The Oxford dictionary has many faces depending on what English speaking country you live in and the year your dictionary was published as they continue to keep up with the changes in the language and word usage. I have a different view of the word and its usage other than the current definition in the Oxford dictionary on line. When I lived in Scotland in the early 1960's the term "scotch" was used to refer to inanimate objects like food and drink like a scotch egg or a location Scotch Crossing and when used on people it was considered to be derogatory and therefore identified as a "pejorative adjective" (I learned this terminology in Scotland from my school master landlord and have never forgotten it). So for me to use the word on a person would be unthinkable and impolite. In the Navy and later in the Merchant Marine I certainly heard enough use of the term in a derogatory manner to cure me of ever using it to refer to myself or others. So I use Ulster Scots and Scottish to refer to my ancestry and heritage and scotch is a drink that I do not imbibe. cheers Garth At 11:14 PM 11/27/2008, you wrote: >I have read the term Scotch (referring to nationality) in many >books--written by Scots and referring to themselves. ( ie: >Scotch kings) My gg mother >came from Scotland and the family always referred to their nationality as >Scotch. I refer you to the Oxford English dictionary. (The new authority >on the English language.) > >There is a whole page of explanation for all the things Scottish which are >also referred to as Scotch. The terms are interchangeable. P > > >> > >> At 01:00 PM 11/24/2008, you wrote: > >>>If you are interested in the settlement of Ulster by the Scots do > >>>some research on the Plantations of Ulster circa 1609. The first two > >>>were settled by Hamilton's and Montgomery's. There are several sites > >>>with this information but Wikapedia is probably the the place to > >>>start with the condensed version. The Ulster web site also has a > >>>great deal of information also. > >>> > >>>Google "Ulster Plantations" there is lots there. > >>> > >>>regards > >>>Garth > >>> > >>> > >>>At 12:46 PM 11/24/2008, you wrote: > >>> >There was at least one point in time when the Scots were encouraged > >>> >by the British to move to Northern Ireland.. and yes it was they who > >>> >in turn moved to the U.S., many to the south, and were responsible > >>> >for much of the westward expansion... > >>> >There was a wonderful show, on one of the History Channels I > >>> >believe, that told the story.. > >>> >faye > >>> > > >>> >---- MomElefant <[email protected]> wrote: > >>> > > I could be wrong But I believe the "Scotch Irish" term came about > >>> > > because the early Irish immigrants form the 1600's and 1700's and > >>> > > early > >>> > > 1800's who were very well established did NOT want to be confused > >>> > > with > >>> > > or associated with the "poor Irish immigrant" fleeing the "Potato > >>> > > Famine' who came over with nothing and settled in the slums of New > >>> > > York > >>> > > and Boston. > >>> > > Therefore the Irish who had been here for many generations became > >>> > > known > >>> > > as "Scotch Irish" > >>> > > > >>> > > MomEl > >>> > > > >>> > > [email protected] wrote: > >>> > > > Faye: > >>> > > > > >>> > > > There was a fair amount of movement between Scotland and > >>> > Ireland at various times. Believe that is how the name "Scots > >>> > Irish" came about. > >>> > > > > >>> > > > Lauraine > >>> > > > > >>> > > >> From: Faye <[email protected]> > >>> > > >> Date: 2008/11/24 Mon AM 09:58:14 CST > >>> > > >> To: [email protected] > >>> > > >> CC: Betty <[email protected]> > >>> > > >> Subject: Re: [CAN-USA-MIG] Surnames from Scotland; people > >>> > lived in Ireland > >>> > > >> > >>> > > >> While Sligo is outside of Northern Ireland, I wonder if some > >>> > of the Scotts who were moved to Ireland in the 1600s might have > >>> > settled there? > >>> > > >> > >>> > > >> faye > >>> > > >> > >>> > > >> ---- Betty <[email protected]> wrote: > >>> > > >> > >>> > > >>> Hello, > >>> > > >>> > >>> > > >>> Just a reminder that my ancestors in the Prov. of Quebec from > >>> > 1820's on were > >>> > > >>> KERR and HENDERSON families - definitely names from > >>> > Scotland. But they > >>> > > >>> were born and raised in County Sligo, Ireland. And, one > >>> > of the books on > >>> > > >>> the "history of Argenteuil Co. and Prescott Co. ..." state > >>> > that they were > >>> > > >>> "Irishmen." > >>> > > >>> > >>> > > >>> (For dozens of researchers, this is a "concrete-block > >>> > wall." None of us > >>> > > >>> can find out who the parents were of the 9 people who left > >>> > Sligo-Town and > >>> > > >>> came to Canada. (4 couples, one single lady). As each > >>> > year of research > >>> > > >>> goes on, we are finding out that there were KERR and > >>> > HENDERSON families in > >>> > > >>> the late 1700's in County Sligo, even in Sligo Town. But, > >>> > we have no way > >>> > > >>> to connect our ancestors up to them. And, even "naming > >>> > patterns" don't > >>> > > >>> help.) > >>> > > >>> > >>> > > >>> Betty (near Lowell, MA, USA) > >>> > > >>> > >>> > > >>> List Administrator > >>> > > >>> > >>> > > >>> > >>> > > >>> FYI: > >>> > > >>> > >>> > > >>> In 2 weeks we will be attending a "cousins get-together" > >>> > which is about the > >>> > > >>> ~20 KERR cousins / siblings I have. They all like to > >>> > celebrate their KERR > >>> > > >>> heritage; even have a few patches of a KERR