > > 301 Crow Canyon Drive > > > Folsom, CA 95630 > > > > > > Tel: (916) 987-3599 > > > Fax: (916) 987-3555 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > Got a GRIPE?? Got a PROBLEM?? Just wanna' WHINE? Don't post it to the list...write me, dusty (list administrator) at CHAHTA-L-admin@cultures.rootsweb.com >

She was. Found an article over at about.com Sorry I didn't save the URL. Juli At 09:53 PM 4/6/01 -0400, you wrote: >I believe she was in Wisconsin

Webster's New World Dictionary defines intelligence as: the ability to learn or understand from experince. One of the most intelligent animals (other than man) is the dolphin, but you don't hear stories about them. Nor does anybody take their name. Why? Please share with me a story from one of these "story telling animals". Maybe it will be easier to understand than to just have you tell me "...those of us who allow ourselves to listen...". I have changed the subject line again. This has got so far away from what it started out as!! Jim jmorsn@coastalnet.com http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gemma West" <gemmawest@usa.net> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 12:24 PM Subject: [CHAHTA] Jim, intelligence > Every creature has its own way of communicating. For those of us who allow > ourselves to listen and observe, the stories of the animals are obvious. The > lessons are clear. Storytelling is useless if we refuse to take the time to > listen. Most of us have 5 senses, some of us have more than 5 but all of us > can put forth the effort to use these senses to derive knowledge. > > I don't have a working definition for intelligence so I can't say whether or > not it is the same thing as wisdom. Every time I think I've found such a > defintion, I realize that it falls short. Defining things doesn't always > work. After all language has its limitations and we can't always afford to be > limited. A lot is lost. However I think that branding a creature as less > intelligenct is simply another way to say that one is better than the other. > That is completely incompatible with everything I have learned. At the most > basic level, everything is neutral. Assigning adjectives like stupid, > intelligent, good, and bad are only a reflection of you, not the object that > is being described. > > > > > "Jim Morrison, Jr." <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> wrote: > Lets see now....Is "intelligence" the same as "wisdom"? > This "animal" you are refering to has a HUGE amount of unused > "intelligence". Through Trial and Error this "animal" is gaining the > "wisdom" to put this "intelligence" to work for him. > As for YOUR disapproval as to what this newly appointed "animal" is doing: > Three years from now YOU had better be out there campaining for the ONE you > beleive in!! > You may have kicked sand in my face on this last one, BUT if the animals in > the stories have soooooo much wisdom to share, why are THEY not telling the > story? > Jim > > jmorsn@coastalnet.com > http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Gemma West" <gemmawest@usa.net> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Monday, April 02, 2001 11:14 AM > Subject: [CHAHTA] Jim, intelligence > > > > Well Jim that would have to depend on your definition of intelligence. > > Computer scientists, working in the field on "Arficial Intelligence" can't > > even come to a consensus what that word means. What's your take on this > term? > > > > > > Let's not forget there is a certain animal who is trying to determine how > to > > sustain enclosed enviorments in the middle of the desert so that we can > move > > to Mars. This animal has also built a huge solar space station (now the > third > > brightest object in the sky) to determine how life can be sustained > outside of > > this planet. So somehow this animal has concluded that taking care of the > > beautiful planet we already live on is either more difficult or less > desirable > > than turning unsustainable environments into sustainable ones. A certain > > animal, one who has just been appointed president of a large polulation of > > these animals, has recently decided to keep his nation out of an > environmental > > conference. He cites economic growth as a reasonable alternative to > having a > > livable atmosphere. This type of behavior does not fit my definition of > > intelligence. How about yours? > > > > As far as evolution. Other animals are continuously undergoing evolution > just > > as we are. It is a Chahta principle that all things are constantly > changing. > > Do you think it is consistent with Chahta beliefs to say that other > animals > > are less intelligent than we are? In many of our stories , our lessons > are > > taught to us by other animals. These animals are referred to as knowledge > > givers. It's inconsistent to learn from someone who is less intelligent > than > > you are isn't it? > > > > "Jim Morrison, Jr." <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> wrote: > > Hi Barb > > I totally disagree. What animal has more intellegence than man? What other > > animal has evolved as far as man has? > > And lets not forget that man himself is an animal!! > > Jim > > > > jmorsn@coastalnet.com > > http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Barbara Ellison" <greybird7@pisp.net> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Saturday, March 31, 2001 1:49 PM > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Fw: Choctaw Christian Culture > > > > > > > Hi Jim... > > > Elkdreamer's point was that man is not superior to animals. > > > B. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Jim Morrison, Jr." <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Saturday, March 31, 2001 1:57 PM > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Fw: Choctaw Christian Culture > > > > > > > > > > Elk > > > > I have to disagree with you. MAN is not the weakest animal on earth, > nor > > > the > > > > slowest. HE is one of the most intelligent which has caused him to > > become > > > > very lazy. > > > > I have never been inside a "sweat lodge", but by design I would think > > you > > > > have to enter on your hands and knees to help keep the heat inside. > Not > > to > > > > degrade you to the point you feel you are an animal. Tell me > something: > > > > which animal do you know of that starts a fire under rocks and then > > pours > > > > water on them to creat steam so that they can sit inside sweat and > > > meditate? > > > > Jim > > > > > > > > jmorsn@coastalnet.com > > > > http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > Sent: Saturday, March 31, 2001 5:44 AM > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Fw: Choctaw Christian Culture > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito again Barbara > > > > > Man is the weakest animal on mother earth. The only thing that has > > > > helped > > > > > us to survive is our ability to think. Every other animal has > sharper > > > > teeth > > > > > can run faster etc. When you go into a sweat lodge you do so on your > > > hands > > > > > and knees to remind us that we are still animals, and part of the > > circle > > > > of > > > > > life here on Mother Earth. > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Fw: Choctaw Christian Culture > > > > > >Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2001 19:06:30 -0600 > > > > > > > > > > > >Again, speaking of animals..we know it is NOT necessary that we > > consume > > > > > >their bodies...and if you really want to keep including plants..we > > > don't > > > > > >have to kill those to eat parts of them...but I was really talking > > > about > > > > > >animals... > > > > > >And do you really think YOU mean as much to a squirrel as her own > > baby > > > > > >does? > > > > > >As for me..in many ways I feel equal to the snake, toad, and > > > insect...but > > > > > >in > > > > > >many more I feel inferior being the species I am...it would seem > that > > > in > > > > > >most cases, a squirrel knows better how to be a squirrel than a > human > > > > does > > > > > >a > > > > > >human...I still think it is very egocentric to think that animals > > were > > > > put > > > > > >here for human use....Then again..some people think the earth is > flat > > > > > >too... > > > > > >Barbara > > > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > > > >From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > > > > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > >Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2001 5:13 PM > > > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Fw: Choctaw Christian Culture > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I reiterate, if the Creator did not intend for men to chase down > > > > > >animals, > > > > > > > kill them and eat them...or to pull plants up by their roots and > > > > consume > > > > > > > them...why did he make it necessary that we do so?? Why not > > design > > > a > > > > > > > bio-system that didn't require this exchange? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am not saying that man and the animals/plants don't relate to > > each > > > > > >other, > > > > > > > but to spiritually equate a squirrel with one of my children > > defies > > > > > >rational > > > > > > > thought. I can certainly appreciate the sacredness of the > > squirrel, > > > > or > > > > > >the > > > > > > > deer, or the bird. I can recognize the purpose they serve on > this > > > > > > > planet..the roll they play within the circle of life. I can > (and > > > do) > > > > > >pay > > > > > > > them honor and try to learn from them about the world around me. > > I > > > > can > > > > > >(and > > > > > > > do) salute them and call them brother. But the fact remains, > the > > > > > >Creator > > > > > > > put them here to be of service to me, not the other way around. > > Man > > > > was > > > > > >not > > > > > > > created to serve the animals or the plants....to take care of > them > > > > > >perhaps, > > > > > > > to be stewards of them, but not beneath them in the eyes of the > > > > > >Creator.... > > > > > > > Do you feel you are the inferior of a snake? Or a toad? Or an > > > > insect? > > > > > > > I'm curious what you feel your role i in the circle of life is. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dusty > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dusty > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > > From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> > > > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > > > Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2001 8:51 AM > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Fw: Choctaw Christian Culture > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't think I was talking about where man placed animals...I > > > think > > > > I > > > > > >was > > > > > > > > talking about where Hashtali placed them and what Hashtali's > > > purpose > > > > > >was > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > placing them, and that to think Hashtali placed them for human > > use > > > > is > > > > > >a > > > > > > > > mistake, just like thinking Hashtali placed the man there for > > the > > > > > >lion's > > > > > > > > use...I don't see what is so hard for you to understand in > what > > I > > > > have > > > > > > > > said...I know that to accept what I have said as valid at all > > > would > > > > > > > require > > > > > > > > a lot of re-evaluation about one's own views on reality, which > > > might > > > > > > > entail > > > > > > > > changes one would not want to make...but that is always up to > > the > > > > > > > > individual...and many individuals prefer "herd mentality"... > > > > > > > > Barbara > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > > > From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > > > > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, March 28, 2001 11:21 PM > > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Fw: Choctaw Christian Culture > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Barbara: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your logic is convoluted. To state that ancient man placed > > the > > > > > >animals > > > > > > > he > > > > > > > > > killed for food or the plants he gathered for medicine on > the > > > same > > > > > >level > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > > he did his family members is patently ridiculous. If that > > were > > > > the > > > > > >case > > > > > > > > > there would never have been a deer killed, a fish eaten, a > > bison > > > > > > > butchered > > > > > > > > > or a berry picked. It is a romantic notion that exists in > > > > fantasy, > > > > > >nice > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > think about, but impossible in reality. Fact is that > man > > > > chose > > > > > >to > > > > > > > > eat, > > > > > > > > > clothe himself and survive as the Creator intended and he > used > > > the > > > > > > > > resources > > > > > > > > > around him. Had not the power of the Universe ordained it > > so, > > > he > > > > > >would > > > > > > > > > have created a man who could draw nourishment from the air > he > > > > > > > > > breathed...like moss. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To be grateful for the chicken we have for dinner is fine, > > but > > > > let' > > > > > >s > > > > > > > > face > > > > > > > > > it...that chicken did not bid his loved ones goodbye and lay > > > down > > > > on > > > > > >the > > > > > > > > > chopping block. And the animals our ancestors ate did not > > > > willingly > > > > > > > walk > > > > > > > > > into camp and say "Here I am..eat me." I personally think > > that > > > > > >paying > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > sort of respect for the life of an animal taken is a good > > > > thing...we > > > > > > > > > practice it in our family, and many post-kill hunting > customs > > > are > > > > > > > holdover > > > > > > > > s > > > > > > > > > from those old ceremonies. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Stewardship of the earth dictates taking only what one > needs, > > > but > > > > > >make > > > > > > > no > > > > > > > > > mistake, when man is hungry he will kill and eat whatever is > > > > > >available > > > > > > > > > without hesitation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As far as your lion/man analogy...again...God-given > > intelligence > > > > > >plus > > > > > > > free > > > > > > > > > choice. The man could have stayed safe inside his house and > > not > > > > > >walked > > > > > > > > > where the lion was waiting. God takes the rap for a lot of > > > things > > > > > >he's > > > > > > > > just > > > > > > > > > not responsible for. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dusty > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > > > > From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> > > > > > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, March 28, 2001 1:53 PM > > > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Fw: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > > > > > > > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" > without > > > the > > > > > >quotes > > > > > > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > > Got a GRIPE?? Got a PROBLEM?? Just wanna' WHINE? Don't post > it > > > to > > > > > >the > > > > > > > list...write me, dusty (list administrator) at > > > > > > > CHAHTA-L-admin@cultures.rootsweb.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > > > > > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without > the > > > > quotes > > > > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > >TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > > > > >Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the > > > quotes > > > > > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: > > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at > > http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________ > > Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > ____________________________________________________________________ > Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > Need more CHOCTAW information. Visit Rusty Lang's pages at http://www.choctaw-web.com for articles, censuses, etc. > >

