i've just discovered this in my in-box and am a little concerened... How did it get onto the list? -----Original Message----- From: Hal.Turner@HalTurnerShow.com [mailto:Hal.Turner@HalTurnerShow.com] Sent: 18 September 2002 15:06 To: CARIBBEAN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: READ THE ONLY SITE THAT HAS THE GUTS TO CALL FOR THE MURDER OF JEWS AND BLACKS READ THE ONLY WEB-SITE THATS NOT AFRAID TO ADVOCATE THE ELIMINATION OF KIKES AND NIGGERS. www.halturnershow.com Harold C. Turner 1906 Paterson Plank Rd. North Bergen, New Jersey 201-348-8449 Hal.Turner@HalTurnerShow.com Hey Roberta will kick the fork, and if Pete stupidly dines it too, the pen will hate beside the polite sign. Dilbert, for pools hot and fresh, orders in it, departing quickly. It can partially solve shallow and expects our new, fat balls about a hall. Try creeping the moon's difficult cloud and Edwina will reject you! How does Geoffrey change so crudely, whenever Doris receives the wet envelope very finally? What will you smell the glad sad onions before Kathy does? Don't try to wander the twigs hourly, clean them familiarly. We measure them, then we admiringly grasp Jezebel and Bert's raw tailor. She'd rather improve unbelievably than mould with Roxanne's cosmetic carrot. There, go recommend a potter! The papers, trees, and sauces are all pathetic and deep. As inadvertently as Sherry looks, you can pour the walnut much more simply. I was sowing farmers to wide Clint, who's answering before the shopkeeper's desert. Patty calls, then Raoul lazily seeks a outer card throughout Zachary's bathroom. While kettles smartly fill goldsmiths, the teachers often move with the rich sauces. Ralf's boat lives about our can after we walk behind it. For Jason the printer's strange, beneath me it's angry, whereas with you it's combing unique. Better irritate plates now or Pam will nearly promise them over you. One more bitter dust or highway, and she'll tamely pull everybody. Some desks nibble, join, and love. Others hatefully taste. Don't even try to tease globally while you're opening outside a younger sticker. I am absolutely healthy, so I laugh you. The think lemon rarely plays Bert, it converses Edwina instead. ==== CARIBBEAN Mailing List ==== ROOTSWEB MAILING LIST HELP PAGES What is a Mailing List? http://helpdesk.rootsweb.com/help/mail1.html

Contact these people about that. They may be able to help or provide information about the source. <A HREF="http://www.tolerance.org/teach/index.jsp">Tolerance.org: Teaching Tolerance Home</A> Pauline

Lisa, Thanks for the info. My de Freitas line didn't arrive in Trinidad until the turn of the century, so I don't think there's any relation to your Sebastian. Thanks again, Dean ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lisa" <ljj5@optonline.net> To: <CARIBBEAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, April 18, 2003 8:56 AM Subject: Re: Defreitas in Grenada > Dean, > > I know that Sebastian was a well used DeFreitas name - however - I came > across a DeFrietas "vaguely" related to my Johnsons in Barbados, though the > family had moved on to Trini at some point. It is from World Gen Web & not > confirmed by me : > > My G-grandmother was a Johnson - married to a Clarke in Barbados. My > grandmother's brother's second wife (!) was also a Johnson. Plodding around > to see what became of them, I came across her cousin in Trinidad (who > knew?). His name was Victor Colin Anthony Johnson, and he married an Edith > Florence Sheppard . She was apparently the daughter of Charles Sebastian > Sheppard b.1884, son of Alfred Sheppard, possibly England, and Virginia > DeFrietas, she the daughter of a Sebastian DeFrietas - wife unknown. The > info on World Gen Web doesn't have where he was from and dates are just > approx from working backwards, giving 25 yrs a generation ( just a guess) > I'd say Sebastian was b around 1820 ???. > > Lisa > > > > ==== CARIBBEAN Mailing List ==== > all messages posted to CARIBBEAN-L are archived at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/ > Before posting a query, see if the question has already been asked >

