Go Lillian. I do hope you have more hatchets so I can read about them. Val ----- Original Message ----- From: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Monday, March 06, 2000 1:05 PM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Can you believe what is on E-bay???? > > --WebTV-Mail-23334-6114 > Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit > > Halito Chahtas > Just read thru all posts and was disturbed by what Markie found on E-bay > too. I agree with Greywolf and other responses from list but must add a > few things, just my beliefs. > > SHAMAN is not an NDN word. I abhor the use of it! It is a bastardized > terminology for medicine man, woman, maker, etc. In Chahta, ours are > MAKERS and MOTHERS (Makers of Medicine and Spirit Mothers) Every tribe > has their own word for their traditional keepers and practicers of > spiritual and medicine ways and beliefs. (I will be using the word Maker > in the context of this post.) Most who use the word SHAMAN to describe > themselves are shysters or non-purveyors of the truth in Spirit. > > NEVER was money, not to mention white man's money, a form of payment for > spiritual help! A maker of medicine did not ask for payment. They would > ask for Spirits help period if the asker was of true request. A person > never went to a traditional person and asked for help without an > offering in return...but payment is another word I do not like in this > context! An offering in return was given to the person who Spirit > worked thru to help the Peoples. The gift/offering was for that person > and SPIRIT! For example...in Christian beliefs.. ie: Old Testament, only > the purest and best offerings were offered to God for sacrifice so the > smoke from the sacrifice would be pleasing to God to answer the prayers > asked. True makers of medicine never ask for payment because they have > been given a gift from Spirit and to try and capitalize on that is not > of traditional ways and beliefs. > > In regards to AIM (American Indian Movement). Yes AIM did (when started > in 1970s) and does help to work toward NDN solidarity in all > traditional, cultural and heritage beliefs and tribal structures, as do > many other organizations, such as AIR (American Indian Rights), The > Confederation of Autonomous Chapters (spin-off of AIM) and many others.. > BUT .. it's EVERY NDN's responsibility to take action against any and > all who take of our culture and heritage for their own monetary and > self-promoting gains! We can not sit idly by and allow the perpetuation > of plunder of heritages and cultures to continue, If we do we are > turning a blind eye and allowing the continuation of Removal and The > Trail of Tears! > If you witnessed the digging up of one of your family member's graves so > that the body/bones could be sold for some new age remedy for > spirituality, would you approve?.. Help them dig??? I don't think > so..... We all are keepers and protectors of our heritage and culture > ... don't depend on the watchdog groups to do what the Old Ones expect > us to do! > > People such as this person selling SNAKE OIL on E-bay can be reported to > Ndn watchdog organizations so that their e-mail address, their profile > and what they are doing can be posted on the net and linked thru out the > Indian Nations on the Net. I hope that in the not too distant future > someone will create a web site listing all the Snake OIl salespersons > and doers of so called Native American Shaman business and totem animal > finders and etc etc etc, cuz most generally there AIN"T NUTHIN" NATIVE > ABOUT IT! > > Apologies for my soap box.. I just get so angry about this kind of stuff > that I go searching for all my buried hatchets! Yokoke for your reading > this..again just my beliefs...no hurt intended to anyone!!!!!!! > <:<>:> Lillian > > > --WebTV-Mail-23334-6114 > Content-Disposition: Inline > Content-Type: Message/RFC822 > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit > > Received: from mailsorter-101-11.iap.bryant.webtv.net (209.240.198.45) by > storefull-291.iap.bryant.webtv.net with WTV-SMTP; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 > 03:00:38 -0800 (PST) > Return-Path: <[email protected]> > Received: from bl-10.rootsweb.com (bl-10.rootsweb.com [204.212.38.26]) by > mailsorter-101-11.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/ms.dwm.v7+dul2) > with ESMTP id DAA29705; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 03:00:36 -0800 (PST) > Received: (from [email protected]) by bl-10.rootsweb.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id > CAA03664; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 02:59:36 -0800 > Resent-Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 02:59:36 -0800 > Message-Id: <[email protected]> > X-Sender: [email protected] > X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) > Date: Sat, 04 Mar 2000 04:54:55 -0600 > Old-To: [email protected] > From: Markie <[email protected]> > Mime-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > Subject: [CHAHTA] Can you believe what is on E-bay???? > Resent-Message-ID: <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Resent-From: [email protected] > Reply-To: [email protected] > X-Mailing-List: <[email protected]> archive/latest/229 > X-Loop: [email protected] > Precedence: list > Resent-Sender: [email protected] > > Well Folks, > > I just "thought" I had seen it all... while surfing E-bay, I came across > this page. I just had to share this with "someone"... so I guess it will > be my family here. Can you believe that someone is actually "selling" > this? And what's more unbelievable is someone is "BUYING" it!! I knew > it was going on all over the country, but on > "E-BAY"??? > > E-mail Shaman?? I can't help but laugh, even tho it is not funny... it's > sad how so many people will take our native american beliefs that are held > sacred, and make money off of them. It makes me ... nukoa (mad) and > nukhaklo (sad)... the worst thing about this to me, is they probably don't > know the first thing about what they are selling.... I wouldn't be > surprised to learn the only thing this person knows is what they read from > some kooks book that they read! > > I'm sorry, just had to say this to somebody.... let me get off of my soap > box here. > > Markie < still shaking my head in disblief over this one> > > > *****$250.00***** > > SHAMAN APPRENTICE PROGRAM..SERIOUS ONLY! > Item #271981927 > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=271981927 > > >I am a Native American shaman, spiritualist and herbalist. > > > >The Shaman Program is a very elite and special Program, with daily > teachings, lessons and specific instructions. It is not to be entered into > lightly and I will only accept a handful of people for this Program. You > will learn a great deal and experience many things. > > > >You will learn how to recognize, call upon and utilize the energies and > powers from our animal totems to your benefit. How to use herbs and Mother > Earth to heal. You will gain a greater knowledge of your own energies and > spirit. These knowledges and training will transform you! > > > > > >Lessons are transmitted by email each day. These are not > computer-generated; they are one-on-one and individually tailored to your > needs abilities and capabilities. You MUST be prepared to review the > lessons, complete the assignments and tasks and return your "homework" to > me within 24 hours each day! Any questions, please email me PRIOR to > bidding. My references are always available upon request. Please...serious > students only! You must be 18 or older and prove it. Will make exception > for 16 and 17 year-olds with notarized parental consent. > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > Home Page: > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/index.htm > Choctaw Chat: > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/chat.htm > > > --WebTV-Mail-23334-6114-- > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > To Unsubscribe: > Send msg. to [email protected] > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... >

