I also have another Nicholas Fry in my family, but he was born in Frederick Maryland (1735) and died in Loudoun County, VA (Sep 10, 1837). Since he was in the Revolution, more documentation is available, but his brother Christian (my ancestor) has less documentation. It is now thought that the father was Hans Jacob Frey who immigrated from Alsace in 1754. Jacob's ancestry is known in Alsace for several generations back, however, the connection between THAT Jacob and the Jacob in Frederick, Maryland is only circumstantial (some of the same passengers on the Halifax also end up in Frederick, MD, including Hans Jacob's brother-in-law). There is a gap of 10 years after the arrival of the Halifax in Philadelphia and the first records (Reformed church) in Frederick, MD. We suspect they spent some time in Lancaster County, MD. There was a regular interchange between the German churches of Lancaster County, Frederick, and North Carolina.

In regard to the latest messages mentioning Nicholas Fry and the German naming system. You never know where these stories come from, but my sources tell me that the occurrence of Johannes/Johan and Anna/Marie or Maria, was supposed to have been in honor of the King and queen at the time and yes it was only an honorarium and was dropped, in everyday use. Of course the dictionary says Hans is Jack, - but before it gets to Jack it is John. Jack is an everyday form of John like Harry is an every day form of Henry. Hans in the Netherlands is Hannes, it becomes John in English usage. As for Nicholas himself, sorry but those little stories on families found in the Heritage Books are written down by folks who remember them from the tales of their elders who heard them from their elders. There is a measure of truth in every one but they need deep researching and lots of latitude so far as accuracy is concerned. Those heritage books and all other biographical sketch type books are often referred to as "Wish Books" - translation "I wish my family were as wonderful/wealthy/flawless as I have depicted here". Most of us could duplicate them with little effort. If anyone ever had a bad moment or a skeleton in the closet, it is never detailed in these books, nothing wrong with thinking well of your family but they are always too good to be true. Folks have been researching Nicholas Fry for generations, his still remains an elusive history. One of the reasons is that some of the records in the southern states have been destroyed or not been made available to examine. Not everyone understands that the pile of papers left by Uncle Julian or great grandmother Hattie could be of any value to the general public or would be willing to share what they consider personal documents. I know how this works, I have learned from personal experience how determined some families to keep family affairs within the family. God willing one of you will untangle this Nicholas Fry mess - and I hope I am aware of it when it happens. Onward and upward! Agnes Cloninger

Thanks Bill, I have seen several different versions of German naming patterns on line. It may all be in which "expert" you believe. I have been told for years that German families would name all their sons, Johannes, Johann, Hans, with the eldest using the name "John", and the rest going by what we would call their middle name. They did the same with girls, sometimes using Anna, and sometimes Mary, and sometimes both. It had something to do with their Lutheran Religion. I would guess that your Dietrich and Heinrich had an older brother Johannes (John). This naming pattern went away after a few generations in this country. My German to English dictionary says that "Hans" in German translates to "Jack" in English. Now I understand why Jack is a nickname for John. We owe that to our German ancetors. Don ----- Original Message ----- From: "candace ramseur" <cramseur@emeraldis.com> To: "Don Claypool" <dc3665@cooketech.net> Sent: Wednesday, January 19, 2005 9:42 PM Subject: Re: [CATAWBA-WEST] Nicholas Fry > Don, I've read a slighty different take of the naming of German speaking > families. They may use the first name in several children and then drop > it and call the child by the second name. > For instance Johannes Dietrich Ramsauer was called Dietrich. Johannes > Heinrich Ramsauer was called Heinrich. If they really wanted to call > the child Johannes then they used that name alone. > I can't remember the source where I read this. > Bill Ramseur

