Yeah and incest to keep the blood lines pure. If you feel this way is right.....? As far back as there is reported history there has always been the "mixing" of blood lines. Whenever MAN defeated his enemy he took the women he wanted. That was part of his award for winning the battle. That still happens today!! If you are making refernce to the "white" man, don't forget, he did not win ALL the battles. Jim jmorsn@coastalnet.com http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Patsy Caleb" <studentarchaeologist@home.com> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 10:21 PM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] twinkies > you know what dusty > god always kept brothers apart from each other the danites over here and the > davidites in another area > or the whites in one area and the indains in another area etc > i just think thats the way; its supposed to be > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Dusty <dustyc@microgear.net> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 2:10 PM > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] twinkies > > > > The problem seems to be, with people who have no Indian blood, getting > them > > to LISTEN. The native people of this country are far more in tune with > what > > is going on re this continent than the invaders, but those who are all > into > > technology and the worship of man's knowledge rather than Gods knowledge > > seem to screw everything up and then wonder what happened to make things > go > > wrong. IMHO > > > > dusty > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 2:01 PM > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] twinkies > > > > > > > Those who have grown up in Indian communities but seem to have no > > knowledge > > > of their own spirituality are still aware of something inside that is > > > different, even if they don't know what it is.(Because of the thick > > > assimilation) > > > And it is my hope that more of our people will recognise that we are not > > > "second class" and that our spirituality is not just a matter of > > "beliefs", > > > and that it is not "inferior" to the spirituality any other race of > > > people...It is also my hope that those non-Indians who can learn a > better > > > way of living in balance from Indians, or whoever, will do so... > > > B. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Gemma West" <gemmawest@usa.net> > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 1:35 PM > > > Subject: [CHAHTA] twinkies > > > > > > > > > > What has happened for many people is that they wander through life > > trying > > > to > > > > figure out what is wrong...trying to figure out why they don't fit in. > > > > Attempts are made to mold themselves into someone else's defintions of > > > good > > > > and bad. These attempts fail. Finally that person decides to look to > > > their > > > > ancestors. They find themselves. They finally feel comfortable. It > is > > > > obvious to all that ancestors shape our biological characteristics. > It > > is > > > > obvious to me that ancestors shape our spirituality. The sad thing is > > > that > > > > sometimes the assimilation is so thick that you can grow up around > > Indians > > > and > > > > still not know your own spirituality. The beautiful thing is finding > > the > > > few > > > > who have refused assimilation and are willing to share knowledge. > > > > > > > > When non-Indian people ask to be allowed into the community it causes > us > > > to > > > > question ourselves. Does community still exist? What are they here > to > > > get? > > > > Are we really different from them? I think the great thing about this > > > reverse > > > > acculturation is that it is spurring some of us to re-embrace our own > > > > ancestors. It is removing the shame that our elders had to live with. > > > This > > > > shame had no place and that is becoming clear to new generations. If > we > > > can > > > > influence people to live a balanced life then that is a great thing. > > > After > > > > all, our children and their children will have to live in a world > shaped > > > by > > > > the parents. We can not afford to be selfish with principles of > > balance. > > > It > > > > seems that they need these principles much more than we do. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> wrote: > > > > "Our spirituality" is not "just an idea" and it is not something we > went > > > to > > > > class and learned somewhere, or got off the internet...it is born in > us > > > > (which is obvious to those Indians who were raised surrounded by a > white > > > > society) and a non-Indian may be able to learn from us some things, > but > > > they > > > > cannot "acquire" what they are not born with, and their attempts to > put > > > > themselves on an "equal footing", with Indians, so to speak, is at > best > > > > futile...and at worst, an attempt at cultural theft... > > > > B. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:59 PM > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > I shall play devil's advocate again and expose my rear to everyone's > > > > slings > > > > > and arrows... > > > > > > > > > > What about those people who do not "want to be NA", but just think > > our > > > > > spirituality, philosophy and way of life is a good idea. I've had > > > > countless > > > > > elders tell me, "I don't care what kind of blood you have, as long > as > > > it's > > > > > human". Just because an Anglo wants to practice our ways because it > > > works > > > > > for them, doesn't mean they deserve to be belittled by a derogatory > > > name. > > > > > Are there really that many among us that are so arrogant to do so. > > > > > > > > > > Where did we ever get the idea that that we were so exclusive? > Isn't > > > that > > > > > TRUE racism? > > > > > > > > > > dusty > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: John & Arla Williams <jaws@crosstel.net> > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:45 PM > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Elkdreamer, Where did the term come from? Arla > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:38 PM > > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Fay > > > > > > > Mostly people that want to be N/A and really have no Indian > blood > > at > > > > all > > > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: > > > > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the > > quotes > > > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > Choctaw Home Page: > > > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at > > > > http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________ > > > > Get free email and a permanent address at > http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > Choctaw Home Page: > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > Got a GRIPE?? Got a PROBLEM?? Just wanna' WHINE? Don't post it to the > list...write me, dusty (list administrator) at > CHAHTA-L-admin@cultures.rootsweb.com > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > >

Thank you!! I told everybody at the beginning of this discussion I WAS NOT A BIBLE TOOTER. I am a MAN and I do make mistakes!! Jim jmorsn@coastalnet.com http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Thurman & Elizabeth Harrison" <harriso5@ix.netcom.com> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 6:38 PM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > It was Abraham. He was ordered by God to sacrifice his son. In the end he > did not have to follow through? > thurman > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 5:05 PM > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > I was going to ask that same question. I don't remember Job making > > sacrifice. He complained a lot (lol), but his family members died from > > other causes, not from sacrifice. > > > > dusty > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Colin Kelley <CKELLEY@swpa.gov> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 1:39 PM > > Subject: RE: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > Did Job sacrifice a son? > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Patsy Caleb [mailto:studentarchaeologist@home.com] > > > Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 12:11 PM > > > To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > > > The original "Thou Shalt not kill" reads "Thou shalt not kill without a > > > reason" from the Lost Books of the Bible and forgotten Books of Eden" > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: Jim Morrison, Jr. <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 10:16 PM > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > > > > What "animal" gives its life freely to death? > > > > The ONLY one that could is MAN (human). And even MAN does not do so > > > > hesitation. Could you honestly take a child of YOUR'S and kill the > child > > > as > > > > an offering? For whatever the "rewards" that were promised. Could you? > > > > When did Job sacarafice is son? Before or after the 10 Commandments > were > > > > writen? Why? Isn't one of the Commandments "Thous Shall Not Kill"? > > > > Jim > > > > > > > > jmorsn@coastalnet.com > > > > http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2001 7:12 AM > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > > > > > > > good question > > > > > I think that the statement, offering of his life could be > > considered > > > to > > > > > be like Job in the Bible he really didn't do it willing but when he > > did > > > > God > > > > > blessed him. Kind of like the warrior does giving thanks to the > > animal's > > > > > spirit so he could feed his family. > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > >Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 09:27:28 -0500 > > > > > > > > > > > >I have one question here just for clarification. It doesn't mean > I'm > > > > > >challenging your statement, it just means I have a question, OK? > If > > > the > > > > > >animal is giving an offering of it's life, why does it run away? > > > > > > > > > > > >dusty > > > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > > > >From: Elkdreamer Wilkins <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > >Sent: Monday, April 02, 2001 5:19 AM > > > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Jim > > > > > > > #1 question > > > > > > > Another word for the supreme being > > > > > > > #2 the offering of its life > > > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: "Jim Morrison, Jr." <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> > > > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > >Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 01:23:34 -0400 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Two quick questions: > > > > > > > >1) Who is "Grand Father"? > > > > > > > >2) The ANIMAL is giving an offering when IT is killed? > > > > > > > >Jim > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >jmorsn@coastalnet.com > > > > > > > >http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > > > > > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > > >From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > > > > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > > > >Sent: Saturday, March 31, 2001 10:36 PM > > > > > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Dennis > > > > > > > > > I am sorry if I offended you in anyway. My intrest is in > all > > > > > >things > > > > > > > > > Choctaw. and Spirituality is one of the aspects of it. To > > > > understand > > > > > > > >Indian > > > > > > > > > people you have to dig deep into their thought pattern. When > > > they > > > > > >killed > > > > > > > > > animals for food and clothing they said a prayer To > > Grandfather > > > > for > > > > > >the > > > > > > > > > offering that the animal gave and gave respect to the animal > > > also. > > > > > >When > > > > > > > >they > > > > > > > > > did beadwork they put part of their spirit in it also. when > a > > > > object > > > > > >was > > > > > > > > > discarded it was done with respect. Spirtuality was > considered > > > in > > > > > >all > > > > > > > >things > > > > > > > > > done. That is one of the reasons that the Europeans that > came > > > here > > > > > > > > > misunderstood our people and their ways. > > > > > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: Dennis Boswell <dennisb@primenet.com> > > > > > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > > > >Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 09:56:57 -0800 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Message for Elkdreamer and Dusty: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Regarding who subscribes to CHAHTA-L and why, permit me to > > > > suggest > > > > > >that > > > > > > > > > >this list very likely has Choctaw and non-Choctaw > > subscribers. > > > > > >Among > > > > > > > >both > > > > > > > > > >groups, there are those who have an exclusive interest in > > > > religion > > > > > >all > > > > > > > >the > > > > > > > > > >way to those who have an exclusive interest in some other > > > aspect > > > > of > > > > > > > >Choctaw > > > > > > > > > >life but no interest at all in religion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >In my case, I find Choctaw religious beliefs and the recent > > > > > >discussion > > > > > > > > > >surrounding them educational and thought provoking. > However, > > my > > > > > > > >personal > > > > > > > > > >interest does not directly concern Choctaw religion. It is > > very > > > > > >narrow > > > > > > > >and > > > > > > > > > >concerns central Mississippi, pre-removal Choctaw social > and > > > > family > > > > > > > > > >customs, very narrowly defined examples of the Choctaw > > language > > > > as > > > > > > > >about > > > > > > > > > >1800, relationships with early white settlers, trails and > > paths > > > > > > > >followed > > > > > > > >by > > > > > > > > > >these Choctaw in relationship to today's central > Mississippi > > > > county > > > > > > > > > >boundaries and the impact of removal on these same Choctaw > > with > > > > > > > >specific > > > > > > > > > >emphasis on the Durant Choctaw clan. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >If I unsubscribe, which I will do one day (to return at a > > later > > > > > >date), > > > > > > > >it > > > > > > > > > >will have nothing to do with whether I do or do not "learn > > > other > > > > > > > >religious > > > > > > > > > >views," "heat in the kitchen" or "sensitive subjects." It > > will > > > > have > > > > > > > > > >everything to do with the fact that I subscribe to about > > > > > >thirty-five > > > > > > > >lists, > > > > > > > > > >receive mountains of email and have priorities on my time > and > > > my > > > > > > > >interests > > > > > > > > > >that are quite different than anyone else on this list - a > > > > comment > > > > > >that > > > > > > > > > >about everyone of you can make. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Recognize that one of the wonderful aspects of CHAHTA-L (in > > > > > >comparison > > > > > > > >with > > > > > > > > > >virtually all na hollo lists) is the diversity of thought, > > > > > >background, > > > > > > > > > >education and perspective it offers. Were I to make one > > > > suggestion > > > > > >to > > > > > > > >those > > > > > > > > > >of you who clearly dominate this list, please guard against > > > > > >becoming > > > > > > > >too > > > > > > > > > >clannish lest the very diversity that enriches this site > > might > > > in > > > > > >time > > > > > > > > > >vanish leaving something less in its wake than you enjoy > > today. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >At 08:50 AM 03/31/2001 -0800, you wrote: > > > > > > > > > >>Halito Dusty and All list members > > > > > > > > > >> I believe that we all have the right to believe in the > way > > > > that > > > > > >we > > > > > > > >want > > > > > > > > > >>to. And in this aspect the right to discuss our and each > > > others > > > > > >views > > > > > > > >in > > > > > > > > > >>a intellegent and Adult way. Aparentlly the ones that left > > > will > > > > in > > > > > >no > > > > > > > >way > > > > > > > > > >>ever learn that there are other views than their own. Like > I > > > > have > > > > > > > >always > > > > > > > > > >>been told if you can't stand the heat get out of the > > kitchen. > > > I > > > > > >guess > > > > > > > > > >>that is what they did. Lets keep up the heat I'm having > fun. > > > > > > > > > >> Walk in Beauty > > > > > > > > > >> Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >>>From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > > > > > > > > > >>>Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > > > >>>To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > > > >>>Subject: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > > > >>>Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 09:38:58 -0600 > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > >>>We lost another 5 listmembers this morning. Don't know > for > > > > what > > > > > > > >reason. > > > > > > > > > >>>While I suspect sensitive subject matter may be the > reason, > > > > this > > > > > >is > > > > > > > >only > > > > > > > > > >>>a > > > > > > > > > >>>supposition on my part. I have absolutely no objection > to > > > the > > > > > >topic > > > > > > > > > >>>continuing if that's what you guys want. Among other > > > > > >peculiarities > > > > > > > >and > > > > > > > > > >>>character faults, I happen to wholeheartedly support the > > > First > > > > > > > >Amendment > > > > > > > > > >>>on > > > > > > > > > >>>this particular topic. What do you guys think?? > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > >>>dusty > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > > > >Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > > > > > > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at > > > http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > > > Got a GRIPE?? Got a PROBLEM?? Just wanna' WHINE? Don't > post > > it > > > > to > > > > > >the > > > > > > > >list...write me, dusty (list administrator) at > > > > > > > >CHAHTA-L-admin@cultures.rootsweb.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > >Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > > > > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at > http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > Choctaw Home Page: > > > > > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > >Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: > > > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the > quotes > > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at > > > http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > >

