A question for the brains trust. In the 1851 census I came across an entry that has me stumped. 16 Castle Street, Agnes Nicol, head, Married, 26 Captains wife M L, Bute Rothesay The M L was in the occupation or profession section, in upper case and was quite clear. Any suggestions as to what it might signify? Robert Nicol, her husband died 1874 in Pernambuco, Brazil which suggests that it was not a fishing boat that he was captain of but beyond that I have no other information. Thanks, Bill

I received such an enthusiastic response to the last letter that I thought you could manage another. Sadly there are few remaining. I had three great aunts, daughters of Archie McKinlay who went through all the old correspondence and removed anything that either contained profanities or did not fit the image that they wanted their father to be remembered by. Very sad but they were raised in a somewhat different era. Once again the bits in brackets are inclusions I have made. Bendigo Diggins 20/3/1854 Dear Parents, This being a wet day and mail going to leave for England next week, I embrace this opportunity of letting you know my whereabouts in this great south land. You will observe that I am at a different diggins from when I wrote you last, David Prentice [ probably the son of Archibald and Jane] and I left McLoon[ location unknown] and went to town. That is Melbourne where I met James [brother], he having came down along with H Millen and James McLie a fortnight previous. D Prentice has taken a situation but I intend to give the diggins a trial again so James and I is here working together. We have been a week at work since coming up and have only made £8 worth of gold, this I call very poor work but since the rain has set in we expect to make it better. James made £6 per week all the time he was up here last time. I can’t say that I have averaged that though I have no reason to complain. I have always enjoyed good health and never felt the want of money ever since I came to this country. No doubt you will here of great distress etc. etc. experienced by parties in this colony but I think it’s altogether their own folly or lazy to work. No person in this colony need want as long as they have health and will work for they are well paid for every description of work. A common workman on roads is paid 14/- per day. I could have got a situation in the town at my own business[ he had been a draper] £180 a year and board but I did not like to take it and leave it in three months or so for the diggins. I intend the diggins another season trial and if not successful to give them up altogether and take up a situation or do something between James and I on a small scale on our own account, but what that will be don’t know yet as there is many things in this country that a person can turn to and make a little money. If James had taken out the ‘Union’ or a vessel of her size (as smaller crafts than the Union has come here from home) he would have made a fortune in a very short time. James is quite well and has been so all along since coming to this country. Robert Nicol [ a cousins husband] has not been so well at all since coming here. James and I were advising him to go home as this climate does not do for him, it’s the same disease as he had at home. He has taken a situation on wharfe at Melbourne as landing clerk at £5 per week, it’s very light work. Hugh Miller is working at his trade. James McFie is driving a horse and dray. Coopers in Melbourne just now, I don’t know what he is gowing to do. I suppose take a situation or try the diggins - John Lokie, Ebenyz McKirdy, Areby Brown Richard Ferguson and a great many Rothesay folks. I saw Charles McDonald in Town, he was working among the shipping. He was quite well. I saw my two cousins John and Robert.[Stewart] John has a situation at his own business in town and Robert has come into Melbourne 2 days before I left for hear. He has been for the last four months in the bush sawing at days wages but he intended along with another party to try it on their own account, it’ s a first rate paying trade. No doubt you will be thinking it strange to turn a sawer. It’s a daily occurrence here. You will meet with all kinds of professional men at manual labour of all sorts. The last letter I had was from mother of date13th August but I expect that there will be some in town by last mail which Robert Nicol is to forward here if any – all the pleasure I have in this country is getting a letter from home letting me know how you are all keeping and…….(letter ends.)

Try the Matson Shipping Lines. I think they left from Glasgow to North America. Ann

If you have two (or more) e-mail addresses, you MUST use the one with which you subscribed for all postings to the list. -----Original Message----- From: Jennie Macfie <archive@culturalfantasists.co.uk> To: Buteshire List <ButeshireGenWeb-L@rootsweb.com> Date: Wednesday, 7 March 2001 00:56 Subject: {not a subscriber} Letter from Australia >I really enjoyed reading the letter from Australia with its wealth of >detail on life in Bute and in Austra;ia, all those fascinating details >like the prices Something like that makes history so exciting and >alive, >Jennie Macfie >

Posted on: Buteshire Scotland Queries Reply Here: http://cgi.rootsweb.com/~genbbs/genbbs.cgi/Scotland/Bute/10501 Surname: Cameron, Anderson ------------------------- Looking for Margaret Anderson Cameron who lived and worked in Edinburgh as a domestic servant in 1948. Any information would be appreciated.