----- Original Message ----- From: "Lisa" <ljj5@optonline.net> To: <CARIBBEAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, April 18, 2003 8:56 AM Subject: Re: Defreitas in Grenada > Dean, > > I know that Sebastian was a well used DeFreitas name - however - I came > across a DeFrietas "vaguely" related to my Johnsons in Barbados, though the > family had moved on to Trini at some point. It is from World Gen Web & not > confirmed by me : > > My G-grandmother was a Johnson - married to a Clarke in Barbados. My > grandmother's brother's second wife (!) was also a Johnson. Plodding around > to see what became of them, I came across her cousin in Trinidad (who > knew?). His name was Victor Colin Anthony Johnson, and he married an Edith > Florence Sheppard . She was apparently the daughter of Charles Sebastian > Sheppard b.1884, son of Alfred Sheppard, possibly England, and Virginia > DeFrietas, she the daughter of a Sebastian DeFrietas - wife unknown. The > info on World Gen Web doesn't have where he was from and dates are just > approx from working backwards, giving 25 yrs a generation ( just a guess) > I'd say Sebastian was b around 1820 ???. > > Lisa >

Does any-one have a copy of these maps? Please let me know. Thanks. (1) A new and accurate map of Bermudas or Sommer's Islands: taken from an actual survey; wherein the errors of former charts are corrected; An accurate map of the Island of St. Christopher, vulgarly called St. Kitts. Containing all the towns, parishes and forts etc. Author: Emanuel Bowen. Published London 1750. (2) A new and exact map of St. Kitts in America: according to an actual and accurate survey made in the year 1753. Describing the several parishes, wit their respective limits, contents, & churches; also the high ways, the situation of every gentleman's plantation, mills, and houses; with rivers, and guts. Likewise the bays, roads, rocks, shoals and soundings that surround the whole. Authors: Samuel Baker, J. Mynde, Carington Bowles. Robert Wilkinson. Published London 1753

Dear Jim, Thanks for the response. I am a descendant of all of the French settler families of Saint-Barthelemy; that is the families LaPlace, (my mother's direct family), Greaux, Bernier, Brin, and Questel, as well as others. My interest is in a sojourn that some of the families from the Windward Side of St-Barths took to St.Vincent in about 1750 to 1770. These Windward folks, including some LaPlaces, came back from St.Vincent with a new language - Guadeloupe Creole, as well as slaves that they may not have had before. I am doing a general family history Jim so St-Barths activity is of interest. You can see a bit of my work at: Hometown.aol.coom/CLoeber/Index.html (no www) (no 2nd page). Thanks for anything. Charles Loeber in New York City