Kris: Are you new to this list? That's what we've been doing the last week or so. And in doing so, our list shrank from about 100 down to 68 as of this morning. In the past 10 days I've received mail that ranged from mild chiding to words that a sailor that had been to sea for seven years wouldn't think of. Stick around, the subject will come back up again! <LOL> If you have questons, please ask. Someone here may be able to answer. dusty ----- Original Message ----- From: Kris Harapan <harapank@wwdb.org> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 10:22 AM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > Tsana, > > I second this. Having recently begun a spiritual quest of my own, I have > been looking for a forum (online and off) that would support me in asking > questions, without trying to force me onto a given path. I have just left > that route behind, and would very much like to find the path that is right > for me. What seems to be the hardest right now is finding a reputable > source for guidance into exploring new areas, and having a place where it is > okay to have questions. Am open to any suggestions others might have. > > I know the recent discussions have been a bit hard on some, but I have found > it to be quite helpful. I know concern has been expressed about using this > forum for spiritual discussions, what would be the possibility of having a > list for discussion of traditional Choctaw beliefs, the impact of outside > religions on those beliefs, and how this impacts their descendents today? > Would their be enough interest to support something like that? > > Kris > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Tsa na Jordan <medicgirl78@yahoo.com> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 9:52 PM > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > Barbara, > > I, like, Patsy, beg to differ. The only difference, it seems, between > > you and I is that you had a chance to grow up with and learn the Choctaw > > culture from your family, elders, etc. I, on the other hand, did not have > > that luxury. Now, it's no fault of mine, nor of my family. They did what > > they thought best for the family at the time. OK, so does that mean that > I > > am not as interested? NO. Does that mean that I can't learn a lot about > it > > from the internet, books, elders, other tribal members, etc.? NO. Does > it > > mean that I can become as knowledgable as you who grew up with it? YES. > I > > will probably never know all that you do, nor will that bother me. I want > > to learn my family's history and culture. Does it mean that I may adopt > > some of the beliefs I learn about? PROBABLY since I've already adopted > some > > of the Cherokee beliefs. Does it mean that you are a better "Indian" than > > I? NOPE. Does it mean that you are a better person, in general, than I? > > NOPE. > > I would appreciate your sharing some of the ways of the Choctaw since > > you are so educated in those ways. Now, I'm fully aware that there are > some > > things that simply aren't meant to be on the internet, and I respect that. > > So, sister, I lay down my bundle of tobacco beside you and ask in a good > > way - will you help me learn? I ask this with all respect. But, with the > > same respect I'm also saying that I don't want to debate or argue. If > > you're willing to sharing information, I'm your sponge, here to soak it > all > > up! > > Thanks, Barbara! > > Tsana > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Patsy Caleb <studentarchaeologist@home.com> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 1:12 PM > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > can i disagree to that because the more i learn about my choctaw > heritage > > > the more spiritual i become > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 10:49 AM > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > "Our spirituality" is not "just an idea" and it is not something we > went > > > to > > > > class and learned somewhere, or got off the internet...it is born in > us > > > > (which is obvious to those Indians who were raised surrounded by a > white > > > > society) and a non-Indian may be able to learn from us some things, > but > > > they > > > > cannot "acquire" what they are not born with, and their attempts to > put > > > > themselves on an "equal footing", with Indians, so to speak, is at > best > > > > futile...and at worst, an attempt at cultural theft... > > > > B. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:59 PM > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > I shall play devil's advocate again and expose my rear to everyone's > > > > slings > > > > > and arrows... > > > > > > > > > > What about those people who do not "want to be NA", but just think > > our > > > > > spirituality, philosophy and way of life is a good idea. I've had > > > > countless > > > > > elders tell me, "I don't care what kind of blood you have, as long > as > > > it's > > > > > human". Just because an Anglo wants to practice our ways because it > > > works > > > > > for them, doesn't mean they deserve to be belittled by a derogatory > > > name. > > > > > Are there really that many among us that are so arrogant to do so. > > > > > > > > > > Where did we ever get the idea that that we were so exclusive? > Isn't > > > that > > > > > TRUE racism? > > > > > > > > > > dusty > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: John & Arla Williams <jaws@crosstel.net> > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:45 PM > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Elkdreamer, Where did the term come from? Arla > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:38 PM > > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Fay > > > > > > > Mostly people that want to be N/A and really have no Indian > blood > > at > > > > all > > > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: > > > > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the > > quotes > > > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > Choctaw Home Page: > > > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at > > > http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > _________________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. >

Some groups are dated as of 1902. Other groups are dated as of different dates. Here's the way it breaks down: Choctaws by Blood, Sept. 25, 1902 Newborn Choctaws, March 4, 1905 Minor Choctaws, Marhc 4, 1906 Intermarried Choctaws, Sept. 25, 1902 Choctaw Freedmen, Sept. 25, 1902 Minor Choctaw Freedmen, March 4, 1906 Mississippi Choctaws, Sept. 25, 1902 Newborn Miss. Choctaw, March 4, 1905 Minor Miss. Choctaw, March 4, 1906 Chickasaws, Sept. 25, 1902 Newborn Chickasaw, March 4, 1905 Minor Chickasaw, March 4, 1906 Intermarried Chickasaw, Sept. 25, 1902 Chickasaw Freedmen, 'Sept. 25, 1902 Cherokee by Blood, Sept. 1, 1902 Minor Cherokee, March 4, 1905 Delaware Cherokee-no date shown on roll Intermarried Cherokee-no date shown Cherokee Freedmen-no date shown Minor Cherokee Freedmen-March 4, 1907 Creeks by Blood-age is shown as of date of enrollment. In order to calculate age it is necessary to have a copy of census card showing date of enrollment Newborn Creeks-age as of enrollment date Minor Creek-age as of enrollment date Creek Freedmen-age as of enrollment date Minor Creek Freedmen-age age of enrollment date Seminole by Blood-Dec. 31, 1899 Seminole Freedmen-March 3, 1905 Minor Seminoles-March 3, 1905 dusty ----- Original Message ----- From: Elkdreamer Wilkins <elkdremr@hotmail.com> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 9:32 AM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Dawes info.? > Halito Fay > On the Nail site the first page has the year that it was done. It was > in 1902. > Walk in Beauty > Elkdreamer > > > >From: faynshep <faynshep@telapex.com> > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Dawes info.? > >Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2001 21:35:46 -0700 > > > >But how do you know what year that roll was done? I'm thinking there is > >some broad span of years. Do you just have to wait until you get the > >packet > >and then will you be able to find out about when they were born? > >Fay > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: Dusty <dustyc@microgear.net> > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > >Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 1:19 PM > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Dawes info.? > > > > > > > Yes, age is listed on the Dawes roll. You calculate it from the year > >that > > > particular roll was done. > > > > > > dusty > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: faynshep <faynshep@telapex.com> > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 1:06 PM > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Dawes info.? > > > > > > > > > > You know, it tells you so much but it doesn't say what year that > > > information > > > > was taken so you don't know when a person was born. I will call them > >and > > > see > > > > if I can order over the phone. > > > > Fay > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: Dusty <dustyc@microgear.net> > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 7:22 AM > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Dawes info.? > > > > > > > > > > > > > I can tell you what family members are listed on the same census > >card, > > > > > sometimes helping people to recognize if a name is their ancestor or > > > not. > > > > > > > > > > Seems to me like I have been told you can do this over the phone > >with > > > > credit > > > > > card. > > > > > > > > > > dusty > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: faynshep <faynshep@telapex.com> > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 1:14 AM > > > > > Subject: [CHAHTA] Dawes info.? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dusty, Can you order a packet over the phone and pay with a credit > > > card? > > > > > > I have a name, age, census number, and roll number. Is there any > >more > > > > > info. > > > > > > on what you have? > > > > > > Fay > > > > > > Don't ever give up.!!!! > > > > > > http://www.accessgenealogy.com/gedcoms/ratcliff/ > > > > > > List owner HOLDEN-L, SCHIFANO-L > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > > > > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the > > > quotes > > > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > > > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the > >quotes > > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > Choctaw Home Page: > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > >TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > >Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... >

"In my humble opinion" dusty ----- Original Message ----- From: Linda Branum <mamalin@1s.net> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 9:47 AM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] IMHO? Dusty > Hi Dusty, > I am wondering what IMHO is. I know its like LOL and other puter slang but > I keep seeing this one and don't know what you mean????? > Thanks Dusty, > Linda Kirby Branum > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 8:13 AM > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > IMHO if you feel you have the blood, then you probably do. It's those > old > > spirits calling to you. > > > > dusty > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Jim Morrison, Jr. <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 12:40 AM > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > Elk > > > What about those (ME!!) who feel that they are, ancestors were in the > > proper > > > geographical area at the right time frame, but just can not find the > proof > > > (or whatever you want to call it!!)? > > > Jim > > > > > > jmorsn@coastalnet.com > > > http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 9:38 PM > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > Halito Fay > > > > Mostly people that want to be N/A and really have no Indian blood at > all > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > >From: faynshep <faynshep@telapex.com> > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > >Date: Wed, 04 Apr 2001 20:11:49 -0700 > > > > > > > > > >Excuse me, but, what is a twinkie? > > > > >Fay > > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > > >From: Kim Collins <2buckets@arbuckleonline.com> > > > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > >Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 6:07 PM > > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Elkdreamer, > > > > > > Well said! And so true. > > > > > > Kim IBSSG > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 7:14 AM > > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Gemma > > > > > > > I was refering to people that have no Native American blood in > > > them > > > > >at > > > > > > > all. But I do feel for them because they are far removed from > > their > > > > > > > ancestors here in America. Our Old ones still walk with us here. > > > > > > > Walk in beauty > > > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: Gemma West <gemmawest@usa.net> > > > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > >Subject: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > >Date: 3 Apr 2001 10:10:11 EDT > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Who are you referring to when you say "they" ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >"Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > > >Halito Gemma > > > > > > > > My personal observations give me reason to believe that they > > can > > > > >see > > > > > > > >that > > > > > > > >we have a more centered culture with the bones of our Ancestors > > > here > > > > >with > > > > > > > >us > > > > > > > >to help guide our thoughts. They are trying to achive the same > > > > >connect > > > > > > that > > > > > > > >we feel to our past. > > > > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: Gemma West <gemmawest@usa.net> > > > > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > > >Subject: [CHAHTA] twinkies > > > > > > > > >Date: 2 Apr 2001 11:02:35 EDT > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Sometimes I think the rush to investigate Indian ancestry is > > > rather > > > > > > > >amusing > > > > > > > > >also. After all, it has been estimated that only 7% of all > > > > >Americans > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > >Indian blood. On the other hand it has been estimated that > 20% > > of > > > > > > > > >European-Americans have African blood. For some reason, > > however, > > > > >there > > > > > > > >has > > > > > > > > >been no parallel rush to claim African blood. I have to > wonder > > > why. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >"Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> wrote: > > > > > > > > >This is a good topic if anyone wants to tackle it within > > > > > > > >guidelines....the > > > > > > > > >words "twinkie" and "wannabe" and their usage by both NA's > and > > > > >whites. > > > > > > > > >Also, the prejudices that make these words acceptable. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >dusty > > > > > > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > > > >From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> > > > > > > > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > > > > >Sent: Sunday, April 01, 2001 9:20 PM > > > > > > > > >Subject: [CHAHTA] Something so funny.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Was listening to AIROS (www.airos.org/) > > > > > > > > > > this morning and there was a comic on talking about a > > twinkie > > > > > > > >university > > > > > > > > >called I Wannebe U....the whole routine was hilarious....this > > is > > > a > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > > >Got a GRIPE?? Got a PROBLEM?? Just wanna' WHINE? Don't post > > it > > > to > > > > >the > > > > > > > > >list...write me, dusty (list administrator) at > > > > > > > > >CHAHTA-L-admin@cultures.rootsweb.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >____________________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > > >Get free email and a permanent address at > > > > > > http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > > >Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at > > > > > > > > >http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >_________________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > >Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at > http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: > > > > > > > >Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the > > > > >quotes > > > > > > > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >____________________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > >Get free email and a permanent address at > > > > >http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > >Choctaw Home Page: > > > > > > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at > http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > > > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > > > > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the > > > quotes > > > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > >To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > > > >Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the > quotes > > > > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the > quotes > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... >

