Jeremaih H Delong was born on 1828 at Bellevilla, Prince Co Ontario Prov. Canada. who were his parents??? My DeLong history mentioned that Simon and Catherine (Dempsey) DeLong was unconfirmed to Jeremiah but he had brother, Conard Delong.. Jeremiah H Delong married to Phebe Ann Smith on may 17 1851 at Milford Canada. their 6 children were born in Bellavilla Canada : Jeremaih T Delong ???? to son to Jeremaih and Phebe Delong Charles H DeLong George Frank DeLong John Franklin DeLong (my great grandpa) Mary DeLong Anna J DeLong William James DeLong Any related to you ??? I need your help. Look for your answer soon. Thanks, Dorothy here is my address: mdwichman@neb.rr.com

Hi Lois - petitions all set and ready to go. Freda ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lois Sparling" <lsparling@shaw.ca> To: <CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, September 30, 2004 9:53 PM Subject: Re: [CCC] Post-1901 Census -- Petitions for Senate of Canada and Non-Residents > The Alberta Family Histories Society will have a Census Release Campaign > table at our family history seminar and fair in a couple of weeks. We > expect to gather many, many signatures at that time. We also plan to > distribute the petitions at our October general meeting next Monday (Freda > take note). > > Lois Sparling > Calgary, Alberta > > Muriel M. Davidson wrote: > >>To all:- >> >>I know Senator Lorna Milne will be pleased when she receives >>the three envelopes of petitions -- two for Senate -- envelopes >>kept arriving daily, and every one a great surprise. >>Genealogical societies and Historical Societies, plus LDS centres, >>gathered the bulk of the signatures - the balance were private. >> >>Non-Resident Petitions: >>There were 128 signatures from societies out of total of 318. >> >>Canadian petitions for the Senate: >>We have a total of 1437 signatures to date up to September 30. >>British Columbia has 203 signatures gathered via societies out of >>600 total >>Alberta has a total of 142 with 29 from AFHS, Calgary >>Saskatchewan has 161, all gathered at genealogical societies >>Ontario has a total of 401 with 268 from societies. >> >>Others are: Nova Scotia - 107; New Brunswick - 2; >>Manitoba - 19 >> >>I will send an attachment of my tabulation privately to any society, >>one only has to ask. >> >>Let's keep the pen and ink flowing on the petitions - found at >>http://www.globalgenealogy.com/Census/ >> >>Muriel M. Davidson muriel_davidson@sympatico.ca >> >> >> >> >> >>==== CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN Mailing List ==== >>Keep up to date on Post 1901 Census Issues at >> http://globalgenealogy.com/Census/ >>en français http://globalgenealogy.com/Census/Index_f.htm >> >> >> > > > ==== CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN Mailing List ==== > How to unsubscribe from Digest Mode. Send a message to > CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-D-request@rootsweb.com that contains (in the > Subject line and body of the message) the command -- unsubscribe -- and no > additional text. > >

To all:- I know Senator Lorna Milne will be pleased when she receives the three envelopes of petitions -- two for Senate -- envelopes kept arriving daily, and every one a great surprise. Genealogical societies and Historical Societies, plus LDS centres, gathered the bulk of the signatures - the balance were private. Non-Resident Petitions: There were 128 signatures from societies out of total of 318. Canadian petitions for the Senate: We have a total of 1437 signatures to date up to September 30. British Columbia has 203 signatures gathered via societies out of 600 total Alberta has a total of 142 with 29 from AFHS, Calgary Saskatchewan has 161, all gathered at genealogical societies Ontario has a total of 401 with 268 from societies. Others are: Nova Scotia - 107; New Brunswick - 2; Manitoba - 19 I will send an attachment of my tabulation privately to any society, one only has to ask. Let's keep the pen and ink flowing on the petitions - found at http://www.globalgenealogy.com/Census/ Muriel M. Davidson muriel_davidson@sympatico.ca

The Alberta Family Histories Society will have a Census Release Campaign table at our family history seminar and fair in a couple of weeks. We expect to gather many, many signatures at that time. We also plan to distribute the petitions at our October general meeting next Monday (Freda take note). Lois Sparling Calgary, Alberta Muriel M. Davidson wrote: >To all:- > >I know Senator Lorna Milne will be pleased when she receives >the three envelopes of petitions -- two for Senate -- envelopes >kept arriving daily, and every one a great surprise. >Genealogical societies and Historical Societies, plus LDS centres, >gathered the bulk of the signatures - the balance were private. > >Non-Resident Petitions: >There were 128 signatures from societies out of total of 318. > >Canadian petitions for the Senate: >We have a total of 1437 signatures to date up to September 30. >British Columbia has 203 signatures gathered via societies out of >600 total >Alberta has a total of 142 with 29 from AFHS, Calgary >Saskatchewan has 161, all gathered at genealogical societies >Ontario has a total of 401 with 268 from societies. > >Others are: Nova Scotia - 107; New Brunswick - 2; >Manitoba - 19 > >I will send an attachment of my tabulation privately to any society, >one only has to ask. > >Let's keep the pen and ink flowing on the petitions - found at >http://www.globalgenealogy.com/Census/ > >Muriel M. Davidson muriel_davidson@sympatico.ca > > > > > >==== CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN Mailing List ==== >Keep up to date on Post 1901 Census Issues at > http://globalgenealogy.com/Census/ >en français http://globalgenealogy.com/Census/Index_f.htm > > > >

I have deleted most of the message -- MMD ----- Original Message ----- From: <todayoncpac@cpac.ca> To: <muriel_davidson@sympatico.ca> Sent: Thursday, September 30, 2004 3:08 PM Subject: CPAC Highlights - September 30 Upcoming special CPAC coverage: A new session of the House of Commons starts Monday, October 4th at 11am ET / 8am PT on CPAC and the first order of business is the election of the Speaker of the House. Then on Tuesday, October 5th starting at 2:30pm ET / 11:30am PT, tune in for complete coverage of the Speech from the Throne presented by Governor General ADRIENNE CLARKSON in the Senate Chamber. From interviews to your views, it's all LIVE on CPAC. THURSDAY, SEPTEMBER 30 Today's national agenda, tonight on CPAC 6pm ET: HEADLINE POLITICS On September 30, 2004, Prime Minister PAUL MARTIN announced that MPs will not receive a salary increase.

Many thanks, David!!! You have the same thought I do -- 70 years is long enough. I have worked with census records -- they are great -- but to continue the research, one must use other documents. I have used wills, letters of administration, marriage bonds, marriage licences, obituaries -- the census records are ONLY a starting point. Muriel M. Davidson muriel_davidson@sympatico.ca Co-Chair, Canada Census committee http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~downhome/post1901census.htm ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Rowat" <drowat@rogers.com> To: <CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, September 30, 2004 12:01 AM Subject: [CCC] Census question Dear Jeff, I'm disappointed to hear that there is still a debate about "opt-in" or "opt-out" questions on the Census. It should be obvious by how that such questions will lead to less than 100% agreement, making the value of the Census for genealogists severely flawed. Instead of giving options to Census respondents, why doesn't Statistics Canada simply add a statement to the effect that the Census data will be transferred to the Archives and released in 70 years from the date of the Census? I cannot imagine why anyone would object to having their address, age, marital status etc. released for genealogical or historical perusal after such a period. In my own case, I will be 140 years old if the 2011 Census gets released after 70 years, and I sure won't care. I have deliberately suggested 70 years rather than the 92 currently legislated (we think), because it is much more reasonable, and if there is going to be a compromise, let's have a reasonable position to start from. David Rowat

Dear Jeff, I'm disappointed to hear that there is still a debate about "opt-in" or "opt-out" questions on the Census. It should be obvious by how that such questions will lead to less than 100% agreement, making the value of the Census for genealogists severely flawed. Instead of giving options to Census respondents, why doesn't Statistics Canada simply add a statement to the effect that the Census data will be transferred to the Archives and released in 70 years from the date of the Census? I cannot imagine why anyone would object to having their address, age, marital status etc. released for genealogical or historical perusal after such a period. In my own case, I will be 140 years old if the 2011 Census gets released after 70 years, and I sure won't care. I have deliberately suggested 70 years rather than the 92 currently legislated (we think), because it is much more reasonable, and if there is going to be a compromise, let's have a reasonable position to start from. David Rowat

To all:- We lost one committee member this evening, but knowing her interest, Lyn Duncan will be keeping abreast of all happenings. Her reason -- Lyn has "webtv" so does not have the capacity for too many messages. We welcome George Fraser, formerly from Sydney, Nova Scotia -- he presently resides in Brighton, ON George Harris asked about Canada Census Committee work a long time ago (it seems) so I added him this evening A warm welcome to both!! I forgot one URL -- one which will be updated very shortly http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~downhome/committee.html There will shortly be a change on the page as Murray Calder did not become re-elected. Photos are welcomed -- or Bryan Keddy will post only names. [He promises a new Bryan photo!] During the past few days I have concentrated on ONTARIO, dividing the messages into BLUE, RED, GREEN and a very short message for the present GOLD ones. It has been a busy day -- broken up with lunch at the Mandarin Restaurant with my son -- he told me I had to eat but I really believe he was the one who wanted the Chinese food today. Waiting for more replies tomorrow!! Muriel

