A belated welcome to Maureen G, P. O'Brien and Sheila Martin who joined during or immediately after the RootsWeb problem period. If you haven't already contributed, we hope to hear from you soon. ****** ****** ****** Thanks to Bill for his informative post on the 1851 census 'comments' (even if it did come twice due to the RootsWeb problems), and his later advice that the full ED descriptions are now on his Census Website. Background - The 1851 Microfiche Index ED descriptions were originally included in Musings #6 to #10 back in Feb/Mar 1999. However the compiler's of the Fiche index set, in their wisdom, left out the interesting (non geographic) descriptions. The ones that had extra "descriptive" information in the original Census books are Kilbride ED's 8, 10 & 11; Kilmory ED 1; and Rothesay ED's 1 and 16. Bill's post covered Kilbride #8 and Kilmory #1 - just a reminder that you will find the extra information for the others on Bill's site at http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~buteshire1841/index.htm {Note: Rothesay ED #1 will be found under the Rothesay Link 1 & Rothesay ED #16 will be found under Rothesay Link 2} ****** ****** ****** Feel free to join in and present your own items. Peter Cook cookfmly@bigpond.com List maintainer and Co-host with Barbara < babrown12@optonline.net > of the ButeshireGenWeb mailing list.

Merv Please may I have the details from the Marriage Cert.? I had an Isabella ROSS in Rothesay and would be interested to see if there's any connection. Cyndy -------------------------------Original Message----------------------------------------------------- Yes Peter Hyndman was my great grandfather's brother, he married Isabella Ross in 1891at Rothesay, I have copied marriage certificate, don't know a lot about Isabella but have followed Hyndman line back to Kintyre, please let me know what details you want. Regards, Merv. _________________________________________________________________ Add MSN 8 Internet Software to your current Internet access and enjoy patented spam control and more. Get two months FREE! http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/byoa

Hi List, I am a current member of the Lanark List and am an ARBUCKLE by birth. I am researching ARBUCKLE in Scotland and have my own line back to the marriage of William ARBUCKLE & Agnes ADDIE in 1784. I would like to ask if anybody is researching ARBUCKLE or has this name mentioned in their family tree to either subscribe to the rootsweb ARBUCKLE list and post the information that they have or contact me off list and I will make a note of the information. I have lists of all ARBUCKLE bmd from Scotlands People Website and I try to help others by using these lists to narrow their searches and hopefully one day will be able connect the majority of bmd to each other. As there isn't an ARBUCKLE on the Guild of One Name Studies, then a central place where everybody can send there info is probably the next best thing. Please contact me off list as I am sending this email to every list in Scotland (eventually), and will not be staying subbed. The website addresses mentioned above are Scotland People http://www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk/ Rootsweb List for ARBUCKLE ARBUCKLE-L@rootsweb.com to subscribe ARBUCKLE-L-request@rootsweb.com and digest mode is ARBUCKLE-D-request@rootsweb.com My own email address is avrila@lineone.net I would just like to say thank you to each list for their time and hope that one day ALL the ARBUCKLE's will be able to connect from all different countries. All information that is sent to me will be kept in the strictest confidence, I am not in this for anything other than the satisfaction of knowing that if anybody wants help with ARBUCKLE they now know of somebody else that might be able to help. Thanks Avril Anderton (nee Arbuckle) --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.528 / Virus Database: 324 - Release Date: 16-10-03

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/SeC.2ACI/379.383.1 Message Board Post: Hi Marguerite, Yes Peter Hyndman was my great grandfather's brother, he married Isabella Ross in 1891at Rothesay, I have copied marriage certificate, don't know a lot about Isabella but have followed Hyndman line back to Kintyre, please let me know what details you want. Regards, Merv.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Surnames: Hyndman, Ross Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/SeC.2ACI/379.383 Message Board Post: Hi, Have you a Peter Hyndman who married Isabella Ross in Rothesay in 1890, she died in 1926. I would be grateful if you could pass on any information , she died at Meadowcap, I think, thank you Marguerite

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/SeC.2ACI/546.1 Message Board Post: I have connections to a Duncan Weir who was married to a Margaret McIlroy and lived in Millport in the 1900's. Is this your Weir's? Would be glad of a reply. thank you.