Thanks ya'll I will look......byeeeeee c ya, Linda ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dennis Boswell" <dennisb@primenet.com> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 10:08 AM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] IMHO? Dusty > Linda, here is an even more complete computer slang site. > > http://www.futureland.gr/comics/slang/slang.htm > > At 08:03 AM 04/07/2001 -0700, you wrote: > >Linda, take a look at > > http://www.ukans.edu/acs/docs/computing-glossary/computerslang.shtml > > > > > > > >At 09:47 AM 04/07/2001 -0500, you wrote: > >> Hi Dusty, > >> I am wondering what IMHO is. I know its like LOL and other puter slang but > >>I keep seeing this one and don't know what you mean????? > >> Thanks Dusty, > >>Linda Kirby Branum > >>----- Original Message ----- > >>From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > >>To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > >>Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 8:13 AM > >>Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > >> > >> > >> > IMHO if you feel you have the blood, then you probably do. It's those > >>old > >> > spirits calling to you. > >> > > >> > dusty > >> > ----- Original Message ----- > >> > From: Jim Morrison, Jr. <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> > >> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > >> > Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 12:40 AM > >> > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > >> > > >> > > >> > > Elk > >> > > What about those (ME!!) who feel that they are, ancestors were in the > >> > proper > >> > > geographical area at the right time frame, but just can not find the > >>proof > >> > > (or whatever you want to call it!!)? > >> > > Jim > >> > > > >> > > jmorsn@coastalnet.com > >> > > http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > >> > > ----- Original Message ----- > >> > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > >> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > >> > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 9:38 PM > >> > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > Halito Fay > >> > > > Mostly people that want to be N/A and really have no Indian blood at > >>all > >> > > > Walk in Beauty > >> > > > Elkdreamer > >> > > > > >> > > > >From: faynshep <faynshep@telapex.com> > >> > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > >> > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > >> > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > >> > > > >Date: Wed, 04 Apr 2001 20:11:49 -0700 > >> > > > > > >> > > > >Excuse me, but, what is a twinkie? > >> > > > >Fay > >> > > > >----- Original Message ----- > >> > > > >From: Kim Collins <2buckets@arbuckleonline.com> > >> > > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > >> > > > >Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 6:07 PM > >> > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > Halito Elkdreamer, > >> > > > > > Well said! And so true. > >> > > > > > Kim IBSSG > >> > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > >> > > > > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > >> > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > >> > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 7:14 AM > >> > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Halito Gemma > >> > > > > > > I was refering to people that have no Native American blood in > >> > > them > >> > > > >at > >> > > > > > > all. But I do feel for them because they are far removed from > >> > their > >> > > > > > > ancestors here in America. Our Old ones still walk with us here. > >> > > > > > > Walk in beauty > >> > > > > > > Elkdreamer > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >From: Gemma West <gemmawest@usa.net> > >> > > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > >> > > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > >> > > > > > > >Subject: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > >> > > > > > > >Date: 3 Apr 2001 10:10:11 EDT > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >Who are you referring to when you say "they" ? > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >"Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> wrote: > >> > > > > > > >Halito Gemma > >> > > > > > > > My personal observations give me reason to believe that they > >> > can > >> > > > >see > >> > > > > > > >that > >> > > > > > > >we have a more centered culture with the bones of our Ancestors > >> > > here > >> > > > >with > >> > > > > > > >us > >> > > > > > > >to help guide our thoughts. They are trying to achive the same > >> > > > >connect > >> > > > > > that > >> > > > > > > >we feel to our past. > >> > > > > > > > Walk in Beauty > >> > > > > > > > Elkdreamer > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >From: Gemma West <gemmawest@usa.net> > >> > > > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > >> > > > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > >> > > > > > > > >Subject: [CHAHTA] twinkies > >> > > > > > > > >Date: 2 Apr 2001 11:02:35 EDT > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >Sometimes I think the rush to investigate Indian ancestry is > >> > > rather > >> > > > > > > >amusing > >> > > > > > > > >also. After all, it has been estimated that only 7% of all > >> > > > >Americans > >> > > > > > have > >> > > > > > > > >Indian blood. On the other hand it has been estimated that > >>20% > >> > of > >> > > > > > > > >European-Americans have African blood. For some reason, > >> > however, > >> > > > >there > >> > > > > > > >has > >> > > > > > > > >been no parallel rush to claim African blood. I have to > >>wonder > >> > > why. > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >"Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> wrote: > >> > > > > > > > >This is a good topic if anyone wants to tackle it within > >> > > > > > > >guidelines....the > >> > > > > > > > >words "twinkie" and "wannabe" and their usage by both NA's > >>and > >> > > > >whites. > >> > > > > > > > >Also, the prejudices that make these words acceptable. > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >dusty > >> > > > > > > > >----- Original Message ----- > >> > > > > > > > >From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> > >> > > > > > > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > >> > > > > > > > >Sent: Sunday, April 01, 2001 9:20 PM > >> > > > > > > > >Subject: [CHAHTA] Something so funny.... > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Was listening to AIROS (www.airos.org/) > >> > > > > > > > > > this morning and there was a comic on talking about a > >> > twinkie > >> > > > > > > >university > >> > > > > > > > >called I Wannebe U....the whole routine was hilarious....this > >> > is > >> > > a > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > >> > > > > > > > >Got a GRIPE?? Got a PROBLEM?? Just wanna' WHINE? Don't post > >> > it > >> > > to > >> > > > >the > >> > > > > > > > >list...write me, dusty (list administrator) at > >> > > > > > > > >CHAHTA-L-admin@cultures.rootsweb.com > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> >____________________________________________________________________ > >> > > > > > > > >Get free email and a permanent address at > >> > > > > > http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > >> > > > > > > > >Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at > >> > > > > > > > >http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> >_________________________________________________________________ > >> > > > > > > >Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at > >>http://explorer.msn.com > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > >> > > > > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: > >> > > > > > > >Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > >> > > > > > > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the > >> > > > >quotes > >> > > > > > > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > >____________________________________________________________________ > >> > > > > > > >Get free email and a permanent address at > >> > > > >http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > >> > > > > > > >Choctaw Home Page: > >> > > > > > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >>_________________________________________________________________ > >> > > > > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at > >>http://explorer.msn.com > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > >> > > > > > > Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > >> > > > > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > >> > > > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > >> > > > > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > >> > > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the > >> > > quotes > >> > > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > >> > > > >To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > >> > > > >Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > >> > > > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the > >>quotes > >> > > > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > _________________________________________________________________ > >> > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > >> > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > >> > > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > >> > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the > >>quotes > >> > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > >> > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > >> > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > >> > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > >> > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > >> > > > >> > > >> > > >> > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > >> > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > >> > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > >> > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > >> > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > >> > > >> > >> > >>==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > >> To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > >>Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > >>Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > >>Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > >Regards, > > > >Dennis K. Boswell > >301 Crow Canyon Drive > >Folsom, CA 95630 > > > >Tel: (916) 987-3599 > >Fax: (916) 987-3555 > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > >Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at > >http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. > > > > > > > Regards, > > Dennis K. Boswell > 301 Crow Canyon Drive > Folsom, CA 95630 > > Tel: (916) 987-3599 > Fax: (916) 987-3555 > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. >

Kris, Like I told Tsana, she either misunderstood my post or didn't know what I was responding to...You are welcome to use the message board on our site for any discussions or questions you might have... http://www.angelfire.com/ok3/greybird7/index.html ...don't know what kind of answers you will get, guess it will depend on the questions and who wants to answer... Chi pisa Barbara ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kris Harapan" <harapank@wwdb.org> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 10:22 AM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > Tsana, > > I second this. Having recently begun a spiritual quest of my own, I have > been looking for a forum (online and off) that would support me in asking > questions, without trying to force me onto a given path. I have just left > that route behind, and would very much like to find the path that is right > for me. What seems to be the hardest right now is finding a reputable > source for guidance into exploring new areas, and having a place where it is > okay to have questions. Am open to any suggestions others might have. > > I know the recent discussions have been a bit hard on some, but I have found > it to be quite helpful. I know concern has been expressed about using this > forum for spiritual discussions, what would be the possibility of having a > list for discussion of traditional Choctaw beliefs, the impact of outside > religions on those beliefs, and how this impacts their descendents today? > Would their be enough interest to support something like that? > > Kris > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Tsa na Jordan <medicgirl78@yahoo.com> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 9:52 PM > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > Barbara, > > I, like, Patsy, beg to differ. The only difference, it seems, between > > you and I is that you had a chance to grow up with and learn the Choctaw > > culture from your family, elders, etc. I, on the other hand, did not have > > that luxury. Now, it's no fault of mine, nor of my family. They did what > > they thought best for the family at the time. OK, so does that mean that > I > > am not as interested? NO. Does that mean that I can't learn a lot about > it > > from the internet, books, elders, other tribal members, etc.? NO. Does > it > > mean that I can become as knowledgable as you who grew up with it? YES. > I > > will probably never know all that you do, nor will that bother me. I want > > to learn my family's history and culture. Does it mean that I may adopt > > some of the beliefs I learn about? PROBABLY since I've already adopted > some > > of the Cherokee beliefs. Does it mean that you are a better "Indian" than > > I? NOPE. Does it mean that you are a better person, in general, than I? > > NOPE. > > I would appreciate your sharing some of the ways of the Choctaw since > > you are so educated in those ways. Now, I'm fully aware that there are > some > > things that simply aren't meant to be on the internet, and I respect that. > > So, sister, I lay down my bundle of tobacco beside you and ask in a good > > way - will you help me learn? I ask this with all respect. But, with the > > same respect I'm also saying that I don't want to debate or argue. If > > you're willing to sharing information, I'm your sponge, here to soak it > all > > up! > > Thanks, Barbara! > > Tsana > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Patsy Caleb <studentarchaeologist@home.com> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 1:12 PM > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > can i disagree to that because the more i learn about my choctaw > heritage > > > the more spiritual i become > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 10:49 AM > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > "Our spirituality" is not "just an idea" and it is not something we > went > > > to > > > > class and learned somewhere, or got off the internet...it is born in > us > > > > (which is obvious to those Indians who were raised surrounded by a > white > > > > society) and a non-Indian may be able to learn from us some things, > but > > > they > > > > cannot "acquire" what they are not born with, and their attempts to > put > > > > themselves on an "equal footing", with Indians, so to speak, is at > best > > > > futile...and at worst, an attempt at cultural theft... > > > > B. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:59 PM > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > I shall play devil's advocate again and expose my rear to everyone's > > > > slings > > > > > and arrows... > > > > > > > > > > What about those people who do not "want to be NA", but just think > > our > > > > > spirituality, philosophy and way of life is a good idea. I've had > > > > countless > > > > > elders tell me, "I don't care what kind of blood you have, as long > as > > > it's > > > > > human". Just because an Anglo wants to practice our ways because it > > > works > > > > > for them, doesn't mean they deserve to be belittled by a derogatory > > > name. > > > > > Are there really that many among us that are so arrogant to do so. > > > > > > > > > > Where did we ever get the idea that that we were so exclusive? > Isn't > > > that > > > > > TRUE racism? > > > > > > > > > > dusty > > > > > > > > > >

i always thought that Imho meant I imagine so ----- Original Message ----- From: Dusty <dustyc@microgear.net> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 6:13 AM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > IMHO if you feel you have the blood, then you probably do. It's those old > spirits calling to you. > > dusty > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Jim Morrison, Jr. <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 12:40 AM > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > Elk > > What about those (ME!!) who feel that they are, ancestors were in the > proper > > geographical area at the right time frame, but just can not find the proof > > (or whatever you want to call it!!)? > > Jim > > > > jmorsn@coastalnet.com > > http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 9:38 PM > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > Halito Fay > > > Mostly people that want to be N/A and really have no Indian blood at all > > > Walk in Beauty > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > >From: faynshep <faynshep@telapex.com> > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > >Date: Wed, 04 Apr 2001 20:11:49 -0700 > > > > > > > >Excuse me, but, what is a twinkie? > > > >Fay > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > >From: Kim Collins <2buckets@arbuckleonline.com> > > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > >Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 6:07 PM > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Elkdreamer, > > > > > Well said! And so true. > > > > > Kim IBSSG > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 7:14 AM > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Gemma > > > > > > I was refering to people that have no Native American blood in > > them > > > >at > > > > > > all. But I do feel for them because they are far removed from > their > > > > > > ancestors here in America. Our Old ones still walk with us here. > > > > > > Walk in beauty > > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: Gemma West <gemmawest@usa.net> > > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > >Subject: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > >Date: 3 Apr 2001 10:10:11 EDT > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Who are you referring to when you say "they" ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > >"Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > >Halito Gemma > > > > > > > My personal observations give me reason to believe that they > can > > > >see > > > > > > >that > > > > > > >we have a more centered culture with the bones of our Ancestors > > here > > > >with > > > > > > >us > > > > > > >to help guide our thoughts. They are trying to achive the same > > > >connect > > > > > that > > > > > > >we feel to our past. > > > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: Gemma West <gemmawest@usa.net> > > > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > >Subject: [CHAHTA] twinkies > > > > > > > >Date: 2 Apr 2001 11:02:35 EDT > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Sometimes I think the rush to investigate Indian ancestry is > > rather > > > > > > >amusing > > > > > > > >also. After all, it has been estimated that only 7% of all > > > >Americans > > > > > have > > > > > > > >Indian blood. On the other hand it has been estimated that 20% > of > > > > > > > >European-Americans have African blood. For some reason, > however, > > > >there > > > > > > >has > > > > > > > >been no parallel rush to claim African blood. I have to wonder > > why. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >"Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> wrote: > > > > > > > >This is a good topic if anyone wants to tackle it within > > > > > > >guidelines....the > > > > > > > >words "twinkie" and "wannabe" and their usage by both NA's and > > > >whites. > > > > > > > >Also, the prejudices that make these words acceptable. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >dusty > > > > > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > > >From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> > > > > > > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > > > >Sent: Sunday, April 01, 2001 9:20 PM > > > > > > > >Subject: [CHAHTA] Something so funny.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Was listening to AIROS (www.airos.org/) > > > > > > > > > this morning and there was a comic on talking about a > twinkie > > > > > > >university > > > > > > > >called I Wannebe U....the whole routine was hilarious....this > is > > a > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > >Got a GRIPE?? Got a PROBLEM?? Just wanna' WHINE? Don't post > it > > to > > > >the > > > > > > > >list...write me, dusty (list administrator) at > > > > > > > >CHAHTA-L-admin@cultures.rootsweb.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >____________________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > >Get free email and a permanent address at > > > > > http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > >Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at > > > > > > > >http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >_________________________________________________________________ > > > > > > >Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: > > > > > > >Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the > > > >quotes > > > > > > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >____________________________________________________________________ > > > > > > >Get free email and a permanent address at > > > >http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > >Choctaw Home Page: > > > > > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > > > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the > > quotes > > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > >To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > > >Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... >