I thought it was healthy debate. Lois Sparling Michael Samario wrote: >Hi! > >This thread is starting to go out of hand... > >Please remember, we are all on the same side. I'm sure Gordon did not mean any disrespect. I think everyone should wait for Gordon to respond back to Jeff's comments before turning this mailing list into a war zone. > >Just a suggestion... > > >Michael R. Samario > > >==== CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN Mailing List ==== >How to unsubscribe from Mail Mode. Send a message to >CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L-request@rootsweb.com that contains >(in the Subject line and body of the message) the command >-- unsubscribe -- and no additional text. > > > >

Such a debate would start in Committee and Bill S-13 did not get to the debate stage in the House of Commons Committee. Personally, I feel my objections have been heard. While we do not yet have access to the 1911 census (and I lost my try to pry it loose in the Federal Court), it looks like the 2006 census will be taken without that insidious and evil Opt In or Opt Out box to be ticked. Lois Sparling fredastewart wrote: > Hi Jeff - IF there is debate it needs to be open to the public, in the > House of Commons, so all members can take part and voice their > opinions; and so all Canadians can hear what these arguments are and > who is saying what. Most of the privacy thing is a scare mongering > tactic to deflect from real issues. Sorry Jeff but I've had it up to > the ears with so-called privacy issues. Common-sense by people > themselves needs to come into play. You can't legislate for > everything or the system becomes so costly and cumbersome it can't > possibly work. > Freda Stewart > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul, Jeff: SEN" > <PAULJ@SEN.PARL.GC.CA> > To: <CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 11:11 AM > Subject: RE: [CCC] Bella Online Article > > >> I'm sorry to disagree with Ms. Malone, but I find her arguments to be a >> bit cynical. The fact of the matter is that if the Liberal Party did >> not want the release of historic census records then the 1906 census >> never would have seen the light of day. The work of Murray Calder and >> Senator Milne, as well as the work of Muriel, Gordon, and everyone >> reading this list caused the 1906 census to be released. And I think >> that today is a good day to remind people that it was a Liberal >> government that released the 1906 census and it was a Liberal government >> that DID tell Fellegi to take off and introduced a bill to provide a >> structure for the relase of all future census records. Now it is true >> that Sen. Milne wanted amendments to that bill and it did not pass. >> There is a new minister involved now, and you will note that he has not >> yet stated a position on the release of historic census records. We >> will have to wait and measure him by the first pronouncements that he >> makes. >> >> Real debate is occurring on this issue. If there was no real debate the >> government would not have moved from stating that no records will ever >> be released to releasing the 1906 census and providing legislation that >> would allow for the future release of census records. Were we happy >> with the legislation - no. But that does not in any way shape or form >> support the assertion that there is no real debate. In fact it shows >> the exact opposite. >> >> As for whether or not the privacy issues are specious, well I would >> respectfully disagree. Don't forget that we are talking about privacy >> of both census that have taken place, and censuses that will take place. >> Does the government have the right to tell a person during the 2006 >> census that in 92 years all of the information that they collect will >> become public for all to see and no one can do anything about it? I >> think that is a question that reasonable people can have a healthy >> disagreement about. I would certainly agree with Ms. Malone that there >> is no harm in the government doing exactly that, and that I would vote >> for a bill that did that because I believe in the integrity of the >> historical record. However, I would not ever suggest that a person who >> wanted to make an argument that each person should decide whether or not >> to include their personal information from the 2006 census in the >> National Archives is making a specious argument about privacy. >> >> The government has clearly stated that they are not going to move on >> this file until a complete solution that looks at both long term and >> short term issues are thorougly examined and ONE solution is put into >> place to deal with it and put the file to bed. I can't say that I blame >> them. >> >> All that having been said, Senator Milne is still actively working on >> this file and the second that we know where the government is going, >> you'll be the first to hear. >> >> Jeff Paul >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Betty Malone [mailto:bmalone@ameritech.net] >> Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 12:47 PM >> To: Paul, Jeff: SEN; CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com >> Subject: RE: [CCC] Bella Online Article >> >> With due respect to Jeff Paul, political parties try to appear to be all >> things to all people & thus will allow a minority faction to be visible >> & noisy about a cause in which they ardently believe, knowing who has >> the >> votes. They want the public to think real debate is occurring. That >> way, >> they avoid the ire of supporters of that cause. >> >> The "privacy issue" is specious, since 92-year-old census data is >> useless >> for identity theft or whatever. The only people for whom census data >> has >> value are the families & historians. The US releases its census data >> 20 >> years earlier than Canada & has never had a "privacy issue." There is >> no >> justification for delaying release of Canadian census data even the >> current >> 92 years. The goal should be to release it as soon as practicable, not >> as >> late as possible. >> >> If the Liberal Party was really interested in release of the census >> records, it would direct Fellegi to turn the records over to the >> Archivist, as provided by law & practiced without problem, until his >> intervention. >> >> Betty >> St. Charles, IL >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Paul, Jeff: SEN [mailto:PAULJ@SEN.PARL.GC.CA] >> Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 10:27 AM >> To: CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com >> Subject: RE: [CCC] Bella Online Article >> >> I would like to make a point here that I think is really important. >> There seems to be a tendency here to separate Senator Milne from the >> governing party. They are one and the same thing. If the Liberal Party >> was genuinely against this movement, Senator Milne would have been shut >> down a long time ago. The fact of the matter is that over 99% of >> Liberals support our cause and are just figuring out how to balance the >> privacy issues that inherently go along with it. >> >> So to answer something that Mr. Westman said, the governing party is not >> allowing Fellegi to get away with anything. Just the opposite. It is >> some of the most partisan Liberal staff, MPs, and Senators who are >> fighting tooth and nail against Dr. Fellegi to ensure that he doesn't >> get away with anything. Sen. Milne, Murray Calder, Richard McGuire and >> I are just the ones you hear about. >> >> Jeff Paul >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Herb Westman [mailto:herb.westman@sympatico.ca] >> Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 11:20 AM >> To: Paul, Jeff: SEN; CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com >> Subject: Re: [CCC] Bella Online Article >> >> I would like to express great gratitude to Jeff Paul and Senator Milne >> for their tireless work on our behalf. >> >> The unfortunate thing about this situation is that the currently >> governing party has allowed Mr. Fellegi to "get away" with his >> obstructionism, sort of like aiding and abetting, so supporters of what >> appears to be the lawful position in this case have to go to the >> political opposition to press the issue and get public recognition for >> our position. The Privacy Act has many deficiencies in it or >> alternatively has been abused by those lacking in common sense. I have >> had personal experience with this type of situation in a case of a >> relative dying without a will and the result has been what could be >> called stupidity, speaking most charitably; obstruction of common >> justice might be another way to describe it. Most incredible! Perhaps >> in this case Mr. Fellegi is looking to create a reason for his early >> retirement with a healthy severance package - he deserves no respect for >> this action. >> >> Again thanks to Mr. Paul and Senator Milne for their battle for common >> sense. More profuse thanks will arrive when the battle is finally won. >> >> Herb Westman >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Paul, Jeff: SEN" <PAULJ@SEN.PARL.GC.CA> >> To: <CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com> >> Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 9:58 AM >> Subject: [CCC] Bella Online Article >> >> >>> Good morning everyone: >>> >>> Unfortunately I have to take some time this morning to take issue with >> >> >>> some comments made by Gordon Watts in the Bella Online article that >>> Gilbert Provost posted yesterday. In particular I am shocked and >>> disappointed at the comments made by Gordon that the political party >>> that has been the most supportive of the Canada Census Project has >> >> been >> >>> the Conservative Party and its predecessor, the Canadian Alliance. >> >> That >> >>> would have been bad enough, but he went further to say that the >> >> Liberal >> >>> Party has been the least supportive of this issue. >>> >>> The fact of the matter is that there is only 1 MP or Senator currently >> >> >>> actively working on this file and that is Senator Lorna Milne - and >> >> she >> >>> is a Liberal. The only MP to have ever taken this issue seriously is >>> former MP Murray Calder who was also a Liberal. I can also tell you >>> that there have been more than a few cabinet ministers that have been >>> pushing for the release of the census, but because of cabinet >>> confidentiality issues, they can't do so publically. >>> >>> What is even more disappointing in Gordon's comments is the number of >>> times that he has dealt with our office, has met with Senator Milne, >> >> has >> >>> plotted strategy with Senator Milne, and has asked Senator Milne for >>> advice. How he can possibly say that he has had more support from >>> Conservatives is absolutely beyond me. I would have thought that by >> >> now >> >>> Gordon would understand that it is very easy for an opposition member >> >> to >> >>> say that they support someone 100% because they never have to deliver >>> anything. As far as Gordon is concerned all that a party has to do is >> >> >>> pay lip service and say yes to his questions and he will give them all >> >> >>> the credit in the world. However since Senator Milne is a government >>> member and has to deliver on this file, her 5 years of work, endless >>> meetings with 5 different cabinet ministers, 3 privacy commissioners, >> >> 2 >> >>> access to information commissioners, dozens of MPs and Senators and >> >> more >> >>> speeches in the Senate and to caucus than I can count, simply do not >> >> add >> >>> up to enough support for Gordon to even warrant a mention when >> >> directly >> >>> asked about how much political support he has received. >>> >>> I will be very blunt by telling everyone that we do not and we can not >> >> >>> list everything that Senator Milne does to work on this file on this >>> listserve. If we did, no cabinet minister would ever meet with us on >>> any issue ever again. Since you folks last heard from me there have >>> been numerous meetings on this file. We are pushing very hard to get >>> the government to act. I know that there is huge support within the >>> Liberal Party to get this resolved. But if we announce baby steps and >> >> >>> maybes and all of the ups and downs of negotiations that would be the >>> end of this project. >>> >>> The fact of the matter is that Gordon knows all of this very well, and >> >> >>> there have been times over the years that we have let him in on >> >> various >> >>> things in advance and in secrecy in order to properly measure what the >> >> >>> response of the genealogical community would be. He knows that we >> >> have >> >>> been working on this file on an ongoing basis. In fact Gordon knows >>> that Sen. Milne has been working to find a champion in the House of >>> Commons for this one. We even talked about that last week. I find it >> >> >>> quite amusing that one week he would suggest that we find a Liberal to >> >> >>> champion the cause in the House, and the next he would be complaining >> >> in >> >>> the media of the lack of support from the Liberal Party. >>> >>> That all having been said, I want you all to know that this file >>> continues to be a very very hot one in our office. We've been meeting >> >> >>> with and talking to people as recently as this past Monday on the >> >> file. >> >>> I hope that this kind of support by Liberals is sufficient for >> >> Gordon's >> >>> liking. >>> >>> Yours truly, >>> >>> Jeff Paul >>> Policy Advisor >>> Office of the Hon. Lorna Milne >>> Ph: (613) 947-9744 >>> Cell: (613) 715-2965 >>> >>> >>> >>> ==== CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN Mailing List ==== How to unsubscribe from >>> Mail Mode. Send a message to >>> CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L-request@rootsweb.com that contains (in the >>> Subject line and body of the message) the command >>> -- unsubscribe -- and no additional text. >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >> ==== CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN Mailing List ==== Keep up to date on Post >> 1901 Census Issues at >> http://globalgenealogy.com/Census/ >> en frangais http://globalgenealogy.com/Census/Index_f.htm >> >> >> >> >> ==== CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN Mailing List ==== >> How to unsubscribe from Mail Mode. Send a message to >> CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L-request@rootsweb.com that contains >> (in the Subject line and body of the message) the command >> -- unsubscribe -- and no additional text. >> >> > > > > ==== CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN Mailing List ==== > How to unsubscribe from Mail Mode. Send a message to > CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L-request@rootsweb.com that contains (in the > Subject line and body of the message) the command -- unsubscribe -- > and no additional text. > >