My Bute families are:--- John (1762-1804 and Margaret (Black, 1763-1835) McCURRIE/CURRIE of Ardbeg farm. Donald (1771 - 1853) and Ann (Clark, 1772 - 1842) CAMPBELL of Rothesay. William (1769 - 1845 and Susan (Simpson, 1776 - 1853) BARR of Cranslagloan, Nth.Bute William ( 1796 -1865) and Margaret (Malcolm, 1801-1872) SPROULE of Rothesay. Kay McGregor Rotorua

Posted on: Buteshire Scotland Queries Reply Here: http://cgi.rootsweb.com/~genbbs/genbbs.cgi/Scotland/Bute/10500 Surname: gilkison ------------------------- i am looking for information on gilkison's who may have immigrated to the east coast of america in the early to mid 1700's. specifically looking for a john gilkison born probably around the 1740's maybe 50's may have had a son william and john who came over with him. he married a elizebeth jameson. any leads would be great. and if i can help you with anything on the american end i would be glad to. look forward to hearing back from you. thanks wayne

Posted on: Buteshire Scotland Queries Reply Here: http://cgi.rootsweb.com/~genbbs/genbbs.cgi/Scotland/Bute/10499 Surname: ------------------------- John Beith may now be reached at john.beith@attglobal.net

I hope this is not considered off-topic. If not, it may be nice to start a thread on this. It is a letter written by my G. Grandfather Archibald McKinlay to his parents in Rothesay just after his arrival in the colony (Australia) on the ship 'Edmond'. It contains quite a few names that may just tie in with others families. Spelling and grammar are the original, the bits in brackets I've added. Melbourne 12th March 1853 Dear Father and Mother We arrived hear on 3rd March after a pleasant passage of 110 days. Was quite well all the passage so was all the rest of the Rothesay folks. I enjoyed the voyage very well. We were all well pleased with the captain & officers. Our ship was out before ships that left two & three weeks before us. The Malabar, which left three weeks before us was five days after us, the ship that Anderson the Drugist [possibly David K] sailed in is not arrived yet so that we are better off as regards the passage. We had the very best of provisions & plenty of them & lots of ammusements to keep our spirits up. Their was two newspapers kept going all the voyage, one is the Punch Hole & the other in a more serious strain. They were well conducted, both written by Scotchmen. The ship was pretty free from disease. Their was ten deaths & four births. Those who died was mostly ill before leaving Liverpool. I wish I had not taken so many cloths with me as they are a great trouble and expense storeing them in this country. They charge one shilling per week for storeage. I like the climate of this country very well. This month is like August at home & the air is very clean and pleasant. The soil is very sandy about the town but farther back its very good. Wages is very good at present, tradesmen of all sorts can easily make from 20/- to 30/- per day. Common laborers can get 14/- per day. 3 pounds per week and board is given for driving a horse and cart. House rents is very high. We are living in an empty house with two rooms for which we pay at a rate of fifty shillings per week. Our party has one half of the house & McLean the upholsterer the other. There is two Rothesay folks staying next door. They have been out some months. Their name is McPherson & Stewart, joiner by trade. They were married previous to leaving home. I have seen a great number of Rothesay folks since landing. John, Robert and Thomas Stewart [cousins] I saw yesterday. They had been at the diggings but did not do much. John & Thomas is got into a situation. Robert intends going to Sydney. James was here about three weeks since but did not see his brothers, they having been at the diggings They came down to town two days before the ship sailed for Sydney but did not know of his being here till I came & told them the ship he was into. They say they had no letter from home since they left. Its very difficult to get letters out of the post office here if they are to be left in the office to be called for. The best way is to address letters to the care of some of the merchants as they can be got at at once. Tell Mrs Mitchell that Alex is here just now and is quite well. He arrived from the diggins yesterday. He tells me he sent home some gold & a letter two months ago. I saw Colin Smith some two or three times since I came here. His wife thought him dead when he left. He has been in this colony for two years, previous to that he was in Calafornia. He says he wrote often & sent home some sixty pounds last July. He has been at the diggins since he came here & would have made money but he spends his money too free. He puts up in Lauries – the mason – house. I met Malcolm Stewarts wife yesterday. She has been up at the diggins along with her husband. She was in town selling their gold and says she would not stay in the town upon any account. She was going to start for the Bendigo diggings today, her husband being up their, they were making money and had bought some ground up at that quarter. You may tell Peter Stewart that they are well. Let Mrs Gilchrist know that I did not see William as he is up at the diggins & is doing pretty well their. Tell Ann Dun..