Hello, Many thanks to Bill, Marion and Irene for the wealth of information that they have sent. It is greatly appreciated. It would seem to be a safe assumption that this is our Robert, what a shame the father is not listed. Can anyone explain why I can find lists of 1700's female Cunningham births in the IGI, but no boys! Thanks again, Regards, Sheila Pembrokeshire.

Hi all, I've now posted a transcription of all the 1851 enumeration district descriptions on the census homepage, address given below. Just click on the relevant piece to access them. If anything interesting in the ministers comments arises, I'll post those directly to the list. As time permits, I will go through the 1841 film and do likewise. (I am reliably informed that the enumeration books were filmed with all but the cover included.) Cheers Bill Coordinator for Buteshire 1841& 1851 FreeCensus Project Link to Home Page: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~buteshire1841/index.htm

Hi Sheila, Perhaps the ages and relationships given in the later census might be helpful in sorting out the family. The following are the Cunninghams that are listed in the 1851 census for Cumbray. 29 Kames Street. Mary Cunningham, head, widowed, age 63, housekeeper, b. Cumbray, Bute Margaret Cunningham, dau, unmarried, age 29, b. Cumbray, Bute (Also listed are 4 lodgers, masons from Largs, Ayrshire) Also at the 29 Kames St is another Cunningham family Thomas, head, married, age 35, shoemaker, b. Cumbray, Bute Jane, wife, aged 34, b. Largs, Ayrshire Robert, son aged 5, scholar, b. Cumbray Jane Boyd, dau. aged 5 b. Cumbray James, son, aged 2 b. Cumbray John, son, aged 1 b. Cumbray Cardiff Street, Margaret Cunningham, head, unmarried, 40, Dressmaker b. Cumbray At 4 Kames Street (spelling as enum.) John Cuningham, head, mar, 76, superannuated seaman, Cumbray Elizabeth, wife, 62, Cumbray William, son, unmar, 38, shoemaker, Cumbray Mary, dau, unmar, 28, Cumbray Elizabeth, grand dau, 9, scholar, Cumbray The Hunters were rather numerous, accounting for 7.5% of the 1841 Cumbray population and 8.8% by 1851 so it perhaps a bit of a jump to assume that there is a connection on the basis of occupation but it certainly doesn't rule out the possibility. Cheers, Bill

That would be excellent.......thanks edward Limpsfield, Surrey Using Norton Anti-Virus 2003