I have been aware but keeping quiet about the debate within cabinet about the release of the post 1906 census. This is a critical factor in how others view this whole thing. However, some Alliance MPs were very interested as well, in particular, Jason Kenny. We have not informed you about all our past dealings with the Alliance Party. So let's just agree that no one person knows all that has been going on behind the scenes and that this is not a partisan issue. This is a cross-party tug of war between (misplaced) privacy concerns and freedom of information. I disagree with Gordon's emphasis on the silly conditions on access to the historic access for an additional 20 years. The big issue for me is the proposal to have an opt in/opt out box to tick in all future census returns. This seriously degrades the value of all future census as a historical records of the nation. The rest, in my view, was a fair and reasonable compromise - a trade off between stupid annoyances and certainty that the 1911 and later census would be released to the public. Jeff knows this but perhaps the rest of the list may not know or understand my position. I would never have risked a second Federal Court Action over the stupid strings to have been attached to access to the 1911 and later census. Going to court is always very risky. Settle if at all possible. And for the gentleman who wondered why I decided not to appeal my/our loss in Federal Court, a loss in the Federal Court of Appeal would be even more serious. I therefore decided not to take that risk. Sorry I cannot consult all my hundreds of paying clients. I cannot be blunt on a mailing list like I can be with clients behind closed doors. Which brings me to the topic I planned to address to the list tonight before I say Jeff's email. We are "calling out the troops" to get signatures on the petitions in Calgary. This is the third time I have called on the members of the Alberta Family Histories Society to do this. No doubt they will deliver lots and lots of signatures again. No doubt the Alberta Genealogical Society will do the same and also the disparate family history groups in British Columbia (especially those outside Vancouver). It is NOT, I repeat, NOT a good thing for this to be a Western issue. It is especially not helpful to have so much of the support from the Far West. Alberta in particular is not viewed favourably in Ottawa. The residents of B.C. may be viewed more favourably but not taken more seriously. In short, the OGS must stop leaving it to others to do something about getting the 1911 census released. It is ridiculous that Calgary can gather more signatures on these petitions in a month than the OGS with all its branches and all its members can gather in a year. Lois Sparling Calgary, Alberta Paul, Jeff: SEN wrote: >Good morning everyone: > >Unfortunately I have to take some time this morning to take issue with >some comments made by Gordon Watts in the Bella Online article that >Gilbert Provost posted yesterday. In particular I am shocked and >disappointed at the comments made by Gordon that the political party >that has been the most supportive of the Canada Census Project has been >the Conservative Party and its predecessor, the Canadian Alliance. That >would have been bad enough, but he went further to say that the Liberal >Party has been the least supportive of this issue. > >The fact of the matter is that there is only 1 MP or Senator currently >actively working on this file and that is Senator Lorna Milne - > >