What Gemma said! Gemma, seriously, that was nicely worded! I like the way you think and write - to the point with great explanations that don't take all day like when I write! Take care all! Tsana ----- Original Message ----- From: Gemma West <gemmawest@usa.net> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 1:35 PM Subject: [CHAHTA] twinkies > What has happened for many people is that they wander through life trying to > figure out what is wrong...trying to figure out why they don't fit in. > Attempts are made to mold themselves into someone else's defintions of good > and bad. These attempts fail. Finally that person decides to look to their > ancestors. They find themselves. They finally feel comfortable. It is > obvious to all that ancestors shape our biological characteristics. It is > obvious to me that ancestors shape our spirituality. The sad thing is that > sometimes the assimilation is so thick that you can grow up around Indians and > still not know your own spirituality. The beautiful thing is finding the few > who have refused assimilation and are willing to share knowledge. > > When non-Indian people ask to be allowed into the community it causes us to > question ourselves. Does community still exist? What are they here to get? > Are we really different from them? I think the great thing about this reverse > acculturation is that it is spurring some of us to re-embrace our own > ancestors. It is removing the shame that our elders had to live with. This > shame had no place and that is becoming clear to new generations. If we can > influence people to live a balanced life then that is a great thing. After > all, our children and their children will have to live in a world shaped by > the parents. We can not afford to be selfish with principles of balance. It > seems that they need these principles much more than we do. > > > > Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> wrote: > "Our spirituality" is not "just an idea" and it is not something we went to > class and learned somewhere, or got off the internet...it is born in us > (which is obvious to those Indians who were raised surrounded by a white > society) and a non-Indian may be able to learn from us some things, but they > cannot "acquire" what they are not born with, and their attempts to put > themselves on an "equal footing", with Indians, so to speak, is at best > futile...and at worst, an attempt at cultural theft... > B. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:59 PM > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > I shall play devil's advocate again and expose my rear to everyone's > slings > > and arrows... > > > > What about those people who do not "want to be NA", but just think our > > spirituality, philosophy and way of life is a good idea. I've had > countless > > elders tell me, "I don't care what kind of blood you have, as long as it's > > human". Just because an Anglo wants to practice our ways because it works > > for them, doesn't mean they deserve to be belittled by a derogatory name. > > Are there really that many among us that are so arrogant to do so. > > > > Where did we ever get the idea that that we were so exclusive? Isn't that > > TRUE racism? > > > > dusty > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: John & Arla Williams <jaws@crosstel.net> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:45 PM > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > Elkdreamer, Where did the term come from? Arla > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:38 PM > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > Halito Fay > > > > Mostly people that want to be N/A and really have no Indian blood at > all > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > Choctaw Home Page: > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at > http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. > > > ____________________________________________________________________ > Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

