No new members this week, however welcome back to Mrs Irene Macleod after a short break. ****** ****** ****** There has been some discussion recently on the Lanark list about the RootsWeb PML service. It started from discussion on the practice of placing "blanket" research surname lists in auto signatures. (My personal opinion on these is that they should be discouraged, but its not a "Rule" for this list - yet <G>) I've extracted the main points (Note: a minimum financial contribution to RootWeb is required [Currently US$24 per annum] ) ... ~~~~~ ~~~~~ ~~~~~ One excellent reason to put in spaces or add a random asterisk (e.g. S*mith) is to prevent unnecessary distribution via PML. If you wrote your surnames without spaces in every single message you sent, then anyone who had signed on for these names would get EVERY single message you ever write, plus those that people reply to without editing them out. For those of you wondering, "What on earth is PML?" It's the RootsWeb Personal Mailing List program for donors at the $24 level and higher: Registering for PML brings all messages posted to RootsWeb's thousands and thousands of archived mailing lists which include your surnames. You won't need to subscribe to a zillion mailing lists just in case someone mentions your ancestor, just register with this program! Also searched: new GenConnect messages and new submissions to the RootsWeb Surname List. I highly recommend it! Audrey Ann Bennett ~~~~~ ~~~~~ ~~~~~ This ought to help you out: http://pml.rootsweb.com/ You can also click on "Support Levels and Benefits" under the subheading "CONTRIBUTING TO ROOTSWEB" from the RootsWeb main page at http://www.rootsweb.com. Scroll down to "Sponsor Level" for PML info. Audrey ~~~~~ ~~~~~ ~~~~~ And after you start using PML you should consider joining PML-USERS-L to swap ideas & questions with other users. mailto:[email protected]?subject=subscribe&body=subscri be Alex ****** ****** ****** At http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~ayrshire/mypics.html some Bute and Arran pics from Ayrshire List Owner Alex Hughes<[email protected]> ****** ****** ****** Feel free to join in and present your own items. Peter Cook [email protected] List owner and Co-host with Barbara < [email protected] > of the ButeshireGenWeb mailing list. List owner of the SCT-RENFREW and SCT-ARGYLL mailing lists.

Hello again everyone, Bill's message reminded me of a posting last year. I have taken the liberty of copying it below, from the archive. With thanks to Bill and Gerald, Madeleine Date: Sat, 13 Mar 1999 21:51:38 -0500 From: Gerald Teaster <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Message-id: <[email protected]> Subject: Massacre at Toward and Dunoon Several have made the request recently for more information about the massacre of 200 people at Toward. I have had the good fortune to be able to visit the remains of the small castle at Toward and have long been interested in its story. The actual massacre was not at Toward but in Dunoon about 10 miles away. Toward Castle was the home of the Lamont clan. The Lamonts were the ruling clan in the Cowal district that includes Dunoon and Toward. The Lamonts had a long running feud with the powerful Campbell clan under the Marquis of Argyle. By 1646, when the killing occurred, this feud was over 200 years old. There are conflicting stories of how the feud started. One account says that it started in 1400 over women. The sons of one of the Lamont chieftains interfered with an attempt by members of the Court of King Robert III to capture and carry off some of the Lamont girls. At this time, the King was in residence at the Royal Castle at Rothesay, on the Isle of Bute. The mainland at Toward is only about two or three miles away from Rothesay across the Kyles of Bute. As time went on the feud deepened. It came to a head in 1646. The Lamonts and Campbell were on different sides during the time of religious upheaval in Scotland known as the Covenanting. This issue had led to warfare between the different factions throughout Scotland. In June 1646, the Campbells attacked the Lamonts in their small castle at Toward. The story of this attack is quoted directly from the excellent Lamont web site "http://third.informatik.uni-kl.de/~daniel/clan2.html". "Dunoon is a place of grim memory for the Lamonts. There the Campbells carried out one of the massacres which stain their clan's history. In 1646 the Campbells made a concentrated attack on the Lamont castles of Toward and Ascog, and, when the garrisons surrendered under written guarantee of liberty, the Campbells ignored the terms of capitulation. The survivors of the defenders were carried in boats to Dunoon and in the church were sentenced to death. About 100 were shot or stabbed to death and another 36 of 'the special gentlemen' of the Lamonts were hanged from a tree in the churchyard and dead and dying were buried in pits. The Chief and his close kin were hustled away to Inveraray, where some were hanged The Chief and his brothers being kept prisoner for five years. It was 16 years before the ringleaders of the massacre were brought to justice, and Sir Colin Campbell was beheaded. The Clan Lamont Society in 1909 raised a monument on the spot where so many met their deaths." This monument can still be seen today in Dunoon. The small "family sized" Castle at Toward gives little hint of its bloody past. I have photographs of the castle remains that I would be happy to scan and send to anyone that is interested. Gerald Teaster Summerville, SC ______________________________