I am waiting for people to send in positive replies for the release of the 1911 and later census records. There will be a plan put in place which, hopefully, will allow members of the Canada Census Committee to retire and get back to personal family research. When I wish to comment to a person, regardless of my thoughts, I do this "face-to-face" -- even on e-mail!! Let's COOL and CHILL this topic immediately -- there are no only private citizens of Canada subscribed and might enjoy the in-fighting, which I certainly do not. Muriel ----- Original Message ----- From: "fredastewart" <fritzzi@shaw.ca> To: <CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 1:51 PM Subject: Re: [CCC] Bella Online Article Hi Jeff - IF there is debate it needs to be open to the public, in the House of Commons, so all members can take part and voice their opinions; and so all Canadians can hear what these arguments are and who is saying what. Most of the privacy thing is a scare mongering tactic to deflect from real issues. Sorry Jeff but I've had it up to the ears with so-called privacy issues. Common-sense by people themselves needs to come into play. You can't legislate for everything or the system becomes so costly and cumbersome it can't possibly work. Freda Stewart ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Paul, Jeff: SEN" <PAULJ@SEN.PARL.GC.CA> > To: <CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 11:11 AM > Subject: RE: [CCC] Bella Online Article > > > > I'm sorry to disagree with Ms. Malone, but I find her arguments to be a > > bit cynical. The fact of the matter is that if the Liberal Party did > > not want the release of historic census records then the 1906 census > > never would have seen the light of day. The work of Murray Calder and > > Senator Milne, as well as the work of Muriel, Gordon, and everyone > > reading this list caused the 1906 census to be released. And I think > > that today is a good day to remind people that it was a Liberal > > government that released the 1906 census and it was a Liberal government > > that DID tell Fellegi to take off and introduced a bill to provide a > > structure for the relase of all future census records. Now it is true > > that Sen. Milne wanted amendments to that bill and it did not pass. > > There is a new minister involved now, and you will note that he has not > > yet stated a position on the release of historic census records. We > > will have to wait and measure him by the first pronouncements that he > > makes. > > > > Real debate is occurring on this issue. If there was no real debate the > > government would not have moved from stating that no records will ever > > be released to releasing the 1906 census and providing legislation that > > would allow for the future release of census records. Were we happy > > with the legislation - no. But that does not in any way shape or form > > support the assertion that there is no real debate. In fact it shows > > the exact opposite. > > > > As for whether or not the privacy issues are specious, well I would > > respectfully disagree. Don't forget that we are talking about privacy > > of both census that have taken place, and censuses that will take place. > > Does the government have the right to tell a person during the 2006 > > census that in 92 years all of the information that they collect will > > become public for all to see and no one can do anything about it? I > > think that is a question that reasonable people can have a healthy > > disagreement about. I would certainly agree with Ms. Malone that there > > is no harm in the government doing exactly that, and that I would vote > > for a bill that did that because I believe in the integrity of the > > historical record. However, I would not ever suggest that a person who > > wanted to make an argument that each person should decide whether or not > > to include their personal information from the 2006 census in the > > National Archives is making a specious argument about privacy. > > > > The government has clearly stated that they are not going to move on > > this file until a complete solution that looks at both long term and > > short term issues are thorougly examined and ONE solution is put into > > place to deal with it and put the file to bed. I can't say that I blame > > them. > > > > All that having been said, Senator Milne is still actively working on > > this file and the second that we know where the government is going, > > you'll be the first to hear. > > > > Jeff Paul > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Betty Malone [mailto:bmalone@ameritech.net] > > Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 12:47 PM > > To: Paul, Jeff: SEN; CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com > > Subject: RE: [CCC] Bella Online Article > > > > With due respect to Jeff Paul, political parties try to appear to be all > > things to all people & thus will allow a minority faction to be visible > > & noisy about a cause in which they ardently believe, knowing who has > > the > > votes. They want the public to think real debate is occurring. That > > way, > > they avoid the ire of supporters of that cause. > > > > The "privacy issue" is specious, since 92-year-old census data is > > useless > > for identity theft or whatever. The only people for whom census data > > has > > value are the families & historians. The US releases its census data > > 20 > > years earlier than Canada & has never had a "privacy issue." There is > > no > > justification for delaying release of Canadian census data even the > > current > > 92 years. The goal should be to release it as soon as practicable, not > > as > > late as possible. > > > > If the Liberal Party was really interested in release of the census > > records, it would direct Fellegi to turn the records over to the > > Archivist, as provided by law & practiced without problem, until his > > intervention. > > > > Betty > > St. Charles, IL > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Paul, Jeff: SEN [mailto:PAULJ@SEN.PARL.GC.CA] > > Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 10:27 AM > > To: CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com > > Subject: RE: [CCC] Bella Online Article > > > > I would like to make a point here that I think is really important. > > There seems to be a tendency here to separate Senator Milne from the > > governing party. They are one and the same thing. If the Liberal Party > > was genuinely against this movement, Senator Milne would have been shut > > down a long time ago. The fact of the matter is that over 99% of > > Liberals support our cause and are just figuring out how to balance the > > privacy issues that inherently go along with it. > > > > So to answer something that Mr. Westman said, the governing party is not > > allowing Fellegi to get away with anything. Just the opposite. It is > > some of the most partisan Liberal staff, MPs, and Senators who are > > fighting tooth and nail against Dr. Fellegi to ensure that he doesn't > > get away with anything. Sen. Milne, Murray Calder, Richard McGuire and > > I are just the ones you hear about. > > > > Jeff Paul > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Herb Westman [mailto:herb.westman@sympatico.ca] > > Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 11:20 AM > > To: Paul, Jeff: SEN; CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com > > Subject: Re: [CCC] Bella Online Article > > > > I would like to express great gratitude to Jeff Paul and Senator Milne > > for their tireless work on our behalf. > > > > The unfortunate thing about this situation is that the currently > > governing party has allowed Mr. Fellegi to "get away" with his > > obstructionism, sort of like aiding and abetting, so supporters of what > > appears to be the lawful position in this case have to go to the > > political opposition to press the issue and get public recognition for > > our position. The Privacy Act has many deficiencies in it or > > alternatively has been abused by those lacking in common sense. I have > > had personal experience with this type of situation in a case of a > > relative dying without a will and the result has been what could be > > called stupidity, speaking most charitably; obstruction of common > > justice might be another way to describe it. Most incredible! Perhaps > > in this case Mr. Fellegi is looking to create a reason for his early > > retirement with a healthy severance package - he deserves no respect for > > this action. > > > > Again thanks to Mr. Paul and Senator Milne for their battle for common > > sense. More profuse thanks will arrive when the battle is finally won. > > > > Herb Westman > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Paul, Jeff: SEN" <PAULJ@SEN.PARL.GC.CA> > > To: <CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 9:58 AM > > Subject: [CCC] Bella Online Article > > > > > >> Good morning everyone: > >> > >> Unfortunately I have to take some time this morning to take issue with > > > >> some comments made by Gordon Watts in the Bella Online article that > >> Gilbert Provost posted yesterday. In particular I am shocked and > >> disappointed at the comments made by Gordon that the political party > >> that has been the most supportive of the Canada Census Project has > > been > >> the Conservative Party and its predecessor, the Canadian Alliance. > > That > >> would have been bad enough, but he went further to say that the > > Liberal > >> Party has been the least supportive of this issue. > >> > >> The fact of the matter is that there is only 1 MP or Senator currently > > > >> actively working on this file and that is Senator Lorna Milne - and > > she > >> is a Liberal. The only MP to have ever taken this issue seriously is > >> former MP Murray Calder who was also a Liberal. I can also tell you > >> that there have been more than a few cabinet ministers that have been > >> pushing for the release of the census, but because of cabinet > >> confidentiality issues, they can't do so publically. > >> > >> What is even more disappointing in Gordon's comments is the number of > >> times that he has dealt with our office, has met with Senator Milne, > > has > >> plotted strategy with Senator Milne, and has asked Senator Milne for > >> advice. How he can possibly say that he has had more support from > >> Conservatives is absolutely beyond me. I would have thought that by > > now > >> Gordon would understand that it is very easy for an opposition member > > to > >> say that they support someone 100% because they never have to deliver > >> anything. As far as Gordon is concerned all that a party has to do is > > > >> pay lip service and say yes to his questions and he will give them all > > > >> the credit in the world. However since Senator Milne is a government > >> member and has to deliver on this file, her 5 years of work, endless > >> meetings with 5 different cabinet ministers, 3 privacy commissioners, > > 2 > >> access to information commissioners, dozens of MPs and Senators and > > more > >> speeches in the Senate and to caucus than I can count, simply do not > > add > >> up to enough support for Gordon to even warrant a mention when > > directly > >> asked about how much political support he has received. > >> > >> I will be very blunt by telling everyone that we do not and we can not > > > >> list everything that Senator Milne does to work on this file on this > >> listserve. If we did, no cabinet minister would ever meet with us on > >> any issue ever again. Since you folks last heard from me there have > >> been numerous meetings on this file. We are pushing very hard to get > >> the government to act. I know that there is huge support within the > >> Liberal Party to get this resolved. But if we announce baby steps and > > > >> maybes and all of the ups and downs of negotiations that would be the > >> end of this project. > >> > >> The fact of the matter is that Gordon knows all of this very well, and > > > >> there have been times over the years that we have let him in on > > various > >> things in advance and in secrecy in order to properly measure what the > > > >> response of the genealogical community would be. He knows that we > > have > >> been working on this file on an ongoing basis. In fact Gordon knows > >> that Sen. Milne has been working to find a champion in the House of > >> Commons for this one. We even talked about that last week. I find it > > > >> quite amusing that one week he would suggest that we find a Liberal to > > > >> champion the cause in the House, and the next he would be complaining > > in > >> the media of the lack of support from the Liberal Party. > >> > >> That all having been said, I want you all to know that this file > >> continues to be a very very hot one in our office. We've been meeting > > > >> with and talking to people as recently as this past Monday on the > > file. > >> I hope that this kind of support by Liberals is sufficient for > > Gordon's > >> liking. > >> > >> Yours truly, > >> > >> Jeff Paul > >> Policy Advisor > >> Office of the Hon. Lorna Milne > >> Ph: (613) 947-9744 > >> Cell: (613) 715-2965 > >> > >> > >> > >> ==== CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN Mailing List ==== How to unsubscribe from > >> Mail Mode. Send a message to > >> CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L-request@rootsweb.com that contains (in the > >> Subject line and body of the message) the command > >> -- unsubscribe -- and no additional text. > >> > >> > > > > > > > > > > ==== CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN Mailing List ==== Keep up to date on Post > > 1901 Census Issues at > > http://globalgenealogy.com/Census/ > > en frangais http://globalgenealogy.com/Census/Index_f.htm > > > > > > > > > > ==== CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN Mailing List ==== > > How to unsubscribe from Mail Mode. Send a message to > > CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L-request@rootsweb.com that contains > > (in the Subject line and body of the message) the command > > -- unsubscribe -- and no additional text. > > > > > > > > ==== CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN Mailing List ==== > How to unsubscribe from Mail Mode. Send a message to > CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L-request@rootsweb.com that contains > (in the Subject line and body of the message) the command > -- unsubscribe -- and no additional text. >

Many thanks, Betty!! Unless Gordon did not keep an audio tape of his interview, what has been printed could be entirely out of context. Newspapers edit copy so the gist of the article can be published, whereas even one left-out word could change the meaning of a paragraph. Just a comment from The Other Half -- working with newspapers for more than 50 years!! Let's move on to other topics -- use our time to check and see IF our Members of Parliament and Senators are fully in agreement the 1911 census be released IMMEDIATELY. Should one check the Automated Genealogy 1901 index, there is nothing there one could use for identity theft:- misspelled surnames; changes of names of places; plus other factors -- the 1911 will be no different -- except we will hopefully find more of our missing ancestors. YES -- My Senator and Member of Parliament agree to census release [Senator Lorna Milne and Colleen Beaunier, MP] Muriel M. Davidson muriel_davidson@sympatico.ca ==================== ----- Original Message ----- From: "Betty Malone" <bmalone@ameritech.net> To: <CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 12:47 PM Subject: RE: [CCC] Bella Online Article With due respect to Jeff Paul, political parties try to appear to be all things to all people & thus will allow a minority faction to be visible & noisy about a cause in which they ardently believe, knowing who has the votes. They want the public to think real debate is occurring. That way, they avoid the ire of supporters of that cause. The "privacy issue" is specious, since 92-year-old census data is useless for identity theft or whatever. The only people for whom census data has value are the families & historians. The US releases its census data 20 years earlier than Canada & has never had a "privacy issue." There is no justification for delaying release of Canadian census data even the current 92 years. The goal should be to release it as soon as practicable, not as late as possible. If the Liberal Party was really interested in release of the census records, it would direct Fellegi to turn the records over to the Archivist, as provided by law & practiced without problem, until his intervention. Betty St. Charles, IL -----Original Message----- From: Paul, Jeff: SEN [mailto:PAULJ@SEN.PARL.GC.CA] Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 10:27 AM To: CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: RE: [CCC] Bella Online Article I would like to make a point here that I think is really important. There seems to be a tendency here to separate Senator Milne from the governing party. They are one and the same thing. If the Liberal Party was genuinely against this movement, Senator Milne would have been shut down a long time ago. The fact of the matter is that over 99% of Liberals support our cause and are just figuring out how to balance the privacy issues that inherently go along with it.