Barbara, I, like, Patsy, beg to differ. The only difference, it seems, between you and I is that you had a chance to grow up with and learn the Choctaw culture from your family, elders, etc. I, on the other hand, did not have that luxury. Now, it's no fault of mine, nor of my family. They did what they thought best for the family at the time. OK, so does that mean that I am not as interested? NO. Does that mean that I can't learn a lot about it from the internet, books, elders, other tribal members, etc.? NO. Does it mean that I can become as knowledgable as you who grew up with it? YES. I will probably never know all that you do, nor will that bother me. I want to learn my family's history and culture. Does it mean that I may adopt some of the beliefs I learn about? PROBABLY since I've already adopted some of the Cherokee beliefs. Does it mean that you are a better "Indian" than I? NOPE. Does it mean that you are a better person, in general, than I? NOPE. I would appreciate your sharing some of the ways of the Choctaw since you are so educated in those ways. Now, I'm fully aware that there are some things that simply aren't meant to be on the internet, and I respect that. So, sister, I lay down my bundle of tobacco beside you and ask in a good way - will you help me learn? I ask this with all respect. But, with the same respect I'm also saying that I don't want to debate or argue. If you're willing to sharing information, I'm your sponge, here to soak it all up! Thanks, Barbara! Tsana ----- Original Message ----- From: Patsy Caleb <studentarchaeologist@home.com> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 1:12 PM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > can i disagree to that because the more i learn about my choctaw heritage > the more spiritual i become > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 10:49 AM > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > "Our spirituality" is not "just an idea" and it is not something we went > to > > class and learned somewhere, or got off the internet...it is born in us > > (which is obvious to those Indians who were raised surrounded by a white > > society) and a non-Indian may be able to learn from us some things, but > they > > cannot "acquire" what they are not born with, and their attempts to put > > themselves on an "equal footing", with Indians, so to speak, is at best > > futile...and at worst, an attempt at cultural theft... > > B. > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:59 PM > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > I shall play devil's advocate again and expose my rear to everyone's > > slings > > > and arrows... > > > > > > What about those people who do not "want to be NA", but just think our > > > spirituality, philosophy and way of life is a good idea. I've had > > countless > > > elders tell me, "I don't care what kind of blood you have, as long as > it's > > > human". Just because an Anglo wants to practice our ways because it > works > > > for them, doesn't mean they deserve to be belittled by a derogatory > name. > > > Are there really that many among us that are so arrogant to do so. > > > > > > Where did we ever get the idea that that we were so exclusive? Isn't > that > > > TRUE racism? > > > > > > dusty > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: John & Arla Williams <jaws@crosstel.net> > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:45 PM > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > Elkdreamer, Where did the term come from? Arla > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:38 PM > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Fay > > > > > Mostly people that want to be N/A and really have no Indian blood at > > all > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: > > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > Choctaw Home Page: > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at > http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

Chata is what the Choctaw call themselves

Hmmm. Seems to me that the Rez is going to either peter out or self destruct somewhere down the road. Tommie Dusty wrote: > In order to qualify for enrollment in the Mississippi Band of Choctaw, one > must have 1/2 or more blood quantum, plus meet age requirements. You have > to enroll before age 18 I believe. Their stringent blood quantum > requirements pretty well excludes anyone who ever left the community, as was > its intention. They used the 1940 Mississippi census when they established > their base roll. > > dusty > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Kim Collins <2buckets@arbuckleonline.com> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 11:32 PM > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] twinkies > > > The Choctaw Nation of Oklahoma accepts all who can trace their lineage to > an > > original enrollee ( and who have a CDIB) of the Choctaw roll regardless of > > blood quantum. > > I personally prefer American Indian as any one born in the US is NA. Don't > > profess to know what the Choctaw nation of OK thinks about the term > though. > > Yes the Choctaw have had dealings and inter marriages with Europeans for > > many years. Many great chiefs were of mixed blood. > > I do believe that MS Choctaw have a more stringent requirement for tribal > > membership but I am not sure. > > Perhaps there is some one on the list who can supply you a better answer. > > Kim > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: <Chata1507@aol.com> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 9:46 PM > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] twinkies > > > > > > > I have been told that the Choctaw Nation prefers the term Indian over > > native > > > American since anyone born in America is also a native American. This > > makes > > > sense to me. However, each nation has their own opinion. In addition I > > > think it's what ever you are comfortable with. > > > > > > On a previous question. In Minnesota the tribes historically accepted > > > persons into tribe who basically moved in with them, became community > > > supporters and identified with the tribe and its goals. This included > > > captives who were adopted. Friends on various reservations in Minnesota > > also > > > chuckle at the concept of full blood because over the years of euro > > contact > > > who can really know blood genetics. For example Crazy Horse was light > > haired > > > and blue eyed according to a Lakota friend. The Mandans have many with > > light > > > eyes and hair. > > > > > > Look at the pictures of a lot of the old Choctaw and you see euro > > influence. > > > The Choctaw have had contact since they ran De Soto out in the early > > 1500s. > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at > > http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > Got a GRIPE?? Got a PROBLEM?? Just wanna' WHINE? Don't post it to the list...write me, dusty (list administrator) at CHAHTA-L-admin@cultures.rootsweb.com