Hi All, The following I posted on the 11th but with the list problems, I suspect it has disappeared off into a black hole somewhere. (If it didn't, I apologise for the repeat.) Last week Peter raised the question of comments on census films. >From what I can see, they were absent from the county in 1841. In the 1851 census there was, at the start of each enumeration district, a space for remarks of the Minister of the Parish. While the majority of these, that I have seen so far, are nothing more than a declaration that it's an accurate record, the Minister for Cumbray had a bit more to say for himself. He did have handwriting however that is even worse than mine so this is the best I can. do. "ED 1 As this is the largest district, I here remark in regard to the parish generally, that by the present census the population is 138 less than in 1841. To account for this it is remarked that the pop. In '41 was taken in June when in summer this place is ... to by visitors and others for the benefit of their health, hence the decrease. At the same time the Native population is about 1000 an I have several times observed in the course of my official visitations; and the [increase?] from 1000 to 1275 to be accounted for, from the circumstance of there being at present - as for about 2 years past, a vast importation of masons, joiners, labourers etc employed in the erection of new building, while, when complete - they will again be obliged to leave the parish. At the same time a few visitors and strangers were in the village when the census was taken. ED 2. As this No 2 forms part of the village of Millport, the remarks made on No 1 apply to this district. P.S. In No 3 I have remarked that there is an increase of the population in the country, which perhaps ought to have been entried in No 1 & which will afill farther account for the increase of the population generally for these three or four years ED 3. The Little Cumbray, the population of which has been taken, is not part of the parish of Cumbray but of West Kilbride, Ayrshire and yet it is in the County of Bute and so, for that reason I conclude it has been included with the parish. It will be observed that in the county there are 15 houses and 127 persons, the rest of the population being confined to the village of Millport. The population has increased in the country district in consequence of a greater number of agricultural labourers being required for improvements and the reclaiming of waste land. I approve of the manner in which the enumerator has discharged his duties." There are also, occasionally, some interesting descriptions of the individual enumeration districts within the county. Following are a couple from Arran (Again 1851) ED # 8 Kilbride The district combines the village of Lamlash and a few detached farm houses upon both sides of the said village. There are no public works going on in the village. It is a great watering place. Steam boats run twixt Glasgow and Lamlash every day during the steamer season and crowds of people come from Glasgow, Paisley and all the neighbouring towns upon the opposite coast of the mainland. Lamlash district is bounded upon the east and nor-east by the Brodick road , on the north and nor-west by the heathery hills that stand about 1 quarter of a mile above Lamlash, on the west and south-west by Penlester Burn, a small water that runs from the hills and upon the south east by the far famed harbour of Lamlash so acceptable by the poor fatigued sailor. ED # 1 Kilmory So much of the parish of Kilmory as lies between the march separating Dipping from Kilbride Parish and Levencorrach Water (comprehending five farms vis:- Dipping, Kildonian, Drumlabarra, Ballymenoch and Auchenhew also the island of Pladda.) The district is entirely agricultural, each farm divided into lots of different sizes varying from 16 acres to 50 acres each. These lots increase in size as to their distance to the shore, their rent varying form 15/- per Scotch acre to 35/- according to the quality of the land and the nearness to the shore for seaweed for manure. The Island of Pladda is separated from Arran by a channel about a mile in breadth If anything else turns up I will let you know. Cheers, Bill

Hello everyone,I'm new to this list and would like to post my interest: HENRY CAMPBELL BN 1874 Rothesay Bute married 1898 ST.Andrews Chapel Rothesay to GRACE TURNER.Residence 19 Store Lane Rothesay HENRY CAMPBELL'S father was JAMES CAMPBELL & mother was CATHERINE REILLY. That is about all the info i have right now! If their is anyone with the same connections would very much like to hear from them. Regards Maureen

In a message dated 18/10/2003 22:45:49 GMT Standard Time, elinor.martin@btinternet.com writes: > It seems that my gg grandfather, Robert Cunningham, was born in Millport, > Bute. > He was born on 3rd October, 1813. > His parents were Robert Cunningham, Exciseman, and Mary Hunter, who were > married on 31st August 1810, in Cumbraes parish. > Robert junior's children were all born in Glasgow, and he died in Dalziel, > in 1890. > In the 1841 census transcript, there seem to be three Cunningham households. > A John Cunningham, Revenue pensioner, is head of one, and Mrs Robert > Cunningham seems to be head of another. Is this Mary Hunter? Is Robert dead, or > away? Hi when Robert married Mary Hunter in 1810 he was described as "Robert Cunningham sailor in the cutter and Mary Hunter" .the cutter presumably being the Royal George. Robert Cunningham the father says he was born 3 Feb 1780............ in the early 1800s a lot of the birth entries were collected by the minister from family bibles and the families are entered as groups............. and this is where the birthdate of Robert the father comes from ........... but the names of his parents are not given. the info is on Frame Number 113 on the film. <<<<<<<<<The following are the Cunninghams that are listed in the 1851 census for Cumbray. 29 Kames Street. Mary Cunningham, head, widowed, age 63, housekeeper, b. Cumbray, Bute Margaret Cunningham, dau, unmarried, age 29, b. Cumbray, Bute (Also listed are 4 lodgers, masons from Largs, Ayrshire) Also at the 29 Kames St is another Cunningham family Thomas, head, married, age 35, shoemaker, b. Cumbray, Bute Jane, wife, aged 34, b. Largs, Ayrshire Robert, son aged 5, scholar, b. Cumbray Jane Boyd, dau. aged 5 b. Cumbray James, son, aged 2 b. Cumbray John, son, aged 1 b. Cumbray>>>>>>>>>>> '''''''''''''' Robert Cunningham and Mary Hunter had Children 1 M Thomas Cunningham Birth: 26 Jun 1811 Cumbrae 2 M Robert Cunningham Birth: bef 3 Oct 1813 Cumbrae 3 M James Cunningham Birth: bef 9 Jun 1817 Cumbrae 4 F Margaret Cunningham Birth: bef 26 Mar 1819Cumbrae Death: 30 Aug 1888 Cumbrae 5 M John Cunningham Birth: 22 May 1821 Cumbrae 6 M Isaac Cunningham Birth: 22 May 1821 Cumbrae could Thomas the shoemaker be the eldest child ...still rounding down his age in 1851??? Cardiff Street, Margaret Cunningham, head, unmarried, 40, Dressmaker b. Cumbray At 4 Kames Street (spelling as enum.) John Cuningham, head, mar, 76, superannuated seaman, Cumbray Elizabeth, wife, 62, Cumbray William, son, unmar, 38, shoemaker, Cumbray Mary, dau, unmar, 28, Cumbray Elizabeth, grand dau, 9, scholar, Cumbray I think this pair are a John Cunningham and his wife Elizabeth Simpson whose son William was born 22 Feb 1812 ..I've got them marrying in April 1811..where he is called 'mariner Royal George Cutter' She died in 1885 and he was dead by that time. Irene