Well actually Freda the debate is taking part in public as well as in private. If you look at the Senate debates, and at the proceedings of the committee in the Senate: http://www.parl.gc.ca/37/2/parlbus/commbus/senate/Com-e/soci-e/10ev-e.ht m?Language=E&Parl=37&Ses=2&comm_id=47 http://www.parl.gc.ca/37/2/parlbus/commbus/senate/Com-e/soci-e/12ev-e.ht m?Language=E&Parl=37&Ses=2&comm_id=47 http://www.parl.gc.ca/37/2/parlbus/chambus/senate/deb-e/034db_2003-02-11 -E.htm?Language=E&Parl=37&Ses=2#46 As you can see from the comments of Senator Murray and others they do genuinely care about privacy issues. If there is some other kind of real issue involved, I would like to know about it. I do agree the comment that you can't legislate for everything. In fact we saw that in S-13 where the 20 year period of limited access was created. That was certainly unworkable. However what is really being debated is whether to add a question to the census that will ask people whether or not their census will be included in the historic record, and what form that question will take. That is a realistic debate that has proved very difficult to win. -----Original Message----- From: fredastewart [mailto:fritzzi@shaw.ca] Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 1:51 PM To: Paul, Jeff: SEN; CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [CCC] Bella Online Article Hi Jeff - IF there is debate it needs to be open to the public, in the House of Commons, so all members can take part and voice their opinions; and so all Canadians can hear what these arguments are and who is saying what. Most of the privacy thing is a scare mongering tactic to deflect from real issues. Sorry Jeff but I've had it up to the ears with so-called privacy issues. Common-sense by people themselves needs to come into play. You can't legislate for everything or the system becomes so costly and cumbersome it can't possibly work. Freda Stewart ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul, Jeff: SEN" <PAULJ@SEN.PARL.GC.CA> To: <CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 11:11 AM Subject: RE: [CCC] Bella Online Article > I'm sorry to disagree with Ms. Malone, but I find her arguments to be a > bit cynical. The fact of the matter is that if the Liberal Party did > not want the release of historic census records then the 1906 census > never would have seen the light of day. The work of Murray Calder and > Senator Milne, as well as the work of Muriel, Gordon, and everyone > reading this list caused the 1906 census to be released. And I think > that today is a good day to remind people that it was a Liberal > government that released the 1906 census and it was a Liberal government > that DID tell Fellegi to take off and introduced a bill to provide a > structure for the relase of all future census records. Now it is true > that Sen. Milne wanted amendments to that bill and it did not pass. > There is a new minister involved now, and you will note that he has not > yet stated a position on the release of historic census records. We > will have to wait and measure him by the first pronouncements that he > makes. > > Real debate is occurring on this issue. If there was no real debate the > government would not have moved from stating that no records will ever > be released to releasing the 1906 census and providing legislation that > would allow for the future release of census records. Were we happy > with the legislation - no. But that does not in any way shape or form > support the assertion that there is no real debate. In fact it shows > the exact opposite. > > As for whether or not the privacy issues are specious, well I would > respectfully disagree. Don't forget that we are talking about privacy > of both census that have taken place, and censuses that will take place. > Does the government have the right to tell a person during the 2006 > census that in 92 years all of the information that they collect will > become public for all to see and no one can do anything about it? I > think that is a question that reasonable people can have a healthy > disagreement about. I would certainly agree with Ms. Malone that there > is no harm in the government doing exactly that, and that I would vote > for a bill that did that because I believe in the integrity of the > historical record. However, I would not ever suggest that a person who > wanted to make an argument that each person should decide whether or not > to include their personal information from the 2006 census in the > National Archives is making a specious argument about privacy. > > The government has clearly stated that they are not going to move on > this file until a complete solution that looks at both long term and > short term issues are thorougly examined and ONE solution is put into > place to deal with it and put the file to bed. I can't say that I blame > them. > > All that having been said, Senator Milne is still actively working on > this file and the second that we know where the government is going, > you'll be the first to hear. > > Jeff Paul > > -----Original Message----- > From: Betty Malone [mailto:bmalone@ameritech.net] > Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 12:47 PM > To: Paul, Jeff: SEN; CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: RE: [CCC] Bella Online Article > > With due respect to Jeff Paul, political parties try to appear to be all > things to all people & thus will allow a minority faction to be visible > & noisy about a cause in which they ardently believe, knowing who has > the > votes. They want the public to think real debate is occurring. That > way, > they avoid the ire of supporters of that cause. > > The "privacy issue" is specious, since 92-year-old census data is > useless > for identity theft or whatever. The only people for whom census data > has > value are the families & historians. The US releases its census data > 20 > years earlier than Canada & has never had a "privacy issue." There is > no > justification for delaying release of Canadian census data even the > current > 92 years. The goal should be to release it as soon as practicable, not > as > late as possible. > > If the Liberal Party was really interested in release of the census > records, it would direct Fellegi to turn the records over to the > Archivist, as provided by law & practiced without problem, until his > intervention. > > Betty > St. Charles, IL > > -----Original Message----- > From: Paul, Jeff: SEN [mailto:PAULJ@SEN.PARL.GC.CA] > Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 10:27 AM > To: CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: RE: [CCC] Bella Online Article > > I would like to make a point here that I think is really important. > There seems to be a tendency here to separate Senator Milne from the > governing party. They are one and the same thing. If the Liberal Party > was genuinely against this movement, Senator Milne would have been shut > down a long time ago. The fact of the matter is that over 99% of > Liberals support our cause and are just figuring out how to balance the > privacy issues that inherently go along with it. > > So to answer something that Mr. Westman said, the governing party is not > allowing Fellegi to get away with anything. Just the opposite. It is > some of the most partisan Liberal staff, MPs, and Senators who are > fighting tooth and nail against Dr. Fellegi to ensure that he doesn't > get away with anything. Sen. Milne, Murray Calder, Richard McGuire and > I are just the ones you hear about. > > Jeff Paul > > -----Original Message----- > From: Herb Westman [mailto:herb.westman@sympatico.ca] > Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 11:20 AM > To: Paul, Jeff: SEN; CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [CCC] Bella Online Article > > I would like to express great gratitude to Jeff Paul and Senator Milne > for their tireless work on our behalf. > > The unfortunate thing about this situation is that the currently > governing party has allowed Mr. Fellegi to "get away" with his > obstructionism, sort of like aiding and abetting, so supporters of what > appears to be the lawful position in this case have to go to the > political opposition to press the issue and get public recognition for > our position. The Privacy Act has many deficiencies in it or > alternatively has been abused by those lacking in common sense. I have > had personal experience with this type of situation in a case of a > relative dying without a will and the result has been what could be > called stupidity, speaking most charitably; obstruction of common > justice might be another way to describe it. Most incredible! Perhaps > in this case Mr. Fellegi is looking to create a reason for his early > retirement with a healthy severance package - he deserves no respect for > this action. > > Again thanks to Mr. Paul and Senator Milne for their battle for common > sense. More profuse thanks will arrive when the battle is finally won. > > Herb Westman > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Paul, Jeff: SEN" <PAULJ@SEN.PARL.GC.CA> > To: <CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 9:58 AM > Subject: [CCC] Bella Online Article > > >> Good morning everyone: >> >> Unfortunately I have to take some time this morning to take issue with > >> some comments made by Gordon Watts in the Bella Online article that >> Gilbert Provost posted yesterday. In particular I am shocked and >> disappointed at the comments made by Gordon that the political party >> that has been the most supportive of the Canada Census Project has > been >> the Conservative Party and its predecessor, the Canadian Alliance. > That >> would have been bad enough, but he went further to say that the > Liberal >> Party has been the least supportive of this issue. >> >> The fact of the matter is that there is only 1 MP or Senator currently > >> actively working on this file and that is Senator Lorna Milne - and > she >> is a Liberal. The only MP to have ever taken this issue seriously is >> former MP Murray Calder who was also a Liberal. I can also tell you >> that there have been more than a few cabinet ministers that have been >> pushing for the release of the census, but because of cabinet >> confidentiality issues, they can't do so publically. >> >> What is even more disappointing in Gordon's comments is the number of >> times that he has dealt with our office, has met with Senator Milne, > has >> plotted strategy with Senator Milne, and has asked Senator Milne for >> advice. How he can possibly say that he has had more support from >> Conservatives is absolutely beyond me. I would have thought that by > now >> Gordon would understand that it is very easy for an opposition member > to >> say that they support someone 100% because they never have to deliver >> anything. As far as Gordon is concerned all that a party has to do is > >> pay lip service and say yes to his questions and he will give them all > >> the credit in the world. However since Senator Milne is a government >> member and has to deliver on this file, her 5 years of work, endless >> meetings with 5 different cabinet ministers, 3 privacy commissioners, > 2 >> access to information commissioners, dozens of MPs and Senators and > more >> speeches in the Senate and to caucus than I can count, simply do not > add >> up to enough support for Gordon to even warrant a mention when > directly >> asked about how much political support he has received. >> >> I will be very blunt by telling everyone that we do not and we can not > >> list everything that Senator Milne does to work on this file on this >> listserve. If we did, no cabinet minister would ever meet with us on >> any issue ever again. Since you folks last heard from me there have >> been numerous meetings on this file. We are pushing very hard to get >> the government to act. I know that there is huge support within the >> Liberal Party to get this resolved. But if we announce baby steps and > >> maybes and all of the ups and downs of negotiations that would be the >> end of this project. >> >> The fact of the matter is that Gordon knows all of this very well, and > >> there have been times over the years that we have let him in on > various >> things in advance and in secrecy in order to properly measure what the > >> response of the genealogical community would be. He knows that we > have >> been working on this file on an ongoing basis. In fact Gordon knows >> that Sen. Milne has been working to find a champion in the House of >> Commons for this one. We even talked about that last week. I find it > >> quite amusing that one week he would suggest that we find a Liberal to > >> champion the cause in the House, and the next he would be complaining > in >> the media of the lack of support from the Liberal Party. >> >> That all having been said, I want you all to know that this file >> continues to be a very very hot one in our office. We've been meeting > >> with and talking to people as recently as this past Monday on the > file. >> I hope that this kind of support by Liberals is sufficient for > Gordon's >> liking. >> >> Yours truly, >> >> Jeff Paul >> Policy Advisor >> Office of the Hon. Lorna Milne >> Ph: (613) 947-9744 >> Cell: (613) 715-2965 >> >> >> >> ==== CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN Mailing List ==== How to unsubscribe from >> Mail Mode. Send a message to >> CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L-request@rootsweb.com that contains (in the >> Subject line and body of the message) the command >> -- unsubscribe -- and no additional text. >> >> > > > > > ==== CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN Mailing List ==== Keep up to date on Post > 1901 Census Issues at > http://globalgenealogy.com/Census/ > en frangais http://globalgenealogy.com/Census/Index_f.htm > > > > > ==== CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN Mailing List ==== > How to unsubscribe from Mail Mode. Send a message to > CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L-request@rootsweb.com that contains > (in the Subject line and body of the message) the command > -- unsubscribe -- and no additional text. > >

