I am new to this list and am searching for elusive ancestors from the canal era. Owen Ryan, born Ireland, appears to have been working on the Delaware and Chesapeake Canal when his son John was born 01 November 1825 in MD. John later moved to Douglassville, PA where he married Margaret Irey and was a boatman on the Schuylkill Canal. Can anyone tell me where are the best places to research information on the Owen Ryan and other canal workers/boatman of this era and in this region? Thanks, Colleen Ryan Beener

Just a thought - could this be the North Staffordshire Railway? Gus Tysoe Droitwich -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] <[email protected]> To: [email protected] <[email protected]> Date: 13 April 2000 12:53 Subject: [CANAL-PEOPLE] NSR Wharf, Burslem, Staffordshire > >Can anyone help me with what NSR Wharf is? I know where Burslem is, but would >like an exact location if possible of NSR Wharf, hopefully something of it >still exists so that I may photograph it on my next journey home. > >

Hi all, I have an ancestor who according to the 1881 census lived at NSR Wharf, Burslem, Staffordshire with his family, he is listed as a porter. Can anyone help me with what NSR Wharf is? I know where Burslem is, but would like an exact location if possible of NSR Wharf, hopefully something of it still exists so that I may photograph it on my next journey home. Cheers, Jim Thompson.

I am a new subscriber to the List and wonder if there is anyone with connections to the Commander family. Briefly Robert Commander b 1835 Worcester apparently worked on the canals. His brother George Commander owned The Prince of Wales Robert's son George Robert worked the canals before settling in Wales early 1900's. If anyone has a connection or would like further details please contact me. Kind regards Ann Cape Town

I thought the following may be of interest to some of you. The 1871 Reading census shows Joseph EACOTT as a Publican of the " Jack of Newbury", Bridge Street, Reading. Lodgers include: Goerge ? Cocks 56 Miller Berks Robert Stone ?18 Coal labourer East Hundred Berks James Bartholomew ?18 " " George Wilkins 24 " Wantage Berks ?Aeron Gough 18 " " Joseph Bowles 40 Sawyers labourer " John Wilton 72 Traveller in Fancy Goods London George Wicks 45 Coal labourer Wilts Alfred Rim or Prim 53 Journeyman Painter Kingston on Thames Sidney " 12 " Albert Gough 20 Journeyman Plumber Wantage Berks Richard Whitehouse 43 Waterman Reading Berks Joseph Eacott is also shown as Boatowner and Master of the Vessels "Victoria" and "Napoleon" "Victoria" James Emans 56 Waterman Melksham Wilts Thomas King 54 Waterman Devizes Wilts "Napoleon". John Cornick 20 Waterman Seend Wilts The boats are at Canal Wharf, Bridge Street Reading. Sylvia Ford [email protected]

Hi all, I just want to introduce myself, I am Jim Thompson from Northwich, Cheshire, UK now residing in Orlando, Florida USA. I am researching the HOOLE family of Wincham, Cheshire & Etruria, Staffordshire as can be seen both are on the Trent & Mersey. My great great-grandfather John HOOLE was a boatman as was his father, they were from Wincham, in the 1881 census John HOOLE was residing at Drawbridge Cottage, Etruria Vale Shelton, Staffordshire and listed as a lock keeper. I haven't checked to see if he is alive on the 1891 census yet, but his wife Eliza died 25 AUG 1887 at the same address as on the 1881 census. The burial was listed as Stoke Church. If anyone is familiar with this location in Etruria or Stoke as it is perhaps now part of, I would love to hear from you. I am also going to need to find a volunteer to possibly check the GRO for John HOOLEs death, after I see whether he is on the 1891 census. What registration district would be correct for Etruria? I have a few nice canal photos of locks near Nantwich if anyone has ancestors from this area, I would be glad to scan them. Cheers, Jim Thompson.