elkdreamer do the choctaws have exorists like a withchdoctor or the like ----- Original Message ----- From: Elkdreamer Wilkins <elkdremr@hotmail.com> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 8:44 AM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > Halito Jim > The spirit of all is impornant. Every animal, Plant, bug, bird, bacteria > etc: are part of the circle of life and must be respected as such. > The prayer that we say, All my relations means. > A-ho Grandfather > A prayer for the four leggeged, two leggeged, winged and finned, the > tree nation's, the creeping and crawling. > All my relations > A-ho > Walk in beauty > Elkdreamer > > > > > >From: "Jim Morrison, Jr." <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > >Date: Sat, 7 Apr 2001 00:53:33 -0400 > > > >I am not a student of anthroplogy so I looked it up in the dictionary!! > >anthropology = the study of man, esp. of variety, physical and cultural > >characteristics, distribution, customs, social relationships, etc. of > >mankind: often restricted to the study of the institutions, myths, etc. of > >nonliterate peoples. > >Hmmmm > >As for "Flight or Fight", I never thought of it as a "human" trait, but as > >an animal one. > >You pray to the "sprit" of a cow, pig, chicken, egg, etc. for them being so > >nice as to allow themselves to be killed so that you can eat them? WOW!!! > >Jim > > > >jmorsn@coastalnet.com > >http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > >Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 12:34 PM > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > Halito Jim > > > Grandfather is a term that we use in respect for the Creator of life. > > > And as a student of anthroplogy I also know about the flight or fight > > > reasoning that humans have. This instinct is what has enabled our > >species > > > to survive. The offering that I refer to is the respect that we give to > >the > > > animals spirit and acknowledging that we all are part of the circle of > >life. > > > Walk in Beauty > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > >From: "Jim Morrison, Jr." <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > >Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2001 08:42:23 -0400 > > > > > > > >Elk > > > >Is your "Grand Father" the same as mine? Who is your supreme being? > > > > > > > >An "offering" would be like a "gift". The only animal that has the > > > >intelligence to make that decission is "MAN". We have a natural > >instinct > > > >called "Flight or Fight". All "animals" will rather fight than die!! > > > >Jim > > > > > > > >jmorsn@coastalnet.com > > > >http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > >From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > >Sent: Monday, April 02, 2001 6:19 AM > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Jim > > > > > #1 question > > > > > Another word for the supreme being > > > > > #2 the offering of its life > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: "Jim Morrison, Jr." <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > >Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 01:23:34 -0400 > > > > > > > > > > > >Two quick questions: > > > > > >1) Who is "Grand Father"? > > > > > >2) The ANIMAL is giving an offering when IT is killed? > > > > > >Jim > > > > > > > > > > > >jmorsn@coastalnet.com > > > > > >http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > > > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > > > >From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > >Sent: Saturday, March 31, 2001 10:36 PM > > > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Dennis > > > > > > > I am sorry if I offended you in anyway. My intrest is in all > > > >things > > > > > > > Choctaw. and Spirituality is one of the aspects of it. To > >understand > > > > > >Indian > > > > > > > people you have to dig deep into their thought pattern. When > >they > > > >killed > > > > > > > animals for food and clothing they said a prayer To Grandfather > >for > > > >the > > > > > > > offering that the animal gave and gave respect to the animal > >also. > > > >When > > > > > >they > > > > > > > did beadwork they put part of their spirit in it also. when a > >object > > > >was > > > > > > > discarded it was done with respect. Spirtuality was considered > >in > > > >all > > > > > >things > > > > > > > done. That is one of the reasons that the Europeans that came > >here > > > > > > > misunderstood our people and their ways. > > > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: Dennis Boswell <dennisb@primenet.com> > > > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > >Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 09:56:57 -0800 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Message for Elkdreamer and Dusty: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Regarding who subscribes to CHAHTA-L and why, permit me to > >suggest > > > >that > > > > > > > >this list very likely has Choctaw and non-Choctaw subscribers. > > > >Among > > > > > >both > > > > > > > >groups, there are those who have an exclusive interest in > >religion > > > >all > > > > > >the > > > > > > > >way to those who have an exclusive interest in some other > >aspect > >of > > > > > >Choctaw > > > > > > > >life but no interest at all in religion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >In my case, I find Choctaw religious beliefs and the recent > > > >discussion > > > > > > > >surrounding them educational and thought provoking. However, my > > > > > >personal > > > > > > > >interest does not directly concern Choctaw religion. It is very > > > >narrow > > > > > >and > > > > > > > >concerns central Mississippi, pre-removal Choctaw social and > >family > > > > > > > >customs, very narrowly defined examples of the Choctaw language > >as > > > > > >about > > > > > > > >1800, relationships with early white settlers, trails and paths > > > > > >followed > > > > > >by > > > > > > > >these Choctaw in relationship to today's central Mississippi > >county > > > > > > > >boundaries and the impact of removal on these same Choctaw with > > > > > >specific > > > > > > > >emphasis on the Durant Choctaw clan. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >If I unsubscribe, which I will do one day (to return at a later > > > >date), > > > > > >it > > > > > > > >will have nothing to do with whether I do or do not "learn > >other > > > > > >religious > > > > > > > >views," "heat in the kitchen" or "sensitive subjects." It will > >have > > > > > > > >everything to do with the fact that I subscribe to about > > > >thirty-five > > > > > >lists, > > > > > > > >receive mountains of email and have priorities on my time and > >my > > > > > >interests > > > > > > > >that are quite different than anyone else on this list - a > >comment > > > >that > > > > > > > >about everyone of you can make. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Recognize that one of the wonderful aspects of CHAHTA-L (in > > > >comparison > > > > > >with > > > > > > > >virtually all na hollo lists) is the diversity of thought, > > > >background, > > > > > > > >education and perspective it offers. Were I to make one > >suggestion > > > >to > > > > > >those > > > > > > > >of you who clearly dominate this list, please guard against > > > >becoming > > > > > >too > > > > > > > >clannish lest the very diversity that enriches this site might > >in > > > >time > > > > > > > >vanish leaving something less in its wake than you enjoy today. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >At 08:50 AM 03/31/2001 -0800, you wrote: > > > > > > > >>Halito Dusty and All list members > > > > > > > >> I believe that we all have the right to believe in the way > >that > > > >we > > > > > >want > > > > > > > >>to. And in this aspect the right to discuss our and each > >others > > > >views > > > > > >in > > > > > > > >>a intellegent and Adult way. Aparentlly the ones that left > >will > >in > > > >no > > > > > >way > > > > > > > >>ever learn that there are other views than their own. Like I > >have > > > > > >always > > > > > > > >>been told if you can't stand the heat get out of the kitchen. > >I > > > >guess > > > > > > > >>that is what they did. Lets keep up the heat I'm having fun. > > > > > > > >> Walk in Beauty > > > > > > > >> Elkdreamer > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >>>From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > > > > > > > >>>Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > >>>To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > >>>Subject: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > >>>Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 09:38:58 -0600 > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>>We lost another 5 listmembers this morning. Don't know for > >what > > > > > >reason. > > > > > > > >>>While I suspect sensitive subject matter may be the reason, > >this > > > >is > > > > > >only > > > > > > > >>>a > > > > > > > >>>supposition on my part. I have absolutely no objection to > >the > > > >topic > > > > > > > >>>continuing if that's what you guys want. Among other > > > >peculiarities > > > > > >and > > > > > > > >>>character faults, I happen to wholeheartedly support the > >First > > > > > >Amendment > > > > > > > >>>on > > > > > > > >>>this particular topic. What do you guys think?? > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>>dusty > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > >Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > > > > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >_________________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at > >http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > Got a GRIPE?? Got a PROBLEM?? Just wanna' WHINE? Don't post it > >to > > > >the > > > > > >list...write me, dusty (list administrator) at > > > > > >CHAHTA-L-admin@cultures.rootsweb.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > >Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > Choctaw Home Page: > > > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > >Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > Need more CHOCTAW information. Visit Rusty Lang's pages at > >http://www.choctaw-web.com for articles, censuses, etc. > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > >Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... >