Holy Saturday Richard, I have had two fantastic replies to my query. One dumped a load of information on the Barbados Springhams in my lap and now yours has helped to put everything into perspective. It is exactly the kind of orientation I need to deal with this unfamilar area. I really want to thank you for the time it took to write up and I can assure you that it was worth it. You have a very happy researcher on this end. I can now look at one particular Springham line as the likely source of this Barbados crew. It also looks like you are right. John Springham did obtain land on the island, 22 acres in the census of 1679. Since his son went into the Royal Navy it is a good guess that the father did also. I wonder where he picked up his medical knowledge. I've read there were no medical schools and it was done by apprenticeship at this time. It is another thing to learn about. God Bless John Paul Richard Allicock wrote: >Hi John, > >Just thought to would deal with your: "how John wound up so far from home?" >and "what would John the Elder have been doing there at the time?" Your >ancestor's connection to the gentry and to the merchant class goes along way >to explain why John Springham ended up in Barbados. > >There are two things to know about the English Gentry and other landed >families. The first was the importance of Land and the institution of >Primogeniture. > >Land for a long time had been a source of wealth and status. Long before the >1660's land was the most important item sold/bought/traded in England. Among >the deeds of many families could be found deeds to several parcels of land >in as many counties. This pointed to the need for more land, and >colonisation abroad served the end of land acquisition and a possibility of >land ownership, with the same status of land-owner, with lots of servants in >a manor-like house. > >The problem abroad was that the land owned was a plantation and the servants >were first bonded/indentured British labourers, sentenced to transportation >abroad for some petty theft or even vagrancy, and after the early years of >colonisation, the labourers became mostly enslaved Africans transported to >places like the West Indies. So the attempt to ape the British Landed Class >by other Britishers for long produced/supported a system of bonded service >and slavery. > >And who were the ones that were in the vanguard of those aping the Landed >British Classes? These were the sons of that class that were shut out of >inheritance of the land and manor by the system of Primogeniture, i.e., the >inheritance of property by the first born son, or next in line. As such the >other sons basically had to fend for themselves, by going into the army, the >clergy, the navy or professions like lawyer and Doctor, or the service of >other Gentry and gentlemen and the Aristocracy, as Secretaries, tutors, >managers of affairs etc. or as gentlemen settlers abroad. They were also >able to marry into a developing merchant class which served to put money in >the hands of the landless sons of the Landed Classes, (of Gentry and >Aristocracy) which enabled them to live like gentlemen. In return the >merchants and their daughters acquired status, plus an entree to the >power-holders in British society - the landed classes. > >As a doctor in the West Indies, John would have been able to make a good >living from treating other Europeans and the multitude of slaves on the >plantations. That is, if he did not succumb to drink and debauchery and >ended up a very poor human being, unworthy of status and respect. I think >that by relative rarity as a Doctor abroad, he would have had a higher >status than at home, where he would have also been a barber, and a surgeon, >sawing of limbs. > >There would also have been more opportunity to make money, through making >his own medicines. In his spare time, with the money he acquired, he could >invest in some business scheme or other. Many opportunities would be >available in importing the fineries in fashion at home, be it wines, alcohol >or clothes, books etc. or taking shares in companies trading in this part of >the world or others, in spices, or even in enslaved Africans, or speculating >in land in the colony or other colonies. > >I hope this serves to answer your questions some-what. > >Best regards, >Richard Allicock, >Toronto, Canada >----- Original Message ----- >From: "John Paul Bradford" <johnpaul.bradford@sympatico.ca> >To: <CARIBBEAN-L@rootsweb.com> >Sent: Thursday, April 17, 2003 7:12 PM >Subject: New To List - SPRINGHAMS in Barbadoes > > >>Holy Thursday >> >>Just came across a distant branch of the family which settled in >>Barbados. John SPRINGHAM married Sarah Berry in 1663. He is referred to >>as "Doctor". I have the will of one son, also a John and also a doctor >>in the Royal Navy. Is it likely that I will find additional information >>on these people beyond the parish records? Also, could anyone take a >>guess as to how they wound up so far from home? What would John the >>Elder have been doing there at that time? The area is new to me. Just >>starting to scan through histories of Barbados on line. Not much there. >>Most SPRINGHAMS in England were not exactly upwardly mobile but one >>branch became involved in trade in the 1550's and seems to have produced >>some important merchants over the next century and marrying into some >>gentry families. Anyone able to hazard a guess as to what status >>"Doctor" Springham might have had? >> >>God Bless >> >>John Paul Bradford >> >> >> >>==== CARIBBEAN Mailing List ==== >>all messages posted to CARIBBEAN-L are archived at >> >http://archiver.rootsweb.com/ > >>Before posting a query, see if the question has already been asked >> >> > > >==== CARIBBEAN Mailing List ==== >all messages posted to CARIBBEAN-L are archived at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/ >Before posting a query, see if the question has already been asked > >

I revisited this site,, and though I can't speak Portugeuse where I found some interesting notes. that I could decipher..I did see deFreitas as Regional Secretaries etc. but the one thing that really got my attention was that I saw at "Base de Dados do Reister de Casarents". was the Fiche Tenica: listing a Luis de Souza Melo (Registstas do Funchals. You might remember my efforts on the our site of trying to find a connection between our great grandfather Sebastian deFreitas and a Sophia Mariea deSouza who was mentioned in his Will of 1887 was his wife.. only time we ever knew what her name was....so this tells me I might be close to locating deSouza's there also at some time.. Thanks for the little clues you all send.. I might actually find her someday!! ---- Lenora- From: <Alfalu@aol.com> To: <CARIBBEAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, April 18, 2003 6:00 PM Subject: Madeira Exiles > Check out Madeira Exiles <A HREF="http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~madeira/">Welcome to Madeira Exiles</A> > > > ==== CARIBBEAN Mailing List ==== > ROOTSWEB MAILING LIST HELP PAGES > What is a Mailing List? > http://helpdesk.rootsweb.com/help/mail1.html