The offer still stands!!!! dusty ----- Original Message ----- From: faynshep <faynshep@telapex.com> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 11:55 PM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Re: THANKS TO OUR ANCESTORS > Dusty said one time if we could find her "Smith" Choctaw family she would > put us in her will, all I want is her books. LOL > Fay > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Dennis Boswell <dennisb@primenet.com> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 7:11 PM > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Re: THANKS TO OUR ANCESTORS > > > > Dusty, several times a day, I am amazed at your personal warehouse of > > historic and legal knowledge about Choctaw history. I cannot imagine how > > many shelves, boxes and stacks of information you likely surround yourself > > with in your home, or is it all in your head?. > > > > At 08:28 PM 04/06/2001 -0500, you wrote: > > >Those limitations on being able to do business without a legal guardian > for > > >1/2 or fullbloods were called "restrictions", and that law as formally > > >struck down around the turn of the century, I believe. I can't put my > hand > > >on the exact date at the moment. > > > > > >dusty > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > >Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > Regards, > > > > Dennis K. Boswell > > 301 Crow Canyon Drive > > Folsom, CA 95630 > > > > Tel: (916) 987-3599 > > Fax: (916) 987-3555 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > Choctaw Home Page: > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > Need more CHOCTAW information. Visit Rusty Lang's pages at http://www.choctaw-web.com for articles, censuses, etc. >

IMHO, the leaders at Rosebud and Pine Ridge are responsible for the poverty-striken condition some of their people live in. Time and time again those leaders have been plagued with accusations of scandal, skimming of tribal funds, etc. They steadfastly refuse to take MILLIONS of dollars money that has been offered to them by the government. Their leaders are willing to let their own people freeze and starve to death (and that is happening every winter) rather than compromise with outsiders who are offering help. Last year things got so bad that the tribal headquarters was taken over by a group of protestors, including elders. who closed it down and inhabited it for days. One woman with several children who had been trying to months to get relief money just moved her mattresses into the receptionists office and set up camp, saying she would live there until they could find her a place for herself and her children to live. They kept in touch with the outside via radio. Finally, after resorting to calling in the state police, the tribal council agreed to meet with the protestors. I have, in the past, sent aid in the form of cash and clothing to a few of the people in that area through relief agencies and individuals dedicated to works of charity. The boxes of clothing (much of it brand new with the tags still on) were found dumped under a bridge near Rosebud and since our return address was written on it, the person who found it wrote and told us. It's up to the LEADERS of those tribes to get off their duffs and help their own people. They have time and time again refused outside aid and must be held responsible for their actions by their own people. They must heal themselves internally first. IMHO dusty ----- Original Message ----- From: faynshep <faynshep@telapex.com> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 11:52 PM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Re: THANKS TO OUR ANCESTORS > I'm sorry, but according to my friend Iris with the Lakota Sioux on the Pine > Ridge reservation, she was helping me to gather information on a family that > I could help out this winter personally by going straight to them instead of > some organization and paying them some sort of fee. The family she found > for me was an elderly man named Ross and his grandson Mathew. Ross and > Mathew were in the dark and in the cold because their "guardian" had not > paid their light bill or paid for them some butane. With all the millions > and millions that this country owes to the Native Americans, I took a small > $20.00 and mailed Ross and Mathew a blanket, socks, caps, and some food. > Now, you tell me who needs repriations? > Fay > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Dusty <dustyc@microgear.net> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 6:28 PM > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Re: THANKS TO OUR ANCESTORS > > > > Those limitations on being able to do business without a legal guardian > for > > 1/2 or fullbloods were called "restrictions", and that law as formally > > struck down around the turn of the century, I believe. I can't put my > hand > > on the exact date at the moment. > > > > dusty > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... >