Like Madeleine, I have been ploughing through Blain's History of Bute and there are a couple of other points that may be relevant.(Then again they may not be, I am a very late starter when it comes to Scottish history.) One is that about 1500, James Stewart, the then sheriff of Bute married Lady Mary Campbell the daughter of Archibald, Earl of Argyll. there was no issue from that marriage and James remarried. By 1544 it appears that the Earl of Argyll( or the son possibly of the former) had possession of Rothesay castle and the command of the whole Island. Although his stay was fairly brief the intention, it seems, was "divesting the Sheriff of a considerable portion of his estate." It would appear from the account that the Campbells had the support of the Lamonds of Toward Castle. Loyalties and alliances it seems were pretty negotiable. From another source "In 1641 the Lamonds, beseiged in Toward Castle by the clan Campbell were induced to surrender on the condition that their lives would be spared. They were at once marched to Dunoon Castle and cruelly butchered. Among a number of Butemen who went to their rescue and shared their fate were Provost John Jamieson and John McKinlay."

Hello everyone, In case it's of interest, here is a list of the landholders in the island of Bute in 1657, "as appears by Cromwell's valuation". This is from Blain's History of Bute (1880) - his punctuation. Sir James Stewart, sheriff of Bute; Bannatyne of Kames, Ninian Stewart of Kilchattan, Ninian Stewart of Ascog, Robert Jameson, crowner; John Stewart of Gallachan, John Stewart of Ardinho; John Stewart of Ambrismore, Ninian Spence of Wester Kames; Ninian Bannatyne of Kerrylamont, James Stewart of Kilwhinleck, Archibald Bannatyne of Lubas, Donald More McCaw of the half of North Garrachty; MacCaw, of South Garrachty; Stewart of Largizean; John Macwarthie, of Kerrymenoch; John Macpherson, of the half of Kerrytonley; Mackirdy, of Bruchag; Allan MacConachy, of Quochag; Robert Stewart, of Scarrel; Ninian, Fier portioner of Barnauld; Donald MacConachy, of Ambrisbeg; John Glass, portioner of Mid-Ascog; Archibald Stewart, and Robert Macilcheran, of Ardscalpsey; Donald Macneil, of Kilmory; Mr Patrick Stewart, of Roseland; Duncan Campbell, of Stuck; Robert Campbell, of Tawnie; Robert MacNeil, of Lenihall; John Bannatyne, portioner of Glecknabae; Allan, of Eskechragan; Robert Stewart, of Achawilling; Hugh Boyd, of Kneslagloan, (an encumbrancer); Edmond Stuart, of Mecknoch; Jamieson, of Lenihulline; Donald Campbell, of Kilmichael. "In about 50 years after this period, there remained of the foregoing only - the Earl of Bute; Bannatyne of Kames; Stewart of Ascog; Stewart of Kilwhinleck; MacCaw, portioner of South Garrachty; Macpherson, portioner of Kerrytonley; Macwrarthie, of Kerrymenoch; MacConachy, of Ambrisbeg; Glass, portioner of Mid-Ascog; and MacNeil of Kilmory." Madeleine