Hello Barry... Thank your for the information. Chalford and Oxford are a little distant from the homebases of my people but could be a connection. Grfthr. THOMAS PEARCE was a lockmaster/toll tax collector at/nr Dudley c.1885 - 1935. Another couple of names into the list! JWP

If anyone is researching these names I came across the following entry in the 1851 census for Lechlade. Boat in dock WYATT Alan 43 Barge Master Oxford Ann 35 Chalford PEARCE Robert Servant 13 Boatman's Boy Chalford Paddy Treves

Hi Sharon, While knowing nothing, I regret, of your SPENCERs, I do know Newhall Street in Birmingham, which still exists, and includes the Post Office Tower amongst other notable buildings. And a flight of locks runs beneath it, which establishes a canal connection of a sort. You say you've found young Philip in the 1881 Census - but on looking at the National Index, there are 21 Philip SPENCERs, including 2 Philip G's who were born (nominally) in 1861 and 1863. The Census was taken on 3 April - and Philip Gell was baptised 8 June 1862 in Derbyshire. The one you quote the details of, however said he was born in Shropshire. But the other was born at CRICK (sic), Derbyshire... HIS details are: Dwelling: 124 Merton Bank Lane Census Place: Parr, Lancashire, England Source: FHL Film 1341894 PRO Ref RG11 Piece 3737 Folio 140 Page 60 Marr Age Sex Birthplace Joseph PARKES M 33 M Wheelock, Cheshire, England Rel: Head; Occ: Fish Dealer Sarah PARKES M 31 F Middleton, Derby, England Rel: Wife; Occ: Wife Fish Dealer Sarah PARKES U 5 F Alltopp, York, England Rel: Daur; Occ: Scholar Mary PARKES U 2 F Hollingwood, Lancashire, England Rel: Daur Philip G. SPENCER U 20 M Crick, Derby, England I suspect this one is yours - but you'll still need to look at the actual Census Film for both of them, as the Index doesn't always include everything the enumerator wrote down.... As far as the 1881 Census Index is concerned, there were 313 SPENCERs were born in Derbyshire betweeen 1855 and 1865 - and of the 238 of them who were still there in 1881 there were none born at Crich / Crich Carr... (But, rather oddly, at least 3 were born at Newhall!) Furthermore, between 1820 and 1840 there were 243 Thomases and 505 Marys born in the UK, which makes searching for his parents - always assuming they were still alive anyway - quite an undertaking. Not impossible, but way beyond the scope of a simple look-up request. Again, it would seem that you've only got Philip's baptism from the IGI, whi ch, even more than the Census Index, is likely to contain errors, as well as being incomplete. But did your looker-up only look at the Derbyshire fiches? You need to see the actual entry in the Parish's baptisms register, which will - or should - give his father's occupation and an indication of his address. It may even give his date and place of birth, too, if you're VERY lucky. And the the General Register Office's Index of births could well include him - but not necessarily, as it didn't become compulsory enough to warrant a fine for non-registration until around 1875 - quite possibly in a totally different area IF his parents were travelling Boatmen. And you'll need to buy the certificate, too... HTH Gus Tysoe Droitwich, Worcs Linear-Salt-Lake City -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] <[email protected]> To: [email protected] <[email protected]> Date: 06 April 2000 13:03 Subject: [CANAL-PEOPLE] Thomas Spencer and his son Philip Gell Spencer >I have found the baptism for Philip Gell Spencer: >Phillip Gell Spencer christened 8th June 1862, Crich, Derby, England. Father >- Thomas. Batch No. C049781. >I have found Philip in the 1881 census: > Dwelling: 71 Newhall St > Census Place: Birmingham, Warwick, England > Source: FHL Film 1341719 PRO Ref RG11 Piece 3010 Folio 108 >Page 1 > Marr Age Sex Birthplace >Philip G. SPENCER U 18 M ...hall, Shropshire, England > Rel: Lodger (Head) > Occ: Fire Insurance Clerk

Hi, The 1871 Reading census shows Joseph EACOTT as a Publican of the " Jack of Newbury", Bridge Street, Reading. He is also shown as Boatowner and Master of the Vessels "Victoria" on which his brother-in-law James Emans is to be found, and the " Napoleon". The boats are at Canal Wharf, Bridge Street Reading. The crew of the boats all seem to come from Devizes and Melksham. Does any of this information ring any bells. If it does, I would love to hear from you. Sylvia Ford [email protected]

Hi It might be worth contacting the Boatman's index. If you need the address I will forward it off list. Julie Goucher [email protected] List Owner

Forwarding! ----- Original Message ----- From: Elaine Hooper <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, April 06, 2000 5:38 PM Subject: HOOPER > Hello Carol (O'Neill) > > We were in touch about a possible connection last month, regret I still > can't see one! (Am back to Richard & Elizabeth Hooper m 8.6.1824 St > Peter's, Wolverhampton). I will keep your details handy and if I can make a > connection I will certainly come back to you. > > Regards, Elaine >