--WebTV-Mail-23334-6114 Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit Halito Chahtas Just read thru all posts and was disturbed by what Markie found on E-bay too. I agree with Greywolf and other responses from list but must add a few things, just my beliefs. SHAMAN is not an NDN word. I abhor the use of it! It is a bastardized terminology for medicine man, woman, maker, etc. In Chahta, ours are MAKERS and MOTHERS (Makers of Medicine and Spirit Mothers) Every tribe has their own word for their traditional keepers and practicers of spiritual and medicine ways and beliefs. (I will be using the word Maker in the context of this post.) Most who use the word SHAMAN to describe themselves are shysters or non-purveyors of the truth in Spirit. NEVER was money, not to mention white man's money, a form of payment for spiritual help! A maker of medicine did not ask for payment. They would ask for Spirits help period if the asker was of true request. A person never went to a traditional person and asked for help without an offering in return...but payment is another word I do not like in this context! An offering in return was given to the person who Spirit worked thru to help the Peoples. The gift/offering was for that person and SPIRIT! For example...in Christian beliefs.. ie: Old Testament, only the purest and best offerings were offered to God for sacrifice so the smoke from the sacrifice would be pleasing to God to answer the prayers asked. True makers of medicine never ask for payment because they have been given a gift from Spirit and to try and capitalize on that is not of traditional ways and beliefs. In regards to AIM (American Indian Movement). Yes AIM did (when started in 1970s) and does help to work toward NDN solidarity in all traditional, cultural and heritage beliefs and tribal structures, as do many other organizations, such as AIR (American Indian Rights), The Confederation of Autonomous Chapters (spin-off of AIM) and many others.. BUT .. it's EVERY NDN's responsibility to take action against any and all who take of our culture and heritage for their own monetary and self-promoting gains! We can not sit idly by and allow the perpetuation of plunder of heritages and cultures to continue, If we do we are turning a blind eye and allowing the continuation of Removal and The Trail of Tears! If you witnessed the digging up of one of your family member's graves so that the body/bones could be sold for some new age remedy for spirituality, would you approve?.. Help them dig??? I don't think so..... We all are keepers and protectors of our heritage and culture ... don't depend on the watchdog groups to do what the Old Ones expect us to do! People such as this person selling SNAKE OIL on E-bay can be reported to Ndn watchdog organizations so that their e-mail address, their profile and what they are doing can be posted on the net and linked thru out the Indian Nations on the Net. I hope that in the not too distant future someone will create a web site listing all the Snake OIl salespersons and doers of so called Native American Shaman business and totem animal finders and etc etc etc, cuz most generally there AIN"T NUTHIN" NATIVE ABOUT IT! Apologies for my soap box.. I just get so angry about this kind of stuff that I go searching for all my buried hatchets! Yokoke for your reading this..again just my beliefs...no hurt intended to anyone!!!!!!! <:<>:> Lillian --WebTV-Mail-23334-6114 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Message/RFC822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit Received: from mailsorter-101-11.iap.bryant.webtv.net (209.240.198.45) by storefull-291.iap.bryant.webtv.net with WTV-SMTP; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 03:00:38 -0800 (PST) Return-Path: <[email protected]> Received: from bl-10.rootsweb.com (bl-10.rootsweb.com [204.212.38.26]) by mailsorter-101-11.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/ms.dwm.v7+dul2) with ESMTP id DAA29705; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 03:00:36 -0800 (PST) Received: (from [email protected]) by bl-10.rootsweb.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA03664; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 02:59:36 -0800 Resent-Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 02:59:36 -0800 Message-Id: <[email protected]> X-Sender: [email protected] X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Sat, 04 Mar 2000 04:54:55 -0600 Old-To: [email protected] From: Markie <[email protected]> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: [CHAHTA] Can you believe what is on E-bay???? Resent-Message-ID: <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Resent-From: [email protected] Reply-To: [email protected] X-Mailing-List: <[email protected]> archive/latest/229 X-Loop: [email protected] Precedence: list Resent-Sender: [email protected] Well Folks, I just "thought" I had seen it all... while surfing E-bay, I came across this page. I just had to share this with "someone"... so I guess it will be my family here. Can you believe that someone is actually "selling" this? And what's more unbelievable is someone is "BUYING" it!! I knew it was going on all over the country, but on "E-BAY"??? E-mail Shaman?? I can't help but laugh, even tho it is not funny... it's sad how so many people will take our native american beliefs that are held sacred, and make money off of them. It makes me ... nukoa (mad) and nukhaklo (sad)... the worst thing about this to me, is they probably don't know the first thing about what they are selling.... I wouldn't be surprised to learn the only thing this person knows is what they read from some kooks book that they read! I'm sorry, just had to say this to somebody.... let me get off of my soap box here. Markie < still shaking my head in disblief over this one> *****$250.00***** SHAMAN APPRENTICE PROGRAM..SERIOUS ONLY! Item #271981927 http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=271981927 >I am a Native American shaman, spiritualist and herbalist. > >The Shaman Program is a very elite and special Program, with daily teachings, lessons and specific instructions. It is not to be entered into lightly and I will only accept a handful of people for this Program. You will learn a great deal and experience many things. > >You will learn how to recognize, call upon and utilize the energies and powers from our animal totems to your benefit. How to use herbs and Mother Earth to heal. You will gain a greater knowledge of your own energies and spirit. These knowledges and training will transform you! > > >Lessons are transmitted by email each day. These are not computer-generated; they are one-on-one and individually tailored to your needs abilities and capabilities. You MUST be prepared to review the lessons, complete the assignments and tasks and return your "homework" to me within 24 hours each day! Any questions, please email me PRIOR to bidding. My references are always available upon request. Please...serious students only! You must be 18 or older and prove it. Will make exception for 16 and 17 year-olds with notarized parental consent. > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== Home Page: http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/index.htm Choctaw Chat: http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/chat.htm --WebTV-Mail-23334-6114--