I am trying to make the jump back from Guilford/Orange Co, NC, to Pennsylvania on my Starr family. They were "poor Germans" and hard to trace, therefore I am trying to trace related lines in hopes of running into my Starrs. One branch of the Starrs migrated to Lincoln Co, and married with grandchildren of Nicholas Fry. A friend sent me the info below that was found on-line. >> According to the book, "The Heritage of Catawba County North Carolina," Vol 1 1986,p 159: " When Johannes Nicholaus Frey ( later angelicized to Frye or Fry) arrived in Pa from Rotterdam aboard the ship, Brittania, on September 21,1731,he was 6 years old. He arrived with his father, Johanis (also spelled Johannes) Frey,age 30(born about 1701) and his mother,Johaneva, age 33( born abt 1704). The Freys became part of the Moselem Lutheran Congregation in Berks County." >> According to Moselem Church records, Nicholaus married Maria Elizabetha Pabst (angelicized Bobst/Popst/Pope) in 1744. According to the above book, the children born to this couple were baptized in the Tohicken Reformed Church in Berks Co, PA. The following children's names are found in the book above: >> Hannah,born 1745;Niocholaus,Jr,born 2 February1746;John Jacob,born 28 February 1758; John George,born 10 March 1760; Philip,MAry, Susannah. >> Nicholaus was in NC sometime after1761. He was given a land grant by King George III January 25,1773, of 150 acres in Tryon CountyNC on both sides of the South Fork River. I find a couple of things wrong with the above. First, they have Nicholas marrying when he was 18 or 19 years old. Very possible, but I have found that most German men married between the ages of 25 to 30. Second, they show a son, John Jacob Frey, born 28 Feb 1758 in the Tohickon Reformed Church in Berks Co, NC. The records of the Tohickon Church, which is in BUCKS County, not Berks, shows the son born on the date above listed simply as John Frey. In normal German naming patterns, the name John was given to the eldest son in the family. A son named John Jacob would be baptized that way. I am wondering if the above researcher picked the wrong Nicholas off of ship lists, and, or got the children of two different Nicholas Frys mixed together. Is anyone researching Nicholas Fry of Lincoln Co, NC, who has already figured this out? Thank you, Don

Jan this area includes a number of churches, expecially the old Daniel's Lutheran and Reformed Church. You might find some family there. The Howards Creek area is close to modern day Catawba county. I send to you the Williams' graves at Daniels. This may be no help, butr it can eliminate a graveyard. Edith Ann Williams, wife of Perry Dean Williams, Living in 1982 Paul Williams Feb. 4, 1981 and died the same day, s/of Perry Dean and Edith Ann (Welborn) Williams. No Reynolds, many Seagles. Both the Catawba And Lincoln County Court House will have the death certificates, which will give you the information. Anne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jan Williams" <jxwilliams@earthlink.net> To: <CATAWBA-WEST-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, January 15, 2005 3:12 PM Subject: [CATAWBA-WEST] Cleo Reynolds Williams and Ethel Williams > Cleo Reynolds was born about 1877 and married Edward Sidney Williams > (1882-1947). They lived in the Howard¹s Creek, Lincoln Co., and Jacob¹s > Fork, Catawba Co., areas. One of their children was Ethel Williams, born > about 1912. > > Sid is buried at Bethlehem Baptist Church outside Kings Mountain, NC, but > Cleo is not there. Would appreciate her burial place and dates. Also, > would like any info about Ethel < who she married, burial place, dates. > > Thanks! > > Jan > > > ==== CATAWBA-WEST Mailing List ==== > ==== CATAWBA-WEST Mailing List ==== > Sharing info on the region West of the Catawba River, NC > For further info, see http://www.rootsweb.com/~nccatawb/ > Our thanks to RootsWeb for hosting this list and web page > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.7.0 - Release Date: 1/17/2005 > > -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.7.0 - Release Date: 1/17/2005

Would someone be kind enough to gives me the dates for Robert Lee TAYLOR who is buried in the Eastview Cemetery (7:052). I am not sure my dates are correct. Thank you> Ray

Cleo Reynolds was born about 1877 and married Edward Sidney Williams (1882-1947). They lived in the Howard¹s Creek, Lincoln Co., and Jacob¹s Fork, Catawba Co., areas. One of their children was Ethel Williams, born about 1912. Sid is buried at Bethlehem Baptist Church outside Kings Mountain, NC, but Cleo is not there. Would appreciate her burial place and dates. Also, would like any info about Ethel ‹ who she married, burial place, dates. Thanks! Jan

Shelia, The stagecoach stop was where the old Stamey Store stands.It was called Kitchen's Corner.Hwy 182 which runs east to west by it is named Stagecoach Trl.It also goes through Lawndale and Polkville.I believe it came from Salisbury through Lincolnton and on to Fallston. Dennis "GRAY, SHELIA" wrote: > I grew up in Fallston (tiny town in Upper Cleveland County on Hwy. 18, > between Shelby and Hickory). A wonderful fixture in our little town was > Stamey's store, which stood at the intersection of Hwy. 18 and 182. I > think I heard as a child that the store stood on the site that was once > a stagecoach stop...anyone know if this is historically correct and > where the stagecoach line would have originated? > > I live in Texas now, and have tried to do some research online, etc., > but have been unable to find anything. Shelia > > Shelia D. Gray > Library Specialist for Acquisitions > South Campus Library > Ext. 4108 > > ==== CATAWBA-WEST Mailing List ==== -- Dennis Morgan dmorgan@shelby.net Web Page at: http://dmorgan.home.shelby.net Researching surnames: Morgan,Smith,Hudson,McSwain,Lankford, Hamrick In Cleveland and Rutherford Counties in NC and in Cherokee County in SC. Researching Surnames: Peace,Morris,Pittman,Gosnell, Cantrell in Spartanburg and Greenville Counties in SC.

