Thanks Suzanne very much for your help. As Sherry rightly points out, I have quite a challenge with Isaac LEWIS. It seems almost conclusive that he is the same Charles LEWIS that I have in the census and there's nothing in what you've told me that seems to discount that theory. However, your revalation that his name is ben Avraham Avinu doesn't provide the help I was hoping for in locating hi father. In fact, it seems to suggest one of three possibilities: a) he is not actually my gg grandfather because he is not Halevi (which should be provable if I can locate my g grandfather's birth certificate), b). he is my gg grandfather but at the time of his marriage he didn't know his father's hebrew name (which seems unlikely, because he would then have to have remembered/proven later that he was Halevi), or c). he is my gg grandfather and someone after him "adopted" Halevi (which seems unlikley, because as I understand it, one has to prove one's ancestry to the rabbi when one registers a birth). Just to add to the confusion, he gives his father's name on his civil birth certificate as Levy LEWIS, and despite that being a very rare name, I cannot find a birth registration or census entry for any possible Levy LEWIS. Perhaps that means he had been adopted, or didnt know his father's real name. Or perhaps it means he was trying to obscure his past for some reason. So unless I've missed any other possibilities, I probably have to hope that a) turns out to be true, otherwise I will still have a conundrum on my hands, and it seeems not much prospect of a solution. Steve

I am sure we are all saddened to read Dom's message telling us of Su's passing. I have emailed him with our condolences on behalf of the list and unsubscribed Su's email address as he requested. If you would like to pass on your condolences then you need to do it privately although how long that address will stay active and how often it will be checked I am not sure. Best wishes, Sherry

Hi again, Suzanne. I have a question, as this was a marriage entry, is it possible that Isaac didn't know who his father was? In other words would illegitimacy be a possible answer to the "problem"? I know we discussed illegitimacy a while ago, on list, but I can't remember any definitive answer! Sherry On 28/04/2008, Suzanne Lieberman <sfl@netvision.net.il> wrote: > > > However, the next bit reads son > of Avraham Avinu. He confirmed that this is normally the name given to a > convert. The only other reason it would be used is if the party writing > the > gravestone did not know Itsik's father's name, they would write AA, as the > father of all Jews. > >

Those of you who have corresponded with Su will be sad to learn that she passed away on Friday 25th April in the local hospital, Armidale, NSW. The Funeral is on Friday next. Please light a candle for her. Dom, her son Admin - please unsubscribe

The lady's name is Bayla - which makes sense as her name is Betsy. I have asked my husband who is a not only Israeli, but also very learned in Jewish law, for his opinion of the name. He says it is Itsik, which is also Yitzchak (Isaac)which is good news for you. However, the next bit reads son of Avraham Avinu. He confirmed that this is normally the name given to a convert. The only other reason it would be used is if the party writing the gravestone did not know Itsik's father's name, they would write AA, as the father of all Jews. Hope this helps

The Deputy would have been chosen by Exeter Hebrew Congregation. There is no residential requirement for Deputies. I suggest writing to the Boad of Deputies and Exeter for further information. Exeter may well have minutes on the appointment. Maurice Hoffman Wembley

For Philip Kirby I don't know if this helps, but a Louis Frederick Pyke married Sierlah Rose Cohen, the great granddaughter of Jane Hyman (nee Cohen) who was the sister of my gt gt grandfather, Samuel Cohen who died in Sydney in 1861. Sierlah's mother was Victoria Flora Goldsmid. I have a few names closer to today, but I tend not to put the names of people who are possibly living on public places without their permission. I do know of some closer relatives and could perhaps get in touch with them in time. Just to complicate things the Cohen part of Sierlah Rose Cohen is not my Cohen family! Dinah Harvey Sydney

Hi Suzanne, I should have said that the image was a set of images taken on a mobile phone and enhanced to the best of Steve's ability and pieced together. Steve found the entry on a recent trip to London and had no camera with him, so he did the best he could. I had hoped that because I could read the English (with a bit of a struggle) that the Hebrew would be the same. Knowing a little bit about Steve's search I think that a conversion by the groom might explain a lot but Steve should decide that! Hopefully, Steve will share his thoughts with us when he reads your message. Thanks for your help. Sherry On 27/04/2008, Suzanne Lieberman <sfl@netvision.net.il> wrote: > The text is very unclear. If you have a clearer image, please send it. > >From what I can make out, the man's name is: > > xxxx son of Avraham Avinu (our Father Abraham) - which suggests that he may > be a convert > > Gila (?) daughter of Baruch > Our website is at > www.british-jewry.org.uk > We update regularly. Let us know if you have ideas to offer. > > British-Jewry-admin@rootsweb.com is the address to use for help. > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to BRITISH-JEWRY-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >

The text is very unclear. If you have a clearer image, please send it. >From what I can make out, the man's name is: xxxx son of Avraham Avinu (our Father Abraham) - which suggests that he may be a convert Gila (?) daughter of Baruch

Dear David, I am afraid I don't know - I don't even know his occupation! Regards, Beverly Dear Beverely, Is this John Hart the jeweller previously from Dublin, then Suffolk before moving to london? David Alexander Puycelsi France