Even every speck of dust ----- Original Message ----- From: Elkdreamer Wilkins <elkdremr@hotmail.com> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 8:44 AM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > Halito Jim > The spirit of all is impornant. Every animal, Plant, bug, bird, bacteria > etc: are part of the circle of life and must be respected as such. > The prayer that we say, All my relations means. > A-ho Grandfather > A prayer for the four leggeged, two leggeged, winged and finned, the > tree nation's, the creeping and crawling. > All my relations > A-ho > Walk in beauty > Elkdreamer > > > > > >From: "Jim Morrison, Jr." <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > >Date: Sat, 7 Apr 2001 00:53:33 -0400 > > > >I am not a student of anthroplogy so I looked it up in the dictionary!! > >anthropology = the study of man, esp. of variety, physical and cultural > >characteristics, distribution, customs, social relationships, etc. of > >mankind: often restricted to the study of the institutions, myths, etc. of > >nonliterate peoples. > >Hmmmm > >As for "Flight or Fight", I never thought of it as a "human" trait, but as > >an animal one. > >You pray to the "sprit" of a cow, pig, chicken, egg, etc. for them being so > >nice as to allow themselves to be killed so that you can eat them? WOW!!! > >Jim > > > >jmorsn@coastalnet.com > >http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > >Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 12:34 PM > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > Halito Jim > > > Grandfather is a term that we use in respect for the Creator of life. > > > And as a student of anthroplogy I also know about the flight or fight > > > reasoning that humans have. This instinct is what has enabled our > >species > > > to survive. The offering that I refer to is the respect that we give to > >the > > > animals spirit and acknowledging that we all are part of the circle of > >life. > > > Walk in Beauty > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > >From: "Jim Morrison, Jr." <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > >Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2001 08:42:23 -0400 > > > > > > > >Elk > > > >Is your "Grand Father" the same as mine? Who is your supreme being? > > > > > > > >An "offering" would be like a "gift". The only animal that has the > > > >intelligence to make that decission is "MAN". We have a natural > >instinct > > > >called "Flight or Fight". All "animals" will rather fight than die!! > > > >Jim > > > > > > > >jmorsn@coastalnet.com > > > >http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > >From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > >Sent: Monday, April 02, 2001 6:19 AM > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Jim > > > > > #1 question > > > > > Another word for the supreme being > > > > > #2 the offering of its life > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: "Jim Morrison, Jr." <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > >Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 01:23:34 -0400 > > > > > > > > > > > >Two quick questions: > > > > > >1) Who is "Grand Father"? > > > > > >2) The ANIMAL is giving an offering when IT is killed? > > > > > >Jim > > > > > > > > > > > >jmorsn@coastalnet.com > > > > > >http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > > > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > > > >From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > >Sent: Saturday, March 31, 2001 10:36 PM > > > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Dennis > > > > > > > I am sorry if I offended you in anyway. My intrest is in all > > > >things > > > > > > > Choctaw. and Spirituality is one of the aspects of it. To > >understand > > > > > >Indian > > > > > > > people you have to dig deep into their thought pattern. When > >they > > > >killed > > > > > > > animals for food and clothing they said a prayer To Grandfather > >for > > > >the > > > > > > > offering that the animal gave and gave respect to the animal > >also. > > > >When > > > > > >they > > > > > > > did beadwork they put part of their spirit in it also. when a > >object > > > >was > > > > > > > discarded it was done with respect. Spirtuality was considered > >in > > > >all > > > > > >things > > > > > > > done. That is one of the reasons that the Europeans that came > >here > > > > > > > misunderstood our people and their ways. > > > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: Dennis Boswell <dennisb@primenet.com> > > > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > >Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 09:56:57 -0800 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Message for Elkdreamer and Dusty: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Regarding who subscribes to CHAHTA-L and why, permit me to > >suggest > > > >that > > > > > > > >this list very likely has Choctaw and non-Choctaw subscribers. > > > >Among > > > > > >both > > > > > > > >groups, there are those who have an exclusive interest in > >religion > > > >all > > > > > >the > > > > > > > >way to those who have an exclusive interest in some other > >aspect > >of > > > > > >Choctaw > > > > > > > >life but no interest at all in religion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >In my case, I find Choctaw religious beliefs and the recent > > > >discussion > > > > > > > >surrounding them educational and thought provoking. However, my > > > > > >personal > > > > > > > >interest does not directly concern Choctaw religion. It is very > > > >narrow > > > > > >and > > > > > > > >concerns central Mississippi, pre-removal Choctaw social and > >family > > > > > > > >customs, very narrowly defined examples of the Choctaw language > >as > > > > > >about > > > > > > > >1800, relationships with early white settlers, trails and paths > > > > > >followed > > > > > >by > > > > > > > >these Choctaw in relationship to today's central Mississippi > >county > > > > > > > >boundaries and the impact of removal on these same Choctaw with > > > > > >specific > > > > > > > >emphasis on the Durant Choctaw clan. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >If I unsubscribe, which I will do one day (to return at a later > > > >date), > > > > > >it > > > > > > > >will have nothing to do with whether I do or do not "learn > >other > > > > > >religious > > > > > > > >views," "heat in the kitchen" or "sensitive subjects." It will > >have > > > > > > > >everything to do with the fact that I subscribe to about > > > >thirty-five > > > > > >lists, > > > > > > > >receive mountains of email and have priorities on my time and > >my > > > > > >interests > > > > > > > >that are quite different than anyone else on this list - a > >comment > > > >that > > > > > > > >about everyone of you can make. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Recognize that one of the wonderful aspects of CHAHTA-L (in > > > >comparison > > > > > >with > > > > > > > >virtually all na hollo lists) is the diversity of thought, > > > >background, > > > > > > > >education and perspective it offers. Were I to make one > >suggestion > > > >to > > > > > >those > > > > > > > >of you who clearly dominate this list, please guard against > > > >becoming > > > > > >too > > > > > > > >clannish lest the very diversity that enriches this site might > >in > > > >time > > > > > > > >vanish leaving something less in its wake than you enjoy today. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >At 08:50 AM 03/31/2001 -0800, you wrote: > > > > > > > >>Halito Dusty and All list members > > > > > > > >> I believe that we all have the right to believe in the way > >that > > > >we > > > > > >want > > > > > > > >>to. And in this aspect the right to discuss our and each > >others > > > >views > > > > > >in > > > > > > > >>a intellegent and Adult way. Aparentlly the ones that left > >will > >in > > > >no > > > > > >way > > > > > > > >>ever learn that there are other views than their own. Like I > >have > > > > > >always > > > > > > > >>been told if you can't stand the heat get out of the kitchen. > >I > > > >guess > > > > > > > >>that is what they did. Lets keep up the heat I'm having fun. > > > > > > > >> Walk in Beauty > > > > > > > >> Elkdreamer > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >>>From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > > > > > > > >>>Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > >>>To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > >>>Subject: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > >>>Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 09:38:58 -0600 > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>>We lost another 5 listmembers this morning. Don't know for > >what > > > > > >reason. > > > > > > > >>>While I suspect sensitive subject matter may be the reason, > >this > > > >is > > > > > >only > > > > > > > >>>a > > > > > > > >>>supposition on my part. I have absolutely no objection to > >the > > > >topic > > > > > > > >>>continuing if that's what you guys want. Among other > > > >peculiarities > > > > > >and > > > > > > > >>>character faults, I happen to wholeheartedly support the > >First > > > > > >Amendment > > > > > > > >>>on > > > > > > > >>>this particular topic. What do you guys think?? > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>>dusty > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > >Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > > > > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >_________________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at > >http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > Got a GRIPE?? Got a PROBLEM?? Just wanna' WHINE? Don't post it > >to > > > >the > > > > > >list...write me, dusty (list administrator) at > > > > > >CHAHTA-L-admin@cultures.rootsweb.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > >Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > Choctaw Home Page: > > > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > >Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > Need more CHOCTAW information. Visit Rusty Lang's pages at > >http://www.choctaw-web.com for articles, censuses, etc. > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > >Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... >

Hi Dusty, I am wondering what IMHO is. I know its like LOL and other puter slang but I keep seeing this one and don't know what you mean????? Thanks Dusty, Linda Kirby Branum ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 8:13 AM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > IMHO if you feel you have the blood, then you probably do. It's those old > spirits calling to you. > > dusty > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Jim Morrison, Jr. <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 12:40 AM > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > Elk > > What about those (ME!!) who feel that they are, ancestors were in the > proper > > geographical area at the right time frame, but just can not find the proof > > (or whatever you want to call it!!)? > > Jim > > > > jmorsn@coastalnet.com > > http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 9:38 PM > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > Halito Fay > > > Mostly people that want to be N/A and really have no Indian blood at all > > > Walk in Beauty > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > >From: faynshep <faynshep@telapex.com> > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > >Date: Wed, 04 Apr 2001 20:11:49 -0700 > > > > > > > >Excuse me, but, what is a twinkie? > > > >Fay > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > >From: Kim Collins <2buckets@arbuckleonline.com> > > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > >Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 6:07 PM > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Elkdreamer, > > > > > Well said! And so true. > > > > > Kim IBSSG > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 7:14 AM > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Gemma > > > > > > I was refering to people that have no Native American blood in > > them > > > >at > > > > > > all. But I do feel for them because they are far removed from > their > > > > > > ancestors here in America. Our Old ones still walk with us here. > > > > > > Walk in beauty > > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: Gemma West <gemmawest@usa.net> > > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > >Subject: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > >Date: 3 Apr 2001 10:10:11 EDT > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Who are you referring to when you say "they" ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > >"Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > >Halito Gemma > > > > > > > My personal observations give me reason to believe that they > can > > > >see > > > > > > >that > > > > > > >we have a more centered culture with the bones of our Ancestors > > here > > > >with > > > > > > >us > > > > > > >to help guide our thoughts. They are trying to achive the same > > > >connect > > > > > that > > > > > > >we feel to our past. > > > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: Gemma West <gemmawest@usa.net> > > > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > >Subject: [CHAHTA] twinkies > > > > > > > >Date: 2 Apr 2001 11:02:35 EDT > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Sometimes I think the rush to investigate Indian ancestry is > > rather > > > > > > >amusing > > > > > > > >also. After all, it has been estimated that only 7% of all > > > >Americans > > > > > have > > > > > > > >Indian blood. On the other hand it has been estimated that 20% > of > > > > > > > >European-Americans have African blood. For some reason, > however, > > > >there > > > > > > >has > > > > > > > >been no parallel rush to claim African blood. I have to wonder > > why. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >"Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> wrote: > > > > > > > >This is a good topic if anyone wants to tackle it within > > > > > > >guidelines....the > > > > > > > >words "twinkie" and "wannabe" and their usage by both NA's and > > > >whites. > > > > > > > >Also, the prejudices that make these words acceptable. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >dusty > > > > > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > > >From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> > > > > > > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > > > >Sent: Sunday, April 01, 2001 9:20 PM > > > > > > > >Subject: [CHAHTA] Something so funny.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Was listening to AIROS (www.airos.org/) > > > > > > > > > this morning and there was a comic on talking about a > twinkie > > > > > > >university > > > > > > > >called I Wannebe U....the whole routine was hilarious....this > is > > a > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > >Got a GRIPE?? Got a PROBLEM?? Just wanna' WHINE? Don't post > it > > to > > > >the > > > > > > > >list...write me, dusty (list administrator) at > > > > > > > >CHAHTA-L-admin@cultures.rootsweb.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >____________________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > >Get free email and a permanent address at > > > > > http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > >Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at > > > > > > > >http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >_________________________________________________________________ > > > > > > >Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: > > > > > > >Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the > > > >quotes > > > > > > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >____________________________________________________________________ > > > > > > >Get free email and a permanent address at > > > >http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > >Choctaw Home Page: > > > > > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > > > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the > > quotes > > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > >To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > > >Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... >

Hi Dennis, I do think this is a really interesting forum. I also have learned a lot from this one two. Regards, Linda ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dennis Boswell" <dennisb@primenet.com> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 10:42 PM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Were all Brothers and Sisters > I like that idea, Linda. It emphasizes the one thing you all have in common > - full blooded ancestors while deemphasizing the path each of you took in > your travels that brought you to this day. > > Note my use of "you." As several of you know, I am not NA, but am enjoying > this conversation immensely while learning much. > > nd At 10:11 PM 04/05/2001 -0500, you wrote: > >Hi Dusty and all, > > I want to say that my brother looks full blood Indian but we are just > >1/32. I don't look a bit like and Indian but I have the same amt of blood as > >he does. > > I feel the amt of Indian doesn't matter. We are all brothers and sisters > >just some of us have proof and others don't. > > I think we should all remember TOGETHER WE STAND DIVIDED WE FALL. All of > >us need to unite together and stop worring about how much blood we have but > >our people were all at one time full blood so who cares if you are full or > >just a little. You are still my sister and brother and all are NA. > >Regards, Linda Kirby Branum > > > > (Guynes and Sain are my Indian heritage surnames) Guynes being Choctaw and > >documented and Sain Cherokee undocumented. But I feel ancestors calling from > >both!! > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > >Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 8:29 PM > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] twinkies > > > > > > > > Gemma and all: > > > > > > I am intrigued and challenged by your question, "Does the community still > > > exist." I have pondered this question for many years and under many > > > different circumstances., and would like to get some feedback from other > > > listmembers. > > > > > > What is the state of the Indian community today..... > > > Specifically, WHAT IS AN INDIAN? Is it a matter of blood quantum? > > > Lifestyle? Beliefs? > > > > > > There can be no argument that there is definite predjudice among NA as to > > > "who is Indian" and who is not. There are "skins" and there are "bloods". > > > Why the separation? What does it take to be considered "Indian enough". > > > Are some NAs practicing a racism they would decry in other races.? Don't > > > quote me the government's definition of Indian, I'm well aware of that. > > > > > > I want the opinions of others on this list. > > > > > > dusty > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: David and Tommie Marsters <haili65@proaxis.com> > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 7:30 PM > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] twinkies > > > > > > > > > > Well put, Gemma. I agree. > > > > Tommie > > > > > > > > Gemma West wrote: > > > > > > > > > What has happened for many people is that they wander through life > > > trying to > > > > > figure out what is wrong...trying to figure out why they don't fit in. > > > > > Attempts are made to mold themselves into someone else's defintions of > > > good > > > > > and bad. These attempts fail. Finally that person decides to look to > > > their > > > > > ancestors. They find themselves. They finally feel comfortable. It > >is > > > > > obvious to all that ancestors shape our biological characteristics. > >It > > > is > > > > > obvious to me that ancestors shape our spirituality. The sad thing is > > > that > > > > > sometimes the assimilation is so thick that you can grow up around > > > Indians and > > > > > still not know your own spirituality. The beautiful thing is finding > > > the few > > > > > who have refused assimilation and are willing to share knowledge. > > > > > > > > > > When non-Indian people ask to be allowed into the community it causes > >us > > > to > > > > > question ourselves. Does community still exist? What are they here > >to > > > get? > > > > > Are we really different from them? I think the great thing about this > > > reverse > > > > > acculturation is that it is spurring some of us to re-embrace our own > > > > > ancestors. It is removing the shame that our elders had to live with. > > > This > > > > > shame had no place and that is becoming clear to new generations. If > >we > > > can > > > > > influence people to live a balanced life then that is a great thing. > > > After > > > > > all, our children and their children will have to live in a world > >shaped > > > by > > > > > the parents. We can not afford to be selfish with principles of > > > balance. It > > > > > seems that they need these principles much more than we do. > > > > > > > > > > Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> wrote: > > > > > "Our spirituality" is not "just an idea" and it is not something we > >went > > > to > > > > > class and learned somewhere, or got off the internet...it is born in > >us > > > > > (which is obvious to those Indians who were raised surrounded by a > >white > > > > > society) and a non-Indian may be able to learn from us some things, > >but > > > they > > > > > cannot "acquire" what they are not born with, and their attempts to > >put > > > > > themselves on an "equal footing", with Indians, so to speak, is at > >best > > > > > futile...and at worst, an attempt at cultural theft... > > > > > B. > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:59 PM > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > I shall play devil's advocate again and expose my rear to everyone's > > > > > slings > > > > > > and arrows... > > > > > > > > > > > > What about those people who do not "want to be NA", but just think > > > our > > > > > > spirituality, philosophy and way of life is a good idea. I've had > > > > > countless > > > > > > elders tell me, "I don't care what kind of blood you have, as long > >as > > > it's > > > > > > human". Just because an Anglo wants to practice our ways because it > > > works > > > > > > for them, doesn't mean they deserve to be belittled by a derogatory > > > name. > > > > > > Are there really that many among us that are so arrogant to do so. > > > > > > > > > > > > Where did we ever get the idea that that we were so exclusive? > >Isn't > > > that > > > > > > TRUE racism? > > > > > > > > > > > > dusty > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > From: John & Arla Williams <jaws@crosstel.net> > > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:45 PM > > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Elkdreamer, Where did the term come from? Arla > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:38 PM > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Fay > > > > > > > > Mostly people that want to be N/A and really have no Indian > >blood > > > at > > > > > all > > > > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: > > > > > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the > > > quotes > > > > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > Choctaw Home Page: > > > > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at > > > > > http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________ > > > > > Get free email and a permanent address at > >http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > >Got a GRIPE?? Got a PROBLEM?? Just wanna' WHINE? Don't post it to the > >list...write me, dusty (list administrator) at > >CHAHTA-L-admin@cultures.rootsweb.com > > > Regards, > > Dennis K. Boswell > 301 Crow Canyon Drive > Folsom, CA 95630 > > Tel: (916) 987-3599 > Fax: (916) 987-3555 > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > Choctaw Home Page: > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ >

I guess it also says "Thou shalt not commit adultry unless thou are horny". Right? Jim jmorsn@coastalnet.com http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Patsy Caleb" <studentarchaeologist@home.com> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 1:10 PM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > The original "Thou Shalt not kill" reads "Thou shalt not kill without a > reason" from the Lost Books of the Bible and forgotten Books of Eden" > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Jim Morrison, Jr. <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 10:16 PM > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > What "animal" gives its life freely to death? > > The ONLY one that could is MAN (human). And even MAN does not do so > > hesitation. Could you honestly take a child of YOUR'S and kill the child > as > > an offering? For whatever the "rewards" that were promised. Could you? > > When did Job sacarafice is son? Before or after the 10 Commandments were > > writen? Why? Isn't one of the Commandments "Thous Shall Not Kill"? > > Jim > > > > jmorsn@coastalnet.com > > http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2001 7:12 AM > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > good question > > > I think that the statement, offering of his life could be considered > to > > > be like Job in the Bible he really didn't do it willing but when he did > > God > > > blessed him. Kind of like the warrior does giving thanks to the animal's > > > spirit so he could feed his family. > > > Walk in Beauty > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > >From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > >Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 09:27:28 -0500 > > > > > > > >I have one question here just for clarification. It doesn't mean I'm > > > >challenging your statement, it just means I have a question, OK? If > the > > > >animal is giving an offering of it's life, why does it run away? > > > > > > > >dusty > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > >From: Elkdreamer Wilkins <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > >Sent: Monday, April 02, 2001 5:19 AM > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Jim > > > > > #1 question > > > > > Another word for the supreme being > > > > > #2 the offering of its life > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: "Jim Morrison, Jr." <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > >Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 01:23:34 -0400 > > > > > > > > > > > >Two quick questions: > > > > > >1) Who is "Grand Father"? > > > > > >2) The ANIMAL is giving an offering when IT is killed? > > > > > >Jim > > > > > > > > > > > >jmorsn@coastalnet.com > > > > > >http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > > > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > > > >From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > >Sent: Saturday, March 31, 2001 10:36 PM > > > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Dennis > > > > > > > I am sorry if I offended you in anyway. My intrest is in all > > > >things > > > > > > > Choctaw. and Spirituality is one of the aspects of it. To > > understand > > > > > >Indian > > > > > > > people you have to dig deep into their thought pattern. When > they > > > >killed > > > > > > > animals for food and clothing they said a prayer To Grandfather > > for > > > >the > > > > > > > offering that the animal gave and gave respect to the animal > also. > > > >When > > > > > >they > > > > > > > did beadwork they put part of their spirit in it also. when a > > object > > > >was > > > > > > > discarded it was done with respect. Spirtuality was considered > in > > > >all > > > > > >things > > > > > > > done. That is one of the reasons that the Europeans that came > here > > > > > > > misunderstood our people and their ways. > > > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: Dennis Boswell <dennisb@primenet.com> > > > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > >Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 09:56:57 -0800 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Message for Elkdreamer and Dusty: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Regarding who subscribes to CHAHTA-L and why, permit me to > > suggest > > > >that > > > > > > > >this list very likely has Choctaw and non-Choctaw subscribers. > > > >Among > > > > > >both > > > > > > > >groups, there are those who have an exclusive interest in > > religion > > > >all > > > > > >the > > > > > > > >way to those who have an exclusive interest in some other > aspect > > of > > > > > >Choctaw > > > > > > > >life but no interest at all in religion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >In my case, I find Choctaw religious beliefs and the recent > > > >discussion > > > > > > > >surrounding them educational and thought provoking. However, my > > > > > >personal > > > > > > > >interest does not directly concern Choctaw religion. It is very > > > >narrow > > > > > >and > > > > > > > >concerns central Mississippi, pre-removal Choctaw social and > > family > > > > > > > >customs, very narrowly defined examples of the Choctaw language > > as > > > > > >about > > > > > > > >1800, relationships with early white settlers, trails and paths > > > > > >followed > > > > > >by > > > > > > > >these Choctaw in relationship to today's central Mississippi > > county > > > > > > > >boundaries and the impact of removal on these same Choctaw with > > > > > >specific > > > > > > > >emphasis on the Durant Choctaw clan. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >If I unsubscribe, which I will do one day (to return at a later > > > >date), > > > > > >it > > > > > > > >will have nothing to do with whether I do or do not "learn > other > > > > > >religious > > > > > > > >views," "heat in the kitchen" or "sensitive subjects." It will > > have > > > > > > > >everything to do with the fact that I subscribe to about > > > >thirty-five > > > > > >lists, > > > > > > > >receive mountains of email and have priorities on my time and > my > > > > > >interests > > > > > > > >that are quite different than anyone else on this list - a > > comment > > > >that > > > > > > > >about everyone of you can make. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Recognize that one of the wonderful aspects of CHAHTA-L (in > > > >comparison > > > > > >with > > > > > > > >virtually all na hollo lists) is the diversity of thought, > > > >background, > > > > > > > >education and perspective it offers. Were I to make one > > suggestion > > > >to > > > > > >those > > > > > > > >of you who clearly dominate this list, please guard against > > > >becoming > > > > > >too > > > > > > > >clannish lest the very diversity that enriches this site might > in > > > >time > > > > > > > >vanish leaving something less in its wake than you enjoy today. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >At 08:50 AM 03/31/2001 -0800, you wrote: > > > > > > > >>Halito Dusty and All list members > > > > > > > >> I believe that we all have the right to believe in the way > > that > > > >we > > > > > >want > > > > > > > >>to. And in this aspect the right to discuss our and each > others > > > >views > > > > > >in > > > > > > > >>a intellegent and Adult way. Aparentlly the ones that left > will > > in > > > >no > > > > > >way > > > > > > > >>ever learn that there are other views than their own. Like I > > have > > > > > >always > > > > > > > >>been told if you can't stand the heat get out of the kitchen. > I > > > >guess > > > > > > > >>that is what they did. Lets keep up the heat I'm having fun. > > > > > > > >> Walk in Beauty > > > > > > > >> Elkdreamer > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >>>From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > > > > > > > >>>Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > >>>To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > >>>Subject: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > >>>Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 09:38:58 -0600 > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>>We lost another 5 listmembers this morning. Don't know for > > what > > > > > >reason. > > > > > > > >>>While I suspect sensitive subject matter may be the reason, > > this > > > >is > > > > > >only > > > > > > > >>>a > > > > > > > >>>supposition on my part. I have absolutely no objection to > the > > > >topic > > > > > > > >>>continuing if that's what you guys want. Among other > > > >peculiarities > > > > > >and > > > > > > > >>>character faults, I happen to wholeheartedly support the > First > > > > > >Amendment > > > > > > > >>>on > > > > > > > >>>this particular topic. What do you guys think?? > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>>dusty > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > >Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > > > > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at > http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > Got a GRIPE?? Got a PROBLEM?? Just wanna' WHINE? Don't post it > > to > > > >the > > > > > >list...write me, dusty (list administrator) at > > > > > >CHAHTA-L-admin@cultures.rootsweb.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > >Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > Choctaw Home Page: > > > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > >Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. > >

Thanks Barabara, I'll have to check it out. Kris ----- Original Message ----- From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 9:10 AM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Kris > Kris, > Like I told Tsana, she either misunderstood my post or didn't know what I > was responding to...You are welcome to use the message board on our site for > any discussions or questions you might have... > http://www.angelfire.com/ok3/greybird7/index.html > > ...don't know what kind of answers you will get, guess it will depend on the > questions and who wants to answer... > Chi pisa > Barbara > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Kris Harapan" <harapank@wwdb.org> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 10:22 AM > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > Tsana, > > > > I second this. Having recently begun a spiritual quest of my own, I have > > been looking for a forum (online and off) that would support me in asking > > questions, without trying to force me onto a given path. I have just left > > that route behind, and would very much like to find the path that is right > > for me. What seems to be the hardest right now is finding a reputable > > source for guidance into exploring new areas, and having a place where it > is > > okay to have questions. Am open to any suggestions others might have. > > > > I know the recent discussions have been a bit hard on some, but I have > found > > it to be quite helpful. I know concern has been expressed about using > this > > forum for spiritual discussions, what would be the possibility of having a > > list for discussion of traditional Choctaw beliefs, the impact of outside > > religions on those beliefs, and how this impacts their descendents today? > > Would their be enough interest to support something like that? > > > > Kris > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Tsa na Jordan <medicgirl78@yahoo.com> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 9:52 PM > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > Barbara, > > > I, like, Patsy, beg to differ. The only difference, it seems, > between > > > you and I is that you had a chance to grow up with and learn the Choctaw > > > culture from your family, elders, etc. I, on the other hand, did not > have > > > that luxury. Now, it's no fault of mine, nor of my family. They did > what > > > they thought best for the family at the time. OK, so does that mean > that > > I > > > am not as interested? NO. Does that mean that I can't learn a lot > about > > it > > > from the internet, books, elders, other tribal members, etc.? NO. Does > > it > > > mean that I can become as knowledgable as you who grew up with it? YES. > > I > > > will probably never know all that you do, nor will that bother me. I > want > > > to learn my family's history and culture. Does it mean that I may adopt > > > some of the beliefs I learn about? PROBABLY since I've already adopted > > some > > > of the Cherokee beliefs. Does it mean that you are a better "Indian" > than > > > I? NOPE. Does it mean that you are a better person, in general, than > I? > > > NOPE. > > > I would appreciate your sharing some of the ways of the Choctaw > since > > > you are so educated in those ways. Now, I'm fully aware that there are > > some > > > things that simply aren't meant to be on the internet, and I respect > that. > > > So, sister, I lay down my bundle of tobacco beside you and ask in a good > > > way - will you help me learn? I ask this with all respect. But, with > the > > > same respect I'm also saying that I don't want to debate or argue. If > > > you're willing to sharing information, I'm your sponge, here to soak it > > all > > > up! > > > Thanks, Barbara! > > > Tsana > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: Patsy Caleb <studentarchaeologist@home.com> > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 1:12 PM > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > can i disagree to that because the more i learn about my choctaw > > heritage > > > > the more spiritual i become > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 10:49 AM > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > "Our spirituality" is not "just an idea" and it is not something we > > went > > > > to > > > > > class and learned somewhere, or got off the internet...it is born in > > us > > > > > (which is obvious to those Indians who were raised surrounded by a > > white > > > > > society) and a non-Indian may be able to learn from us some things, > > but > > > > they > > > > > cannot "acquire" what they are not born with, and their attempts to > > put > > > > > themselves on an "equal footing", with Indians, so to speak, is at > > best > > > > > futile...and at worst, an attempt at cultural theft... > > > > > B. > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:59 PM > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I shall play devil's advocate again and expose my rear to > everyone's > > > > > slings > > > > > > and arrows... > > > > > > > > > > > > What about those people who do not "want to be NA", but just think > > > our > > > > > > spirituality, philosophy and way of life is a good idea. I've had > > > > > countless > > > > > > elders tell me, "I don't care what kind of blood you have, as long > > as > > > > it's > > > > > > human". Just because an Anglo wants to practice our ways because > it > > > > works > > > > > > for them, doesn't mean they deserve to be belittled by a > derogatory > > > > name. > > > > > > Are there really that many among us that are so arrogant to do so. > > > > > > > > > > > > Where did we ever get the idea that that we were so exclusive? > > Isn't > > > > that > > > > > > TRUE racism? > > > > > > > > > > > > dusty > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > Choctaw Home Page: > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > >

Halito Jim The spirit of all is impornant. Every animal, Plant, bug, bird, bacteria etc: are part of the circle of life and must be respected as such. The prayer that we say, All my relations means. A-ho Grandfather A prayer for the four leggeged, two leggeged, winged and finned, the tree nation's, the creeping and crawling. All my relations A-ho Walk in beauty Elkdreamer >From: "Jim Morrison, Jr." <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION >Date: Sat, 7 Apr 2001 00:53:33 -0400 > >I am not a student of anthroplogy so I looked it up in the dictionary!! >anthropology = the study of man, esp. of variety, physical and cultural >characteristics, distribution, customs, social relationships, etc. of >mankind: often restricted to the study of the institutions, myths, etc. of >nonliterate peoples. >Hmmmm >As for "Flight or Fight", I never thought of it as a "human" trait, but as >an animal one. >You pray to the "sprit" of a cow, pig, chicken, egg, etc. for them being so >nice as to allow themselves to be killed so that you can eat them? WOW!!! >Jim > >jmorsn@coastalnet.com >http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> >Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 12:34 PM >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > Halito Jim > > Grandfather is a term that we use in respect for the Creator of life. > > And as a student of anthroplogy I also know about the flight or fight > > reasoning that humans have. This instinct is what has enabled our >species > > to survive. The offering that I refer to is the respect that we give to >the > > animals spirit and acknowledging that we all are part of the circle of >life. > > Walk in Beauty > > Elkdreamer > > > > >From: "Jim Morrison, Jr." <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > >Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2001 08:42:23 -0400 > > > > > >Elk > > >Is your "Grand Father" the same as mine? Who is your supreme being? > > > > > >An "offering" would be like a "gift". The only animal that has the > > >intelligence to make that decission is "MAN". We have a natural >instinct > > >called "Flight or Fight". All "animals" will rather fight than die!! > > >Jim > > > > > >jmorsn@coastalnet.com > > >http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > > >----- Original Message ----- > > >From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > >Sent: Monday, April 02, 2001 6:19 AM > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > > > > Halito Jim > > > > #1 question > > > > Another word for the supreme being > > > > #2 the offering of its life > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: "Jim Morrison, Jr." <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > >Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 01:23:34 -0400 > > > > > > > > > >Two quick questions: > > > > >1) Who is "Grand Father"? > > > > >2) The ANIMAL is giving an offering when IT is killed? > > > > >Jim > > > > > > > > > >jmorsn@coastalnet.com > > > > >http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > > >From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > >Sent: Saturday, March 31, 2001 10:36 PM > > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Dennis > > > > > > I am sorry if I offended you in anyway. My intrest is in all > > >things > > > > > > Choctaw. and Spirituality is one of the aspects of it. To >understand > > > > >Indian > > > > > > people you have to dig deep into their thought pattern. When >they > > >killed > > > > > > animals for food and clothing they said a prayer To Grandfather >for > > >the > > > > > > offering that the animal gave and gave respect to the animal >also. > > >When > > > > >they > > > > > > did beadwork they put part of their spirit in it also. when a >object > > >was > > > > > > discarded it was done with respect. Spirtuality was considered >in > > >all > > > > >things > > > > > > done. That is one of the reasons that the Europeans that came >here > > > > > > misunderstood our people and their ways. > > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: Dennis Boswell <dennisb@primenet.com> > > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > >Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 09:56:57 -0800 > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Message for Elkdreamer and Dusty: > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Regarding who subscribes to CHAHTA-L and why, permit me to >suggest > > >that > > > > > > >this list very likely has Choctaw and non-Choctaw subscribers. > > >Among > > > > >both > > > > > > >groups, there are those who have an exclusive interest in >religion > > >all > > > > >the > > > > > > >way to those who have an exclusive interest in some other >aspect >of > > > > >Choctaw > > > > > > >life but no interest at all in religion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > >In my case, I find Choctaw religious beliefs and the recent > > >discussion > > > > > > >surrounding them educational and thought provoking. However, my > > > > >personal > > > > > > >interest does not directly concern Choctaw religion. It is very > > >narrow > > > > >and > > > > > > >concerns central Mississippi, pre-removal Choctaw social and >family > > > > > > >customs, very narrowly defined examples of the Choctaw language >as > > > > >about > > > > > > >1800, relationships with early white settlers, trails and paths > > > > >followed > > > > >by > > > > > > >these Choctaw in relationship to today's central Mississippi >county > > > > > > >boundaries and the impact of removal on these same Choctaw with > > > > >specific > > > > > > >emphasis on the Durant Choctaw clan. > > > > > > > > > > > > > >If I unsubscribe, which I will do one day (to return at a later > > >date), > > > > >it > > > > > > >will have nothing to do with whether I do or do not "learn >other > > > > >religious > > > > > > >views," "heat in the kitchen" or "sensitive subjects." It will >have > > > > > > >everything to do with the fact that I subscribe to about > > >thirty-five > > > > >lists, > > > > > > >receive mountains of email and have priorities on my time and >my > > > > >interests > > > > > > >that are quite different than anyone else on this list - a >comment > > >that > > > > > > >about everyone of you can make. > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Recognize that one of the wonderful aspects of CHAHTA-L (in > > >comparison > > > > >with > > > > > > >virtually all na hollo lists) is the diversity of thought, > > >background, > > > > > > >education and perspective it offers. Were I to make one >suggestion > > >to > > > > >those > > > > > > >of you who clearly dominate this list, please guard against > > >becoming > > > > >too > > > > > > >clannish lest the very diversity that enriches this site might >in > > >time > > > > > > >vanish leaving something less in its wake than you enjoy today. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >At 08:50 AM 03/31/2001 -0800, you wrote: > > > > > > >>Halito Dusty and All list members > > > > > > >> I believe that we all have the right to believe in the way >that > > >we > > > > >want > > > > > > >>to. And in this aspect the right to discuss our and each >others > > >views > > > > >in > > > > > > >>a intellegent and Adult way. Aparentlly the ones that left >will >in > > >no > > > > >way > > > > > > >>ever learn that there are other views than their own. Like I >have > > > > >always > > > > > > >>been told if you can't stand the heat get out of the kitchen. >I > > >guess > > > > > > >>that is what they did. Lets keep up the heat I'm having fun. > > > > > > >> Walk in Beauty > > > > > > >> Elkdreamer > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >>>From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > > > > > > >>>Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > >>>To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > >>>Subject: [CHAHTA] TOPIC OF RELIGION > > > > > > >>>Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 09:38:58 -0600 > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > >>>We lost another 5 listmembers this morning. Don't know for >what > > > > >reason. > > > > > > >>>While I suspect sensitive subject matter may be the reason, >this > > >is > > > > >only > > > > > > >>>a > > > > > > >>>supposition on my part. I have absolutely no objection to >the > > >topic > > > > > > >>>continuing if that's what you guys want. Among other > > >peculiarities > > > > >and > > > > > > >>>character faults, I happen to wholeheartedly support the >First > > > > >Amendment > > > > > > >>>on > > > > > > >>>this particular topic. What do you guys think?? > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > >>>dusty > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > >Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > > > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >_________________________________________________________________ > > > > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at >http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > Got a GRIPE?? Got a PROBLEM?? Just wanna' WHINE? Don't post it >to > > >the > > > > >list...write me, dusty (list administrator) at > > > > >CHAHTA-L-admin@cultures.rootsweb.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > >Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > Choctaw Home Page: > > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > >Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > Need more CHOCTAW information. Visit Rusty Lang's pages at >http://www.choctaw-web.com for articles, censuses, etc. > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== >Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

Halito Jim Not more, it's that we have a lot more information avaliable than they did. They teach from their point of view, we take their teachings add our own experiences to it and pass it on to the next generation. Walk in Beauty Elkdreamer >From: "Jim Morrison, Jr." <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Fw: Choctaw Christian Culture >Date: Sat, 7 Apr 2001 00:58:44 -0400 > >You think we know more now (over 2,000 years after the FACT) then those who >came before us? I thought "elders" were teachers from their wisdom!! >Jim > >jmorsn@coastalnet.com >http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> >Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 12:45 PM >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Fw: Choctaw Christian Culture > > > > Halito Jim > > In the Christan Bible it mentions Angles etc. that are helpers. And >most > > world religions refer to only one Supreme Being in their teachings with >the > > others as helpers. You have to remember that the people back then didn't > > have the knowledge that we have today. They were trying to explain their > > Spiritualty as they saw it through their eye's at that time in history. > > Walk in Beauty > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > >From: "Jim Morrison, Jr." <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Fw: Choctaw Christian Culture > > >Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2001 01:28:47 -0400 > > > > > >Oh I think there are plenty of people who beleive there is more than >one > > >god. Why? Look at the different "beleifs" and methods of worship.Where >is > > >it > > >written that you are suppose to have Bible study on Weds. night? Or >that > > >Catholics do not HAVE to go to Mass on Sunday, but may go to 5:30 PM >Mass > > >on > > >Saturday instead? Neptun, Vensus, Mars, Thor and the rest were all gods >and > > >godesses that the Greek worshiped. The Devil is a god that many >worship. > > >I beleive that there is only one "Supreme Being" though. And all of >these > > >other gods and godesses will have to answer to HIM in the end. > > >Jim > > > > > >jmorsn@coastalnet.com > > >http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > > >----- Original Message ----- > > >From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > >Sent: Monday, April 02, 2001 10:18 AM > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Fw: Choctaw Christian Culture > > > > > > > > > > Jim: > > > > > > > > Is what you are saying that you think there may be more than one >"God"? > > > > > > > > dusty > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: Jim Morrison, Jr. <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > Sent: Sunday, April 01, 2001 11:21 PM > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Fw: Choctaw Christian Culture > > > > > > > > > > > > > I thought about this along time ago and forgot about it until just > > >now. > > > > This > > > > > may sound strange to some, but if you think about it with an open >mind > > >you > > > > > will see what I mean. > > > > > > > > > > I think that no matter who or what you believe in, if you believe >it > > > > > COMPLETELY without doubt, that is "plane" ypu will reach when you > > >die!! > > >If > > > > > YOU believe in reincarnation then YOU will probably be >reincarnated!! > > >If > > > > you > > > > > believe in Devil worship then YOU will probably end up with the >Devil. > > >If > > > > > you beive in a certain God then you will probably end up with that > > >God. > > >I > > > > > will not say MY God is greater than YOUR God, because MY God gave >you > > >a > > > > > brain to make YOUR own choice!! > > > > > Jim > > > > > > > > > > jmorsn@coastalnet.com > > > > > http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: "Barbara Ellison" <greybird7@pisp.net> > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > Sent: Saturday, March 31, 2001 6:05 PM > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Fw: Choctaw Christian Culture > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ok...well I will ask you now...do you think that if people(some > > >people, > > > > > all > > > > > > people, specific people, any people) don't accept Jesus as >saviour, > > >that > > > > > > they will suffer for all eternity? My answer to my own question >is > > >"no". > > > > > > (Please just say yes or no...it's a simple question) If your >answer > > >is > > > > > > "yes", then we are right where we have been since the beginning >of > > >this > > > > > > discussion,, and maybe then you will let it go...? > > > > > > B. > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > > Sent: Saturday, March 31, 2001 3:45 PM > > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Fw: Choctaw Christian Culture > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I never said "suffer for all eternity". Those aren't my >words. > > >That > > > > > > > apparently is your interpretaton of hell. To the best of my > > >memory > > >of > > > > > the > > > > > > > past conversation, those were not my words. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dusty > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > > From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> > > > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > > > Sent: Saturday, March 31, 2001 2:15 PM > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Fw: Choctaw Christian Culture > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I didn't ask you to stop anything...I said I have all the >time > > >in > > > > the > > > > > > > world > > > > > > > > and can wait til you do have time....If this quote you have >made > > >a > > > > few > > > > > > > times > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > > Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at > > > > > > http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > Got a GRIPE?? Got a PROBLEM?? Just wanna' WHINE? Don't post it >to > > >the > > > > > list...write me, dusty (list administrator) at > > > > > CHAHTA-L-admin@cultures.rootsweb.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > > > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the > > >quotes > > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the >quotes > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > >To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > >Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== >Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