Tried to pull up website - would not come up but I will figure out a way to e-mail this character, wholeheartedly agree!!!!!!!! I believe that thought came to any one who cares. Margie -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Saturday, March 04, 2000 12:47 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Can you believe what is on E-bay???? --WebTV-Mail-3123-54 Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit Jami & Markie I agree,this is ridiculous. Rita --WebTV-Mail-3123-54 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Message/RFC822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit Received: from mailsorter-101-11.iap.bryant.webtv.net (209.240.198.45) by storefull-278.iap.bryant.webtv.net with WTV-SMTP; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 05:52:38 -0800 (PST) Return-Path: <[email protected]> Received: from bl-10.rootsweb.com (bl-10.rootsweb.com [204.212.38.26]) by mailsorter-101-11.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/ms.dwm.v7+dul2) with ESMTP id FAA21933; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 05:52:36 -0800 (PST) Received: (from [email protected]) by bl-10.rootsweb.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA10827; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 05:52:17 -0800 Resent-Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 05:52:17 -0800 From: [email protected] Message-ID: <[email protected]> Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 08:51:45 EST Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Can you believe what is on E-bay???? Old-To: [email protected] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 67 Resent-Message-ID: <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Resent-From: [email protected] Reply-To: [email protected] X-Mailing-List: <[email protected]> archive/latest/231 X-Loop: [email protected] Precedence: list Resent-Sender: [email protected] Hmmm... I think an email to the seller is in store.... Anyone else care to flood their email box?? This is ridiculous! People like this need to be taught that what they are doing is WRONG and perpetuating a fallacy that can never be upheld by any tribe! Jami ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== To Unsubscribe: Send msg. to [email protected] Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... --WebTV-Mail-3123-54-- ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== Home Page: http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/index.htm Choctaw Chat: http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/chat.htm

I,totally agree with you about a medicine man in pretense on Internet trying to sell anything period... NOT REAL and this person needs to stop it! That's exactly one reason the Indians had "AIM" to keep people like that from taking advantage of the First Nations not specificially for violence but because of atrocities such as this! He needs to watch what he's doing ... -----Original Message----- From: Markie [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Saturday, March 04, 2000 6:40 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Can you believe what is on E-bay???? Hi Patsy, I don't mean to be putting anyone down....and try very hard to never do that...I never judge anyone, and try to see both sides even if I have walked in their shoes at some point...... BUT there are so many people out there who "are" taking people's good, "hard earned" money to teach them something that they, themselves, usually do not know anything about. I have never in my life time "ever" known of/seen any TRUE "shaman, medicine man, holy woman, spititual person, elder", or what ever else you want to call them, "SELLING" their heritage or if you prefer, spirituality. And when I say "true", I mean someone who holds it in their heart. Who believes it in their sole, through and through, with every breath they take. Blood quantum does not enter into this at all to me... To me A "true" person of the people is not someone who is just out to make a dollar. So many of the Native Americans are being so hurt, mad, outraged, and many other things about this type of thing. I have heard some talking of the feeling of being raped of their culture by this type of situtation. I, for one, would not ever give someone a single penny for something like this. The Native American people feel this is just one more thing that we are being robbed of.... just like all of our land that was stolen from us by the US Gov. among other things... Native Americans were not even American citizens and didn't get the right to vote until 1928, "after" fighting in WWI, which had our own Choctaw men, who were the VERY FIRST code talkers EVER, serving their lives for this country. This is one thing, in my opinion, that is "not" for sale! And to do so is wrong, no matter how one looks at it. I don't take a stand on many things, but this just happens to be the one that I do stand up for. This auction is a dutch bid.... that means that as many people that wants to, can bid on it...so right now there are 5 bidders.... @ $250.00 each, so he is making a total of $1,250.00 at this moment, with 1 day and 20 hours to go before the auction ends!!! Sounds like he is right in there with "some" of the Television Evanglists to me! BUT selling it on the Internet??? Giving classes on the Internet thru E-mail?? No Way! NO, this is not right by my standards at all! I think it is a disgrace! He should be ashamed!!! Sorry... this soapbox just keeps gettting under me somehow.. Markie Here is the ebay page address again if anyone would like to check this out... http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=271981927 At 04:13 PM 03/04/2000 -0700, you wrote: >yall better look before you leap maybe put em bigfoot in_________ >Signd Bigfoot >----- Original Message ----- >From: Markie <[email protected]> >To: <[email protected]> >Sent: Saturday, March 04, 2000 3:53 PM >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Can you believe what is on E-bay???? > > >> Lucus, >> >> Your msg. gave me chill bumps.. <S> I know some folks like Woogie also. >> And you are so correct in what you say. Our "real" spiritual people don't >> take anyone's money. The gifts they receive, come from a lot higher >place >> than this old earth. I've either heard of Woogie, or met him at one >> time... the name is so familiar to me.... But I'm not sure from where? A >> group of us went to the Chappibbitie (ms?) pow wow in Lawton several years >> ago, so that may be where I know the name from, but not sure. >> >> I Thank the Creator for giving us people like him. >> >> I know that even some Indian People do this type of thing.. I knew one of >> them "very well" and he was full blood. A true blue con artist in the >> flesh... but you couldn't help but like him. <G> Like my sister in law >> said... have you ever met a con artist that wasn't likeable? That's what >> makes them so good at what they do. Good and bad come in all sizes and >> races...I didn't know there was a magazine named "Shaman's Drum". I'm >> further out in the boonies than I thought... LOL >> >> I don't know why I was so shocked to see this on E-Bay, but I was. I was >> surfing Collectiable stuff, and came across it. It just took me by >> surprise, I guess.. . It also made me very sad. There are so many who >> just do not know what they are talking about, and so many who do not know >> any better, and who want to learn of their culture, fall for it, from >lack >> of knowledge. Taken in by their good hearts, and the sincere need to >> learn, but those good hearts are then torn with untruths, before they >know >> what happened to them.....this is what is sad to me. >> >> Thank you for sharing >> Markie >> >> At 01:13 PM 03/04/2000 -0600, you wrote: >> >Markie, >> > >> >As sad as it is, there are a number of "professional shaman" schools in >> >business today; some by Native Americans and many by non-indians. They >> >advertise in the magazine Shaman's Drum. >> > >> >It makes my heart sick inside but Texas and Oklahoma are filled with >> >non-indian "shamans" who charge people for counseling and healings. Most >of >> >these are women. Woogie Watchetaker, a noted medicine man of the >Comanche >> >Nation told me once that people who take money for sharing the gifts of >God >> >will never go to the land of souls after they cross the river. Woogie >could >> >make rain, heal all sorts of illnesses and bring good fortune for some >> >people. but he NEVER charged a penny for that. He lived in a little >> >three-room wooden shotgun house outside of Lawton. Sometimes people would >> >bring gifts and leave them on his porch at night and sometimes they would >> >slip a little cash to his wife, but she too never ASKED for any money. >And >> >he was very spiritual. Once we slept alone together on the second floor >of >> >an old army barracks at Fort Hood, Texas before an Indian burial there. >I >> >got up at three in the morning and noticed that he was not in his bed. I >> >found him on his knees praying in the dark by a window. Compare that >with >> >people who charge to teach people to be "shamans." >> > >> >Lucas Graywolf >> > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== Home Page: http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/index.htm Choctaw Chat: http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/chat.htm