Hello Ray, The entry in Catawba co., marriages reads: Taylor, William age 21 son of Sidney and Malinda married Moose, Estes age 19 dau of E. A. and Sarah dated 22 Mar 1890 performed by J. M. Brown, Justice of the Peace witnesses W. R. Sims, Y. U. Martin, C. A. Deal. I have more about these couples if you would like to contact me. Estes father was Elkanah Alexander Moose and her mother was Sarah Wike Estes died 30 June 1896 and William David Taylor married second Ellen Susan Setzer, dau of James Noah Setzer and Ellen Malinda Sigmon. That marriage was also in Catawba Co., and took place 19 Dec 1897 about a year after Estes died Agnes C. On 1/14/05 4:00 PM, "CATAWBA-WEST-D-request@rootsweb.com" <CATAWBA-WEST-D-request@rootsweb.com> wrote: > From: "Ray H. Smith" <rsmith2092@carolina.rr.com> > Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2005 13:24:26 -0500 > To: CATAWBA-WEST-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: Catawba County Marriage Lookup > > Would someone be kind enough to look for a marriage between William David > TAYLOR and Estes Lovenia MOOSE on March 22, 1890 in Catawba County, NC. > > Thank You. Ray

I grew up in Fallston (tiny town in Upper Cleveland County on Hwy. 18, between Shelby and Hickory). A wonderful fixture in our little town was Stamey's store, which stood at the intersection of Hwy. 18 and 182. I think I heard as a child that the store stood on the site that was once a stagecoach stop...anyone know if this is historically correct and where the stagecoach line would have originated? I live in Texas now, and have tried to do some research online, etc., but have been unable to find anything. Shelia Shelia D. Gray Library Specialist for Acquisitions South Campus Library Ext. 4108

Would someone be kind enough to look for a marriage between William David TAYLOR and Estes Lovenia MOOSE on March 22, 1890 in Catawba County, NC. Thank You. Ray

It's been quiet here - thought I'd stir up a little ancestral dust... I'm trying to track down more about the John Smith who married Mrs. Elizabeth Fry. I think she is Elizabeth Starr who married Philip Fry. I found the info below posted by Derek on rootsweb and a post-it-note on a John Smith pedigree other than Derek's. I'm still trying to figure out which Philip Fry married Elizabeth Starr. Does anyone have the estate papers for John Smith? (I can go get them if not) Marriage bond - Mrs.Elizabeth Fry and John Smith. (Is this the same John Smith as below?) The bond date was 2 July 1816, witness William Ervin; Ligt Williams (I don't know what Ligt means) The post it note in quotes: "I have traced My GGgrandfather to this family. My GGgrandfathers name is Marcus Lafayette Smith. I found Him in court records as illigitimate child of John Smith. He is also mentioned in the estate records of John Smith Sr with John & other members of this family. Hope to hear from you." posted by esh@mstar2.net (email address no good now) Is it possible that this Elizabeth Smith, bound to Jacob Starr was an illegitimate child born to Elizabeth Starr and John Smith, Sr. prior to her marriage to Philip Fry in 1808? Court of Pleas & Quarter Sessions Lincoln County, North Carolina Pg 53: July 1810 -- Ordered that Elizabeth Smith about four years & six months old be bound unto Jacob Starr who is to give her one year schooling & $20.00 worth of suitable property when of age. Rootsweb - posted by Derek Hartshorn ID: I74 Given Name: John Surname: SMITH Birth: ABT 10 APR 1770 in Lincoln (Catawba) Co., North Carolina Death: 23 NOV 1847 in Catawba County, North Carolina Burial: St. John's Lutheran Ch. Cem., N. of Conover, NC Father: George Adam SMITH (SCHMIDT) b: ABT 1730 in prob. Pennsylvania Mother: Catarina Marriage 1 Catherine MAUSER b: ABT 1780 Married: ABT 1795 Children George ? SMITH b: ABT 1800 Elizabeth SMITH b: 1795 - married Elias Smyre Birth: 25 FEB 1796 in Lincoln Co., NC Death: 6 SEP 1843 Burial: Old Hass Cemetery, Catawba, NC Marriage 1 Elias Smyre b: 1 NOV 1791 in Lincoln Co., NC Married: 1 MAR 1815 in Lincoln Co., NC Mary Magdaline SMITH b: 1798 Catherine SMITH b: ABT 1800 in Lincoln (Catawba) Co., North Carolina David SMITH b: 21 JUN 1803 in Catawba County, North Carolina John SMITH b: 1809 Frederick A SMITH b: 3 JAN 1813 Lena SMITH b: ABT 1815 Annie SMITH b: 1818