Chata and Chahta are the same meaning..they mean Choctaw...Some of us spell it one way, some the other.Depends on how we first learned it...Since the Choctaw language was not a written language but only a spoken language, there are no "absolutely correct" spellings...they have been spelled mainly as they sound, tho in some cases, in my opinion, some letters have been used that are not necessary...hopefully the spellings will be standardized at some point, but til then, spelling phonetically usually gets the message across.... Barbara ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dennis Boswell" <dennisb@primenet.com> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 10:54 PM Subject: [CHAHTA] Chata vs. Chahta - Meaning ? > I have seen this spelled both "Chata" and "Chahta." Which is correct? > > > If the correct spelling is "Chata," then what does "Chahta" mean? > > > > Doesn't "Chata" or "Chahta" (whichever is correct) really refer to > pre-removal Choctaw instead of post-removal Choctaw or is it used to refer > to Choctaw without regard to either pre- or post-removal? > > > > Also, is "Chata" or "Chahta" (whichever is correct) also the name of the > language spoken by pre- or post-removal Choctaws ? > > > Sorry for all the questions, but based on what I have seen in some of the > CHAHTA-L traffic lately, I am confused. Somewhere along the line, I got the > impression that "Chahta" (with an "h") referred to the "old ones" and the > language they spoke. Am I wrong? > > > At 11:26 PM 04/06/2001 -0400, you wrote: > >Chata is what the Choctaw call themselves > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > >TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > >Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > Regards, > > Dennis K. Boswell > 301 Crow Canyon Drive > Folsom, CA 95630 > > Tel: (916) 987-3599 > Fax: (916) 987-3555 > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ >

Kim, the word "Choctaw" is an English derivation of the original word "Chata" in the language spoken by our ancestors. Chata/Chahta/Chatah (it's spelled several ways) does not translate, as it was a proper name. Legend tell of twin brothers, chiefs, Chata and Chiksa, who were the original leaders of the people. We are, quite literally, "children of Chatah". We speak the language he spoke. The children of Chiksa who separated from our people are the Chickasaws. Our languages, way, customs are very similar, lending some truth to the traditional legend. dusty ----- Original Message ----- From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 9:52 PM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Re:Mississippi Band of Choctaw Indians Tribal MembershipRequirements > It is a Choctaw > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Patsy Caleb" <studentarchaeologist@home.com> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 9:23 PM > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Re:Mississippi Band of Choctaw Indians Tribal > Membership Requirements > > > > What is a Chata? > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Kim Collins <2buckets@arbuckleonline.com> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 7:10 PM > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Re:Mississippi Band of Choctaw Indians Tribal > > Membership Requirements > > > > > > > Dennis, Thanks for the reply. It is as I thought and I understand their > > > reasoning. To keep the Chata race as pure as possible. It is sad that > the > > > numbers are dwindling and will continue to decline though. Another > product > > > of assimilation, but a noble effort by the Mississippi Band of Choctaw. > I > > > wish them well. > > > Kim > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Dennis Boswell" <dennisb@primenet.com> > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 9:48 AM > > > Subject: [CHAHTA] Re:Mississippi Band of Choctaw Indians Tribal > Membership > > > Requirements > > > > > > > > > > Halito, Kim. > > > > > > > > When I last visited Philadelphia, MS, (October, 1998) their checklist > > for > > > > tribal membership included: > > > > > > > > "Before you apply be sure you are one-half (1/2) or more Choctaw blood > > and > > > > are a descendant of an enrolled member of the Mississippi Band of > > Choctaw > > > > Indians listed in the 1940 roll. (See Articles III, Section 1 and 2 of > > the > > > > Tribal Constitution). > > > > > > > > Make sure: > > > > > > > > 1. The Application for Enrollment is completed > > > > 2. The Ancestry Chart is completed > > > > 3. If applicant is under 18 years old both parents must sign. > > > > 4. Original long form birth certificate is included > > > > 5. A copy of the Social Security card is included. > > > > 6. An original of the Parternity (sp) Affidavit is included (if > needed) > > > > 7. Statement from official of the other Indian tribe (if applicable) > > > > stating the inividual (sp) is not enrolled with them is included. > > > > > > > > Please mail to the following address: > > > > > > > > Mrs. Angela Briscoe > > > > Tribal Enrollment Office > > > > Post Office Box 6365 > > > > Philadelphia, Mississippi 39350" > > > > > > > > This information appeared as shown above in a copy of "A Choctaw > > > Handybook" > > > > that I purchased from the Choctaw Museum Gift Shoppe located in the > > > > Choctaw Museum of the Southern Indian. At the time (October, 1998), > they > > > > had available a Gift Shoppe list of items for sale along with prices. > > The > > > > Gift Shoppe's Telephone number was (601) 650-1685 and their Web site > was > > > > http://allcatalogs.com/choctaw. However, I just tried that web site > and > > it > > > > did not respond. > > > > > > > > > > > > At 11:32 PM 04/05/2001 -0500, you wrote: > > > > >The Choctaw Nation of Oklahoma accepts all who can trace their > lineage > > to > > > an > > > > >original enrollee ( and who have a CDIB) of the Choctaw roll > regardless > > > of > > > > >blood quantum. > > > > >I personally prefer American Indian as any one born in the US is NA. > > > Don't > > > > >profess to know what the Choctaw nation of OK thinks about the term > > > though. > > > > >Yes the Choctaw have had dealings and inter marriages with Europeans > > for > > > > >many years. Many great chiefs were of mixed blood. > > > > >I do believe that MS Choctaw have a more stringent requirement for > > tribal > > > > >membership but I am not sure. > > > > >Perhaps there is some one on the list who can supply you a better > > > answer. > > > > >Kim > > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > > >From: <Chata1507@aol.com> > > > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > >Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 9:46 PM > > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have been told that the Choctaw Nation prefers the term Indian > > over > > > > >native > > > > > > American since anyone born in America is also a native American. > > This > > > > >makes > > > > > > sense to me. However, each nation has their own opinion. In > > addition > > > I > > > > > > think it's what ever you are comfortable with. > > > > > > > > > > > > On a previous question. In Minnesota the tribes historically > > accepted > > > > > > persons into tribe who basically moved in with them, became > > community > > > > > > supporters and identified with the tribe and its goals. This > > included > > > > > > captives who were adopted. Friends on various reservations in > > > Minnesota > > > > >also > > > > > > chuckle at the concept of full blood because over the years of > euro > > > > >contact > > > > > > who can really know blood genetics. For example Crazy Horse was > > light > > > > >haired > > > > > > and blue eyed according to a Lakota friend. The Mandans have many > > > with > > > > >light > > > > > > eyes and hair. > > > > > > > > > > > > Look at the pictures of a lot of the old Choctaw and you see euro > > > > >influence. > > > > > > The Choctaw have had contact since they ran De Soto out in the > early > > > > >1500s. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at > > > > >http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: > > > > >Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the > quotes > > > > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > Dennis K. Boswell > > > > 301 Crow Canyon Drive > > > > Folsom, CA 95630 > > > > > > > > Tel: (916) 987-3599 > > > > Fax: (916) 987-3555 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > Got a GRIPE?? Got a PROBLEM?? Just wanna' WHINE? Don't post it to > the > > > list...write me, dusty (list administrator) at > > > CHAHTA-L-admin@cultures.rootsweb.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > Choctaw Home Page: > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... >