Halito list members, I stopped by the web page of two of our list members. Barbara Ellison and Neal White. I was saddened and shocked to read that Neal had passed away on Feb 24th. I do not know the circumstances, as his last message on their message board was Feb. 15th. Barbara put a message there on March 3rd, saying that she was using the library computer as hers had broken while Neal was in the hospital. She is unable to receive e-mail from her address of <[email protected]> She did leave the following address, but don't know when or how she will receive mail at this one. <[email protected]> She sounded lost and not knowing which way to turn in her message. She said she did not know what will happen to their web site. The last time that I talked to Neal, he was getting ready for Tax time as he worked doing Income Taxes for other people. He said he would be busy until Tax time was over, and then be back here. Some of our older members here will remember Neal, especially from the Chahta mail list. Neal is an author and wrote of his growing up years in the Choctaw Nation of Oklahoma; ongoing events in the same rural neighborhood; and his personal views on various issues concerning Choctaws. His book, which is a collection of short stories, is listed on our Choctaw Web page under authors. I think I remember Sandi ordering a copy a while back, and I intended to myself, just hadn't gotten around to it yet. Altho, I never met Neal, from reading his short stories on their web page, he must have been a wonderful person. This is the address where everyone could order his book, so I feel it is appropiate to place it here in case anyone would like to send a card to Barbara. Neal White Rt.1, Box 2685 Wister, Oklahoma 74966 May our friend be safe as he makes his journey. Markie

Me too Dan!! I guess you fell off somewhere along the trail... I had to pick you up, brush you off, and put you back on again.. that's what happens when you ride one of those wild stallions we just brought into the village...now us women folks, we ride those little surefooted mares we have.... Ayyyyyyy <G> I also put you on the accept list for good... <G> Good tip... the (find on this page)... now why didn't I think of that? LOL I'm always a day late and a dollar short!!! Thank you... Markie At 11:04 PM 03/05/2000 -0800, you wrote: >To search for a site or word just use the (find on this page ) search on >your browser l;-) > >Thanks for the frindship <G> > I thought I was already subscribed <?> > >Dan > >Genealogy Community Support site >Host site for my lists and people who want to be found >Also Stayton-Santiam Genealogy >http://www.angelfire.com/or/matney >Make money surfing, see my site >Cherokees/Surname lists/Shopping > >----- Original Message ----- >From: Markie <[email protected]> >To: <[email protected]> >Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2000 10:18 PM >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] ((Passing Friendship)) > > >> Hi Dan, >> >> I accept this friendship from your Cherokee Mail List, and pass it on to >> the others here among our people. Wa do, and Yakoke! Hey, I'm >trilingual >> now!! Use to, I could only speak "country".. haha >> >> Your web site is awesome!!! You have so many links, it's wonderful! >It's >> a "one stop shop" for Native American links to web pages. I haven't >> checked them all out yet, but if you do not already have this link listed, >> it's a good one. A friend of mine... Internet friend.... has a page on >> Louisiana Indian History..... here is the URL in case you don't have it. >I >> talked with Ben last night and he has just updated the pages, and has >> everything working.... >> >> http://personal.lig.bellsouth.net/lig/w/a/wahya/ >> >> Yakoke, and blessings to you and yours. >> Markie :) >> >> At 11:47 PM 03/05/2000 -0600, you wrote: >> >Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 22:08:04 -0800 >> >From: "Dan" <[email protected]> >> > >> >Still passing the friendships <G> >> > >> >Just a note I have put 1500 plus indian website links on my website and >> >are accessed through my main page bottom right corner of the index. >> > >> >Dan >> >Cherokee lists /;-) >> >Genealogy Community Support site >> >Host site for my lists and people who want to be found >> >Also Stayton-Santiam Genealogy >> >http://www.angelfire.com/or/matney >> >Make money surfing, see my site >> >Cherokees/Surname lists/Shopping >> > >> >> >> >> ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== >> To Unsubscribe: >> Send msg. to [email protected] >> Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes >> Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... >> >> > > >==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== >Home Page: >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/index.htm >Choctaw Chat: >http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/chat.htm > > >

Watch all that dust, I seem to have been falling off a lot latley <BG> So hows all the research going, any new solid clues ?? Dan Genealogy Community Support site Host site for my lists and people who want to be found Also Stayton-Santiam Genealogy http://www.angelfire.com/or/matney Make money surfing, see my site Cherokees/Surname lists/Shopping ----- Original Message ----- From: Markie <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2000 11:34 PM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] ((Passing Friendship)) > Me too Dan!! I guess you fell off somewhere along the trail... I had to > pick you up, brush you off, and put you back on again.. that's what happens > when you ride one of those wild stallions we just brought into the > village...now us women folks, we ride those little surefooted mares we > have.... Ayyyyyyy <G> I also put you on the accept list for good... <G> > > Good tip... the (find on this page)... now why didn't I think of that? LOL > I'm always a day late and a dollar short!!! > Thank you... > Markie > <<Snip>

Hi Dan, I accept this friendship from your Cherokee Mail List, and pass it on to the others here among our people. Wa do, and Yakoke! Hey, I'm trilingual now!! Use to, I could only speak "country".. haha Your web site is awesome!!! You have so many links, it's wonderful! It's a "one stop shop" for Native American links to web pages. I haven't checked them all out yet, but if you do not already have this link listed, it's a good one. A friend of mine... Internet friend.... has a page on Louisiana Indian History..... here is the URL in case you don't have it. I talked with Ben last night and he has just updated the pages, and has everything working.... http://personal.lig.bellsouth.net/lig/w/a/wahya/ Yakoke, and blessings to you and yours. Markie :) At 11:47 PM 03/05/2000 -0600, you wrote: >Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 22:08:04 -0800 >From: "Dan" <[email protected]> > >Still passing the friendships <G> > >Just a note I have put 1500 plus indian website links on my website and >are accessed through my main page bottom right corner of the index. > >Dan >Cherokee lists /;-) >Genealogy Community Support site >Host site for my lists and people who want to be found >Also Stayton-Santiam Genealogy >http://www.angelfire.com/or/matney >Make money surfing, see my site >Cherokees/Surname lists/Shopping >

Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 22:08:04 -0800 From: "Dan" <[email protected]> Still passing the friendships <G> Just a note I have put 1500 plus indian website links on my website and are accessed through my main page bottom right corner of the index. Dan Cherokee lists /;-) Genealogy Community Support site Host site for my lists and people who want to be found Also Stayton-Santiam Genealogy http://www.angelfire.com/or/matney Make money surfing, see my site Cherokees/Surname lists/Shopping >----- Original Message ----- >From: Markie <[email protected]> >To: <[email protected]> >Sent: Wednesday, December 29, 1999 12:54 PM >Subject: ((Passing Friendship)) > > >> Hi List Members, >> >> On the Cherokee mail list, everyone is passing their "Friendship" around >to >> each other. They are accepting it, and then passing it to others...I >> asked permission from Dan, the list owner, if we could pass it to our >lists >> here. He said yes! <G> >> >> So with this post, I would like to "Pass Friendship" to each and everyone >> of you for the New Millennium. May our Friendship be passed among all >> Native American peoples so our traditions will continue, as we join hands >> with each other! >> >> <SNIP> >> > Please enjoy and Keep passing frienships , it is the one thing we can >> >all share . >> >Here is hoping the new year brings good things . >> >Dan >> <SNIP> >> >> I accept this Friendship from Dan, and pass it on to each of you. >> >> *****+-+-+-+-HAPPY NEW YEAR!!!!!+-+-+-+-+***** >> Markie >> >> >[email protected] >> > >> > ((Passing Friendship)) >> > >> > With this I pass my friendship to all those who wish to be friends in >> peace bringing in the new year . >> > >> > >> > Friends and Peace are my moto ; >> > Join in for the new year comming up. >> > We will sit here and watch the computer >> > go bonkers Jan 1 ,2000 <<BG>> >> > >> > Genealogy Community Support site >> > Host site for my lists and people who want to be found >> > http://www.angelfire.com/or/matney >> > Cherokees/Surname lists/Shopping >> > Over 40 pages >> > Dan >> > >> > >> > >> >> > > >

To search for a site or word just use the (find on this page ) search on your browser l;-) Thanks for the frindship <G> I thought I was already subscribed <?> Dan Genealogy Community Support site Host site for my lists and people who want to be found Also Stayton-Santiam Genealogy http://www.angelfire.com/or/matney Make money surfing, see my site Cherokees/Surname lists/Shopping ----- Original Message ----- From: Markie <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2000 10:18 PM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] ((Passing Friendship)) > Hi Dan, > > I accept this friendship from your Cherokee Mail List, and pass it on to > the others here among our people. Wa do, and Yakoke! Hey, I'm trilingual > now!! Use to, I could only speak "country".. haha > > Your web site is awesome!!! You have so many links, it's wonderful! It's > a "one stop shop" for Native American links to web pages. I haven't > checked them all out yet, but if you do not already have this link listed, > it's a good one. A friend of mine... Internet friend.... has a page on > Louisiana Indian History..... here is the URL in case you don't have it. I > talked with Ben last night and he has just updated the pages, and has > everything working.... > > http://personal.lig.bellsouth.net/lig/w/a/wahya/ > > Yakoke, and blessings to you and yours. > Markie :) > > At 11:47 PM 03/05/2000 -0600, you wrote: > >Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 22:08:04 -0800 > >From: "Dan" <[email protected]> > > > >Still passing the friendships <G> > > > >Just a note I have put 1500 plus indian website links on my website and > >are accessed through my main page bottom right corner of the index. > > > >Dan > >Cherokee lists /;-) > >Genealogy Community Support site > >Host site for my lists and people who want to be found > >Also Stayton-Santiam Genealogy > >http://www.angelfire.com/or/matney > >Make money surfing, see my site > >Cherokees/Surname lists/Shopping > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > To Unsubscribe: > Send msg. to [email protected] > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > >

>This auction is a dutch bid.... that means that as many people that wants >to, can bid on it...so right now there are 5 bidders.... @ $250.00 each, >so he is making a total of $1,250.00 at this moment, with 1 day and 20 >hours to go before the auction ends!!! Sounds like he is right in there >with "some" of the Television Evanglists to me! OOPS... I was wrong, wrong, wrong... he has ONE bidder.... but has spots for "5" people.... so good.... he's not making $1,250.00 right now.... but $250.00 is to much!! I will watch this auction to see if he "does" get his five people tho.... THEN it will be the above amount if he does.. my apologies... Markie

Hi Patsy, I don't mean to be putting anyone down....and try very hard to never do that...I never judge anyone, and try to see both sides even if I have walked in their shoes at some point...... BUT there are so many people out there who "are" taking people's good, "hard earned" money to teach them something that they, themselves, usually do not know anything about. I have never in my life time "ever" known of/seen any TRUE "shaman, medicine man, holy woman, spititual person, elder", or what ever else you want to call them, "SELLING" their heritage or if you prefer, spirituality. And when I say "true", I mean someone who holds it in their heart. Who believes it in their sole, through and through, with every breath they take. Blood quantum does not enter into this at all to me... To me A "true" person of the people is not someone who is just out to make a dollar. So many of the Native Americans are being so hurt, mad, outraged, and many other things about this type of thing. I have heard some talking of the feeling of being raped of their culture by this type of situtation. I, for one, would not ever give someone a single penny for something like this. The Native American people feel this is just one more thing that we are being robbed of.... just like all of our land that was stolen from us by the US Gov. among other things... Native Americans were not even American citizens and didn't get the right to vote until 1928, "after" fighting in WWI, which had our own Choctaw men, who were the VERY FIRST code talkers EVER, serving their lives for this country. This is one thing, in my opinion, that is "not" for sale! And to do so is wrong, no matter how one looks at it. I don't take a stand on many things, but this just happens to be the one that I do stand up for. This auction is a dutch bid.... that means that as many people that wants to, can bid on it...so right now there are 5 bidders.... @ $250.00 each, so he is making a total of $1,250.00 at this moment, with 1 day and 20 hours to go before the auction ends!!! Sounds like he is right in there with "some" of the Television Evanglists to me! BUT selling it on the Internet??? Giving classes on the Internet thru E-mail?? No Way! NO, this is not right by my standards at all! I think it is a disgrace! He should be ashamed!!! Sorry... this soapbox just keeps gettting under me somehow.. Markie Here is the ebay page address again if anyone would like to check this out... http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=271981927 At 04:13 PM 03/04/2000 -0700, you wrote: >yall better look before you leap maybe put em bigfoot in_________ >Signd Bigfoot >----- Original Message ----- >From: Markie <[email protected]> >To: <[email protected]> >Sent: Saturday, March 04, 2000 3:53 PM >Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Can you believe what is on E-bay???? > > >> Lucus, >> >> Your msg. gave me chill bumps.. <S> I know some folks like Woogie also. >> And you are so correct in what you say. Our "real" spiritual people don't >> take anyone's money. The gifts they receive, come from a lot higher >place >> than this old earth. I've either heard of Woogie, or met him at one >> time... the name is so familiar to me.... But I'm not sure from where? A >> group of us went to the Chappibbitie (ms?) pow wow in Lawton several years >> ago, so that may be where I know the name from, but not sure. >> >> I Thank the Creator for giving us people like him. >> >> I know that even some Indian People do this type of thing.. I knew one of >> them "very well" and he was full blood. A true blue con artist in the >> flesh... but you couldn't help but like him. <G> Like my sister in law >> said... have you ever met a con artist that wasn't likeable? That's what >> makes them so good at what they do. Good and bad come in all sizes and >> races...I didn't know there was a magazine named "Shaman's Drum". I'm >> further out in the boonies than I thought... LOL >> >> I don't know why I was so shocked to see this on E-Bay, but I was. I was >> surfing Collectiable stuff, and came across it. It just took me by >> surprise, I guess.. . It also made me very sad. There are so many who >> just do not know what they are talking about, and so many who do not know >> any better, and who want to learn of their culture, fall for it, from >lack >> of knowledge. Taken in by their good hearts, and the sincere need to >> learn, but those good hearts are then torn with untruths, before they >know >> what happened to them.....this is what is sad to me. >> >> Thank you for sharing >> Markie >> >> At 01:13 PM 03/04/2000 -0600, you wrote: >> >Markie, >> > >> >As sad as it is, there are a number of "professional shaman" schools in >> >business today; some by Native Americans and many by non-indians. They >> >advertise in the magazine Shaman's Drum. >> > >> >It makes my heart sick inside but Texas and Oklahoma are filled with >> >non-indian "shamans" who charge people for counseling and healings. Most >of >> >these are women. Woogie Watchetaker, a noted medicine man of the >Comanche >> >Nation told me once that people who take money for sharing the gifts of >God >> >will never go to the land of souls after they cross the river. Woogie >could >> >make rain, heal all sorts of illnesses and bring good fortune for some >> >people. but he NEVER charged a penny for that. He lived in a little >> >three-room wooden shotgun house outside of Lawton. Sometimes people would >> >bring gifts and leave them on his porch at night and sometimes they would >> >slip a little cash to his wife, but she too never ASKED for any money. >And >> >he was very spiritual. Once we slept alone together on the second floor >of >> >an old army barracks at Fort Hood, Texas before an Indian burial there. >I >> >got up at three in the morning and noticed that he was not in his bed. I >> >found him on his knees praying in the dark by a window. Compare that >with >> >people who charge to teach people to be "shamans." >> > >> >Lucas Graywolf >> >