Candy, I started to try to answer your question about the "Campbell/Stuart Bute split" but quickly realised it was sadly outside my capabilities:-( Hopefully someone else will step forward. I did dig out some other information that might be of interest. The name of Stuart, Scotland's royal dynasty, is intertwined with the history of Bute. The family name of the current Marquess of Bute, who lives on the island, is Crichton-Stuart (the Crichton was added in the early 19th century because of a marriage). The Crichton-Stuart family can trace their ancestry back to the 12th century. By 1204, these Stuarts held lands in Bute. In 1315 Walter Stuart married the daughter of Robert the Bruce, their son becoming Robert II, the first Stuart king. Robert had 13 children by two marriages and eight out of wedlock. A John Stuart was appointed hereditary Sheriff of Bute in 1385 and granted certain lands on the island, but it is uncertain whether he was one of Robert's second family or one of the illegitimate. The family was given various hereditary titles over the centuries and continued to prosper. Most of the island is now owned by the Marquess. The ancient family of Bannatyne, originally from Ayrshire, occupied the 14th century Kames Castle at the north end of Bute. At one time the family had 11 estates throughout Scotland, although Kames was always the main one. The last of the direct line of Bannatynes, James, died in 1786. He was succeeded by his nephew, William Mcleod, who took the name Bannatyne. The estate was sold in 1812. The name Glass appears to be an old one on Bute. It is mentioned in 17th century records for Kingarth, for example, and in the 1660s a John Glass was the provost of Rothesay. A list of landholders in the island in 1657 includes John Glass, portioner of Mid-Ascog. There are Glass tombstones at Rothesay and Kingarth. I *think* the Campbell/Stuart split referred to might be to do with a document called the National Covenant and also loyalties during the English Civil War. The Campbells, led by the Duke of Argyll, supported the Covenant and fought against the king. I believe the Stuarts of Bute were loyalists, but I am not sure of this. Can someone help me out here? As you may know, Charles I (1625-49), raised in England, had little understanding of Scottish religious reformism and believed in the divine right of kings. In 1637 he attempted to impose a new prayer book on the Kirk. The reformers in Scotland denounced his changes as Popery and organised the National Covenant, a religious pledge that committed the signatories to "labour by all means lawful to recover the purity and liberty of the Gospel as it was established and professed." Bute on the whole supported the Covenant. Hector Bannatyne of Kames signed as a representative of the landowners of Bute and Matthew Spence for the burgesses of Rothesay. As far as I know the Campbells had no family ties to Bute, but I'm prepared to be corrected on that. There were various Campbell raids on the island. During the 1685 rebellion the followers of the Duke of Argyll overran Bute, plundered the town of Rothesay and burned Rothesay Castle, after which it remained ruined and uninhabitable. Most of my information on the Bute families comes from The Isle of Bute by Norman S Newton (published by David and Charles ISBN 1 898630 00, £7.99). This is basically a guide book but it gives a good overview of Bute history and has stunning pictures of the island. The Island of Bute by Ian S Munro (David and Charles ISBN 0 7153 6081) is also basically a travel book, but goes into a little more detail about the island's history. It is out of print but you might be able to get it through a library. As you may know, In Search of Scottish Ancestry by Gerald Hamilton-Edwards (Phillimore) has a good introduction to Scottish history and explains about the Covenanters etc. I also find Scotland The Rough Guide handy for its general information on Scotland as well as its explanation of the historical framework. I hope you find your Glass connection to Bute :-) I also hope I'm not going to regret stepping outside my area of limited knowledge into this fascinating but complicated period of Scottish history. Fingers crossed but I wait to be corrected ... Regards Madeleine Wales In a message dated 4/6/00 11:19:44 AM GMT Daylight Time, [email protected] writes: << Recently Daphne Kilbourn-Jacob posted some information in which she mentioned the Campbell and Stuart Septs split Bute. I am woefully uninformed on the history of Bute and was wondering if someone could give me some background on this split. I'm told my family (Glass) was a Sept of Stuart of Bute, so am wondering how/if this split impacted my (so far, unsuccessful) search for Bute ancestors. >>

Greetings Listers - Recently Daphne Kilbourn-Jacob posted some information in which she mentioned the Campbell and Stuart Septs split Bute. I am woefully uninformed on the history of Bute and was wondering if someone could give me some background on this split. I'm told my family (Glass) was a Sept of Stuart of Bute, so am wondering how/if this split impacted my (so far, unsuccessful) search for Bute ancestors. Candy Cox Charlotte, North Carolina