[possibly Duncan]… that John McKinnon is working at his trade making 5 pounds per week, Board and lodgings costs 30/- per week but the way we live costs us about 8/- per week & we live well. Roast mutton or beef with loaf bread every day. Sugar is 4d per pound, tea is 1/3, mutton is from 5d to 6d, the 4lb loaf is ¼. The baker trade pays well here but the shop rents is very high. Vegetables is very dear. 1/6 for a cabbage, 6d for a small turnip & other kinds in proportion. Any person renting a few acres of ground & raising vegetables would make a fortune in a short time. I intend, along with our party to proceed to Bendigo digging next week & will likely be up for three months or so but will write every opportunity from their. If we don’t succeed we will get lots of situations in town or country and good wages we used to hear of at home. As regards the bad order kept is all together untrue as I have not seen any squable since coming here. The Police here is very strict in taking drunk up people on the streets and they are often fined five pounds next day so it is no joke to get out of order. We are not going to take our cart with us but are going to sell it. We expect to get from 45 to 50 pounds & for the harness will get 12 pounds so that we are not to be losers by our speculations. It would be a risk to buy a horse, us being new to the road we would be sure to lose it so we thought it would be better to sell them. Any quantity of people would get as much as they like to do and well paid for it. A steady person is sure to make money here. Tell Mrs McAlpin that Robert left this place for Geelong to enter a boat in conexion with the custom house. He gets 18 pounds a month & a house to live in. I did not see him, he having left the day I landed. Wages for young women is good. They get 80 to 100 pounds a year as housekeeper. I wish I had taken a lot of herrings in firkins as you could easily get 18/- to 20/- each wholesale. They retail them at 4d each. Butter – Irish – I could have got 2/6 per pound. Bricks for building any person could make 300 per cent on them. Any person sending out any of the above would pay them well. Give my best respects to Janet, Isabella & John,[siblings] Jessie and Agnes.[McAlister, cousins] I enjoy very good health thank God & I think the climate is good & will do agree with me. Hope this will reach you in good health. I expected letters from you all on arrival but there is mail since we left but there is one daily expected. If I could, bricks, butter flour –Sept. – herrings & oats or cheap cane bottom chairs consigned to me hear, I would make at least 200 per cent on the invoice price. The invoice coming a month before goods could have them disposed of before their arrival. The purchaser paying all landing charges etc. etc.

Bill As I understand Scottish law, a woman does not /did not loose her maiden name when she married. Over time the custom of usage of the maiden name by the wife has dropped off, but in 1871 your particular enumerator was doing the entries correctly as per law not as per hobby. Someone with a better knowledge may straighten this out if I'm not quite right. regards Peter >I have a general genealogy question relating to the 1871 census for Isle of >Arran, Kilbride, Bute. > >While reviewing a microfilm of this census the other day I noticed the odd >widow whose children had a different last name. In discussion we initially >assumed the widow had simply re-married and maybe lost a second husband. > >However when I found the following entries I became quite puzzled. > >First entry is: >West Clauchland #5 > Ann STEWART, a widow, whose children go by SHAW. > >Next entry is: >West Clauchland #6 >Margaret STEWART, a widow whose children go by HAMILTON > >Next entry: >West Clauchland # 7 >Alexander STEWART married to Marg't ROBERTSON > >Now on the information I've been able to gather thus far I think the second >(#6) entry is the one I'm interested in as I believe Margaret HAMILTON's >maiden surname was STEWART. I'm just a little perplexed to see it on the >census that way. > >Would anyone have a suggestion about the following: > >Could this have been a particularly fastidious census taker who had >genealogy as a hobby or was there a trend toward calling widows and/or wives >by their maiden surname? As I mentioned there were other instances but this >one was of particular interest and has 3 examples on the same page. > >Any help or clarification greatly appreciated. > >Brian Dunn >Kamloops BC, Canada

