FYI Sherry & Jackye The Essex Record Office will be closed for stocktaking from Monday 15 to Saturday 27 November inclusive, re-opening on Monday 29 November.

If Linda Wolfe Kelley's reply on 14 Oct didn't solve your query, then the info on YorksBMD includes a link to enable you to order a copy of the secular marriage certificate. That will give you more information at the secular level. A British marriage certificate includes: 1: *Given and Family Names of the bride and groom. 2: **ages of bride & groom (or possibly just whether "of full age" (21 +) or minors (under 21) 3: occupations of bride & groom 4: current residence(s) of bride and groom 5: *names of bride's and groom's father's 6: the fathers' occupations (and, possibly, whether or not already deceased at the time of the ceremony) * It has become clear that some immigrant families, less accustomed to the use of surnames rather than patronyms, and accustomed to the use of more than one version of given name, were not always consistent in their choice of names in these sections of secular registration documents. It may also have been that they did not regard the secular registration documents as having any great importance, as compared with religious documentation. **"full age" remained at 21 in the UK until ca 1970 when it was lowered to 18. Purchasing a BMD certificate direct from the GRO or from the Local District Registry Office is almost always *significantly* less expensive than going through an intermediary site. The fee should be the standard amount of ca £9, even from abroad. The information should be the same, whichever source you use: central or local. However, the central record was derived from the local one by transcription, quarterly, which has allowed some errors to creep in: both as to omission of whole records, or errors in transcription of content. Once you know more about the families' residences and occupations, it may be possible to find traces of them in the Historical Directories site (a .org site set up by Leicester University some years ago). It has images of trade, and similar, directories going back into the early C19th, and they are searchable with OCR. As you work backwards, there is also an 1894 Commercial Directory of Jews in the UK amongst the books in archive.org, also searchable. Mary SW Herts ________________________________ Date: Thu, 14 Oct 2010 19:28:28 -0400 From: Jonny <[email protected]> Subject: [BRITISH-JEWRY] Saperia in Leeds To: [email protected] <snip> The Yorkshire BMD site lists the following marriage: Year: 1908 Groom: Alexander Joseph Bride: Ada L. Saperia Church/Register Office: Louis Street Synagogue If anyone has any knowledge of the above marriage and/or the couple's families or can obtain more information from one of the publications of that time, please contact me off-list. <snip> Jonny Joseph Los Angeles, CA, USA

Hmm, incandescent or compact fluorescent? Sorry, couldn't resist it at this late hour (11:11 pm) in my local cafe - yes, open until midnight. Must be the gunpowder green tea I'm sipping. Jeremy Berkeley, California At 1:01 AM -0600 10/14/10, [email protected] wrote: >I had a light bulb moment :-) > >Sherry (Oxford)

I have a life-size portrait of my gr gr grandfather that may have been done in London in the 1880's, or just possibly in the States a little earlier. I was wondering if anyone knew how common (or uncommon) it would have been for someone to have a portrait done. I have portrait photos of other ancestors, but no paintings except for those done by another (non-Jewish) gr gr grandfather who happened to be a painter. I've wondered what inspired my ancestor to have it done - one day I shall get the painting cleaned and then send a photo to the National Portrait Gallery to see if they can tell me anything about it (I sent a query to the NPG asking about possible artists and got a reply saying to send a photo). Eve Richardson Toronto, Canada

Bob - you are probably correct that as the children never married there are no more descendants but it isnt always so ........... I have family that had children and (dont tell anyone) they werent married and the babies were adopted. So it might be worthwhile checking out - dont quite know how to do it but Im sure there are BJers who do - on one of the sites where you can put in the name of the family member and check out births from that person. Usually the men (sorry guys) who had illegitimate children with non-Jewish girls. Just food for thought. Have a good day Regards Angie Elfassi Israel Searching: RAYKH-ZELIGMAN/RICHMAN, Stakliskes, Lithuania/Leeds COHEN, Sakiai, Lithuania/Leeds MAGIDOWITZ, Jurbarkas, Lithuania/Leeds KASSIMOFF, Rezekne, Latvia/Leeds "The entire family is buried there and the children never married so that ends that branch."