Forwarding! ----- Original Message ----- From: Ron O'Neill <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, April 06, 2000 2:01 PM Subject: Surname Hooper > Hello Elaine Hooper, I'm pretty new to the list but I saw your surname and had > to reply. I have a Caroline Hooper, fathers name George, who had a wife > named Emma ???????. George is listed as coming from B.....moor Bridge > and Emma came from Bloxwich they also had a son named George who was > born in Wordsley about 1868. They had other children but they were born > in Wolverhampton. Its a long shot but do they belong to your chain. I > think the B...moor Bridge may be Brockmoor but I do not know if there > was such a place. Regards Carol O'Neill > > > > >

Here is a copy of an e-mail message that I sent to the Derbyshire list: I am having trouble tracking down two of my ancestors and would be grateful for any advice. I have found the baptism for Philip Gell Spencer: Phillip Gell Spencer christened 8th June 1862, Crich, Derby, England. Father - Thomas. Batch No. C049781. Someone also kindly looked at the IGI fiche for me and it states that Philip's parents were Thomas and Mary, but there isn't a marriage for Thomas and Mary on the IGI. I sent away for Philip's birth certificate to Crich thinking that if he was baptised there, then he must have been born there, but they could not find any trace of him. I have found Philip in the 1881 census: Dwelling: 71 Newhall St Census Place: Birmingham, Warwick, England Source: FHL Film 1341719 PRO Ref RG11 Piece 3010 Folio 108 Page 1 Marr Age Sex Birthplace Philip G. SPENCER U 18 M ...hall, Shropshire, England Rel: Lodger (Head) Occ: Fire Insurance Clerk There is a place on the map named Benthall in Shropshire, but I can't find any other Spencers in that area on the 1881 census. I was wondering if it was more likely that he came from Newhall on the Derby/Staffordshire border and that the county is just down incorrectly on the census. Does anyone have access any Newhall census indexes presuming that there is any for the 1871 census or even the 1861 census for Thomas Spencer. Look forward to any advice that you may be able to give me. Sharon Newall Cheshire Someone suggested that my family may have been canal people and that I should subscribe to this list. Has anybody any ideas as to whether my family were on the canals or heard of this family in particular. Many thanks!

Dear Elaine Thank you very much for your reply. I found it most helpful and think that my next line of attack may be a request to the Local Record Office. Once again my sincere thanks. Janet -----Original Message----- From: Elaine Hooper <[email protected]> To: [email protected] <[email protected]>

Dear Elaine, Thank you for posting this information for Janet and all. I wasn't getting anywhere with the standard web sites! Best Wishes Rosemarie California Searching BLACKBURN, Bridlington CASEMENT - Isle of Man, Hull GRAY - Drypool, Beverley, Bridlington JENNINGS - Hull KEENAN - Drypool, Ireland TAYLOR- Drypool ----- Original Message ----- From: Elaine Hooper <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, April 05, 2000 4:51 AM Subject: Re: [CANAL-PEOPLE] Waterman AND CANAL RECORDS > Hi Janet - re records of "water people." The following describes the four > main sources of information unique to waterways from "Canal Miscellany - A > compilation of records and memories of canal family life in and around > Warwickshire and The Midlands". Warwickshire Family History Society 1998. > WFHS 7 Mersey Road, Bulkington, Warwickshire CV12 9QB > > 1. Register of Boats and Barges. Inland Waterway craft were required to be > registered by the Clerk of the Peace from 1795. Registers are usually > deposited in local record offices. > > 2. Public Health Registers. Kept under the Canal Boat Acts 1877 to 1844 > and administered by the Local or Port Authority through whose district a > canal or river navigation passed. The Acts were introduced to prevent > overcrowding and to improve living standards on the cabin boats. Boats with > living accommodation had to be registered and were issued with a numbered > certificate. The number together with the town was usually painted on the > cabin side. These registers may be deposited at the local record office, > but some are still with the Authority concerned. > > 3. Gauging Tables. Kept by each Navigation Company, show the carrying > capacity of the boat. Other details vary but they usually contain the > owners name and address. Registers may be at the National Waterways Museum, > Llanthony Warehouse, Gloucester Docks, Gloucester GL1 2EL > > 4. British Transport Historical Records. A collection of documents, canal > company minute books, maps, etc. kept at the Public Record Office, Kew, > London. > >

