Dear Clive I assume you have looked at the 1851 Bucks census and seen that John was a servant living with another family?Possible contenders for his parents are John and Esther? I have Youens that married my Pym family.Now,I know my cousin in Bucks met a lady in Wycombe library and they exchanged some details about the Youens family.I have our bit and probably somewhere along the line they are related.I will forward your message on to her and see if she still has details on the lady descended from the Youens family.I know she dosn`t go on line very often at the moment and she is not on the Bucks list,so maybe a while before she gets back to you. Regards Kate CHESTER --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.775 / Virus Database: 522 - Release Date: 08/10/04