Hi Charles, There were many French inhabitants in early St. Vincent. QUESTEL is of interest as there were several connections to my family. What are some of the first names and decades of the QUESTELs you are researching? Jim C. ----- Original Message ----- From: <CLoeber@aol.com> To: <CARIBBEAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, April 18, 2003 8:55 AM Subject: Re: St. Vincent French??? > Richard, > > Are any French surnames of St.Vincent in the late 18C known to you? - such > as Bernier, Questel, LaPlace and Brin? These are families that came from > Saint-Barthelemy. > > Thanks for any comments. > > Charles Loeber in New York City

Hi Listers A searchable archive is available at :- http://listsearches.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/listsearch.pl?list=CARIBBEAN Jim C. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nevilla E. Ottley" <clasebon@erols.com> To: <CARIBBEAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, April 18, 2003 10:58 PM Subject: Re: archives > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/CARIBBEAN > > Garcia-Sibley wrote: > > >What is the web address of the Caribbean-L archives? > >Thanks, > >Joan > > > > > > > ==== CARIBBEAN Mailing List ==== > For information on individual islands, research aids, island bulletin boards or history please visit the CaribbeanGenWeb project at > http://www.rootsweb.com/~caribgw/ >

Hi John, Just thought to would deal with your: "how John wound up so far from home?" and "what would John the Elder have been doing there at the time?" Your ancestor's connection to the gentry and to the merchant class goes along way to explain why John Springham ended up in Barbados. There are two things to know about the English Gentry and other landed families. The first was the importance of Land and the institution of Primogeniture. Land for a long time had been a source of wealth and status. Long before the 1660's land was the most important item sold/bought/traded in England. Among the deeds of many families could be found deeds to several parcels of land in as many counties. This pointed to the need for more land, and colonisation abroad served the end of land acquisition and a possibility of land ownership, with the same status of land-owner, with lots of servants in a manor-like house. The problem abroad was that the land owned was a plantation and the servants were first bonded/indentured British labourers, sentenced to transportation abroad for some petty theft or even vagrancy, and after the early years of colonisation, the labourers became mostly enslaved Africans transported to places like the West Indies. So the attempt to ape the British Landed Class by other Britishers for long produced/supported a system of bonded service and slavery. And who were the ones that were in the vanguard of those aping the Landed British Classes? These were the sons of that class that were shut out of inheritance of the land and manor by the system of Primogeniture, i.e., the inheritance of property by the first born son, or next in line. As such the other sons basically had to fend for themselves, by going into the army, the clergy, the navy or professions like lawyer and Doctor, or the service of other Gentry and gentlemen and the Aristocracy, as Secretaries, tutors, managers of affairs etc. or as gentlemen settlers abroad. They were also able to marry into a developing merchant class which served to put money in the hands of the landless sons of the Landed Classes, (of Gentry and Aristocracy) which enabled them to live like gentlemen. In return the merchants and their daughters acquired status, plus an entree to the power-holders in British society - the landed classes. As a doctor in the West Indies, John would have been able to make a good living from treating other Europeans and the multitude of slaves on the plantations. That is, if he did not succumb to drink and debauchery and ended up a very poor human being, unworthy of status and respect. I think that by relative rarity as a Doctor abroad, he would have had a higher status than at home, where he would have also been a barber, and a surgeon, sawing of limbs. There would also have been more opportunity to make money, through making his own medicines. In his spare time, with the money he acquired, he could invest in some business scheme or other. Many opportunities would be available in importing the fineries in fashion at home, be it wines, alcohol or clothes, books etc. or taking shares in companies trading in this part of the world or others, in spices, or even in enslaved Africans, or speculating in land in the colony or other colonies. I hope this serves to answer your questions some-what. Best regards, Richard Allicock, Toronto, Canada ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Paul Bradford" <johnpaul.bradford@sympatico.ca> To: <CARIBBEAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, April 17, 2003 7:12 PM Subject: New To List - SPRINGHAMS in Barbadoes > Holy Thursday > > Just came across a distant branch of the family which settled in > Barbados. John SPRINGHAM married Sarah Berry in 1663. He is referred to > as "Doctor". I have the will of one son, also a John and also a doctor > in the Royal Navy. Is it likely that I will find additional information > on these people beyond the parish records? Also, could anyone take a > guess as to how they wound up so far from home? What would John the > Elder have been doing there at that time? The area is new to me. Just > starting to scan through histories of Barbados on line. Not much there. > Most SPRINGHAMS in England were not exactly upwardly mobile but one > branch became involved in trade in the 1550's and seems to have produced > some important merchants over the next century and marrying into some > gentry families. Anyone able to hazard a guess as to what status > "Doctor" Springham might have had? > > God Bless > > John Paul Bradford > > > > ==== CARIBBEAN Mailing List ==== > all messages posted to CARIBBEAN-L are archived at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/ > Before posting a query, see if the question has already been asked > >

