Beginning with 1855, the New York State censuses ask that the county of birth be supplied for those born in New York. State censuses seldom have a general index, and New York is no exception; but its 1865 and 1875 censuses for Cattaraugus Co. have been indexed locally and the results put online. If you order FHL films 584487 and 584491, you'll find the family of Charles Carpenter on pages 22 and 551, respectively. Have you checked local and county histories, obituaries in local/county newspapers, etc.? Using the Cattaraugus Grantee Index (you might also look in the Mortgagor Index), you could identify the volume/page numbers of deeds of purchases (and mortgages) by Charles Carpenter of land in Cattaraugus Co. Then check the relevant record volumes to see if the earliest (not necessarily the first-recorded) deed or mortgage indicates Charles's former place of residence. The indexes and record volumes are available on FHL film. It's an outside shot, but you should also check Cattaraugus Co. probate records for both Charles and Harriet. Sometimes you learn things you don't expect. As a general research principle, find out all you can about Charles and Harriet from all conceivable sources. If you haven't already checked it, perhaps their son Arthur's death certificate gives his parents' respective places of birth. If all else fails and you know the identity of any of Charles's or Harriet's siblings, you might try researching one of them. You might also see if you can find a link to the surname DeVere. But before you try anything else, check the state census films mentioned above. Gene Z. In a message dated 4/5/2005 4:00:40 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, Joyce Sharpley writes: Charles Carpenter b. 15 Nov 1830 in NY, d. 20 Nov 1888 in Cattaraugus Co. NY and is buried in the East Randolph Cemetery, Maple Hill cemetery. He married Harriet A. Palmer b. 22 Dec 1840 in NY. They had 2 sons, Clayton b. 1862 in Randolph, Cattaraugus, NY and d. 1863 and is buried in the East Randolph cem. Also. The second child was Arthur DeVere Carpenter b. 13 Sep 1866 in Napoli, Cattaraugus, NY, d. 4 Aug 1958 in Seattle, King, WA. Charles was a marble sculptor/cutter. I sent for his death certificate last September and finally received my response last week. The report was, that there is no record of his death. I even called the office and they pulled the records for that year to double check for me. I am very disappointed of course. Does anyone know another way I can find the parents of Charles Carpenter. There are several Charles Carpenters born in New York the same age as my ggrandfather. I've checked the census records. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.