My sincere thanks to those Kind Souls who replied to my questions about an old occupation and coal usage in Kilbride, Arran. I very much appreciate your taking the time and making the effort to help me out with your answers. Kind Regards to All, Pat Ontario, Canada a former (thank goodness) Torontonian living on a rural route :-) not too far from Ottawa

In a message dated 3/5/01 2:34:13 AM GMT Standard Time, cerberus@mail.ocis.net writes: > While reviewing a microfilm of this census the other day I noticed the odd > widow whose children had a different last name. In discussion we initially > assumed the widow had simply re-married and maybe lost a second husband. > Hi I found this use of the wife's maiden name in an 1841 census in Muirkirk. I wouldn't be too surprised to find it on the islands. Apart from the fact that legally Scots married women retain the use of their maiden name, on an island where everyone would know everyone else, chances are the use of maiden names would persist long after they were married. Maybe the enumerator reckoned that by being widowed the women reverted to their maiden name. A nice little bonus for us searchers if so! Irene

Hi List: I have a general genealogy question relating to the 1871 census for Isle of Arran, Kilbride, Bute. While reviewing a microfilm of this census the other day I noticed the odd widow whose children had a different last name. In discussion we initially assumed the widow had simply re-married and maybe lost a second husband. However when I found the following entries I became quite puzzled. First entry is: West Clauchland #5 Ann STEWART, a widow, whose children go by SHAW. Next entry is: West Clauchland #6 Margaret STEWART, a widow whose children go by HAMILTON Next entry: West Clauchland # 7 Alexander STEWART married to Marg't ROBERTSON Now on the information I've been able to gather thus far I think the second (#6) entry is the one I'm interested in as I believe Margaret HAMILTON's maiden surname was STEWART. I'm just a little perplexed to see it on the census that way. Would anyone have a suggestion about the following: Could this have been a particularly fastidious census taker who had genealogy as a hobby or was there a trend toward calling widows and/or wives by their maiden surname? As I mentioned there were other instances but this one was of particular interest and has 3 examples on the same page. Any help or clarification greatly appreciated. Brian Dunn Kamloops BC, Canada

Hi List: I am seeking infomration on parents, sibs, or children of this couple: George CAMPBELL b: 1820- 1830 Kilbride, Buteshire d: prior to1881, Buteshire Spouse: Elizabeth HAMILTON b: 1829 Kilbride, Buteshire d: Unknown Known children: John CAMPBELL b: 1858, Kilbride d: 1901South Africa Margaret Stewart CAMPBELL b: 1863 d: u/k but likely before 1871 Any information or leads greatly appreciated. Brian Dunn Kamloops BC