Good words, Fay! dusty ----- Original Message ----- From: faynshep <faynshep@telapex.com> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 11:45 PM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Re: THANKS TO OUR ANCESTORS > You know we were promised we would get weaker but wiser. I know I'm getting > weaker and the wiser part I'm not to sure of. Yes, we owe our ancestors a > debt that we will never repay. We all are trying to honor their memory by > searching out their records and bringing them out from obscurity and writing > their names down so that they might always be remembered. And no, I don't > think I would have had the metal that they had or the courage and strength > so to remember them, to speak of them, to honor them and put their records > down in a book for all generations to come, is a good thing for all of us to >

Each group is dated with the year it was done. If you'll look on the original pages, it's at the top of the start of each group. (Choctaw Minors, Choctaw Adults, etc.) Most groups are dated as of 1902, but some have other dates. You can figure from the age in 1902, or whatever year, back to when they were born. I do MANY every day! <LOL> dusty ----- Original Message ----- From: faynshep <faynshep@telapex.com> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 11:35 PM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Dawes info.? > But how do you know what year that roll was done? I'm thinking there is > some broad span of years. Do you just have to wait until you get the packet > and then will you be able to find out about when they were born? > Fay > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Dusty <dustyc@microgear.net> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 1:19 PM > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Dawes info.? > > > > Yes, age is listed on the Dawes roll. You calculate it from the year that > > particular roll was done. > > > > dusty > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: faynshep <faynshep@telapex.com> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 1:06 PM > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Dawes info.? > > > > > > > You know, it tells you so much but it doesn't say what year that > > information > > > was taken so you don't know when a person was born. I will call them and > > see > > > if I can order over the phone. > > > Fay > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: Dusty <dustyc@microgear.net> > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 7:22 AM > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Dawes info.? > > > > > > > > > > I can tell you what family members are listed on the same census card, > > > > sometimes helping people to recognize if a name is their ancestor or > > not. > > > > > > > > Seems to me like I have been told you can do this over the phone with > > > credit > > > > card. > > > > > > > > dusty > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: faynshep <faynshep@telapex.com> > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 1:14 AM > > > > Subject: [CHAHTA] Dawes info.? > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dusty, Can you order a packet over the phone and pay with a credit > > card? > > > > > I have a name, age, census number, and roll number. Is there any > more > > > > info. > > > > > on what you have? > > > > > Fay > > > > > Don't ever give up.!!!! > > > > > http://www.accessgenealogy.com/gedcoms/ratcliff/ > > > > > List owner HOLDEN-L, SCHIFANO-L > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > > > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the > > quotes > > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the > quotes > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > Choctaw Home Page: > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... >