Hi! This thread is starting to go out of hand... Please remember, we are all on the same side. I'm sure Gordon did not mean any disrespect. I think everyone should wait for Gordon to respond back to Jeff's comments before turning this mailing list into a war zone. Just a suggestion... Michael R. Samario

Hi Folks, I've only had an opportunity to read through the current posts briefly and one thing did catch my eye right away. It concerns me a bit to hear that '...partisan Liberal staff, MPs, and Senators who are fighting tooth and nail against Dr. Fellegi to ensure that he doesn't get away with anything.' And that, 'it was a Liberal government that DID tell Fellegi to take off'. If this is the situation and reflects what the the working relationship is then why is the man still Chief Statistician? In the end he is a public servant. I've always found it curious that in the case of the 1906 census that as soon as the Information Commissioner got the ball rolling in court that it was released to the world almost immediately. Why on earth did it have to get to that point in the first place? If there is that much support in government then why would the situation be allowed to get to such a point? Thanks, Joe K. Saskatoon "Paul, Jeff: SEN" <PAULJ@SEN.PARL.GC.CA> wrote:I'm sorry to disagree with Ms. Malone, but I find her arguments to be a bit cynical. The fact of the matter is that if the Liberal Party did not want the release of historic census records then the 1906 census never would have seen the light of day. The work of Murray Calder and Senator Milne, as well as the work of Muriel, Gordon, and everyone reading this list caused the 1906 census to be released. And I think that today is a good day to remind people that it was a Liberal government that released the 1906 census and it was a Liberal government that DID tell Fellegi to take off and introduced a bill to provide a structure for the relase of all future census records. Now it is true that Sen. Milne wanted amendments to that bill and it did not pass. There is a new minister involved now, and you will note that he has not yet stated a position on the release of historic census records. We will have to wait and measure him by the first pronouncements that he makes. Real debate is occurring on this issue. If there was no real debate the government would not have moved from stating that no records will ever be released to releasing the 1906 census and providing legislation that would allow for the future release of census records. Were we happy with the legislation - no. But that does not in any way shape or form support the assertion that there is no real debate. In fact it shows the exact opposite. As for whether or not the privacy issues are specious, well I would respectfully disagree. Don't forget that we are talking about privacy of both census that have taken place, and censuses that will take place. Does the government have the right to tell a person during the 2006 census that in 92 years all of the information that they collect will become public for all to see and no one can do anything about it? I think that is a question that reasonable people can have a healthy disagreement about. I would certainly agree with Ms. Malone that there is no harm in the government doing exactly that, and that I would vote for a bill that did that because I believe in the integrity of the historical record. However, I would not ever suggest that a person who wanted to make an argument that each person should decide whether or not to include their personal information from the 2006 census in the National Archives is making a specious argument about privacy. The government has clearly stated that they are not going to move on this file until a complete solution that looks at both long term and short term issues are thorougly examined and ONE solution is put into place to deal with it and put the file to bed. I can't say that I blame them. All that having been said, Senator Milne is still actively working on this file and the second that we know where the government is going, you'll be the first to hear. Jeff Paul -----Original Message----- From: Betty Malone [mailto:bmalone@ameritech.net] Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 12:47 PM To: Paul, Jeff: SEN; CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: RE: [CCC] Bella Online Article With due respect to Jeff Paul, political parties try to appear to be all things to all people & thus will allow a minority faction to be visible & noisy about a cause in which they ardently believe, knowing who has the votes. They want the public to think real debate is occurring. That way, they avoid the ire of supporters of that cause. The "privacy issue" is specious, since 92-year-old census data is useless for identity theft or whatever. The only people for whom census data has value are the families & historians. The US releases its census data 20 years earlier than Canada & has never had a "privacy issue." There is no justification for delaying release of Canadian census data even the current 92 years. The goal should be to release it as soon as practicable, not as late as possible. If the Liberal Party was really interested in release of the census records, it would direct Fellegi to turn the records over to the Archivist, as provided by law & practiced without problem, until his intervention. Betty St. Charles, IL -----Original Message----- From: Paul, Jeff: SEN [mailto:PAULJ@SEN.PARL.GC.CA] Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 10:27 AM To: CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: RE: [CCC] Bella Online Article I would like to make a point here that I think is really important. There seems to be a tendency here to separate Senator Milne from the governing party. They are one and the same thing. If the Liberal Party was genuinely against this movement, Senator Milne would have been shut down a long time ago. The fact of the matter is that over 99% of Liberals support our cause and are just figuring out how to balance the privacy issues that inherently go along with it. So to answer something that Mr. Westman said, the governing party is not allowing Fellegi to get away with anything. Just the opposite. It is some of the most partisan Liberal staff, MPs, and Senators who are fighting tooth and nail against Dr. Fellegi to ensure that he doesn't get away with anything. Sen. Milne, Murray Calder, Richard McGuire and I are just the ones you hear about. Jeff Paul -----Original Message----- From: Herb Westman [mailto:herb.westman@sympatico.ca] Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 11:20 AM To: Paul, Jeff: SEN; CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [CCC] Bella Online Article I would like to express great gratitude to Jeff Paul and Senator Milne for their tireless work on our behalf. The unfortunate thing about this situation is that the currently governing party has allowed Mr. Fellegi to "get away" with his obstructionism, sort of like aiding and abetting, so supporters of what appears to be the lawful position in this case have to go to the political opposition to press the issue and get public recognition for our position. The Privacy Act has many deficiencies in it or alternatively has been abused by those lacking in common sense. I have had personal experience with this type of situation in a case of a relative dying without a will and the result has been what could be called stupidity, speaking most charitably; obstruction of common justice might be another way to describe it. Most incredible! Perhaps in this case Mr. Fellegi is looking to create a reason for his early retirement with a healthy severance package - he deserves no respect for this action. Again thanks to Mr. Paul and Senator Milne for their battle for common sense. More profuse thanks will arrive when the battle is finally won. Herb Westman ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul, Jeff: SEN" To: Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 9:58 AM Subject: [CCC] Bella Online Article > Good morning everyone: > > Unfortunately I have to take some time this morning to take issue with > some comments made by Gordon Watts in the Bella Online article that > Gilbert Provost posted yesterday. In particular I am shocked and > disappointed at the comments made by Gordon that the political party > that has been the most supportive of the Canada Census Project has been > the Conservative Party and its predecessor, the Canadian Alliance. That > would have been bad enough, but he went further to say that the Liberal > Party has been the least supportive of this issue. > > The fact of the matter is that there is only 1 MP or Senator currently > actively working on this file and that is Senator Lorna Milne - and she > is a Liberal. The only MP to have ever taken this issue seriously is > former MP Murray Calder who was also a Liberal. I can also tell you > that there have been more than a few cabinet ministers that have been > pushing for the release of the census, but because of cabinet > confidentiality issues, they can't do so publically. > > What is even more disappointing in Gordon's comments is the number of > times that he has dealt with our office, has met with Senator Milne, has > plotted strategy with Senator Milne, and has asked Senator Milne for > advice. How he can possibly say that he has had more support from > Conservatives is absolutely beyond me. I would have thought that by now > Gordon would understand that it is very easy for an opposition member to > say that they support someone 100% because they never have to deliver > anything. As far as Gordon is concerned all that a party has to do is > pay lip service and say yes to his questions and he will give them all > the credit in the world. However since Senator Milne is a government > member and has to deliver on this file, her 5 years of work, endless > meetings with 5 different cabinet ministers, 3 privacy commissioners, 2 > access to information commissioners, dozens of MPs and Senators and more > speeches in the Senate and to caucus than I can count, simply do not add > up to enough support for Gordon to even warrant a mention when directly > asked about how much political support he has received. > > I will be very blunt by telling everyone that we do not and we can not > list everything that Senator Milne does to work on this file on this > listserve. If we did, no cabinet minister would ever meet with us on > any issue ever again. Since you folks last heard from me there have > been numerous meetings on this file. We are pushing very hard to get > the government to act. I know that there is huge support within the > Liberal Party to get this resolved. But if we announce baby steps and > maybes and all of the ups and downs of negotiations that would be the > end of this project. > > The fact of the matter is that Gordon knows all of this very well, and > there have been times over the years that we have let him in on various > things in advance and in secrecy in order to properly measure what the > response of the genealogical community would be. He knows that we have > been working on this file on an ongoing basis. In fact Gordon knows > that Sen. Milne has been working to find a champion in the House of > Commons for this one. We even talked about that last week. I find it > quite amusing that one week he would suggest that we find a Liberal to > champion the cause in the House, and the next he would be complaining in > the media of the lack of support from the Liberal Party. > > That all having been said, I want you all to know that this file > continues to be a very very hot one in our office. We've been meeting > with and talking to people as recently as this past Monday on the file. > I hope that this kind of support by Liberals is sufficient for Gordon's > liking. > > Yours truly, > > Jeff Paul > Policy Advisor > Office of the Hon. Lorna Milne > Ph: (613) 947-9744 > Cell: (613) 715-2965 > > > > ==== CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN Mailing List ==== How to unsubscribe from > Mail Mode. Send a message to > CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L-request@rootsweb.com that contains (in the > Subject line and body of the message) the command > -- unsubscribe -- and no additional text. > > ==== CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN Mailing List ==== Keep up to date on Post 1901 Census Issues at http://globalgenealogy.com/Census/ en frangais http://globalgenealogy.com/Census/Index_f.htm ==== CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN Mailing List ==== How to unsubscribe from Mail Mode. Send a message to CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L-request@rootsweb.com that contains (in the Subject line and body of the message) the command -- unsubscribe -- and no additional text. --------------------------------- Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals

I'm sorry to disagree with Ms. Malone, but I find her arguments to be a bit cynical. The fact of the matter is that if the Liberal Party did not want the release of historic census records then the 1906 census never would have seen the light of day. The work of Murray Calder and Senator Milne, as well as the work of Muriel, Gordon, and everyone reading this list caused the 1906 census to be released. And I think that today is a good day to remind people that it was a Liberal government that released the 1906 census and it was a Liberal government that DID tell Fellegi to take off and introduced a bill to provide a structure for the relase of all future census records. Now it is true that Sen. Milne wanted amendments to that bill and it did not pass. There is a new minister involved now, and you will note that he has not yet stated a position on the release of historic census records. We will have to wait and measure him by the first pronouncements that he makes. Real debate is occurring on this issue. If there was no real debate the government would not have moved from stating that no records will ever be released to releasing the 1906 census and providing legislation that would allow for the future release of census records. Were we happy with the legislation - no. But that does not in any way shape or form support the assertion that there is no real debate. In fact it shows the exact opposite. As for whether or not the privacy issues are specious, well I would respectfully disagree. Don't forget that we are talking about privacy of both census that have taken place, and censuses that will take place. Does the government have the right to tell a person during the 2006 census that in 92 years all of the information that they collect will become public for all to see and no one can do anything about it? I think that is a question that reasonable people can have a healthy disagreement about. I would certainly agree with Ms. Malone that there is no harm in the government doing exactly that, and that I would vote for a bill that did that because I believe in the integrity of the historical record. However, I would not ever suggest that a person who wanted to make an argument that each person should decide whether or not to include their personal information from the 2006 census in the National Archives is making a specious argument about privacy. The government has clearly stated that they are not going to move on this file until a complete solution that looks at both long term and short term issues are thorougly examined and ONE solution is put into place to deal with it and put the file to bed. I can't say that I blame them. All that having been said, Senator Milne is still actively working on this file and the second that we know where the government is going, you'll be the first to hear. Jeff Paul -----Original Message----- From: Betty Malone [mailto:bmalone@ameritech.net] Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 12:47 PM To: Paul, Jeff: SEN; CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: RE: [CCC] Bella Online Article With due respect to Jeff Paul, political parties try to appear to be all things to all people & thus will allow a minority faction to be visible & noisy about a cause in which they ardently believe, knowing who has the votes. They want the public to think real debate is occurring. That way, they avoid the ire of supporters of that cause. The "privacy issue" is specious, since 92-year-old census data is useless for identity theft or whatever. The only people for whom census data has value are the families & historians. The US releases its census data 20 years earlier than Canada & has never had a "privacy issue." There is no justification for delaying release of Canadian census data even the current 92 years. The goal should be to release it as soon as practicable, not as late as possible. If the Liberal Party was really interested in release of the census records, it would direct Fellegi to turn the records over to the Archivist, as provided by law & practiced without problem, until his intervention. Betty St. Charles, IL -----Original Message----- From: Paul, Jeff: SEN [mailto:PAULJ@SEN.PARL.GC.CA] Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 10:27 AM To: CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: RE: [CCC] Bella Online Article I would like to make a point here that I think is really important. There seems to be a tendency here to separate Senator Milne from the governing party. They are one and the same thing. If the Liberal Party was genuinely against this movement, Senator Milne would have been shut down a long time ago. The fact of the matter is that over 99% of Liberals support our cause and are just figuring out how to balance the privacy issues that inherently go along with it. So to answer something that Mr. Westman said, the governing party is not allowing Fellegi to get away with anything. Just the opposite. It is some of the most partisan Liberal staff, MPs, and Senators who are fighting tooth and nail against Dr. Fellegi to ensure that he doesn't get away with anything. Sen. Milne, Murray Calder, Richard McGuire and I are just the ones you hear about. Jeff Paul -----Original Message----- From: Herb Westman [mailto:herb.westman@sympatico.ca] Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 11:20 AM To: Paul, Jeff: SEN; CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [CCC] Bella Online Article I would like to express great gratitude to Jeff Paul and Senator Milne for their tireless work on our behalf. The unfortunate thing about this situation is that the currently governing party has allowed Mr. Fellegi to "get away" with his obstructionism, sort of like aiding and abetting, so supporters of what appears to be the lawful position in this case have to go to the political opposition to press the issue and get public recognition for our position. The Privacy Act has many deficiencies in it or alternatively has been abused by those lacking in common sense. I have had personal experience with this type of situation in a case of a relative dying without a will and the result has been what could be called stupidity, speaking most charitably; obstruction of common justice might be another way to describe it. Most incredible! Perhaps in this case Mr. Fellegi is looking to create a reason for his early retirement with a healthy severance package - he deserves no respect for this action. Again thanks to Mr. Paul and Senator Milne for their battle for common sense. More profuse thanks will arrive when the battle is finally won. Herb Westman ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul, Jeff: SEN" <PAULJ@SEN.PARL.GC.CA> To: <CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 9:58 AM Subject: [CCC] Bella Online Article > Good morning everyone: > > Unfortunately I have to take some time this morning to take issue with > some comments made by Gordon Watts in the Bella Online article that > Gilbert Provost posted yesterday. In particular I am shocked and > disappointed at the comments made by Gordon that the political party > that has been the most supportive of the Canada Census Project has been > the Conservative Party and its predecessor, the Canadian Alliance. That > would have been bad enough, but he went further to say that the Liberal > Party has been the least supportive of this issue. > > The fact of the matter is that there is only 1 MP or Senator currently > actively working on this file and that is Senator Lorna Milne - and she > is a Liberal. The only MP to have ever taken this issue seriously is > former MP Murray Calder who was also a Liberal. I can also tell you > that there have been more than a few cabinet ministers that have been > pushing for the release of the census, but because of cabinet > confidentiality issues, they can't do so publically. > > What is even more disappointing in Gordon's comments is the number of > times that he has dealt with our office, has met with Senator Milne, has > plotted strategy with Senator Milne, and has asked Senator Milne for > advice. How he can possibly say that he has had more support from > Conservatives is absolutely beyond me. I would have thought that by now > Gordon would understand that it is very easy for an opposition member to > say that they support someone 100% because they never have to deliver > anything. As far as Gordon is concerned all that a party has to do is > pay lip service and say yes to his questions and he will give them all > the credit in the world. However since Senator Milne is a government > member and has to deliver on this file, her 5 years of work, endless > meetings with 5 different cabinet ministers, 3 privacy commissioners, 2 > access to information commissioners, dozens of MPs and Senators and more > speeches in the Senate and to caucus than I can count, simply do not add > up to enough support for Gordon to even warrant a mention when directly > asked about how much political support he has received. > > I will be very blunt by telling everyone that we do not and we can not > list everything that Senator Milne does to work on this file on this > listserve. If we did, no cabinet minister would ever meet with us on > any issue ever again. Since you folks last heard from me there have > been numerous meetings on this file. We are pushing very hard to get > the government to act. I know that there is huge support within the > Liberal Party to get this resolved. But if we announce baby steps and > maybes and all of the ups and downs of negotiations that would be the > end of this project. > > The fact of the matter is that Gordon knows all of this very well, and > there have been times over the years that we have let him in on various > things in advance and in secrecy in order to properly measure what the > response of the genealogical community would be. He knows that we have > been working on this file on an ongoing basis. In fact Gordon knows > that Sen. Milne has been working to find a champion in the House of > Commons for this one. We even talked about that last week. I find it > quite amusing that one week he would suggest that we find a Liberal to > champion the cause in the House, and the next he would be complaining in > the media of the lack of support from the Liberal Party. > > That all having been said, I want you all to know that this file > continues to be a very very hot one in our office. We've been meeting > with and talking to people as recently as this past Monday on the file. > I hope that this kind of support by Liberals is sufficient for Gordon's > liking. > > Yours truly, > > Jeff Paul > Policy Advisor > Office of the Hon. Lorna Milne > Ph: (613) 947-9744 > Cell: (613) 715-2965 > > > > ==== CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN Mailing List ==== How to unsubscribe from > Mail Mode. Send a message to > CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L-request@rootsweb.com that contains (in the > Subject line and body of the message) the command > -- unsubscribe -- and no additional text. > > ==== CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN Mailing List ==== Keep up to date on Post 1901 Census Issues at http://globalgenealogy.com/Census/ en frangais http://globalgenealogy.com/Census/Index_f.htm