Welcome back to Maureen. Would List Members please note that as a result of the recent upgrades at RootsWeb, the archive service may be unavailable - RootsWeb are slowly rebuilding the archives, but its a slow process. When I hear more, I'll pass it on to the list. ****** ****** ****** Thanks to Irene for confirming that right now, the whole UK 1901 Census is only available from the PRO (by personal application as detailed last week). Exact details of its release next year can be found on the PRO site by monitoring this page :- http://www.pro.gov.uk/census/factsheet.htm ****** ****** ****** Originally on NB RootsWeb under the title "I'm not stuck, I'm ancestrally challenged" ... ENJOY! {and apologies to all who may have seen them before} Geneology Quips My family coat of arms ties at the back ... is that normal? My family tree is a few branches short! All help appreciated. My ancestors must be in a witness protection program! Shake your family tree and watch the nuts fall! My hobby is genealogy, I raise dust bunnies as pets. How can one ancestor cause so much TROUBLE?! I looked into my family tree and found out I was a sap . I'm searching for myself; Have you seen me? If only people came with pull-down menus and on-line help ... Isn't genealogy fun? The answer to one problem leads to two more! It's 2000 ... Do you know where your G-G-Grandparents are? A family reunion is an effective form of birth control. A family tree can wither if nobody tends it's roots. A new cousin a day keeps the boredom away. After 30 days unclaimed ancestors will be adopted. Am I the only person up my tree ... sure seems like it. Any family tree produces some lemons, some nuts, and a few bad apples. Ever find an ancestor HANGING from the family tree? FLOOR The place for storing your priceless genealogy records. Gene-Allergy It's a contagious disease but I love it. Genealogists are time unravelers. Genealogy is like playing hide and seek They hide ... I seek! Genealogy Tracing yourself back to better people. "Crazy" is a relative term in my family. A pack rat is hard to live with but makes a fine ancestor. I want to find ALL of them! So far I only have a few thousand. I Should have asked them BEFORE they died! I think my ancestors had several "Bad heir" days. I'm always late. My ancestors arrived on the JUNEflower. Only a Genealogist regards a step backwards, as progress. Share your knowledge, it is a way to achieve immortality. Heredity: Everyone believes in it until their children act like fools! It's an unusual family that hath neither a lady of the evening or a thief. Many a family tree needs pruning. Shh! Be very, very quiet ... I'm hunting forebears. Snobs talks if they had begotten their own ancestors! That's strange half my ancestors are WOMEN! I'm not sick, I've just got fading genes. Genealogists live in the past lane. Cousins marrying cousins Very tangled roots! Cousins marrying cousins A non-branching family tree Alright! Everybody out of the gene pool! Always willing to share my ignorance ... Documentation ...The hardest part of genealogy. Genealogy Chasing your own tale! Genealogy ... will I ever find time to mow the lawn again? That's the problem with the gene pool NO Lifeguards I researched my family tree ... and apparently I don't exist! ****** ****** ****** Feel free to join in and present your own items. Peter Cook cookfmly@bigpond.com List maintainer and Co-host with Barbara < babrown@fast.net > of the ButeshireGenWeb mailing list.

Posted on: Buteshire Scotland Queries Reply Here: http://genconnect.rootsweb.com/gc/Scotland/Bute/10498 Surname: TAYLOR, WHITEHILL, BRADSHAW, MCDIARMID, MCKENZIE, MCDONALD ------------------------- James Taylor married Janet Whitehill on June 25, 1797, Abbey, Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland. James Taylor and Janet Whitehill had the following children: Mary b. April 10, 1798 Archibald b. August 25, 1800 Margaret b. August 15, 1802 d.September 5, 1802 Margaret b.March 12, 1804 Janet b.September 30, 1805 Ann b. May 10, 1808 James b.September 27, 1810 _____________________________________ Janet Taylor married Thomas Bradshaw (Broadshaw) June 7, 1827, Middle Church, Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland. Janet Taylor and Thomas Bradshaw had the following children: John b. 1833, Middle Church, Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland m. Elizabeth McDiarmid Thomas b. 1836, Middle Church, Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland m. Mary McDonald James b. 1841, Middle Church, Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland m. Isabella McKenzie Janet b.1849 Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland m. John Gemmill ____________________________________ John Bradshaw married Elizabeth McDearmid (McDiarmid) on December 7, 1860 in Milton, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland. John was born in 1833, Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland. Elizabeth was born on June 11, 1838, Kilchoman, Argyllshire, Scotland. John and Elizabeth had the following children: Thomas (1861-1954)m. Ellen Elizabeth Goring Annabella (Died as Child) (1863-1874) Janet (1865-) John (1867-)m. Maggie Elizabeth (1869-) Emily (1871-)m. Francis Templeton Mary Helen (1873-) m. James Roy Archibald (1874-)m. Marion McDonald If you have any information, please e-mail me. I look forward to hearing from you. Candace

