Sounds like a Y-DNA test would be very useful in this case especially since the DNA databases have a lot of samples from Britain and Ireland Rory -----Original Message----- From: Ironywaves [mailto:ironywaves@knology.net] Sent: 27 March 2003 05:06 To: CARIBBEAN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Irish Slaves Wayne? Are you still out there? I'd like to have a sit down if you see this... Will Dockery http://groups.yahoo.com/group/temple_ofisis From: Wayne Dockery As a Jamaican of Irish decent (last name=Dockery, orignally O'Dockery), I would have liked to trace back in any available records to see when and where my ancestors came from. However, no one in my family claims to know anything about my paternal grandfather other than his first name. No one knows how many generations back his people came from Ireland. However, from what I gather from my parents and aunts/uncle, the majority of Irish "slaves" or indentured servants primarily went to Jamaica and Barbados as well as Grenada. There was also a major influx of Irish into Jamaica during the Potatoe Famine when everyone wanted to go to Jamaica to make their wealth in the sugar, spice, and grain- alcohol industries (i.e., Rum). On 21 Nov 1996 06:38:21 -0800, Daniel Smothergill wrote: >Cromwell, after thoroughly drubbing Ireland in the mid-1600's, enslaved >hundreds, perhaps thousands, of Irish men and women and shipped them >to the West Indies. The principal destinations appear to have been >Jamaica and Barbados, but it is likely that some went to the other >islands controlled by England as well. > >What ever happened to these Irish slaves? Does anyone know whether >some went to Tortolla? > >There is sporadic discussion of Irish Slaves in the West Indies >on soc.genealogy. UK + Ireland. Check it out. From: Madeleine Mitchell The Irish Slaves supposedly sent by Cromwell to the West Indies keeps cropping up every two months or so. In Jamaica, in 1662, the population was 3,653 whites and 522 negroes. If Cromwell had sent 50,000 women and children to Jamaica by 1660 when James II ascended to the throne, I would have expected a much greater population in 1662. Further these were supposed to be women. The ratio of men to women in Jamaica was about 2:1 at this time. Furthur my understanding is that Cromwell proposed (although no-one seems to able to verify that he actually did), to send 1000 Irish women to Jamaica not 50,000, along with Scots and English convicts to populate the island. There are very few Irish names in the early parish records of Jamaica. One would have to postulate that they all died, if they got there, or that the even with an extreme shortage of women in the island, none of the men secured these women as wives. Further if these were women how would Irish surnames descend? For later Irish immigration to Jamaica, post-emancipation in 1834, see an article by Carl H. Senior. *Robert Kerr emigrants of 1840: Irish "Slaves" for Jamaica* Jamaica Journal #42 pp 104-116, 1978. These were indentured servants hired to replace the freed slaves, and promised land upon the end of serviture. They numbered in the 100's not thousands. The scheme to hire Europeans (Germans, Scots, Portuguese) after slavery was abolished was a dismal failure. Madeleine From: Dan_Smothergill I believe that there was a true difference between Irish slaves and indentured servants. The slaves were truly slaves; owned by their masters. Several postings on soc. geealogy. UK + Ireland give references to 17th century Irish being forced into slavery and deported to the West Indies by the conquering English. Apparently, hundreds, perhaps thousands, of Irish women were sent to Jamaica as slaves.That was just one of many similar instances. Unfortunately, I haven't been able thus far to come across any good primary references. Indentured servants, in contrast, agreed to work for a period of time at their new location in return for their employer having paid their fare to come over. My own ancestors from County Cavan, Ireland somehow wound up on St. Johns, Danish West Indies in 1840. That is what had motivated my own interest in the question. A friend of mine has told me of a dissertation that was done by a Jesuit priest on the "Black Irish" that resulted from these Irish slaves mixing with African slaves. As soon as he comes up with further information, I will post it. Maria Markham Thompson I believe that one West Indian island which had a large influx of Irish settlers was Montserrat: whether these were Cromwellian deportees or not I have no idea. Is there anyone out there from Montserrat who might shed more light? The usual term for European "slaves" was "Indentured" workers. The term of indenture was often seven years, after which I believe it was possible to regain free status. -- ********************************************************************** ==== CARIBBEAN Mailing List ==== ROOTSWEB MAILING LIST HELP PAGES What is a Mailing List? http://helpdesk.rootsweb.com/help/mail1.html