Lucus, Your msg. gave me chill bumps.. <S> I know some folks like Woogie also. And you are so correct in what you say. Our "real" spiritual people don't take anyone's money. The gifts they receive, come from a lot higher place than this old earth. I've either heard of Woogie, or met him at one time... the name is so familiar to me.... But I'm not sure from where? A group of us went to the Chappibbitie (ms?) pow wow in Lawton several years ago, so that may be where I know the name from, but not sure. I Thank the Creator for giving us people like him. I know that even some Indian People do this type of thing.. I knew one of them "very well" and he was full blood. A true blue con artist in the flesh... but you couldn't help but like him. <G> Like my sister in law said... have you ever met a con artist that wasn't likeable? That's what makes them so good at what they do. Good and bad come in all sizes and races...I didn't know there was a magazine named "Shaman's Drum". I'm further out in the boonies than I thought... LOL I don't know why I was so shocked to see this on E-Bay, but I was. I was surfing Collectiable stuff, and came across it. It just took me by surprise, I guess.. . It also made me very sad. There are so many who just do not know what they are talking about, and so many who do not know any better, and who want to learn of their culture, fall for it, from lack of knowledge. Taken in by their good hearts, and the sincere need to learn, but those good hearts are then torn with untruths, before they know what happened to them.....this is what is sad to me. Thank you for sharing Markie At 01:13 PM 03/04/2000 -0600, you wrote: >Markie, > >As sad as it is, there are a number of "professional shaman" schools in >business today; some by Native Americans and many by non-indians. They >advertise in the magazine Shaman's Drum. > >It makes my heart sick inside but Texas and Oklahoma are filled with >non-indian "shamans" who charge people for counseling and healings. Most of >these are women. Woogie Watchetaker, a noted medicine man of the Comanche >Nation told me once that people who take money for sharing the gifts of God >will never go to the land of souls after they cross the river. Woogie could >make rain, heal all sorts of illnesses and bring good fortune for some >people. but he NEVER charged a penny for that. He lived in a little >three-room wooden shotgun house outside of Lawton. Sometimes people would >bring gifts and leave them on his porch at night and sometimes they would >slip a little cash to his wife, but she too never ASKED for any money. And >he was very spiritual. Once we slept alone together on the second floor of >an old army barracks at Fort Hood, Texas before an Indian burial there. I >got up at three in the morning and noticed that he was not in his bed. I >found him on his knees praying in the dark by a window. Compare that with >people who charge to teach people to be "shamans." > >Lucas Graywolf >

yall better look before you leap maybe put em bigfoot in_________ Signd Bigfoot ----- Original Message ----- From: Markie <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Saturday, March 04, 2000 3:53 PM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Can you believe what is on E-bay???? > Lucus, > > Your msg. gave me chill bumps.. <S> I know some folks like Woogie also. > And you are so correct in what you say. Our "real" spiritual people don't > take anyone's money. The gifts they receive, come from a lot higher place > than this old earth. I've either heard of Woogie, or met him at one > time... the name is so familiar to me.... But I'm not sure from where? A > group of us went to the Chappibbitie (ms?) pow wow in Lawton several years > ago, so that may be where I know the name from, but not sure. > > I Thank the Creator for giving us people like him. > > I know that even some Indian People do this type of thing.. I knew one of > them "very well" and he was full blood. A true blue con artist in the > flesh... but you couldn't help but like him. <G> Like my sister in law > said... have you ever met a con artist that wasn't likeable? That's what > makes them so good at what they do. Good and bad come in all sizes and > races...I didn't know there was a magazine named "Shaman's Drum". I'm > further out in the boonies than I thought... LOL > > I don't know why I was so shocked to see this on E-Bay, but I was. I was > surfing Collectiable stuff, and came across it. It just took me by > surprise, I guess.. . It also made me very sad. There are so many who > just do not know what they are talking about, and so many who do not know > any better, and who want to learn of their culture, fall for it, from lack > of knowledge. Taken in by their good hearts, and the sincere need to > learn, but those good hearts are then torn with untruths, before they know > what happened to them.....this is what is sad to me. > > Thank you for sharing > Markie > > At 01:13 PM 03/04/2000 -0600, you wrote: > >Markie, > > > >As sad as it is, there are a number of "professional shaman" schools in > >business today; some by Native Americans and many by non-indians. They > >advertise in the magazine Shaman's Drum. > > > >It makes my heart sick inside but Texas and Oklahoma are filled with > >non-indian "shamans" who charge people for counseling and healings. Most of > >these are women. Woogie Watchetaker, a noted medicine man of the Comanche > >Nation told me once that people who take money for sharing the gifts of God > >will never go to the land of souls after they cross the river. Woogie could > >make rain, heal all sorts of illnesses and bring good fortune for some > >people. but he NEVER charged a penny for that. He lived in a little > >three-room wooden shotgun house outside of Lawton. Sometimes people would > >bring gifts and leave them on his porch at night and sometimes they would > >slip a little cash to his wife, but she too never ASKED for any money. And > >he was very spiritual. Once we slept alone together on the second floor of > >an old army barracks at Fort Hood, Texas before an Indian burial there. I > >got up at three in the morning and noticed that he was not in his bed. I > >found him on his knees praying in the dark by a window. Compare that with > >people who charge to teach people to be "shamans." > > > >Lucas Graywolf > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > To Unsubscribe: > Send msg. to [email protected] > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > >

I guess i have seen to many indians growing up in southeastern oklahoma going without so much i always stop and think first before i judge any because of poverty and the like. innocent befor e proven guilty i always said yall let me know what becomes of the poor indian your stomping into the ground and if you actually have any real evidence against this person send it so we can all see it ----- Original Message ----- From: Markie <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Saturday, March 04, 2000 3:53 PM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Can you believe what is on E-bay???? > Lucus, > > Your msg. gave me chill bumps.. <S> I know some folks like Woogie also. > And you are so correct in what you say. Our "real" spiritual people don't > take anyone's money. The gifts they receive, come from a lot higher place > than this old earth. I've either heard of Woogie, or met him at one > time... the name is so familiar to me.... But I'm not sure from where? A > group of us went to the Chappibbitie (ms?) pow wow in Lawton several years > ago, so that may be where I know the name from, but not sure. > > I Thank the Creator for giving us people like him. > > I know that even some Indian People do this type of thing.. I knew one of > them "very well" and he was full blood. A true blue con artist in the > flesh... but you couldn't help but like him. <G> Like my sister in law > said... have you ever met a con artist that wasn't likeable? That's what > makes them so good at what they do. Good and bad come in all sizes and > races...I didn't know there was a magazine named "Shaman's Drum". I'm > further out in the boonies than I thought... LOL > > I don't know why I was so shocked to see this on E-Bay, but I was. I was > surfing Collectiable stuff, and came across it. It just took me by > surprise, I guess.. . It also made me very sad. There are so many who > just do not know what they are talking about, and so many who do not know > any better, and who want to learn of their culture, fall for it, from lack > of knowledge. Taken in by their good hearts, and the sincere need to > learn, but those good hearts are then torn with untruths, before they know > what happened to them.....this is what is sad to me. > > Thank you for sharing > Markie > > At 01:13 PM 03/04/2000 -0600, you wrote: > >Markie, > > > >As sad as it is, there are a number of "professional shaman" schools in > >business today; some by Native Americans and many by non-indians. They > >advertise in the magazine Shaman's Drum. > > > >It makes my heart sick inside but Texas and Oklahoma are filled with > >non-indian "shamans" who charge people for counseling and healings. Most of > >these are women. Woogie Watchetaker, a noted medicine man of the Comanche > >Nation told me once that people who take money for sharing the gifts of God > >will never go to the land of souls after they cross the river. Woogie could > >make rain, heal all sorts of illnesses and bring good fortune for some > >people. but he NEVER charged a penny for that. He lived in a little > >three-room wooden shotgun house outside of Lawton. Sometimes people would > >bring gifts and leave them on his porch at night and sometimes they would > >slip a little cash to his wife, but she too never ASKED for any money. And > >he was very spiritual. Once we slept alone together on the second floor of > >an old army barracks at Fort Hood, Texas before an Indian burial there. I > >got up at three in the morning and noticed that he was not in his bed. I > >found him on his knees praying in the dark by a window. Compare that with > >people who charge to teach people to be "shamans." > > > >Lucas Graywolf > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > To Unsubscribe: > Send msg. to [email protected] > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > >

Lucas: Thank you for sharing your experiences with Woogie Watchetaker. He must have been an extremely spiritual man. If only there were many more like him to give us all examples of doing good works just for the sake of helping people, and not to make a lot of money. Sandi :)

Markie, As sad as it is, there are a number of "professional shaman" schools in business today; some by Native Americans and many by non-indians. They advertise in the magazine Shaman's Drum. It makes my heart sick inside but Texas and Oklahoma are filled with non-indian "shamans" who charge people for counseling and healings. Most of these are women. Woogie Watchetaker, a noted medicine man of the Comanche Nation told me once that people who take money for sharing the gifts of God will never go to the land of souls after they cross the river. Woogie could make rain, heal all sorts of illnesses and bring good fortune for some people. but he NEVER charged a penny for that. He lived in a little three-room wooden shotgun house outside of Lawton. Sometimes people would bring gifts and leave them on his porch at night and sometimes they would slip a little cash to his wife, but she too never ASKED for any money. And he was very spiritual. Once we slept alone together on the second floor of an old army barracks at Fort Hood, Texas before an Indian burial there. I got up at three in the morning and noticed that he was not in his bed. I found him on his knees praying in the dark by a window. Compare that with people who charge to teach people to be "shamans." Lucas Graywolf ----- Original Message ----- From: "Markie" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Saturday, March 04, 2000 4:54 AM Subject: [CHAHTA] Can you believe what is on E-bay???? > Well Folks, > > I just "thought" I had seen it all... while surfing E-bay, I came across > this page. I just had to share this with "someone"... so I guess it will > be my family here. Can you believe that someone is actually "selling" > this? And what's more unbelievable is someone is "BUYING" it!! I knew > it was going on all over the country, but on > "E-BAY"??? > > E-mail Shaman?? I can't help but laugh, even tho it is not funny... it's > sad how so many people will take our native american beliefs that are held > sacred, and make money off of them. It makes me ... nukoa (mad) and > nukhaklo (sad)... the worst thing about this to me, is they probably don't > know the first thing about what they are selling.... I wouldn't be > surprised to learn the only thing this person knows is what they read from > some kooks book that they read! > > I'm sorry, just had to say this to somebody.... let me get off of my soap > box here. > > Markie < still shaking my head in disblief over this one> > > > *****$250.00***** > > SHAMAN APPRENTICE PROGRAM..SERIOUS ONLY! > Item #271981927 > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=271981927 > > >I am a Native American shaman, spiritualist and herbalist. > > > >The Shaman Program is a very elite and special Program, with daily > teachings, lessons and specific instructions. It is not to be entered into > lightly and I will only accept a handful of people for this Program. You > will learn a great deal and experience many things. > > > >You will learn how to recognize, call upon and utilize the energies and > powers from our animal totems to your benefit. How to use herbs and Mother > Earth to heal. You will gain a greater knowledge of your own energies and > spirit. These knowledges and training will transform you! > > > > > >Lessons are transmitted by email each day. These are not > computer-generated; they are one-on-one and individually tailored to your > needs abilities and capabilities. You MUST be prepared to review the > lessons, complete the assignments and tasks and return your "homework" to > me within 24 hours each day! Any questions, please email me PRIOR to > bidding. My references are always available upon request. Please...serious > students only! You must be 18 or older and prove it. Will make exception > for 16 and 17 year-olds with notarized parental consent. > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > Home Page: > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/index.htm > Choctaw Chat: > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/chat.htm > >