----- Original Message ----- From: "Drew" <drewmac@ihug.co.nz> To: <ButeshireGenWeb-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, March 02, 2001 5:15 AM Subject: Re: Old Occupations Questions > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: McCabeClan <mccabe@istar.ca> > > > > > > Does anyone know where in Ayrshire the coal was usually imported from for > use in Arran? > > > Cheers > Drew > NZ Drew The nearest place to import coal from would be Saltcoats whose harbour was linked by canal to the pits around Stevenston. Willie > > > > ==== ButeshireGenWeb Mailing List ==== > *********************************************************************** > The Buteshire GenWeb page is at > http://www.rootsweb.com/~sctbutes/ > > ============================== > Visit Ancestry's Library - The best collection of family history > learning and how-to articles on the Internet. > http://www.ancestry.com/learn/library > >

----- Original Message ----- From: McCabeClan <mccabe@istar.ca> > > If a man living in Lamlash, Kilbride Parish, Arran was described from 1851 onwards as a coal merchant/coal agent wouldn't he have to have the coal all brought over from Ayrshire? > Does anyone know where in Ayrshire the coal was usually imported from for use in Arran? ******* Kilbride pages of the 2nd Statistical Accounts page 9, http://edina.ac.uk/cgi/StatAcc/StatAcc.cgi tells us that a little south of the Cock, blind or glance coal of excellent quality was found. It was not mined but thought you might be interested. Cheers Drew NZ

"Shaw turners" wouldn't be shawl turners, would it? I have just looked at my great grandmother's Paisley shawl. It has a narrow hem (about 1/8inch) to which is attached a fringe. The hem is stitched by hand. I await correction. Coal mining in Ayrshire. There was far more of it in Renfrewshire but it would depend where the border cut through. And some of the ports from which the coal would be shipped over to Arran and Bute would be in Ayrshire. The coal stretched down to Cumnock and New Cumnock. We may not have had as much snow in Britain as you've had in Ontario, but we have had enough, thank you. My feet haven't felt quite so fruz as they do right now in a long, long time. /cheers Pat (once a Torontonian, now living in UK) ----- Original Message ----- From: "McCabeClan" <mccabe@istar.ca> To: <ButeshireGenWeb-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, March 01, 2001 2:44 PM Subject: Old Occupations Questions > Hello All, > > A couple of questions... > > I have a chaps two young daughters in an 1851 census described as "shaw turners" by occupation. > I'm just guessing that this probably had something to do with cloth making etc. but does anyone know for sure what this occupation was? > > If a man living in Lamlash, Kilbride Parish, Arran was described from 1851 onwards as a coal merchant/coal agent wouldn't he have to have the coal all brought over from Ayrshire? > Does anyone know where in Ayrshire the coal was usually imported from for use in Arran? > > Thanks a lot. > > Pat > > > > ==== ButeshireGenWeb Mailing List ==== > *********************************************************************** > For Websites or WebPages of Buteshire GenWeb subscribers see > http://www.rootsweb.com/~sctbutes/homepage.htm > > ============================== > Search over 900 million names at Ancestry.com! > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/rwlist1.asp > >

McCabeClan wrote: > > Hello All, > > A couple of questions... > > I have a chaps two young daughters in an 1851 census described as "shaw turners" by occupation. > I'm just guessing that this probably had something to do with cloth making etc. but does anyone know for sure what this occupation was? > > If a man living in Lamlash, Kilbride Parish, Arran was described from 1851 onwards as a coal merchant/coal agent wouldn't he have to have the coal all brought over from Ayrshire? > Does anyone know where in Ayrshire the coal was usually imported from for use in Arran? > > Thanks a lot. > > Pat Dear Pat, >From my 4 years on the Scottish lists, I have read many postings from members researching their ancestors in the area from Ayrshire and sorrounding Lowlands who were coal miners. Go to <www.rootsweb.com> for Archives and look under the years 2000, 1999 and 1998 on the SCOTLAND-GENWEB-L and also the Scotch-Irish-L (this contains many Scots who migrated to Northern Ireland {Ulster}); additionally, Northern Ireland had its own coal fields and may have been a source for coal to Arran. BTW, the Archives are a great source for information, but you do need to search each year and each list individually. Happy Hunting, Daphne Jacob