Weeellllllll, it's easy for most people to remember a subject they're really interested in. I have several book that I use for reference also. dusty ----- Original Message ----- From: Dennis Boswell <dennisb@primenet.com> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 9:11 PM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Re: THANKS TO OUR ANCESTORS > Dusty, several times a day, I am amazed at your personal warehouse of > historic and legal knowledge about Choctaw history. I cannot imagine how > many shelves, boxes and stacks of information you likely surround yourself > with in your home, or is it all in your head?. > > At 08:28 PM 04/06/2001 -0500, you wrote: > >Those limitations on being able to do business without a legal guardian for > >1/2 or fullbloods were called "restrictions", and that law as formally > >struck down around the turn of the century, I believe. I can't put my hand > >on the exact date at the moment. > > > >dusty > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > >Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > Regards, > > Dennis K. Boswell > 301 Crow Canyon Drive > Folsom, CA 95630 > > Tel: (916) 987-3599 > Fax: (916) 987-3555 > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > Choctaw Home Page: > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ >

After thinking about it I am reminded that Ruthie King once had a Choctaw chat room. Her old address was rimes@hotmail.com. Don't know if that's still a good address. dusty ----- Original Message ----- From: Dusty <dustyc@microgear.net> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 8:02 PM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Re: CHAHTA-D Digest V01 #195 > HA!! This is it!! We tried a chat room once and it failed. People are on > such different schedules, no one has a set time to sit down and chat.

Thanks for the info ----- Original Message ----- From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 10:35 PM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Chata vs. Chahta - Meaning ? > Patsy, > When we first learned how to speak english, we didn't write it...we learned > by sound only, and later we learned what letters were used to write those > words....well, Choctaw was not written long ago,but only spoken, until > someone came along who knew english and wanted to write what was being said > in Choctaw using the same letters as english...so they listened to the way > the Choctaw word sounded, and then used letters that came as close as > possible to how the Choctaw word sounded...since then, people have been > using those same letters to write in Choctaw. > Barbara > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Patsy Caleb" <studentarchaeologist@home.com> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 12:09 AM > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Chata vs. Chahta - Meaning ? > > > > Last year they had a language school going on ? How do you learn it if it > > is not written anywhere and how do they have these "learn the choctaw > > language school > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 9:02 PM > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Chata vs. Chahta - Meaning ? > > > > > > > Chata and Chahta are the same meaning..they mean Choctaw...Some of us > > spell > > > it one way, some the other.Depends on how we first learned it...Since > the > > > Choctaw language was not a written language but only a spoken language, > > > there are no "absolutely correct" spellings...they have been spelled > > mainly > > > as they sound, tho in some cases, in my opinion, some letters have been > > used > > > that are not necessary...hopefully the spellings will be standardized at > > > some point, but til then, spelling phonetically usually gets the message > > > across.... > > > Barbara > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Dennis Boswell" <dennisb@primenet.com> > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 10:54 PM > > > Subject: [CHAHTA] Chata vs. Chahta - Meaning ? > > > > > > > > > > I have seen this spelled both "Chata" and "Chahta." Which is correct? > > > > > > > > > > > > If the correct spelling is "Chata," then what does "Chahta" mean? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Doesn't "Chata" or "Chahta" (whichever is correct) really refer to > > > > pre-removal Choctaw instead of post-removal Choctaw or is it used to > > refer > > > > to Choctaw without regard to either pre- or post-removal? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Also, is "Chata" or "Chahta" (whichever is correct) also the name of > the > > > > language spoken by pre- or post-removal Choctaws ? > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry for all the questions, but based on what I have seen in some of > > the > > > > CHAHTA-L traffic lately, I am confused. Somewhere along the line, I > got > > > the > > > > impression that "Chahta" (with an "h") referred to the "old ones" and > > the > > > > language they spoke. Am I wrong? > > > > > > > > > > > > At 11:26 PM 04/06/2001 -0400, you wrote: > > > > >Chata is what the Choctaw call themselves > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > >TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > > > >Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the > > quotes > > > > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > Dennis K. Boswell > > > > 301 Crow Canyon Drive > > > > Folsom, CA 95630 > > > > > > > > Tel: (916) 987-3599 > > > > Fax: (916) 987-3555 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > Got a GRIPE?? Got a PROBLEM?? Just wanna' WHINE? Don't post it to the > list...write me, dusty (list administrator) at > CHAHTA-L-admin@cultures.rootsweb.com > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ >

thanks ----- Original Message ----- From: Dusty <dustyc@microgear.net> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 8:46 PM Subject: [CHAHTA] CHOCTAW CHAT ROOM > After thinking about it I am reminded that Ruthie King once had a Choctaw > chat room. Her old address was rimes@hotmail.com. Don't know if that's > still a good address. > > dusty > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Dusty <dustyc@microgear.net> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 8:02 PM > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Re: CHAHTA-D Digest V01 #195 > > > > HA!! This is it!! We tried a chat room once and it failed. People are > on > > such different schedules, no one has a set time to sit down and chat. > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... >