tartan pinned to > >>> > > >>> their > >>> > > >>> clothes. And, several of my late uncles and aunts always > >>> > INSISTED that > >>> > > >>> they were "Scots" and some of them attended the "Highland > >>> > Games," etc. > >>> > > >>> Over the weekend I was trying to find a way on-line of finding > >>> > > >>> some > >>> > > >>> "HENDERSON tartan" patches. I wanted to remind my siblings > >>> > and cousins > >>> > > >>> that one of our ancestors was William HENDERSON, born 1780's > >>> > in Ireland. > >>> > > >>> Unfortunately, it was his daughter who carried on the name > >>> > for us. My > >>> > > >>> gr-gr-grandparents were supposedly cousins, Robert KERR and > >>> > > >>> Elizabeth > >>> > > >>> HENDERSON, b1827 in Argenteuil County, and in 1880's they > >>> came down to > >>> > > >>> Boston, MA. > >>> > > >>> > >>> > > >>> Robert and Elizabeth are buried in Everett, MA, and the KERR > >>> > > >>> name > > > >>> > > >>> is > >>> > > >>> mentioned there. But, I've been reminded that my > >>> > gr-grandparents, William > >>> > > >>> KERR and Elizabeth HANNAH, are buried in Malden, MA, in the > >>> > HANNAH grave - > >>> > > >>> and the KERR name is not mentioned on the stone. My > >>> > sister tells me it > >>> > > >>> cost a lot of money to add names to a stone, but someday I > >>> > will find a way > >>> > > >>> to do that. And, I haven't seen the KERR stone in > >>> > Everett, so I don't > >>> > > >>> know if the HENDERSON name is mentioned > there. (~1905 burials) > >>> > > >>> > >>> > > >>> Hmmmm. Maybe that's what I'll do today. > >>> > > >>> > >>> > > >>> > >>> > > >>> > >>> > > >>> > >>> > > >>> > >>> > > >>> > >>> > > >>> When you want to respond to a query or comment posted on > >>> > this List, I find it MUCH easier to post a new message -- > >>> > remembering to include the SUBJECT from the post you are responding > >>> > to !! Please make sure there is a SURNAME or place-name in the > >>> > Subject. > >>> > > >>> > >>> > > >>> To search the archives: > >>> > > >>> > > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/search?path=CAN-USA-MIGRATION > >>> > > >>> The information page is: > >>> > > >>> > >>> > > > http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/other/Immigration/CAN-USA-MIGRATION.html > >>> > > >>> > >>> > > >>> > >>> > > >>> > >>> > > >>> ------------------------------- > >>> > > >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > >>> > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' > >>> > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >>> > > >>> > >>> > > >> When you want to respond to a query or comment posted on this > >>> > List, I find it MUCH easier to post a new message -- remembering > >>> > to include the SUBJECT from the post you are responding to > >>> > !! Please make sure there is a SURNAME or place-name in the > >>> > Subject. > >>> > > >> > >>> > > >> To search the archives: > >>> > > >> >http://archiver.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/search?path=CAN-USA-MIGRATION > >>> > > >> The information page is: > >>> > > >> > >>> http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/other/Immigration/CAN-USA-MIGRATION.html > >>> > > >> > >>> > > >> > >>> > > >> > >>> > > >> ------------------------------- > >>> > > >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > >>> > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' > >>> > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >>> > > >> > >>> > > >> > >>> > > > > >>> > > > When you want to respond to a query or comment posted on this > >>> > List, I find it MUCH easier to post a new message -- remembering > >>> > to include the SUBJECT from the post you are responding to > >>> > !! Please make sure there is a SURNAME or place-name in the > >>> > Subject. > >>> > > > > >>> > > > To search the archives: > >>> > > > > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/search?path=CAN-USA-MIGRATION > >>> > > > The information page is: > >>> > > > > >>> http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/other/Immigration/CAN-USA-MIGRATION.html > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > ------------------------------- > >>> > > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > >>> > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' > >>> > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >>> > > > > >>> > > When you want to respond to a query or comment posted on this > >>> > List, I find it MUCH easier to post a new message -- remembering > >>> > to include the SUBJECT from the post you are responding to > >>> > !! Please make sure there is a SURNAME or place-name in the > >>> > Subject. > >>> > > > >>> > > To search the archives: > >>> > > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/search?path=CAN-USA-MIGRATION > >>> > > The information page is: > >>> > > > > http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/other/Immigration/CAN-USA-MIGRATION.html > >>> > > > >>> > > > >>> > > > >>> > > ------------------------------- > >>> > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > >>> > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' > >>> > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >>> > > >>> > When you want to respond to a query or comment posted on this > >>> > List, I find it MUCH easier to post a new message -- remembering > >>> > to include the SUBJECT from the post you are responding to > >>> > !! Please make sure there is a SURNAME or place-name in the > >>> > Subject. > >>> > > >>> >To search the archives: > >>> >http://archiver.