>The release of the Canadian census records affects not only >ALL Canadians, but descendants of many former Canadians >living in all parts of the world. I don't disagree. But it's utterly besides the point when it comes to HOW to achieve the goal. It affects ALL Canadians, but ANY GIVEN CANADIAN can only be expected to influence ONE of the 308 MPs. And that's their own. If their own MP is already on-side, then it's case closed. If their MP is not on-side, then let the electors in that district lobby the MP, esp. if he or she is a newly-elected member. But hunting down MPs, who you don't and can't even vote for, and frankly harassing them, is going to hurt more than it helps. This is a fact of life. Sorry to have to point it out, sorry to burst any bubbles, but it is a fact of life. Don't shoot the messenger. >YES -- any vote on this issue affects all who desire release of the >Canadian census records. Yes. HOWEVER, don't imagine for one second that any MP, other than your own, has any responsibility to you. THEY DON'T. And haranguing MPs who don't represent your riding is counterproductive: It makes a cause look like a bunch of crackpots, no matter what the cause is or how legitimate. Our political system works a certain way. You are going to achieve results by working WITH the system, not AGAINST it. >Please forward the section that states a Member of Parliament >only answers to the residents of his or her constituency? Have you ever voted? That's where the MP answers. An MP can only be a candidate in one electoral distric, and an elector can only vote, once, in one electoral district. It's in the Elections Act. >Until that time, the present symbol on the Ontario scoreboard >will remain the same. You may not like to hear it, but I have just posted some simple facts of political life. Unless you live in his riding, Maurizio Bevilacqua (Charles Hubbard, Bob Mills, Ed Broadbent, Réal Ménard), doesn't owe you anything. Not even a response. This is a fact of political life. You can try to overcome it, you can try to push that water uphill, but it won't work. Don't get your nose out of joint when it doesn't work, or when someone points out that it won't. The most effective way to get a response from Mr. Bevilacqua, or to have a stand to criticize him if he DOESN'T respond, is for people in the genealogical community, who are electors in the riding of Vaughan, just outside Toronto, to write to him on the issue. Vaughan being one of the most populous ridings, surely that can't be too hard. And please: Someone posting to this list is OBVIOUSLY a member of the list. Don't email the list and the respondent; that means your recipient gets two copies, not one. That's not nice to email inboxes.

Dear Wallace:- The release of the Canadian census records affects not only ALL Canadians, but descendants of many former Canadians living in all parts of the world. YES -- any vote on this issue affects all who desire release of the Canadian census records. Please forward the section that states a Member of Parliament only answers to the residents of his or her constituency? Until that time, the present symbol on the Ontario scoreboard will remain the same. Muriel M. Davidson muriel_davidson@sympatico.ca ----- Original Message ----- From: "Wallace J.McLean" <ag737@freenet.carleton.ca> To: <CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 11:16 AM Subject: [CCC] Maurizio Bevilacqua and other MPs > > > >Congratulations on your election in your riding -- so many > >of these were changed, but your duties will still be the same. > >As you seem to have been a Member of Parliament prior to > >March 1999, you must be accustomed to duties to not only > >constituents, but all Canadians. > > I have to stress again, that an MP, *as* MP, has no > political responsibilities to anyone outside his or her own riding. That > includes responsibilities to respond. I would imagine most out-of-riding > campaign mail, whether paper, fax, or email, in any given private members' > office, is deleted or discarded on sight, unless the author has some > personal connection to the MP or the riding. It would otherwise be > impossible to keep up with the flood. > > MPs are elected by small sets of 10,000 to 50,000 electors, not by > Canadians or Albertans or Ontarians at large. This is a fundamental fact > of our political system, and anyone engaged in any political campaign must > always be cognizent of, and respectful of, that fact. > > It is a mistake, and frankly a waste of time, for people in Moose Jaw-Salt > Flats to try and sway the opinion of the member for > Saint-Onesime--Maskawaga. (Fictitious ridings). "All politics is local." > > The only MPs, other than your own, that you can legitimately hope to sway, > are > > - your province or region's regional political minister (e.g., Ralph > Goodale in SK; John Efford in NL); > > - the MP who also happens to be a Minister or Parliamentary Secretary for a > given portfolio which has federal jurisdiction over some part of the cause > that concerns you; > > - and the MPs who sit on a particular committee that has taken, or will take, > notice of the issue at hand. > > And that, only after you have written to your own MP, if he or she is not > also one of the above. > > It is unfair to yourself, and to the MP who is getting bombarded with > out-of-riding campaign mail, to think otherwise. The census campaign is > worthwhile, but it has to be fought right, and strategically. > Carpet-bombing other people's Members of Parliament is a waste of > resources and time, and, if annoying enough to the other MPs and their > staff, potentially very counter-productive. > > The most powerful piece of campaigning anyone can do is to write to the MP > who last appeared on the ballot in the community where you live. There are > genealogists in every riding in Canada, so the best thing is to keep > stirring the pot among the larger genealogical community, raising their > awareness of the issue, and encouraging people to write to their own > representatives on Parliament Hill. > > > This stuff doesn't apply to campaigning among Senators... I'm sure one of > the list has much more insight into that! ;) > > > > ==== CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN Mailing List ==== > How to unsubscribe from Digest Mode. Send a message to > CANADA-CENSUS-CAMPAIGN-D-request@rootsweb.com that contains > (in the Subject line and body of the message) the command > -- unsubscribe -- and no additional text. >

Greetings All. This morning Jeff Paul has taken me to task, and rightfully so, regarding the BellaOnline article which quoted my responses to questions asked by Betty Dobson. One of those questions was "Which political party, if any, do you find more open to supporting the project?" Part of my response stated "The Liberal and Bloc Quebecois Members have shown the least support, based on numbers of Members and percentage of responses to our letters and emails seeking their position on the question of support." In formulating my response to the question I was looking at the numbers only, and based on those numbers my response was factually correct. However, numbers and isolated facts do not always tell the whole story. My response to the question tended to focus on the negative rather than the positive. Jeff Paul was correct in taking me to task -- not so much for what I did say, as for what I did not say. I did not give credit where credit was, and is, due. What I did not say was that without the support and tremendous amount of work done on our behalf by certain Liberals such as Senator Lorna Milne, former MP Murray Calder, former Minister of Industry Alan Rock, and former Heritage Minister Sheila Copps we would not now have online access to the 1906 Census. Without the support of these individuals, and others, we would now be no closer to seeing the release of subsequent Historic Censuses than we were when the Post 1901 Census campaign started six years ago. No-one, and I emphasize no-one, has put more effort into achieving what we seek than has Senator Lorna Milne. She and her staff have worked tirelessly behind the scenes and no-one is more aware of that than I. Their work on our behalf continues today. In responding to the question asked I was remiss in not giving credit where credit is due. I cannot rewrite an article already published but I can, and do, offer my sincere public apology to Senator Milne, her staff, and to those supportive Members who may have felt my response belittled their support. We can write letters to MPs 'until the cows come home'. However, without someone to speak for us in the Senate and the House of Commons little can be accomplished. We are grateful beyond words for having had Senator Milne as our spokesperson in the Senate and for Murray Calder in the House of Commons. We are grateful also to others in both places that have expressed support for the access we seek. In referring to political parties it is easy to get in the habit of using generalities -- of 'tarring everybody with the same brush', so to speak. I am no less guilty of that than anyone else. We tend to forget that political parties, or any organizations for that matter, are made up of individuals and that various individuals within the party or organization have their own opinions regarding any specific issue. We have had individual support from Members of all federal political parties, including the Liberal party, and we should not forget that. Happy Hunting Gordon A. Watts gordon_watts@telus.net Co-chair Canada Census Committee Port Coquitlam, BC http://www.globalgenealogy.com/Census en francais http://www.globalgenealogy.com/Census/Index_f Permission to forward without notice is granted