Hi Janet - re records of "water people." The following describes the four main sources of information unique to waterways from "Canal Miscellany - A compilation of records and memories of canal family life in and around Warwickshire and The Midlands". Warwickshire Family History Society 1998. WFHS 7 Mersey Road, Bulkington, Warwickshire CV12 9QB 1. Register of Boats and Barges. Inland Waterway craft were required to be registered by the Clerk of the Peace from 1795. Registers are usually deposited in local record offices. 2. Public Health Registers. Kept under the Canal Boat Acts 1877 to 1844 and administered by the Local or Port Authority through whose district a canal or river navigation passed. The Acts were introduced to prevent overcrowding and to improve living standards on the cabin boats. Boats with living accommodation had to be registered and were issued with a numbered certificate. The number together with the town was usually painted on the cabin side. These registers may be deposited at the local record office, but some are still with the Authority concerned. 3. Gauging Tables. Kept by each Navigation Company, show the carrying capacity of the boat. Other details vary but they usually contain the owners name and address. Registers may be at the National Waterways Museum, Llanthony Warehouse, Gloucester Docks, Gloucester GL1 2EL 4. British Transport Historical Records. A collection of documents, canal company minute books, maps, etc. kept at the Public Record Office, Kew, London. Hope this helps. Elaine -----Original Message----- From: Janet Corbett <[email protected]> To: [email protected] <[email protected]> Date: 04 April 2000 16:03 Subject: [CANAL-PEOPLE] Waterman >Dear Listers > We see a lot about boatman/waterman. I am searching for details of Thomas Corbett a waterman in 1834-45 Worcester. He is always described as a waterman and I am of the opinion that he may have been a ferryman rather than a canal boatman as I had originally thought, that is rowing across a river. Could anybody on the list tell me if this may be a correct assumption and if so where I would look for details of such. Are there any records kept of these water people. Thanking you in advance. Janet Corbett > > >============================== >The RootsWeb WorldConnect Project: >Tens of millions of individuals... and counting. >http://worldconnect.genealogy.rootsweb.com/ > >

Hi all Just a quick email to say that if you have emailed my and it bounced this was due to technical problems with Virgin. It seems, and I have everything crossed <VBG> that the problem is resolved, although what the problem was no one, including Virgin seems to know. Anyway; I am back and I bet you never missed me!! The list has been a bit quiet, and I apologies for not being more active, but I do have to sleep sometime! I am working on a few big projects and 24 hours a day is simply not enough! As soon as they are complete I will be a bit more hands on! Now, Easter is just around the corner, if you are going away please remember to unsubscribe. The address is: [email protected] for those of you who rec postings in mail mode and [email protected] who rec mail in digest mode. When you are ready to rejoin the list send the word subscribe to the relevant address as above. Please do not send any message with the subscribe/unsubscribe note as it upsets the computer process. If you are having problems etc my email is [email protected] and you can email me and I will endeavour to assist. Meanwhile happy researching. Julie Goucher [email protected] List Owner

Dear Listers We see a lot about boatman/waterman. I am searching for details of Thomas Corbett a waterman in 1834-45 Worcester. He is always described as a waterman and I am of the opinion that he may have been a ferryman rather than a canal boatman as I had originally thought, that is rowing across a river. Could anybody on the list tell me if this may be a correct assumption and if so where I would look for details of such. Are there any records kept of these water people. Thanking you in advance. Janet Corbett

Peter Reading, Hi, I don't know if this is anything to do with your Edward Reading, but I found it on the 1851 three counties census CD. Name Relationship Mar Age Sex Occupation Birthplace Edward READING Head M 51 M Boatman Warwick-Warwick Mary READING Wife M 26 F Char Woman Cuckfield-Sussex Elizabeth READING Daur - 8 F Scholar Stratford On Avon-Warwick Mary READING Daur - 7 F Scholar Stratford On Avon-Warwick Edward READING Son - 3 M Scholar Stratford On Avon-Warwick Maria READING Daur - 2 F --- Stratford On Avon-Warwick Sarah HIRONS (READING) SDau - 11 F Scholar Stratford On Avon-Warwick Address: Waterside, Stratford on Avon Census Place: (Old Stratford) Stratford On Avon Stratford on Avon, Warwickshire PRO Reference: HO/107/2074 Folio: 257 Page: 6 FHL Film: 0087342 Sylvia Ford [email protected]