Hello Rob, You can contact me on e-mail: [email protected] or PO Box 719 Bowral NSW 2576 Australia. Looking forward to hearing from you. Kevin Herring. ----- Original Message ----- From: Rob Petterson <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, April 05, 2000 11:34 AM Subject: RE: Bannatyne/Taylor > We were interested in seeing this message, because we also have this Ann > Bannatyne and John Taylor in our ancestry, through their daughter Janet > Taylor who married John McCurdy. The message gives us no way to contact > Kevin Herring, but we would like to exchange information with him and/or > with anyone else on this branch. > > Thanks for responding to the list with the attachment, Daphne! > Paula and Rob Petterson > > -----Original Message----- > From: Daphne Kilbourn-Jacob [mailto:[email protected]] > Sent: Monday, April 03, 2000 4:13 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: Ballantine/Bannatyne > > > Kevin Herring wrote: > > > > G'day Daphne, I have an Ann Bannatyne who married John Taylor at Kilmory, > > Isle of Arran 4/2/1774. I have read that the Bannatynes originated in > nearby > > Rothesay but I think they may have also been over Glasgow way earlier, > > perhaps a different lot. I have no other info on Ann at this stage, but am > > still trying to track down her ancestry. Kevin Herring, Bowral NSW > > Australia. > Dear Kevin, > The ancestral home of the Bannatynes ws actually Kames, Bute, Gaelic > family name: MacCamelyne. They were an armigerous family who were a > sept of the Campbells. According to Black, the earliest documented > member of the family was William de Bennothine of Lanark in the 1200's. > I have seen a copy of a newspaper dated ca. 1559 in Glasgow with men- > tion of several Bannatynes but didn't think they were mine so now I > can't find the site. > Thanks for writing. > Daphne Jacob > > >

We were interested in seeing this message, because we also have this Ann Bannatyne and John Taylor in our ancestry, through their daughter Janet Taylor who married John McCurdy. The message gives us no way to contact Kevin Herring, but we would like to exchange information with him and/or with anyone else on this branch. Thanks for responding to the list with the attachment, Daphne! Paula and Rob Petterson -----Original Message----- From: Daphne Kilbourn-Jacob [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Monday, April 03, 2000 4:13 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: Ballantine/Bannatyne Kevin Herring wrote: > > G'day Daphne, I have an Ann Bannatyne who married John Taylor at Kilmory, > Isle of Arran 4/2/1774. I have read that the Bannatynes originated in nearby > Rothesay but I think they may have also been over Glasgow way earlier, > perhaps a different lot. I have no other info on Ann at this stage, but am > still trying to track down her ancestry. Kevin Herring, Bowral NSW > Australia. Dear Kevin, The ancestral home of the Bannatynes ws actually Kames, Bute, Gaelic family name: MacCamelyne. They were an armigerous family who were a sept of the Campbells. According to Black, the earliest documented member of the family was William de Bennothine of Lanark in the 1200's. I have seen a copy of a newspaper dated ca. 1559 in Glasgow with men- tion of several Bannatynes but didn't think they were mine so now I can't find the site. Thanks for writing. Daphne Jacob

Graeme, If you do find a connection with John Gillies, the solicitor and town clerk of Rothesay let me know as I have found a whole heap of information on him and his family. They emigrated to NZ in 1851/2.He became a solicitor of the high court and his son, a judge, member of the legislature, treasurer of the Colony and a long list of other achievements. I have copies of fairly lengthy obituaries of them both which contain a lot of information. Bill McKinlay

Kevin Herring wrote: > > G'day Daphne, I have an Ann Bannatyne who married John Taylor at Kilmory, > Isle of Arran 4/2/1774. I have read that the Bannatynes originated in nearby > Rothesay but I think they may have also been over Glasgow way earlier, > perhaps a different lot. I have no other info on Ann at this stage, but am > still trying to track down her ancestry. Kevin Herring, Bowral NSW > Australia. Dear Kevin, The ancestral home of the Bannatynes ws actually Kames, Bute, Gaelic family name: MacCamelyne. They were an armigerous family who were a sept of the Campbells. According to Black, the earliest documented member of the family was William de Bennothine of Lanark in the 1200's. I have seen a copy of a newspaper dated ca. 1559 in Glasgow with men- tion of several Bannatynes but didn't think they were mine so now I can't find the site. Thanks for writing. Daphne Jacob