My thanks to the listers who have helped me with the Hart- Pyke lines. The research began following receipt of transcripts of two letters written by Napthali Hart ( son of Henry Hart and Phoebe Myers my 4x great grandparents) from West Maitland NSW 1843/44. The letters were written to his sister Bella Solomon ( wife of Josiah) and are in the Redcliffe Salaman collection at Cambridge University( Salaman and Courlander/Phillips/Solomon are also part of my distant relatives). In the letters Napthali referred to the death of Harriet Pyke 1820-1843- she was the daughter of John Leon Pyke ( father Leon and mother Clara) 1791-1784 and Dinah Joel ( 1800-1861). This is how my interest in the Hart/Pyke lines began. Dr Phillip Kirby Norfolk England

Dear Dinah Thank you for your message regarding Pyke/Goldsmid and Hart links. My 2nd Hart line ( John Hart and Elizabeth Jacobs my 3x great grandparents) daughter Catherine Hart ( known as Kate) married Abraham Crawcour ( son of Samuel Crawcour my 5x great grandfather) and on his death married Lionel Campbell Goldsmid. I do not believe there were any children from either marriage. I am happy to be put in contact with any Hart/Goldsmid or other relatives should they wish. Best wishes Dr Phillip Kirby Norfolk England

Hello, Those of you who have been with us for over a year know how this works under AUP of Rootsweb. The site is due for renewal in early June. The site is in no danger of not being renewed as Jackye and I will see to it that it's renewed. If anyone wants to "help" then please email me off list and I will coordinate everything as I did last year. Thanks Sherry

< married Esther Hart 1821-1881( parents John Hart - jeweller- his first name may have been Henry and mother Clara maiden name unknown).> Could Esther be a sister of Samuel and/or Louis Hart? Two sisters, Ann (Nancy) and Rebecca Marks married respectively Louis Hart (b. 1823, Liberty of the Rolls) and Samuel Hart (b. 1826, St. Dunstans). Both Samuel and Louis had a father called John but I do not yet have enough proof to conclude that they were brothers, although it looks likely. Intriguingly, a niece of Ann and Rebecca, Jane Marks (b.1855), married Richard Pelham Hart, son of yet another John Hart - this John is known to have been living in Boulogne in 1875. Frustratingly I have been unable to trace any other members of these Hart lines - if anyone has a connection, I would be delighted! Beverly Bergman Camberley UK

Dear Beverely, Is this John Hart the jeweller previously from Dublin, then Suffolk before moving to london? David Alexander Puycelsi France < married Esther Hart 1821-1881( parents John Hart - jeweller- his first name may have been Henry and mother Clara maiden name unknown).> ________________________________________________________________________ AOL's new homepage has launched. Take a tour at http://info.aol.co.uk/homepage/ now.

I am doing a bit of housekeeping and updating of the web site today. Amongst the updates there is a request for someone to translate some Hebrew, from Steve Lewis. Please, if you can read Hebrew give this a look and reply to list so we can all learn. Thank you. Sherry See : http://www.british-jewry.org.uk/New%20Member%20Area/Digital%20View/digitalview.htm

Eve, I'm curious to know where you discovered that Joseph Lazarus was a member of the Board of Deputies. The book "Lost Jews of Cornwall" mentions 14 other Lazarus's and Susser 13. Strangely neither mention Joseph. I suggest you try the other towns in the south-west, Plymouth, Penzance and Falmouth as being within travelling distance, the Jews moved around and intermarried between towns. Regards, David Liss. (Watford)

My thanks to Terry Newman for his data on my Hart-Pyke- Goldsmid relatives. As a summary Phoebe Hart b 1844 d 1909 Burwood( parents Aaron Hart and Ann Rebecca Crawcour my 3x great grandparents) married Albert Aaron Goldsmid 1846-1933 Burwood( parents Joseph Goldsmid and Celia Jacobs). Phoebe was the sister of Bernard Hart m Rachel Pyke. Bernard's daughter Esther R V Hart married her cousin Percy Goldsmid in 1926 but died shortly afterwards. Phoebe and Albert's children were: Joseph/Percy/Rebecca/Lionel but there may have been more. I know very little about the Australian Goldsmid lines so any data welcome. Dr Phillip Kirby Norfolk England

Phillip I did a search for you, which seems to add to your knowledge. Bernard Hart died 12th Oct 1929 aged 70. (Baruch ben Avraham) His wife, Rachel Hart, died 6th May 1944. (Rachel bat Leib). Both tombstones in Sydney's Rookwood Jewish Cemetery. Esther R V Hart married Percy H Goldsmid in 1926 in Sydney. Unfortunately she died in 1928. Tombstone states Violet Goldsmid, died 9th Feb 1928 aged 38. Percy H Goldsmid died 21st Jany 1948 aged 77. Both tombstones in Sydney's Rookwood Jewish Cemetery. There is a possibility that Bernard and Rachel Hart's other children may have moved interstate. Regards Terry Newman Sydney, Australia > My Hart and Pyke line connections include: > Bernard Hart m Rachel Pyke 1889 Woollahara NSW > Their children: > Esther R V Hart b 1890 > Annie 1891-92 > Aaron H C b1893 Bathurst > Doris A b 1896 Paddington NSW > > Rachel Hart nee Pyke d 1944 Rookwood.

In some research I am doing have just come across some information about a Crawcour family in Ballarat, Victoria. The third wedding at the first Ballarat Synagogue was of a Samuel Crawcour marrying an Isabella Abrahams. Also have a note that Sydney Abraham married Rebecca Crawcour 10 May 1860. You wrote: >From other research I know that numbers of my other Hart/Crawcour/Cantor/Goldsmid lines settled in Australia with several families in Melbourne and the Victoria area. > Dr Phillip Kirby >