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/search?path=CAN-USA-MIGRATION > >>> >The information page is: > >>> > >http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/other/Immigration/CAN-USA-MIGRATION.html > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> >------------------------------- > >>> >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > >>> >[email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' > >>> >without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >>> > >>> > >>> When you want to respond to a query or comment posted on this > >>> List, I find it MUCH easier to post a new message -- remembering > >>> to include the SUBJECT from the post you are responding to > >>> !! Please make sure there is a SURNAME or place-name in the Subject. > >>> > >>>To search the archives: > >>>http://archiver.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/search?path=CAN-USA-MIGRATION > >>>The information page is: > >>>http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/other/Immigration/CAN-USA-MIGRATION.html > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>------------------------------- > >>>To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > >>>[email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' > >>>without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >> > >> > >> When you want to respond to a query or comment posted on this List, I > >> find it MUCH easier to post a new message -- remembering to include the > >> SUBJECT from the post you are responding to !! Please make sure there > >> is a SURNAME or place-name in the Subject. > >> > >> To search the archives: > >> http://archiver.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/search?path=CAN-USA-MIGRATION > >> The information page is: > >> http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/other/Immigration/CAN-USA-MIGRATION.html > >> > >> > >> > >> ------------------------------- > >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' > >> without > > > >> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > When you want to respond to a query or comment posted on this List, I > > find > > it MUCH easier to post a new message -- remembering to include the SUBJECT > > from the post you are responding to !! Please make sure there is a > > SURNAME or place-name in the Subject. > > > > To search the archives: > > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/search?path=CAN-USA-MIGRATION > > The information page is: > > http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/other/Immigration/CAN-USA-MIGRATION.html > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > When you want to respond to a query or comment posted on this List, I > > find it MUCH easier to post a new message -- remembering to include the > > SUBJECT from the post you are responding to !! Please make sure there > > is a SURNAME or place-name in the Subject. > > > > To search the archives: > > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/search?path=CAN-USA-MIGRATION > > The information page is: > > http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/other/Immigration/CAN-USA-MIGRATION.html > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > > > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >When you want to respond to a query or comment posted on this List, I find >it MUCH easier to post a new message -- remembering to include the SUBJECT >from the post you are responding to !! Please make sure there is a >SURNAME or place-name in the Subject. > >To search the archives: >http://archiver.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/search?path=CAN-USA-MIGRATION >The information page is: >http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/other/Immigration/CAN-USA-MIGRATION.html > > > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >[email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >When you want to respond to a query or comment posted on this List, I find >it MUCH easier to post a new message -- remembering to include the SUBJECT >from the post you are responding to !! Please make sure there is >a SURNAME >or place-name in the Subject. > >To search the archives: >http://archiver.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/search?path=CAN-USA-MIGRATION >The information page is: >http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/other/Immigration/CAN-USA-MIGRATION.html > > > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >[email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' >without the quotes in the >subject and the body of the message > >**************Life should be easier. So should your homepage. Try the NEW >AOL.com. >(http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002) > When you want to respond to a query or comment posted on this > List, I find it MUCH easier to post a new message -- remembering > to include the SUBJECT from the post you are responding to > !! Please make sure there is a SURNAME or place-name in the Subject. > >To search the archives: >http://archiver.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/search?path=CAN-USA-MIGRATION >The information page is: >http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/other/Immigration/CAN-USA-MIGRATION.html > > > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >[email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' >without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message