Hi Graeme, I have a document that is a disposition of a property in Castle St. Rothesay from a Janet SMITH to her sister Grace McFie on 4th March 1858. This was witnessed by two clerks of the town clerk and notiary public, John Wilson. One was Alexander Tannock, the other, William GILLIES, possibly your gg grandfather. Bill McK.

Posted on: Buteshire Scotland Queries Board URL: http://cgi.rootsweb.com/~genbbs/genbbs.cgi/Scotland/Bute?read=342 Surname: HANNIGAN, MCCLEAN ------------------------- Searching for any information related to Agnes HANNIGAN/MCCLEAN. Born Rothesay, Bute 1912-15.Parents: Catherine McClean and John Hannigan. Emigrated to US. Lived in Boston. Married John J. O'Brien. Any info re: knowledge, relatives, etc. would be appreciated. Thanks

Hello Daphne, I found these in the 1837 Pigot's Directory. (Arran) Grocers etc Bannatyne, James. Lamlash Inns Bannatyne, James. Lamlash Vitners Bannatyne, Ebenezer. Blackwater (Rothesay) Linen and Woollen Drapers Bannatyne, Gillies. Montague st Vitners Bannatyne, Dugald. Montague st Miscellaneous Bannatyne, Ninian. Fishery Office, Montague st Cheers, - Dot Wells (nee Maclean) Perth, Western Australia. mailto:[email protected] Research Names http://carmen.murdoch.edu.au/community/dps/research/wel02.html

Hi Graeme, Me again. I just remembered that I had a coulple of letters in a family album which I inherited. One of these is addressed to Mr John Gillies, Writer (Solicitor), Rothesay and the other is signed by him. The first has no date but the second is dated 23/5/1851 and is to "Dear Thomas" and I think finishes "Your aff father" so there is another little lead for you. My GGGfather was Sherriff Clerk of Rothesay and his son whose album this was had a solicitor's firm which probably followed John Gillies's. Searching a little further, I have a poster advertising a building site for sale and referring anyone who wished details thereon to contact John Gillies, Town Clerk, Rothesay and dated 17/4/1846. Going on I find some more letters to John Gillies, one written in Whitehaven by a John McKinlay on 17/10/1849 which arrived in Rothesay on 18/10/1849 - what price progress. I wish my 1st Class post arrived next day!! If you would like a copy of anything I will be pleased to fax or send them to you. Regards, Alistair

Dear List members, Have not posted for a long time because I could not tie my ancestor, William Ballantine, directly to Bute. Recently, a distant cousin sent me her GEDCOM file and I discovered that William had given his place of birth as Ayr, Scotland when he arrived in the Mass Colony when he arrived, ca. 1650. This aroused some suspicions after he married into a prominant family and it was rumored that he was really from Glasgow, that he may have been a secret Jacobite who found it necessary to leave Scotland suddenly when the English won their uprising with Covenanting help. As the Bannatyne family had been Septs of both the Campbells and the Stuarts at different times (the two Clans that split Bute), I wondered if William might have been born on Bute, gone to Glasgow as an apprentice as a cooper, but maintained contacts with the Stuarts as a supporter. He was b. in 1627, parents unk. and no records found so far of his early life until he came to Boston. Are there any historians on the list who might know anything about this? My guess is that in Scotland his Surname was spelled Bannatyne but changed to a more Anglicised Ballantine on the ship over, or even with letters of introduction, supplied by Stuarts. This sounds like a spy novel, except that the material was supplied by contemporaries who were 17th century puritan Colonists. If anyone has any information about this man, the apprenticeship of Coopers from Bute, Stuart involvement in the British Uprising of the 1640's or 'commuting' to Glasgow around this time, I would be very grateful for any details. Thanks in advance, Daphne Jacob

Posted on: Buteshire Scotland Queries Board URL: http://cgi.rootsweb.com/~genbbs/genbbs.cgi/Scotland/Bute?read=338 Surname: Bannatyne, Ballantine ------------------------- Searching for William Ballantine/Bannatyne, b. 1627, was a Cooper in Glasgow,Sct.> Boston, Mass. ca. 1645-1650, may have left Scotland suddenly during or after the English Uprising. Family originated in Bute but Wm.'s parents unk. on US genealogical records and sources.