--WebTV-Mail-3123-54 Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit Jami & Markie I agree,this is ridiculous. Rita --WebTV-Mail-3123-54 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Message/RFC822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit Received: from mailsorter-101-11.iap.bryant.webtv.net (209.240.198.45) by storefull-278.iap.bryant.webtv.net with WTV-SMTP; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 05:52:38 -0800 (PST) Return-Path: <[email protected]> Received: from bl-10.rootsweb.com (bl-10.rootsweb.com [204.212.38.26]) by mailsorter-101-11.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/ms.dwm.v7+dul2) with ESMTP id FAA21933; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 05:52:36 -0800 (PST) Received: (from [email protected]) by bl-10.rootsweb.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA10827; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 05:52:17 -0800 Resent-Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 05:52:17 -0800 From: [email protected] Message-ID: <[email protected]> Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 08:51:45 EST Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Can you believe what is on E-bay???? Old-To: [email protected] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 67 Resent-Message-ID: <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Resent-From: [email protected] Reply-To: [email protected] X-Mailing-List: <[email protected]> archive/latest/231 X-Loop: [email protected] Precedence: list Resent-Sender: [email protected] Hmmm... I think an email to the seller is in store.... Anyone else care to flood their email box?? This is ridiculous! People like this need to be taught that what they are doing is WRONG and perpetuating a fallacy that can never be upheld by any tribe! Jami ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== To Unsubscribe: Send msg. to [email protected] Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... --WebTV-Mail-3123-54--

send me the ebay address or url or email i want to see this can somebody transfr it all to out chat site ----- Original Message ----- From: Graywolf <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Saturday, March 04, 2000 12:13 PM Subject: Re: [CHAHTA] Can you believe what is on E-bay???? > Markie, > > As sad as it is, there are a number of "professional shaman" schools in > business today; some by Native Americans and many by non-indians. They > advertise in the magazine Shaman's Drum. > > It makes my heart sick inside but Texas and Oklahoma are filled with > non-indian "shamans" who charge people for counseling and healings. Most of > these are women. Woogie Watchetaker, a noted medicine man of the Comanche > Nation told me once that people who take money for sharing the gifts of God > will never go to the land of souls after they cross the river. Woogie could > make rain, heal all sorts of illnesses and bring good fortune for some > people. but he NEVER charged a penny for that. He lived in a little > three-room wooden shotgun house outside of Lawton. Sometimes people would > bring gifts and leave them on his porch at night and sometimes they would > slip a little cash to his wife, but she too never ASKED for any money. And > he was very spiritual. Once we slept alone together on the second floor of > an old army barracks at Fort Hood, Texas before an Indian burial there. I > got up at three in the morning and noticed that he was not in his bed. I > found him on his knees praying in the dark by a window. Compare that with > people who charge to teach people to be "shamans." > > Lucas Graywolf > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Markie" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Saturday, March 04, 2000 4:54 AM > Subject: [CHAHTA] Can you believe what is on E-bay???? > > > > Well Folks, > > > > I just "thought" I had seen it all... while surfing E-bay, I came across > > this page. I just had to share this with "someone"... so I guess it will > > be my family here. Can you believe that someone is actually "selling" > > this? And what's more unbelievable is someone is "BUYING" it!! I knew > > it was going on all over the country, but on > > "E-BAY"??? > > > > E-mail Shaman?? I can't help but laugh, even tho it is not funny... it's > > sad how so many people will take our native american beliefs that are held > > sacred, and make money off of them. It makes me ... nukoa (mad) and > > nukhaklo (sad)... the worst thing about this to me, is they probably don't > > know the first thing about what they are selling.... I wouldn't be > > surprised to learn the only thing this person knows is what they read from > > some kooks book that they read! > > > > I'm sorry, just had to say this to somebody.... let me get off of my soap > > box here. > > > > Markie < still shaking my head in disblief over this one> > > > > > > *****$250.00***** > > > > SHAMAN APPRENTICE PROGRAM..SERIOUS ONLY! > > Item #271981927 > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=271981927 > > > > >I am a Native American shaman, spiritualist and herbalist. > > > > > >The Shaman Program is a very elite and special Program, with daily > > teachings, lessons and specific instructions. It is not to be entered into > > lightly and I will only accept a handful of people for this Program. You > > will learn a great deal and experience many things. > > > > > >You will learn how to recognize, call upon and utilize the energies and > > powers from our animal totems to your benefit. How to use herbs and Mother > > Earth to heal. You will gain a greater knowledge of your own energies and > > spirit. These knowledges and training will transform you! > > > > > > > > >Lessons are transmitted by email each day. These are not > > computer-generated; they are one-on-one and individually tailored to your > > needs abilities and capabilities. You MUST be prepared to review the > > lessons, complete the assignments and tasks and return your "homework" to > > me within 24 hours each day! Any questions, please email me PRIOR to > > bidding. My references are always available upon request. Please...serious > > students only! You must be 18 or older and prove it. Will make exception > > for 16 and 17 year-olds with notarized parental consent. > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > > Home Page: > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/index.htm > > Choctaw Chat: > > http://freepages.cultures.rootsweb.com/~choctaw/chat.htm > > > > > > > ==== CHAHTA Mailing List ==== > To Unsubscribe: > Send msg. to [email protected] > Put "one" word in "body" of message:... "unsubscribe" without the quotes > Nothing in the subject line... Turn off signatures....... > >

Hmmm... I think an email to the seller is in store.... Anyone else care to flood their email box?? This is ridiculous! People like this need to be taught that what they are doing is WRONG and perpetuating a fallacy that can never be upheld by any tribe! Jami