Not surprisingly there were no new subscribers this week, although several current subscribers did check that they were still 'on' the list once the 'list2' server came back up. As always, if you haven't already contributed, we hope to hear from you soon. ****** ****** ****** Digest Subscribers with bigpond.com (and associated Aussie ISP's), may need to check the archives, as due to their ISP's problems (coming on top of the RootsWeb ones) Bute Digest V03 #135 bounced for some of you. The following link takes you to monthly indexes of the list mail archives - an alternative to searching the full archive, if for example, you've been off on holiday for just a few weeks, or you have missed a single digest. http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/ButeshireGenWeb/ Minor issue (for me) is the requirement to scroll to the bottom for the current month :-( The address to use to search the full archive is :- http://searches.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/listsearch.pl Enter the name of the list - in this case ButeshireGenWeb, then follow the prompts at the next screen, you will have to choose a year if you do not want the default (current) year. Note however that due to the problems this week, this archive has not yet been updated. Thus, for example, last Sunday's Musing's #218 is not listed yet, but it is shown in the October 2003 index. {With the recent problems at both RootsWeb and Bigpond, issue #218 may have arrived in subscriber's mail boxes any day this last week, but is correctly dated in the monthly archive at 12 October.} ****** ****** ****** Feel free to join in and present your own items. Peter Cook cookfmly@bigpond.com List maintainer and Co-host with Barbara babrown12@optonline.net of the ButeshireGenWeb mailing list.

Hello Sheila, The book Bute & Arran Monumental Inscriptions pre 1855 has a Cumbrae MI for Robert Cunningham, died 18.7.1840, aged 62, and his wife Mary Hunter, died 30.9.1863, aged 77. Could this be your couple? They had a daughter Margaret died 30.8.1888 aged 69 according to the MI. Madeleine Wales *Bute & Arran Monumental Inscriptions pre 1855, edited by Alison Mitchell. Published by the Scottish Genealogy Society 1997

Hello Everyone, Hurrah! After more than a week of trying, evidently problems at rootsweb, I've just joined your list, as I've only recently discovered ancestors from Cumbrae. ( Hope I don't get multiple mailings as a result of all my attempts) It seems that my gg grandfather, Robert Cunningham, was born in Millport, Bute. He was born on 3rd October, 1813. His parents were Robert Cunningham, Exciseman, and Mary Hunter, who were married on 31st August 1810, in Cumbraes parish. Robert junior's children were all born in Glasgow, and he died in Dalziel, in 1890. In the 1841 census transcript, there seem to be three Cunningham households. A John Cunningham, Revenue pensioner, is head of one, and Mrs Robert Cunningham seems to be head of another. Is this Mary Hunter? Is Robert dead, or away? I would presume John and Robert were related. There are also Hunters who were Revenue men. Can it be assumed that this is the branch of the family that Mary came from? Look forward to hearing from the experts. Regards, Sheila Martin