Halito Jim I never said that I am one of the one's that felt that way. I believe that Grandfather knows who is and who isn't and he is the only one that has the right to make that decision. Anyone that comes to me and says that they are Indian, to me they are Indian and I except them as such. the blood quantrum is not important. what is in your heart is. Walk in Beauty Elkdreamer >From: "Jim Morrison, Jr." <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies >Date: Sat, 7 Apr 2001 01:40:51 -0400 > >Elk >What about those (ME!!) who feel that they are, ancestors were in the >proper >geographical area at the right time frame, but just can not find the proof >(or whatever you want to call it!!)? >Jim > >jmorsn@coastalnet.com >http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> >Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 9:38 PM >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > Halito Fay > > Mostly people that want to be N/A and really have no Indian blood at all > > Walk in Beauty > > Elkdreamer > > > > >From: faynshep <faynshep@telapex.com> > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > >Date: Wed, 04 Apr 2001 20:11:49 -0700 > > > > > >Excuse me, but, what is a twinkie? > > >Fay > > >----- Original Message ----- > > >From: Kim Collins <2buckets@arbuckleonline.com> > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > >Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 6:07 PM > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > Halito Elkdreamer, > > > > Well said! And so true. > > > > Kim IBSSG > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 7:14 AM > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Gemma > > > > > I was refering to people that have no Native American blood in >them > > >at > > > > > all. But I do feel for them because they are far removed from >their > > > > > ancestors here in America. Our Old ones still walk with us here. > > > > > Walk in beauty > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > >From: Gemma West <gemmawest@usa.net> > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > >Subject: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > >Date: 3 Apr 2001 10:10:11 EDT > > > > > > > > > > > >Who are you referring to when you say "they" ? > > > > > > > > > > > >"Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> wrote: > > > > > >Halito Gemma > > > > > > My personal observations give me reason to believe that they >can > > >see > > > > > >that > > > > > >we have a more centered culture with the bones of our Ancestors >here > > >with > > > > > >us > > > > > >to help guide our thoughts. They are trying to achive the same > > >connect > > > > that > > > > > >we feel to our past. > > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: Gemma West <gemmawest@usa.net> > > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > >Subject: [CHAHTA] twinkies > > > > > > >Date: 2 Apr 2001 11:02:35 EDT > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Sometimes I think the rush to investigate Indian ancestry is >rather > > > > > >amusing > > > > > > >also. After all, it has been estimated that only 7% of all > > >Americans > > > > have > > > > > > >Indian blood. On the other hand it has been estimated that 20% >of > > > > > > >European-Americans have African blood. For some reason, >however, > > >there > > > > > >has > > > > > > >been no parallel rush to claim African blood. I have to wonder >why. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >"Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> wrote: > > > > > > >This is a good topic if anyone wants to tackle it within > > > > > >guidelines....the > > > > > > >words "twinkie" and "wannabe" and their usage by both NA's and > > >whites. > > > > > > >Also, the prejudices that make these words acceptable. > > > > > > > > > > > > > >dusty > > > > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > >From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> > > > > > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > > >Sent: Sunday, April 01, 2001 9:20 PM > > > > > > >Subject: [CHAHTA] Something so funny.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Was listening to AIROS (www.airos.org/) > > > > > > > > this morning and there was a comic on talking about a >twinkie > > > > > >university > > > > > > >called I Wannebe U....the whole routine was hilarious....this >is >a > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > >Got a GRIPE?? Got a PROBLEM?? Just wanna' WHINE? Don't post >it >to > > >the > > > > > > >list...write me, dusty (list administrator) at > > > > > > >CHAHTA-L-admin@cultures.rootsweb.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >____________________________________________________________________ > > > > > > >Get free email and a permanent address at > > > > http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > >Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at > > > > > > >http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >_________________________________________________________________ > > > > > >Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: > > > > > >Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the > > >quotes > > > > > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >____________________________________________________________________ > > > > > >Get free email and a permanent address at > > >http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > >Choctaw Home Page: > > > > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the >quotes > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > >To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > >Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== >TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: >Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

Tsana, I second this. Having recently begun a spiritual quest of my own, I have been looking for a forum (online and off) that would support me in asking questions, without trying to force me onto a given path. I have just left that route behind, and would very much like to find the path that is right for me. What seems to be the hardest right now is finding a reputable source for guidance into exploring new areas, and having a place where it is okay to have questions. Am open to any suggestions others might have. I know the recent discussions have been a bit hard on some, but I have found it to be quite helpful. I know concern has been expressed about using this forum for spiritual discussions, what would be the possibility of having a list for discussion of traditional Choctaw beliefs, the impact of outside religions on those beliefs, and how this impacts their descendents today? Would their be enough interest to support something like that? Kris ----- Original Message ----- From: Tsa na Jordan <medicgirl78@yahoo.com> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 9:52 PM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > Barbara, > I, like, Patsy, beg to differ. The only difference, it seems, between > you and I is that you had a chance to grow up with and learn the Choctaw > culture from your family, elders, etc. I, on the other hand, did not have > that luxury. Now, it's no fault of mine, nor of my family. They did what > they thought best for the family at the time. OK, so does that mean that I > am not as interested? NO. Does that mean that I can't learn a lot about it > from the internet, books, elders, other tribal members, etc.? NO. Does it > mean that I can become as knowledgable as you who grew up with it? YES. I > will probably never know all that you do, nor will that bother me. I want > to learn my family's history and culture. Does it mean that I may adopt > some of the beliefs I learn about? PROBABLY since I've already adopted some > of the Cherokee beliefs. Does it mean that you are a better "Indian" than > I? NOPE. Does it mean that you are a better person, in general, than I? > NOPE. > I would appreciate your sharing some of the ways of the Choctaw since > you are so educated in those ways. Now, I'm fully aware that there are some > things that simply aren't meant to be on the internet, and I respect that. > So, sister, I lay down my bundle of tobacco beside you and ask in a good > way - will you help me learn? I ask this with all respect. But, with the > same respect I'm also saying that I don't want to debate or argue. If > you're willing to sharing information, I'm your sponge, here to soak it all > up! > Thanks, Barbara! > Tsana > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Patsy Caleb <studentarchaeologist@home.com> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 1:12 PM > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > can i disagree to that because the more i learn about my choctaw heritage > > the more spiritual i become > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 10:49 AM > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > "Our spirituality" is not "just an idea" and it is not something we went > > to > > > class and learned somewhere, or got off the internet...it is born in us > > > (which is obvious to those Indians who were raised surrounded by a white > > > society) and a non-Indian may be able to learn from us some things, but > > they > > > cannot "acquire" what they are not born with, and their attempts to put > > > themselves on an "equal footing", with Indians, so to speak, is at best > > > futile...and at worst, an attempt at cultural theft... > > > B. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:59 PM > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > I shall play devil's advocate again and expose my rear to everyone's > > > slings > > > > and arrows... > > > > > > > > What about those people who do not "want to be NA", but just think > our > > > > spirituality, philosophy and way of life is a good idea. I've had > > > countless > > > > elders tell me, "I don't care what kind of blood you have, as long as > > it's > > > > human". Just because an Anglo wants to practice our ways because it > > works > > > > for them, doesn't mean they deserve to be belittled by a derogatory > > name. > > > > Are there really that many among us that are so arrogant to do so. > > > > > > > > Where did we ever get the idea that that we were so exclusive? Isn't > > that > > > > TRUE racism? > > > > > > > > dusty > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: John & Arla Williams <jaws@crosstel.net> > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:45 PM > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > Elkdreamer, Where did the term come from? Arla > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 8:38 PM > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Fay > > > > > > Mostly people that want to be N/A and really have no Indian blood > at > > > all > > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: > > > > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the > quotes > > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > Choctaw Home Page: > > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at > > http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > _________________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > >

IMHO if you feel you have the blood, then you probably do. It's those old spirits calling to you. dusty ----- Original Message ----- From: Jim Morrison, Jr. <jmorsn@coastalnet.com> To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 12:40 AM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > Elk > What about those (ME!!) who feel that they are, ancestors were in the proper > geographical area at the right time frame, but just can not find the proof > (or whatever you want to call it!!)? > Jim > > jmorsn@coastalnet.com > http://www2.coastalnet.com/~g7d3j4nb/ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 9:38 PM > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > Halito Fay > > Mostly people that want to be N/A and really have no Indian blood at all > > Walk in Beauty > > Elkdreamer > > > > >From: faynshep <faynshep@telapex.com> > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > >Date: Wed, 04 Apr 2001 20:11:49 -0700 > > > > > >Excuse me, but, what is a twinkie? > > >Fay > > >----- Original Message ----- > > >From: Kim Collins <2buckets@arbuckleonline.com> > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > >Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 6:07 PM > > >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > Halito Elkdreamer, > > > > Well said! And so true. > > > > Kim IBSSG > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> > > > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 7:14 AM > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > > > > > > > > > Halito Gemma > > > > > I was refering to people that have no Native American blood in > them > > >at > > > > > all. But I do feel for them because they are far removed from their > > > > > ancestors here in America. Our Old ones still walk with us here. > > > > > Walk in beauty > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > >From: Gemma West <gemmawest@usa.net> > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > >Subject: [CHAHTA] Elkdreamer, twinkies > > > > > >Date: 3 Apr 2001 10:10:11 EDT > > > > > > > > > > > >Who are you referring to when you say "they" ? > > > > > > > > > > > >"Elkdreamer Wilkins" <elkdremr@hotmail.com> wrote: > > > > > >Halito Gemma > > > > > > My personal observations give me reason to believe that they can > > >see > > > > > >that > > > > > >we have a more centered culture with the bones of our Ancestors > here > > >with > > > > > >us > > > > > >to help guide our thoughts. They are trying to achive the same > > >connect > > > > that > > > > > >we feel to our past. > > > > > > Walk in Beauty > > > > > > Elkdreamer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: Gemma West <gemmawest@usa.net> > > > > > > >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > >Subject: [CHAHTA] twinkies > > > > > > >Date: 2 Apr 2001 11:02:35 EDT > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Sometimes I think the rush to investigate Indian ancestry is > rather > > > > > >amusing > > > > > > >also. After all, it has been estimated that only 7% of all > > >Americans > > > > have > > > > > > >Indian blood. On the other hand it has been estimated that 20% of > > > > > > >European-Americans have African blood. For some reason, however, > > >there > > > > > >has > > > > > > >been no parallel rush to claim African blood. I have to wonder > why. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >"Dusty" <dustyc@microgear.net> wrote: > > > > > > >This is a good topic if anyone wants to tackle it within > > > > > >guidelines....the > > > > > > >words "twinkie" and "wannabe" and their usage by both NA's and > > >whites. > > > > > > >Also, the prejudices that make these words acceptable. > > > > > > > > > > > > > >dusty > > > > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > >From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> > > > > > > >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > > > >Sent: Sunday, April 01, 2001 9:20 PM > > > > > > >Subject: [CHAHTA] Something so funny.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Was listening to AIROS (www.airos.org/) > > > > > > > > this morning and there was a comic on talking about a twinkie > > > > > >university > > > > > > >called I Wannebe U....the whole routine was hilarious....this is > a > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > >Got a GRIPE?? Got a PROBLEM?? Just wanna' WHINE? Don't post it > to > > >the > > > > > > >list...write me, dusty (list administrator) at > > > > > > >CHAHTA-L-admin@cultures.rootsweb.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >____________________________________________________________________ > > > > > > >Get free email and a permanent address at > > > > http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > >Need more CHOCTAW information?? Visit Judy White's pages at > > > > > > >http://accessgenealogy.com/native for rolls, data, etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >_________________________________________________________________ > > > > > >Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > > To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L genealogy mail list: > > > > > >Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the > > >quotes > > > > > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >____________________________________________________________________ > > > > > >Get free email and a permanent address at > > >http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > >Choctaw Home Page: > > > > > >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > > Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the > quotes > > > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > >To subscribe to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L Genealogy mail list: > > >Send msg. to CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST-L-request@rootsweb.com > > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "subscribe" without the quotes > > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... >

Halito Patsy They have the language classes on-line the Choctaw of Oklahoma have a web site that offers them. there is also a dictionary, work books and tapes for the class. The on-line classes interact through a program called rot-to player. and you interact in real time with motion pictures and a type of instant messaging. Walk in Beauty Elkdreamer >From: "Patsy Caleb" <studentarchaeologist@home.com> >Reply-To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com >To: CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Chata vs. Chahta - Meaning ? >Date: Fri, 6 Apr 2001 22:09:13 -0700 > >Last year they had a language school going on ? How do you learn it if it >is not written anywhere and how do they have these "learn the choctaw >language school >----- Original Message ----- >From: Barbara Ellison <greybird7@pisp.net> >To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> >Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 9:02 PM >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Chata vs. Chahta - Meaning ? > > > > Chata and Chahta are the same meaning..they mean Choctaw...Some of us >spell > > it one way, some the other.Depends on how we first learned it...Since >the > > Choctaw language was not a written language but only a spoken language, > > there are no "absolutely correct" spellings...they have been spelled >mainly > > as they sound, tho in some cases, in my opinion, some letters have been >used > > that are not necessary...hopefully the spellings will be standardized at > > some point, but til then, spelling phonetically usually gets the message > > across.... > > Barbara > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Dennis Boswell" <dennisb@primenet.com> > > To: <CHAHTA-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 10:54 PM > > Subject: [CHAHTA] Chata vs. Chahta - Meaning ? > > > > > > > I have seen this spelled both "Chata" and "Chahta." Which is correct? > > > > > > > > > If the correct spelling is "Chata," then what does "Chahta" mean? > > > > > > > > > > > > Doesn't "Chata" or "Chahta" (whichever is correct) really refer to > > > pre-removal Choctaw instead of post-removal Choctaw or is it used to >refer > > > to Choctaw without regard to either pre- or post-removal? > > > > > > > > > > > > Also, is "Chata" or "Chahta" (whichever is correct) also the name of >the > > > language spoken by pre- or post-removal Choctaws ? > > > > > > > > > Sorry for all the questions, but based on what I have seen in some of >the > > > CHAHTA-L traffic lately, I am confused. Somewhere along the line, I >got > > the > > > impression that "Chahta" (with an "h") referred to the "old ones" and >the > > > language they spoke. Am I wrong? > > > > > > > > > At 11:26 PM 04/06/2001 -0400, you wrote: > > > >Chata is what the Choctaw call themselves > > > > > > > > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > >TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > > >Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > >Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the >quotes > > > >Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Dennis K. Boswell > > > 301 Crow Canyon Drive > > > Folsom, CA 95630 > > > > > > Tel: (916) 987-3599 > > > Fax: (916) 987-3555 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > > Markie and Fay's CHOCTAW-SOUTHEAST Home Page: > > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/ > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS LIST: > > Send msg. to CHAHTA-L-request@rootsweb.com > > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > > > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== >Got a GRIPE?? Got a PROBLEM?? Just wanna' WHINE? Don't post it to the >list...write me, dusty (list administrator) at >CHAHTA-L-admin@cultures.rootsweb.com > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com