I am searching for info on Oscar Dellinger , m. Bessie Pope, d/o Augustus Pope and Catherine Benfield. Bessie b. 1892. In 1910 she was in the household of Augustus Pope, wd, 2 children, Clarence and Fred. This is not the Oscar Dellinger of Avery and Caldwell County, who was s/o Martha, who was d/o of Elcanah Dellinger. I think this Oscar might have been the s/o Jonas Dellinger, but thats just a guess. Any help is appreciated.

The FamilyHart online database was updated over the Christmas hollidays bringing to over 406,000 names online. Thousands of these names are from North and South Carolina especially in the Piedmont areas. You can peruse the database from the following url: _http://midatlantic.rootsweb.com/familyhart/_ (http://midatlantic.rootsweb.com/familyhart/) > < Thanks! Don & Jeanine Hartman FamilyHart _http://midatlantic.rootsweb.com/familyhart/_ (http://midatlantic.rootsweb.com/familyhart/) Administrators for the following lists at Rootsweb: Pennsylvania, PADutchGenONLY, Penna-Dutch, PAYork, PA-York-Gen, MD-Fred-Gen, MDWashin, Burket, Dierdorff, Gotshall, Glattfelder, Hartman, Kohr, Kaufman, Sturm

Civil War Soldiers and Sailors Roster at http://www.itd.nps.gov/cwss/soldiers.htmhttp David Bookout Confederate Infantry 14th Regiment, North Carolina Infantry Harry Erwin wrote: > > Would someone be kind enough to check the NC Civil War Rosters to > see if David H. > > Bookout served in this unit? Thank You > >

Would someone be kind enough to check the NC Civil War Rosters to see if David H. Bookout served in this unit? Thank You

I found and old post from Lin Hillis but it is no longer an active email. They were looking for James Pitillo who married Susan Ward in 1801 Lincoln Co. Margaret Ikerd daughter of George Ikerd who had an Illegitimate child with James Pitillo, Jacob Scronce who married Susan Summey and Emoline Schronce who married Jessie Potillo born 1826 son of James and Margaret Ikerd. If you are still working on any of these lines please contact me. I am also looking for James Pitillo I have reason to believe he could be the father of another child of Margaret Ikerd. Please any help at all on this Pitillo/Petillo lines is most appreciated. Thanks

I use LDS Paf files and have for some time. I thoroughly enjoy using this program, Its easy to learn, very easy to use. And as someone said, you can't beat the price. Charles L.

What we use as a Gen program is partly dictated by what brand of computer we have, how much ram/ hard drive we have, as well as what operating system we have installed. I use a MAC, and although there are a number of programs available I use Reunion and have for many years. I always keep both my Reunion and my Operating System current. Some programs are free for the down-loading - the LDS Church has PAF that is available free on line last time I looked. It is a PC only program, although it once served the Apple crowd also. It used to be quite a decent format and you cannot beat the price. You also cannot bead the probability that it will continue to be available and be upgraded. Always consider that some programs disappear or fail to be supported. It is important that you have easy access to competent support, and that upgrades match the upgrades in software that continue to evolve. Oh Yes, need not be a member of the Mormon church to use PAF it works equally well for those of us who are not members. Agnes C. On 12/19/04 9:00 AM, "CATAWBA-WEST-D-request@rootsweb.com" <CATAWBA-WEST-D-request@rootsweb.com> wrote: > From: FORTENBERR@aol.com > Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 16:30:46 EST > To: CATAWBA-WEST-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: Computer Program > > I would like information about the latest computer programs people are using > for geneology work, more specifically about the Rootsmagic geneology program. > > Thanks > -Gary > > ____________________________

At 04:30 PM 12/18/2004, FORTENBERR@aol.com wrote: >I would like information about the latest computer programs people are using >for geneology work, more specifically about the Rootsmagic geneology program. > >Thanks >-Gary Hi Gary, all, Try GOOGLE and search for "genealogy software." RootsMagic (the one I use) can be found and described at www.rootsmagic.com. --Derick