RootsWeb's list2 server has been out of commission for several days, for urgent maintenance work, and this has caused significant disruption for many Mailing Lists, including ButeshireGenWeb. Some Lists, have only been marginally affected in that there has been some duplication of messages. The latest news from RootsWeb is that the server is now back up and running. If all goes to plan then the release of backlogged messages will take place over a period of time - perhaps a few days - so affected list subscribers should not be hit by a large volume in one go. Messages might not be released or received in chronological order. Please also note that some lists may not come back on line immediately. No details have been made available as which lists these are, so I'm sending this in the hope that Bute is NOT one of them. Kind regards Peter Cook Rossmoyne Western Australia <cookfmly@bigpond.com> List maintainer and Co-host with Barbara <babrown12@optonline.net> .

Hi listers, I am related to the WRIGHT family who were Grocers/Coal Merchants in Rothesay from about 1825 in Montague St. They lived in Rothesay but built a new home called "Braeside" near Loch Ascog in 1851....... Robert WRIGHT married Helen THOM in Rothesay 1825 (I am their ggg granddaughter) Helen's father was John Thom and her mother was Elizabeth TAIT. They married Craigie by Kilmarnock 1805 Helen was born in Tarbolton c1805 and had a sister Jean who I think married Adam DICK (but I'm not 100% sure if she was Helen's sister). There was a brother John also. So I'm stuck here trying to link them up. John Thom (Helen's father) had three brothers: Robert, William and James (all born in Tarbolton I think). Robert Thom was a cotton spinner but became a civil engineer and the owner of Rothesay Cotton Mills. He also worked on maximising the water power to drive the cotton mills in West Lothian and Rothesay and gained a reputation as an excellent hydraulic engineer. He was commissioned to design the domestic and industrial water supply to Greenock They lived on a farm in Ascog Tower, Kingarth. William was a surgeon and moved to Annan James was also a civil engineer Robert THOM married Catherine PRENTICE 1814 in Edinburgh. Her brother was Archibald Prentice the soon to be Manager of the Rothesay Cotton Mill. They had 6 children - only 3 survived - Robert, Catherine and Eliza Robert died at 34 - not sure if he married Catherine moved to Logie, Perth - never married Eliza married James ANNAN and raised 3 children in Ascog but later moved to Stirling, Roseneath and later West Kilbride, Ayr I would appreciate any help or information on any of the above. Many thanks, Liz Larsen Coffs Harbour Australia (ex New Zealand)

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/SeC.2ACI/79.213.1.1.1.1 Message Board Post: Just wrote down"from wind and tide." Never heard that before. I have, "and in the still earlier Dean of Lismore mc (c 1512) Drumboy was let to Donald McCawe or Makkaw in 1481, and in 1487 he is recorded as dead. Patrick and John Makcaw had receipt of remission pro inter fictione quondam Johnannes Makcornok (?) John Makcaw was familiar servitor to King James V. and Archdeacon of the Cathedral Church of Lismore. Donald McCaw Voyll was fined for reset of members of Clan Gregor 1613 and in 1662 Alison Makca is in record in Edinburgh. There was an old family of this name in Bute. In 1506, Gillinaw M'Kaw had a grant of the land of North Garrochach. Gilpatrick Makkaw had half of the land of South Garrochach, and John MakKaw , the other half. Gilpatrick Makcoe of Dungull, Bute is in record ,1534 . Patrick Mc'Kaw and Isobell More Mc'Kaw, his wife were charged with witchcraft in Bute in 1662.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/SeC.2ACI/79.213.1.1.1 Message Board Post: I have a copy of a letter saying McCaws were cast adrift from Bute-presumably for sheep stealing, and by wnd and tide came to N. Ireland. I am not aware McCaws became protestant on reaching Ireland. My earliest McCaw reference is 1481and a place called Drumboy let to Donald McCawe. My earliest Bute reference is 1490 when Christian McCaw witnessed a sasine(legal document) in favour of Ninian Stewart the Sheriff of Bute.