Jonny, google Saperia Family from Leeds and you will see a lot of information that several Saperias have put together. Ada is listed on the Genealogy page. Linda Wolfe Kelley California On Oct 14, 2010, at 4:28 PM, Jonny wrote: I have read a number of postings to this list regarding the Saperia family in Leeds. The Yorkshire BMD site lists the following marriage: Year: 1908 Groom: Alexander Joseph Bride: Ada L. Saperia Church/Register Office: Louis Street Synagogue If anyone has any knowledge of the above marriage and/or the couple's families or can obtain more information from one of the publications of that time, please contact me off-list. Many thanks in advance, Jonny Joseph Los Angeles, CA, USA Our website is at www.british-jewry.org.uk We update regularly. Let us know if you have ideas to offer. [email protected] is the address to use for help. ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Eve My great aunt Violet had portraits in oil of her father (myggrandfather Henry born 1836)) and of another bearded worthy who was probably one of my great uncles as I suspect that my gggrandfather Joshua Poland (Polak?) born 1792 would still have been observant enough to have avoided any such non orthodox frivolity. Unfortunately I have lost any trace of these portraits. Best Nigel Warshaw Berkeley, California USA +1 510 527 3942 -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Eve Richardson Sent: Thursday, October 14, 2010 8:11 PM To: [email protected] Subject: [BRITISH-JEWRY] portraits I have a life-size portrait of my gr gr grandfather that may have been done in London in the 1880's, or just possibly in the States a little earlier. I was wondering if anyone knew how common (or uncommon) it would have been for someone to have a portrait done. I have portrait photos of other ancestors, but no paintings except for those done by another (non-Jewish) gr gr grandfather who happened to be a painter. I've wondered what inspired my ancestor to have it done - one day I shall get the painting cleaned and then send a photo to the National Portrait Gallery to see if they can tell me anything about it (I sent a query to the NPG asking about possible artists and got a reply saying to send a photo). Eve Richardson Toronto, Canada Our website is at www.british-jewry.org.uk We update regularly. Let us know if you have ideas to offer. [email protected] is the address to use for help. ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I have read a number of postings to this list regarding the Saperia family in Leeds. The Yorkshire BMD site lists the following marriage: Year: 1908 Groom: Alexander Joseph Bride: Ada L. Saperia Church/Register Office: Louis Street Synagogue If anyone has any knowledge of the above marriage and/or the couple's families or can obtain more information from one of the publications of that time, please contact me off-list. Many thanks in advance, Jonny Joseph Los Angeles, CA, USA

I was remiss in not acknowledging that Rosemary Rees of the list had also sent the same info, but I overlooked it at first, not realizing that it was the very Salomon I had been seeking. Thanks Rosemary! R. ------------------------- Randall Davis

In case it does anyone else some good, here's information sent by Gina Marks from the list, who seems to have provided the necessary clue. Of the Salomon photographers listed at the site she points to, Herman Salomon seems like a good bet. He shows up in the 1891 census, age 30, at 146 Stoke Newington Road, with occupation "Artist, Portraiture, Sculp". His wife's name is Victoria, perhaps the origin of the studio name. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: [email protected] To: [email protected] Subject: Re Historical Data on a Photograph This website might have the information you are searching. He has a few Salomons listed: http://www.cartedevisite.co.uk/photographers-category/photographers/photographers-s/ Regards, Gina [email protected] Re: historical data on a photograph (Randall Davis) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Sun, 10 Oct 2010 12:20:20 -0400 > From: "Randall Davis" <[email protected]> > Subject: [BRITISH-JEWRY] historical data on a photograph > To: [email protected] > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII > > I have a photograph of a relative with the following information printed on the back: > > Photographed by Salomon > Potrait Painter > and > Sculptor > Victoria Studio > 39 Lauriston Road > South Hackney > Late of South Kensington > > It's a formal studio protrait mounted on cardboard, and from the photo itself I would guess it's > 1880's or thereabouts, but that's a guess. > > I would much appreciate it if anyone has access to a resource that would indicate when that studio > was in business, so I can date the photo more accurately. > > Many thanks in advance. > > ------------------------- > Randall Davis > Weston, MA, USA, as the leaves are starting to change >