Posted on: Buteshire Scotland Queries Board URL: http://cgi.rootsweb.com/~genbbs/genbbs.cgi/Scotland/Bute?read=337 Surname: Ferguson, Gentleman ------------------------- Trying to locate information of Malcolm Ferguson,married to Janet McEwan 17/11/1859 at Lochgiphead. Argyll Scotland. They had John Ferguson, b1860, Archibald, Eneas, Anne and Henrietta. c1862 -1868. John married Jane Gentleman, and they had seven children. Archibald, Malcolm, Jean, Annie, John, Janet and Henrietta.This last John came to Western Australia,married and settled here. His brother Archibald ,married a J. Anderson in Scotland and they had six children,none of whom we are able to locate. Their names and birth dates are: Jane Mair Gentleman FERGUSON,b.28/8/1918. Eleanor Gow FERGUSON, b10/10/1920. Angus Lamont FERGUSON,b23/10/1922 William Anderson FERGUSON.b 2/11/1924. John Maolcolm FERGUSON.b 7/1/1926, and Agnes Anderson FERGUSON b 28/6/1927. These last named could still be alive and we would like to make a contact if possible, with them or some of their family. My husband's name is Malcolm John FERGUSON . The families of William and/or Forbes GENTLEMAN ,we would also like to contact. Their family ran an undertaking business at Motherwell in Scotland and we were told that Forbes was a British Water Polo Olympian. Other branches of the family ,would also be interested in making a contact. Does anyone know if some of these people immigrated from Scotland, My husband always says "My grandmother was a Gentleman" but people in Australia have never heard of it as a surname. CAN ANY ONE OUT THERE HELP PLEASE?

Welcome to Lynnda Scallon, G Bowne , and Graeme Fitzpatrick who have joined this week. If you haven't already contributed, we hope to hear from you soon. ****** ****** ****** As announced yesterday on the Buteshire Query Board I have opted this list in for a new RootsWeb service, whereby all postings to the Bute Query Board are, to use the RootsWeb term, sent via a "gateway" to this list. As the announcement was immediately reposted to this list, we know the system works. For those of you who may wish to sort these messages to a different area within your system, note that the first line will always read: "Posted on: Buteshire Scotland Queries" As with normal List messages, subscribers who wish their reply to go only to the Query Board poster, should use their "reply to" option. Those who want their reply to come to the list as well, would probably be advised to go on line, find the "gateway"ed message in question, and post a linked reply to the Query Board. Any such post will of course get sent to the list. Please note that many of the Query Board posts are "ambit" posts ie NOT related specifically to Bute, but never-the-less still genuine attempts by frustrated researchers to advance their lines. Based on the last three months submissions, we should get an average of four extra messages per week (Range is 1 to 7). ****** ****** ****** Feel free to join in and present your own items. Peter Cook [email protected] List owner and Co-host with Barbara < [email protected] > of the ButeshireGenWeb mailing list. List owner of the SCT-RENFREW and SCT-ARGYLL mailing lists.

Posted on: Buteshire Scotland Queries Board URL: http://cgi.rootsweb.com/~genbbs/genbbs.cgi/Scotland/Bute?read=334 Surname: ------------------------- The Bute Scotland Query board has now been "gatewayed" to the ButeshireGenWeb list - Any message posted to this board will also be posted to the mailing list. (This is NOT an April 1 scam)

Hi, all. A few days ago, I listed a query for these people, on my first day on the list. The next day, I got a reply from Madeleine in Wales with some details from Bute MI's which all tie in to what we already knew. In one go, on my 2nd day on the list, Madeleine has helped me go back 2 generations and 100 years ! Thank you very much (publicly this time) Graeme PS I wonder what happens next week ?