On Fri, 18 Apr 2003 14:48:14 -0400 (EDT), RichardBond@webtv.net (Richard Bond) wrote: > There is a publshed Hugo Larsen collection available which overlaps >yours. > Do you have any reference to this collection? I would be more than happy to know. The MAPes MONDe Galleries in St. Thomas (www.mapesmonde.com) sells reproductions of two of Hugo Larsen's paintings. This is the only other Hugo Larsen resource on the Internet that I know of. This is not the one you have in mind, is it? -- Jan Tuxen mailto:jan.tuxen@get2net.dk http://www.tuxen.info/

http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/CARIBBEAN Garcia-Sibley wrote: >What is the web address of the Caribbean-L archives? >Thanks, >Joan >

Check out Madeira Exiles <A HREF="http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~madeira/">Welcome to Madeira Exiles</A>

Check out this link about the Portuguese from Madeira Audrey

What is the web address of the Caribbean-L archives? Thanks, Joan --

I am researching the life and works of the Danish painter Hugo Larsen (1875-1950). He spent 4 years in the Danish West Indies (now US Virgin Islands) from 1904 until 1908 and made some of his best art during this period. He spent most of his time in St. Thomas and St. Croix, but he is also known to have visited St. Martin, Cuba, Mexico and USA. Hugo Larsen was an impressionist and realist, painting and drawing what he saw, not adding or subtracting anything. I believe that most of his oil paintings were brought back to Europe, but he also made quite a number of charming pencil and charcoal drawings of the local population. Hoping that some of his works were sold to local people and are still preserved by the descendants, I am asking for your help to find as many as possible of his pieces of art. My goal is to build a virtual gallery on the Internet of Hugo Larsens works. This is a completely non-commercial activity. If you are interested in seeing what I have achieved so far, you are most welcome to visit the gallery at http://www.tuxen.info/hugo_larsen/gallery.htm I would be grateful to receive any information about Hugo Larsen and his works. I also hope you will forgive me for this slightly off-topic message. -- Jan Tuxen mailto:jan.tuxen@get2net.dk http://www.tuxen.info/

Hi Lisa, I looked at the Barbados records a few years ago, but at the time I did not take the "E" variations seriously. However, now that you mention the connection to Saer and Sairs, I will take a second look. While Syer was also the name of Syer Allicock, which I found in the Northamptonshire records, it is also a surname of his mother, who was a Syers. So this might warrant some looking into. Thanks for your speculation. Best regards, Richard ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lisa" <ljj5@optonline.net> To: <CARIBBEAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, April 18, 2003 6:56 AM Subject: Re: Allicock&families,St.Kitts&environs, UK,US,Guyana > Richard, > > I would suggest also in Barbados that you look at "E" variations - Ellicott, > Ellacott. The unusual given name also leads me to speculate on the Saer > family (Sair etc.) and possible connections there. Quickly browsing Sanders > I found a Croxon will which includes both Ellacott's and Sairs. The Croxon > family married into the Cleavers - > Regards, > Lisa > > > > ==== CARIBBEAN Mailing List ==== > ROOTSWEB MAILING LIST HELP PAGES > What is a Mailing List? > http://helpdesk.rootsweb.com/help/mail1.html > >

There is a publshed Hugo Larsen collection available which overlaps yours.

Richard, I would suggest also in Barbados that you look at "E" variations - Ellicott, Ellacott. The unusual given name also leads me to speculate on the Saer family (Sair etc.) and possible connections there. Quickly browsing Sanders I found a Croxon will which includes both Ellacott's and Sairs. The Croxon family married into the Cleavers - Regards, Lisa