Hi Georgina by now you have probably already seen the info from all the other messages ( night time here so I wasn't aware of them!) however I have sent to you the image. > > Thank for your offer it was Michael Hart who died 10 March 1910, his > brother > was David Hart, my great grandfather. I was hoping that it says where he > is > buried, I know his wife was Kate and he had four children. > I still cant believe I typed out HART without thinking to check the family tree! doh! (Incidently the research was for another Hart-hunter) cheers Cynthia

A big thank you to everyone for your help, once again. Regards to all, Georgie

I want to thank all of you that replied to my "brick wall" emails and to give a progress report. Brenda's clue about Jacobs family at Enfield turned out to be correct. The entire family is buried there and the children never married so that ends that branch. On the Moscovitch side I did track down some grandchildren and great grandchildren living in Manchester and other great grandchildren living in Israel. I have been in contact with each of them and will meet the UK people when I visit next month. Ironically the oldest person did not know that her grandparents had any siblings and was truly astonished to hear about the rest of the family. Also learned where the Moscovitch family came from - Warsaw. Still trying to determine where the Jacobs family came from but getting closer. Since my emails I have added over 50 people to the tree by coming forward. I started this project in March and between my wife's side of the family and mine I now have 407 confirmed people from 6 countries. Two of the branches are traced back to 1720. The other four go back to the early 1800's so far. Hopefully some cemetery visits while I am in UK will clear up some other branches. Again. Thanks to everyone for their support. Bob Moss Chicago, IL USA Moscovitch, Jacobs,Schneider, Plotzkar, Levy.

I had a light bulb moment :-) Sherry (Oxford) > Sherry you are a star! > I followed your instructions and found it.

Sherry you are a star! I followed your instructions and found it. Thanks very much Regards Georgie

Hi Miriam, Michael died in London, I think it was Hackney, I have looked on the US burial site but it is not there, I thought that he might be buried in Plashet as most of the family are there. Thanks very much Georgina > >> Thank for your offer it was Michael Hart who died 10 March 1910, his >> brother >> was David Hart, my great grandfather. I was hoping that it says where he >> is >> buried, I know his wife was Kate and he had four children. > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Georgie, It's there but indexed as Jan 10th 1910-just been looking at it! Try ALEXANDER and then 1910-1910 and then "earliest first" and the first page of results will be for 7th Jan and then some entries for 10th Jan-click on "view whole edition" and scroll through... HTH Sherry (Oxford, UK) > It is 14 January 1910.

To ascertain where any surviving hospital records are held, go to http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/hospitalrecords/search.asp Jill Staines, Middlesex Researching: ELKAN, HYAMS, KARPIN, SIMONS/SYMONDS, SMILOWSKI

Hi Jeremy, It is 14 January 1910. Thanks very much > > > Dear Georgina, > > I think it might help if you could provide the specific date of the > missing issue. > > Jeremy

Dear Ruth, My name is Miriam Pollak (everyone mis-spells the surname). It is a CD-ROM of personal entries from the Jewish Chronicle from 01 January 1900 to 31 December 1909 inclusive. Entries include: Births, Barmitzvahs, Engagements, Marriages, Deaths and In Memoriam. I've also added Tombstone settings to deaths that I could be certain about. I have a couple of CD's left (bear in mind the CD only works in a Windows environment, not Mac) and would be happy to pass them on to interested parties, as my husband and I are about to depart from England where we have been for the last four years. Please contact me directly if you are interested. Miriam Borehamwood >> What is Miriam Pollack's fabulous CD "The JC Project" and how does one get> it?> Thanks, Ruth